Downsizing Again...to a 250!

[pyoungbl]

Maybe it's psychological, maybe it's old age.  At any rate, I'm starting to think in terms of smaller, lighter, and simpler.  I'm the owner of a fantastic Stelvio and an equally neat V7.  Bought both new and I have no regrets.  Now I want to try something even smaller than the V7.  Today I ordered a CSC RX3.  This is a re-branded Zongshen 250cc adventure bike.  http://www.cscmotorcycles.com/RX3-CYCLONE-s/108.htm   Yep, Chinese.  The same company that made BMW 650 engines, some HD parts, and (I think) at least part of the latest Ducati Scrambler.  This will push me to downsize my traveling kit and that's OK.  In fact, it's long overdue.  By the end of February I should have something interesting sitting in the driveway.  Ah, the adventure continues.  Maybe the idea of a new 500cc Falcone is not quite so strange after all.

Peter Y.

[cruzziguzzi]

I dig my Harley 883 hugely for many reasons and one of the foremost is size and though it has same mass, the ass is low.

There are some pretty cool 1/4 litre +/- bikes out there. That pretty little Ninja comes immediately to mind as does the Suzuki TU250.


Todd.

[oldbike54]

 Read a road trip report recently where those bikes were the weapon of choice . Keep us apprised Peter, they look interesting .

 Dusty

[NorthRider]

I have been following the CSC bike saga for a while now. Really like the idea of importer direct.... As for not having a dealer network, I have a Guzzi and a Buell. What do you think! Lol
But seriously, the older I get, the more I think about what would happen if I dumped the bike out in the boonies while riding alone.
Would really like to see a 400cc ADV bike. That seems like the perfect size to me.

[Bisbonian]

I'm very interested to hear how you get on with this over time.

I get to read a lot of first impressions, but there's never a bunch of follow up.

[Aaron D.]

That is something I've considered too, I'll be curious. Mostly if it is a viable dual purpose bike.

[ohiorider]

Several manufacturers are offering 250 - 300cc bikes that look like they'd be a blast to ride.  The 'baby' Ninja twin, and Honda's 250 or 300cc (don't remember which) single come with relatively low price tags and decent warranties.  When I purchased my Kaw W650, I added 2 additional years of factory warranty to the bike's 12mo/12000 mile warranty for not a bunch of money.  When the exhaust cracked ahead of the muffler, I could have had it welded.  However, Kaw honored their warranty and replaced the right header and muffler, at well over 25,000 miles.

I'm beginning to find the V7II rather attractive, and that'd be a step down in size for me, coming off the 1200 Sport (if that were to happen.)

[swordds]

I love my V7II but my other bike is a Suzuki TU250X. I  get so many compliments from that bike, it looks like a late 1960s British motorcycle and several people have asked if I restored it. Very light even compared to a V7II (it feels like getting on a scooter or a bicycle after being on the V7II) and very smooth and quiet. I prefer the V7II on the highway but the Suzuki has no problem traveling at 65mph though at 70mph it is pretty much tapped out. I  am getting 75 - 80 mpg and it uses regular gas and will cruise 180+ miles on one tank. It is a joy on gravel roads. I have saddle bags and a Burley flat-bed bicycle trailer for in town shopping and groceries and laundry, etc.  There is an excellent Suzuki TU250X forum.  Someone on the forum has even added a sidecar and that is a beautiful rig. The Louisiana State Police use this motorcycle for beginners training and if I had to have only one motorcycle I don't know what I would do. I don't really need two motorcycles and sometimes it is even a bother having two but I can't bring myself to get rid of the TUX, it is such a beautiful and fun little bike.

[sturgeon]

Nice! I've done 500-km days on my WR250R and find it, well, tiring. The engine is capable of highway speeds all day long, but pretty buzzy at anything over 80 km/h. I'm very interested to hear what the CSC is like. 

[kingoffleece]

I had a CZ250 in the stable for a few years.  Very fun to ride.

be sure to read Joe Gresh's story last month about touring on that bike.  Great stuff.

[jas67]

....
But seriously, the older I get, the more I think about what would happen if I dumped the bike out in the boonies while riding alone.
Would really like to see a 400cc ADV bike. That seems like the perfect size to me.

That's why my ADV bike is a 650cc thumper instead of a 1200cc twin.    It still weighs over 400#, but, I can at least stand it back up by myself.     Now, a 400cc AV bike weighing 300#, that would be the perfect ADV bike IMHO.

I don't see any reason one couldn't just buy any of the already existing 250cc Enduros and make an ADV Bike out of it.

There are many (not all listed are current models):
Yamaha WR250R (likely the best of the class)
Kawasaki KLR250
Kawasaki KLX250X
Kawasaki Super Sherpa
Suzuki DRZ250
Honda CRF250L (and the older CRF230L)

I'd be a lot more comfortable with the reliability of these Japanese models than an unproven Chinese bike.

[Penderic]

Its not a 250 but it is really light.

Looking for the long downhill.

[jas67]

Honda actually made a 250cc ADV bike in the late 80's, the NX250:


Dry weight was 260lbs, so, likely 300 wet.   The 249cc water cooled engine made 25HP, plenty for a 300 lb bike.
The air cooled 249cc engine of the XR250L at the time was only 19 HP.

The suspension had 8.7" of travel in the front, and 7.9" in the back, definitely off road capable.
It had a small fairing to offer a little wind protection on the highway.

[kidsmoke]

My nephew has been running around west africa (primarily Ghana) for the last year and a half on this Chinese Apsonic Aloba. He loads it down heavily, and generally beats the snot out of it, and it's proven a crazy reliable steed.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Honda actually made a 250cc ADV bike in the late 80's, the NX250:

Dry weight was 260lbs, so, likely 300 wet.   The 249cc water cooled engine made 25HP, plenty for a 300 lb bike.
The air cooled 249cc engine of the XR250L at the time was only 19 HP.

The suspension had 8.7" of travel in the front, and 7.9" in the back, definitely off road capable.
It had a small fairing to offer a little wind protection on the highway.

Also had an "odd" sized rear tire - 120/90-16. Probably the only reason MZ Saxon Country owners can still find suitable tires!

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

That's why my ADV bike is a 650cc thumper instead of a 1200cc twin.    It still weighs over 400#, but, I can at least stand it back up by myself.     Now, a 400cc AV bike weighing 300#, that would be the perfect ADV bike IMHO.

I don't see any reason one couldn't just buy any of the already existing 250cc Enduros and make an ADV Bike out of it.

There are many (not all listed are current models):
Yamaha WR250R (likely the best of the class)
Kawasaki KLR250
Kawasaki KLX250X
Kawasaki Super Sherpa
Suzuki DRZ250
Honda CRF250L (and the older CRF230L)

I'd be a lot more comfortable with the reliability of these Japanese models than an unproven Chinese bike.

You forgot the XT225 and XT250. "Lois on the Loose" proved the 225 was ADV capable. She was at the Timonium (MD) Motorcycle Show last year, but unfortunately not again this year. http://cycleshow.net/travel-touring/

[jas67]

You forgot the XT225 and XT250. "Lois on the Loose" proved the 225 was ADV capable. She was at the Timonium (MD) Motorcycle Show last year, but unfortunately not again this year. http://cycleshow.net/travel-touring/

Thanks, Charlie.   I don't know how I could forget the XT, esp. since they are priced much lower than the WR (Guzzi content).

I have a friend who rides his all over the fire roads up in State College and loves it.

[bigbikerrick]

A Yamaha XT 225 "Serow" was my wife's first street legal bike. Great little air cooled enduro that would go almost anywhere, and was stone solid reliable. I changed the front sprocket to make the gearing 1 tooth taller for the highway, and my wife put many enjoyable miles on that bike touring around Arizona.
Rick.

[Semper-guzzi]

I'm very interested in the RX3 as well. I'll most likely be buying one in the next 8 months or so.

[lucydad]

Peter,

Cool bike!  Nothing wrong with a 250 in my book!  Please let us know impressions as you ride it and enjoy. 

[leafman60]

Glad you pulled the trigger, bit the bullet, kicked the ball....

Bring it to Daytona! Better yet, RIDE it to Daytona!

[Guido Valvole]

My V50s (II and Monza) are reasonably light at maybe 375 pounds. And feel heavy compared to the 300-lb BSA B40/SS90. I recently got to ride a friend's 125cc MV, vintage `54 or 55 or so. Felt like a bicycle with a motor and was all sorts of silly fun on small backroads up to maybe 50 mph. Made the Beeza feel like a heavy pig, lol. The most fun I've ever  had not going more the 50 mph  .  I rode a Ninja 300 for a bit a couple of years ago, felt electric, smooth, light, and boring with little tactile feedback. Much shifting necessary, and downshifting 4 gears to a stop from 30 mph or so was a bit interesting.

250 to 350 used to be a reasonably-sized bike. Now 500s are "too small" and anything under a liter is for "beginners". How silly!
cr

[pyoungbl]

I'm in the process of reading a book that goes into the development of CSC (the company) and their new offerings.  5000 miles at 8000 RPM available on Amazon for Kindle @ $10.  It's a fun winter read.  I'm getting a greater degree of confidence about the bike as I see what a world class manufacturing operation is behind it.  Sara and I went to China a year ago and it's a bit easier to understand how sophisticated their manufacturing can be, given the chance.  Too many times the customer is demanding low cost rather than quality.  In this case the company is determined to hold the line on quality and let the cost fall where it may.  As an example, 100% of the bikes are put on a dyno to prove output.  That's QC to the nth degree.

There is a good chance I'll have the bike at Daytona, in 4 weeks.

Peter Y.

[sign216]

A 250 is a nice size.  Don't listen to the chest- thumpers that say differently.

[Muzz]

Peter, I see at the moment that you have a big block and a small block.

Have you considered getting rid of the big block, getting a 250 for general all purpose stuff and keeping the small block for the longer trips. I do not find the (small block) Breva very heavy at all to heave around and also find it very comfortable for the longer trips.

[EldoMike]

Honda actually made a 250cc ADV bike in the late 80's, the NX250:


Dry weight was 260lbs, so, likely 300 wet.   The 249cc water cooled engine made 25HP, plenty for a 300 lb bike.
The air cooled 249cc engine of the XR250L at the time was only 19 HP.

The suspension had 8.7" of travel in the front, and 7.9" in the back, definitely off road capable.
It had a small fairing to offer a little wind protection on the highway.

I rescued one of these from a barn a few weeks ago..hope to go through it before summer

[pyoungbl]

Peter, I see at the moment that you have a big block and a small block.

Have you considered getting rid of the big block, getting a 250 for general all purpose stuff and keeping the small block for the longer trips. I do not find the (small block) Breva very heavy at all to heave around and also find it very comfortable for the longer trips.

Yes, I actually put the Stelvio on the market in December but changed my mind in January.  I have planned a trip from Va to Ca in July.  The Stelvio is a fantastic bike for munching miles so it makes sense to hang on to it until I finish that trip.  Then I'll get back down to two bikes, V7 and the 250.  I did a 1500 mile weekend rally on the V7 last fall.  No problems.  The Stelvio lets me carry much more camping gear and it has that fantastic range.  OTOH, I dread moving the Big Girl if/when she takes a nap.

[flip]

The RX3 is a neat looking bike! The 2500 mile valve check intervals seems a bit excessive or if not, it would get irritating to me pretty quickly.

[pyoungbl]

The 2500 mile valve check came from the engineers at Zongshen and it appears to be a very conservative figure.  CSC did a 5,000 mile tour with 10 of these bikes and found that all the valves were basically well in spec after that trip...5K at 8K rpm.  CSC is now recommending 5K valve check.  Zongshen also spec'd a 2K mile oil change.  I intend to pull oil samples at each change just to figure out how often I need to change the oil.  The bike only holds 1.5 Quarts or so.  Interestingly enough, there is a cartridge oil filter and two oil strainers.  You replace the filter and check the strainers for metal bits (just like on the Stelvio 8V...but there is no requirement to check the one on the Stelvio).  To do a full oil change you need to remove all three drains so you get a full drain from both the crankcase and the transmission, they share the same oil.

Peter Y.

[acogoff]

     I had a look at their parts diagram and can't figure out their oil pump. Seems there are two. Maybe they have a scavenge pump and a pressure pump, thus all the strainers? I realize that a ball bearing crank probably doesn't need a whole lot of oil, but I want more oil than that in my crankcase.