Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Pasta Hog on February 05, 2015, 10:41:26 AM
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As noted in another thread, I had a rear flat on my Harley, took it in, and then had another flat on the next ride. I have been rooting around on the web trying to find out how to protect myself in the future. Both of my bikes have tubes.
Carrying spare tubes is not a viable option. Removing tires is impossible without tools, light, and so on. The Guzzi weighs about 600 pounds with gas and fluids, and the Harley is 800 dry, so I am not going to drop them on their sides on the shoulder, gouge them up, and let cars whiz by while I struggle with them.
I just found out about Slime, and I have a question about it. I was thinking I'd put it in both bikes as a preventative measure, but I have read that it can be hard on rims. The manufacturer says not to leave it in a tire for more than two years. The obvious question is, does this mean I have to buy new tubes every two years even if the tires still have life in them?
I am wondering if I should get a Slime repair kit instead, but whatever I get has to fit in a very small fork bag. I'm not buying bags just for this. The fork bag is about the size of a half-gallon milk jug, and it already has the Guzzi toolkit in it.
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I don't think Slime will prevent a flat in tube-type tires. I admit my data is from many years ago when I last tried it..perhaps the recipe has changed?
Peter
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Curious about this as well. Just watching this thread :pop
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They make a recipe just for tubes.
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Carrying a bottle of tube-type Slime and a small air compressor is another option. I'm doing that, and if I ever put the Slime to use I'll report back. I took a cheap 12v compressor out of its fancy plastic case, and it takes up very little room now:
(http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c327/triplejim/motorcycles/guzzi/misc/12v_compressor_zpsf2a8bb03.jpg)
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If the slime is in your tube, then it should not come in contact with the wheel as long as there are no leaks.
Perhaps that warning is for tubeless tires.
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It looks like I made a mistake in reading the instructions for the tube-only Slime. It says it's only guaranteed to WORK for two years. Sorry about that.
No doubt, of the many flat tires that I have had, Slime may have help in some small percentage. But I can't think of any that it would have helped, because those were just a roadside repair, then I drove off, non-event for me.
How did you repair tubed tires beside the road without taking the rims off?
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Definitely not an option for me.
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If you cannot or do not want to tackle roadside repairs your best option is get and insurance policy that offers roadside assistance. Rollback to the rescue.
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I think your best option is to modify the rims so you can use tubeless tires.
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That's what I did. No more tubes.
I did run slime when I had tubes. I was lucky when I had a tube problem (washer left inside) and the slime slowed the leak enough for me to get home (30mi).
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PH , you are looking for a magic fix that probably doesn't exist . Sometimes reality isn't pleasant .
Dusty
How, realistically, do you change a rear flat on an 800-pound FLSTC with bags that don't come off? That's my reality. How do you do that by the side of the road?
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PH , no such thing as 100 % insurance against flats . Right now you are spooked due to having 2 flats in close succession , but chances are you can ride another 50K miles and not have another flat . That said , I think Lannis has been running tube type slime as a precaution with success . It will somewhat increase unsprung weight , and maybe even degrade ride quality a bit . Everything is a trade off .
Dusty
I'll admit, I'm a slime-y guy ... I just don't see any downside to Slime in a tubed tire. First of all, you use about a pint per tire, which weighs about 1 pound. Different tubes alone vary that much in weight, let alone tires, so I don't think that the unsprung weight deal is much of an issue, considered how much SPRUNG weight any motorcycle with the job of hauling me about is carrying. It stays liquid, so it doesn't knock the tire out of balance. It doesn't contact the rim because it's inside the tube I've never had a flat tire on a Slimed tube tire. That doesn't mean they haven't been pierced, but they didn't lose air. And I've had the same Slime in tubes I've re-used on Britbikes for years and years.
I sometimes use it in tubeless tires, especially before a long trip when I know that I'm going to use up the tire within 4 months or so. It IS a mess when I change the tire; if it's me changing it, I just deal with it. If it's the shop doing it, I warn them before hand and sometimes they don't charge any extra and sometimes they charge $5 or $10 extra for cleanup.
But the proof of the pudding is in the eating, says I. I changed one tire on the road in 1978, found one flat on my Centauro in my shed the next day after a ride (tubeless, non-Slimed), and other than that have had no flats. One-up, geared-up, the base load is 275 pounds - two-up for a trip - 425+ pound payload, and I run my tires till the tread is gone.
Comparing my on-the-road flat tire experience with that of others on the list, I'm planning to continue to dance with who brung me ..... ;-T
Lannis
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From the slime website on slime for tubes
Note is says NOT TO BE USED ON SNAKE BITES. :D 8 :'(
http://slime.com/210/products/16-oz-tube-sealant-with-hang-tag-10056ht/
"The inner tube formulation should not be used in a tubeless tire. Slime sealants are designed to treat tread area punctures only and should not be used to repair sidewall punctures, snake bites, rim spoke punctures or gashes from metal or glass".
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How, realistically, do you change a rear flat on an 800-pound FLSTC with bags that don't come off? That's my reality. How do you do that by the side of the road?
Well , that is the problem . Look , not trying to be a smart a$$ , but if you choose to ride an 800 lb bagger with tube tires , you must accept that self imposed problem . Slime , or one of the other tire sealants might help , but there is no magic dust . Flip side . I once assisted a fella repair a flat on an older RK on the side of the road , so it can be done .
Dusty
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I'm not looking for magic dust. Just the best solution.
The latest flat started at some point during a ride of over 100 miles. For part of that ride, I was on the Card Sound toll road, which is nearly empty. There is no real shoulder. There are no cops. There are no call boxes. It was pitch black; there are almost no lights. The bugs there will almost pick you up and carry you off; the misery of being caught in a cloud of them would be nearly unbearable. If I had gotten stuck out there with no alternatives except roadside service and magically conjuring up a friend to help me remove the bags and tire, I would have been in a real mess.
This is why I posted the thread. I was hoping that Slime was a good emergency measure to get me closer to civilization.
It sounds like I should use it and look into some compact means of adding air. I signed up for the AMA, but I would prefer riding to towing, if possible.
I appreciate the responses.
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the best solution is modify the rims and go tubeless.
;-T
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if you are concerned about flats on your touring bike, for gods sake, get tubeless tires. half the time you will not know you have a nail until you see it. other times they will slowly deflate. carry a plug kit and means to inflate. no laying the bike on its side, no getting terribly filthy, no long delays or tows. If you must have wire wheels, then look into one of the many methods for making them tubeless if they are not.
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the best solution is modify the rims and go tubeless.
;-T
Yeah , or simply replace the tube type rims with HD tubeless wheels .
Dusty
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I just had a flat 3 months ago. Drywall screw in the rear tire. I slimed it and it's been holding air since. These are tubed tires and I went ahead and slimed the front tire while I was at it. Curious thing is that I've never had to add air to either tire after that, and it was much warmer then. There is also another similar product called Ride-On I think. Both products claim they will fill a hole up to 1/4 inch in diameter for tubeless and 1/8 inch for tubed tires. I think it is good for the more common punctures like drywall screws and roofing nails. The downside I suppose is that you might not ever notice the puncture if it self seals and riding on something like a screw may do more damage to the tire over time.
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I put Slime in my rear tubeless tire on my Aprilia maxi-scooter because it had a small leak and just for safetys sake on a long ride. Later found out the slow leak was the valve stem. When you put Slime in your tube/rim be sure you don't leave any in the valve stem as it will stop your Schrader valve from working properly. I use Qtips for that. ;) 2 years later I replaced the tire and found the slime had pretty much disappeared and was on the painted rim and had not hurt the mag rim at all. When the Slime is active it also acts as a balancer in the tire. :) I don't get many flats because I'm very careful where my bike/scooter wheels go. My son Matt got a lot of flats because he wasn't careful. Just sayin'. I carry Slime and an air compressor with me on trips and also have AMA towing as a last resort. ;D
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I just changed the tires on the CX and I add Slime as a precaution and it seems to work. In this last case I pinched the tube (tire wouldn't seat) and had to replace it but that was pretty instant and certainly wouldn't have helped given the size of that rip. I probably should modify those rims for tubeless.
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if you are concerned about flats on your touring bike, for gods sake, get tubeless tires. half the time you will not know you have a nail until you see it. other times they will slowly deflate. carry a plug kit and means to inflate. no laying the bike on its side, no getting terribly filthy, no long delays or tows. If you must have wire wheels, then look into one of the many methods for making them tubeless if they are not.
:+1
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You might take a look at a product called Ride-On.
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How do these products, Slime / Ride On hold up to sitting in storage, especially in winters? Will they become a block of goo or do they maintain their same properties?
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When I purchased my Miata I asked the salesman about a spare tire. The spare proved by Mazda is a bottle of slime and a air compressor all contained in a nice little kit stored in the trunk. :BEER:
Matt
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When I had my KLR 650 I kept a bottle of slime in the top case. One day after doing 50 miles of back dirt and long unused roads in Ct.(believe it or not it can be done) the bottle open up in the case and covered everything in there, maps ,gloves snacks in slime. After that happen the case never leaked!
The only time I really needed it was when I picked up a nail which tore the tube, nothing would have worked for that.
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The only time I really needed it was when I picked up a nail which tore the tube, nothing would have worked for that.
No no no. I heard on the internit that someone used it and didn't have a flat. That proves it always works.
:bow
Doesn't it?
:BEER:
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No no no. I heard on the internit that someone used it and didn't have a flat. That proves it always works.
:bow
Doesn't it?
:BEER:
Oh, don't be silly. :BEER: Nobody's claiming that it "always works". Obviously, damage to the tire that results in a long slash in the tube wouldn't seal up, just like a slash in a tubeless tire caused by a big piece of metal wouldn't be pluggable on the roadside, either. That doesn't mean that tire plugs are useless and don't work.
Seems to be almost a religious fervor against the stuff. Me, I use it where it seems to make sense for insurance, and don't use it where it's more trouble than it's worth.
The only fact I know is that I get about 1 flat tire about every 200,000 miles. Maybe I'm just a statistical anomaly, who knows? Personally, I don't bet that way.
Lannis
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I wonder what would happen if you used "Ride On", then once that's layered, then add "Slime" - Probably creates a Caustic Explosion, or.. or... maybe makes an indestructible tire :P
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How about Mr. Tuffy??
http://www.mrtuffy.com/product-line.html
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How about Mr. Tuffy??
http://www.mrtuffy.com/product-line.html
Works great on bicycles. I use it myself for long distance races. However, its sold for bicycles and may not hold up in motorcycle use?
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The only fact I know is that I get about 1 flat tire about every 200,000 miles. Maybe I'm just a statistical anomaly, who knows? Personally, I don't bet that way.
Lannis
I must be on the other end of the scale, my average is a flat at every 20k miles. Usually the rear tire but at least once on the front. I've had flats on every bike I've evered owned.
:'(
and to set this thread on fire: I've never thrown away a punctured tire and have continued to ride it until it wore out. Usually the those tires wore out sooner than normal.
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Seems to be almost a religious fervor against the stuff. Me, I use it where it seems to make sense for insurance, and don't use it where it's more trouble than it's worth.
I forgot to ask: has it actually been shown to be infested with demons or anything? Will I be burned at the stake if I use it?
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:D :D :D :D :D
Yes , no , maybe ;D
Dusty
Only if someone sees you ::)
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The Ride On website has an impressive video of drilling holes in a front tire and running over a nail board with no loss of air. But maybe it went flat the next day ;) Although still an impressive video. I'm sold!
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I'v run slim in my v65 for several years, tires are at least 4 years old, not yet have I had been shown how well Slime works in the tubes, but it makes me feel better knowing it's in. I have heard that Ride ON may be better.
http://www.ride-on.com/motorcycles.html
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(http://s3.media.squarespace.com/production/296766/10025686/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/loisslimer.jpg)
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"Many Shubs and Zulls knew what it was to be roasted in the depths of a Sloar that day, I can tell you!"
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My 2cents worth. Used slime in off road tubed tires for years. Seems to me that in street tires it would at least slow the leak down to a level where a decent rider could feel the loss of air pressure and pull over. A nail in an unslimed tire would be an instant flat at speed. With slime there would be time to notice a gradual loss of pressure if it doesn't seal it completely. The two year thing don't know about but off road its lasted for years. Once punctured though a patch won't stick, but you shouldn't be patching street tubes anyway.
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I'm going with Ride-On.
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Carrying a bottle of tube-type Slime and a small air compressor is another option. I'm doing that, and if I ever put the Slime to use I'll report back. I took a cheap 12v compressor out of its fancy plastic case, and it takes up very little room now:
(http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c327/triplejim/motorcycles/guzzi/misc/12v_compressor_zpsf2a8bb03.jpg)
Just bought one of these earlier today at Tractor Supply for $10:
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/81J9YcJNl2L._SY355_.jpg)
Not very big even in it's plastic case: 4.5" w x 6" l x 2.5" thick.
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That's probably about the size mine was when I got it. Chuck the plastic and it'll really be small. Or keep it as-is if you have room. Mine fits in a small zippered side compartment of my tail bag.
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I only run the Slime as a temporary fix. Carry a bottle of tube slime and a compressor. Will get you to where you can properly replace a tube.
I check the tubes out when I replace the tires, when in doubt, I replace them. Cheap insurance and nice to know I have new tubes inside the new rubber.
One less thing to worry about out on the road.
Had to use tube slime once for that very purpose. Had the trailer loaded, hooked up and ready to head out for a camp-out. Road to work so I could get a head start on the miles. Made a pit stop on the way in to work and picked up a nail in the rear Jackal tire pulling into a parking lot. Luckily I was parked near the west Wichita wally world and bought a bottle of tube slime. Followed the directions, aired up the tire and next morning had the tube replaced at the now closed Guzzi dealer. Didn't make a mess inside the tire, and I probably could have rode the bike like that, but I knew the right thing to do was replace the tube.
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Don't underestimate those little compressors. I got a call once from a woman who was stranded on the top of Harbor Mountain here in Sitka. She and her little daughter had been picnicking and berry picking up above the cloud line. When they returned to the car, the left rear tire was flat. She said she'd slimed the heck out of it and it still wouldn't hold air, and of course the spare was also flat. I filled my portable tank, added my silly little $10 compressor (came in a kit with SLIME for $19.95 back when I needed the sealer), and went up to help.
Harbor Mountain road is a WWII construction knocked out in a hurry to supply artillery batteries in the hills during the Alaskan campaign. It has never been improved. It rises about 3,000' in 5.5 miles, clinging to the cliffs in typical military fashion. It's closed about 8 months of the year due to ice, snow, and other slippery stuff. You can see your own tail lights on some of the switchbacks, and of course it wasn't intended for 2wd traffic, speed, or people with pacemakers. Frequent washouts, slides, and treefalls make it a new experience every time. I use it to tune up for road trips. I figure if I can get a full-dress Convert up and down it I'm ready for anything. The road can be challenging in daylight with four good tires, but it was going to be dark by the time I got there and I didn't know what to expect from the tires if they wouldn't hold slime.
The tire was flat all right, sitting in a puddle, and there was the contents of a can of insulating foam slathered over the tire stem and rim. She thought it was tire sealer and couldn't figure out how to inject it in the valve stem with the spray nozzle. In desperation she coated the tire with it. Also a lot of the quarter panel, herself and her kid. It was almost set up when I got there. I had a good laugh. She didn't see the humor.
I managed to get the valve out of the stem an clear an airway. The valve wasn't going to work again though, so I used the one from her spare. She'd been carrying the insulating foam in her kit thinking it was slime, so there was none of that, and I wasn't going to jack up the car to find and patch the hole in the dark. So I gave it as much air as I could from the tank. I was dissatisfied with the pressure I got out of the tank, so I hooked up the compressor directly to the tire. It took a while and got smelly-hot, but that little pos pumped the tire up to 45#, with chunks of foam cracking off as it inflated. Bubbles in the puddle told me the leak was daring me to outrun it.
I enjoy a challenge, so I jumped into the car and high-tailed it to town, leaving her to clean up the mess and drive my rig down. I took the trail as fast as I could without leaning too hard on the already-softening tire. At the intersection of the main road I took a look and figured I might make the additional 6 miles to the auto shop, but was prepared for failure. On the plus side, the jarring run downhill had knocked off most of the foam. At the roundabout, 4 miles down the line, the car wallowed left and oversteered right. A few blocks later it was yawing going straight. The rim hit the road a few hundred feet from the shop. It was a dirt road, so I finished the trip on the rim.
I haven't used the compressor since. I don't know if it still works. She learned how to read a spray bottle, and now carries both slime and a compressor. The berries made good jam. She gave me some.
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I have used Slime or similar products for years, primarily on tube-type tires. I've never had a problem and it has saved me several problems with acquired nails, shards etc.
Most punctures I've experienced occur in the rear tire, presumably from items flipped up by the front tire.
My typical practice is to replace the tube with its sealer contents on every other tire change for regularly-used tires.
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I have used Slime or similar products for years, primarily on tube-type tires. I've never had a problem and it has saved me several problems with acquired nails, shards etc.
Most punctures I've experienced occur in the rear tire, presumably from items flipped up by the front tire.
My typical practice is to replace the tube with its sealer contents on every other tire change for regularly-used tires.
Yep, if 50 some years of riding, I've only had a front flat once, a giant thorn when I was riding in the woods. ;D
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Yep, if 50 some years of riding, I've only had a front flat once, a giant thorn when I was riding in the woods. ;D
I've had a couple happen on the road. Flat front tires at speed on the road are nasty. It makes a flat rear tire handle like a dream. :o