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Would you want your wife, mother or sister treated like this in the workplace. If the answer is no how can you support your argument?Dean
Just my opinion, but isn't it a good idea to treat others how you want to be treated? JS
From the EEOC definition: Sexual HarassmentIt is unlawful to harass a person (an applicant or employee) because of that person’s sex. Harassment can include “sexual harassment” or unwelcome sexual advances, requests for sexual favors, and other verbal or physical harassment of a sexual nature.Harassment does not have to be of a sexual nature, however, and can include offensive remarks about a person’s sex. For example, it is illegal to harass a woman by making offensive comments about women in general.Both victim and the harasser can be either a woman or a man, and the victim and harasser can be the same sex.Although the law doesn’t prohibit simple teasing, offhand comments, or isolated incidents that are not very serious, harassment is illegal when it is so frequent or severe that it creates a hostile or offensive work environment or when it results in an adverse employment decision (such as the victim being fired or demoted).The harasser can be the victim's supervisor, a supervisor in another area, a co-worker, or someone who is not an employee of the employer, such as a client or customer.
In my (former) place of work, if the incident made your wife feel uncomfortable, she'd be well within her rights to file a complaint of her own, should she choose to do so.
That leaves alot to interpretation. I don't consider a hug a "sexual advance" do you?
That's probably what got the guy going in the first place.What's the first thing that all the guys say to each other at the first bathroom break at 10:00 AM at the annual day-long EEOC Anti-Harassment training session?"Damn, I wish one of these babes would sexually harass ME! Won't find ME making any complaints!" All good fun at the bar, spring break, or Mardi Gras. All business at work; has to be.Lannis
That's not my point Lannis, if I've offended someone, I would like them to tell me so and I'll apoligize and stop what ever it was I was doing. If I think your being an asshole you can bet you will know it right away, I won't go whining to HR I'll tell you so. I'd give you a chance to do better. It was a hug, not shooting her the moon.
There are issues on a number of levels here.Apart from it being very 'Unprofessional' for a manager to go around touching his subordinates regardless of gender there is also the age difference thing which, I'm sorry, I find creepy. I'm in my late fifties but am still able to fully appreciate the attractiveness of young women but the idea of sleazing up to them and offering 'Hugs' or anything else is totally loathsome and purient! Also, as mentioned there is the 'Power' thing, Manager potentially has the ability to make decisions that will effect the career and future of their subordinates. That means that whether suggested, implied, threatened or not it could be interpreted by the subordinate that there might be repercussions if they didn't comply with the creepy request for physical contact. No employee should be put in that position.This is not to suggest that there should never be any physical contact. Good lord we're social creatures and in a working environment like a bank or office there are always going to be times when people are reaching up to shelves or into filing cabinets and squeezing past each other in confined spaces but there is a big difference between that and some noxious perv wanting to squeeze his wrinkly old carcass against a young, female subordinate. I'd say the witness has every right to be upset. It's gross! I have no idea if I would of said something but I'd of made a few discreet enquiries around the place to see if it was the sort of thing that happened often and if it was I'd suggest something be done about it. I know if my daughter came home upset after being treated like that I'd be suggesting she make a formal complaint, (And not tell her mother otherwise Jude would probably be down there in about three seconds flat with a pair of pruning shears! She's never liked bullies!).I'm with Lannis. Creep is an antediluvian throwback! It's the twenty first century! We don't need dickheads like this running anything more demanding than a tap!PetePS, and Jon, I agree, there are many, much worse, things going on in the world but that doesn't make this situation OK.
You know Lannis, I must have skimmed over the "make a woman outa you" comment, that is a problem. I stand corrected. He needs to know that's not acceptable.
Is a bank teller job worth that fight? Really?Banks are on every street corner. No way I'd want to work in a place that allowed that BS to go unchecked. I'd be passing my resume around to other banks and be on my way. It's a job, not a career, and life is too short to have to hassle with this kind of BS.
You know Lannis, I must have skimmed over the "make a woman outa you" comment, that is a problem. I stand corrected. He needs to know that's not acceptable. If it were just the hug, not worth getting shit canned over. Tell him not to do that again and document it.
My first reaction to the post that Dean read to me was disgust. Unfortunately it takes aging to get to the place where I am today and would have told the bank manager exactly what he could do with his hug and remarks. When I was 24 I too would have said or done nothing; it was the way of business back then. But not today. Sexual harassment is not about sex. It’s about power. The power one person has over another as in this instance a manager to a subordinate. The 24 year old feels obligated to accept the behavior for fear of losing her job or being treated badly if she shows any resistance. It’s tantamount to quid pro quo where women get to keep their jobs if the manager gets to harass them. And it’s illegal. Additionally any statement, noise or gestures the manager has made about attractive female customers is sexual harassment not mention cultivating a hostile environment. Again there are laws against it. I am willing to bet that the bank has a sexual harassment policy in place. It should have been communicated to every employee upon hire and should have clear guidelines (1.) what constitutes harassment and (2.) the steps to take to report the unacceptable behavior. Tell your wife and the 24 year old to use it and do it now! Tell them to make notes of dates, time and place and any others who may have witnessed the behavior. Tell them to go to HR and verbally require that their discussion be held in strict confidence. (It will be believe me, that is, if the HR dept. has any clue of what it could cost them if they don’t take immediate and appropriate action.) Neither your wife nor the 24 year old has to confront the manager; that’s HR’s job. They just need to give HR everything they remember about all the instances that have taken place. Then they need to go back to work and see if changes are made. If nothing happens and the behavior continues then have them contact the EEOC. The EEOC will want all the same information including when and who in HR was notified. The EEOC will take it from there. Nobody at the bank can stop them from taking whatever action they deem necessary to investigate. If the EEOC finds cause, the bank will be penalized and all parties who have filed a claim can obtain attorneys and file civil suits. Tell your wife not to be afraid, there are at least two who can testify about the manager’s behavior and it needs to stop. Dean's wife Cindy
[snip]This manager is an abusive, pompous ass, and a "bully" type, who in the past numerous times has said innapropriate comments, mostly regarding attractive female customers that enter the bank, and on numerous occasions has yelled at and belittled female employees ,even in front of customers......do you think my wife should take any action with HR, etc. or just let it slide? [snip
My wife worked as a short order cook and there was always some fooling around in the kitchen. You know,verbal nonsense between adults. One time the owner got a bit touchy with some of the women...My wife said, with a smile, while holding a boning knife, " touch me and I'll cut your f***ing dick off ". The owner got the message. People need to initially deal with problems at the personal level... Women or men who feel they have been harassed need to tell the harasser to get lost. If the harasser doesn't, then call out the dogs.
The problem with this approach is that if the harasser is in a position of power, they can doctor up a case for discipline or termination of the person who complained. Then the harasser has a ready defense to any subsequent accusations -- that the person complaining is trying to save their job with false accusations. While it is hard to believe that in this day and age, this is simply a matter of, "If he knew better, he would do better," this is a management issue and it is for management, not a rank-and-file employee, to make the call whether the offending manager can be rehabilitated or should be let go.
Sometimes you have to man up ,do what has to be done and take your chances. If someone was bulling you,and sexual harassment is bulling, would would confront the bully? Besides most states,like NY, are "at will employment".. meaning the employer needs no reason to terminate employment unless there is contract stating otherwise.