Oil leak on top of cylinder

[EV11Jack]

Hi Guys, Well, every time I have an issue I bring it here and you guys are the best in getting me to stop grinding my teeth!!!
I have a 1998 California EV11, 50,000 miles. I've had it for under a year and have been enjoying it after not riding for 30+ years! Sorry to see the fall weather coming, but that's what leather is for, isn't it? Anyhow, on the top of the left cylinder is some sort of connector with a lead coming from under the tank somewhere. It's held down by two small allen head bolts. When I first got the bike it had a very small oil leak apparently coming from this part ( I have a CD with manuals on it and I cannot figure out what it is). I also looked at two paper manuals I purchased, a "Spare Parts Catalog" and a "Workshop Manual". Neither shows the part. The reason that I'm writing is to learn what it is and more importantly how can I order one? I've had the bike in to my local MG dealer and they said it was in stock at Piaggio and they would get one in for me and install it. That was in July. After it didn't come in after a week, the said that the inventory was wrong and I wouldn't get in until the third week of August. Well, you can guess, if I'm asking for help here, they still don't have it in and tell me that it's back-ordered. I just need to find out what it is and more importantly what the part number is so that I can begin my own search to locate one. Pictures attached.
The oil leak is getting worse and worse and I've ruined two pair of boots and pants!
Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks for your usual terrific support!http://wildguzzi.com/forum/Smileys/default/bow.gif
cheers,
Jack

[yogidozer]

http://www.mgcycle.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=37_160&products_id=1226

[yogidozer]

just need this gasket, or make your own
http://www.mgcycle.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=1153

[RinkRat II]

 Hey there EV, I bought a whole assortment of parts a while ago and happen to have that gasket, PM me your address and I'll drop it in the mail to you. I lived in Syosset 72thru 74 then on to Arizona. Always like Oyster Bay area, not what you think of when they say New York!
         
       Paul B

[fotoguzzi]

those small bolts thread into the thin aluminum rocker cover itself, there's no nut on the back side so be very gentle when tightening them, you don't want to strip the threads out in the valve cover.

BTW it's the oil temp sensor even tho it doesn't sit in any oil, funny I know and it's exactly the same as the air temp sensor mounted in front of the right side snorkel from the airbox. Guzzi did some crazy stuff to cut a few $.?
the next gen EV had a head temp sensor that made more sense but had it's own set of problems.

[pehayes]

Give up on solving the leak and just wash it.
This is the oil temperature sensor and it measures the mist above the rocker arms in the left cylinder.
Yes, the screws and holes are VERY fragile and will strip quite easily.
A new gasket will help.  Even with some pliable sealant it will still leak.
With age and heat, the original plastic sensor body takes on a warp or curvature.  You can tighten down the ends, but the center no longer squeezes the gasket very well.
I fabricated a metal piece to mimic the shape of the sensor and that rests on top of the sensor in a hope of keeping the pressure even and constant across all of the gasket surface.  Required longer bolts with nylok nuts inside the valve cover.
I've tried everything.

Still leaks.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

[bigbikerrick]

That sensor ,the way Guzzi put in on the rocker cover with fragile threads that strip, really sucks, and if Patrick, has not been able to solve the leak, with all his expertise, I personally would get another rocket cover without the sensor hole, and mount that trouble-prone sensor somewhere else... not sure where, but on MG cycle's website, they list that sensor as fitting an Aluminum. I have an aluminum, and that sensor is not in the valve cover( thank God) Did someone say the MoGuCo later mounted it in the airbox somewhere?
Rick.

[troyhamilton]

so thats what that do hickey on valve cover is...im not using it except to plug the hole...luddite here!

[Gusable]

It's on a hot dog n mustard bike right? Put a squirt of mustard around the sensor then a dollop of kraut on the whole thing. Ride. Enjoy. Lol  I hope you get it sorted. Makes me want to check mine.  I think it's got some mist around

[pete roper]

Rather than an oil temperature sensor it's the engine temperature sensor and it's a pathetic joke. The theory was fine but in reality what happens is that in cool weather or when it rains the rocker cover is way cooler than it *Should* be and the ECU will compensate by richening up the mixture to a ridiculous degree. Later bikes had the ETS in a plastic holder in the back of the RH head. It was crap too.

Pete

[EV11Jack]

Give up on solving the leak and just wash it.
This is the oil temperature sensor and it measures the mist above the rocker arms in the left cylinder.
Yes, the screws and holes are VERY fragile and will strip quite easily.
A new gasket will help.  Even with some pliable sealant it will still leak.
With age and heat, the original plastic sensor body takes on a warp or curvature.  You can tighten down the ends, but the center no longer squeezes the gasket very well.
I fabricated a metal piece to mimic the shape of the sensor and that rests on top of the sensor in a hope of keeping the pressure even and constant across all of the gasket surface.  Required longer bolts with nylok nuts inside the valve cover.
I've tried everything.

Still leaks.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

Wow! This all sounds like much more than I expected. I'm thinking about doubling up on the gasket & also using a pliable gasket in a tube? Ant thoughts?


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[nc43bsa]

Rather than an oil temperature sensor it's the engine temperature sensor and it's a pathetic joke. The theory was fine but in reality what happens is that in cool weather or when it rains the rocker cover is way cooler than it *Should* be and the ECU will compensate by richening up the mixture to a ridiculous degree. Later bikes had the ETS in a plastic holder in the back of the RH head. It was crap too.

Pete

I don't have any experience with this model, but wouldn't it be more effective to give the ECU the temperature of the oil in the sump?  I can think of a number of sensors that could be used with a bung welded into the oil pan.

[twhitaker]

I stripped the threads in the rocker cover and made a nut with a notch to fit around the sensor to keep it from turning. Sealed the gasket with permatex.

[pete roper]

I don't have any experience with this model, but wouldn't it be more effective to give the ECU the temperature of the oil in the sump?  I can think of a number of sensors that could be used with a bung welded into the oil pan.

The engine doesn't give a damn what temperature the oil is. The whole idea is for the ECU to have a fairly accurate idea of what the temperature is around the combustion chamber so the mixture can be adjusted to suit. With liquid cooled vehicles this is pretty easy, you just bung a sensor into the waterjacket on the head. With an air cooled lump? Not so easy.

Both the rocker cover and the sump are lousy places for a sensor as neither has any real relevance to head temperature. The later system used on the 2V bikes with the sensor in the back of the head is theoretically much better. The problem is they use a crappy plastic holder and it usually has an air gap meaning the reading is once again inaccurate and corrupted by external factors.

Pete

[Ted N]

Been a few years but I used a new gasket with premium grey high temp gasket sealer and it hasn't leaked since. Tip from MPH cycle.

[EV11Jack]

Hey there EV, I bought a whole assortment of parts a while ago and happen to have that gasket, PM me your address and I'll drop it in the mail to you. I lived in Syosset 72thru 74 then on to Arizona. Always like Oyster Bay area, not what you think of when they say New York!
         
       Paul B

Hi Paul, got the gasket in the mail yesterday. Unfortunately I'm working seven days for the next few weeks. Will let you know the outcome when I get a few free moments.
Thanks again!
Jack


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[EV11Jack]

Hi Ted,
I took your advise and picked up a tube Permatex hi-temp, hi-vibration, oil resistant gasket seal. As soon as I get a few minutes, I'm going to install the new gasket that RinkRat II was kind enough to send me. I'll update everyone once I get done with it.
cheers,
Jack

[EV11Jack]

Okay, so here's the latest...I got a tube of Permatex suggested by Ted (ultra grey, advanced formula, maximum torque, #82194) and installed the sensor using it on both sides of the gasket. I put everything together last night and the instructions say to give it 24 hours. Took it out for a quick ride this evening for about 10 miles and it seems to be holding as everything is dry.
However, my biggest fears were confirmed. After reading from a member, that the threads in the soft aluminum can easily be stripped. Well, they are! So everything is being held together by the Permatex.
In checking on E-bay, I discovered a guy that is parting out a 1998 EV11 and he happens to have the cover. The picture even shows the sensor still in the cover. After a short negotiation, I purchased it from him. I'm just hoping that the threads in this unit aren't stripped too, but I had to take a chance.
So, I'll run the "fix" for as long as it lasts and if it gives up, I already have a replacement ready. I also saw the suggestion of putting a nylock nut on the back the bolts. Either way, I think I've finally got the leak taken care of.
I have my next question, but I'll start a new topic for it.
Thanks everyone for all of your help. I really appreciate being part of the community!
cheers,
Jack