Author Topic: NGC- failed lasik issues?  (Read 624 times)

Offline cliffrod

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NGC- failed lasik issues?
« on: January 23, 2023, 11:46:52 AM »
Wondering if anyone here has been through or is tangent to negative result lasik-type surgery with eyes?  A very close friend (mid 60ís) had both eyes done around a year ago and all was great- best vision in many years.  It was like magic.  Then came the touch-up procedure and itís not gone well.  Not sure if heís legally blind now but probably is.  He also cannot tolerate anything more than moderate light levels. Itís very sobering and weíre frustrated with lack of progress since the problems began, even with changing doctors. 

Recently he spoke with an older & now retired doctor of his (GP, not eye Dr) who apparently went through same thing- first surgery went great, touch-up didnít and now heís completely blind in one eye and can barely see with the other.  He had no positive advice towards resolution, either.  It was not good news.

Has anyone here been through similar issues and possibly reached a better outcome? 
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Offline Dirk_S

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2023, 12:36:45 PM »
A close friend had PRK done in one eye, LASIK in the other. The LASIK eye developed a microbial growth on the cornea and needed to be cleaned out. The growth caused some serious discomfort and vision issues. Heís doing better now, and both eyes are better than they were pre-surgery, but the LASIK eye is not as strong as the PRK eye.

I had LASIK done about 12 years ago, the advanced technique because I wanted peregrine falcon vision after so many years of awful nearsightedness. One eye just needed a slight touch up, and Iíve been solid since. Only issue is they get fatigued a little sooner, and a little dryer.

I read some of the long-term horror stories AFTER the surgery.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2023, 03:08:25 PM by Dirk_S »
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Offline normzone

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #2 on: January 23, 2023, 12:51:52 PM »
I worked with a fellow who had the operation - apparently your brain is supposed to adapt to one eye long distance, one eye closeup.

His brain never did adapt, he went through five surgeries to try different variations, and eventually they gave up and put his vision back the way it was when they started.
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Offline Ncdan

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #3 on: January 23, 2023, 03:06:41 PM »
This surgery is a modern day miracle for some people as well as a living nightmare for others.
My wife was legally blind and had to wear contacts because glasses looked like she was wearing the bottom of coke bottles, because the lenses were so thick.
She had the surgery done over 20 years ago and came out with 20/15 vision. I think the last eye exam she was down to 20/20. She did have to start using reading glasses a couple years ago due to the natural aging process.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2023, 05:43:20 PM by Ncdan »

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #3 on: January 23, 2023, 03:06:41 PM »

Offline Bulldog9

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #4 on: January 23, 2023, 05:17:06 PM »
I had PRK 20 years ago. Due to a welding incident as a teenager, my left eye eliminated me from the Lasic/flap. I also wanted PRK because the idea of jumping out of an airplane and potential HALO jumps (not the video game) made PRK the way to go. Was gnarly and had to wear special contacts for the first week or so. I did have some bad scarring and issues with healing that required special drops, but once settled has been good. As the layer regrew, the center had scarring so I couldnt see straight ahead, but out the sides. Was very strange.

Am definitely more light sensitive since, and get best sight with regular drops. Never even thought about a touchup and now glad I didn't.

My dad had eye surgery recently (85) he had the lens replaced with a piece of plastic? He is seeing better than he has in years, they did one eye at a time with about 3 months between.
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Offline normzone

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #5 on: January 23, 2023, 05:31:42 PM »
I believe the lens replacement with plastic is standard procedure these days, I'm told that by the time I develop enough cataracts to address them they'll just do the plastic lens replacement instead.
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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2023, 02:51:12 AM »
I worked with a guy that had a ton of issues after. It took a few years to get straightened out. They wont touch mine. Vary near sighted, and the left is terrible. Aliso the left has nerve issues so even corrected I dont so much as see out of it, but it just kinda fills in the picture for the other eye..  They said they wont touch the left because even if its corrected, I still will not see great out of it, and they dont want to touch the right because thats the one eye I have that does its job.
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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2023, 08:45:40 AM »
Wait until you get cataracts. When they replace the lenses of your eyes they can custom grind the new lenses to correct your vision. I was horribly nearsighted with astigmatism in both eyes. Now my distance vision is 20/25 and I just need readers. YMMV.
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Offline tommy2cyl

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2023, 09:21:58 AM »
Try to keep this short: 
1. LASIK has over a 96% satisfaction rate.
2. There is always risk with any surgery.
3. There is less than 1% risk of serious ocular complications.  That of course is of little consolation if you are in the 1%. 
4. Normal side effects are dry eye.
5. One eye focus near & one far is called mono vision with the near eye the non dominant eye.  Most of the time that can be demonstrated to
   the patient with contacts prior to LASIK so patient can determine if that is an option they would like.  Many times the patient is a contact lens
   patient who has worn mono vision so they are familiar. 
6. Sometimes you can have central corneal haze but this is primarily with PRK.  PRK is chosen over LASIK if the cornea is too thin for the LASIK
    procedure.
7. Cataract removal and IOL (IntraOcular Lens) corrects your vision with the implant.  There are IOL's that correct not only distance but astigmatism and
   near vision as well.  Called Toric and Multifocal.  There can be some minor side effects with the MF lens.
8. I have referred literally thousands of patients for LASIK and to date have never had a single patient not ultimately be satisfied.  Choosing the right
    patient and right surgeon are critical to satisfactory outcomes.
9.  I am currently dealing with a patient that had PRK done many years ago and had severe central corneal haze.  She was not patient originally and
    procedure done prior to being my patient.  She was resigned to 20/50 BCVA (best corrected visual acuity) in each eye.  I was able to refer her
    to a top corneal surgeon where corneal transplants were completed.  Then over 8 months per eye were required for both corneae to stabilize and
    now the is having cataracts surgery to complete this long ordeal for her.  She will ultimately be able to see 20/25 BCVA out of each eye but this has
   been one of the 1% group that needed extensive procedures to get her back to "happy vision."
10.  There is an option called an ICL which is an internal contact lens which is implanted inside the eye.  If the patient has a high Rx or dry eyes & can't
      wear traditional soft or gas perm contacts, this can be an option.  This is different than an IOL.  Not as many ophthalmologists do this procedure.
I hope some of this information is of value.  Just trying to hit the bullet points here.   Overall, LASIK is an exceedingly safe procedure and truly a
game changer for people with large refractive error.  But, there is always risk with any surgical procedure.

Offline Ncdan

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #9 on: January 24, 2023, 09:38:58 AM »
Great information and thanks for sharing with the WGC family.

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Offline cliffrod

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #10 on: January 24, 2023, 09:52:10 AM »
Wow, thank you very much tommy2cyl.  That gives us some better perspective about the entire situation.  I will share it with him as general info from an unnamed internet post, not binding advice.

My friend had very bad cataracts fixed.  I didnít want to say LASIK because I wasnít certain it was that actual proprietary procedure.  We have talked about the always-present statistical failure rate, what that means and that he may simply be that data point, no matter what.  Itís just a real drag to helplessly watch a close friend go blind. 

Thank you again.
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Offline tommy2cyl

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #11 on: January 24, 2023, 11:19:01 AM »
Cliffrod:

Just to clarify.  LASIK is a laser procedure that is done to the front clear window of the eye (cornea) to reshape the curvature to correct for
near sighted (myopia) far sighted (hyperopia) and astigmatism.  This procedure is primarily done on patients aged from 22 to about 50.  It
is not done sooner because the refractive error is usually not stable until around 22.  Usually not done after 50-55 because people are
experiencing presbyopia (lack of near focus ability) so they would still need glasses for near vision so the motivation for LASIK isn't as great.
Also one can amortize the cost over a longer period of time and the cornea heals quicker when we are younger.

Cataract surgery is removing the cloudy lens on the inside of the eye due to aging and replacing with the IOL.  This is the most practiced surgical procedure in
the world. The IOL fits inside of a bag or capsule that the old lens came out of.  Often times the back of this capsule can become cloudy after cataract surgery.
This is called secondary membrane and happens at least 50% post cataract usually within 6 months to 2-3 years.  This is easily corrected with a laser
called YAG which is basically like taking a broom and knocking the cobwebs out of the way.  This is done quickly behind an instrument and only takes
literally a few minutes.  After it is done it doesn't come back.

The other important part of this is the health of the optic nerve and macula.  Even if the cataract has been removed, IOL implanted and all is clear, if the
optic nerve is compromised, as in with high pressure and glaucoma as an example, then the vision can be compromised.  The most common problem is
AMD (Age Related Macular Degeneration).  As we age the very tiny location in the back of the eye on the retina where the light is focused is called the
macula.  This is a tiny are 2-4 mm, and if this area is compromised due to pigmentation, cholesterol deposits (drusen) or hemorrhage and edema due to
diabetes, then the vision can be moderately to severely compromised. 

So, even if the cataract surgery is done well and the cornea is clear, if the macula is compromised this can lead to blindness.  It would be HIGHLY
unlikely to become blind from LASIK and Cataract surgery.  On the rare occasion, interior infection can occur post cataract surgery and enophthalmitis
(interior inflammation of the globe of the eye) can occur and this can be fast and devastating.  I have only seen this a couple times in my career and
it is heartbreaking.  It sounds like to me that your friend may need an evaluation by a retinal specialist to evaluate the health of the back of the eye.
Difficult to pinpoint your friends situation without more specific data, but again, hope this helps.

Offline tommy2cyl

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #12 on: January 24, 2023, 11:23:03 AM »
Oh, and the other possibility to rule out is retinal detachment, which again can be fully evaluated by a retinal specialist.

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #13 on: January 24, 2023, 12:08:05 PM »
I got an IOL after cataract surgery and they got the prescription wrong. Still have to wear glasses and now have massive floaters, too. Itís like seeing through a really dirty gold fish bowl.  :sad:

Offline drdwb

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #14 on: January 24, 2023, 12:51:50 PM »
About 20 years ago I considered having eye corrective surgery. I have an Optometrist friend of over 30 years, he wears glasses, I told him I was considering it and asked why he didnít have the procedure done. His response was very honest and thought provoking, He said you only have one pair of eyes, why would you risk having a surgery that can not be undone, there is always scar tissue no matter how well the procedure is done. Essentially why would you risk permanently damaging your eyes if corrective lens help. Any surgical procedure has risks. To paraphrase Dirty Harry / Clint Eastwood, to you feel lucky kid?  Just my opinion.
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Offline LongRanger

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #15 on: January 24, 2023, 01:04:53 PM »
Best money I ever spent. My LASIK procedure was over 20 years ago, went from 20/1800 to 20/40. Quite liberating!
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Offline cliffrod

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2023, 01:41:00 PM »
Cliffrod:

Just to clarify.  LASIK is a laser procedure that is done to the front clear window of the eye (cornea) to reshape the curvature to correct for
near sighted (myopia) far sighted (hyperopia) and astigmatism.  This procedure is primarily done on patients aged from 22 to about 50.  It
is not done sooner because the refractive error is usually not stable until around 22.  Usually not done after 50-55 because people are
experiencing presbyopia (lack of near focus ability) so they would still need glasses for near vision so the motivation for LASIK isn't as great.
Also one can amortize the cost over a longer period of time and the cornea heals quicker when we are younger.

Cataract surgery is removing the cloudy lens on the inside of the eye due to aging and replacing with the IOL.  This is the most practiced surgical procedure in
the world. The IOL fits inside of a bag or capsule that the old lens came out of.  Often times the back of this capsule can become cloudy after cataract surgery.
This is called secondary membrane and happens at least 50% post cataract usually within 6 months to 2-3 years.  This is easily corrected with a laser
called YAG which is basically like taking a broom and knocking the cobwebs out of the way.  This is done quickly behind an instrument and only takes
literally a few minutes.  After it is done it doesn't come back.

The other important part of this is the health of the optic nerve and macula.  Even if the cataract has been removed, IOL implanted and all is clear, if the
optic nerve is compromised, as in with high pressure and glaucoma as an example, then the vision can be compromised.  The most common problem is
AMD (Age Related Macular Degeneration).  As we age the very tiny location in the back of the eye on the retina where the light is focused is called the
macula.  This is a tiny are 2-4 mm, and if this area is compromised due to pigmentation, cholesterol deposits (drusen) or hemorrhage and edema due to
diabetes, then the vision can be moderately to severely compromised. 

So, even if the cataract surgery is done well and the cornea is clear, if the macula is compromised this can lead to blindness.  It would be HIGHLY
unlikely to become blind from LASIK and Cataract surgery.  On the rare occasion, interior infection can occur post cataract surgery and enophthalmitis
(interior inflammation of the globe of the eye) can occur and this can be fast and devastating.  I have only seen this a couple times in my career and
it is heartbreaking.  It sounds like to me that your friend may need an evaluation by a retinal specialist to evaluate the health of the back of the eye.
Difficult to pinpoint your friends situation without more specific data, but again, hope this helps.

This information does help.  Iím in a unique spot, trying to help but maintain some distance from the situation so I donít inherit all of it like has happened previously with some of his health concerns.  Full time eldercare for my deteriorating 81 yo mother is enough.  I understand macular degeneration in general.  My recently deceased 90 yo uncle (also under our full time care for his last 4 yrs until he died)  had md & related problems that grew increasingly worse and were challenging when paired with his Parkinsonís-related hallucination.  I do understand the differences between lasik procedure to reshape the cornea vs cataract surgery to resolve lens issues, but am limited on accurate info vs accompanying him throughout everything to be his medical representative (again), full time driver, etc. 

What I know is that after serious lost capacity (supposedly) due to cataracts, this friend had both eyes done.  Great improvement.  Follow-up treatment plus different eye drops quickly wrecked his vision and produced significant pain & pressure, Crazy red bloodshot eyes, cloudy pupils and light sensitivity issues.  He has tried a different dr with different treatment producing minor improvement (less discomfort from pressure, whites are white-ish, not painful)  but no noticeable improvement re lost vision.

Thanks again. 
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Online Joliet Jim

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Re: NGC- failed lasik issues?
« Reply #17 on: January 24, 2023, 02:11:47 PM »
He said you only have one pair of eyes, why would you risk having a surgery that can not be undone, there is always scar tissue no matter how well the procedure is done.

Pretty much the way my eyedoc and myself felt with only one eye that wasn't irreversibly damaged. Unfortunately the eye pressure spike to 56 and blindness in my good eye forced the issue. Two months out and so far so good. Maybe I will be able to keep riding.
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