Author Topic: Griso balance issue  (Read 935 times)

Offline Trogladyte

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Griso balance issue
« on: August 14, 2019, 07:39:24 AM »
I'm wondering if I need to balance the throttle bodies on my 8v Griso.

I have a new symptom, which has occurred quite suddenly, and I'm struggling to imagine what may have happened to cause it.

The bike fires up fine, but after pulling away, is a bit sluggish. With a bit more throttle everything kicks in, and she lifts up her skirts and goes, in the usual familiar way. It feels a bit like one cylinder is taking a bit longer than the other to join in with the fun. It's not missing - I know from bitter experience what it feels like with a misfire on one side, and this isn't it.

Can the throttles go out of balance in the normal course of events?

Offline egschade

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Re: Griso balance issue
« Reply #1 on: August 14, 2019, 08:38:34 AM »
Suggest you take your question over to Griso Ghetto https://www.grisoghetto.com/.
The elder Eric in NJ
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Online Bisbonian

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Re: Griso balance issue
« Reply #2 on: August 14, 2019, 09:18:09 AM »
With the amount of stuff you've had to go through, I'd certainly at least give the TB sync a try, assuming you have the necessary stuff to get it done.
For the longest time I would sync my throttle bodies every time I adjusted the valves, which was pretty much every oil change. Anymore, there is so little change on the valves, if any, that I don't bother. However if I developed a running problem then it's an easy, and fairly quick, thing to check.

Offline Dilliw

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Re: Griso balance issue
« Reply #3 on: August 14, 2019, 10:07:13 AM »
Man you've been through the ringer on this bike!

What you are descibing are some of the issues at least the early Griso's had in closed loop.  Pete wrote an article on back in the day:

http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzitech.dk/gb_en_complex-technical_8v-griso.htm

Since you've fought (and won!) the electrical side I would follow some of his  advice:

1. "That having been said it is important that before you embark on ANY changes you should ensure that the bike is correctly tuned and serviced." 

2.  Get it correctly mapped for any exhaust offerings that you are using.  If using the stock exhaust I would still consider a tuning solution since they can be very inexpensive.

3.  The article above was written before Mark started offering his maps, so you now have a choice between Todd's approach (referenced in the article) or Mark's.  FWIW I have Mark's map and my Griso runs better than any motorcycle I've ever ridden at any given rpm or situation.  IF using Mark's map then follow his tuning instructions:

https://www.griso.org/tuning.html



George Westbury
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Re: Griso balance issue
« Reply #3 on: August 14, 2019, 10:07:13 AM »

Online PJPR01

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Re: Griso balance issue
« Reply #4 on: August 14, 2019, 10:44:44 AM »
I'm wondering if I need to balance the throttle bodies on my 8v Griso.

I have a new symptom, which has occurred quite suddenly, and I'm struggling to imagine what may have happened to cause it.

The bike fires up fine, but after pulling away, is a bit sluggish. With a bit more throttle everything kicks in, and she lifts up her skirts and goes, in the usual familiar way. It feels a bit like one cylinder is taking a bit longer than the other to join in with the fun. It's not missing - I know from bitter experience what it feels like with a misfire on one side, and this isn't it.

Can the throttles go out of balance in the normal course of events?

Are you running a Beetle map?    That will help with that low 2-3K RPM flat spot.  Doing the throttle bodies cleans it up almost entirely...probably could do it completely if one super fine tunes it.

I will say however, that while both of those massively improved my Griso's response at low RPM's, there is still an ever so slight miss, but I just power thru it...however the above 2 items made a huge positive difference.

Sounds like the same issue...mine is a 2015 8V...not sure what your model is.
Paul R
2015 Red/Black Griso
2008 Silver Norge
2002 V11 Scura

Offline Trogladyte

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Re: Griso balance issue
« Reply #5 on: August 15, 2019, 04:19:44 PM »
Are you running a Beetle map?    That will help with that low 2-3K RPM flat spot.  Doing the throttle bodies cleans it up almost entirely...probably could do it completely if one super fine tunes it.

I will say however, that while both of those massively improved my Griso's response at low RPM's, there is still an ever so slight miss, but I just power thru it...however the above 2 items made a huge positive difference.

Sounds like the same issue...mine is a 2015 8V...not sure what your model is.
Hi Paul.

This is interesting. No - I'm running the stock map. And the bike is an 08 8v, so one of the earliest 8vs out of the factory. And despite what folk say, it has been a great bike. I did have endless valve issues for a couple of years, because I was eating camshafts and followers as a hobby before everyone, including the factory, realised that there was a more general problem. And i have struggled with a persistent wet misfire for a while. But I've managed to do around 60k miles - mostly in South London bandit country. It's my no 2 bike at the moment, but I still ride it at least once a week.

When you say "doing" the throttle bodies, do you mean balancing them? I think I have the kit to do it.

pete roper

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Re: Griso balance issue
« Reply #6 on: August 15, 2019, 04:45:51 PM »
You'll need Guzzidiag and a set of manometers to balance the throttlebodies. The early factory maps are dreadful. When it was rollerised did they update it? I'd sincerely hope so or it will be running like an utter turd!

Pete

beetle

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Re: Griso balance issue
« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2019, 04:50:31 PM »
Throttle bodies typically get out of balance over a period of time. If this change was sudden, then there may be another cause. Not saying you shouldn't balance them. They should be balanced periodically.

When you got it rollerised, they should have put the latest factory map in. The very first 8V maps were horrific.

As a first step, balance the TB's, then use GuzziDiag to reset the autolearning parameters.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2019, 04:51:23 PM by beetle »

Offline Trogladyte

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Re: Griso balance issue
« Reply #8 on: August 16, 2019, 02:08:06 PM »
Throttle bodies typically get out of balance over a period of time. If this change was sudden, then there may be another cause. Not saying you shouldn't balance them. They should be balanced periodically.

When you got it rollerised, they should have put the latest factory map in. The very first 8V maps were horrific.

As a first step, balance the TB's, then use GuzziDiag to reset the autolearning parameters.
Thanks guys

Yes - the map was updated when it was rollerised.

I've got manometers. And I had Guzzidiag, but that was back in the lovely old days when I had nothing to do with Windoze, and everything was Linux based. Sadly updating my hardware means I am again a victim of Windoze 10. So I suppose I  need to download it and start again.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2019, 02:08:53 PM by Trogladyte »

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Re: Griso balance issue
« Reply #9 on: August 16, 2019, 02:18:43 PM »
Correct...I should have been clearer.  "Doing" meaning referring to in fact doing the throttle body balancing.

Guzzidiag is super easy to use...puts a lot of power into your hands. 

Hopefully the combination of a refresh of GuzziDiag and doing the TB balancing puts the Griso back to its happy spot!

Let us know how it works out!
Paul R
2015 Red/Black Griso
2008 Silver Norge
2002 V11 Scura

beetle

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Re: Griso balance issue
« Reply #10 on: August 16, 2019, 06:13:00 PM »
I've got manometers. And I had Guzzidiag, but that was back in the lovely old days when I had nothing to do with Windoze, and everything was Linux based. Sadly updating my hardware means I am again a victim of Windoze 10. So I suppose I  need to download it and start again.


You do know there's Linux flavours of GuzziDiag?




Offline Trogladyte

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Re: Griso balance issue
« Reply #11 on: August 16, 2019, 06:40:16 PM »

You do know there's Linux flavours of GuzziDiag?
Yeah - I was using it on Linux. I'm windoze now, so I need to download it again.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2019, 06:40:54 PM by Trogladyte »

beetle

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Re: Griso balance issue
« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2019, 06:45:25 PM »
I'm windoze now


You have my sympathies.





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Harper's Moto Guzzi
Harper's Moto Guzzi. Where we still answer the phone, use the highest quality parts, and also do Transmission, rear drive, and carb rebuilds fast. Call us at 816.697.3411 and get your problems resolved.
http://www.harpermoto.com
Advertise Here