VW, now THAT is a major problem.

[oldbike54]

 Geez , a plot by the white house , really , come on now 

  Dusty

[jas67]

The lawyers are already starting up the class-action suits.     Well, that didn't take long.

http://www.hbsslaw.com/cases-and-investigations/cases/Volkswagen-Emissions

http://www.krcomplexlit.com/index.asp?N=attorneys-Seattle-WA-Volkswagen-Investigation&C=517&P=15144

[AJ Huff]

There is something very inconsistent in the stories so far.  Claims that if the emissions were set properly then the cars would start getting worse mileage than they do now.  I've got a 2014 TDI SE Passat and over 5000 miles since I bought it back in January, I am averaging 40 mpg...mostly highway, a little bit of city mixed in.

This is comparable to what I'm getting on my 09 Jetta TDI. I'd say average is 38 mpg at home. On the flat interstate with cruise control set to 70 it gets pretty close to 50 mpg.

-AJ

[AJ Huff]

Maybe in the US, but in the rest of the world PSA (who produce Citroen and Peugeot and are the fifth biggest auotmobile manufacturers) have far superior technology and lower pollution.  They have been running particulate filters for at least ten years in Australia now.

I never see any smoke from PSA cars with PFs, but always used to see ugly black smoke from VWs in Aus.

Even particulate filters are old hat now, diesel trucks and some diesel cars here now run Ad-Blue which is basically liquid urea, injectected into the exhaust to kill NOx emissions.

Very true. Diesel CARS in the US still are not well accepted and I think VW/Audi diesels are the most respected over here. Probably due to better marketing but we have very few options to choose from. I think I've seen one BMW diesel? And Mercedes has there's.  I'm not even sure that there is a domestic option available. People's memory of the of the Oldsmobile diesel engine still lingers thanks to oral history, almost like tall tales.

At home I have no problem finding diesel but my last two trips to Ohio I had real issues trying to find a diesel pump.

My visits to Dusselldorf it SEEMED like 2 of every 3 cars was diesel. I'm sure it is not that high in reality but it was more than significantly higher than how many diesel cars are available here.

-AJ

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Looking at the bigger picture, how will this effect Ducati?

I'm not even sure that there is a domestic option available. People's memory of the of the Oldsmobile diesel engine still lingers thanks to oral history, almost like tall tales.

The Chevy Cruze has an available diesel, but at a ridiculous premium.

[rocker59]

If VW can do it, any OEM can do it.

This may be tip of the iceberg.

Unintended consequence of all the super-high-tech gadgetry.  It can be programmed to do things other than what is advertised.

[jas67]

Very true. Diesel CARS in the US still are not well accepted and I think VW/Audi diesels are the most respected over here. Probably due to better marketing but we have very few options to choose from. I think I've seen one BMW diesel? And Mercedes has there's.  I'm not even sure that there is a domestic option available. People's memory of the of the Oldsmobile diesel engine still lingers thanks to oral history, almost like tall tales.

I would predict that this kills the diesel passenger car market, at least for VW.    VW have a hybrid Jetta, and the electric Golf-E is soon to be on the market.
They will abandon selling the TDI here, and replace it with hybrids and electrics as their high-MPG cars to appease the CAFE requirements (just as all the other makes have).

[LowRyter]

Being a lover of conspiracies, I note that VW USA employees recently chose to vote against union membership--to the dismay of VW HQ itself, and of course the White House. The Chicago Way is to punish people for failing to toe the party line, so maybe VW was now under especially close federal regulatory scrutiny...

Or as Mayor Daley might have said, "We have to scrutin them."

really?  geeesus




paranoia -  projection  -  transference 

[LowRyter]

http://www.theguardian.com/business/video/2015/sep/22/us-volkswagen-michael-horn-video


The head of Volkswagen America, Michael Horn, says at a promotional event in New York on Monday that the carmaker was dishonest with US emission regulators and the public after manipulating engine software to falsify emisisons data. Shares in Volkswagen fell by almost a fifth on Monday after the carmaker issued a public apology

[tonUPRacer]

Oh well, now then, who's gonna do the first meme mashup of Lance Armstrong in a VW TDI?
cr

LOL. If you recall VW was a sponsor of the now infamous Lance Armstrong doping USPS Squad. I actually have the Trek USPS team bike of the 2002 vintage. When I bought it, it had a VW sticker on it and I  removed it and replaced it with a Ducati Power sticker.

[Lannis]

GM is buying their way out of the ignition switch deaths coverup for just under a billion, nobody going to jail, and some firings. If they can do that then I doubt VW can do worse...

You would think that these "big guys" would know that they're eventually going to get caught cheating, and wouldn't even try that stuff ... Like GM did, or, recently, Toshiba who overstated their earnings by over a billion dollars trying to fool the banks and investors, or AT&T who went completely out of business by misstating (i.e., lying like a big dog) capital vs. operational expenses.

I suppose the guilty have already made it to Rio with the boodle by the time the rest get to explain what "happened" and pay for it ....

Lannis

[sib]

.....the carmaker issued a public apology

"We apologize and are very sorry we got caught".  How many times have we heard that from politicians?

[LowRyter]

LOL. If you recall VW was a sponsor of the now infamous Lance Armstrong doping USPS Squad. I actually have the Trek USPS team bike of the 2002 vintage. When I bought it, it had a VW sticker on it and I  removed it and replaced it with a Ducati Power sticker.

ya'know that VW bought Ducati? 

[rocker59]

really?  geeesus

"Bush's fault, Obama's fault, nobody's fault... it won't matter - I'm gonna turn up my TDI. No matter what else happens, no matter who gets offended, I'm gonna roll coal, brother."

[LowRyter]

"We apologize and are very sorry we got caught".  How many times have we heard that from politicians?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbTYhAhJryA

[PJPR01]

I have a very similar car in that its a 2012 2.0l TDI CR with DPF fitted Skoda Octavia with 60k+ miles on the clock

Mine does 60MPG (50 US MPG) all day everyday and  I've seen 70MPG (58 US MPG) on a run.  Now mine is a  6 speed manual and I guess yours is an auto but is that enough to make the difference given the auto should lock up at highway speeds?

 

Same here Tris, mine is a 6 speed manual as well.  If I'm cruising on the highway, I can see upwards of 46 to 48mpg...a few weeks ago, I did Houston to Austin and back (around 350 miles) and averaged 46 mpg.  Not too shabby!

[PJPR01]

"We apologize and are very sorry we got caught".  How many times have we heard that from politicians?

  EVERY time...just play the tape and change the Brand name...same story all the time! 

[jas67]

Press release, Sept 20:
http://media.vw.com/release/1066/

STATEMENT OF PROF. DR. MARTIN WINTERKORN, CEO OF VOLKSWAGEN AG
Sep 20, 2015
Wolfsburg, September 20, 2015 – The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency and the California Air Resources Board (EPA and CARB) revealed their findings that while testing diesel cars of the Volkswagen Group they have detected manipulations that
violate American environmental standards.
 
The Board of Management at Volkswagen AG takes these findings very seriously. I personally am deeply sorry that we have broken the trust of our customers and the public. We will cooperate fully with the responsible agencies, with transparency and urgency, to
clearly, openly, and completely establish all of the facts of this case. Volkswagen has ordered an external investigation of this matter.
 
We do not and will not tolerate violations of any kind of our internal rules or of the law.

The trust of our customers and the public is and continues to be our most important asset. We at Volkswagen will do everything that must be done in order to re-establish the trust that so many people have placed in us, and we will do everything necessary in order to reverse the damage this has caused. This matter has first priority for me, personally, and for our entire Board of Management.
 
Volkswagen Group Communications
Head of Corporate & Business Communications
Andreas Lampersbach
Phone: +49 (0) 53 61 / 9-3 93 56
E-Mail: andreas.lampersbach@volkswagen.de
 
www.volkswagen-media-services.com
www.volkswagenag.co m
Documents

    pdf 30.71 KB 200915vwus

On the heals of this announcement, just 9 days prior:

http://media.vw.com/release/1058/

VOLKSWAGEN IS WORLD'S MOST SUSTAINABLE AUTOMOTIVE GROUP
Sep 11, 2015

    Pole position in Dow Jones Sustainability Index
    Industry Group Leader in the Automobiles & Components sector
    Winterkorn acknowledges "great success for entire team"

The Volkswagen Group has again been listed as the most sustainable automaker in the world's leading sustainability ranking. As in 2013, RobecoSAM AG again classed the company as the Industry Group Leader in the automotive sector in this year's review of the Dow Jones Sustainability Indices (DJSI). Volkswagen is thus one of only two automakers to be listed in both DJSI World and DJSI Europe.

For investors, the Dow Jones Sustainability Index is the most significant benchmark for measuring the development of the world's most sustainable companies. The review analyzed the corporate performance of a total of 33 automotive companies, seven of them from Europe. Volkswagen took pole position with a total of 91 out of 100 possible points. Economic sustainability was awarded 93 points, social sustainability 91 points, and ecological sustainability 89 points.

"This distinction is a great success for the entire team. It confirms that the Volkswagen Group is well on the way to establishing itself long term as the world's most sustainable automaker," commented Prof. Dr. Martin Winterkorn, Chairman of Volkswagen Aktiengesellschaft.

Full marks were awarded to Volkswagen in the areas of codes of conduct, compliance and anti-corruption as well as innovation management, climate strategy and life cycle assessment. The Group is also the industry benchmark for supplier management and environmental reporting. Furthermore, significant progress has been made in human capital development, occupational health and safety, tax strategy and talent attraction.

The experts from RobecoSAM highlighted achievements such as the fact that "sustainability is the foundation of Volkswagen's corporate policy" and that "the company's success has gone hand in hand with an increase in the number and development of employees." Once again in 2014, the Volkswagen Group "invested in new model research and development, and in innovative technologies, which by 2019 will contribute towards developing more efficient vehicles, alternative powertrains, and more environmentally compatible production."

 

Volkswagen AG
Spokesperson Environment and CSR

Stefan Ernst
Letter box 19720
38442 Wolfsburg
Germany
Telephone: +49 (0) 5361 / 9-86267
Telefax: +49 (0) 5361 / 9-74629
E-mail: stefan.ernst1@volkswagen.de

[oldbike54]

"Bush's fault, Obama's fault, nobody's fault... it won't matter - I'm gonna turn up my TDI. No matter what else happens, no matter who gets offended, I'm gonna roll coal, brother."

 It is a plot launched by Captain Chaos  Seriously , a jackass "rolled coal" all over me a couple of years back , it was misting, and that smokey mess was not rising . He thought it was funny until realizing how close he was to , well , it wasn't gonna be pretty .
 Funny picture Mike , who is that guy ?

  Dusty

[PJPR01]

and the CEO is gone...that didn't take long!

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/vw-dismiss-ceo-over-emissions-135635974.html

Raus mit dir Winterkorn - du, du Schweinehund! 

[Lannis]

You know, upon reflection, VW was cheating, and spoofing emissions data, so that they could sell more cars ....

... but how often do we modify our exhausts or our fuel injectors or carbs or whatever for more power, and do something completely illegal in the process as far as emissions go?    We only get by with it because no one's sniffing our tailpipes - if they were, it would be obvious that WE'D broken the law ... ?   

So maybe the thing about specks and beams applies here?    I know that MY beam is pretty intrusive .... !

Lannis

[sib]

"Volkswagen warned that sum could rise, adding diesel cars with so-called Type EA 189 engines built into about 11 million Volkswagen models worldwide had shown a "noticeable deviation" in emission levels between testing and road use."

Gee, to bad it was "noticeable".  Next time we'll do better so that it won't be noticeable.

[Aaron D.]

With Winterkorn gone, can Piech be waiting in the wings?

Wait a minute...

[sib]

German auto supplier Bosch said on Tuesday it had supplied the components to Volkswagen that are now at the centre of the U.S. probe into test rigging.

"We produce the components after specification of Volkswagen," it said in an e-mailed statement. "The responsibility for application and integration of the components lies with Volkswagen."

"I vass only following orderss."  Heard that before.

[ITSec]

GM is buying their way out of the ignition switch deaths coverup for just under a billion, nobody going to jail, and some firings. If they can do that then I doubt VW can do worse...

VW can do MUCH worse - GM didn't purposefully and willfully design their cars to avoid complying with the law (they just were sloppy and then hid things). It's the difference between accident and motive...

That said, GM is getting off light, considering how their cover-up was handled.

[oldbike54]

You know, upon reflection, VW was cheating, and spoofing emissions data, so that they could sell more cars ....

... but how often do we modify our exhausts or our fuel injectors or carbs or whatever for more power, and do something completely illegal in the process as far as emissions go?    We only get by with it because no one's sniffing our tailpipes - if they were, it would be obvious that WE'D broken the law ... ?   

So maybe the thing about specks and beams applies here?    I know that MY beam is pretty intrusive .... !

Lannis

 Awwwwwww damnit , Lannis is right  My guess is that VW will deal with this now that they have been outed , doubt if it will take them down . Talked to a friend this morning that has been driving VW diesels since '89 , now has a 2014 model . He just shrugged and indicated he would have the recall done and doubted the slight performance loss would be noticeable .

  Dusty

[oldbike54]

VW can do MUCH worse - GM didn't purposefully and willfully design their cars to avoid complying with the law (they just were sloppy and then hid things). It's the difference between accident and motive...

That said, GM is getting off light, considering how their cover-up was handled.

 Yeah , but so far no deaths have been linked to the VW debacle .

  Dusty

[ITSec]

You know, upon reflection, VW was cheating, and spoofing emissions data, so that they could sell more cars ....

... but how often do we modify our exhausts or our fuel injectors or carbs or whatever for more power, and do something completely illegal in the process as far as emissions go?    We only get by with it because no one's sniffing our tailpipes - if they were, it would be obvious that WE'D broken the law ... ?   

So maybe the thing about specks and beams applies here?    I know that MY beam is pretty intrusive .... !

Lannis

Well, there are all those products that carry a label "Not for use on any street vehicle" - so at least the manufacturer (of both vehicle and accessory) can say they've met their obligations. The really egregious thing here was not that the emissions regs were not met, but that the company purposefully practiced to deceive and got caught in their own tangled web (thanks for the quote, Walter!).

[oldbike54]

Well, there are all those products that carry a label "Not for use on any street vehicle" - so at least the manufacturer (of both vehicle and accessory) can say they've met their obligations. The really egregious thing here was not that the emissions regs were not met, but that the company purposefully practiced to deceive and got caught in their own tangled web (thanks for the quote, Walter!).

 "Not for use on any street vehicle" , wink wink 

  Dusty

[canuguzzi]

The difference with VW is that there was conspiracy, collusion or both, of the criminal type. When you load up a new map, that is likely in violation of federal law, same with the cat y pipe replacement s. However, you aren't doing it to make money by bypassing emissions regulations nor decieve the consumer. There is no real comparison here.

This is just starting, it isn't a matter of fixing the emissions controls. There are tax incentives, the mpg and emissions averages of their entire model lines, fraud and the list goes on and on. Years ago this might have been a fix, pay fine and forget it. Not these days. Now we're talking many billions of dollars, just in the US market.

Lots of VW owners are cult buyers too, like those buying Subaru's and so on. What the dedicated VW diesel owners say won't matter much and probably won't matter at all, this is way past what the guy down the street thinks or wants. Blood in the water.