Piaggio Group Should Rebadge Aprilia to Moto Guzzi

[pebra]

About selling more bikes: It only takes one thing to sell more bikes, and that's commitment to a good business plan.

Anyway, my impression is that Guzzi is both  better known and sells more bikes than Aprilia.
But I might get things mixed up, as I probably am closer to Guzzi's target group than to Aprilia's, and then numbers I (think) I've seen may be only for big displacement bikes.

[Arizona Wayne]

About selling more bikes: It only takes one thing to sell more bikes, and that's commitment to a good business plan.

Anyway, my impression is that Guzzi is both  better known and sells more bikes than Aprilia.
But I might get things mixed up, as I probably am closer to Guzzi's target group than to Aprilia's, and then numbers I (think) I've seen may be only for big displacement bikes.

I'm sure Aprilia sells more units with all their scooters for starters.   Guzzi doesn't even sell 10K units a year.  I'll bet more MP3s were sold than Guzzis last year.

[jreagan]

Who has more US dealers?

[Devildog]

At least in the UK Aprilias are very popular for the male 20-30's age group, they know they will never afford a Panigale, so an RSV4 is the next best thing.

[rocker59]

Who has more US dealers?

A quick check of both marque's websites showed:

California
Aprilia 17
Guzzi 13

Texas
Aprilia 10
Guzzi 7

Florida
Aprilia 9
Guzzi 7

I'm not going to look at all the States, but those are some biggies, and show a trend.

[Lcarlson]

So I'm thinking not many non-riders have heard of Aprilia or their limited racing heritage. Why bother building this brand up as a racing/ tech heavy arm of the Piaggio Group when Piaggio already owns a brand with tremendous racing history. The Moto Guzzi singles, the fore and aft V-twins and the mighty V8 are all legendary. There is no reason a Moto Guzzi has to be a Port to Starboard V-twin engined motorcycle. Polaris purchased a legendary brand and now they are giving Harley a run for their money. Piaggio Group owns a legendary brand with tremendous racing heritage but has decided to turn the flying eagle into a retro cruiser product tailored for bearded hipsters.

I say release Moto Guzzi from the pigeon hole yoke of the sideways V-Twin and reintroduce the brand as a cutting edge motorcycle back in the business of winning trophy's. Relegate Aprilia to scooters and mopeds. Piaggio group can surely win races under the Aprilia banner but no matter how much marketing they throw at a scooter manufacturer who up until a couple decades ago was using Rotax engines, Aprilia will never be able to build a heritage equal to Moto Guzzi.

Not going to happen, and doesn't need to. Guzzi is a niche manufacturer, and niche manufacturers can't afford racing efforts. Guzzi's storied racing history is just that, history. Aprilia, for its part, has some relatively recent racing success, and they're not about to put a Guzzi label on it. But they don't need to. I'm cautiously optimistic that Guzzi is doing exactly what they need to: improving their products for the non-race replica market. The V7 line has clearly been a success (witness the justified enthusiasm here) and the California 14s are reportedly the second best selling line (they really are, by most objective metrics, better than their H-D competition). The new V9s look like winners to me, at a very attractive price point. I suspect that Guzzzi will take their new big block in a non-cruiser direction in the near future, so they are offering a pretty comprehensive selection of machinery, that I think will appeal to a lot of riders. Guzzi will probably remain a niche product, but that's worked out OK for 95 years, and well, isn't that part of what we like about our chosen steeds?

[frans belgium]

Yeah , and followers of SBK or GP racing from the 1980's are familiar with Aprilia . Moto Guzzi not so much .


 
 We're tryin' dude 

 Dusty

Have to contradict you, Dusty.  In Belgium and around us,  it is not.  I never understood why Piaggio drew the Aprilia card and left Guzzi bleed to death with their 'custom' line.

[frans belgium]

Anyway, my impression is that Guzzi is both  better known and sells more bikes than Aprilia.

Yes, in Belgium anyway. Around us, too.  I would love to sit in the marketing board of Piaggio, to understand what they are thinking...

[johnr]

Guzzi may have a racing heritage and I see nothing wrong with using that as part of their marketing a retro style bike, but I don't think anyone is assuming that means they are competitive by modern sportbike standards.

Guzzi could, if they so wished, make a bike that is. And if they chose not to style it like a demented insect but in a more traditional sport bike or cafe race way, who knows...

[Toecutter]

I think what needs to be remembered is that Guzzi fills a niche in Europe, especially in Italy.

They're the European Harley. It lives on it's heritage, as it should.

[pebra]

Yes, in Belgium anyway. Around us, too.  I would love to sit in the marketing board of Piaggio, to understand what they are thinking...

I saw figures for the German market a few years ago, Europe's biggest. Twice as many Guzzis as Aprilias sold. Probably only big bikes.
And a striking observation from many visits to Italy itself: I see a few Guzzis, but no Aprilias at all.

[oldbike54]

I saw figures for the German market a few years ago, Europe's biggest. Twice as many Guzzis as Aprilias sold. Probably only big bikes.
And a striking observation from many visits to Italy itself: I see a few Guzzis, but no Aprilias at all.

 Interesting . Still I doubt if changing the Aprilia badge to Moto Guzzi will help sales of either one . Racing success from 1950 doesn't sell bikes .

 Dusty

[pebra]

Well Dusty, it appears that fifties racing history sells better than present-day   ;-)

Seriously, it takes much more than racing success to sell bikes.
As Frans said, one must wonder what the Piaggio marketing people are thinking. (if at all)

[oldbike54]

Well Dusty, it appears that fifties racing history sells better than present-day   ;-)

Seriously, it takes much more than racing success to sell bikes.
As Frans said, one must wonder what the Piaggio marketing people are thinking. (if at all)

 Well I mentioned earlier that modern racing success doesn't help much either . Honda and Yamaha's involvement has more to do with corporate ego than boosting sales . Not sure why Ducati is spending all that money .

 Dusty

[Toecutter]

What they're thinking is simple.

They wish to cut costs and maximize profits. They will do so by eliminating what they see as redundancy. Why build a Griso, when there are bikes in the Aprilia range that do the same job?

Why build the Griso when the market isn't supporting it, but is buying the V7 and the California?

Now, I'm not necessarily saying i agree with the thought, but... they are a business, and they want to make money.

Guzzi is Europe's Harley. Nostalgia, emotion and old tech in modern clothing. That's why they sell. That's why they need to make some changes... just like Harley, that market only has so much to give.

It will cost less to crank out a few models that sell well, rather than a few more that sell not so well.

[Greenman]

By any standard you want to use to measure sales, Guzzi has a tiny market share and Aprilia is huge in comparison. Whatever racing heritage Guzzi had it is past history and should stay there. It's a short and painful road to financial disaster to even comtemplate going racing, just ask Mr Buell. Aprilia as some wonderful bikes that are very competitive, but I'm sure it costs them greatly but they're sell bikes and funding it and they are still here. The RSV4 is a huge leap forward from anything Guzzi has.
I've just bought a V2 Tuono, easy to ride and doesn't appear to have any issues. I still love my Sport 1100, but the Tuono is a supercomputer and the Guzzi is an abacus  in comparison.

[Arizona Wayne]

I believe Aprilia road racing is being supported by Aprilia, Piaggio, Vespa scooter sales.

[bad Chad]

I doubt seriously if Aprilia sells more than 30,000 bikes world wide a year, it may be considerably less.  In north america, I suspect sales are pretty close between the two brands.

One, completely nonscientific measure is the number of followers each has on Face Book.

Moto Guzzi has 137,000.   Aprilia has 438,000

Moto Guzzi America has 14,700  Aprilia America has 13,970

[tazio]

4th guzzi (one bought new), whats a face book? 

[tazio]

 No unsolicited comments from the peanut gallery 

[oldbike54]

No unsolicited comments from the peanut gallery 

 So you had the experience ?

 Dusty

[rdbandkab]

My 2cents....  They should leave the badges as is..  With Moto Guzzi, I like the history, the simplicity, and the big-ole engine on display.  With aprilia I like the sportiness and forward thinking design..(our 2002 Futura still looks current).
What they should take care of (both marques that is) is take care of the little "idiosyncrasies" of the latest models they're pushing out.

You can read the purple paragraph for our bikes and thoughts....or not.

I've had 2 aprilias and 2 Guzzis.  1st bike was/is our 2002 Futura.  The Fut has 65,000 miles on it and needed a rec/reg replacement in the beginning(Fut's were spec'd with a weak rec/reg).  .  The OEM's charged at 12v at 4k?  That's about it for idiosyncrasies of the Fut.  The valves, although checked every so often, never needed adjustment.   
Our 2nd bike was our 2006 Breva 1100 that we absolutely loved, loved, loved.. It was to be our backup bike to the Futura.  It took over as the trip bike and we put 53,000 miles on it.   It needed the "startus interuptus" mod and that's all I can think of. I did some routine stuff out of guilt.  Speakers kept the valves in check.   The 3rd bike was the Stevlio NTX.  After the B got "up there" in mileage,  we decided to get a fresh new tourer.  Since we thoroughly enjoyed our time on the Breva 1100,  we found a 2015 Stelvio.  From the start,  I didn't personally care for the clutch.  It worked fine when warmed up,  but we had traded our wonderful clutch rattle for clutch groan.  Our Stelvio also had "the list" of stupid fixes.  Aux light fuses, indicators and mirrors mod, plug caps, front end fairing fasteners falling out from new.  A tail light bolt was stripped from the factory(no biggie).  We ended up selling the NTX at 19,000 miles to get our current ride that is the aprilia Capo 1200.  It has a couple of things that are small pains, but make you think "What the heck were they thinking?" Dash is weird...fuel gauge is worthless when you get low on fuel, and the discrepancy of the real and actual speed and trip is about 8%.  And the trip mileage resets to zero at 600 miles (I'm guessing that's a 10k reset). And the thing is geared to the moon!  Makes for a jerky ride at low speeds, but hey....you look down and your going 60 in 4th.  Two more gears left..   Oh...the rare Capo will shut off for no reason.  We've logged 12,000 since last July.  She's in for a valve check currently.   We're loving the Capo so far, aside from "idiosyncrasies".  She sounds great and looks the part.


richy

[johnr]

I doubt seriously if Aprilia sells more than 30,000 bikes world wide a year, it may be considerably less.  In north america, I suspect sales are pretty close between the two brands.

One, completely nonscientific measure is the number of followers each has on Face Book.

Moto Guzzi has 137,000.   Aprilia has 438,000

Moto Guzzi America has 14,700  Aprilia America has 13,970

That's an interesting, and telling stat.

[johnr]

 

A book used by an old GF to whack you in the face ?

 Dusty

  Look at that! You've gone and done it again Dusty!

[johnr]

I've had 2 aprilias and 2 Guzzis.  1st bike was/is our 2002 Futura.  .   
Our 2nd bike was our 2006 Breva 1100 that we absolutely loved, loved, loved.. It was to be our backup bike to the Futura.  It took over as the trip bike and we put 53,000 miles on it.   It needed the "startus interuptus" mod and that's all I can think of. I did some routine stuff out of guilt.


richy

I think Richy, that if I had a bike that I felt about as you did your Breva, I would have done work as needed due to rising millage and kept that bike.

[Dean Rose]

OK, why would I want to buy an Aprilia/Moto Guzzi? Just let me have the V-twin.


Dean

[rdbandkab]

I think Richy, that if I had a bike that I felt about as you did your Breva, I would have done work as needed due to rising millage and kept that bike.

The decision to move on was more of a "Piece of Mind" thing than anything.  Well...maybe toss in a little of the want for something new also.  I felt it was time to get into something newer or at least with lower mileage for our longer trips.   Since we ride 2up about 100% of the time and do quite a few long distant trips per year,  I had to make a decision about the higher mileage of the B.  I wish I would have been able to keep the Breva, but due to garage space and finances,  we had to sell to help with the purchase of the Stelvio.   
  I'm still keeping an eye out for a used 2006-2008 Breva though...

The Futura and the Breva.

[canuguzzi]

Racing improves the breed which is why Honda and Yamaha engaged . Many of their technologies were proved on the race course and found their way into production bikes.

Sure there was corporate ego involved by that wasn't the reason they did it.

Besides, if winning races doesn't sell bikes, for sure losing them doesn't.

[flip]

I own a Guzzi and an Aprilia. I certainly don't think the brands should merge. Aprilia is aimed at the younger riders that want performance, handling, newer technology and maybe edgy style. They are shopping Aprilias for how they work. Moto Guzzi now seems aimed at people that want their bike to make a statement about them. Performance is not important.

[skippy]

I would like to see Moto Guzzi spruce up their offerings with some more innovative (modern) equipment. There are a few key design features that I do hold dear that are the precise reason why I am drawn the the marque. The cylinders jutting up and out to the side were an elegant design easing the maintenance while providing fantastic cooling for a simple air cooled engine. I don't see any reason not to keep this design while adding liquid cooling to either a push-rod motor or an overhead cam, either way ease of maintenance is preserved.
The dry clutch nestled between the motor (with proper motor oil) and the transmission (with proper gear oil) is an other allure.
The convenience of the shaft final drive is also an unquestionable attraction, especially the CARC, which in my humble opinion is the most superior on the market.
These designs are what attract me to Moto Guzzi but they are not what define Moto Guzzi. They represent the evolution of a line of great motorcycles.
I will continue to devoutly support Moto Guzzi, with what ever products the provide so long as they continue to provide products that meet my discerning taste. However, I will not be interested in a re-badged Aprilia, but I am open to more designs so long as they are rolling out of the red gates of Mandello de Lario.

Skippy