V7 III FUELING

[twowheeladdict]

The V9 with a chrome V7 tank seems to be popular with the few I've seen in CA. No, this is not a foolish rabbit hole as Mr. Roper feared. No, not at this point. Simple fixes are not there it seems. MG wants a picture of the DATA from the shop PC done during final diagnosis. They want to review the settings. No one argues that it is not working properly. They rode it.

How is it that the Japanese seem to be plagued with this FI malady only occasionally?  FZ09 first generation was the last one I hear of in the cycling press.

Actually, the EPA has pretty much ruined modern motorcycles.  Look at how many cottage industry Engine Control Unit tuners there are out there.  Just about every bike I have owned has some guy on the forum who has reverse engineered the ECU and people are lining up to send their ECUs to the guy for a flash at $300 a pop.  The bikes that I am personally familiar with are the Concours 1400, all the Vulcan 1700s, Kawasaki Versys 650 mostly latest generation, Honda Goldwing 1800, Ninja 1000.  These bikes are leaned out so much that they end up running really hot or they have abrupt throttle responses, or power comes on like a switch at a certain point.

Personally, I adapt to each motorcycle pretty easily and learn to use it's flaws and characteristics without issue.  If I wanted a sewing machine riding experience...

[professor]

The dealer called and the V7III is ready for pickup. It was ridden about twenty miles by the service manager and I was assured it is fixed. The old map was replaced by a new map from Italy, done by MG NA, via Piaggio. MG NA did the installation work remotely. The dealer could not interface with the main company computer as they hoped. The map, I am told is the latest for this market, which alone tells me something. Wonder what the other markets get? MY VII ended up with a European market map. I must say the dealer and MG were really easy to deal with and there were no tense moments. They simply wanted to get it done right.

It is really a plug and play show. Plug in the diagnostic software, read the codes, address the code issue. (No code.....then what????)  But, if the diagnostic software does not interface with the map on the bike you have a problem and I did. The bike ran, but not well. I think or it appears, MG wants to stay in this market, so at least they are trying at this dealership.

If you buy a V7III ride it before you buy it and buy what you ride if it works. No demos, then to new. The prices are dropping, so the dealers are in the mood to sell. 2018 is near. Thousand Oaks MD/Vespa had a new V7III for $7500. I buy a new bike every year or two due to my job bonus and I am satisfied to stay with MG a while. This is my third of recent. I,II and now III. Great bikes when they work well and sorted. Piaggio stepped up to the plate for me.

[professor]

I might add I also own a 2017 Vespa 300. It was ridden across the US on Lincoln Hiway and back roads. Zero problems. Piaggio builds quality products. Quirky sometimes, but solid products. The Aprilia was equal to any Japanese bike I owned. They see things different than most Americans, as do most Europeans, in terms of marketing and style. In Germany, France and Italy the Goose does just fine.

[beetle]

I'd be very surprised if there were different maps for different markets. There never has been before.

[professor]

Beetle, I will ask MG Friday if there are different maps. I may not get an answer, but I will ask. Make no mistake they told me, verbatim, "your bike now has the right map for this market".  The II never ran right until, again, I was told  "you have the European map now." You know more about this than anyone else. But, it is worth knowing if it is a turn of speech or phrase or an actual fact. The dealer gave me an indication there are multiple (how many?) maps for the V7 series. Not just updates or versions of the same.

If you own one of these things you learn patience.

[professor]

I will close this out. My bike is back from the dealer with a new map. The new map was installed by MG NA out of Costa Mesa. They did it via the local shop computer. The problem was the map. It runs and warms up as it should. No apparent problems. The throttle is still very sensitive to input. But the engine much smoother than before at speed. It no longer hunts or surges.

No idea from them, why the old map was installed at the factory in Italy in April. They did not or would not say.
The dealer (shop manager) tells me there are indeed different maps for different markets. His shop computer did not recognize the old map on my bike. That is when MGNA got involved.
I know KTM installed a "European Map" to sort out my KTM single. It stalled continuously.  Some (I was told)manufactures even have a map for California CARB bikes. None of this matters to you MG owners. MG tells me and the dealer my bike now has "the right map" for this market, exact words.
MG is not customer friendly. They refer the consumer to the dealer.  You call and leave a message. So, getting information is a task. This dealer sells five to six MG bikes a month.  Mostly small blocks. They deal only in Italian bikes. So, they are in these things constantly.
I was advised not to change or modify the map or attempt to change the exhaust system until the warranty has expired. It might not work out for me.

In a nutshell it amounts to this. The Italians do things their way. If you can abide the mannerisms in which they do business and philosophy in the way they think about and treat the customer and dealer MG is for you. I think it is worth the bother to ride one. If you can't, ride something else. They are not changing for the US market. As much as they want to get a deeper market penetration and have US (California) influence the style of their bikes, they are still Italians. Still owned by Piaggio.  By the way the V9 resulted (documented) from the largest MG British dealer suggesting a cruiser. I am grateful for the local dealer.

[Socalrob]

I will close this out. My bike is back from the dealer with a new map. The new map was installed by MG NA out of Costa Mesa. They did it via the local shop computer. The problem was the map. It runs and warms up as it should. No apparent problems. The throttle is still very sensitive to input. But the engine much smoother than before at speed. It no longer hunts or surges.

No idea from them, why the old map was installed at the factory in Italy in April. They did not or would not say.
The dealer (shop manager) tells me there are indeed different maps for different markets. His shop computer did not recognize the old map on my bike. That is when MGNA got involved.
I know KTM installed a "European Map" to sort out my KTM single. It stalled continuously.  Some (I was told)manufactures even have a map for California CARB bikes. None of this matters to you MG owners. MG tells me and the dealer my bike now has "the right map" for this market, exact words.
MG is not customer friendly. They refer the consumer to the dealer.  You call and leave a message. So, getting information is a task. This dealer sells five to six MG bikes a month.  Mostly small blocks. They deal only in Italian bikes. So, they are in these things constantly.
I was advised not to change or modify the map or attempt to change the exhaust system until the warranty has expired. It might not work out for me.

In a nutshell it amounts to this. The Italians do things their way. If you can abide the mannerisms in which they do business and philosophy in the way they think about and treat the customer and dealer MG is for you. I think it is worth the bother to ride one. If you can't, ride something else. They are not changing for the US market. As much as they want to get a deeper market penetration and have US (California) influence the style of their bikes, they are still Italians. Still owned by Piaggio.  By the way the V9 resulted (documented) from the largest MG British dealer suggesting a cruiser. I am grateful for the local dealer.

Hey Prof, where do you teach at?  My daughter works in the Transportation department at UCI.  I will tell her to void Guzzi tickets.  I get down to Newport Beach pretty frequently.

It's good to know there is a good dealer in Costa Mesa.  I bought mine by my house at Pro Italia.  So far so good with ProItalia.

[professor]

Oh I agree Pro Italia is great. We are blessed with good dealers here in Ca. Yes, by all means pass up the blue goose.

[usedtobefast]

Came across this thread via a search. 

I bought a 2017 V7 iii Racer about a month ago and I'm pretty shocked how spot on the fueling is.  I had read a lot prior to test rides and buying and was kind of ready for some issues ... but none.  I am in CA and a fair weather rider, so probably 45 degrees F is as cold as I'll ride in, but at that temp (or any higher temp), start bike, put on helmet and gloves and off you go, bike running perfectly.  Also bike runs extremely smooth, no surging or stumbling.

I am very picky about this ... and have owned Ducati's and KTM's in the past, and most of them have been a challenge to get them to run smoothly in steady throttle situations ... like a 35 mph speed zone, trying to ride a steady 35-38 mph .... even my TuneECU tweaked KTM 990 is still a bit snatchy in that situation ... whereas this MG is super smooth. 

I'm sure it is on the lean side of things but it runs so well I'm tempted to leave it as-is.  But I keep getting tempted by those Agostini mufflers!  :)


As for a V7 iii map, what is available?  Stock bike map?  Or map for a bike with aftermarket freer flow exhaust? 

[ramarren]

The stock V7III Racer map on my bike was pretty good as delivered: it was a little slow warming up and a little weak in the bottom range, but once warmed up it ran well. I did find some occasional surging at continuous highway throttle settings, but nothing too noxious.

However, I bought an ECU tool from "he who must not be mentioned here" and installed his map for the stock bike. The difference was significant: warm up time dropped to almost nothing, the bottom end was beefier and it ran much better sub-4500 rpm (I was still on break in at the time, so I didn't run it hard over 4500 rpm). I later fitted a set of Agostini mufflers and received a customized map for them from the same source. Now it starts, runs, and sounds like a Racer should. All the way to redline, and then the rev limiter... The bottom end and mid-range performance is where the biggest gains are (and the sound... now it sounds like a Moto Guzzi, not "just another Honda").

Well worth it in my book.  :D

[usedtobefast]

Kind of strange, my bike's warm up time is really zero.  And I can ride along at 2,700 - 3,000 rpms smooth as silk (or butter).  Who knows ... maybe slight variances in the various sensors, injectors, gas quality, maybe different maps ... but whatever cosmic harmonic balance is going on, I'll take it!   

[ramarren]

Kind of strange, my bike's warm up time is really zero.  And I can ride along at 2,700 - 3,000 rpms smooth as silk (or butter).  Who knows ... maybe slight variances in the various sensors, injectors, gas quality, maybe different maps ... but whatever cosmic harmonic balance is going on, I'll take it!   

We may simply have different perspectives and tolerances: What "a little bit slow to warm up" and "a little weak at the bottom end" in my perception means might mean something completely different to your perception. Until you've ridden a bike that has been set up up differently, it's impossible for you to judge what I mean by those descriptions. 

[rider33]

iii purchased 11/17.  Never had a fueling problem or any other problem really.  Maybe I'm just lucky but later runs in new models tend to have some of the kinks worked out, at least that is what I have found in other makes.  My guess would be, that true of Guzzi too.

[ramarren]

iii purchased 11/17.  Never had a fueling problem or any other problem really.  Maybe I'm just lucky but later runs in new models tend to have some of the kinks worked out, at least that is what I have found in other makes.  My guess would be, that true of Guzzi too.

My V7III Racer was delivered on Oct 6, so about a month before yours. And I too felt it was just fine as it came off the showroom floor. But, since I was interested to see what the difference might be and had the money to spend, I tried the tool and the map ... and found it a significant improvement. I even tried the Agostini mufflers with the stock map as well: the customized map I'm using now works a lot better than that configuration.

There's really nothing to debate about it. I'm 100% satisfied with the way the bike runs now and I'm not likely to turn it back to stock any time soon. 

[egschade]

Just a couple hundred miles on my V7 III Stone so I'm still in the low-rev break in mode. So far I have not experienced any fueling issues. Can I expect things may change once I get into higher revs or is this a case of 'if you're good, you're good"?

[egschade]

However, I bought an ECU tool from "he who must not be mentioned here" and installed his map for the stock bike.

Would be interested in hearing more about your experience using the ECU tool and re-mapping as the tool isn't cheap.

[Kev m]

Would be interested in hearing more about your experience using the ECU tool and re-mapping as the tool isn't cheap.

Doesn't Beetle offer something just as good for something like 1/5 of the price?

[egschade]

Doesn't Beetle offer something just as good for something like 1/5 of the price?

Certainly an option as I used his map on my Griso with great results. The question is if there's an update to the GuzziDiag software for the V7 III...

[TimmyTheHog]

Doesn't Beetle offer something just as good for something like 1/5 of the price?

I think Mark (Beetle) is looking for volunteer for V7iii to test out...saw it on facebook post or something like that

[beetle]

Certainly an option as I used his map on my Griso with great results. The question is if there's an update to the GuzziDiag software for the V7 III...

GuzziDiag works on the III. Same reader & writer as the II, et al.

[ramarren]

Would be interested in hearing more about your experience using the ECU tool and re-mapping as the tool isn't cheap.

Did you get my PM?

[beetle]

I think Mark (Beetle) is looking for volunteer for V7iii to test out...saw it on facebook post or something like that

I am. There will be tears, garment-wrending & cursing. Any takers?

[egschade]

I am. There will be tears, garment-wrending & cursing. Any takers?

Will look at re-mapping after I pass the break in period and see how it runs. Right now it's pretty darn good. Plan on using the dealer for the first service and not sure how this new one will react if I roll in with the ECU, mufflers and emissions stuff all tweaked. Given it's still winter it may take me a few weeks to log the necessary miles.

[beetle]

No hurry. I'm going to be focusing on aftermarket pipes.

[egschade]

No hurry. I'm going to be focusing on aftermarket pipes.

Like these https://www.ebay.com/itm/17-Shorty-Tunable-Motorcycle-Muffler-Reverse-Cone-Chrome-1-5-1-625-1-75/161394942872?hash=item2593e36398:g:nlYAAOSw1MBZ2Atv&vxp=mtr? I bought them for the V50 but am curious to hear them on the V7.

[beetle]

dB killers?

[egschade]

dB killers?

"Tunable" baffles. Allen screws are provided that thread into the center holes. More screws = more exhaust pushed through the baffle and a more restricted flow (so they say). Might be a fun little experiment but I'll get 'real' mufflers when the time comes. Maybe even wait for a Mk 3 version of the Arrow high pipe to appear (as impractical as a high pipe is I think they look cool).

[beetle]

Looks pretty restrictive as is. You might want to leave the screws out regardless.