NGC - to sell or not to sell ....... (CB1100)

[ohiorider]

As some of you know, I purchased a leftover 2014 Honda CB1100 (actually an 1140cc engine) in April of 2017.  Not been happy with this bike since that time.  But recently, I spent phone time with a rep from RaceTech, who gave me some tips on tuning the RaceTech Gold emulator valves that now reside in the front forks.  The results are encouraging.  The front end, though not 100% compliant with some of our frost heaved roads, is worlds better than stock.  I'd already changed the fork springs from 1.00 to .90 (lighter springs.)  Additionally the rep recommended:
- remove valves, and if only two bleed holes, drill two more in each valve.  We did that.
- set RaceTech valve springs at two turns from where spring contacted the adjustment bolt.  We did that, too.
- try 10w fork oil, 150mm below top of fork tube with springs out, and forks compressed.  Done.
- set fork spring preload initially with fork caps 5mm above tubes, with legs extended.  Done.
Having made those changes, and previously adding a set of Ikon shocks to the rear, I'm getting there (I think.)

Forks are still slightly too stiff ..... may swap out .90 springs for a pair of .80 springs (lighter yet.)

There's still adjustments that can be made to the RaceTech valves.  RaceTech has invited me to call back with my results after making the first set of changes.

Simply getting used to the low rpm, high torque in line 4 is taking some getting used to.  But I must admit, after today's ride, that 1140cc engine truly is a torque monster.  Though red line is at about 8500rpm, running to 5000rpm in the first 3-4 gears has the bike moving along nicely.   60mph in 6th gear = 2800rpm (approx)

Remains to be seen whether I'll stay with the Honda.  I think it is taking time to get used to a turbine-like engine that makes torque this low, and still has 2500 - 3000 left.  I may give the suspension a few more tweaks, and give this bike a fair chance to prove itself.  I think it just might do that!

It is an easy bike to handle, and carries its weight very low.  The tires are rather narrow, which makes for a bike that switches line quite easily.  Controls, in particular the clutch, are light.

Hopefully, I can get this bargain basement bike set up to my liking.

Bob





Bob

[fotoguzzi]

Though red line is at about 8500rpm,

that surprises me.. I thought 4 cyl motors rev'd way past that..

but yeah, sell it.

[ohiorider]

Though red line is at about 8500rpm,

that surprises me.. I thought 4 cyl motors rev'd way past that..

but yeah, sell it.

Well, then .... remain surprised.

[LowRyter]

Have to say, it's a bike I don't get.  There are many contemporary 4 cyl Japanese bikes that offer a lot of performance.   This one is a contemporary 4 cyl  bike bike that offer nostalgia and little else.  Of course you would find a genuine classic 4 cyl Japanese bike and have more performance.

[fotoguzzi]

I once had a GPZ that didn't have much torq down low but on the boil would  make my eyeballs tear up..  can't really remember but red line must have been over 1200?




and this was the tuned down Kawasaki of the era..

looks like it's going 60 on the center stand.

[Turin]

I almost bought one of those a few years back ( the GPZ ).  I'm not surprised they didn't catch on, it's not like the ZX-11 was an uncomfortable torture rack. I loved the torque and thought it looked cool as hell. ( bought my triumph instead).

[antmanbee]

I once had a GPZ that didn't have much torq down low but on the boil would  make my eyeballs tear up..  can't really remember but red line must have been over 1200?

Wow 1200. My high performance machine idles at 1200. (not one to brag)

[cookiemech]

I guess the lukewarm comments speak to the reason that the CB1100 hasn't sold well in the US . . . But my 2017 CB1100 EX is the sweetest motorcycle I have ever ridden. I can run it up to sixth gear at 40 mph and pretend it's an automatic. Suspension, brakes, handling . . . terrific! Never a tank below 50 mpg, and lately I've seen 58 mpg twice.

But no, it's not hard-edged and doesn't touch the performance capabilities that the modern Japanese (or other) bikes have today.

Out of my six bikes, it and the Road King are getting all my attention these (summer) days.

[twodogs]

Hi Bob, I have only owned 1 4cyl. Honda and it was gone within 3000 miles and I have road all makes of 4 cyl bikes and always come back to the twins, maybe you are the same way 
Bruce

[Chuck in Indiana]

I've never warmed up to a 4 cylinder bike either, FWIW. Different strokes and all that.

[Nic in Western NYS]

I've never warmed up to a 4 cylinder bike either, FWIW. Different strokes and all that.

No more I-4s for me because of the high frequency vibrations, but open to a tidy little V-4

[tazio]

Was at our local car/bike show last weekend, this gentleman had a few tasty custom parts on his CB1100, including the gas tank. Beautiful.
I've had some bikes for many years that have had less then stellar suspension, or some other flaw.
Each one spoke to me in other ways..
If you find yourself trying too hard, where's the fun in that?
You'll figure it out
 

[Travlr]

I'm looking at your bike collection:

Main ride:  2008 Guzzi 1200 Sport
Recent addition:  2012 Griso 8v SE (sold Sept '15)
Reliable standby: 1991 BMW R100GS
New Arrival: 2014 Honda CB1100

You have 2 bikes in the same, big naked, class.  The Sport and the CB1100.
I've generally found that when this happens, you pick one and ride it.
The other sits.

When/if you get the Honda right do you think you will ride it?
Or will you take the Sport?

If so, you might be better off keeping the Sport and trading the CB for a different style of bike?
Perhaps a sport tourer and have the Sport and a LeMans or Ducati ST4S
or a different adventure bike: a Sport and a Stelvio
or a dirt bike? A Sport and a KTM

M

[ohiorider]

I'm looking at your bike collection:

Main ride:  2008 Guzzi 1200 Sport
Recent addition:  2012 Griso 8v SE (sold Sept '15)
Reliable standby: 1991 BMW R100GS
New Arrival: 2014 Honda CB1100

You have 2 bikes in the same, big naked, class.  The Sport and the CB1100.
I've generally found that when this happens, you pick one and ride it.
The other sits.

When/if you get the Honda right do you think you will ride it?
Or will you take the Sport?

If so, you might be better off keeping the Sport and trading the CB for a different style of bike?
Perhaps a sport tourer and have the Sport and a LeMans or Ducati ST4S
or a different adventure bike: a Sport and a Stelvio
or a dirt bike? A Sport and a KTM

M

Even though on paper the 1200S and CB weight about the same, the Honda carries its weight much lower, and is overall an easier bike for me to handle around town.  I think I may be parting with the 1200S due to the fact that at 5'7", she's beginning to feel a bit top heavy for me, plus I think my future rides will be closer to home (day trips.)  The CB, when sorted out, would probably be the bike of choice for that kind of riding.  I view the 12S as a mile eating sport tourer, and the CB as more of a local ride.

The R100GS will have some $$ thrown at it later this month, and will be in reserve for times when the impulse to travel strikes.

[Chuck in Indiana]

No more I-4s for me because of the high frequency vibrations, but open to a tidy little V-4

Yeah, that. I had a Honda V4 that had apparently been built by Asian midgets because my "Merican fingers were too big to get into the valve train.  It *was* an engaging engine to operate, though, even if outrageously complicated.

[Sheepdog]

You’ve undertaken a good approach with your Honda, Bob. You may find that the journey you and the CB make together as you correct shortfalls will cement a lasting relationship. Different (whether it’s continent of origin or engine configuration) is not necessarily better, but it’s tough to know for sure without properly trying it out. There are no uncorrectable faults, dealers are plentiful, and the Honda is a pretty good homage to an acknowledged classic. Your CB1100 may be just what you need at this stage of your life, but in the end only you can make that judgment...

[LowRyter]

4 cyl bikes are very nice.  They can have a broader powerband than a twin.  They certainly can have more power on top.

My nic with the this CB is it's a nostalgia 4 cyl with the performance of a twin. I've got 75 HP on my Guzzi, I want 100 hp from a four.

Nothing like a I-4 cyl with a pipe on it and running it 10k.  V4s really sound good too.  So do triples.

But since most new bikes are water cooled,injected and have balance shafts,  they can produce 100hp+ out of just about anything whether twin, triple, four, six cyl.  It's pretty much order your power and styling into any package you want. 

[MacGlennon]

Bob-
I always like the posts that you make and I try to follow you (but not in a creepy way). I too have got a 1200 sport and just recently this past year, traded my BMW gs in on a V7III in an effort to get a lighter and lower bike.
It started off a little rocky. The bike felt tiny and kind of gutless, but as I’ve ridden it more I’ve come to like ithe easy way of which it rides- it’s a good machine.
Despite this, whenever I see one of those cb1100s, I get a little yearn in my stomach (just the black ones). What I’m saying is- I wish you the best of luck with your bike, and I truly hope that you get it to a place where you positively bond with it. However, if at some point down the road you might consider a swap for my v7 I might be interested. As I’m writing this it seems kinda crazy and if my wife knew what I was doing I’m also wondering how much she would kill me (heehee).
Just throwing it out there- best of luck.
Jim

[mjptexas]

4 cyl bikes are very nice.  They can have a broader powerband than a twin.  They certainly can have more power on top.

My nic with the this CB is it's a nostalgia 4 cyl with the performance of a twin. I've got 75 HP on my Guzzi, I want 100 hp from a four.

Nothing like a I-4 cyl with a pipe on it and running it 10k.  V4s really sound good too.  So do triples.

But since most new bikes are water cooled,injected and have balance shafts,  they can produce 100hp+ out of just about anything whether twin, triple, four, six cyl.  It's pretty much order your power and styling into any package you want.

Summed up pretty well.  Over the years I've owned more 4 cylinder bikes than any other format.  This was one of my favorites:





About 110 hp with an ungodly torque curve.  Had it for 10 years.

[Daleroso]

Aaah, but with the right exhaust there are few sounds as exhilerating as the tortured scream of a japanese multi. (Yes, a twin or triple with the right exhaust can rival.)
Honda's 250 6, CBX with a D&D, a Yoshimura on about anything, LaFranconi Comps are a few examples.

[Turin]

Looking at the specs, I think I'd rather have a ZRX. Better yet,  These first gen 1200 Triumphs are beasts and can be had for cheap.

[JohninVT]

Summed up pretty well.  Over the years I've owned more 4 cylinder bikes than any other format.  This was one of my favorites:





About 110 hp with an ungodly torque curve.  Had it for 10 years.

I bought a ZRX1100 new the first year they came out and kept it 10 years.  Power mods included ZX11 cams, a full titanium Apkrapovic system, pod filters, Ivan's jet kit and ignition advancer.  I also installed Woodcraft clip ons, Sato rear sets, a steering damper, a ZX-6 USD fork and a round headlight.  It's easy to get 140-150hp using flatslides but I didn't bother.  Mine had about 130hp at the rear wheel.  My 75 year old father rides a ZX-11 and my ZRX would pull it from 60 to 100mph.  I used to troll for kids on GSX-R's in the White mountains and I'd always laugh when they'd inevitably pull over while I was sitting on the side of the road taking a break and ask, "What IS that thing?!"  Great fun.  The ZRX 1100 and 1200 will be collectables but not for another ten years.  In comparison, I took a CB1100 for a spin when they first came out and found it an underpowered, overly heavy, wobbly antique.  However, they're finished about 1,000% nicer than a ZRX.  I can see the allure of OWNING a CB1100 but I'd much rather RIDE a ZRX.         

[JJ]

For whatever your reasons, if you are not happy with it..."farm it out"...as there are PLENTY of other worthy two-wheels choices out there!

"Life is too short to drive ANY boring motorcycle..."

[LowRyter]

just a bargain bin bike



82k miles, getting clutch #4.

[Kev m]

As some of you know, I purchased a leftover 2014 Honda CB1100 (actually an 1140cc engine) in April of 2017.  Not been happy with this bike since that time. 

I should have stopped reading here.... And you should have stopped THINKING there.

That is all.

[ohiorider]

Thank you, Kev M.  Your thoughts are quite generous.

[Kev m]

Thank you, Kev M.  Your thoughts are quite generous.

I hope you know my post was neither a complaint nor an insult. It was an observation, a glimpse of myself, overthinking, missing the forest for the trees, trying again and again to justify with my head the truths my heart already knew...

[Ncdan]

Though red line is at about 8500rpm,

that surprises me.. I thought 4 cyl motors rev'd way past that..

but yeah, sell it.

Best I remember our 82 900 CB customs, in-line 4s redlined at 10500rpm

[twowheeladdict]

As some of you know, I purchased a leftover 2014 Honda CB1100 (actually an 1140cc engine) in April of 2017.  Not been happy with this bike since that time.  But recently, I spent phone time with a rep from RaceTech, who gave me some tips on tuning the RaceTech Gold emulator valves that now reside in the front forks.  The results are encouraging.  The front end, though not 100% compliant with some of our frost heaved roads, is worlds better than stock.  I'd already changed the fork springs from 1.00 to .90 (lighter springs.)  Additionally the rep recommended:
- remove valves, and if only two bleed holes, drill two more in each valve.  We did that.
- set RaceTech valve springs at two turns from where spring contacted the adjustment bolt.  We did that, too.
- try 10w fork oil, 150mm below top of fork tube with springs out, and forks compressed.  Done.
- set fork spring preload initially with fork caps 5mm above tubes, with legs extended.  Done.
Having made those changes, and previously adding a set of Ikon shocks to the rear, I'm getting there (I think.)

Forks are still slightly too stiff ..... may swap out .90 springs for a pair of .80 springs (lighter yet.)

There's still adjustments that can be made to the RaceTech valves.  RaceTech has invited me to call back with my results after making the first set of changes.

Simply getting used to the low rpm, high torque in line 4 is taking some getting used to.  But I must admit, after today's ride, that 1140cc engine truly is a torque monster.  Though red line is at about 8500rpm, running to 5000rpm in the first 3-4 gears has the bike moving along nicely.   60mph in 6th gear = 2800rpm (approx)

Remains to be seen whether I'll stay with the Honda.  I think it is taking time to get used to a turbine-like engine that makes torque this low, and still has 2500 - 3000 left.  I may give the suspension a few more tweaks, and give this bike a fair chance to prove itself.  I think it just might do that!

It is an easy bike to handle, and carries its weight very low.  The tires are rather narrow, which makes for a bike that switches line quite easily.  Controls, in particular the clutch, are light.

Hopefully, I can get this bargain basement bike set up to my liking.

Bob





Bob

Never heard an Inline four engine described that way.  Even my Concours 1400 was docile until you opened the throttle.  Unlike my Versys 650 twin and Yamaha FZ-07 twin that would loft the front tire if you gave it some good throttle. 

I could have bought a new Honda back in 14 for around $7k and after the test ride on lookout mountain I passed.  Good thing, but that was around the time I found the Guzzi Cafe Classic. 

[Nic in Western NYS]

As some of you know, I purchased a leftover 2014 Honda CB1100 (actually an 1140cc engine) in April of 2017.  Not been happy with this bike since that time.  But recently, I spent phone time with a rep from RaceTech, who gave me some tips on tuning the RaceTech Gold emulator valves that now reside in the front forks.  The results are encouraging.  The front end, though not 100% compliant with some of our frost heaved roads, is worlds better than stock.  I'd already changed the fork springs from 1.00 to .90 (lighter springs.)  Additionally the rep recommended:
- remove valves, and if only two bleed holes, drill two more in each valve.  We did that.
- set RaceTech valve springs at two turns from where spring contacted the adjustment bolt.  We did that, too.
- try 10w fork oil, 150mm below top of fork tube with springs out, and forks compressed.  Done.
- set fork spring preload initially with fork caps 5mm above tubes, with legs extended.  Done.
Having made those changes, and previously adding a set of Ikon shocks to the rear, I'm getting there (I think.)

Forks are still slightly too stiff ..... may swap out .90 springs for a pair of .80 springs (lighter yet.)

There's still adjustments that can be made to the RaceTech valves.  RaceTech has invited me to call back with my results after making the first set of changes.

Simply getting used to the low rpm, high torque in line 4 is taking some getting used to.  But I must admit, after today's ride, that 1140cc engine truly is a torque monster.  Though red line is at about 8500rpm, running to 5000rpm in the first 3-4 gears has the bike moving along nicely.   60mph in 6th gear = 2800rpm (approx)

Remains to be seen whether I'll stay with the Honda.  I think it is taking time to get used to a turbine-like engine that makes torque this low, and still has 2500 - 3000 left.  I may give the suspension a few more tweaks, and give this bike a fair chance to prove itself.  I think it just might do that!

It is an easy bike to handle, and carries its weight very low.  The tires are rather narrow, which makes for a bike that switches line quite easily.  Controls, in particular the clutch, are light.

Hopefully, I can get this bargain basement bike set up to my liking.

Bob





Bob

Bob, before you sell the bike, do your best to imagine not having the _positive_ experiences you have with it.  Forget the negatives.  It will be the positives that you will regret not having.  If there aren't strong positives of any kind, then the regrets should be mild.  Hope your decision works out in the long run either way.