Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: atavar on August 15, 2015, 11:23:28 PM
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i must preface this by saying almost all of my problems are self induced.
To begin with I have very recently moved and most of my stuff is in a storage unit randomly stacked so it is a chore to find something specific. Usually I don't try.
Getting ready for a 600 mile round trip tomorrow on the 2V Norge. Not being able to remember when I last changed the oil (log book must be in storage) i decide it's time. A simple job, right?
First step is searching for an oil filter I stand a chance of finding locally. I gather a list of acceptable filters from various threads here and head to the local auto parts store. the only one on the list they have is a WIX.. It will work, I guess.
While I am there I grab four bottles of full synth AMSoil at $17.95 a quart, and an oil collection jug.. ack.. as I walk out I recall that I don't recall seeing a filter wrench in the toolbox at the house (remember a bunch of stuff is in storage) so i head back in to the store with the WIX filter in hand and get a wrench that fits it.
Back at the ranch I drag the Norge out of the garage and muscle it up on the center stand, put the collection jug underneath as far back against the centerstand as I possibly can get it. Then I take out the oil drain plug and watch as the oil streams right past the collection jug through the centerstand and puddles on the driveway. Stick my hand in the stream to deflect the oil in to the jug until is slows enough to go where I want it to.. go wash hands and come back to deal with the filter.
I grab the plastic filter wrench and am only a little surprised to find that it won't fit in the filter recess on the Norge. Looking at it and the WIX filter I notice the wrench has two sizes and the WIX filter fits the deepest flats, so I dig around and find a handy hacksaw and cut the outside half of the wrench off. I put the remaining half of the wrench in and am happy to find that it now fits up in to the filter recess. This is only a short relief as I also find that it doesn't fit the UFI filter that is currently on the engine.
As it is now about 7;30 PM I leave everything scattered in the driveway and dash back to a different auto parts store and get one of those three fingered adjustable filter wrenches.
Back at the bike and with much finangling and a few choice words of encouragement I am finally able to break the filter loose and turn it out by hand. Oh yeah. oil comes off every one of the fins just to make sure I have more spots on the driveway to clean up.
Great joy as the WIX filter spins right on and the first tool I bought lets me snug it right up.
Time to add the oil. I go grab the special funnel I got for this task and grab the dipstick to pull it out. The dipstick is stuck so I pull harder. No joy. I wiggle it and pull even harder. The dipstick handle breaks off leaving the dipstick in the big plastic adapter screwed in the engine.
A few choice words of exasperation may have offended my neighbors.
Inside the house to wash my hands and enjoy a beer then back out to the bike.
With much digging around in boxes I am able to find a handful of metric sockets and handles and my set of metric t-handle allen wrenches. Ther eis nothing to do but strip the tupperware off the Norge to get to the stub of the dipstick. As anyone who has wrenched on the Norge is aware, the only kind way to do this without breaking many plastic tabs is to start at the right hand panels and remove them, working around to the left until the Norge is completely nakde from the waist down. For some reason Guido decided the left hand tuperware should be put on first and overlapped by the piece next toward the right, so that the #1 most often done job requires taking out 12 screws and six plastic panels. Remind me to punch Guido right in the snoot if I ever see him.
I get the dipstick adapter unscrewed and yea and verily the dipstick is stuck fast in it. With much pounding and a few more choice words I get the dipstick out. It turns out the o-rings on the dipstick have swelled and gotten hard.
I take the orings off, remembering which was top and which was bottom, and proceed to clean the stub of the dipstick and the dipstick handle. The dipstick was kind enough to break leaving a half inch of plastic on the dipstick with a quarter inch of metal protruding from it so I decide that with a ride tomorrow this is a good opportunity to see if superglue really works. I hose down the plastic bits with carb cleaner to get all the oil off and glue the handle back on the dipstick. i'll let you know how that worked after the ride.
As long as I have the body parts off and the adapter out of the engine leaving a nice big hole this sounds like a great time to put the oil in. Oh wait.. without a dipstick I better measure. With some internet searching and a little calculator work I determine the Norge needs 3600 cubic centimeters of oil for a filter change, which works out to 3.8 quarts.
i put the oil in, but I don't want to put the dipstick back in until the superglue has fully cured. Visions of permanently inserted dipsticks dance in my head. i go ahead and start the engine to check for leaks and while there are no leaks there is significant blowby coming out the dipstick hole spraying a perfect fan of oil droplets over everything. Shut off the engine and wipe everything down.
I get the repaired dipstick and it is a little tacky still, but seems well stuck and the handle doesn't pull off. The dipstick slides in to the adapter nicely without the orings, so I cover the broken bits liberally with axle grease to seal the superglue.
guessing I am not going to have a lot of luck finding itty bitty orings (the hardware store is closed by now) I put the orings back on the dipstick in reverse order, and coat them with grease, and the dipstick slides in to the adapter fine until it hits the hardest oring. Good enough.
I grab the dipstick adapter and a 1" socket and go to put it back in the engine only to find that the plastic threads are all munged up. Guido must have put it in crooked the first time. Remind me to sock him in the eye after I punch him in the nose for the tupperware layout.
Get out my hand pocket knife and chase the plastic threads on the adapter and get it threaded back in to the engine and fire it up.
No leaks!! Hurrah! Quick 25 mile test ride and everything is dry and no drips on the driveway. I think I am good to go for tomorrow.
Next on my list of things to do is to order a new dipstick and adapter.
Is there a new and improved dipstick for the 2V Norge?
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As far as I know, the dipstick is still the same - and my current one has some 80,000 miles on it (after the first broke at 20,000). I take care to re-lubricate it each time I check the oil or remove it for any other reason, and I also take care to pull it out in a straight, true line using a hooked tool (or the end of a mangled coat-hanger), unless I'm on the road.
I use a metal rather than plastic oil cap-wrench, and I use the Mobil1 M1-102 filter, which is readily available from many different auto stores. I like it better than the WIX, which is one of two others often available without access to motorcycle stores. The final readily available one (Pep Boys nationwide) is a PureOne - they show two possible equivalents to the M1-102, but use the bigger one - the smaller one's ring seal is not big enough for the seat on the spin-on on the Guzzi.
When you order a new dipstick, the order is usually for an assembly (one common part number) that includes a new screw-in mount for the dipstick - so everything will be fresh. Check with the dealer when you order.
BTW, if you can't get one quickly, let me know and I'll see if I can dig my spare out - you can replace it for me when you get yours. August is, after all, the EU vacation month...
Ride safe!
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But didja have fun doin it?
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My first attempt at an oil change on the Breva involved a lot of choice words for the #$@%^&(* oil filter, which I needed a three finger adjustable wrench for as well.
I'm slightly glad I don't have fairings, although a proper windshield that actually works would be very nice.
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I feel your frustration. I don't know why every oil filter for the same application seems to have a different wrench. I recently crossed the ufi to a nappa gold and it was supposed to be an exact match, it wasn't. Had to line the inside of my wrench with a wrap of emery cloth for a friction fit, worked great but should not be necessary. I will be going back to the ufi. Hope your ride goes better than the oil change did, great story .
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That made me laugh. Been there myself.
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I too had a dipstick break on my '08 Norge. I bought a kit that brings the dipstick up and out. It is a bit harder to add the oil but easier to get to and it is not plastic.
(http://i917.photobucket.com/albums/ad12/Atlasheating/CIMG0899.jpg) (http://s917.photobucket.com/user/Atlasheating/media/CIMG0899.jpg.html)
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But didja have fun doin it?
:bow: :1: :thumb:
kjf
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I use a bosch filter that available just about everywhere
If I didn't have a tool to remove the UNI, and I had already spilled oil in the driveway, i'd just drive a screwdriver into it and use that to twist it off
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I'm glad I'm not the only one who has those kinds of "easy jobs". I usually try to set aside time for any maintenance on my bike so that I can enjoy the job instead of being rushed. My goal this weekend was to complete a valve adjustment, plug and air filter swap on my V7 during "naptime".
I was well-prepped for the job, I had all the proper tools (I thought) and parts. I have my "garage tools" and my basement workshop (mostly wood-working) tools. I try to get everything I might need ready but this time I forgot a rubber mallet so when it came time to remove my valve covers I had to run downstairs to get the mallet. I really hate doing that drill, but I only had to do it once this time. I'm thinking a couple of bucks for another rubber mallet for the garage might be money well spent...
I managed to get the valves and plugs done before the little monsters woke up. I then attempted to change the air filter while watching them in the garage. Almost managed the feat when I lost screw #4 to the great abyss that is the battery housing. I realized trying to watch a 3 and 1 year old while doing the simplest of tasks is futile. I had no choice but let the job rest until Mom could take over and I could remove the battery to retrieve the errant screw and finish the job. Next time, I shall have victory!
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Yesterday I put on a new rear tire on our V65C and figured it would be a good time to change the rear box and transmission oils, especially because the swingarm is to be level when setting the amount in the rear drive. Everything was going well and a couple of friends stopped by. They were putting a switch in the shop furnace so I could run the fan by itself and not bother the burner section. It's an old oil burner with a rats nest of wires in there. It made little Johnnies head hurt to look at the wiring diagram and compare it to the rats nest so I called a friend who is well versed in such matters. During all the excitement I didn't put in the transmission drain plug, a slightly troublesome job with the exhaust crossover right there and gear oil all over the place. Then I knocked over the funnel and hose, full of gear oil. Without pictures, it never happened!
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I thought this was going to be a diatribe on changing the oil/filter on a KTM. :whip2:
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i thought you'd tell us you left the drain plug off while refilling...
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i thought you'd tell us you left the drain plug off while refilling...
Been there done that.. with $18/quart oil I triple checked that.. lol
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This is why I don't conduct any maintenance immediately prior to a planned trip. However simple, Mr. Murphy will be the one looking over your shoulder.
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Chuck that's what I did but didn't want to come right out and say that
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This is why I don't conduct any maintenance immediately prior to a planned trip. However simple, Mr. Murphy will be the one looking over your shoulder.
Heck, I've even changed the oil in the middle of trips. :cheesy:
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This is why I don't conduct any maintenance immediately prior to a planned trip. However simple, Mr. Murphy will be the one looking over your shoulder.
I definitely do maintenance before a trip - but I avoid doing modifications!
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Thank you.
Without intending to you've made me feel really good about my Bassa plastichrome challenges.
And my speedometer cable change that only took about three hours spread over an entire day now seems like some really quality time spent with friends.
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Thank you for this stand-up routine. I think Guido slithers away unnoticed from the factory in costume as he's surely taken some hits over the years. We all owe him a thing or two. :violent1:
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:grin:
When I went from the Breva to the Stelvio, I believe the "flute" count on the filter changed? I didn't know that of course, until after I drained the oil.. And the correct wrench wasn't carried at any local autozone type store.
I've learned not to leave the cap off of any oil container also. 3/4 of a quart of oil makes a mighty big mess.
My left thumbnail is wavy now because of filter wrench slippage 2 times while changing oil in my Subaru. Both times resulting in me having to take a tiny(sharp) drill bit between the fingers on my right hand and drill a tiny relief hole in my left thumbnail.
richy
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drill bit between the fingers on my right hand and drill a tiny relief hole
A paper clip and a lighter is quicker and less painful. (Don't ask me how I know this)
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You should get a small block. The dipstick has been known to unscrew all by themselves!!! :angry:
Your treatise brought a smile to my face though.
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Great story and this is precisely why I like to watch UFC...............S omebody is always having a worse day then me. :grin:
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Oh, do you remind me of me. Never, ever let us get together and do anything mechanical.
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Ah yes the perfect Zen oil change... Peter Egan wrote about it a few years ago in Cycle World,very funny but too true! I had the guys at O'reilly's autoparts cross reference UFI to K&N oil filter ( HP-1002) has a nice big nut welded to the filter,just use your metric adjustable wrench or socket,easy peasy!!
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I definitely do maintenance before a trip - but I avoid doing modifications!
I'll do it a couple weeks out, so I could still get that part that wasn't supposed to break, or tear, or crack, or get lost...
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I'll do it a couple weeks out, so I could still get that part that wasn't supposed to break, or tear, or crack, or get lost...
Yep. Valve cover gaskets that tear on that last valve adjustment, drain plug gaskets that are on their last leg, a nut that strips and wasn't supposed to, a tire valve that leaks unexpectedly on a tire change ... I don't do ANYTHING to the bike less than 10 days from a big trip ... it always goes pear-shaped ....
Lannis
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This should make you feel better! :thumb:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8uODpt79Ak
...... by comparison! :laugh:
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Gremlins_think_its_fun_to_hurt_you._Use_care_always._Back_up_our_battleskies_-_NARA_-_535381_zpsghgeile4.jpg)
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i must preface this by saying almost all of my problems are self induced.
To begin with I have very recently moved and most of my stuff is in a storage unit randomly stacked so it is a chore to find something specific. Usually I don't try.
Getting ready for a 600 mile round trip tomorrow on the 2V Norge. Not being able to remember when I last changed the oil (log book must be in storage) i decide it's time. A simple job, right?
First step is searching for an oil filter I stand a chance of finding locally. I gather a list of acceptable filters from various threads here and head to the local auto parts store. the only one on the list they have is a WIX.. It will work, I guess.
While I am there I grab four bottles of full synth AMSoil at $17.95 a quart, and an oil collection jug.. ack.. as I walk out I recall that I don't recall seeing a filter wrench in the toolbox at the house (remember a bunch of stuff is in storage) so i head back in to the store with the WIX filter in hand and get a wrench that fits it.
Back at the ranch I drag the Norge out of the garage and muscle it up on the center stand, put the collection jug underneath as far back against the centerstand as I possibly can get it. Then I take out the oil drain plug and watch as the oil streams right past the collection jug through the centerstand and puddles on the driveway. Stick my hand in the stream to deflect the oil in to the jug until is slows enough to go where I want it to.. go wash hands and come back to deal with the filter.
I grab the plastic filter wrench and am only a little surprised to find that it won't fit in the filter recess on the Norge. Looking at it and the WIX filter I notice the wrench has two sizes and the WIX filter fits the deepest flats, so I dig around and find a handy hacksaw and cut the outside half of the wrench off. I put the remaining half of the wrench in and am happy to find that it now fits up in to the filter recess. This is only a short relief as I also find that it doesn't fit the UFI filter that is currently on the engine.
As it is now about 7;30 PM I leave everything scattered in the driveway and dash back to a different auto parts store and get one of those three fingered adjustable filter wrenches.
Back at the bike and with much finangling and a few choice words of encouragement I am finally able to break the filter loose and turn it out by hand. Oh yeah. oil comes off every one of the fins just to make sure I have more spots on the driveway to clean up.
Great joy as the WIX filter spins right on and the first tool I bought lets me snug it right up.
Time to add the oil. I go grab the special funnel I got for this task and grab the dipstick to pull it out. The dipstick is stuck so I pull harder. No joy. I wiggle it and pull even harder. The dipstick handle breaks off leaving the dipstick in the big plastic adapter screwed in the engine.
A few choice words of exasperation may have offended my neighbors.
Inside the house to wash my hands and enjoy a beer then back out to the bike.
With much digging around in boxes I am able to find a handful of metric sockets and handles and my set of metric t-handle allen wrenches. Ther eis nothing to do but strip the tupperware off the Norge to get to the stub of the dipstick. As anyone who has wrenched on the Norge is aware, the only kind way to do this without breaking many plastic tabs is to start at the right hand panels and remove them, working around to the left until the Norge is completely nakde from the waist down. For some reason Guido decided the left hand tuperware should be put on first and overlapped by the piece next toward the right, so that the #1 most often done job requires taking out 12 screws and six plastic panels. Remind me to punch Guido right in the snoot if I ever see him.
I get the dipstick adapter unscrewed and yea and verily the dipstick is stuck fast in it. With much pounding and a few more choice words I get the dipstick out. It turns out the o-rings on the dipstick have swelled and gotten hard.
I take the orings off, remembering which was top and which was bottom, and proceed to clean the stub of the dipstick and the dipstick handle. The dipstick was kind enough to break leaving a half inch of plastic on the dipstick with a quarter inch of metal protruding from it so I decide that with a ride tomorrow this is a good opportunity to see if superglue really works. I hose down the plastic bits with carb cleaner to get all the oil off and glue the handle back on the dipstick. i'll let you know how that worked after the ride.
As long as I have the body parts off and the adapter out of the engine leaving a nice big hole this sounds like a great time to put the oil in. Oh wait.. without a dipstick I better measure. With some internet searching and a little calculator work I determine the Norge needs 3600 cubic centimeters of oil for a filter change, which works out to 3.8 quarts.
i put the oil in, but I don't want to put the dipstick back in until the superglue has fully cured. Visions of permanently inserted dipsticks dance in my head. i go ahead and start the engine to check for leaks and while there are no leaks there is significant blowby coming out the dipstick hole spraying a perfect fan of oil droplets over everything. Shut off the engine and wipe everything down.
I get the repaired dipstick and it is a little tacky still, but seems well stuck and the handle doesn't pull off. The dipstick slides in to the adapter nicely without the orings, so I cover the broken bits liberally with axle grease to seal the superglue.
guessing I am not going to have a lot of luck finding itty bitty orings (the hardware store is closed by now) I put the orings back on the dipstick in reverse order, and coat them with grease, and the dipstick slides in to the adapter fine until it hits the hardest oring. Good enough.
I grab the dipstick adapter and a 1" socket and go to put it back in the engine only to find that the plastic threads are all munged up. Guido must have put it in crooked the first time. Remind me to sock him in the eye after I punch him in the nose for the tupperware layout.
Get out my hand pocket knife and chase the plastic threads on the adapter and get it threaded back in to the engine and fire it up.
No leaks!! Hurrah! Quick 25 mile test ride and everything is dry and no drips on the driveway. I think I am good to go for tomorrow.
Next on my list of things to do is to order a new dipstick and adapter.
Is there a new and improved dipstick for the 2V Norge?
I feel your pain. I edited your rant into a narrative. Easier to read.
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Noted. I will use more line spacing next time. ;)
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On your oil change BTDT many times. :grin: If you ask me in person, I'll deny it. :rolleyes:
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There is no magic to figuring out how much oil is needed for an oil change. If the Norge's oil is at the proper level before the oil change, just add the same amount back in minus a very small amount and that is all it takes.
The method is rather simple. Drain the oil including that from the filter into a 4 liter (or 1 gallon) jug from a previous oil change. Mark the height and transfer that to the new one. Drain the new jog to match the line.
Fill the Norge after the drain and go ride it for the prescribed time. Check the oil and adjust as needed.
No going back and forth checking numerous times. It is a 1,2,3 done thing.
No, the filter will not retain enough oil after emptying it to make enough of a difference that you can't go out and ride it to check properly and adjust. You simply put a small grate over the pan into which you drain the oil and let it sit for a while. What little oil will be retained in the filter is practically nothing.
Then going forward you have a nice job from which to measure the amount needed and there is no guessing or adding/checking/adding/checking to bother with.
The very best thing you can do is to not pay attention to oil threads, seriously, as other than a cross reference for alternative oil filters, all the stuff about this weight and that weight doesn't help you. Use the weight prescribed, the type prescribed and be done with it.
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Had so many moments just like yours. You explained it much better. On the oil seems like I use 3qts. and 8ozs. That puts me in the middle of the dip stick and I never have any oil in the air box.