Opinions on waxed cotton gear please

[Joe A.]

Considering adding to my collection of gear. How is it if you get caught in extended periods of rain? How does it manage temp variations? Anything else that can be shared is appreciated!!

Thanks

[lazlokovacs]

keep it waxed and it handles rain real good

not the warmest but does block wind very well.

excellent with a thermal layer underneath

barbour/belstaff inner pocket is ideal for keeping your rolled up copy of London Review of Books/Paris Review nice and dry when riding through pouring rain on your way to the caff.

screwdrivers that live too long in the pockets can make unwelcome holes

waxed trousers are the greatest


Point 4 may be of niche interest.

 

[PeteS]

It has an odor. You may find it OK but its not like other fabric. Not for me.

Pete

[Guzzistajohn]

Great stuff if padding isn’t an issue for you. And if you’re ok with smelling like a funky old tent. I just threw my old bellstaff away about a month ago.

[Joe A.]

Appreciate the input, thanks!!

[fatbob]

My first Barbour International suit only lasted 30 years and around 400,000 miles.  I hope my current one lasts longer!  Best gear there is. I do not however count on it being waterproof, only water resistant.

[chuck peterson]

A rich tradition of exploration...now a ruined fashion statement....

https://www.maxim.com/style/belstaff-brand-history-2017-3

My favorite is walking into a party of stiff suits and ties with your dripping wet, tar coated, moldy Belstaff...waving the motorcycle flag...

1976 I bought one for the ungodly sum of $85 and I ate rice for a year to pay for it...now for movie stars, it's SO YESTERDAY....we've moved on...

Strange how they work so well...standard gear for the non pirates

[Diploman]

One of the advantages to the Forcefield Pro Shirt X-V armored top (or any of the many similar armored tops available) I wear underneath my riding jacket is that it allows any kind of jacket you prefer to serve as your outer layer.  All the padding/armor functions are accomplished separately, with top-of-the-line back, chest, shoulder and elbow pads all securely held in their assigned places.  The outer jacket, then, serves to protect the rider from the elements and abrasion, but does not need to contain incorporated padding against impact.  This arrangement thus makes a traditional waxed cotton outer shell a viable, safe option, which otherwise it is not, by modern standards.  By the same token, an armored shirt allows a standard leather street jacket to serve moto duty.  The armored shirt offers a great deal of flexibility - I currently wear an Olympia Transition jacket as my outer layer, with all the OEM armor removed, since the shirt's Forcefield armor is superior and better held in place. 

Back in 1971, I bought a Belstaff Trialmaster in London and used it with great pleasure for years, unconcerned about armor.  Never crashed.  I bequeathed it to a friend when I joined the Foreign Service.    Now that armor protection is more of a priority for me, I am thinking of getting another Belstaff to wear over the Forcefield shirt. 

https://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/forcefield-pro-shirt-x-v

[JeffOlson]

I have a Beretta waxed cotton jacket with matching hat. They look nice and are fairly functional, but they are not waterproof. In a downpour, I will get wet!

The only thing that keeps me dry in a downpour is rubber. (At our beach cabin, I do a lot of work on our property outside in the rain because, well, it rains a lot in Washington, and the work won't get done with me sitting inside!)

GoreTex? It leaks. So do all of my other expensive and supposedly water-proof clothes, some less than others. Still, I continue to buy thinking, "This time, it might just work!"

[Rebochi]

 I have a Aerostich Cousin Jeremy jacket that comfortable and so far waterproof.It has modern armour and padding. I haven't tried it in a 2 inch a hour Louisiana downpour or three days of 10 hours a day non stop rain yet but so far it seems to be water proof. 
  My Aerostich Darien jacket is completely water proof, I have never had it soak through in any condition but it is not as comfortable as waxed cotton and it is not as comfortable over a wide temperature range.
  Cortech jackets will soak through in a real downpour or multiple days of riding in the rain.

[Testarossa]

Last year I bought an Oxford waxed-cotton jacket, more or less a Belstaff knock-off, but 30% polyester, and it does have CE armor. It was on sale cheap. I like it a lot -- very comfy, completely windproof and not clammy in warmish weather, unlike my fully-waterproofed gear.  Downside is the dull olive color, which does not contribute to conspicuity. I use it when I know traffic will be light: around my tiny town and occasional day trips on back roads. That's about 80% of my riding nowadays.





I've had a Pendleton waxed-cotton knee-length raincoat for years and years. Always kept me dry.

[Diploman]

Just browsing for a possible wax-cotton jacket, Bristishmotorcycleg ear.com carries most of the - authentically British - candidates (there are also less-expensive knockoffs, some of them even British).

Interestingly, Belstaff now offers an updated version of the classic Trialmaster, a reproduction of the original now fitted with D30 armor in the usual places, as well as a thermal liner, for the princely sum of $520 ( approaching a price class with the likes of Klim, Rukka, et al).

Barbour, on the other hand, still offers the classically stylish Barbour International jacket in essentially original unarmored configuration for $329, competitive with most mid-market jackets. 

Although I would hesitate/regret giving up the Hi-Viz features of my current jacket, the Barbour is nonetheless sinfully tempting to wear over my Forcefield shirt.  Timeless style, great comfort, excellent weather protection.

https://www.britishmotorcyclegear.com/jackets.html

[rodekyll]

I like that "standard gear for the non-pirates" comment.  What you folks are talking about are "oilskins".  Oilskins were the oil or wax-saturated cotton (or hemp) marine foul weather gear worn by actual pirates for centuries.  When I was quite young we thought wearing the stinky, stiff, always greasy-feeling stuff on-deck was cool.  In truth it was like wearing tree bark.  With the better breathing, lighter, better moving, less-bulky, better colored, better fitting WATERPROOF alternatives out there I don't know why anyone would add oilskins to a modern inventory, except as a fashion statement (and that brings us back to the pirate thing).  Mariners abandoned the stuff when rubber was invented.

[Testarossa]

What you folks are talking about are "oilskins".

Nope. Oilskins were originally sailcloth coated with linseed oil. Waxed cotton was originally long-staple Egyptian cotton coated with paraffin (wax, not kerosene). Today a lot of boating folks use "oilskin" to mean almost any two-piece raingear from oiled canvas to vinyl, but waxed cotton is still waxed cotton.

[Joe A.]

I have a Aerostich Cousin Jeremy jacket that comfortable and so far waterproof.It has modern armour and padding. I haven't tried it in a 2 inch a hour Louisiana downpour or three days of 10 hours a day non stop rain yet but so far it seems to be water proof. 
  My Aerostich Darien jacket is completely water proof, I have never had it soak through in any condition but it is not as comfortable as waxed cotton and it is not as comfortable over a wide temperature range.
  Cortech jackets will soak through in a real downpour or multiple days of riding in the rain.

Thanks for the reply, the Jeremy / Falstaff are high on my list. I have a RC light one piece and an old Darien, plus a bunch of other jackets and pants. Looking to thin the herd. I'll be posting the 1 piece RC light as I'm a 2 piece guy, then updating with the Jeremy, a new Darien jacket and pants.

[rodekyll]

Nope. Oilskins were originally sailcloth coated with linseed oil. Waxed cotton was originally long-staple Egyptian cotton coated with paraffin (wax, not kerosene). Today a lot of boating folks use "oilskin" to mean almost any two-piece raingear from oiled canvas to vinyl, but waxed cotton is still waxed cotton.

Originally, they were.  Whale oil.  With the demise of that industry and the rise of petroleum, oilskins evolved.

[malik]

Held make one waxed cotton jacket in their range, comes with armour on the elbows & shoulders, with a pocket for the optional back armour. They have.managed to make it look elegant, and it's comfortable. Worth checking out.

[Green1000S]

I got Merlin Atlow jacket from Revzilla few months back. It is absolutely my favorite jacket.

VERY heavy, but blocks wind effectively and is warm. Got a better back protector for it though.
I have not used it in rain, so cannot say much about waterproofness.
Probably not good after 60-70F temperatures, since it has no vents. 

Did I say that its my favorite jacket, even the Klim Badlands stays in garage....

[blackcat]

I have two of the Aerostich Fallstaff jackets, and they work well in the rain provided you apply the wax everyone once in awhile. I purchased one of the jackets new, and the other one was very slightly used from an Aerostich sale for half price. One of these days I’ll purchase the pants but at around $600 bucks they are not cheap.

When it starts getting hot outside, I turn to other apparel.

[TobyJug]

I used to be an instructor (with Star Rider) and an ex trainee came to my house to read the electric meter so we stopped for a chat.  When he left - he'd left a nice dirty black mark on the wall where he'd brushed passed it with his Belstaff on.

[elvisboy77]

Considering adding to my collection of gear. How is it if you get caught in extended periods of rain? How does it manage temp variations? Anything else that can be shared is appreciated!!

Thanks

I have an Aerostich Darien Falstaff, which I use in the hottest (>90F) weather.  It keeps me a lot cooler than leather.  I think it is good into the low 50's as well.  As far as waterproof, it is pretty good, I would say water resistant rather than -proof.  Of course, I get rained on in my convertible, with the top up so waterproof IMO is not a practical goal when riding a motorcycle.

The other thing I LOVE over the Nylon/Tech/Other fabrics is that it is a lot softer and therefore more comfortable.

I would recommend the Aerostich stuff!

[Stevex]

Fashion statement now isn't it?
In the late 70's and 80's my Belstaff jacket and trews kept me dry through many a British winter's riding.
I remember re proofing it using melted wax, so much fun!
Today I'm sure the best textile suits will do the same without the mess.

[molly]

Fashion statement now isn't it?
In the late 70's and 80's my Belstaff jacket and trews kept me dry through many a British winter's riding.
I remember re proofing it using melted wax, so much fun!
Today I'm sure the best textile suits will do the same without the mess.

I had a Belstaff jacket and trousers combo and they did the job when not much else was available at the time. Having wax under my fingernails every time I stuck my hands in the pockets was a fond memory. There was no real crash protection and loads of under layers were required to keep warm.
In reality leather or the cordura are a far better options today.

[pete roper]

I had a Belstaff jacket and trousers combo and they did the job when not much else was available at the time. Having wax under my fingernails every time I stuck my hands in the pockets was a fond memory. There was no real crash protection and loads of under layers were required to keep warm.
In reality leather or the cordura are a far better options today.

 :1: although I’d generally say not leather either. Leather is great for abrasion but it’s heavy and hot.

Waxed cotton? Good lord! It was hideous. Filthy, dirty, labour intensive to keep it even vaguely waterproof and made you smell like Roman drains! I used a full Belstaff suit when I was despatch riding in London in the early eighties, there were synthetics back then but they weren’t up to much, were very expensive and being honest I was suspicious of the new fangled stuff. To re-wax the gear you’d get together with a few mates and take your horrid gear and throw it in a laundromat tumble dryer along with a tin of wax. It re-coated them really well, inside and out! Not very proud of that as you can imagine the effect on the next load of washing that was put in the dryer .

Nowadays even Shitty, budget, riding gear is about a trillion times better at keeping you warm and dry, not to mention safe! The only reason to use it is as a trendy affectation. It’s like exhaust wrap and those stupid bloody grills people put on the headlights of their ‘Cafe Racers’. While it may not actually single you out as a complete knob the needle on the knob-o-meter will start flickering towards the red zone if you wear it and if it’s combined with other things like the items mentioned above will single you out like a sandwich board with ‘Knobus Maximus’ written on it in fluorescent poster type!

Pete

[molly]

:1: although I�d generally say not leather either. Leather is great for abrasion but it�s heavy and hot.

Waxed cotton? Good lord! It was hideous. Filthy, dirty, labour intensive to keep it even vaguely waterproof and made you smell like Roman drains! I used a full Belstaff suit when I was despatch riding in London in the early eighties, there were synthetics back then but they weren�t up to much, were very expensive and being honest I was suspicious of the new fangled stuff. To re-wax the gear you�d get together with a few mates and take your horrid gear and throw it in a laundromat tumble dryer along with a tin of wax. It re-coated them really well, inside and out! Not very proud of that as you can imagine the effect on the next load of washing that was put in the dryer :embarrassed.

Pete

I bet our paths crossed when you were dispatch riding. At the time I was a regular visitor to London on my bike (operation leg over) and was always amazed at the clobber the dispatch riders wore. One super star I came across often dressed like a Grimsby trawlerman in full oil skins with the trousers taped to his wellington boots even in the summer.

[Carlo DeSantis]

Thanks for the reply, the Jeremy / Falstaff are high on my list. I have a RC light one piece and an old Darien, plus a bunch of other jackets and pants. Looking to thin the herd. I'll be posting the 1 piece RC light as I'm a 2 piece guy, then updating with the Jeremy, a new Darien jacket and pants.

I bought a RC one-piece a long time ago and it is still my favorite riding gear.  A few years after that I added a Darien suit for touring.  The Darien makes it easy to layer and is cooler in hot weather than the RC.  And then maybe a dozen years ago a friend gave me his Falstaff jacket when he was forced to quit riding due to health concerns.  The Falstaff has become my go-to for cool/cold (below 50�F) weather riding.  It blocks the wind better than the RC or Darien, and has heavier lining.  Combined with a Kanetsu heated liner, it is really comfortable in the cold.

That said, the Falstaff spends most of the summer on a hanger.  BTW, I use my regular Darien pants with the Falstaff jacket.

Best,

Carlo

[Zoom Zoom]

Joe, since I know you have some really good riding apparel, is something not living up to its potential?

I only ask because there came a time after several years, that I needed to retreat my Darien stuff. I recall they suggest you do it every couple years, but I got 5 or 6 years out of it before I needed to redo it. After a little experimentation, I figured out what works, at least for me.

I have found that Nik-Wax spray on does very well if applied in the following manner. Garment needs to be clean. They suggest using their wash since it leaves no residue. If you use regular laundry detergent, you should run it through a couple extra rinse cycles. Then, I hang the stuff up outside, get it good and wet if it is not already, and spray the ever living snot out of it with the nik wax. Allow to completely dry, maybe even overnight. Get back out, respray with water to soak it down as much as possible again, spray a second coating of spray on. Let dry. I have found that doing this restores my Stich to its original performance. (It still looks old and worn, but performs as new.)

***Note: I was advised against using the wash in treatment since by doing so will effectively waterproof both sides of the garment. In other words, it will trap perspiration and not breath properly.

There are many here, myself included, that spent a lot of money looking for something that worked as well, and was cheaper than Stich. Some have been successful finding something as good, (maybe), but you will find nothing better! I'm not saying someone here has not mentioned it, but I would like hearing from someone with something less expensive say they have ridden in the pouring rain for a 600 mile day and be dry at the end of it. I, and others can say that with Aerostich. That and Sidi boots!

Well anyhow, that is my 2 cents.

John Henry

[Joe A.]

Hey Zoom! I drank the Aerostich Kool-Aid a while ago and love their stuff! I have too much riding gear I've accumulated over the years taking up a ton of room and have decided to pare it down to a more manageable level. I mean, I still have my Teknic ballistic jacket that I bought back in 2000, and a Schott leather (which I'm keeping that I bought in the 80's)! I plan on keeping one of my mesh jackets and switching the rest to AS. I did mention that I was thinking of selling the RC Light, but damn I like that suit. So, I think my decision point is down to keeping the RC and adding a two piece option. I like the look and feel of waxed cotton and think it would complement the Darien for a change of pace once in a while. As you know, I am a slave to fashion

Thanks again everyone for sharing your opinions and experiences.

And Pete! I need to post more Roper  hot button topics just to get your responses, damn you can turn a phrase!

[Zoom Zoom]

In the Interest of full disclosure I am behind a windshield as well.

, ZZ

[Lannis]

I have read the whole thread with interest, but I still have a question.

Apparently, waxed cotton is hot in hot weather, stinky, can stain things if you're not careful, and ugly.

What's the point of all that if it's not waterproof, I mean really waterproof?

That's like have a mean, ugly, stinky girlfriend that can't cook.

Lannis