Wildgoose Chase Moto Guzzi

General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Irn on August 28, 2020, 06:26:09 PM

Title: Insurance
Post by: Irn on August 28, 2020, 06:26:09 PM
I have now have only 2 two-wheeled vehicles, a 2007 BMW F800ST and a 2006 Vespa 250GTS(not including a rather large bicycle contingent).  Both garaged and not ridden much, under 4k/year per bike. Though I have all my policies with State Farm and have for over 45 years, and their service has been excellent in the rare cases I have filed a claim the cost to insure the bikes is outrageous.  On a lark,  I tried Hagerty for a quote and much better coverage on paper for less than half the costs.  Both bikes are garaged which is a stipulation for coverage.  What am I missing? Any experience with Haggerty.  Thanks in advance for your input.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Ncdan on August 28, 2020, 08:07:27 PM
I recently went with Gieco. I have liability only on an 83 Honda CB1000C and an 02 MG Stone, both for a little over 200.00 a year.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: JJ on August 28, 2020, 08:39:40 PM
My late father used to say that Insurance companies are the biggest legal racket in the USA.  I hate all of them...
They are in business for two reasons and two reasons only:

1. Collect their monthly premiums...
2. Then SCREW YOU when it comes time to pay any claims.

 :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:

For reference, I have ALLSTATE for my properties and vehicles, except our vintage Mustang, which I used HAGGERTY.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: sickora on August 29, 2020, 08:17:01 AM
Haggarty is a speciality insurer focused on collector cars. I believe it is one of the biggest in the world for collector car insurance.   Honestly, I'm a bit surprised they quoted you, as they typically write older motorycles only. But, they are a solid company, I wouldn't worry that they won't cover your claim.   I'd also check out Progressive, Geico, and Dairlyland.   Progressive and Geico are the #1 and #2 Motorcycle insurance writers, and Dairyland is another MC speciality writer. 

And expect Motorcycle premiums to vary wildly, more than car premiums. there are a number of factors to this, that I can elaborate on if you want, but I don't want to put people reading this to sleep. For reference, full coverage with 100/300 limits on my 2019 Guzzi V7iii was $350 for the year with Progressive, this with me having my auto and home through them, and my premium was $180 through Dairyland.  I went with Dairyland.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: n3303j on August 29, 2020, 08:30:03 AM
Mapfre insurance in Massachusetts.
They do all my insurance.
500K Liability.
100K Property Damage.
No coverage for the bike being damaged (I'll underwrite that).
3 bikes, $100 per bike
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: twodogs on August 29, 2020, 08:35:23 AM
Check out Dairyland :bike-037:
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: et18 on August 29, 2020, 09:02:00 AM
I've had Progressive for several years,about $115 per bike annual. Just picked up a 3rd bike, 01 R1200c, and the annual increase was $6. So $230 for 2 bikes, $236 for three.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: guzziart on August 29, 2020, 09:09:46 AM
FWIW, I've got all my bikes insured through Foremost for about $225 (annually) each.  The only advice I have to offer as far as premiums go is "shop around".  Premiums are all over the place, even between agent to agent within the same insurer.

Something else, my mc ins. premiums are paid annually.  My premiums for car insurance were paid every 6 mo. because that is how they have been billing me.  I also, had the option to pay a 3mo premium when the bill comes but it costs $5 more because of additional processing at their end.  So, I recently asked my insurer if they could offer a lower rate.  I was told that if I can pay annually, my rate reduction would be about $180 less per year (21% reduction),  I said I'll take the annual payment plan.  My next question was why the F wasn't I given this option a decade ago and was told some people can't afford to pay that much money at once (annually) so they don't mention it.

More insurance related....I wrecked one bike & lost another to a flood ('07 Money Creek Campground) and both times it was a knock down dragout battle with the insurance company to recoup my losses.  However,  a fair/equitable settlement can be accomplished with a little effort.  The insurer will sell you accessory coverage in the fine print somewhere but will conveniently forget about it when/if a claim is filled....don't you forget about it.  Also, documents to support your claim for a more substantial settlement (receipts, ads for similar vehicles with like miles, etc.) help too.  Even though insurers want to pay out the least amount, they are open to negotiate realistic reasonable values...imho & experience but you have to do your homework too.

Safe riding y'all!
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: guzziart on August 29, 2020, 09:12:27 AM
I've had Progressive for several years,about $115 per bike annual. Just picked up a 3rd bike, 01 R1200c, and the annual increase was $6. So $230 for 2 bikes, $236 for three.

Geez, I will check Progressive next season!
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Bulldog9 on August 29, 2020, 09:56:42 AM
I have now have only 2 two-wheeled vehicles, a 2007 BMW F800ST and a 2006 Vespa 250GTS(not including a rather large bicycle contingent).  Both garaged and not ridden much, under 4k/year per bike. Though I have all my policies with State Farm and have for over 45 years, and their service has been excellent in the rare cases I have filed a claim the cost to insure the bikes is outrageous.  On a lark,  I tried Hagerty for a quote and much better coverage on paper for less than half the costs.  Both bikes are garaged which is a stipulation for coverage.  What am I missing? Any experience with Haggerty.  Thanks in advance for your input.

I've got Haggerty on my Porsche 912, the XS 1100 and on the Convert. I also have their roadside assistance on all.

If you look at the rules it basically says you shouldn't be driving or riding for normal daily activities or commuting to work. Should be limited to pleasure riding, weekend events and Rally's etc.

I've had one claim on the Porsche which was motoguzzi-related. After 8 years with a Yamaha FJR, the first day I brought the Norge home muscle memory failed me, and when I tried to put on the center stand I dropped it.... The tip of the mirror gouged the driver's door and made a nasty gash in the brand new paint. after I finished terrorizing the neighborhood with my verbal renting, I called Haggerty.  They sent out an adjuster immediately and 3 days later I had a check. No issues no hassles and no price increase.

I will gladly use hagerty for any vehicle that I own that qualifies. I have Geico for all of my other cars and motorcycles and they have great prices. I'm also surprised that hagerty quoted you for a 2008, I thought the vehicles had to be 25 years or older.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: blackcat on August 29, 2020, 10:32:52 AM
I have Hagerty on my 70 el Camino and have made one claim with them over the many years of having coverage with them and they were great.  I just sent them a photo of the damage, got a quote for the work and they sent me the full amount within a week.

Dairyland, never again as they were complete jerks when someone backed into my CX. I wasn't even on the bike and they said I was a risk and dropped my coverage even though they didn't pay a nickel for the damages. I switched to Progressive and they have been great, made one claim and they investigated and priced the part through Harper's.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Cam3512 on August 29, 2020, 10:49:55 AM
USAA for the cars, and Progressive (through USAA) on the new V85 Guzzi.  Classic insurance (agreed value) on the 3 vintage Guzzis.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: coast range rider on August 29, 2020, 11:14:03 AM
I've had Progressive for several years,about $115 per bike annual. Just picked up a 3rd bike, 01 R1200c, and the annual increase was $6. So $230 for 2 bikes, $236 for three.
annual increase was $6???
What a ripoff!
My Geico premium went down when I added a second bike.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: cliffrod on August 29, 2020, 11:50:07 AM
Just be diligent with older vehicles with older VIN.  2 yrs ago, we changed to Liberty Mutual per father in law's yrs of good service.  We had no claims or violations for decades.  Changing to them cut our premiums by approx 2/3.  Very cool. 

Then we received notice from DMV a month later to "verify our insurance with provider" for my 73 Chevy truck.  We did. Liberty Mutual said all is paid in full and ok.  The next year, we received no property tax/tag renewal for that truck.  Thought it was just an oversight or lost piece of mail.   When we followed through, we learned tag was revoked 10 months prior for no insurance, violation posted via bench decision against my license for no insurance & not surrendering active tag, violation then attached to my perfect credit report, etc, etc.  Thankfully, I had not been pulled for driving revoked during the prior 10 months, had an accident or other issue.

We learned the old VIN didn't fit the current DMV e-form used by insurer to report coverage, so it was likely rejected as invalid entry & the insurer just moved on instead of resolving the matter properly.  We eventually got it straightened out but will do more in the future if we ever receive such notice from the DMV & not just trust the insurer is doing their job because we paid the bill. 

Needless to say, I'll be even more careful when getting tag & insurance for my 4 digit VIN V700.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Moparnut72 on August 29, 2020, 01:11:35 PM
A few years ago a I purchased a 10 yr old low milege Harley. I kind of thought I paid a little too much for it but it was in primo condition. After owning it for about 9 months it was destroyed in a garage fire. I firgured I would probably take a big hit from the insurance company. Progressive offered a settlement that covered what I had paid for the bike plus taxes and registration fees. I still use them even though I may be able to save a little money with someone else. Customer service is worth more than a few dollars. Now my home owners insurance screwed me to the wall on garage/shop replacement. They weren't "on my side".
kk
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Irn on August 29, 2020, 02:00:36 PM
Thanks to all, great input.  Some research a friend of mine who has a 1946  Chevy pickup and a 2016 Miata has both insured via Hagerty.  It seems their criteria might have changed, the insured vehicles have to be garaged, can not be daily drivers, and most likely have to have a low mileage limit.  All the other companies mentioned, Geico, Progressive, etc were considerably higher for identical coverage but less than current State Farm premium.  Someone mention Mapfre, overwhelming noted on line as having toxic customer service and better hire an attorney to get a claim paid.  Thanks all in the community for your input.  Service from State Farm has been outstanding, their Motorcycle coverage is just insanely expensive plus no tow or roadside option. 
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: GeorgiaGuzzi on August 29, 2020, 04:00:19 PM
I use USAA for our cars and truck. Markle for the bikes. I was with progressive, and their MOTORCYCLE division was great. However, I had an extremely bad experience with their AUTO side when a progressive auto customer hit me on my progressive motorcycle insured motorcycle. I specifically told them when I switched that the reason I was switching was because of their auto side. Iím not paying a penny of my earnings to progressive. But no complaints about their bike coverage. If that all makes sense. Markle has been great. A bit expensive, but after everything Iíve gone thru Iím not dealing with cut rate insurance.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Irn on September 14, 2020, 09:35:03 AM
I wanted to finish up this thread.  Haggerty did issue me a policy for a 2006 Vespa GTS250 and a 2007 BMW F800ST, hardly collector's items or 25 years old.  The main criteria it seems are they can not be daily drivers, my guess mileage limitations under 3k/year, they must be garaged, you have to have another vehicle as your daily driver.  The cost was 70% LESS then State Farm for much higher coverage including tow which State Farm does not offer.  I did get quotes from Geico, Progressive, etc all in the same range as State Farm.  The agent was super helpful to get me coverage.  He was on the phone with the underwriting department,  They will not issue a Sports bike unless it hits the age min.  The F800ST was noted as a sports tourer, a no go until he asked if I had hard bags, and I of course do.  He said to take some photos of the bike with hard bags, presto 5 days latter insurance issued.  I like the company still seems family-owned.  All the agents I dealt with over the phone were super knowledgable first agent was a rider.  The name your replacement value seems so smart, and their reputation for handling claims is great.  For anyone on this site with older Guzzi or any of the foot fwd Geese, you should check them out.  State Farm has been great for home and auto, but I think they just don't want to be in the Moto biz.  Oh yeah, for those of us in CA, since your bike is in a garage for $2/year they give you earthquake coverage, we've had pandemic, firestorms, unbreathable air, just saying our state and the west has been hit hard.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: jcctx on September 14, 2020, 10:57:02 AM
Markel was great for me!!
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: berniebee on September 14, 2020, 11:21:31 AM
One more point: NEVER stop shopping around for insurance. Yeah the lady on the phone may be very nice, but it's a business and they count on you being lulled while the rates go up every year.

Contact three companies at renewal every year or two.  Unless you are Bill Gates, it's worth your time.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Lannis on September 14, 2020, 11:32:00 AM
One more point: NEVER stop shopping around for insurance. Yeah the lady on the phone may be very nice, but it's a business and they count on you being lulled while the rates go up every year.

Contact three companies at renewal every year or two.  Unless you are Bill Gates, it's worth your time.

Absolutely.   No matter which insurance company I've ever had, the game is the same .... Give you a good price the first year, then start ratcheting it up until you can't stand it any more, you go somewhere else for a 25% discount, and it starts going up AGAIN ...

... and three years later you're back at the company you started from, who quotes you a price far less than what you had with them three years ago, and the cycle starts again.

This business of running off good customers with zero claim rates, just to see what they'll sit still for, SEEMS like the dumbest business model ever, except for the fact that these are the biggest, most profitable companies on earth, and always have been.   The fact that the government REQUIRES you to buy their product, and then "regulates" them (strange bedfellows indeed) probably contributes to their ability to hose you.

Lannis
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Tusayan on September 15, 2020, 09:39:08 AM
National General, nine bikes with no collision, $378 total per year.  I donít buy any more insurance than I need, have never made a claim on any vehicle policy, and have saved a lot of money in that way over many decades. 

My total insurance bill for everything in the world I insure is not much less than $5K per year, and my return on investment over many years has been close to zero.  If you try to make a claim, my experience is that you enter a world of hassle with miniature minds, with little to no reward.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: John Croucher on September 15, 2020, 10:04:06 AM
Federal law mandates that Americans have health care insurance.  Insurance Consumers are being double and triple health insured with auto insurance, workmans comp and other health insurance premiums for injuries caused in motor vehicle accidents or negligence of other drivers. Since health care insurance is mandated by law, why should motor vehicle operators be insuring others?  Follow the money and the greasy hands behind the laws.   Insure your vehicle, not your health.   
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: PJPR01 on September 15, 2020, 10:58:31 AM
Interesting thread...just for kicks yesterday, I got a quote from Haggerty for my 3 motorcycles.

I'm paying $870 a year from State Farm today, have 250/500 coverage (used to be 100/300), but the umbrella policy automatically bumps it up to the next level with no extra cost.

Haggerty quotes $670 for 100/300 coverage for all 3 bikes, not bad.  Have asked State Farm to see if they will match the price...we'll see...

Thanks for the tip on Haggerty! 

 
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Lannis on September 15, 2020, 11:53:15 AM
Federal law mandates that Americans have health care insurance.

I don't think that's true.   When I retired, I took a "marketplace" Bronze policy out for Fay and I.

Over the next 3 years, although we were healthy and had no claims, the premiums soared to $2800 a month, with $13,000/year out-of-pocket and deductibles.

We figured that for $48,000 a year, we could cover ourselves, so we dropped all the health insurance and just went to self-pay, where we found that doctors and hospitals keep two sets of books - one for the insurance claims, and one for people paying cash on the barrelhead.

It worked out fine for us, and was MUCH cheaper than carrying insurance for that period.  We joined a co-op for $100/mo, but that didn't pay anything and wasn't insurance.

Now it's true that you can't load before-tax money at $7700/year into a Health Savings Account unless you're carrying high-deductible insurance, but there's nothing that says that you HAVE to buy insurance.   For many people, it just doesn't make sense.

Lannis
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Wild1_OR on September 15, 2020, 12:51:51 PM
I have now have only 2 two-wheeled vehicles, a 2007 BMW F800ST and a 2006 Vespa 250GTS(not including a rather large bicycle contingent).  Both garaged and not ridden much, under 4k/year per bike. Though I have all my policies with State Farm and have for over 45 years, and their service has been excellent in the rare cases I have filed a claim the cost to insure the bikes is outrageous.  On a lark,  I tried Hagerty for a quote and much better coverage on paper for less than half the costs.  Both bikes are garaged which is a stipulation for coverage.  What am I missing? Any experience with Haggerty.  Thanks in advance for your input.

It's important to bear in mind that we get what we pay for. Many companies are simply brokers and if/when a claim is filed, it's challenging to receive proper compensation in a timely manner. Other companies are fine if one stays within their network, but when the choice is made to go outside of their network, the hoops to jump through are frustratingly plenty. All this I learned from personal experience, my time as a personal injury paralegal and shop owners that I've known throughout the years.

My suggestion is to stick with the large well established insurance companies such as State Farm and Allstate. I used to shop insurance based solely on rate, but never again.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Lannis on September 15, 2020, 01:53:05 PM
It's important to bear in mind that we get what we pay for. Many companies are simply brokers and if/when a claim is filed, it's challenging to receive proper compensation in a timely manner. Other companies are fine if one stays within their network, but when the choice is made to go outside of their network, the hoops to jump through are frustratingly plenty. All this I learned from personal experience, my time as a personal injury paralegal and shop owners that I've known throughout the years.

My suggestion is to stick with the large well established insurance companies such as State Farm and Allstate. I used to shop insurance based solely on rate, but never again.

Haggerty is a big well-known company with a good track record.

The reason for the difference in rates when you've been with a company a long time is that they know that there's a certain amount of inertia in a customer who has been with a company that long, a sort of "satisfaction" and unwillingness to change.  So like boiling a frog, they gradually turn up the premiums until you don't notice that the water is hot unless you leap out.   There's no reason for the rate differences, any more than there's any reason for the price of an airline ticket that's $315 for this company this week and $1234 for that company that week then $124 for t'other company t'other week ... it's all in what you'll sit still for.

Lannis
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Wild1_OR on September 15, 2020, 02:21:32 PM
Haggerty is a big well-known company with a good track record.

The reason for the difference in rates when you've been with a company a long time is that they know that there's a certain amount of inertia in a customer who has been with a company that long, a sort of "satisfaction" and unwillingness to change.  So like boiling a frog, they gradually turn up the premiums until you don't notice that the water is hot unless you leap out.   There's no reason for the rate differences, any more than there's any reason for the price of an airline ticket that's $315 for this company this week and $1234 for that company that week then $124 for t'other company t'other week ... it's all in what you'll sit still for.

Lannis

Haggerty is a broker for Essentia and partners with Nationwide, Progressive and/or Esurance. I'm not saying they're good or bad though.

I've been with State Farm for 15 years and many rate increases have been offset by discounts over the years, mostly due to having filed only one comprehensive claim and reaching certain loyalty milestones. After previously always having suffered with insurance brokers, the one time (knock on wood) that I filed a claim and went through the process, was validation that I had made the right choice. Do I pay slightly more for my home and auto insurance, maybe but the peace of mind is worth it.

Something else that I forgot to mention, in addition to the challenges of dealing with many brokers if/when there's a need to file a claim, the rates are less up front, but once a driving citation is received and/or a claim is filed, rates will significantly increase and it's not uncommon to be dropped.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Two Checks on September 15, 2020, 02:27:23 PM
The health insurance mandate was eliminated.
As for vehicle insurance a late friend who lived in TX told me rates were regulated by govt and every company charged the same.
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Bulldog9 on September 15, 2020, 04:14:36 PM
I HAD an old Porsche and the Convert on Haggerty, and the Griso, 12S and Stornello on Geico. I also had my Bullitt Mustang on Geico. Never thought about the 'newer' bikes or cars with Haggerty.

Based on other's input, I just moved the Griso, 12S and Bullitt to Haggerty, saved $800 a year and equal/better coverage. Caveat is not using those bikes or cars for regular daily driving duties and lower miles.

Thanks for the heads up!
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Tusayan on September 15, 2020, 10:50:17 PM
As above, National General (GMAC) charges me $378 per year TOTAL price for basic liability coverage on NINE motorcycles (that price covers all of them).  If you need high liability coverage limits they may not be your choice, plus Iíve been using them claim free since 1988 which may affect my cost.  Might still be worth checking out.

https://nationalgeneral.com/other-products/motorcycle-insurance/coverages.asp
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Lannis on September 16, 2020, 07:03:18 AM
As above, National General (GMAC) charges me $378 per year TOTAL price for basic liability coverage on NINE motorcycles (that price covers all of them).  If you need high liability coverage limits they may not be your choice, plus Iíve been using them claim free since 1988 which may affect my cost.  Might still be worth checking out.

https://nationalgeneral.com/other-products/motorcycle-insurance/coverages.asp

I'll check it out.   I've never gone for "high liability limits", because I figure that even if I'm liable for a road crash  (and I've never even been in a road crash for which I wasn't liable, much less one where I was), how much damage can I be liable for with a motorcycle?    I'm not the guy on a Ducati who put it through the side of a van at 140 MPH.

I'll get a quote and report back!

Lannis
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: sickora on September 16, 2020, 07:36:05 AM
I'll quickly summarize what I've read on this thread.  First,  my background is 15+ years in product management for Personal Lines insurance, including 3 years of running the pricing area of Motorcycle insurance for a very well known insurer. 

In general, most of the sentiments here are correct.  Insurance companies do typically slowly raise rates (1-3% per year) on long term customers. The theory being that these are small enough that the insurer won't switch,  and are needed for inflation and loss trends.  To offset this, there are loyalty rewards, etc..   That is without there being a general rate increase across the entire book of business for the state.

I am also a shopper, but stick to well known companies.  You can get quotes from 3-5 large companies in well under 1/2 hour.  There are enough large companies that by cycling through them (Geico, Progressive, Allstate, State Farm, Liberty Mutual, Farmers, Nationwide, Hartford, Travelers, to name a few) you should find a good price.  For MC specifically, add on Dairyland, Merkel, and apparently Haggarty.

Lastly, your liability limits are your choice. but I've seen multiple MC claims payout hit their limits and then our insured by sued for more money. One at fault accident resulting in grievous injury or death of the other person is not only tragic, but could ruin you financially. Just my two cents.

Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: rjamesohio on September 16, 2020, 08:39:42 AM
Since I added the Breva to my frequently ridden bikes (as opposed to projects) I was quoted an $80 per year increase by Farmers Group just because I substituted the Breva for my old Cali.

My agent did me a solid - he wrote me a policy for BOTH with Progressive for $172 if I paid in advance. That's LESS that what I paid for the Cali and BMW last year with Allstate.

So it pays to shop around or have an agent that is looking out for you.

Regarding Hagerty - I have Hagerty insurance on three vehicles and love dealing with them; their Driver's Club has towing service and you get a really GREAT magazine 6 times a year. That said - I don't include the bikes with Hagerty as they are a little pricey, even though it would have been awesome to have everything in one place...
Title: Re: Insurance
Post by: Lexiyntax on September 16, 2020, 09:00:59 AM
Biggest 'gotcha' I have seen with Progressive insurance is when shopping around they tend to have a lower 'first year' price as they know people are shopping around, it goes up after that for a year or two, but then it starts dropping. Well for all my bikes but the Harley anyway, that is my only bike now that the insurance actually goes up every year.

As someone who keeps bikes long term, I've found Progressive best for me as after those first few years they become the lowest price and with the vanishing deductible it pays to stay with them longer term. In my case I have a local agent who caries it, any time I have an issue I just stop in and they take care of it. Makes a huge difference when one doesn't have to deal directly with a megacorp, I definitely recommend preference to a local agent and whatever they carry for a reasonable rate, may limit your options depending on where you live but I find it makes my insurance life less stressful especially when I have a claim or issue.

Insurance is so wildly variable by state, where one lives, etc. it is hard to get any reasonable feel for which company is best for you on the internet. Almost every posting you read will be a different scenario than you, insurance companies are big on metrics and customization for specific areas.