Wildgoose Chase Moto Guzzi

General Category => Bike Builds, Rebuilds And Restorations Only => Topic started by: Les P on December 04, 2017, 08:19:13 PM

Title: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on December 04, 2017, 08:19:13 PM
I have a few projects that have been in limbo for some time (years) now and this is one of them, a pretty much original 1973 Eldorado with around 15000 miles on the clock.
I will add a few pictures as I go, add others of what has been done so far which is a little ironic given I went out this morning to grab a set of swing arm taper roller bearings to replace the installed new ones that rusted (outer races) beyond service from sitting so long....

These were the pictures when it was for sale.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/websize/E4.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/websize/Eldorado.JPG)

There won't be any vapour blasting, shiny paint jobs or new chrome, what is there will get what it needs to be presentable as far as cosmetics.
The mechanical side is simply, if its worn it gets replaced.

Until a few months ago the frame had been like this for years, it then along with everything else went to a storage locker along with many tubs holding the rest of it.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/websize/IMG_1914.JPG)

Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Rick4003 on December 08, 2017, 06:38:15 AM
Wait... how did your Eldo turn into a sunbeam S7?
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on December 12, 2017, 04:35:58 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/websize/IMG_0004.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: balvenie on December 12, 2017, 06:49:37 PM
Well, I'm curious to say the least :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: oldbike54 on December 13, 2017, 01:45:46 AM
Wait... how did your Eldo turn into a sunbeam S7?

 It's an Ozzie trick ...


 
Well, I'm curious to say the least :grin:

 ...that Balvenie can explain  :grin:

 Dusty
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: balvenie on December 13, 2017, 03:28:13 AM
It's an Ozzie trick ...
 ...that Balvenie can explain  :grin:
 Dusty

hahahahaha What would we do without ya Dusty :laugh: :laugh:
[you rotter :evil: :wink:]
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: oldbike54 on December 13, 2017, 01:48:30 PM
hahahahaha What would we do without ya Dusty :laugh: :laugh:
[you rotter :evil: :wink:]

 Thanks Bill , I do try  :laugh:

 Dusty
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on December 13, 2017, 07:30:09 PM
It's an Ozzie trick ...


 
 ...that Balvenie can explain  :grin:

 Dusty

I'm no 'Aussie Dusty but my father was. ( R.A.A.F / WW2 / Pacific)
I gave him some slack for being a Vet but was told I had to stop telling people I was adopted when I found out.

#

This old bus has been apart so long I forget where some of the bits go so have been doing a bit of a mock up to get an idea of what is what.

The 949 kit should be here today and a 30 litre ultra sonic tank turned up yesterday.
That picture is misleading with the parts looking blasted which they are not, just the usual clean up, I will have to soda blast the cases though with some grey spots (light corrosion) still present.
The blaster is still in the lock up so will do the 2000+ km round trip next week to get the last items including the other S7 Deluxe, Norton and Triumph.

Items replaced will be.

Fork stanchions, bushes and springs, engine valves, guides, springs, rocker units complete, push rods, tappets/followers, NOS stock camshaft, connecting rods, pistons/cylinders, bearing flanges, timing chain and tensioner, oil pump, sump/pan, clutch, transmission output shaft and all bearings, universal, carrier bearing, drive shaft and coupling, final drive bearings and oem ring and pinion, full Greg Bender wiring loom, new carburetor internals, new exhaust system which I didn't really want but it had the small outlet torpedo's.

The wheel bearings have not a mark on them so will most likely reuse them.

The generator will remain (Have both new Bosch mechanical and electronic regulators but was advised the electronic version is optimum for the VW generator not the Eldorado output)

I still have to finish off some sundry bits for the conversion to oil filter pan but will look at an external oil filter relocation also along with a look to see if a oil surge plate, baffle and scraper is worth doing.

I will laugh about this one day, maybe tomorrow.
The frame, swing arm with final drive hung off the rafters for a long time, one day I am looking at the FD and think, what are the chances.....


(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/websize/273.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/websize/274.JPG)

The lobes on the original camshaft all measured good but the thread was damaged, it took a long time to find a replacement then a NOS one came up, I think I read somewhere some cams were soft so it might need checking for hardness.
The crankshaft still needs regrinding and will most likely get it nitrided or similar.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/websize/Camshaft.jpg)

 



Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on December 14, 2017, 06:50:21 PM
949 Gilidoni cylinders just arrived from Germany, thanks HMB Guzzi.

Got a 30 litre ultra sonic cleaner the other day, the jury is still out on the magic cavitating bubbles, but seems to work OK with a white vinegar, dish wash pellets and detergent cocktail along with hot (ish) water. 

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/websize/IMG_0001.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on December 14, 2017, 07:05:59 PM
Well that excitement was short lived, the drama seems endless with this bike sadly.

The shipping box as it sits had perhaps an inch of soft foam at the bottom, cylinder tops on the foam (loose in the big box) and tons of packing on top of that so no real protection and you guessed it, top fins broken on both cylinders.
$961 shipped.

 :violent1:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_0004.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_0005.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/websize/IMG_0013.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: fotoguzzi on December 14, 2017, 07:41:26 PM
What a bummer, have you contacted the shipper for a refund? I wonder if a good magician welder can fix them?
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on December 14, 2017, 10:46:13 PM
Sounds like PPP (pi$$ poor packaging) was the cause of the damage, so HMB should make it right. If they were packed better then they wouldn't have gotten broken, even if they were roughly handled.
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on December 20, 2017, 03:03:29 PM
Its all sorted Charlie, just one of those things I guess.
I must have received over 700 +  packages from oversea's (including the con rods from you) over the years and the first one to have damage so that is not a bad record.

I did the final 2000+ km round trip to get the last of things in storage (three trips and enough truck driving for a life time) leaving Monday afternoon getting back Tuesday.
Today will be getting the lathe etc ready for use and perhaps this thread will start heading in the right direction.

Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: canuck750 on December 20, 2017, 09:57:28 PM
Shame about the cylinders, I have bought a lot of stuff from HMB over the years and have not a problem, touching wood right now!

The bike is looking good.
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: balvenie on December 21, 2017, 03:19:52 AM
Looking forward to your progress Les :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Bucky on December 21, 2017, 12:36:50 PM
Been lurking this thread also.
Looking forward to the final product, Les.

Love those panniers...

Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on December 27, 2017, 04:03:45 AM
Photobucket does not work in some cases although all the links to photo's in my bucket still work but who knows for how long.
I uploaded the ones I had on ADVRider to my ImageEvent account, they were from modifying the engine case to suit the addition of a later oil pan way back in 2015.
The text is edited a bit from the posts there.

I had already bought M4 non oil filter bearings (The crankshaft was 1st under size on all journals)  but then read about modifying the earlier case to take a oil filter front bearing and the associated work to make it work.
So I bought a oil filter front bearing...

The oil gallery is there in the case but not drilled so that was the first order of business.
The later front bearing has one bolt moved so the gallery is able to be drilled, the Eldorado case has a M8 threaded hole in the way.
It was plugged and a new M8 threaded hole was drilled and tapped to suit the new bearing.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/4.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/5.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/6.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/7.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/8.jpg)

You can see the oil feed hole to suit the non filter bearing, in theory the fit of the bearing in the case is supposed to minimise pressure loss and it would have been covered by the later bearing but I elected to machine a plug 0.001 oversize and press it in with Loctite.
Afterward I drilled and tapped a M3 thread into it so it could be pinned with a stainless steel grub screw, overkill but if it was to drop oil pressure could be reduced or worse.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/9.jpg)

The plugged thread can be seen here, the new drilling will past through it to feed the new bearing, M8 alloy rod was turned in the lathe for a tight as possible fit, it goes flush to the inside of the case and Loctited in place.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/10.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/11.jpg)

Some of these bearings are a poor fit in the engine cases (China is a source for some I hear, HBM Guzzi will be doing billet bearings flanges in 2018)


 
 
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on December 27, 2017, 04:23:12 AM
Copied from ADVRider.

Trying to mount the case was a challenge of sorts and did not want to remove any of the studs and also couldn't quite get to the two new holes in one go.
One cylinder stud would have hit the column with maybe 5 mm to go so had to drill one then rotate the case and clock it up again.
I ended up bonding two pieces of hard wood together along with screws, they were bolted to the case and it worked very well.
I did bolt them to the case right side up and took a cut off them (the wood)
Only thing of note, i used a MT3 collect to hold the drill and gain some height.
When the drill came through, what looked to be 100000 mile oil started oozing out which was kind of odd.
From the centre/center hole to the new holes is 28 mm (14 mm spacing for the 5 holes) based on the later oil pan.
I elected to drill the larger hole 9.5 mm instead of 10 mm which is closer to the pan hole in diameter.
The hole you are drilling down to meet is around 26 mm and had given some thought to setting the case so the new passage was drilled on a slight angle 28 mm at the face and 26 mm at the target hole.
After I snapped out of that idea I drilled straight down and was careful where the two holes meet with the slight offset.
It all came out nice so the crankshaft can finally go out for grinding and will have the peace of mind of the oil filter. < (Edit, that is a bit of a joke now, L W Parry in Sydney who had been around a long time closed down, no crank grind there)

Pan holes checked out at 14 mm / 14 / 14 / 14 mm or 28 mm off the centre feed.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/12.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/13.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/14.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/15.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/16.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/17.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/18.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/19.jpg)

M3 thread into the gallery plug.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/20.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/21.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/23.jpg)

All it really needs now is a plate to block off the old oil pick up gallery to oil pump at the inside on the case, the old pick up can be cut and threaded for a pipe plug.
It has two of the M8 threads that take the oil pump retaining cap screws.
The plate should be finished tomorrow.
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on December 27, 2017, 04:51:45 AM
The early bikes oil system was fairly basic
A pick up with screen going to the plain oil pan base, oil pulled up by the oil pump then back into the front pad gallery, oil up to the front bearing and down to the steel crossover (with the pressure relief valve) pipe to the rear pad and on to the rear bearing.

The bearings should be safe this time.
With the new drilling's, from the screened oil pick up in the pan to the oil pump, then under pressure to the oil filter and split up to be sent to the front and rear bearings.
I picked up a OEM spacer (off lamontsanfurd) and it might be possible to machine a take off to fit over the flange for the oil filter in the later pan, lines or such could then pass through the spacer for a externally mounted oil filter.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_2677.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on December 27, 2017, 09:06:04 AM
Only problem with using a sump spacer (or deeper sump) is you lose a little ground clearance on a bike that already has pretty low clearance between the sump and ground.
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on December 28, 2017, 05:17:54 PM
I seem to remember you mentioning that before Charlie so will keep note of it once it is back on its wheels.

The blanking plate to replace the old oil pick up is done, nothing to flash but should do the job and saved cutting up the original oil pick up.
The alloy plate is in a chuck mounted to a rotary table.
The holes in the plate are tapped M6 and work piece drilled 6mm.
The extra taped holes around the central one hold the piece at the various pivot points.
Its around 3 mm thicker than the old pick up flange so might reduce it later (or not)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_3945.JPG)

The block off plate hole measurements.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_2606.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/24.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/25.JPG)

Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: JoeW on December 29, 2017, 09:07:10 PM
I seem to remember you mentioning that before Charlie so will keep note of it once it is back on its wheels.

The blanking plate to replace the old oil pick up is done, nothing to flash but should do the job and saved cutting up the original oil pick up.
The alloy plate is in a chuck mounted to a rotary table.
The holes in the plate are tapped M6 and work piece drilled 6mm.
The extra taped holes around the central one hold the piece at the various pivot points.
Its around 3 mm thicker than the old pick up flange so might reduce it later (or not)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_3945.JPG)

The block off plate hole measurements.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_2606.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/24.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/25.JPG)

Its on to the cylinder heads now, the guides were knurled internally so will drill them out for replacement.
A little tidbit on that oil pan conversion. I sold a filter pan to someone on this forum so he could do the conversion. He drilled the 4 center bolt holes out to accommodate the 8 mm bolts. When he started the bike oil spewed out one of the front bolts. I guess that passage was so close that he drilled into it. I've done this conversion and never had that problem. But, I decided that the next time I do one, I'll use time_serts and reduce the holes in the case to 6 mm. Just thought I'd let you know. Nice machine work BTW.

Sent from my QTASUN1 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on December 30, 2017, 04:22:45 AM
Thanks for that Joe, I was going to make four M8 to M6 reduced studs (unless I can find some off the shelf) that or use inserts in the engine case which would be better but a lot of setting up.
Looking at one of the pan pics there looks to be quite a bit of material around the four 6 mm holes but will take a closer look at the pans I have out of curiosity.

Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on December 31, 2017, 07:10:39 PM
First day of 2018.
Hubs are done, 0000 wire wool and WD40 to finish off and the same for the spokes.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/26.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/27.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/28.JPG)

Nipples got soaked in Duragloss 853 for a minute or so then 0000 wire wool wet with 853 to clean them off, dropped in baking soda and water as they were done.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/29.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on January 02, 2018, 10:57:11 PM
One of the wheel spoke nipples had fractured under the head but eBay came through with a few spares arriving today, USA to Chile to Australia.
50 spokes and 40 nipples so there there should one good in there for sure, thanks  'guzzipartsguy.
The packing was superior to that of the 'some assembly required 949 Gilidoni cylinders which will be sent back to Germany this week.
They are still sitting on the pool table and I shake my head every time I see them.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_4011.JPG)

Fork stanchion lower fasteners off the easy way but will make a tool for reassembly.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_4010.JPG)

No luck with wheel bearings, they just shrug and say not listed.  :laugh:
No doubt the ones on eBay "etc with no markings are from India.
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on January 03, 2018, 08:32:12 AM
No luck with wheel bearings, they just shrug and say not listed.  :laugh:
No doubt the ones on eBay "etc with no markings are from India.

MG Cycle has them, no mention of where they're made:
http://www.mgcycle.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=218&products_id=1433

Also try "Peters Bearings" in Germany. Last I checked with him he had NOS bearings.
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on January 03, 2018, 07:50:33 PM
Thanks for the PM Joe and thanks Charlie, I got a reply within a half hour or so of sending an email.
I replied but it will be late in Germany now, most likely will get a reply here tonight.

The rear bearings are showing some tracking on the cups race, probably still usable but if I can get replacements I will.
Both wheels looked to have undisturbed original seals and plenty of grease, I would be very curious to know how many miles this bike has really done (not that it matters) the rear universal was very sloppy (A new one came from Harper's) yet the body work / paint is as close to perfect as you could want for what must be original.

Any opinions on these VHB slides and wonder what the source is (Italy I hope ? )

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Dellorto-7454-VHB-Throttle-Slide-Size-60-Moto-Guzzi-750-850-Eldorado-Ambassador/182970782724

Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on January 03, 2018, 08:54:52 PM
Any opinions on these VHB slides and wonder what the source is (Italy I hope ? )

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Dellorto-7454-VHB-Throttle-Slide-Size-60-Moto-Guzzi-750-850-Eldorado-Ambassador/182970782724

Likely new-old-stock genuine Dellorto, since until recently there hasn't been any reproductions made. The repros are easy to spot since they have machining marks in a place the originals didn't.
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: canuck750 on January 04, 2018, 02:28:14 PM
I wish I had your machining skill, very impressive  :bow:  :bow:  :bow:

Cheers

Jim
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Rick4003 on January 07, 2018, 02:02:55 AM
Hi Les,

I have to second Jim on this work, very nice work indeed. I'm looking forward to your continued progress, keep coming with all the machining photos! love them! :grin:

On the damaged cylinders, I have also received a dodgy packaged from HMB. No things were broken but a few parts missing and the whole box was full of the contents of their shop trash bin. I ordered a lot of small parts so maybe the parts picker/packer had a bad day. I wrote to michael and complained about the quality of the packing as I had spend more than 1200 in that order. Didn't really enjoy picking all their trash out of my box. Maybe he should consider hiring a new packing guy.
He did send me the missing parts and a T-shirt as an apology, so I guess that's nice enough of him. All my other shipments fro HMB have been good, so just one unlucky one there.

-Ulrik   
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on January 08, 2018, 04:55:19 PM
Hi Ulrik   

Yes it must have been the same packer.  :laugh:

Yesterday was spent driving down to the city, a new 3 cylinder compressor will arrive today and the electrician will come Thursday to fit a 15 amp outlet direct to the power board so I can soda blast some of the castings. ( I did not want to blast anything if possible)
When I got back I spent a little time on the block off plate for better or worse.

If I had an agenda it would be never be afraid of trying something new and would hope by posting a few pictures someone out there might consider buying a small lathe or mill/drill and having a go themselves.
My trade is boilermaker / welder so far removed from any form of machining but get by. (Thank you for the comments all the same)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4021.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4038.JPG)

I got a set of the VHB slides off eBay (They are reproductions going by the description) and tracking says they arrived in Australia on the 7th so should be here by Friday.
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on January 10, 2018, 05:25:35 AM
12 pictures in total, I notice I can not see some pictures in other posts without reloading the page.
#
I forget which year I replaced the universal support bearing but remember it pressed out with no problems.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_2045.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_2047.JPG)

To press the new one in a mandrel was turned, the spigot in the centre fit the bearing bore, the face was relieved so only the outer race was being pressed.
The OD with clearance so it could press the bearing home without binding in the bore for the bearing and allow the circlip to seat securely.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_2063.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_2064.JPG)

Same bench but 1000 kms away from the location of the pictures above.
I picked up some bearings for the pivot a week or so back and the trusty chinesium slide hammer removed the cups that were still in place.
A mandrel with a 12 mm deep step and 0.05 mm (0.002") under 40 mm diameter made installing the cups easy.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_4046.JPG)

First the sleeve.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_4048.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_4050.JPG)

The bigger diameter of the mandrel had been faced in the lathe also so it was used to start and fit the bearing cup flush.
Flip it around to the shouldered side and seat it with a couple of taps.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_4051.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_4052.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_4054.JPG)

Same again on the other side.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_4056.JPG)

I like this stuff, very tacky and stays put.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_4059.JPG)

The electrician is here in the morning to install an outlet for the compressor but will pack the bearing inners and fit the seals tomorrow.
I need to finish wall mounting the clothes dryer first, exciting stuff.
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: balvenie on January 10, 2018, 05:58:34 PM
First things first eh Les :wink: but the pics are lovely thank you :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on January 11, 2018, 12:52:58 AM
All good balvenie.  :thumb:

The eBay VHB slides arrived today.
Original 60 slide on the right, that new slide sure does look like a 40 cutaway and suggests the same thing in a carburetor, side by side.
I will get back to them and might be missing (not seeing) something, code blue is soda blasting for tomorrow.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/large/IMG_4089.JPG)

Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: balvenie on January 11, 2018, 03:00:19 AM
Filth :wink:
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on January 12, 2018, 06:50:02 PM
Here you go then, the swing arm is as about as ready as it will ever be.

The bearing cup installer got a bleed hole so it could be used to seat the seals to avoid any air pressure in that cavity.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4130.JPG)

I put a little extra grease in there.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4131.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4132.JPG)

Seal in with no drama, it got a wipe of rubber grease as did the OD of the spacer piece.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4133.JPG)

Maybe there is some secret way to install these but the extra grease was to allow for air pressure, now when the pin is installed that pressure should push some of that extra grease though the bearing to replace any that might be expelled.
I don't expect to look inside here once in stalled in the frame for some time.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4134.JPG)


Joe (bsanut) got back to me about the eBay VHB slides and said I can send them back, to hard, will machine them into 60 cutaway.
I got a set of the bigger outlet 'torpedo's so wonder if the jetting (including cutaway) is the same (big and small outlet muffler)
Early days but could make any cutaway including slightly richer than a 60.
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on January 13, 2018, 11:33:38 PM
With all that progress yesterday I thought I better catch up with some other bits that had gathered dust.
As posted a ways back, I had found the final drive ring and pinion to be some what beyond service (Either little to no oil or lack of moly additive perhaps)

Anyway who knows how many years ago I had picked up another complete unit off eBay and the pinion was still in its carrier until after lunch today.
I started off tacking an old drive shaft coupling to the end of a Norton fork stanchion, that and a large 36 mm ring spanner did nothing even with some heat on the nut.
Loctite (and double dimpled nut) I bet.

Next was putting the pinion head between hard wood and nylon plate in the press and with heat again it got the impact gun treatment.
Nothing.

Out came the adjustable speed die grinder with (USA) burr.
Holy cow, this is how much it took and still came off with some effort even though cracked, and yes the Loctite was even under the taper roller bearing.
Any way it came up nice, it is a good OEM set, I heard some of the aftermarket sets are not as good as original parts.
The housing ball bearing carrier was warmed and old bearing pushed out easily.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4137.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4139.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4140.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4160.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4166.JPG)

Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on January 16, 2018, 03:08:48 AM
The pinion carrier got some new bearings, first thing I noticed but standard for any stepped shaft with a fillet was the heavy shims were only beveled on the ID on one side, a check showed installed the right way the shim was flush.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4209.JPG)

The new bearings were a little tight so the pinion shaft got a very light polish in the lathe and trial fit until they pushed on with moderate force without binding.
A quick look on MG Cycle past orders showed I had got some spare pinion shims last year so hunted them down. (Both of the final drives, original and eBay only had 0.15 mm shims)
With a bit of juggling of tube spacers and shims I got it down to a reliable 0.02 mm (less than 0.001") end float with the nut pulled up.
I don't know how hot these things get and if the pinion carrier housing will grow closing up that end float, I might try and get a little more tomorrow but under 0.05 mm.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4216.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: balvenie on January 16, 2018, 03:17:46 AM
Fascinating and very good pics :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on January 28, 2018, 10:57:55 PM
I got back this morning to find a package at the door.
Thanks for the heads up Charlie.

It was only the rears showing any real wear and were probably still serviceable but 4 'NOS wheel bearings from Germany.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/large/IMG_4256.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: JoeW on January 29, 2018, 07:56:37 AM
The pinion carrier got some new bearings and then a bit of fiddly stuff to while away a few hours.
Working to a half millimeter is normally close enough.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/BT3a.jpg)

First thing I noticed but standard for any stepped shaft with a fillet was the heavy shims were only beveled on the ID on one side, a check showed installed the right way the shim was flush.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4209.JPG)

The new bearings were a little tight so the pinion shaft got a very light polish in the lathe and trial fit until they pushed on with moderate force without binding.
A quick look on MG Cycle past orders showed I had got some spare pinion shims last year so hunted them down. (Both of the final drives, original and eBay only had 0.15 mm shims)
With a bit of juggling of tube spacers and shims I got it down to a reliable 0.02 mm (less than 0.001") end float with the nut pulled up.
I don't know how hot these things get and if the pinion carrier housing will grow closing up that end float, I might try and get a little more tomorrow but under 0.05 mm.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4216.JPG)
It's been my experience that pinion bearings should have no play. In automotive applications, they are set up with drag. Moto Guzzi does not give any information on this as far as I can see. I've consulted several people in the automotive differential rebuilding business and some older workshop manuals. I've found that the recommended drag on pinion bearings, whether adjusted by crush sleeve or shims, is 20 to 25 inch pounds with new bearings and 12 to 15 with used ones. Also, torquing the 36 mm nut is important. Again, I can't find a spec for torque, I'm tightening them to 120 ft lbs.

Sent from my VS988 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Garmst on January 31, 2018, 02:53:41 AM
Howdy,
by any chance did you change the main bearings? I am looking for used undersize that I can fit to my crank.
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on January 31, 2018, 06:21:07 PM
Thanks for that Joe, I will check it again.
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on January 31, 2018, 06:37:23 PM
Howdy,
by any chance did you change the main bearings? I am looking for used undersize that I can fit to my crank.

There are plenty of secondhand ones on eBay, maybe the grumpy guy has some.

The bearing flanges out of this bike were junk.
Not very good photo's but they are pocked, I do not know enough about this type of bearing material to know if it was high mileage, chromium off the bore or a combination of the two.
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/websize/IMG_4017.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/websize/IMG_4018.JPG)

Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: balvenie on January 31, 2018, 09:05:53 PM
Onya Les :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: SED on April 12, 2018, 12:07:10 AM
Great work and attention to detail.  Love the machine work. Thanks!
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on June 18, 2018, 04:37:27 AM
You won't believe it but five weeks later, nothing, six months and one day after that box of busted parts was posted, nothing.
The order I payed for a month ago that contained a new rear bearing and other needed parts (I figured I could at least get the crankshaft ground) you got it, not shipped.
I guess in another life I pi$$ed off the Moto Guzzi gods it seems.  :laugh:

The months long search for a replacement gearbox or gearbox internals went nowhere so I ended up grabbing the sight unseen 1000SP gearbox off the San Francisco Craigslist after a phone call to the seller.
It should arrive this week and given the risk am hoping for the best, I have some concerns that being 60 next year I might run out of time  :violent1:

The Craglist picture.
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/rr.jpg)

With a bit of luck it will be a good one and the internals can go in the original Eldorado case which gets all new bearings.
I will work on something else until then.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/One1_1.jpg)

Thailand last week and the latest scooter apparel, I'm trying to warm her up to the idea of a two up India trip in the new year.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/1_1.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: balvenie on June 18, 2018, 07:19:24 PM
That's a very nice Norton, Les but terrible about the "missing" parts :cry:
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on June 19, 2018, 10:04:20 PM
I have a couple of Commando's.

I just got off the phone to the USA, the International bank check I posted to pay for that transmission was payed out and then a month later the funds were deducted from the account and the check returned (to the seller).
It seems I have a trans somewhere in the post I haven't payed for it !

Other than that things are going well.
HMB will send me the one cylinder they have in stock , the other one availability is unknown at this stage........
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on June 19, 2018, 11:25:55 PM
You won't believe it, there is a drama.  :laugh: :grin:
A visit to my bank has revealed a hiccup (luckily I had taken a photo of the cheque / check) so am waiting for an update before Interpol / FBI or similar start looking for me.


It all started when I read this thread many years ago, if only I had known..  :laugh: :laugh:

http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/1972-moto-guzzi-on-trans-labrador-highway-dont-need-no-stinkin-gs.718205/

Balvenie, it is what it is, one step forward, a couple sideways ............




Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: balvenie on June 20, 2018, 04:10:32 AM
Heaven help you Les :cry: :cry: :cry:
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on June 20, 2018, 06:49:17 PM
One 1983 Moto Guzzi 1000SP gearbox / transmission just picked up from the post office.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/IMG_4562.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: balvenie on June 20, 2018, 07:36:21 PM
 :grin: :grin: :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Rick4003 on June 21, 2018, 12:35:47 AM
wow, that needs a bit of cleaning :)

Hope you don't get hunted down by FBI or some equivalent  :grin:

Sorry to hear about all the trouble with your parts. I found out the other day that my brand new PHF36's was delivered with two different types of slides   :rolleyes: So I have to figure something out about that too.

-Ulrik 
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on June 21, 2018, 05:30:04 AM
I picked up and posted another bank cheque/check this afternoon, this one had the right encoding etc and should be in the USA mid week.
Curiosity got the better of me, I cleaned all the gunk off the case in kerosene, dried it off and removed the rear cover then pulled the two gear cluster shafts/gears.
Obviously I couldn't see the inner surfaces where the needle rollers run but the gears and dogs (put my reading glasses on) look very nice, I don't think you would find better.
No galling, no pitting, no chips and all of the dogs are very nice.

It does have the later roller type thrust bearing (steel/bronze?/steel thrust in the Eldo trans) but nothing is jumping out to suggest it will not go as a complete unit into the 1973 trans case.
I have a complete set of HMB Guzzi bearings for the original case (I will use the double row ball units they supplied) new needle rollers and other sundries.
  :grin:



 

Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: balvenie on June 22, 2018, 04:35:36 AM
I wish you the very best of luck Les and a truck load of money :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on June 24, 2018, 08:29:58 PM
Its pretty much ready to reassemble, I will use the double row bearings that came in the HMB kit.
The shift drum had a 0.8mm front shim, 1 mm at the rear and doubt the box had ever been opened, the front shim was swapped for a 1 mm for now.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/large/IMG_4597.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/large/IMG_4587.JPG)

Thanks for reminding me, yes the rejuvenation of this old bus has been expensive to date and I haven't really done anything.
I am off to file my tax return, maybe the government will chip in this time.

Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Rick4003 on June 28, 2018, 06:32:45 AM
Hi Les,

That gearbox looks really nice now! Well done on the cleaning, how did you do it? Normal degreasing or vapour blasting?

-Ulrik 
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on June 29, 2018, 06:39:03 AM
Hello Ulrik
That is the original Eldorado case, I do not like vapour blasting so much (It has a silver sheen to it like paint, I did get a cylinder head done on my other Triumph TR5T)
I already had a complete HMB bearing kit to use, I will use the double row bearings that are included.

That trans case got the hand wire brush (Brass bristle) first which was OK, then soda blast, then Duragloss 853 which is a alloy cleaner.
The finish is OK but will blast it (soda) one more time. ( I use the hand brush on the trans gears also then kerosene wash)

My overdue HMB order (with one cylinder kit ?) is on the way according to a DHL email which includes some more final drive shims and a billet M4 rear bearing so the crankshaft can go for grinding undersize.

I had been doing the forks (new stanchions, seals, springs and bronze bushes ) but after hours of looking can not find the wire clips and shims if there were any that secure the top bush so will have to get back to that.

I want to be careful with this bike being original paint so no over polished bits, it is hard to get realistic photo's.
Most of the pieces are super fine steel wool with WD40 instead of polish (Autosol etc)
I want more of a looked after look but not overdone, also it is a bike to be used.

(http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c345/manurewa/Misc/IMG_3555.jpg)

(http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c345/manurewa/Misc/IMG_3554.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: balvenie on June 30, 2018, 05:54:43 AM
Thank you for the Autosol alternative, Les. That alloy looks good :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Rick4003 on June 30, 2018, 06:14:23 AM
Looks really good with the finish on the brake plate. I have to steal that trick too for my alfa engine. Then it will also look almost new on the outside as it is all new on the inside :)

Agree with the over polished stuff. I think it makes it look too much like a show bike and not like a well taken care of bike that is meant for riding. It is also a pain in the butt to keep it looking that shiny. I like to ride the bikes and fix things, not polish and clean it all the time :)

I found out last week that the set of carbs they send me from HMB didn't have matched slides in and being a really old order, they can't will do anything  about it. I should have checked it when I got it. Still it is 50 euros for a new matching slide I could have been without. On the other hand with HMB, my buddy with a G5 ordered their sump spacer with external rear filter and it looked really good and well made. And he has not had any issues with the bike throwing up oil on high speed trips. Before fitting the spacer the bike would spit up oil out of the crankcase breather if he ran the bike faster than 120km/h for longer periods. After fitting the spacer he hasn't had any issues.



-Ulrik
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Rick4003 on July 06, 2018, 05:00:44 AM
Looks very interesting with the reed valve setup, can you explain a little more about it?
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: balvenie on July 08, 2018, 03:48:29 AM
That all looks very pretty, Les :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado, Not all that Glitters is Gold.
Post by: Les P on July 11, 2018, 08:08:42 PM
I got the box from HMB six weeks after paying, you know I sat it there and looked at for a bit before opening it.
All I can say is worse service ever, yep another screw up on the order and will have to phone them and post parts back to Germany at my expense once again.
No Moto Guzzi crankshaft grind this week,  but the 7/8" spiral reamer was in the mail box so I can machine a tool to do the camshaft bushes for the Norton and 1957 TR6.

What can I say...(http://wildguzzi.com/forum/Smileys/default/Beating_A_Dead_Horse_by_livius.gif)




Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on July 11, 2018, 10:31:48 PM
Deep breaths Les :sad:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on July 12, 2018, 03:26:16 AM
People must read these posts and either think whiner or have to be making this crap up.

After waiting months here is the billet M4 rear bearing, wait a minute that is the crap cast version that is not even listed on the HMB website.
Tried to phone them but no reply, yet another email and pictures sent, the engine case will need boring but to risky only having one cylinder.

Its like being in a comedy.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4663.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/main-bearing-rear-2nd-undersize-m4.jpg)




Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on July 12, 2018, 03:58:06 AM
A reply from HBM already.
I inquired to who is packing my orders and to ask them if I had done something wrong !!!  :grin:

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on July 12, 2018, 08:21:03 AM

After waiting months here is the billet M4 rear bearing, wait a minute that is the crap cast version that is not even listed on the HMB website.


I've had zero issues with using the "crap cast" rear main bearings, I'm not sure what is really to be gained by using the fancy billet one.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on July 13, 2018, 07:09:45 AM
I had meant to add plenty are most likely out there with no problems, crap was perhaps a little harsh (They might be made in China these days)

I heard about the machined rear bearing/flange some time back (to match the front) and at that point I already had two of the cast rears from the same (US) retailer along with a non oil filter front. (The better M4 rear can be sold with the front later)

The HBM version is around US$24 more expensive than the cast version (MGC) and they say it will be a better fit in the engine case.
I notice they (HBM) do not list the cast rears on their website anymore.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on July 16, 2018, 03:16:59 AM
I almost forgot about that thread to the right, on an angle and imperial bolt it seems (certainly not M6 / 1)
Stainless inserts were a 200 km round trip, helicoils 8 kms so went that route.
The face of the mounting flange was a little sad so that got fly cut, a clean up tomorrow and the coils can be put in place.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4667.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4669.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4672.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4674.JPG)

Centre hole is 14 mm ID.
Threads are M6 / 1 mm pitch at 32 mm centres / centers.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4676.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4677_1.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on July 16, 2018, 04:03:39 AM
Lovely and clean, Les :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on July 19, 2018, 07:51:35 AM
Only way to travel.
Saturday is bore the engine case for the 88 mm cylinders.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4685.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on August 05, 2018, 06:11:05 AM
Side tracked as usual, waiting for a 24 volt planetary 60 rpm motor coming from Hong Kong.

I got back onto the final drive, I did receive the pinion shims from the vender who will remain nameless, ordered 0.1 mm shims and on checking them with a micrometer they are all 0.15 mm.
Decided to leave the shimming as is after checking it a few more times to be sure.
I made a new preload tool for the crown wheel.

The inner step in the cap is 12 mm deep.
Inner bore is a shade over 70 mm for a push fit. (iirc)
The gubbins that fit into the splined hub - 58 mm and 63 mm OD's, the step at the bottom is 4.5 mm high.
6 mm fasteners are drilled at a 48 mm PCD.
It could have been way more simple but didn't take long to make and works well.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_4781.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_4768.JPG)

I found the wire clips for the front forks so they can go together, new springs, bronze bushes and the 'better stanchions.
The design inside the forks is very British bike and is the same as my 1949 Sunbeam.
I wonder if anyone has adapted a 'Eddie Dow damper mod.

Google picture.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-tSWhG-wNUGg/VFLJOjhXITI/AAAAAAAAAYw/2Hrkl4I8N34/w509-h585-no/Damper%2BDimensions.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on August 05, 2018, 06:54:53 PM
Les, you sure are committed :thumb: :thumb: :bow:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on August 06, 2018, 12:30:47 PM

The design inside the forks is very British bike and is the same as my 1949 Sunbeam.
I wonder if anyone has adapted a 'Eddie Dow damper mod.

Google picture.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-tSWhG-wNUGg/VFLJOjhXITI/AAAAAAAAAYw/2Hrkl4I8N34/w509-h585-no/Damper%2BDimensions.jpg)

I think "EnglandKev" on ADV Rider has proposed using something similar in Loop forks, but I don't know if he's done it. I'm planning to make something similar for my V700 "Tutto Terreno".
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on August 07, 2018, 07:36:29 PM
I decided to get a new ring and pinion along with a selection of the thick front pinion shims, 8 new bolts and locking plates for the outer bearing carrier placing the order around 11:00 am yesterday.
I was very surprised to hear the front door chime around 8:00 AM this morning and the courier dropping it off so it must have been on the plane yesterday afternoon to get to the other side of Australia and then be delivered by this morning.
10 out of 10  for Mario at Thunderbike Motorcycles over there in Perth / Western Australia.
It was great to speak to someone who not only enjoys what they are doing (You would think you are the only customer when you are on the phone also)  but delivers prompt and professional service :thumb: :thumb:


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on August 12, 2018, 06:33:04 PM
The final drive was going well but the large 0.8 and 0.9 mm outer bearing carrier shims I have are to thin so I got on the phone to Stein-Dinse in Victoria to get a 1.1 and 1.2 mm.
The multiple shims on the pinion carrier to set the two tapered roller bearings seems odd so have elected to instead use a spare new 1.5 mm front pinion shim and have it surface ground to 1.38 mm after I grind the OD a little so it can not contact the roller cage.
I think the OEM inner spacer tube and one heavy shim will be better than multiple 0.15 mm shims.

The final drive will then be all new parts bar the alloy housings, it should last forever, maybe longer.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on August 12, 2018, 07:30:45 PM
 Onya Les :thumb: :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: tetarabra on August 13, 2018, 03:31:02 PM
FPS on ...?  :wink:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on August 13, 2018, 10:23:51 PM
The perils of having a motorcycle in boxes and plastic containers etc for years,not to mention moving it (carefully) 1000 kms.
I lost the wire clips that go into the top of the fork lowers but then found them with some Norton bits.
Its so long ago I don't even remember the spacer 'shims that sat on top of the upper bush to be retained by the wire clips, maybe I will find them in the years ahead.

That shim comes in three sizes but seem to be NLA and if they were I don't think I need another surprise opening a box from the land of leather shorts and suspenders.
I will have to machine some, a check with a reunited clip installed revealed they will need to be 2.2 mm in depth.

I had also noticed on fiddling with the fork seal holders one did not seat fully, investigation found excess bronze in one spot had been left from fitting the upper portion to the lower back in 1973.
Some careful filing fixed that, you can see the bronze just below the thread, the O-ring should seal nicely now.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4817.JPG)

No the replacement cylinder is still not here and neither is the billet rear bearing promised weeks ago., at least they are consistent.

 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on August 21, 2018, 12:17:34 AM
I made some inquiries after contacting Stateside Bearings in Cooper Plains.
Left side bearing is the original 3205 out of the Eldorado, middle is a 3205 C3 14 balls per race with serpentine cage and fill slots (AU$35 each or US$25.74) and on the right is the HMB supplied FAG 9 ball version.
Maybe that modern version is not the one people have been using, the price seems to low (to me)
 
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/IMG_4830.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on August 21, 2018, 09:05:40 AM
Price for that bearing sounds about right, 123 Bearing sells an SKF brand bearing for a similarly low cost.
https://www.123bearing.com/bearing-3205-SKF.php
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on August 27, 2018, 08:20:18 AM
Thanks Charlie.

Can it be true, after 8 months in total word from HMB that a B cylinder and the rear bearing will be dispatched.

A package from the USA arrived today with no fuss, dispatched (Iowa) promptly with excellent packing.
I guess it is easy for some venders.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4865.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_4867.JPG)

I started on a quill power feed for the toy mill, the pressure will be on to get it done so it can be put to use boring the Moto Guzzi's engine case to suit the un-machined 88 mm cylinders.
I'm almost excited, Christmas is looming and SWMBO asked if the  Harper's rear seat (sitting on the shelf) will be comfortable.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/websize/IMG_4853.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/websize/IMG_4859.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on August 28, 2018, 07:47:39 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/websize/IMG_4887.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/websize/IMG_4889.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/websize/IMG_4895.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on August 29, 2018, 07:27:01 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/websize/IMG_4938.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/websize/IMG_4939.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on August 29, 2018, 10:51:07 PM
Very pretty Les :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on August 30, 2018, 09:19:45 AM
Jep looks really nice! Post up some more info on your mill! :) which type is it and are you setup with cnc?

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on September 03, 2018, 05:14:10 AM
It a tilting head HM46 mill / drill (non CNC) standard they have 0.25mm backlash but that is easy to work around.
Quite a few of these have been converted to CNC and something on the cards for later. (CNC conversion)
The outer cover for this quill power feed took a day to make with the inner side having 5 pivot points and all done with a 8 mm ball nose cutter but the retaining cap screw and heavy washer that retains the rotary tables hand wheel is replaced with a machined spigot so a battery drill can be used to drive it as needed.

https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/M123

I adapted a power feed for the table cross travel which just needed an adapter to suit the table end to drive end of the feed unit.

Some old TL1000S projects.
http://s30.photobucket.com/user/manurewa/library/Clutch?sort=9&page=1

http://s30.photobucket.com/user/manurewa/library/Cover?sort=2&page=1

I found these video's on You Tube, more or less the same machine so am using them as the basis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vP6aOlH5dYQ


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on September 03, 2018, 11:38:13 AM
Ah, that is Stefan Gotteswinther, have seen a lot of his videos! He does some nice work. Both his mill and lathes are Chinese made, but I believe he has some videos where he shows his modifications to make them better. The stuff he makes on them certainly doesn't look like anything out of China!

I have been toying with the idea of a mill of this type to convert to CNC, they seem like a decent starting point as they are fairly strong compared to a router setup.

I do still need to get a house first to put my stuff in, but hopefully that will happen within a years time [emoji16] I'll just have to find one with a workshop big enough to house my TOS milling machine and the lathe [emoji4]

The TOS is manual mill kneestyle like a Bridgeport, but larger and heavier built. Can't wait to get it up and running! :)

And can't wait to see further updates from your project too!

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on September 09, 2018, 05:01:45 AM
Yes, that's the guy, the version he has looks to be the same but upgraded, a set of those alloy hand wheels arrived from the UK last week.
Very nice looking and quick UPS post.

http://www.wdsltd.co.uk/

These mill/drills are good for the cost but you really do need to go through them, most of the castings still have casting sand on the internal cavities etc so it needs to be removed.
They would be a viable CNC conversion and there are a few online blogs etc where they have been converted in detail.
Even in manual form you can turn out accurate work, the Chinese lathe is no exception but most of the jobs I do are alloy so they are not working that hard (deflection)

http://s30.photobucket.com/user/manurewa/library/1949%20Sunbeam%20S7%20Deluxe/Sunbeam%20S7%20Kubota%20Mod?sort=3&page=1

The quill power feed drive is pretty much done but once again have decided to put the Eldorado back on hold until this HMB Guzzi fiasco is concluded, it will be nine months on the 21st of this month, no replacement cylinder, no rear bearing as promised in August.
I simply can not understand how any company can not only have no integrity when they screw up (twice in a row) but be dishonest (have not only the parts back but keep your money also and care less)
Enough is enough for now ,if there is any progress on the Eldorado itself it will posted but at this stage apologise for wasting peoples time clicking on this non Moto Guzzi thread.  :laugh:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/websize/IMG_4969.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on September 09, 2018, 10:33:46 PM
No one holds it against you Les and fore warned about HMB is fore armed :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Frenchfrog on September 11, 2018, 06:00:42 AM
I'm surprised you have had such a poor experiance with HMB.I've had quite a lot of dealings with them over the years and never had any issues like that. Fast delivery and well packed...good prompt advice wheen I needed advice.One could at a pinch think that the boss is a bit terse but that's often the way German's come across ( Appologies to them but the Mrs is from there and I have worked with lots of German's ...it's just different culture accentuated by language )  and he's probebly hasseled by tom ,dick and harry of timewasting inc.In your case I'd say you have a more than legitimate claim though !
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on September 11, 2018, 07:41:02 AM
The only person having their time wasted is me but will still tolerate German's  :wink: my ex of seven (long) years was from Mainz.
The billet rear M4 bearing was payed for 14 weeks ago, the wrong not even listed on the HMB website 'cast bearing that Mr B stated were junk (on the phone) that was sent instead arrived 8 weeks ago tomorrow and it took 6 weeks for them to post it after payment for that total of 14 weeks.
After contacting them last week to see how it was going I received an odd email where every word was linked to a non relevant website and included a bogus USPS tracking number.
The original cylinder package was shipped on the 4/12/2017.
I am sure they are great people.

Edit. (13/9/18)
I had emailed HMB Guzzi on the 7th of September (The early AM in DE) to see what had happened to the outstanding replacement cylinder and rear main bearing (They said they would be sent asap the previous month)
I got a reply (after lunch in DE) saying they had been sent, it came as no surprise when I finally got the working tracking number out of them that the package had been put in the DHL system (label only) late that same day, in other words it had not been sent until I contacted them once again.  :grin:

Do I blame HMB Guzzi in any way for lack of progress on this bike, the answer is NO, it has simply been a frustrating experience which has still not come to a acceptable conclusion. At this stage I will end up out of pocket at least $229++, (return postage and ended up paying the cost to send one replacement cylinder to me) there has never been any form of apology,accountability or explanation of why the two cylinders were put loose on a piece of thin foam in the bottom of a tall box back in December 2017 with substandard packing piled on top or why I was sent a cast rear bearing when I had payed for a billet version. (They simply didn't seem to care)
In all honesty I think the cylinders were already damaged before being sent given both were broken in the same spot but those spots were nowhere near each other and the box had absolutely no damage to that area externally.
In other words they were packed in a way that DHL could be blamed and that is what I was told when I first got them to respond (HMB) by phone as they would not answer my email back in December 2017 .ie told put a claim in with DHL which I refused to do due to the totally idiotic and unprofessional packing.
All I can do is hope they have done the right thing ethically and the cylinder and bearing on its way is packed properly and not damaged.


I machined a holder for a low tech tool post grinder to refinish the quill worm screw shaft as that section was non critical so had a very fast tool speed from manufacture.
The new finish came out OK.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/websize/IMG_4987.JPG)

Edit 19/10/18
eBay PWM with forward / reverse / speed and readout'
Milled a plastic component box to fit things.
0 to 50 mm per minute feed rate.
Works great so Done.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/large/IMG_5031.JPG)


The box finally arrived from HMB and was packed as it should have been long ago which confirmed my suspicions.
'She asked me, Why is it just sitting there on the floor unopened close to a week after arriving.
I said feel free to open it which she did (with excitement I might add)
I never heard anything back from HMB Guzzi so will sell the M4 cast rear bearing to recoup some of my postage costs.
As far as that saga goes and considering the amount of money I spent in total with HMB Guzzi I will call that THE END but will never buy anything off them again,period.
I am grateful the matter is finally closed !

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Les P on February 06, 2019, 02:29:32 AM
Testing testing.... 2019, feng shui set back to balanced with  a freebie.... I look forward to a good Moto Guzzi year.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/R2.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/R1.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/R3.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 25, 2019, 04:16:24 PM
Like a dummy I locked myself out of my old profile which can't be reinstated.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/GB.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/gh.png)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/de.png)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/Image-64.png)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/Image-36.png)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/MG.jpg)



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 26, 2019, 12:48:07 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/thumbnail_Image-74.png)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/w.png)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/FB.png)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/Image-36_1.png)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/Image-50.png)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on July 26, 2019, 03:59:00 AM
It's Beautiful :grin: :grin: :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 28, 2019, 05:49:36 AM
Not sure where I got up to.
Wheels are done including vapour blasted hubs, they had a bunch of shims for the bearings but I got rid of those and machined those 4140 spacers, lapping the last few 0.0001" for no shimming.
The final drive was the same, I got rid of the stock bits and machined one heavy shim for the pinion and another 4140 inner spacer lapping the final fit.
The final drive probably took two days to do, start to finish and happy how it turned out, the $800 gear set is not top shelf but will do the job.
The crankshaft took nearly three months to be ground, rods have new bushes and ended up using a set out of a 1993 GT ?
The crank still needs to be finish balanced but I had to pick it up as it was to hard to drill so am doing it myself with ARTU drills and then will use T.I.G on the web to retain the two Mallory metal plugs (1/2" and 5/8") and then hydraulic Loctite 660 into the clearance at the plug and hole.
Heads are ready to be picked up tomorrow, at this stage they will be the only part that was not a drama.

Gearbox is back together with the G5 1000 internals, engine case is back from the blasters, when the crank is done the engine can be assembled.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 28, 2019, 05:55:44 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/2_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/1_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/3_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/4_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/5_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/7_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/6_1.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 28, 2019, 06:09:47 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/9_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/8_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/10_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/12_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/11_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/13_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/14_1.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 28, 2019, 06:12:52 AM
The floor board pivots and bushes were sloppy so used the boring head in reverse to do the pivots then bored the brake and shifter to take 21 x 12 x 5 ball bearings, no more slop, the linkages will need some work also.


(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/15_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/16_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/17_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/18_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/19_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/20_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/21_1.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 28, 2019, 06:38:42 AM
After the gearbox was assembled all selections were checked via bore scope as you do.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/WIN_20190316_14_07_15_Pro.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: canuck750 on July 28, 2019, 10:26:18 AM
 :bow: :bow: :bow:

Your level of detail is amazing
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on July 28, 2019, 04:28:04 PM
I am not worthy!   :bow:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on August 01, 2019, 12:04:02 PM
Very nice work I have to say! What are you drilling the crank for? Balance for bigger/different pistons? And as chuck says attention to detail is very high!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 03, 2019, 05:11:53 AM
Very nice work I have to say! What are you drilling the crank for? Balance for bigger/different pistons? And as chuck says attention to detail is very high!

Perhaps it is HMB coming back to haunt me  :laugh:

Those 949cc pistons are some 30/25 grams heavier than the stock items (I had thought when selling the 83 mm bore Gilardoni kits I had that maybe I should sell them after I know there is no drama with the 88 mm kits)

It would have been a jack hammer if left and most likely given the bearings a hard time so I took the newly ground crankshaft to a balance shop.
The choice was try and remove material from the pistons or from the big ends of the connecting rods, I favoured neither so it was add Mallory metal plugs to the crankshaft, a 1/2" to one web and 5/8" to the other (dynamic ?) due to the crankshaft construction.
The balance shop could not drill the crankshaft, they tried but I can do without the drama (with those new journals) so said I would do it myself and install the plugs (2 = 110 grams and $90) then take it back for a final check (which would be somewhat late in the piece once they are secured in the crankshaft.

The problem was, the crankshaft is hard and I mean hard all the way through, I ended getting a 1/2" ARTU drill and doing on but the other needed ordering so that is week two coming up.
I had tried to find a shop to EDM the holes but alldid not have the height as far as the liquid depth for the spark eroding.
Once the crankshaft is done the engine can be assembled.

I had asked the balance shop about someone who could do the cylinder heads and they recommended a Motorsport shop (that I had heard of and was in the same street) so dropped in to 'check them out, you know the kind of place that is spotless and the people look professional and happy to be there with nice machinery with a race team big rig outside.
I spoke to a more senior aged gentleman who was more than happy for me to bring some old Moto Guzzi heads in (guides installed and to size, cut the seats, surface the gasket faces)
I was going to do it myself but the shop made me reconsider, I basically dropped them in one morning and the following afternoon was rung to be told they were ready to pick up, it was the first non drama for the whole project and well worth the $550.
I took the Africa Twin to pick them up and they were dropped off at the vapour blasters on the way home and should be ready to pick up in the new week.

Given I live on an island and far from these places, around 1000 kms was travelled by bike or the trusty 2006 GTI in that week.
In hindsight I would have used KibbleWhite C620 guides and Black Diamond valves.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/Image-88.png)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 03, 2019, 05:13:37 AM
:bow: :bow: :bow:

Your level of detail is amazing

Certainly taken as a compliment given your many top shelf restorations.  :thumb:
It is not so much detail but given the length of time I only want to do it once. ( I still have 3 beveldrive Ducati's, 3 H2's, 2 68 Husqvarna's and 2 TL1000S's ++++  in NZ that will need to be recommissioned at the least after being in storage since 2007)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 03, 2019, 05:21:01 AM
I bought a new set of of rear shocks (Ikons's) and also picked up a set of 20 mm Showa cartridges which I would like to put into the Eldorado forks one day but that would be a fairly involved machining operation to the lower part of the fork legs (but have figured out a way to do it including counter boring inside the front axle hole if need be)
Getting the bike moving under its own power might be a higher priority (I did bring back two sets of PHF 32 mm Dellorto's on my last trip back to NZ and got a set of the later alloy manifolds from Germany that could have sleeved added)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 03, 2019, 07:22:43 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/Image-96.png)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/Image-97.png)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 06, 2019, 06:40:11 PM
Heads are back from the vapour blaster, I also dropped off the cylinder head Jim Comstock did for my 71 Fastback, Kibblewhite C630 guides and Black Diamond valves along with Alu/Bronze inserts on the exhaust ports and those pesky 20tpi 3/8" threads that can pull out of the head gasket face.
I will assemble all of them including a FullAuto head for the Mk2a 850.... New valves, springs and retainers for the Eldorado heads (care of MGCycle).
They will get the later '1000 rockers and supports I got years ago when I was doing the 850, no 950, no 850, and then 950 thing, They say you can go full circle sometimes, I think I was getting good at a figure 8 followed by a half circle forward.  :grin:
I got the later cam followers and adjusters to suit later big ball push rods also.

In my biased opinion he is the Norton guru, period.
http://www.nortonmachineshop.com/

Should be 3 pictures.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/thumbnail_Image-100.png)

Of course I am a little side tracked for a couple of days (still no ARTU 5/8" drill to finish the crankshaft) I had thought about a DRO for the budget mill for many years and finally did, getting a 4 axis Ditron and close to half installed.
Its one of those jobs that need a solid plan beforehand over my usual make it up as you go method.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/websize/Image-103.png)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/websize/thumbnail_Image-101.png)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on August 06, 2019, 06:51:59 PM
They look pretty Les :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on August 07, 2019, 02:05:12 AM
Looks very good! A vapour blasting cabinet is definitively on my wish list!

And also for many years a DRO for the lathe.

If I understand the previous post correctly, you will drill out the crank to add weights so it is possible to balance it with the heavier pistons?
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 07, 2019, 04:39:15 PM
A pretty bike was not what I was after but never could get the alloy to a 'been looked after for 40 + years' so ended up doing what I had considered but did not want to do.
It might become a new trend, an original paint and chrome bike with vapour blasted castings.

The bike must have sat for a long time (the crankshaft was rust covered) and one side showed more oxidisation (grey in the alloy that I could not remove with either acid or soda blasting) so maybe sat against a wall or something.



Rick, yes the weight is to offset the Gilardoni 949cc pistons, maybe I should have bought a crankshaft out of a 88 mm bore bike and used that instead.
As above, it was that or remove weight from the pistons or from the rod big ends and a lot of weight... I will phone today and see what is happening with that two weeks after ordering it.

The vapour blasting is nice but nothing like an original finish, the final drive I did myself and looks much more realistic, a pity I could not get the rest of the castings the same.
I started using the X axis of the DRO as soon as it was ready, should have got one the day after buying the mill is all I can say and one for the lathe is a must have now.



(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/Image-105.png)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/IMG_2863.JPG)



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on August 11, 2019, 07:39:26 AM
A pretty bike was not what I was after but never could get the alloy to a 'been looked after for 40 + years' so ended up doing what I had considered but did not want to do.
It might become a new trend, an original paint and chrome bike with vapour blasted castings.



That is the look I ended up with my Eldo.  Original paint throughout.  I had all the hardware re-plated as is was very rusty.  I decided the bike was just too new to leave all the rusty bits on it. 

(https://i.postimg.cc/qRgB0GC7/991_(2).jpg) (https://postimg.cc/gXFbH8s9)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 15, 2019, 06:04:38 PM
That is a great looking bike, Dave.

My concern was, it is easy to get onto that slippery slope, clean cases, old fasteners, whoops that frame paint looks a little worn..... and those dull hubs and rims and................ ..  :grin:

I rode down to Brisbane/QLD (On the Africa Twin DCT) to pick up some bits including long 8.8 M8 bolts which I will turn and then grind to make M8/M6 step studs to suit the M8 Eldorado engine case to M6 later oil pan.
I can see (I think it was Joe W) what was meant as far as drilling that later pans 4 holes out to 8 mm to suit the Eldorado and getting oil leaks, a bigger hole would be dangerously close to the oil passages in the pan.
Step studs will avoid that but nothing off the shelf was available.

Of course, later yesterday afternoon, I got a call from the same vender saying the 5/8" ARTU drill had arrived from Sydney so jumped back on the AT and picked it up.
I stopped in at a large welding supplies while there and asked the beardless 'hipster about some 309 filler wire to be informed all they could sell me was a $211 tube of wire so I passed on that.
I will T.I.G the crankshaft to hold the Mallory metal inserts and use Loctite 660 or some form of wick in locker afterward.
The crankshaft will then go back for a final spin check but cant see the point once the weights are inserted never to come out (I hope)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/thumbnail_Image-117.png)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on August 15, 2019, 07:53:14 PM
I can see (I think it was Joe W) what was meant as far as drilling that later pans 4 holes out to 8 mm to suit the Eldorado and getting oil leaks, a bigger hole would be dangerously close to the oil passages in the pan.

I've done it that way on every oil filter conversion (five so far), never had any issue with oil leaks. <shrug>
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 21, 2019, 01:32:40 AM
I will get back to it, maybe drill the pan to 8 mm when I get back from NZ next week.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 01, 2019, 11:48:43 PM
In the time it took me to drill two holes, Charlie M has probably rebuilt a complete bike and been on quite a few rides.

I got back from the old country and am back onto that crankshaft, I can say with confidence nothing will stop an ARTU drill.

I should have spun the 1/2" drill faster but found the 5/8" went very well at 575 rpm.
All I need to do is T.I.G around the perimeter of the holes with either 309 S/S or maybe ER70S, I might then try and hydraulic Loctite 660 into the clearance gap or maybe a wicking Loctite.
Once this is done and it has been checked spun up (A bit late by then ? ) I won't have to deal with any more people or companies.
It means I have everything to finish the bike from the cylinder heads to the GB wiring loom, yikes.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/thumbnail_file-13.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on September 03, 2019, 05:26:00 AM
 :thumb:

I had to look up the ARTU drill. It seems like it is a brand name. Which kind of drill did you use? Cobalt or multipurpose?
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 03, 2019, 07:07:05 AM
Yes the brand name is ARTU.

I believe is was this version.
ALLROUND BOHRER
Tough multi-purpose drill bits for concrete, brick, ceramic tiles, hardened steel, wood and even glass.

I still need to secure the plugs, even at 3000 rpm that will be 50 crankshaft revolutions per second, I have ordered some 309L filler wire and will weld to the crankshaft, how much I do not know yet as I would like to use some form of Loctite also maybe 638.
If they departed the crankshaft at speed it might be more then entertaining.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_file-15.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 03, 2019, 08:44:21 PM
Check the spring heights, why not.
28 mm + whatever the indicator reads after the valve is raised onto its seat.
The manual does not address the Eldorado that I can see but for the V7-750 I see a pressure check at 36mm.. I have around a consistent 36.3 mm not that I know what the MG Cycle spring poundage is at that height but they are longer than the manuals stated free height for OEM parts.
I think that will be close enough for head assembly.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/thumbnail_Image-3.jpg)

The courier dropped off 4 quarts of Redline Heavy Shockproof for the final drive as i was doing the check, under the pump now.  :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 05, 2019, 10:43:59 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/thumbnail_Image-9.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 16, 2019, 01:55:40 AM
We will hope they will not part company.
I think the two Mallory metal slugs were actually around 180 grams, filler wire 309L on pulse (Lincoln V200T)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_file-33.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_file-35.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 21, 2019, 04:54:22 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/thumbnail_Image-35.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/thumbnail_file.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on September 21, 2019, 06:36:28 PM
Look at all those lovely parts to play with :grin: :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 21, 2019, 07:22:58 PM
We are not out of the woods yet.
Why they made a bronze thrust where the contact OD is much larger than that of the camshaft sprockets rear face is beyond me.
I will modify the bronze for hopefully better oiling based on the sprocket face condition even though the contact band is only a few mm's.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_file%20_2_.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_file%20_4_.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_file%20_3_.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 22, 2019, 04:07:07 AM
That might help, oil bleeds from the tunnel in the case, fills the recess (3 mm diameter ball nose cutter, 1.5 mm deep) for oiling between the cam and thrust, some should exit via the 2 mm hole to another channel at the front to oil between the thrust and rea rof the camshaft sprocket... Oil should get into the upper channels which are not drilled.
Oil would get there anyway but based on the wear to rear face on the sprocket, more won't hurt.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/A.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/B.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/C.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/D.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/E.JPG)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 22, 2019, 06:08:18 PM
Game on.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-42.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 22, 2019, 07:54:50 PM
Most people would take that brand new part and 'stick it in.
Bearings don't get scratched from fairy dust, its all those non deburred machined edges and drilling's waiting for bits to break off, maybe they will, maybe they won't

All main bearing edges and holes deburred and ready to go now, old crap was the same, modern crap is little better.
The HMB billet rear is no different.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/IMG_3964.JPG)

Barely touched it and it broke free, next stop could have been the connecting rod shells.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/IMG_3965%20_1_.JPG)

100000 miles here I come.


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on September 23, 2019, 02:24:47 AM
Excellent pictures and work Les! Can't wait to see the bike back together! :)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 23, 2019, 09:42:28 PM
HMB billet rear bearing flange swarf, fully checked and deburred.
The oil filter does little at start up, any junk in the oil ways will have done the damage already.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-49.jpg)


(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/1_2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/2_2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/3_2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-48.jpg)




Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 23, 2019, 11:27:25 PM
The camshaft is a NOS later version with the drilled centre / center for the two oil holes for hopefully long life of the lobes.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/IMG_4045%20-%20Copy.JPG)

We still remember the Rainbow Warrior but forgive you, enough to like and use Facom torque wrenches (My others are USA made) but we go 'froggie euro today.
The clearance in the 6 mm holes is enough for the thrust ID to rub on the camshaft, not with some budget printer paper shims.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/IMG_4055%20-%20Copy.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on September 24, 2019, 08:36:27 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-48.jpg)

Not sealing the cam plug? They don't always leak, but I don't like risking it. Did you put some sort of sealer on the two bottom bolts securing the bearing flange? They're below oil level and can leak if not.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 24, 2019, 04:45:42 PM
I put 1207B on the lower portion of the case threads (10 mm or so) from the inside with a cotton tip and blue Loctite gel to the upper portion of the bolt, the clean end of the bolt should wind into the sealer, the upper portion should should bond with the 248.
I am still thinking about that cam plug, the flywheel will go on this morning so that window is closing and probably better to do it than not.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-50.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 25, 2019, 01:53:05 AM
........... and things grind to a halt once again.

Brand new connecting rod bolts, not one shank the same (Under and over 9mm OD ), not one thread diameter the same.
I have a few spare sets of rods so measured the bolts which still had shiny unmarked shanks, the new one above measured 0.04mm (nearly 0.002") larger in OD so no wonder it will never fit.
I can't think of any bolt you need to push in with a hydraulic press.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-53.jpg)

Edit.

I removed the black coating on the new bolts an am willing to bet these are sourced from India, the shanks do not look to be precision ground so explains why the diameters are all over the place.
The finish on the original bolt is much better than the picture shows but night and day between the two finishs but that does not help with any progress which amounts to near nothng today and if better bolts can be brought, that could be weeks away.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-54.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 25, 2019, 03:41:56 AM
I had look up where I got these pieces of crap which will go in the bin.

Stein-Dinse in Germany was the source purchased back in 2015
It is a concern when a quick search returned this reply on Guzzi Tech.

Quote
One more point regarding conrod bolts, there are bolts being sold now by "a big and renown after-market dealer" in Europe, that have caused catastrophic failure in a newly overhauled racing engine for a friend of mine. Bolts were fitted brand new by a competent mechanic. One start to wonder where they get their stuff from some times. There are many statements like "never from there again" being heard among the classic racing folks around here....

Could the above be related to SD no longer stocking bolts, nuts only.

https://www.stein-dinse.biz/product_info.php?products_id=109

Edit.
I see HMB grind them to size which would explain everything I found, not round, not finish ground... !@#$.

https://hmb-guzzi.de/Conrod-screw-T3-LM-etc

Quote
Our screws fit the conrods !  There are screws on the market where the factory forgot to finish these, leaving them unfinished and too thick to fit the conrod bores. But not only that, they are not perfectly round, affecting bearing play. We had them finished to perfectly fit your conrods. Of course this is a price issue, but Engine crank  damages do not occur by coincidence. Our manufacture engines are equipped with these screws, without any damages, since we began !
[/qu0te]
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 25, 2019, 05:25:20 AM
I can't do much until I get another set of bolts so measured these ones from SD.

Measurements for the OEM bolts are uniform and all OD measurements are metric.

The two OEM Moto Guzzi bolts measured  8.99mm - 8.99mm - 8.9mm, nice bolts and the shoulders are round.
They were very uniform.

The bolts supplied by SD.
Shoulder OD / shoulder OD / thread OD

9mm - 9mm - 8.77mm 

9.01mm - 8.99mm - 8.9mm *** only one that came close to fitting.

9.01mm - 9.02mm - 8.9mm

8.99mm - 9.01mm - 8.69mm

All measured by micrometer.
The shoulders on the above bolts are not round and only one bolt fit into a con rod at the first shoulder.
I think I dodged a bullet with this junk.

The centre bolt is out of the rods being used (1993 GT)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-57.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: shiskowd on September 25, 2019, 01:42:57 PM
I put 1207B on the lower portion of the case threads (10 mm or so) from the inside with a cotton tip and blue Loctite gel to the upper portion of the bolt, the clean end of the bolt should wind into the sealer, the upper portion should should bond with the 248.
I am still thinking about that cam plug, the flywheel will go on this morning so that window is closing and probably better to do it than not.

I like this sealing strategy for the two bottom bolts in the bearing hub.

Couple of questions:

a) you don't use the tab locks on the bearing bolts but what looks like wave washers.  Any particular reason?

b) what is this cam plug that can leak??

Great thread - very informative!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 25, 2019, 03:40:25 PM
I never liked those fold over tabs on any bike so used any excuse not to use them so use Blue Loctite 248 in the Gel sticks applicator works for me.

( I work on a lot of bikes so it is not just related to Moto Guzzi, my Italian bike knowledge is Ducati beveldrive based going back to 1983, first full engine rebuild in 1985 including shimming the crankshaft and not following the manual which said no axial clearance on the main bearings, I did not believe that so gave them 0.003" preload, not  a bad guess it seems (0.004")

The cam plug (A form of Welch plug I guess) is the one at the rear of the engine case above the rear main bearing flange. (I read about it possibly leaking, and most likely from Charlie M)

You need to be careful with washers especially on alloy.

Wave washers on alloy. (MG Cycle)

Schnorr washers on steel. (They will more than likely sink into the alloy so not recommended on that material)

I would imagine McMaster-Carr would have both.

If I am ever in doubt I soon find the answer from Charlie Mullendore (Charlie M /Antietam Classic Cycle) or http://www.thisoldtractor.com/moto_guzzi.html




Modify message
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on September 25, 2019, 03:51:09 PM
I might add, not just any old M8 wave washer - DIN 137 wave washers. McMaster-Carr doesn't seem to have them (the stainless ones claim to be DIN 137 but are thin and not very springy), so I usually buy them in bulk from Fastenal. They're a bit thicker and stiffer than others. This is what Guzzi started using after the locking plates on engines and rear drives, and I believe it was a positive change.

I always apply JB Weld to the cam plug. Best to rough up the surface first.

To seal the bottom two bolts, I liberally apply Hondabond 4, which also acts as a low-strength thread locker. I use the same stuff on the oil return pipe - liberally coating the crush washers during assembly.

Other related stuff: the breather pipe gasket surfaces and rear flange gasket surfaces get a light coating of Permatex Aviation or 300 (pretty much the same stuff). Same with the lower third of the timing cover gasket surfaces. 

Just they way I do it. I hate leaks, so do my customers. 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 25, 2019, 03:51:19 PM
Its a new day of course and my engine is sitting on the bench, assembly stalled and had expected to put it back into the frame today.
This photo is dated ‎Friday, ‎2 ‎August ‎2013, ‏‎12:21:16 PM and the engine would have been removed not long later after finding the grooves in the cylinder bores.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_0310.JPG)

I would not have expected a con rod bolt to hold things up, they are not something you sand or screw with to fit, they have a push fit to align the caps and hold things together.

 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on September 25, 2019, 04:28:53 PM
Its a new day of course and my engine is sitting on the bench, assembly stalled and had expected to put it back into the frame today.
This photo is dated ‎Friday, ‎2 ‎August ‎2013, ‏‎12:21:16 PM and the engine would have been removed not long later after finding the grooves in the cylinder bores.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/IMG_0310.JPG)

I would not have expected a con rod bolt to hold things up, they are not something you sand or screw with to fit, they have a push fit to align the caps and hold things together.

Unless they've stretched, I reuse the originals. I once had a used one tested to failure by a friend that works at Mack Trucks (Volvo Powertrain). He was very impressed with the amount of tension necessary to make it snap and opined that I should never have any issues with reusing them in a street ridden Guzzi engine.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 25, 2019, 05:02:47 PM
Thanks for the reply Charlie.
That is what I have been thinking, look the original bolts over and polish them and I guess use those new nuts on them.

I think also those new bolts have cut threads, the OEM look rolled........ I need the Eldorado to come out of the blocks like a champ once back on the road (not that I had it on a road before) so it needs all good parts.
I figured if I do 10000 miles a week on it for a couple of years I  might catch up to you and Mr Adams.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 25, 2019, 05:56:08 PM
Off again, those new bolts also have a very small radius on the shank to head so in the bin they will go.
Weight balanced each end, new bushes and big end refurbished to round.

The original bolts from these rods (1993) are a little thicker than the earlier version and have a bigger transition from the shoulders to shank, polished and back into service.
We will hope those new nuts are not made from chinesium.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-59.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on September 25, 2019, 08:27:56 PM
Love it  :thumb: :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 26, 2019, 06:33:34 AM
I got on the phone to Mario and ordered another set of connecting rod bearing shells which should be here next week along with  a braided oil line for the cylinder heads.

When I rang the balance shop initially I told them the (US$115) shells were still in the rods from the crank grinding, should I remove them ?........ No they will be fine, we are only weighing the rods ends and then proceeded to linish the rods for weight balance and all the crap ended up on the bearings.
I washed them in kerosene but was not happy with surface so another set (AU$140+ post) to replace them.

I will make a flywheel holding tool tomorrow and put the distributor together after shimming.

One step forward, one sideways and then a figure 8.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 26, 2019, 06:26:29 PM
Wow, from the other side of Australia to an island off Queensland by the next morning, add another $244 to the total and confirmation about the quality of the bearings they replace.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-60.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on September 26, 2019, 10:40:31 PM
Yep, whenever I did business with Mario, he was always that fast :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 27, 2019, 03:49:47 AM
Remember the eBay dude who sent me these new  slides that were the wrong cutaway and then said he did not make the size I had received and then a couple of weeks later was listing both sizes.

That ended up being not so bad after all going to the bigger bore engine since then, thanks Charlie for the input.......... Slides machined to 4 mm cutaway which I could not have done if I had received the ones I had ordered.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/thumbnail_Image-61_2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/thumbnail_Image-65_1.jpg)

Count the passes with a 3 mm ball nose cutter, the slides are as about as aerodynamic as a brick, maybe that finish will give a little turbulence at the step.
I still have the Dellorto 32 mm PHF's I brought back from the old country trip before last (and some of the later alloy manifolds) but that will be a project way down the track.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/websize/thumbnail_Image-64_1.jpg)




Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on September 28, 2019, 02:08:35 PM
 :thumb: :popcorn:

Looks very good all of it!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 28, 2019, 04:04:03 PM
I removed the studs to bore the case, they were held with some form of locking agent but heat and being careful they came out with no damage to the alloy.
They have all been prepped finish wise and ready to go back in.

Instead of blue Loctite I am at this stage going to use Loctite 660 which is normally for worn parts, it should mean no air gaps anywhere in the thread, it also means they could probably never be removed once done but the stud thread to case thread engagement will be 100 %.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-67.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 28, 2019, 08:27:14 PM
Unbelievable, I have been sent third under size bearings  (0.762 mm / 0.030") after ordering second under size (0.508 mm / 0.20")

I even said they were marked 020 on the back of the shell and the crank was ground to second under size so now another drama.

Its just a joke.   :violent1:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on September 29, 2019, 12:25:04 AM
Very sorry for you Les :sad: :cry:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 30, 2019, 03:56:44 AM
Even the Queen is out to slow me down being a public holiday so we will get back to the bearings tomorrow.

I finished off the rear end (yes the cam plug is not touched, I figured if it didn't leak by now it should be OK)
Having British bikes I have a Wellseal compound which is now on the sealing washers and the gasket for the piping of the breather.

I took a ride down to Brisbane (on the Africa twin DCT) to get some M8 / 30 8.8 bolts for the ring gear and a long full thread bolt for a clutch tool but they only had normal thread length so got two, cut and welded them together.

New clutch springs, pressure plate, clutch discs, intermediate plate and ring gear (I had tried to find a new Bosch starter pinion but anything available seemed to be NOS and quite expensive)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-77%20-%20Copy.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-70.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-73.jpg)

Yes, there a new Schnorr washers under the new 10.9 bolts.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-71.jpg)

I fired up the welder and then checked the amps, 115 was a little high.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-74.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-75.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 30, 2019, 04:11:44 AM
Not sure I added any text a page or so back.

Both the brake and shift pedals were sloppy, I had thought just put new bronze bushes in and ream them but they could wear out again.
A little more work but I decided to bore both pedal ID's and the mill boring head in reverse on the floor board lower rail bosses to suit the the ID and OD of ball bearings.
Two bearings plus inner (Loctited) and outer spacers.
The seem very smooth now and no play.
I will get some ball joints to get the rest up to speed but there is a possibility if the linkage was to efficient vibration might become a problem.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-74.png)

The inner and outer discs are brass, the raised centre on both gives a tiny gap for no bind on the pedal sides.
I will use a ball joint at that hole in the pedal instead of the rod just being bent at a right angle and a split/cotter pin.

I should touch the paint up on the lower frame tubes, put it on the list.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/FB.png)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 30, 2019, 06:09:04 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-79.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-84.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-85.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-86.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-87.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-89.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-91.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-90.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 30, 2019, 07:27:30 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-93.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on October 01, 2019, 02:12:32 AM
Hi Les,

Fantastic work as always.

I like the idea about replacing the brass bushings with bearings. I have quite a lot of play in my shift and brake lever despite them being almost new. I guess Agostini didn't take a lot of care in the tolerances. 

Nice clutch tool also, will have to make one of those.

And bugger about the bearings shells. You seem to have a bit of bad luck with suppliers!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 01, 2019, 04:36:38 AM
I also got a braided Fren Tubo oil line to the cylinder heads.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-95.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on October 01, 2019, 08:53:33 AM
I also got a braided Fren Tubo oil line to the cylinder heads.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-95.jpg)

Wrong one for a Loopframe. Should have been one like this:

http://www.mgcycle.com/images/atrex/12153601.jpg

I've always just reused the original rigid metal line.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 03, 2019, 03:47:44 AM
Looks like the replacement bearings are coming by mail and not courier so maybe tomorrow delivery, maybe next week.

The perils of doing this over a long period and doing an interstate move a couple of years ago is I would have removed the engine to gearbox studs in 2015 when I converted the engine case to an oil filter front bearing and I found one of the six studs.
Keep searching or might have to make some.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-106.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-107.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 05, 2019, 07:18:32 AM
I removed the previous post, I seem to remember my grandfather saying something like ...There are times when you have nothing good to say it can be better to say nothing at all............ or something like that.

 (https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-118.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 05, 2019, 07:34:40 AM
Forgot new keys so had to machine some to size 4 x 7.5 x 18 to 3 x 5.5 x 16....... Oddly they fit nicely even if time consuming.
I have been thinking for some time about trading my Africa Twin DCT in on a V7 but then I would have to talk to the Moto Guzzi world of sales which could only lead to more mental anguish.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-110.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-111.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-112.jpg)

I read plenty about the generator bracket bolt M8 threads failing, on my bike the holes were drilled deep but the thread went nowhere near the bottom so no wonder they can fail (they were fine on this bike and had tapped them to the bottom of the hole)........... then the other week decided to insert them with 2D or 2.5D recoils when I find some, I will modify the bracket so I can use the Tonti braided oil line I was sent.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-114.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 05, 2019, 07:41:25 AM
When I did the gearbox, it seemed the best way to check the slider engagements was to have a look at each one after assembly to see if they were even.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/WIN_20190316_14_07_15_Pro.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 05, 2019, 11:50:25 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-122.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-119.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-120.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-123.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-124.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 06, 2019, 06:42:36 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-129.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-131.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-132.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 06, 2019, 08:03:45 PM
I decided to just get the sump on and get the engine back in the bike...........

Yep.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-133.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 07, 2019, 01:30:34 AM
Here's to quality M8 die nuts.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-135.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 07, 2019, 02:34:05 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/cc.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on October 07, 2019, 04:04:05 AM
Looking good Les :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on October 08, 2019, 05:45:38 AM
Moto art!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 08, 2019, 06:43:08 PM
Thanks for hanging in there.  :grin:

There are bits I should (shoulda,coulda) have had done already including the studs to suit the Eldorado engine case (M8) and the later oil pan which uses 6mm capscrews (The holes in the pan are 7mm) ... 6mm nylocs will make for easy socket fitment also.
It will also need 6 spacers to be able to mount the Eldorado lower bash strips to it but an easy job

I needed to make a small centre/center to hold the end of turned M8 8.8 bolts which will end u being the 4 studs needed and yes it looks like the holes in the pan could be drilled to take a 8mm stud.
No point being logical this late in the piece.

 (https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-139.jpg)

I have a package that is supposed to be here which includes the correct oil pick up gauze/strainer, not sure where the other one came from but it is for a much later model.
Just got a call to say the M8 2.5D recoil inserts have arrived to suit the generator bracket bolts which will become studs so time to fire up the DCT and go down to the city once again.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 09, 2019, 03:52:19 AM
I made it back from where the robots live with the recoil inserts and the posted bits were at the front door so it was on to making the M8 / M6 step studs.

Having to order another pick up screen I added 2 OEM keys and dowels and the 4 short studs were available so got those too, only having to make the two long ones.
Where the original studs are (minus the 1 found and 1 dowel) will remain a mystery, I think things are back on track to button the engine up tomorrow.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-142.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-146.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-148.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-140.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 10, 2019, 06:09:31 AM
The plastic hat needed some probably unneeded attention but it got it anyway.

A custom M6 8.8 stud, a top hat spacer after the hat hole was enlarged, now the washer sits on top of the spacer.
As it was the top was bent in until it touched the pedestal so it got milled lower for the spacer.
It won't be going anywhere.

The oil filter pad as cast was a little rough looking so I milled all 4 surfaces in the pan.
I got two of the big hose clamps for the final drive bellows because the Internet said the filter can unscrew so you should fit one around the filter body to act as a locking device (up against the pressure relief I guess)

On closer inspection it is no wonder it can undo, the oil filter only engages the threaded spigot in the pan by a few millimetres... folk know that right ?

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-150.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-149.jpg)

The pad height lower to upper is now reduced to 3 mm and that is with 3 mm removed from the oil filter sealing rubber outer pad.
Even with that removed the filter is only three turns to seated.
I have had two of these later oil filter pans and both looked to not have been tampered with as far as the screw in spigot that the filter screws to, neither had any form of sealing ring under the hex.
I am going to fit a seal and use a sealant on the threads.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-151.jpg)


The fancy HMB Guzzi pressure relief valve had a flimsy narrow copper ring which distorted with near no torque on it so threw it in the bin, based on that I will make some other seal for it and test the release pressure.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 11, 2019, 03:52:21 AM
M8 2D inserts for 18 mm of thread with 8.8 studs.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-160.jpg)


Tapped M14 to suit the thread on the relief and fit the shoulder closely.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-155.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 11, 2019, 09:46:20 PM
Ready to go back into the frame it left in 2013.
The only bits retained of the original long block are.

The engine case/block.
One cylinder head.
The crankshaft.
The timing chain sprockets.
The rocker covers.
The two front covers.
The flywheel.
The distributor below the cap.
The cleaned exterior bolts.

Camshaft and crankshaft nut torqued to 108 fl/lbs.
I considered making a handle for the lower flange holding tool then remembered I had an adjustable handle to keep it real.

All new bits, this will be one old bike where all the shiny bits are on the inside.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-161.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-166.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-167.jpg)



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 12, 2019, 01:17:31 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/IMG_4383%20-%20Copy.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/IMG_4387%20-%20Copy.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on October 12, 2019, 03:46:53 AM
It looks beautiful Les :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 13, 2019, 05:38:01 AM
 :thumb:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-174.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-176.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: wirespokes on October 13, 2019, 10:32:30 PM
It looks beautiful Les :grin: :thumb:
I'll second that!

Great photo too - looks like  pro advertising shot.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 14, 2019, 01:45:55 AM
Most are snaps with my iPhone 6.

A new tool ready to test.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-182.jpg)

Curiosity go the better of me and have no intention of removing the swing arm in the future except for more lubrication on the splines (Redline CV2 grease) so thought it worthwhile.
It seemed like a simple enough thing, the machined part is a push fit into the universal carrier bearing, the splined coupler is a nice sliding fit.
Install the swing arm and move the coupler out until it will slide on the output shaft spline, measure the stick out of the pivots that thread into the frame and use those measurements as a reference when it is installed with the universal.
Guess what, the stick out for a sliding fit was close enough to even on both to be a surprise but you all knew that already.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-183.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 14, 2019, 05:29:01 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-184.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-186.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-190.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 15, 2019, 03:35:41 AM
The inside of the generator looked good, even the commutator < ? only needed a light clean up.
I did look up the Volkswagen version of this unit but will see if this one makes some electricity first, I bought a Bosch electronic regulator ages ago and have a full Greg Bender wiring loom...... two brown distributor caps from Italy and a new Bosch blue coil along with a Dyna ignition booster.

I drove the 40 minute return to get a new generator bearings (6202 & 6203 with shields) got back to find the invoice said 6202 but had been given a smaller 6200 (wrong shelf) so did the 40 minutes again to get the right one which was offered for free, thanks but declined.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-191.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on October 18, 2019, 05:30:17 AM
Looks great all of it. It has never looked so or been so carefully assembled ever before!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 18, 2019, 04:58:33 PM
I guess we will never know the true past of this bike but we will try and get it back to a condition it will be happy with, if the bike is happy it will most likely take me places (and back again).

I have tried to use a lot of the fasteners that came with it but am not sure what the actual originals are, some are obvious, others not so much so bought modern replacements. (Not to mention losing 5 of the 6 rear engine studs along the way, and half of the socket heads out of the rocker covers)
They are very shiny of course and then you get the mismatch thing starting.... does it matter, not really.

I soaked a new 8 mm zinc nut over night in white vinegar.

A nut that was on the bike to the left.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/Nuts.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_privatevarmobileContainersDataApplicationF4A1CFDE-C021-4133-B46B-9C3560AF2F5CtmpCBCE3993-70E3-43E4-95C7-68C77037398EImage.jpg)



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 18, 2019, 05:15:28 PM
I will post this here, I have British bikes also.
These were tests done by a highly respected (Worldwide) Norton guru from the USA.

The Commando engine is air cooled, has push rods and a flat tappet camshaft and clearances not unlike the Moto Guzzi of old.
These are scar tests so are fairly tough on the oil and you would need to follow the links to the thread posts to see the full picture.

https://www.accessnorton.com/Oil-Tests/NortonOil.php

I read on FB this morning that you can not use synthetic oil in an older Moto Guzzi because the seals will leak, of course when you go to the 'seal shop they will ask you if you want a mineral oil or synthetic oil seal.

Yes Charlie, your Rotella T4 is there.  :thumb:  (Stage 1) but not available here in Australia.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 22, 2019, 01:59:54 AM
I dropped the Bosch starter motor in at an auto electrical shop this morning to have a new set of brushes soldered in........... after some discussion I took back the rest of the starter motor (so it could be assembled and tested) and the generator for testing.

Before.
The starter motor commutator was in great condition like the generator and only needed a light clean up.
It seemed to work well the last time I used it in 2012 but a service could not hurt.

4 new brushes.
Two new bushes for the commutator to spin on.
The solenoid cap was removed and the the contact cleaned up and a general service and test.
I declined a paint job but can take it back for one if I want, a drama free day and got the the tour of the place to boot.

 (https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/2_3.jpg)

The generator was spun up and made 38/40 amps unregulated (Well I think that is what they said) less in service and also good to go........... I declined a paint job on that as well.
They can both be installed.

After.
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/23_1.jpg)
 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 24, 2019, 05:23:32 PM
I have bolting bits back on slowly..........

I got new wheel bearings from Germany some time back but in place the shimming was quite a bit out (loose) and more shims were not readily available and the ones I did find were a 500 mimimum order.
I then machined new spacer tubes from 4140 and lapped them the final 0.0001" with the axle torqued to spec each time. (no shims)
They are in place with Redline CV2 moly grease along with new seals.

 (https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/IMG_4256.JPG)

The bike came with white wall tyres/tires and elected to stay with that (Dunlop D177F)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/gg.jpg)

There were nuts dropped down one holder on the fork leg (to secure the front murderer/fender) so I made some new ones along with brass washers and the old bolts.
These blocks are 35 mm long, 10 mm wide by 6 mm thick.
M6 threaded holes, top of block to the bottom hole was 26 mm and back 18.5 mm to the first hole (centres/centers)

Some VHT Barrel paint and they fit nicely.
The front guard needed a bit of tweaking at the stays to fit nicely and on centre without rubbing on the fork shroud as it had been doing.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/h.jpg)

I think these M8 bolts were out of the crankshaft bearing flanges, a clean up and yes brass washers with new Nylocs.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/mj.jpg)

Note the paint, this is a mechanical only bike but got extra polish on the old paint.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/sd.jpg)

I knew the brakes were poor when we rolled the bike off the transporter back in 2012 but surfaced the shoes (with a mask) as they may very well be the originals being green coloured with copper.
Fitting them proved optimistic was unwarranted, the lever travel could be measured with a calendar down at the hub so they will need to be replaced but the fronts are the early type with a full pivot hole in the shoe and are not available as a off the shelf part.

I should have clicked much earlier to the brakes based on this picture from when the bike was listed for sale.
The arm is well back and when in the hub there is probably 2 mm or more clearance shoes to brake hub ID to get contact.
I found two places to have the old shoes re bonded, one 100 kms away, the other 800 kms, it will depend on what material they will use, the later says they use MZ Gold which works well, I would need to arc them to suit the drums.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/E16.JPG)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 24, 2019, 05:32:21 PM
I am going to remove the L/H floor board rail and cut the shift pivot tube with its bushes off.
There are some weird things going on including the transition up to the gearbox being on an old angle and to far rearward.
Converting the pedals to ball bearings set extra work in motion, they move nicely but the shaft is floppy so will rollerise that that too so it will be fit and forget but easy repair but not by me.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 25, 2019, 05:58:31 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/IMG_0346.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/mm.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 26, 2019, 06:27:27 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/as.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/df.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: shiskowd on October 26, 2019, 09:23:04 AM
Wow - is this the end??
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 26, 2019, 05:41:50 PM
There are still a lot of small things to do yet and those are the things that can catch you out on the road.

As posted up the page, I need to get the brake shoes relined and did ring ring one company within 100 kms about doing it who seemed quite put out that I wanted to arc the shoes myself.
There is no way I am going to let the wheels and brake backing plates out of my sight as the risk of them getting damaged is to high so will most likely post the shoes the 800 kms to another state for relining.

I did make a quick shoe 'expander which worked well, the spigot fits into the axle hole and is secured with a heavy washer and bolt so it can not depart the backing plate in use.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rr.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 27, 2019, 03:55:52 AM
Whoops.... All the previous photos from a week or so back show the pulley flange the right way then I put it on back to front and torqued the nut but explains the head scratching today.
At least the low tech crankshaft holder will make it an easy remedy.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-167.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 30, 2019, 01:34:55 AM
No roll pins so drove down to the city and back to get some (M3 x 16 mm and some 1/8" x 5/8" just in case)
 I stopped off at the local billiard shop (I sold my 8' by 4' to them the other year) and they gave me some felt but ended up stopping at a big fabric shop (Spotlight) on the way back and they had a thicker more woolly felt.
The original felt is AWOL somewhere.

Maybe it is the grey hair, but at the counter the lady says, if you have a VIP card its 30% off (I didn't) but a lady behind me had her card out in flash for the discount, I thanked her of course... Only $4 and enough to do at least 500 distributor oil felts for under the top bush.

It can go back together this afternoon.
I have enough spare parts to do 500000 miles.... I got one cap off MG Cycle, two brown ones off a eBay (Italy) for a Fiat 500 (iirc) but the rotors will not work it seems but will still have 4 caps and three rotors (MGC) to keep me going for a bit including the cap and rotor that came on the bike.
Yes I got a Dyna Ignition Booster some time back and a new coil and spark plugs.

Oddly enough I was going to get the fancy plugs @ $20+ each but some research showed they are only good for longevity and old school copper core might still be the go to plug for the best conduction.
When I mentioned this to the guy at the store he mentioned being at the drag strip and that is what they were putting in a 'Top Fueller to his surprise.
If they are good enough for top fuel they should be OK in the Eldorado.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ser.jpg)

The distributor was in good condition so only got a light clean up on the pad for the securing bolt.
I will machine a shim to reduce the shaft end float.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis.jpg)





Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: s1120 on October 30, 2019, 06:08:20 AM
Oddly enough I was going to get the fancy plugs @ $20+ each but some research showed they are only good for longevity and old school copper core might still be the go to plug for the best conduction.
When I mentioned this to the guy at the store he mentioned being at the drag strip and that is what they were putting in a 'Top Fueller to his surprise.
If they are good enough for top fuel they should be OK in the Eldorado.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ser.jpg)

The distributor was in good condition so only got a light clean up on the pad for the securing bolt.
I will machine a shim to reduce the shaft end float.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis.jpg)

I really always had the best luck with the normal coper plugs.. As you said... unless you have something that designed for something special that is going to last 100K...  just copper works, vary well, and is priced right.

Back in my drag racing days, and not having good aftermarket units [that I could afford then!] spent a lot of time shimming distributors. It was amazing how far some of them were out.. 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 30, 2019, 07:59:52 PM
To get 0.15 mm on the distributor took making a shim which is done.
Speaking of copper, there are quite a few small jobs that I had put on the back burner, one being the front fork drain screws after I finally found where they went.
Found the spot but had no sealing washers that small so made some.

That means the fork oil can go in (Redline 30wt synthetic) and the top fork caps can be torqued.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bts.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/co.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 01, 2019, 05:06:04 PM
It is sinking in there is probably not one item on this bike that has not been bodged or worn out (in 15000 miles)

I had forgotten the seat, why does it have UNC threads and the studs are spaced imperially and not even close to that on the frame.
When I got the bike it has washers on the inside of the front lugs which were then bent inward when some DPO cranked the bolt up.
They are an odd seat, the rear is down and the nose points up with the two mounts hitting the side cover brackets.

I raised the rear 19 mm and machined top hat spacers to suit the 11 mm hole in the frame (That the last person put a 8 mm bolts through)  after spending some time straightening the seat front lugs.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/1a.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/1b.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/1d.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/1g.jpg)

The fuel tank clunks side to side, that is next along with the taps being checked over and new indexing washers.......... I ordered new jets etc for the carburettors (locally) early in the week, its the weekend, the money was taken and the order is still on hold.
I should have ordered them off MG Cycle and will most likely place Order #14 with them next week which will push expenditure at that store close to US$6000 alone not including international post.

I did do a test seating, the floorboards are kind of comfortable as are those wacky handlebars (I did try a set of Norton Commando bars) and the WW tyres are growing on me......... I think the expense will be forgotten by second gear.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on November 01, 2019, 10:08:13 PM
I had forgotten the seat, why does it have UNC threads and the studs are spaced imperially and not even close to that on the frame.
When I got the bike it has washers on the inside of the front lugs which were then bent inward when some DPO cranked the bolt up.
They are an odd seat, the rear is down and the nose points up with the two mounts hitting the side cover brackets.

I'm guessing it's a Harper's solo seat, made in the US, hence the "UNC" threads. Later seats have shorter studs and it has been suggested to Harper's that they make them metric, don't know if they've changed them or not though. The front bracket is too wide, on most Loop frames anyway, but not on a few. Mine needed two thick washers on each side between the bracket and frame.

As for the "rear down" position, that's how the original seats (LAPD) that the Harper's solo is modeled after were. In my experience, that's also the way they are most comfortable - I mounted one higher in the rear and it was nowhere near as comfortable as the "rear down" one that's on my V700 (and '69 and '71 Ambassadors before that). 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 01, 2019, 11:41:04 PM
If the rear of the seat is down hard the studs bend outwards, the thread is already sad on the inside side from rubbing on the frame as I got it........ I will see how it goes.

I suppose I could start looking at batteries and what to get.... I got oil today and will fill and prime the engine.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on November 02, 2019, 08:48:08 AM
If the rear of the seat is down hard the studs bend outwards, the thread is already sad on the inside side from rubbing on the frame as I got it........ I will see how it goes.

I suppose I could start looking at batteries and what to get.... I got oil today and will fill and prime the engine.

Must be a production "variation". I've installed five of the Harper's seats for customers and myself and the stud spacing was fine.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 02, 2019, 05:33:50 PM
Who knows, but the studs scrape down the inner side of the frame slots to the point the thread was worn down.
Maybe the frame is bent.

I am going to take a break from it today.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on November 02, 2019, 06:56:57 PM
You're doing great, Les. Enjoy your break :thumb:  :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 02, 2019, 08:59:01 PM
Thanks.  :grin:

I thought I might get the sump buttoned up first, the M8 to M6 step studs held the gasket (I put it on dry but would normally have wiped on Loctite 515 both sides) in place and it went on nicely.
Another change is I have decided to to use high ZDDP Penrite multi grade mineral running in oil which is allowed for up to 500 kms (300 miles).

I will need to make some form of spacers to fit the three Eldorado 'bash strips to this later sump (or look up what they had and get some)
As posted back a ways, I also decided to leave the spacer out.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/s1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/s3.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 13, 2019, 01:21:39 AM
When I got the bike the ignition switch had been moved to the police dash which I didn't give to much thought to until I removed it, at least the installer had had a go .... but as a boilermaker the holes could have been a little neater even if they worked.

The trip meter reset which would have been where the ignition switch had been moved to but had been moved to that new location care of another 'custom made bigger hole.
By default I need to tidy things up due to buying a complete new police loom off Greg Bender and had not really thought about the ignition switch which is mounted back by the L/H rear shock on that model.

All I have to do is......
Move the ignition switch to the rear of the bike to suit the new loom. (which I like)
Move the trip reset back to where it belongs but the hole is way to big.
Fit the push pull switch to where the reset had been moved to but the hole is to big.
Then the loom will be plug and play again.
How hard could that be..............

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/Dash.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/Bore.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on November 13, 2019, 02:54:36 PM
Hi Les, Looking good! That is some very pretty holes the PO have left you with, are you going to weld a new piece in or just make an adapter ring to fit?

I'm getting closer to being able to move my milling machine into the workshop :) Can't wait :)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 13, 2019, 04:38:06 PM
Nice timing  :grin:

I just finished one with a brass insert (with another at the back, the trip reset holds them together)
The dash is only 2.6 mm thick so these had to be as thin as possible, the spigot at the rear is only 0.15 mm in depth to locate it in the new hole.

 (https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/d1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/d3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/d4.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/d2.jpg)

I hope you have or will get a DRO for your mill, it makes things very easy (or perhaps in time an old skill will be forgotten)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 13, 2019, 05:02:58 PM
When I lived in Darwin I did buy a small lathe (left at my Brothers workshop) when I fit the RMZ forks to my DR650.
No mill but there are still files.
You can make a reasonable radius using a suitable diameter steel washers and then checking looks from 10 feet away.

I needed to make two alloy brackets to mount the indicators to the new forks, two holes at the triple pinch bolts, one for the indicator stem, file to the washer.
Perhaps a ID hole could be done the same.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/IMG_1588.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/IMG_1590.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/IMG_1592.jpg)


I went through the Moto Guzzi's Lucas indicators last week but will need to find another flasher relay perhaps, the DB panniers have two orange lights each and the flasher I have says for 4 bulbs max (not 6)... We will see once I get the battery hooked up.


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 14, 2019, 05:14:24 AM
Nothing wrong with the ignition switch, clean and back together.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/sw1.jpg)

Jetting arrived today, 50 pilots, 130 mains. V9 needles.
For you US folk, that is $100 ($70) and 16 days local post , never complain about MG Cycle... What if i had been on a hurry.  :laugh:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hs.jpg)

I got some NOS late push rods off ScoutKB (the famous guy) not only did he charge me only $22 international post (that local order was $14) but he has or had a Sunbeam S7 Deluxe so must be alright.

Just pretend there is a push rod picture here.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on November 14, 2019, 08:31:06 AM


I got some NOS late push rods off ScoutKB (the famous guy) not only did he charge me only $22 international post (that local order was $14) but he has or had a Sunbeam S7 Deluxe so must be alright.

Just pretend there is a push rod picture here.

"Late pushrods". How "late"? There's a difference in the radius of the ball and socket ends, early vs. late. You need cam followers/lifters and adjuster screws to match that radius.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 14, 2019, 02:38:14 PM
I have the later lifters purchased years ago when the original version was not available along with the later adjusters.

But...
The later new adjusters have a smaller diameter than the ones that were in the G5 (iirc) rockers I got back who knows when. (I will assume those adjusters are OEM Moto Guzzi) so will have to compare them again as far as the radius and the adjusters that are still in the original 850 rockers.

I should have just got new later model push rods long ago. (The ones from KB (short upper cup) are NOS factory but only two) I have a set of those but one ball end has worn so the radius is tighter so rocks in the lifter cup so will use two of the good ones and one for a spare. (One in the bin)
Buying used parts was false economy and should have known better (The exception would be some people know a good part from bad)

The reflections make things look worse, three are OK but that end one had been running on its tip.
 
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/zz.jpg)



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 14, 2019, 05:18:26 PM
I have a set of later manifolds to put PHF32's on to .........but that is for a later date, the one way after where the engine runs.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/c.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Pescatore on November 16, 2019, 02:47:04 PM
:thumb:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-174.jpg)

I recognize the clutch parts, same in small blocks (V65).
Do you use that grease or does the transmission oil keep
the flat bearings lubed?
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 16, 2019, 03:16:05 PM
That area must see oil in service but wiped the o-ring with rubber grease so the unit slid in smoothly, I packed the thrust washer with Suzuki branded Moly paste. (As a rule except on the DCT AT select neutral at a stop so the bearing will only be under load at gear shifts)
The five O-rings for the push rod also got rubber grease.

The Eldorado is probably a week or less from starting but I got a call (recommended) from a race team who has a problem (What they want to do has no off the shelf part it seems) and could I help them, even bringing the bike a considerable round trip to look at......... I said why not (A billet fuel injection rail ) 
I have been getting a little to laid back with my bike so a job with some urgency might get me back on track.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 16, 2019, 04:27:56 PM
Did I mention, second battery @ $250 so will tie it in with rope to save funds.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/BT30U.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on November 16, 2019, 07:28:27 PM
Nuthin' wrong with rope Les :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 19, 2019, 04:55:38 PM
That was a bit of work and swarf but done......... I also got an email saying the Norton front brake rotor I dropped off in August for Blanchard grinding is done also... gosh.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/fi4.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/fi2.jpg)

A bit different to the piece of 40 mm by 25 mm flat bar it started as.... Now back to that old Moto by Guzzi.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/fi1.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 25, 2019, 05:13:25 AM
We are back on to the worlds most expensive Eldorado that is not being restored.

I was inspired enough to burn some midnight oil and finish the 4th axis of the DRO via a machined block for 8 mm linear bearings and bunch of other time consuming bit along with the usual pile of swarf.... My next major machining project will be a CNC conversion.

I picked the Norton's front brake rotor up from machining @ $128... It looks good for 46 years old.
The Moto Guzzi brakes shoes should be back before christmas.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/w2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/w1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/powerfeed/w3.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 09, 2019, 05:44:29 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image-89.jpg)

Remember this pic.
This was a good lesson to not get your torque wrench out some time after using it to get a now 'staged pic to go with the 100's of others.... and set it to the wrong torque.
Without a long story, even when you are 99% sure you torqued the ring gear bolts correctly a picture can be worth a thousand words and a ton of 'Did I ? (I had considered not bothering as I bolted more parts on)

There was only one way to know for sure and they were torqued to the correct 30 n/m (22 ft/lbs) and not the 42 n/m (30 ft/lbs) of the 'staged pic.......... after removing the gearbox to check and another set of new bolts installed.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/gb.jpg)

I will say it was a walk in the park, all those lubricated studs and bolts came out like a better than new bike, the homemade clutch tool which I actually put somewhere that I remembered worked great once again.
Engine raised a little to get up and over the front mount frame bushes to so it could go forward and the swing arm pivots out and arm rearward made it an easy job with all back how it was.

I find I can not get #130 5 mm main jets so next job is to modify the jet holders to suit later 6 mm jets.... If only MG Cycle was within riding distance.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 10, 2019, 01:11:08 AM
https://ducati-gowanloch.com/shop/rubber-parts/ducati-clutch-cable-boot/

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ast.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ff.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 10, 2019, 10:08:27 PM
Stock 5 mm thread #130 jets for VHB's are apparently not available in Australia.
I got the later 6 mm mains but elected to use a 5.1 mm tapping drill.... One main slide spring is MIA.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/wrt.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 15, 2019, 07:41:51 PM
Another year draws to a close, the lost VHB slide spring is still lost so I ordered two new ones this morning for new year delivery and got Mario to send me a in stock new spline insert for the rear wheel which I had debated on for some time.
A cush drive rear hub would be nice.

Today is finish the ignition switch relocation via a machined from Acetal body, no word yet on the brake shoes sent for relining.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hs_1.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 16, 2019, 08:54:42 PM
I've had zero issues with using the "crap cast" rear main bearings, I'm not sure what is really to be gained by using the fancy billet one.

I was doing a google search and somewhat ironic it opened on this post.

It was HMB (on the phone) who told me the cast rear bearings were crap/junk and something about being made in China .. for the record.

Edit..
But enough about those knob jockeys at HMB.

The phone rang and my relined brake shoes will be in the mail by the morning from Sydney (BCA Friction Materials)
It was a pleasure to talk to people more than keen to make sure you had the information needed to resize the shoes and bedding in procedure (At least a 20 minute call which means over half an hour)
I will send them the brake shoes out of my 1949 S7 Deluxe for relining which will get the MZ Gold lining having steel drums, the Moto Guzzi got some other compound (with a long number) and was told it was a good thing I included detailed information as this compound will perform better.
I am almost excited.  :laugh:

The new splined rear wheel hub will most likely be on its way also but not smart debating over it going back to when the wheels were bare hubs (I laced and trued them myself)
There is a possibility the 4140 bearing spacer tubes (no shims) I machined might not be correct in a replacement hub but you never know your luck.
The clock resets come January 1st 2020.

(https://cdn.images.express.co.uk/img/dynamic/36/590x/Groundhog-Day-762403.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 16, 2019, 11:46:31 PM
It occurred to me to check the front porch for a delivery.
Thanks Mario at Thunderbike Motorcycles over there in Perth.
Ordered yesterday, at the door in under 24 hours and so smooth and shiny.

The spline in the final drive seems to be in excellent condition, this new wheel hub confirms I should have got a new one months ago but you can't rush these things.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/Hub.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/Hub2.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 16, 2019, 11:51:56 PM
The eagle eyed of my two thread followers  :laugh: :laugh: might note I went back and removed the tin fold over locking tabs and replaced them with wave washers and 'blue Loctite torqued to the correct tension which eludes me at the moment.
Will they loosen and fall out, surely not.
All is good in the world of Eldorado today.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on December 17, 2019, 04:08:03 AM
Looks good all of it. Although I think we are more than two following  :thumb: It just gets old with the same old looking good comment  :bow: Appreciate you're taking the time to post.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 17, 2019, 05:27:20 AM
I have to admit, sometimes I wonder if this thread will ever end.  :laugh: :laugh: (Charlie would have it done by the weekend)

As a test I removed the wheel bearings and seals (to be replaced with more new ones) machined a quick mandrel (48 mm - 0.05 mm or so) put it into the bore of the old inner hub, heated the alloy for some time with a heat gun and then hit the mandrel with a reasonable sized hammer, the result was surprising.

Not one micron of movement... yikes, two more blows and the same... It will need more thought.

My sister asked if I will fly over (NZ) for Christmas but I will stay here with a trip to the city tomorrow to get enough bits for the duration.... It needs to be done by January, January 2020 that is.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/fgh.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Pescatore on December 17, 2019, 05:34:27 PM
Are the nuts/bolts that you replaced original parts, or do you order from places like McMaster-Carr?
I will be reinstalling a cleaned up V65 engine and I would like the visible bolts, hex screws, etc. to look new.
I have bought original stuff so far.  Some people on this forum recommend that.
I am not sure what to order for metal/strength... etc.  I did read not to use stainless.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on December 17, 2019, 07:54:51 PM
Looks good all of it. Although I think we are more than two following  :thumb: It just gets old with the same old looking good comment  :bow: Appreciate you're taking the time to post.

What he said, Les. I really enjoy it :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on December 18, 2019, 08:25:14 AM
I have to admit, sometimes I wonder if this thread will ever end.  :laugh: :laugh: (Charlie would have it done by the weekend)

As a test I removed the wheel bearings and seals (to be replaced with more new ones) machined a quick mandrel (48 mm - 0.05 mm or so) put it into the bore of the old inner hub, heated the alloy for some time with a heat gun and then hit the mandrel with a reasonable sized hammer, the result was surprising.

Not one micron of movement... yikes, two more blows and the same... It will need more thought.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/fgh.jpg)

Perhaps you could put the whole wheel hub in an oven to heat the whole thing up and then press the bearing hub out with a press or a big hammer if you don't have a press (yet) :grin: The aluminium should expand more than the steel and loosen up a bit. Even if they will be same temperature after heating.

I'm curious about your z-axis DRO setup. From what I can figure out the scale itself it fixed and you are moving the sensor head up and down with the quill movement? Is that correct? Is there a rod that is hidden behind the two linear rails the sensor head slides on?
Does your mill have z-axis movement only in the quill or is it with a movable knee? 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: canuck750 on December 18, 2019, 09:44:43 AM
Your engineering / machinist skills are excellent and inspiring, I wish I had the skills to use my lathe and mill for making more than spacers and drilling holes :bow: :bow: :bow:

I would bet your bike will be the finest mechanical example in existence :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 20, 2019, 04:43:59 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dfg.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/IMG_5015.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/FB1.JPG)

The original 14 mm shaft and bushes were quite worn and not sure how it ever lined up with the welded arm 8 mm past the one on the gearbox and also mismatched the other way.
The bearings are installed (21x12x5) and I had a spare shaft (15 mm from a stock shift) I put it up between centres, machined to 11.99 mm and the end ground for two flat and the end machined for a 6 mm lock nut.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/kl.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/we.jpg)

If they ever wear out replacement will be off the shelf parts with no extra work, it will need a machined arm for attachment to the shift arm on the gearbox.
The brake and shift pedals have the same bearings.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hj.jpg)



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 22, 2019, 04:16:55 AM
Are the nuts/bolts that you replaced original parts, or do you order from places like McMaster-Carr?
I will be reinstalling a cleaned up V65 engine and I would like the visible bolts, hex screws, etc. to look new.
I have bought original stuff so far.  Some people on this forum recommend that.
I am not sure what to order for metal/strength... etc.  I did read not to use stainless.

We can only dream of a source like McMaster-Carr here in Australia (New bolts etc is a 120 km return trip to the city)
I have tried to reuse as much as what was on the bike when I got, most were cleaned up with a wood handle brass bristle wire (hand) brush (works great on alloy also) that or 00000 steel wool with WD40 or kerosene...... some I did replace (zinc) with new but soaked them in white vinegar to grey them a bit but you had to be careful as one batch/brand had a high 'chinesium content and the vinegar removed the zinc in  matter of hours.

Stainless is not that bad (but lower strength grade mostly) but not for this bike as it is more a mechanical restoration all chrome was treated to tin foil (alu foil?) and water, any shiny alloy has been done to the minimal (no polishing mops) and to what might be how it was when new + 40 years (no mirror finishes or material removal)
It is probably cleaner or shinier on the inside.

Most zinc bolts will be grade 4.9 or 8.8... 8.8 is fine for most things but if used in a low stress application (where a 4.9 would be fine) and torqued to a 4.9 spec it can be of no real gain (not stretched) and depending on what it is going into and how much thread engagement, pulling threads might be pulled if torqued to spec in alloy.
In sating that I saw 8.8 on 90% of what I removed, the exception might be the 4.9 1/4 inch bolt someone used on one of the neutral switch bolts (Both helcoiled to M6/1 now)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/tnk2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/tnk1.jpg)

Perhaps you could put the whole wheel hub in an oven to heat the whole thing up and then press the bearing hub out with a press or a big hammer if you don't have a press (yet) :grin: The aluminium should expand more than the steel and loosen up a bit. Even if they will be same temperature after heating.

I'm curious about your z-axis DRO setup. From what I can figure out the scale itself it fixed and you are moving the sensor head up and down with the quill movement? Is that correct? Is there a rod that is hidden behind the two linear rails the sensor head slides on?
Does your mill have z-axis movement only in the quill or is it with a movable knee?

I think you might have seen this pic on ADV Rider, the extra 8 mm rod was hidden.
The complete head raises and lowers (and tilts) also so that has a 500 mm scale.

I will get back to the hub next week, I got six 150 mm long M8 8.8 bolts that could pass through the existing holes (sliding fit) with a thick alloy ring on the push side (some other ring at the out side perhaps greater OD than the hub itself that bolts would anchor to)
I could then use a large 3 leg puller to that bolted ring, the puller could then push on the mandrel into the bearing step of the steel insert ....... with heat on the wheel hub.
It is very tight it seems and would not want to risk breaking the wheel hub.
It might be easier to strip the wheel back to the hub, in the oven and use my china hydraulic press.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/a1.jpg)

Balvenie and Jim... I will keep bluffing my way through the machining (thanks for the vote of confidence all the same) and there has been quite a bit, I am not sure I could have done as much if at all without the mill/drill and lathe starting with the modifications for the oil filter and various tools to make things easier as you went.
Merry Christmas to all.  :thumb: :thumb:


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 22, 2019, 04:23:26 AM
I should mention how old school is this...

I had phoned BCA Friction Materials some time ago and spoken to Leon in the area that makes it happen.

They (Robyn) rung me last Tueday to say they were done and had then put me through to Leon as mentioned up the page, he gave me the low down on bedding in the shoes and also had an interesting chat on old bikes and brakes in general.
He mentioned mid conversation that the shoes had been posted early that morning Express post so I got them ASAP, (I thanked him of course) he then transferred me back to Robyn at the front desk to arrange payment (bank transfer)
That's right, they were in the post before I payed for the job.
They arrived Friday.

I did take a quick look today but arcing the shoes will take a bit of set up as far as anchoring the shoes (the springs will not be enough so some form of turn buckles perhaps)
Of course some caution will be needed come time to grind them (In the mill and rotary table) , I would not like to have to send them back for re re lining.  :grin:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/sfg.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Frenchfrog on December 22, 2019, 05:00:52 AM
Well Les you have certainly called my bluff with all this work !!!! Like some of the others I'm impressed and admirative of your skills and persistence in achieving perfection !!!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: radguzzi on December 22, 2019, 12:59:14 PM

 Like some of the others I'm impressed and admirative of your skills and persistence in achieving perfection !!!


Agreed. seems that Les is the consummate perfectionist.  Absolutely beautiful work.  Wow...!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 25, 2019, 05:26:09 PM
I will try harder next time Rob.... I think a perfectionist would have touched up the scraped paint on the lower frame rails or done something with the starter motor paint wise.

All I have done is addressed what was 'broken and that was nearly everything.
The shifter is done including a new arm at 42.5 mm centres and the (stock) linkage from it to the gearbox shortened and extra M7 / 1 thread added so all the levers are in a neutral resting fulcrum.

Today is remove the new rear tyre/tire, strip the wheel to the hub and look at replacing the inner hub which is crazy tight like it has Loctite ........then re lace and true it and move onto arcing the ($267.64) re lined brake shoes.. I picked up a Norton #40 grit sanding belt at the local hardware store and will machine a drum for it fixed with contact adhesive.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ar2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ar4.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/IMG_0072.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 25, 2019, 08:28:58 PM
Lets go.... on another figure 8.  :grin:

The bead broke easy, the tube came out easy (talcum powder)... The hub stripped easy with never seize on the spoke threads.... about 20 minutes.

It will get a shake and bake after lunch and I will hope the gods will be on my side come time to press that old inner.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ty.jpg)

Edit..

Done, baked and pressed out, there was no way this would have come out without a press and it creaked all the way.... There was some form of nickel based anti seize used at the factory ? (luckily) or maybe this new one will be the third insert.... or maybe someone removed the good one it might have had and pushed this worn out one in before selling the bike  somewhere in the past.

 (https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hb2.jpg)

For you more budget orientated MotoGuzziIsts I will let this old spline hub one go for US$8.  :grin:

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 25, 2019, 09:33:13 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/Stock.jpeg)


(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/1998%20TL1000S%20-%20Copy.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/tl%20-%20Copy.gif)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 26, 2019, 04:35:52 AM
Reassembly of the rear wheel hub went like a dream.

I measured the bore of the wheel and the new spline insert 54.06 mm (The old one was 54.07 or more +0004"+)

Hub got 15 minutes in the fan oven @ 100C then 10 minutes soak time with the oven off.

The new steel  insert got around an hour in the freezer and then was left to stand for 15 minutes on the counter top until wiping it left no residue (ice or moisture)
It has reduced to 54.03 mm. (Mitutoyo micrometer, a real one Made in Japan)
It got a very light rub with Suzuki branded Moly Paste to the portion that would seat in the wheel hub, the under side of the flange remained clean for maximum clamping friction (like a car wheel)

The heated hub got the same to the bore (Moly Paste) using a lint free rag to rub it on (its hot)

Based on the numbers, the press would not be needed.

The six M8 (150 long) bolts I got the other day were dropped into the holes in the inserts flange.
They were long enough to then go into the wheel hub holes with the insert not touching.
The six M8 factory bolts at the ready.

Now or never.
The wheel hub is face up on the bench.
Down goes the insert with a push and seats like a dream, the bolts making sure the holes line up without drama.

The stock bolts were placed one at a time and seated with a alloy drift (a flat facing inward)
Nuts applied to two of the bolts and seated.
I dropped the wheel bearing outer races in as the heat had soaked into the insert by now.

It then went to the press and got a light pressure to the top of the insert and left until it has cooled off.
I elected to use red Loctite, nuts  torqued to 38 N/M.

I was going to re lace and true the wheel but will do the brake shoe grinding first and will need to recheck the NOS wheel bearings are still to spec  with the 4140 spacers I machined for the original insert.

I never took any pictures as you need to work fast, as soon as the cold inner touches hot things start to happen.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 27, 2019, 12:09:28 AM
A new day and as usual being 60, I am grateful for not dying in my sleep especially as the beloved Eldorado is closer to going than not.
I have been debating for some time over a new GPS, my Zumo 550 is either 10 years old or maybe 11 being purchased back in 2008 or 2009 (I forget which) and cost the princely sum of $1200 (iirc)
It has never missed a beat even as I watched it bounce around on its mount over 1000's of kms of corrugated dirt roads (You did need to roll it into the cradle mount since 2010 or it would not charge but that was not the GPS) ... but it is getting old and updates @ $100 did not seem to work last time and some of the newer GPS's have some nice features at half the cost.
Will one of these be better that the trusty Zumo 550 we will see.......... A new model is on the way but not a Garmin, we will hope the TomTom Rider 550 is worth the hype.
Add make a adaptor mount for the Eldorado to the list when it gets here.

I did buy some alloy plate for a new battery tray last week but have decided it (Even though out of sight) might be to contemporary and will take a different tack.
Stay tuned for that one as it might involve some 'Cabots.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on December 27, 2019, 07:17:10 AM
Good to hear that the oven trick worked and that it went back together smooth. I might steal that bearings in the gear/brake arms idea. Plans to make new footrests and gear/brake setup this winter/spring.

I think I did see the picture on ADV rider where you could see the third pull rod, but it was a long time after posting the comment.

What is the story about the TL1000S?
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 27, 2019, 02:40:29 PM
What is the story about the TL1000S?

I have two (in storage) two 1998's once bought in 2000, the other above in 2004/5.
That one I bought, rode home 25 kms and pulled it to bits as per the top photo... The mods list was quite long but a good deal of the prep was no different to the Eldorado (reliability and the TL has a few faults to be addressed)

That is it 5 months later in the lower pictures (116RWHP)
Last bolt fixed, oil etc etc then rolled it out of the garage, put a long serial cable out the window to load a new FI map from the PC.
Engine started, a check over, rode it around the block, a check over again then full riding gear and took it on a 350 km ride to the Coromandel peninsula (hilly winding roads, poor cell phone coverage), it never missed a beat including the following 54000 kms before it was put into storage.

I would expect the Eldorado to be no different but the cylinder head re torquing will stop that... It also has running in oil so will dump it at 200 kms.
It will end up on Royal Purple 20/50 HPS.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on December 27, 2019, 05:27:11 PM
I wouldn't miss this topic for anything unless it's to be a fly on the wall of Les's shed :thumb: :thumb: :thumb: :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on January 01, 2020, 02:43:47 PM
There would not be much to see Mr B.

6:17am
Some 'shops are open today and the Africa Twin is pointing at the door ready for a trip to get a cheap vernier caliper so I can arc the new brake shoes. ($267 for 4 shoes in 3000 series compound)
I machined a drum to go into the collet holder and used some fancy contact glue to hold a band cut from a Norton #40 grit belt sander loop.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hjk.jpg)

With a bit of luck I can test it after lunch.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: canuck750 on January 01, 2020, 06:25:45 PM
There would not be much to see Mr B.

6:17am
Some 'shops are open today and the Africa Twin is pointing at the door ready for a trip to get a cheap vernier caliper so I can arc the new brake shoes. ($267 for 4 shoes in 3000 series compound)
I machined a drum to go into the collet holder and used some fancy contact glue to hold a band cut from a Norton #40 grit belt sander loop.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hjk.jpg)

With a bit of luck I can test it after lunch.

Now that is clever! :bow:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on January 03, 2020, 11:32:56 AM
Now that is clever! :bow:

Agreed! I will steal the method to do mine if I ever get around to finish my V7.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on January 04, 2020, 05:35:53 PM
You can't rush these things.

I had noticed some oxidising in the deeper part of that recess (water ?) but did not want to drill a drain hole (not that this bike will ever get wet)
After my flywheel bolt checking exercise I remembered to paint it with some epoxy black at reassembly.

I have to say, I read of folk having trouble with the seal to the air box (when I got the bike it was covered in mastic type sealer) from the rubber boot.
If the air box front is straight/flat and the boot fitted squarely the seal seems perfect, a few minute job.
Why is the opening for filter replacement not at the rear of the air box though ?

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/pt.jpg)

As far as the pedal pivots etc, there are needle roller units and inner sleeves that could be used also.

#

To many bikes, I fit the new Continental Classic Attacks to the Norton Commando 850 the other day (New 2.5 inch Excel rims and yes a major drama getting them) 

On the second wheel the tube seemed a little baggy and the second outer stem nut was missing (I had inflated the new tube before hand to put talcum powder onto it and hung it up until being used) odd, but carried on.

I fit the new tyre,go and pump it up/seat the bead and come back to the room, job well done...... I am doing the next thing to be done and notice a skinny section inflated tube with talcum powder with two stem nuts hanging on the handle bar of the Hypermotard.
Hmmmm ? ... I look at it and it has 100/90/19 on it. ??? so what is inside that 19 inch tyre ?
I then deflate the freshly installed tyre, break the beads, get one side of the tyre off the rim and was lucky enough to get the tube out.
I put the 19 inch tube in, tyre refitted  and then re inflate the removed tube and hang it up until needed.

That tube ?, yes it was a the 120 by 18 inch tube from the Eldorado...whoops.

I put tape under the rubber band, the Eldorado is the same and will redo when the rear tyre is reinstalled.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/rim.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: shiskowd on January 04, 2020, 06:40:36 PM
To many bikes, I fit the new Continental Classic Attacks to the Norton Commando 850 the other day (New 2.5 inch Excel rims and yes a major drama getting them) 

I'm patiently waiting for the Canadian stock of Continental Classic Attacks (radials) to replenish before I place an order (no one has the 110/90-18 rear tire).  Are they troublesome to spoon on?
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on January 07, 2020, 01:07:46 AM
They are an easy tyre/tire to fit as long as the sidewall is in the dished centre/center most will go on fine.... The Dunlops (D177) on the Eldorado were a little bit harder to fit but it is a lot of tyre for that narrow rim.
A pair of Classic Attack 100/90/19's here are over $500, the 110/85/19 rear I wanted was not available in Australia.

Haven't we done this before.
After machining new 4140 bearing spacers long ago for the original rear wheel splined insert, it did not work out for this replacement.
There was a tiny bit of pick up so did it again in a fraction of the time... Its not really a measure thing once you get down the final part 'thou or so but done and happy with it.

 I will re lace the wheel later today.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hub5.jpg)


I will say that the replacement insert @ $399 is OK, how long it will last is unknown spline wise but the bore on the spline side gives the NOS bearing outer race a push/sliding fit, not alarming but it will get a drop or two of Loctite retainer compound.
The brake side was a nice press fit.

Edit...
Everything is turning nicely so re lace time.
I remember thinking long ago, the final drive should be OK.

New bearings $200+
New R&P $800
New spline insert $399
Who knows what else for sundry seals etc... Not to mention those dandy new brake shoes (arced) @ $267, NOS wheel bearings @ $75 a pop, exhaust $1300, new shocks $600 or so, vapour blasting the rim and wheel hub $130 (I did the final drive housing myself), a new coupler, drive shaft and Universal (Harpers) etc etc.
Who would have thought.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/re1.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on January 07, 2020, 07:00:52 PM
Straight spoke hubs are fairly easy to lace so no real point in going there.... Be methodical, don't force the seating (run out) and use a spoke torque wrench.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/wh4.jpg)

In the real world its pay the utilities week.

Rates @ $392
Water @ $259
Power @ $266 (I have 6 or 8 (forget) solar panels also)

All for a three month period and not bad for a roof over my head with running water and lights which is far removed from days in PNG (Bougainville Island and the Panguna Copper Mine) in the early 1980's.
As I probably mentioned my dear old dad was in the R.A.A.F in WW2 (Pacific), tally ho, chocks way and all that, my step father was R.N.Z.A.F WW2 (Pacific) on Hudson bombers (iirc) based out of the Soloman's.... The Americans had taken over the Japanese air field by then and that gave them the range to reach Bougainville Island to drop off get well packages, the ones with fins and a pointy end.
When I got the opportunity to go/work there I jumped at it. (Off and on from 1982 to 1984) I also took any trip that was offered into the jungle so went from top to bottom (Buka to Buin)
If anything it made you appreciate running water and power.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/BB.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/B2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/A16a.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/B12.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/B13.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/B18.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/websize/LO1.jpg)

It was in the later part of 1981 maybe but read an article where Harley Davidson had sold manufacture rights to a Japanese company (Rikuo perhaps) to make motorcycles around 1932 or so.
I am at a workmates village one day (Paul the guy in the river crossing with Toyota picture) (His mother did not know what to feed me  :laugh:) ........ and he says do you want to see an old motorcycle, sure........... I did not expect much but there under some banana trees was a motorcycle and side car of what looked to be WW2 vintage... A Harley Davidson but looking closely it had Japanese writing embossed into the engine side covers.
A Rikuo ? that had been sitting there for decades and perhaps still there. (A day with no camera)
Those were great times for a young dude and enjoyed every second of it, everything from Zero's in the jungle, General Yamatos crashed plane and even stopping off at Munda on occasion where I think Pappy Boyington was based.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on January 07, 2020, 09:27:34 PM
Very interesting story Les, especially the pic of Paul, wading ahead of the 4WD(?). Presumably he survived the experience so the crocs could not have been hungry? :wink:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on January 15, 2020, 10:40:27 PM
That PNG area was safe Mr B... Crocodile stories are something else like all the people who gasped when I crossed the East Alligator River at Cahills Crossing coming back from Arnhem land on my DR650 with the water over the pegs. (I probably should have waited another half and hour being tidal)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ir2_dCnK1Q

This is the closest I have been to a Croc in the wild (no zoom)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/IMG_0711.jpg)


Things are progressing and even though the Eldorado wheels came up OK I dropped them off today for a professional wheel builder to go over them  and see if they can get them better for install and forget.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on January 16, 2020, 03:10:43 AM
Don't go back Les: I think it misses you :grin: :grin: :grin: :wink:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: wirespokes on January 22, 2020, 02:14:39 PM
Wouldja look at those pearly whites!

There's a rule of thumb goes like this: food has eyes on the sides of its head, predators, on the front. Crocks seem to violate that rule.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on January 22, 2020, 05:43:20 PM
I am probably the only person working in slow motion.

I picked the wheels up the other day (Along with some 5/16" UNF 2D recoils for the Commando's front disc hub) they must have been fairly good as the cost to true both was $100 (US$ under 70)
Peace of mind and all that.

I redid the brakes as they were rubbing and had removed the minimum, why because the axle holes are not perfectly central.
This time I rotated the backing plates on the mandrel over rotating them via the rotary table.
The final 0.020" was done with the stone wheel, the cams had a shim under each and the OD was done as close to the ID as possible.
If I can detach myself from the couch I will reassemble them this morning.......... The brake will be applied come time to torque the axles and the 2LS front will get some means (arms with weights maybe) so the shoes are in a contact with the drum come time to fit the connecting/adjuster rod.

We will hope all the time spent will return good brakes.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dtfg.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dft.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on January 25, 2020, 10:35:34 AM
Good tip that it is better to rotate around the mandrel than rotate the whole assembly on the table. I think I would have used the rotary table also as a first.

You're definitely not the only one who work in slowmotion. I don't work at all. At least not on the bikes. Not the 850 T5 and absolutely not on the V7  :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: SED on January 26, 2020, 12:30:25 AM
Love the Bougainville pictures and stories - cool!  But glad you got no closer than this!   :shocked:

This is the closest I have been to a Croc in the wild (no zoom)
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/IMG_0711.jpg)

ps. Love slow motion - work better that way.
Title: wr
Post by: LesP on January 28, 2020, 11:05:55 PM
I was doing some ground work yesterday and out popped a brown snake a few feet from where I had been working at ground level a few minutes earlier.......... Shows what happens when you forget about things like that........ It is the first alive snake I have seen so I had to do some ID on it before retreating a bit.

I have oil pressure gauges coming from Marlin in the USA along with braided lines from Speedway motors also in the USA @ $19.95 each with fittings.
A charge / oil pressure unit from the UK.

https://www.marlinsclocks.com/

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/

https://www.improvingclassicmotorcycles.com/

The week has been up and down, the Eldorado is off the work table which is a step closer to moving under its own power... but..

This morning I got a phone call to say my Aunt passed away at 86 so will fly to NZ, she was the best you could ever wish for....another wake up call.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on January 29, 2020, 03:14:20 AM
Sorry to hear about that Les. Take your time. Look after you.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on February 28, 2020, 05:35:38 PM
Thank Mr B... There were people out the door into the foyer and beyond.
#

I haven't been that motivated to be sure but some guy from Antietam Classic Cycle over there in the U.S.A sent me a free tail light so will have rise to the challenge. (Thanks Charlie  :thumb: :thumb:)

It had some paint and solvent burn on the clear lens, my original was broken in halfso what to do.
I did see a NOS lens on eBay but that would be the easy way out, why separate them now.

Lets go...

1500 grit.
2000 grit (both with wash detergent)
Brasso metal polish and plastic polish.
I left some of the black in the corner to keep it real.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/1272.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/333.jpg)

The 47 year old rubber lens trim out of the old (damaged) light was dry but still good and has been in this bag with silicone spray for a week + rejuvenating.
The tail light is nearly the last of the electrical.
The Greg Bender wiring loom was a good investment, easy to fit (for a elec dummy) and super high quality.

Two 100 psi pressure gauges and three braided lines arrived from Marlin/USA and Speedway motors but after to many dead end local phone calls I could not find a off the shelf M12 - 1.5 pitch banjo bolt with a 1/8" NTP thread in the head (Plenty in the USA based on google) so will have to make one so I can retain the oil pressure sensor and have a take off for the gauge.

One original push/pull dash switch was seized and had to admit defeat.
I got two new switches in the GB loom kit but being modern they had plastic rings and ugly knobs plus the thread was a different pitch to the original rings.

No problem, course M8 pitch (.1) goes in fine pitch (.75).
New switches with the original knobs and knurled alloy rings re tapped for the best of both worlds and no plastic bits in view.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/Switch.jpg)

The original Lucas L874 front indicators were in place but nothing on the rear ( Orange lights on the Dan Brown panniers)
Having British bikes and spares I made up a set for the rear as the chromed bracket that held the originals came with the bike.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/Lucas.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/W1.jpg)






Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on February 28, 2020, 06:13:27 PM
Fixed.
Decals be gone, scotch bright with some VHT Barrel paint and its straight out of 1973.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/c1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/c2.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on February 28, 2020, 07:08:04 PM
Good stuff!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on February 29, 2020, 06:48:00 PM
Not if I get a smudge on my new photo station (ironing board)  :laugh:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/cev6.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rt.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/w5.jpg)

Sunday 10:30 AM and house chores done.

https://www.epodex.com/en/produkt/transparent-red-epoxy-resin/

I found this product and might see if they ship international or maybe just put the old CEV 127 lens back on battle scars and all (I did get one of the cheap lens off eBay that are similar but not the same long ago)
Remembering this is not a restoration so even the paint applied to the light housing had to look old factoryish right, not like hand buffed lacquer.

Even a Clauss Studio's lens would be close to $92 with post which is cheap compared to a NOS item so the old one is looking better by the minute.

https://www.claussstudios.com/store/p441/Puch_CEV_127_Tail_Light_Lens.html

I could not get the clear lens out even rotating the clips that hold it so filed the rivet heads off, some small 3 mm screws that had a similar head shape and turned some alloy threaded M3 will replace them.
If someone wants to remove that lens in 40 years it should be easier now.
Time to crimp the GB new wires in place........ The silicone rubber seal came up great (and did not go gooey or dissolve which can happen)
 

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 01, 2020, 01:06:07 AM
One custom banjo bolt.
I used a die nut to cut the M12 - 1.5 thread and have to admit it made a nice job, a quick hex done in the mill rotary table and called good to go.
I still need to make a alloy sandwich plate to take the stock oil pressure sensor, this banjo bolt will secure it where the sensor used to be, the Marlin oil pressure gauge came with a 1/8 NPT to AN fitting that screws in to the banjo head.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/BB.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on March 01, 2020, 03:22:41 AM
It's beautiful, Les :grin: :bow:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Canuck750 on March 02, 2020, 10:34:25 AM
Attention to detail is second to none!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 02, 2020, 06:42:12 PM
Some of the detail I would rather avoid, sometimes I remember back to when I saw how bad the engine, gearbox and final drive was considered (the dollar was still good then) bringing in another bike to use the drive train out of (and I mean up to a 4 valve bike)
Its getting closer, I took the ATDCT out yesterday on some errands including getting another oil pressure switch that has a 1/8" NPT thread.
30C by lunch time, same today...

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/IMG_0003_1.JPG)

The adaptor should be done in the next hour or so, with that in I can fit the wires to the generator and its cover.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/sd_1.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 02, 2020, 07:24:09 PM
It will need a interconnecting oil passage and plug to be finished.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/fg.jpg)

Done but not torqued and a thought, maybe I should refit the cylinder head oil line first....

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/O5.jpg)



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 03, 2020, 09:58:41 PM
What happened to the Yahoo Loop list, is it still online ?
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on March 04, 2020, 08:38:27 AM
What happened to the Yahoo Loop list, is it still online ?

The Yahoo group was moved here: https://motoguzzi.groups.io/g/LoopFrames
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 04, 2020, 06:26:42 PM
That all worked out well, the gauge port will also be used to inject oil before the first start.
The sealing washers got a wipe with WellSeal both sides.

Yes those are brass washers on the generator cover and generator bracket clamp pins.
A PO had tightened the generator plastic cover bolts until the small washers had imprinted the cover, I guess in an effort to stop them loosening.
The new washers cover the damaged area's, under the washers are collars that the 6 mm bolts pass through, they bare on both the threaded bracket and the washer so when the bolts are tightened there is no compression for loosening, the cover is retained by default......... in theory.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/T1.jpg)

Final generator to bracket seating done and torqued to 30 n/m.
The holes have deep M8 thread inserts, custom M8 /1.25 studs and the Nylocs are the taller version.
The studs also got Loctite 660 to fill any voids between the threads.
Although firm they should still be removable with effort.
I am hoping for fit and forget.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/T3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/T4.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 04, 2020, 09:49:35 PM
A bit late once the bolts have been over tightened and the plastic has fractured but......
The neutral switch on the gearbox is little different, nothing stopping the plastic being over compressed.
Soldier on........

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/in1.jpg)

The new springs are in the VHB's with their custom machined slides (Euro 948 cc jetting) and the throttle action is very light but the threaded adjusters on the 1 into 2 junction's have no recess for the upper cable so it flops around.
Add it to the list, remove them and machine something so the cable end is supported/captivated.

I have to wonder again why the air box removable panel is at the front and not the rear so even a filter replacement would be a simple operation.
In saying that the air box is easy to install and the fit to the rubber boot is perfect if not better than that, I would modify the air box but it is original including its black paint.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on March 04, 2020, 09:57:05 PM
If you haven't already, cut a 1" wide slice out of the rear of the generator cover. Two halves are a lot easier to get on and off, plus they don't stress crack as bad as a 1 piece cover.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 05, 2020, 01:38:51 AM
You mean cut it in half  :undecided:
I couldn't, generator wires attached and the cover went back on easy with the throttle and choke 1 into 2 housing out of the way.

Unlike before, this time all the bolts went in with room to spare and no forcing it, there are some cracks but it is in good condition for its age.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/cv.jpg)

I raided some NGK caps (LB05F 8051) and leads from the Norton parts bin but the Eldorado having a distributor means shopping for some more bits to have a HT lead from it to the coil.
Eng Kev did influence me with the Dyna, it might be just extra weight and wires.  :laugh: but will need mounting.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/DB.jpg)

I forget what I posted on the distributor in the past.
Stripped, new felt, end float set with a machined shim, new points and condenser, that cap is NOS I think as is the rotor and will try that Dyna.
I did face the pad in the lathe and machined a brass cup with as large a seat as could be fit for the locking capscrew.

I brought my timing light (and leak down tester etc) back on the last trip to NZ so can set the timing.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ds.jpg)


 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 05, 2020, 01:57:36 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/restonot.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 05, 2020, 02:28:40 AM
If you haven't already, cut a 1" wide slice out of the rear of the generator cover. Two halves are a lot easier to get on and off, plus they don't stress crack as bad as a 1 piece cover.

I followed what you said as far as the fuel tank that was moving side to side and around on the mounts.

It already had new ish rubbers with the original top hat inserts and had got a new set of MG Cycle.
I put the new rubbers on the steel inserts reversed so the flanges were snug against the frame, a small section of the inserts stuck out (now on the outside) so I took the rubbers that were in the tank before and cut the flanges off them which then went over that stick out nicely and then large thin stainless steel washers.When bolted up the tank is firm but still moves on the rubbers.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/TK1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/TK2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/TK3.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 06, 2020, 10:38:21 PM
Update.. It was a nice enough day to go out on the bike so spent an hour or so at big automotive stores trying to find a right angle brass HT terminal and rubber boot for the ignition coil with no luck.
They simply do not have that sort of thing even if it is listed online.

The (older) parts guy nearly laughed when I asked if they had black HT lead off the roll.  :laugh:

Looks like they will have to be an eBay purchase or more online searching and a trip to the city.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Tom H on March 07, 2020, 12:47:22 AM
LesP,

I have not read all of this post, if you need copper core plug wire, I have a bunch. No coil 90 degree, but I think I have straight. For a cap, find a 7mm cap and wrap tape around the coil to seal it. Did that for my distributor.

If your in the USA, I might be able to send some.

Tom
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 07, 2020, 04:25:19 PM
LesP,

I have not read all of this post, if you need copper core plug wire, I have a bunch. No coil 90 degree, but I think I have straight. For a cap, find a 7mm cap and wrap tape around the coil to seal it. Did that for my distributor.

If your in the USA, I might be able to send some.

Tom

I had (Norton) Pazon ignition kits on the shelf so raided them for ignition parts so have NGK right angle spark plug caps (LB05F) and enough HT leads that have a crimp on one end that fit the distributor cap but ideally I need one right angle brass terminal and boot for the coil. (Being all spark plug wires one end has nothing on it)
I will see what I can find Monday with a trip to the city, be it a terminal and boot or better enough parts to make what I need from scratch.
Thanks for the post and offer of help.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 07, 2020, 04:56:40 PM
The taps were good but squeaky, cleaned with a tad of rubber grease on the selector face.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/t1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/t3.jpg)

Brass 0.5 mm sealing washers, with some nut juggling the one with a rust spot was moved to the underside out of sight...two for one.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/s3_1.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 07, 2020, 05:04:06 PM
Pictures to date.
Link.
https://imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods?n=0&z=2&c=4&x=0&m=24&w=0&p=0
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 07, 2020, 08:39:46 PM
The bike came with these fittings, two feeds and a balance.
I went to single feed fittings on the carburetors and this will be the cross over.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/x6.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/x1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/x9.jpg)

Fuel hose will be Made in Italy 'green Ducati.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 08, 2020, 10:09:44 PM
I went out this morning and got a set of carbon core HT leads that I will cut and fit the NGK caps to, that will will do for now but with a straight end (all they had) out of the coil the lead might foul the generator cover......... I could relocate the coil.
In the mean time its back to something to restrain the Motobatt MBTX30U ($250 in AU !) so pulled the battery tray back out of the bike.
When I had refit the tool box's before, instead of steel/paint on steel I machined some washers.

On the outer side of the rear fender, a brass washer, a nylon washer between the tool box and rail it sits on, on the inside of the box, a fibre washer, another brass washer and a Nyloc.
Deadly... firm but not over tight.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bt1.jpg)

The washers under the inlet manifold capsrews are brass, I tried to find a decent Bakelite rod to machine new heat insulators for under them  (As came stock) but had to use the modern replacements which are compressible fibre.
Moto Guzzi seemed to go to a bit of trouble to reduce direct heat soak from the cylinder heads into the manifolds.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/in.jpg)

It has so many brass washers it might lose a few mph.



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on March 08, 2020, 10:28:23 PM
It's a fascinating story Les. Who would have thought that Guzzi would use Bakelite washers :grin:
Don't worry about losing speed with brass washers; just wear Red Socks :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 09, 2020, 06:05:48 AM
Fascinating and true.  :grin:
I had to dig the device out for checking the carburetor sync, with some luck it will be put to use.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/sy.jpg)

I also got a email asking if I want to sell my 2211 mile 1974 TR5T....

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/IMG_0063.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 09, 2020, 06:32:00 AM
Spread the word, I will also have a 1954 Sunbeam S7 Deluxe available and a 2007 1100S Hypermotard.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/20171114_093021.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/IMG_0127.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 09, 2020, 03:57:18 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/tr.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 11, 2020, 12:09:03 AM
By crikey, over 1000 views since last week in a thread that is slower than drying paint.

I can report that working on British bikes (since 1979) and Italian bikes (since 1983) that they have little in common as far as engineering and concept thinking in general.

I changed the oil on the Triumph TR5T which included removing the (unobtainium 1974) air box to get at the drain in the rear of the top frame tube which stores the oil.
No such silliness on a Moto Guzzi.

On return from the oil shop my Norton watch had arrived from the UK.
I had placed my order just in time because Andover Norton / UK turned into the fun police and stopped the vender selling them due to the 'green blob likeness.
Although not a big watch wearer still will do nicely being the likeness of a Norton Commando Smiths speedometer.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/an.jpg)


I'm sure Charlie M and Mr Adams would love a Moto Guzzi loop inspired watch.  :laugh:

https://yourwatchdesign.co.uk/
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 13, 2020, 01:29:04 AM
That's that, gave the TR5T a full service and going over.... It fired up first kick, took a spin around the neighbourhood and took a couple of pic's.
Money is in the bank, new owner is happy and it gets transported south next week.
You would be hard pressed to find a better original one.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1974triumphtr5t/q2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1974triumphtr5t/q3.jpg)

Its back to the black bike, there was plenty of 3 mm felt left over from the the new distributor felt replacement so a suitable piece was cut for the tray base and sides.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1974triumphtr5t/tr5.jpg)

 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 15, 2020, 06:11:32 PM
I have interest in the Sunbeam (have 2) and my 1957 TR6 but that is not for sale.

Yesterday was riding with mates, given they were on big inch cruisers, a 1973 Eldorado would most likely be moe fitting than a Africa Twin DCT..... one day.
A great day all the same and an easy 500 kms.

The $2 fuel hose junction is good. (4 port T)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hs1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hs2.jpg)

Back to the other bits, maybe I could fire it up end of the week.


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 17, 2020, 01:41:41 AM
A Motobatt MBTX30U is $250 here so its needs to be restrained, the side covers should hide this billet stuff... I made a wooden strap similar to this alloy one first but it looked more like something I made in 'Woodwork class 1973.
Sometimes a bad idea is just that in reality.  :laugh:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/str.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on March 17, 2020, 04:24:37 AM
Never mind your woodwork Les, I did some for my bike and it Broke In My Hands :cry: :cry: :cry:
Signed,
balvenie; Woodwork class 1960
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 17, 2020, 04:33:33 PM
 :thumb:

First thing this morning was the truck arriving to pick up the now with 2213 miles on the clock 1974 Triumph TR5T Trophy Trail.
It might be the best original 1974 model in Australia and still a first kick starter.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1974triumphtr5t/tr1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1974triumphtr5t/tr2.jpg)

Good bye ' little buddy.  :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 17, 2020, 05:21:57 PM
Something needed to attach the cross bar to the battery tray, couldn't see anything to buy....

Let's go.

Air hostess Jackie got me a whiteboard which is still handy.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/st1.jpg)

12 mm round at 187 mm long, forget the alloy grade but tough.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/st2.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 17, 2020, 09:08:50 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image%20_1_.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on March 17, 2020, 10:35:35 PM
Very pretty Les :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 18, 2020, 01:29:02 AM
I think there was a piece of angle iron holding the battery down when I got the bike but to long ago to remember.

With the shoulders on the studs, when the nuts are tightened the top clamp rests on them securing the battery (felt under the top bar and in the tray) but can not over compress it.
Fit and forget I hope.
The plate (original black paint) and battery tray can go back into the bike (again)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image%20_25_.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 18, 2020, 02:15:07 AM
Radius form tool and end prep for live centre/center.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/cd.jpg)

M6 to attach to tray.
A modified M6 bolt (upward) holds the tray to the frame plate, a brass insert in the tray with a M6 thread holds the tray down, the M6 thread above the insert (25 mm of) threads into the hold down studs.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thrd.jpg)

M8 - 1.25 die nut.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/th3.jpg)

Live centre/center radiused form tool.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/lc.jpg)

10 mm hex... 0 - 60 - 120 - 180 - 240 - 300

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hx.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 18, 2020, 02:29:03 AM
The chrome will get you home, if you fix the other bits too.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bts_1.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 18, 2020, 07:10:18 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/tryu.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on March 18, 2020, 08:55:44 PM
Nice!  :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on March 18, 2020, 09:00:51 PM
Lovely :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 18, 2020, 10:37:02 PM
 :thumb:

I need to make something to mount the oil gauge..........


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXm2lXIqYHo
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 18, 2020, 10:44:08 PM
 :popcorn:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_Y3mnj-8lA
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on March 19, 2020, 04:18:22 AM
:popcorn:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_Y3mnj-8lA

Thank you Les, that was excellent :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 20, 2020, 03:36:21 AM
 :thumb:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/knm.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/scp.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on March 20, 2020, 03:58:25 AM
Well, that's Class if you like :bow:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 20, 2020, 05:09:46 AM
My first go at making knobs.  :grin: ....... and that rubber gasket has been there since 1973 most likely so it can go another round.

I rebuilt the VHB 29's with all new parts including the new slides I machined to the '1000 Euro spec cutaway, I am going to remove the new white floats though and put the original brown floats back in.
I got new slide spings off Mario and have to say the action is very smooth and no harder to turn than the FI bikes I have (They do have 1/4 turn throttles unlike the Eldorado which looks to be around 2 turns)

The cable hung down out of the 1 into 2 junction because the recess it goes into is only a few mm deep ? ........... not now, this cap will press onto the adjuster end and support the cable.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxoGvBQtjpM

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/adj.jpg)




Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on March 20, 2020, 08:25:53 AM
Les, That is probably the nicest looking battery clamp and tray in existence :grin:  :drool: Very nice work, love the radius on the stay bolts.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 20, 2020, 05:36:56 PM
I think that radius tool cost NZ$20 nearly 20 years ago and threw it in with other bits (22 kgs worth) on one of the trips last year.
It came in handy again on the cable support cap which works well.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/t1_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/t3_1.jpg)

That radius cutters first use was on a TL1000 clear clutch cover on the outer surface way back in 2004.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/CL9.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/C35a2.jpg)

I forget where I saw it the other day but someone made windowed Moto Guzzi rocker covers so you can see where the clatter is coming from.  :laugh:




Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 20, 2020, 07:32:08 PM
Saggy cables can make for PITA carburettor synchronisation.

A bit of boring on the lathe and a spin on the rotary table and another support cable for the cables from the 1 into 2 junction to carburettors.
This cap will press over the original cap.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/c3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/c2_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/c1_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/c5.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/c4.jpg)



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: pmillar on March 20, 2020, 09:09:56 PM
I think that radius tool cost NZ$20 nearly 20 years ago and threw it in with other bits (22 kgs worth) on one of the trips last year.
It came in handy again on the cable support cap which works well.

That radius cutters first use was on a TL1000 clear clutch cover on the outer surface way back in 2004.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/CL9.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/C35a2.jpg)

I forget where I saw it the other day but someone made windowed Moto Guzzi rocker covers so you can see where the clatter is coming from.  :laugh:

Now there's a blast from the past - original owner of a '97 TL1000S. Purchased a clear cover for it some time in the mid-90's. Beautiful work.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 20, 2020, 09:26:15 PM
Now there's a blast from the past - original owner of a '97 TL1000S. Purchased a clear cover for it some time in the mid-90's. Beautiful work.

I remember your bikes from TLPlanet being in Ann Arbor.

My Moto Guzzi experience didn't quite go to plan.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on March 20, 2020, 10:36:00 PM
Les, that link to Big Mamma Thornton was Great :grin: :grin: :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 21, 2020, 04:32:03 PM
Quite the lady but the 'drink got her in the end.

#

A change of plan of course since I had plenty of those rubber (whatever they might be called) so did two more for the adjusters to suit them.
A little bit of old with a little bit of new.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image%20_12_.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image%20_10_.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Frenchfrog on March 22, 2020, 08:06:57 AM
Your standards are so high ! Nice cable holder too...is that a standard Guzzi part or self made ?
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 22, 2020, 05:10:38 PM
Your standards are so high ! Nice cable holder too...is that a standard Guzzi part or self made ?

The main body is all stock Moto Guzzi, I just pressed those machined alloy bits onto the stock end cap and threaded adjusters to support the cables so they did not droop as before.
I have found in the past in general if the cable ends are happy, slide synchronisation is pretty much set and forget.

I could have machined a complete new 1 into 2 unit but the main part of the old one had nothing wrong with it.
Having a small mill and lathe makes these sort of things easy, near impossible without.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 22, 2020, 06:58:58 PM
It is easy to remember back to when I never had luxuries (like a small mill and lathe)

I remember a very good friend (R.I.P) and motorcyclist who had a shop with all manner of tool room equipment, this is a long time ago.
He said have a go on the lathe and was somewhat surprised to find me using a pencil to mark a piece of alloy bar then machining up to the mark, his advice was good to this day and suggested using the incremented dials which would make things easier if not more accurate.
He was right. (Thanks Jim  :thumb:)

I could stick something (a drill ? ) under the slide to get them close to synchronised or for 5 minutes time @ 28.95 mm OD and  5.2 mm high.  :laugh:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/wdg.jpg)

My hope is it will start instantly with a sniff of petrol and spark.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 22, 2020, 07:34:23 PM
Egads.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/fer5.jpg)

6.8 mm OD by 6.8 mm deep with a 6 mm bore.
I need to put (machine) something under those original carburettor cap bolts (Never had anything)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/fer.jpg)




Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 22, 2020, 07:37:26 PM
Nothing is to much trouble for this bike and how odd is it when your favourite bike is one you have never ridden.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 22, 2020, 11:35:26 PM
One tube insert in the throttle so no more flop there either.
This one is a sliding fit and should stay put.
The first one was a firm push fit and with no slit for the inner cable would have been interesting if the cable needed replacement so it was make another.
The overall throttle action is Super (Pratic) so worth the screwing around (9 machined pieces overall, choke and throttle)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ins.jpg)

The bike had separate choke plunger kits when I got it but got a stock unit off eBay but as it turned out a pin was missing to stop it rotating.
I could have machined something not worth machining like tapping the body M4 thread and machining a M4 fastener to have a 3 mm step down shank to fit the 3 mm hole in the brake perch.
Instead I went full on bogan, carefully battery drilled the perch with an old 1/8" drill (3.175 mm) did the same on the choke body hole and then cut and ground the drill to make a pin.
Loctite 660 should keep it snug in the choke body.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/pn1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/pn2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/pn4.jpg)

Once again I am concerned October and 61 is getting closer by the minute.  :laugh:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LBnMRWeV-E
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on March 23, 2020, 04:27:48 AM
Nothing is to much trouble for this bike and how odd is it when your favourite bike is one you have never ridden.

 :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 23, 2020, 05:12:01 AM
Its all good if you stay on the level.
I have a hunch we are in the same neighbourhood Mr B.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/lev.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 24, 2020, 09:22:54 PM
Amazingly enough it is close to firing up but am going to finish things instead.
Timing is set, the later fat push rods (9 mm OD) have been swapped out for the later later push rods (10 mm) and I might add they should not contact but clearance at the 12 o clock position on the 88 mm Gilardoni cylinders push rod tunnels is close enough that any less would be a decent margin concern.
There is no way they would have fit if I had not milled the 850 heads push rod bores either.
Everything else is ship shape.

I did get these Fiat 500 distributor caps (2 of) from Italy last year and Fiat 500 rotors also (which will not work as pointed out) and have raided the Norton spare parts shelf for new Pazon supplied copper core HT leads and the silicone ones I got the other week can go in a cupboard somewhere (Another figure 8 around in circles)
I think the NGK caps are suppressed so that should be OK with non suppressed spark plugs.

The 7 mm HT leads are a nice fit at the terminals in the cap but can move around in front of that portion, not now though.
With the rubber boot and these Acetyl push inserts, all should be good including in rain.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ds1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ds2.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 25, 2020, 05:41:19 PM
I had another look at the exhaust yesterday and have sent an email off to MG Cycle (They are not doing phone calls it seems after ringing them)

Any attempt to fit this new balance pipe will damage the muffler stubs, I ended up with one side fully fit up with that balance pipe in place and clamped, holding the other muffler stub near the balance pipe end put the muffler mount hole some 20 mm pass the frame bracket itself (not its hole)
I will be pi$$ed if I have to cut this new part to get it to fit (Over $1000 exhaust system), of course the 47 year old stock balance pipe fits fine so just using that might be less of a PITA.
Its seems a little late in the piece to be fitting parts with a crow bar.  :laugh:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/Pipe.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on March 25, 2020, 10:35:13 PM
" in the same neighbourhood"
Yep; I am in Buderim and BTW, call me Bill :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 26, 2020, 04:07:56 AM
Pleased to meet you Bill.  :thumb:
I am at 4507.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/image4%20_1_%20-%20Copy.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on March 26, 2020, 04:10:54 AM
Gotta be the Gold Coast, eh? Looks nice :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 26, 2020, 04:12:11 AM
I rang Mario today, he is well.

2 x distributor clips.
2 x exhaust nuts with locking rings.
2 x 88 mm head gaskets.
2 x washers for under the head nuts.

Tomorrow I will ride down to the city and pick up 150 mm of 60 mm OD aluminium bronze bar.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 26, 2020, 04:13:57 AM
Gotta be the Gold Coast, eh? Looks nice :thumb:

Bribie Island.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 26, 2020, 08:13:01 PM
I drove down to the city in the car instead of taking the bike (Maybe the air is bad)
Population 2.28 million and it was light traffic all the way with minimal pedestrians and many closed businesses but Black Hawk Metals was open and picked up the phone ordered pre cut piece of Aluminium Bronze, $105 @ 150 mm/6 inches long.
It should be noted I am not a real machinist and bluff my way along learning a bit as I go, googling says this grade is hard to machine but was surprised at the good finish with a end pass @ 300 rpm and aluminium tooling (insert)
Perhaps optimism is getting the better of me as it will need to be threaded both internally and externally.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/abb.jpg)

   
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on March 26, 2020, 10:47:26 PM
Bribie Island.

Bribie!! :grin:
We're practically neighbours :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 29, 2020, 07:08:01 PM
I've been doing a bit mainly on the rear brake,torque arm and original switch... I put the 998 wheels on FB yesterday spur of the moment and the money is in the bank already.
Some funds for the Moto Guzzi.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/Wheels.jpg)

The street is quiet, lock down seems to be taken for serious and looks to be for a long duration.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 30, 2020, 01:14:51 AM
The package from Perth arrived, the lock down here makes you grateful to receive anything. (Overnight post took nearly 4 days, like normal overnight but 4 of them  :laugh:)
Open package, throw wrapping in the bin, spray metal bits with carburettor cleaner then go wash your hands, thanks China, you're awesome.
I got these plus a spare set of 88 mm head gaskets.

The new distributor clips made a massive difference as far as securing the FIRE brand Made In Italy Fiat 500 distributor cap.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/clps.jpg)

The new 'you beauty exhaust nuts with locking rings do not fit inside the aluminium police style finned exhaust nut covers.
You can't have it to easy so will machine the bore in the covers.
I guess I could 'hammer them on  :wink:  :wink: but will mill the bore larger to suit the nuts.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/nuts.jpg)

 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 31, 2020, 03:52:25 AM
The AU$109.90 stainless steel nuts (Not the best material with the very different expansion to alloy but will do) have a bigger OD than the stock factory (bronze) nuts so would not fit into the US$104.74 finned clamps.
The threads on the nuts were crazy long sticking out of the head by a long way so the fancy clamps if they had fit would be a long way from the head also.
The answer was easy, just take those brand new parts and attack them while trying to get the alloy clamps closer to the head.

Turn a mandrel in the lathe that suits the ID in relaxed state before tightening.
Run the dial gauge over it.
Mill with 12 mm cobalt end mill that cost the equivalent of 2 -1/2 weeks wages back in January 1976 as an apprentice. ($75)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/5_2.jpg)

Use fancy DRO unit from previous pages to replicate to a micron.
ID out to 56.8 mm for a push fit.
Increase depth from 8 mm to 9 mm.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/4_2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/6_2.jpg)

Reduce locking ring from 8 mm to 6 mm ( 1.5 mm pitch so still 4 peak engagement)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/8_2.jpg)

Reduce nut by 4.5 mm with double chamfer.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/10_2.jpg)

Whoever gets this bike next will never know the attention it got and how close it got to being parted out if it had remained in the USA.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/13_2.jpg)

For now I am going to use the original muffler balance pipe.
Ironic a fabricator can not be bothered modifying the new one to fit.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on March 31, 2020, 05:57:33 AM
My arm is getting tired from tipping my hat to you!   :bow: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 31, 2020, 04:36:13 PM
My arm is getting tired from tipping my hat to you!   :bow: :thumb:

That is a major complement coming from you Dave.  :thumb: :thumb:

It was another time to appreciate having a small lathe, mill and tooling.
One part was to get them to work together given the nut would not fit into the finned clamp, the other just cosmetic but it looks much nicer not having a crazy large gap between the clamp and head.
#
In the real world, first up is find out why my 2 1/2 year old fridge has suddenly near frozen all the food in the cooler section of it which it had not done previously. (Never touched any adjustment)
My local supermarket, two limit on a lot of items and as I found out at the 'Deli section, 1 kg (2.2 lb) limit on chicken and it seems pasta is the new toilet paper with near empty shelves. (and 2 packet limit signs)
There might be a lot more stay at home, lock down time in the garage to come.
#
The wheels/rims/brakes up the page were collected by the buyer yesterday at a safe distance and he must have got busy when he got home as I got this picture last night of them mounted on his 748.
Good to see them back in use and some more rubles for the Eldorado pot can't hurt which more than likely will go toward registration/titling.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/45.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 31, 2020, 05:10:28 PM
I need to add doing something about the dipstick to the list that seems to get longer (unlike the dipstick) also.

The bike came with one of those aftermarket dipstick kits that have a boss that screws into the case and the dipstick is simply pushed in to secure it (two O-rings on the stick shoulder)
The engine has been filled with oil for months (no sump spacer) as per the manual except for around 200 ml reserved for oiling the top end/rockers before start up.
The oil level only just touches the end of the dipstick went pushed home, some 12 mm from the low mark, 47 mm from the high.

I am sure I put the correct amount of oil in (3 litres - 200 ml) so a dipstick that hardly works will need some modification for peace of mind........... or make a complete new one with a small threaded section at the top to secure it.
Put it on the list.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on March 31, 2020, 07:41:16 PM
I use 3 qts., no more or less, and then mark the dipstick accordingly. Back when I went for the whole 3.2 qts. that's in the manual, it would push oil out somewhere until it was at ~ 3 qts. anyway.

I never trusted the "finger pull" dipsticks in any case. 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 31, 2020, 08:20:33 PM
I use 3 qts., no more or less, and then mark the dipstick accordingly. Back when I went for the whole 3.2 qts. that's in the manual, it would push oil out somewhere until it was at ~ 3 qts. anyway.

I never trusted the "finger pull" dipsticks in any case.

Thanks Charlie.
I had to look that up.... 3 quarts is a shade over 2.8 litres which is in the engine as of now (the other 200 mls is in my new oil squirt can)
I will leave it at that volume (2.8l)

I could not live with that dipstick design even if convenient, it simply removes to easy (even if the O-rings look to be good) and could depart company on the road.
I like everything I can to be fit and forget (peace of mind on the road)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 31, 2020, 10:02:36 PM
Before, tight with a new copper sealing ring
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rg2.jpg)

After... Close (to close nearly) enough.
The L/H header will need a tweak as it is but 1 mm or less from hitting the floor board rearward foot plate mount.
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rg1.jpg)


New dipstick parts under way.
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/oil1.jpg)

Then I checked the dipstick out of my Africa twin, almost perfect.
The end of the old dipstick is the high mark (2.8 L) and all but lines up with the Honda high/low.
I could get another but would they reject each other at the transplant.
To be continued.........

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dps.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 01, 2020, 01:08:36 AM
One day I will make a proper handle.
You can run tooling upside down and power thread away from shoulders. (No brake on this lathe)

Or you just, unplug from the power and set the gear train up to suit in this case 1.5 mm pitch and after engaging the lead screw manually wind the saddle in via vice grips in this case, back out wind back and so one....... Its alloy so no fancy angle (29.5 degrees) on the compound, just straight in on the slide for a half dozen passes or so.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thr1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thr2.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 01, 2020, 05:12:07 AM
Yes that is a new 6 mm cap screw aged in white vinegar.... I think I have cabin fever.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/plg.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 02, 2020, 02:17:26 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ds3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/8a.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ds10.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 02, 2020, 06:03:03 AM
Needs more cowbell or something totally different.... It will do for now and still needs a stick but the shops are shut (afaik) (for a long 4 mm s/s fastener to modify)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/11_2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/er.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: radguzzi on April 02, 2020, 09:38:06 AM


You are such a talented machinist and builder Les, just wow...!  Stunning project.

Best.
Rob



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 03, 2020, 03:44:07 AM
Thanks Rob and might add I have more than enjoyed your threads here and other sites (Norton)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 03, 2020, 04:04:38 AM
Yes, managed to slip some brass in there, I stopped counting at 58 items.  :laugh:
Still no answer on the stick part, alloy (4 mm OD) might be OK but if it snapped off.. yikes.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dp9.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on April 03, 2020, 04:23:16 AM
Another lovely bit of work :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 04, 2020, 05:59:13 AM
 :thumb:

When is the last time someone made grommet holes with a DRO on the mill.
Yes Looper's , the battery tray is out again... I gave up on running the electrical wires down through the small 'triangle at the left rear corner of the tray and fender/mudguard.
The tool boxes and rear guard have been off so many times the 6 mm Nyloc's that hold them have cycled enough times to be replaced so lucky I got plenty.

The GB wiring loom came with two new grommets for the wiring that passes through the fork triple clamp, so the old (47 years old ?) ones are now in the battery tray for the starter cable and the minor wires down there..... just stick them through the grommet ed holes and almost look factory fitted.


The starter cable will pass down between the clutch and gear shift arms.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ghk.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/grm3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/grm1.jpg)



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on April 05, 2020, 07:18:41 AM
Les,  have you kept a tally of hours spent on this?  At a conservative rate of $30 per hour US I can only imagine what the total would be!  The labor charge and materials would probably make a Cycle Garden Eldo look like a bargain.   :grin:   Fantastic work!  This Eldo sure lucked out when you decided to save it.   
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on April 05, 2020, 09:26:33 AM
This is the kind of project where you throw the receipts out at once and forget about how many hours you spend fixing it :)

Anyway I'm sure Les have enjoyed most of the hours he spend on the bike so far
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: shiskowd on April 05, 2020, 09:34:09 AM
This is the kind of project where you throw the receipts out at once and forget about how many hours you spend fixing it :)


Great advice!  But I would argue the enjoyment/satisfaction vs. cost ratio for these projects is better than many other en-devours I've done over the years.

Nice work Les, that Eldo will truly be one of a kind.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 06, 2020, 11:03:11 PM
Greetings Gentleman (and any Ladies in the 55 to 60 age group  :wink:)

Some of those things would need some thought... In reality I could have simply done the minimum and even found used iron cylinders, maybe even looked for a used crankshaft with its bearings (they come up when you don't want them or after you buy something else)

I did not do much on the bike for years really, just place a order (14 of) with MG Cycle every now and again........ I bought 2nd under mains, then 6 months later read about converting to an oil filter........... so I went out and bought a mill/drill and some time later a lathe (or the other way round and then another front bearing (oil filter engine).......... and the years went by, my usual job is at gas projects (Domestic for power production and LNG for export so when working am away from home for 9 months of the year (4 and 1 FIFO, time poor but money for projects)

Did I save the Eldorado, not really, I just came to an imaginary agreement to do my bit and then it would need to do its bits if happy with my input.
(That would be future miles on the road)
These old Moto Guzzi's are far removed from what I have normally worked on to date and that is from CBX Honda's to Kawasaki H2's, Beveldrive Ducati's to Norton and Triumphs from the crankshaft up (Did I mention the Moto Guzzi sludge trap is deburred, chamfered and flapper honed on the ID)
Yes an enjoyable bike to work on... I have been doing some Norton work also.

Maybe I could have just ridden it (The fubared ring and pinion would have still gone round and round)... Maybe the dodgy cylinders and knurled valve guides would have hung in there, the cracked camshaft thread might never have failed who knows.......... I guess I got to a point, just spend what has to be spent.
Total hours would be quite high especially when you go around in circles.

Should someone wonder why the extension is longish when the torque arm (I did not measure the original centres/centers) was not extended that much, it is because around 40 mm of it had been beaten in with a hammer for tyre/tire clearance.
No more bashed clearance dish now and with the arm moved to the other side of the lug all is good.
Two for one.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/TAX.jpg)

Pretty bad when I have to do some metal work.... Fired up the V200T and found some ER70S-6.
Any metal finishing was no less than a cross hatch angle inline with the tube.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/TAX1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/TAX2.jpg)

I guess that is the thing having a few tools at your disposal (although I did have to pay for them) you can do what you like even if the gain verses time invested is out of kilter... you can do it anyway.
It seems that guy Luigi went to some trouble on the back brake.

I thought the alloy lever might be bent but google images showed them angling inward toward the backing plate, the bore through the plate for the cam is quite wide (support/ less flex ?) and the arm is then angled back in to get it slightly over that bore... wow.

I forget how it was when I got the bike being so long ago but when I installed the 6 mm pull rod to the wheel side of the crossover shaft actuating arm and then to the alloy rear arm the rod hit the nut that secures the front internal brake shoe anchor anchor and was binding in the slot of the rear arm.
Ehhh.. so I put it to the outside of the front arm but then was on a crazy angle (straight before) I left it like that until today.

With a bit of a quick test rotating the backing plate CCW until the rod missed and installed on the arm side where the pull is straight it was deemed OK cycling the suspension.
Extend the torque arm a little and the nut is out of the way, the rod is a straight pull on the wheel side of the front arm (and drops into the slot in the rear arm not pushed in) the rear lever is now at a better (I think) mechanical angle rearward.
Maybe it is like  like Luigi planned now.

The torque arm will go to the outside of the lug to miss the 120/90/18 but have no idea how you get the wheel off with the rear guard in place... If the paint (Original? ) had needed redoing I would have modified the guard so the rear part hinged up to get the wheel out.

Only the front of the arm will be repainted.

It probably took longer to type this than do the mod. :laugh:


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 10, 2020, 02:37:06 AM

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/fm.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/Pipe.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 10, 2020, 02:48:28 AM
The extended torque arm (350 mm C/C now) to rotate the backing plate a little CCW works great, the pull arm stopping just short of the backing plate pivot nut at full suspension travel without all the weird angles it had.
Both drum brakes need to be working nicely, I might need them one day.

In the spirit of things only the portion with with paint removed got VHT barrel paint and that was rubbed down with OOOO steel wool 24 hours later... The original black paint that was left lives another day.
It looks like a stock part, mission accomplished.

1/2 a step forward and do-si-do.  :laugh: :laugh:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Canuck750 on April 10, 2020, 10:49:56 AM
Amazing work Les, I don't think I have ever seen such attention to detail and skill,
way beyond my machine tool or fabrication capabilities, your work inspires me and probably everyone else who follows this build.
:bow: :bow: :bow:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 11, 2020, 06:40:22 AM
Thanks Jim  :thumb:

Without taking anything away from the many others doing great work, the likes of Yourself, Dave S and Charlie M are in a whole other ballgame to me.. You guys are not only doing outstanding work but bike after bike to the same super high standard and not just Moto Guzzi's.
 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on April 11, 2020, 07:57:56 AM
Thanks for the compliment, but my work looks like it is done with a hammer and prybar compared to yours.   :bow:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 11, 2020, 04:54:49 PM
It would take some convincing to believe that.  :laugh:
#
The ignition coil mounts under the main frame rail, the outlet end of it points at the generator cover and is very close, I could not get a right angle HT terminal and that is why it now lives beside the battery (LHS) so I can use the straight terminal I have.
By default that will leave more room for a reed valve baffle box.

I ended up robbing four Pazon 7 mm copper core ignition leads from my spares and removing one crimped terminal to make a coil HT.
Note to self, order more Pazon HT leads.

 (https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/coil4.jpg)

Maybe the devil is in the detail.
I elected to use studs and nyloc's, one of the cable loops (itiwtac) from the mill DRO kit will do nicely to hold the neutral switch wire.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/coil3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/coil2.jpg)

O-rings from the ALDI kit to the base of the coil as buffers.... Oddly enough the ALDI tap and die kit included both in M7 which came in handy when more thread was needed on the stock foot control rods. (Saved a ride to the city to buy one for what most likely will be a one time use)
Those crazy German's think of everything.  :thumb:

For the holes I spent 5 or so minutes and made a quick drill jig to suit 10.5 mm back from the battery tray and at 28 mm centres/centers.
With a mill and DRO its easy to make and when clamped to the job means the holes will be exactly where you want them (If you clamp it in the right spot)
Works very well over single holes also, mark the hole and place hole jig over it, clamp and one round hole where you want it.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/drl.jpg)

HT lead separators.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/spc.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/csr.jpg)

 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 15, 2020, 11:23:11 PM
I think it would be safe to say there is not one square millimetre I have not looked at now starting at the rough machined crankshaft sludge trap / oil feed cavity to the connecting rod journals (Yes that was de-burred and stone reamed with a final hone with a to size flapper wheel and then the feed holes chamfered on the inner side)

This box (oxygen/acetylene seam welded by the look of it) like most other bits looked good from the outside, even the original paint was nice.
Filing the seam soon had it apart for what would have been a reed valve install.
It had a pile of rust dust and there is nothing stopping that crud getting into the oil via the drain back to the sump.
I had been tempted to just 'stick it back on as is............

You would have to wonder what this bike has been through in the past given the main pipe goes to a inlet above the spinning crankshaft......... . Not much sign of oil here only massive condensation or mayonnaise (never up to temperature) to form not only rust but etched corrosion to that quality Italian sheet metal and mainly at the top.

Glad I looked, that crud could have got to the sump.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/tin.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 16, 2020, 08:32:22 PM
Just one ground, it got special treatment.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/eth.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Scout63 on April 21, 2020, 06:34:59 AM
Very clean work Les. This bike will treat you right.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 21, 2020, 07:36:22 PM
Clean except for the beat up paint and faded rust, Ben ... I have about $2.50 in new paint invested and most of it went on that brand new blue coil and tail light housing.
I saved some money there.

I went through my parts stash (and found the 3D printer ABS filament by default) and found a suitable Lucas head light.
Its a real one and pre 1976 when they started making not the same reproductions.
Fitting for this bike as I think it will do a 24 hour no problem.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/lm2.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Scout63 on April 21, 2020, 10:02:03 PM
Im glad you reminded me. I have an oem Lucas headlight shell from my Commando rebuild. Maybe Ill get it rechromed for the Guzzi.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 22, 2020, 05:02:37 AM
That would look good on  a custom Ben.

The Lucas  LeMans 24 hour head light looks good but had forgotten how it attached having no lip on the chrome surround for W clips like British bikes.
Then I remembered the tangs on the back of the reflector locate in the head light bucket, steel on steel, so is a juggling act to get it located and the trim fixed.

The Moto Guzzi had the same wonky slot at the head light ears like Commando's so got the brass washer treatment.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/hdt.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/IMG_3541.JPG)

The MotorSport shop that did the Moto Guzzi heads said they could re-bore the Sunbeam block but then the Plague struck.
I haven't touched it since my interstate move and the thread for that went over 130000 views long ago, I will list my other one next week... Keep the 1949, sell the 54.
The Sunbeam is like the Moto Guzzi, all mechanical right down to a unobtainium NOS bronze worm wheel and screw.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/sunbeams7deluxe/IMG_3511.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/IMG_1715.JPG)

The dangers of liking to many bikes from the crankshaft up.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 22, 2020, 06:33:22 AM
That picture reminds me why you should check things.
That gear box cluster is this gear box cluster after I gave it a spruce up with a tad of cleaning, new bushes (blue checked) and imperial bearings.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/sunbeams7deluxe/IMG_4304.JPG)

This picture was off the UK eBay site it was listed on and won it for under $100, a bargain.
The seller was a large bike breaker shop (A Scotsman) and agreed to remove the clusters etc from the case ( I rang him and did a how to on the phone) and then post them to me in Australia.
Anyway it duly arrived and indeed was a jewel in the rough (It would have been made any time between 1949 and 1954)

Here is why just buying things and bolting them on willy nilly can bite you in the behind.
There is only one place in the world that you can buy most parts for the Sunbeam S7 Deluxe and that place is in the UK and around since they bought all the remaining Sunbeam stock maybe 60 years or more ago an since making replica parts.
They proclaim themselves "S%#*&^%$T Engineering are the world's experts on these machines"

In the refurbishment of the clusters all new bronze bushes were purchased from them, the shafts are hollow and oil can enter one end by design, flow through that central drilling and I guess by centrifugal force exit via radial holes in the shaft to two grooves at each gear pairing. The oil filled groove would then feed the holes in the bronze bushes to lubricate the gears they ride on.
Seems like a nifty way of doing things but then again these Sunbeams are like no other motorcycle built.

I get the bushes and the first thing I notice ?
The bush at the top was one of the new ones, (old one below it) the holes were wrongly drilled at the centre so no oil could get to the gears, perhaps they would have galled or some other calamity in use.
Of course I contacted them but they were not concerned by it or perhaps knew no different being the worlds experts.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/sunbeams7deluxe/6.JPG)

I simply made a mandrel and what was needed to index things and drilled the required new feed holes to line up with the oil grooves in the shaft based off the original bush and shaft measurements as a confirmation.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/sunbeams7deluxe/7.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/sunbeams7deluxe/8.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/sunbeams7deluxe/10.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/sunbeams7deluxe/11.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/sunbeams7deluxe/12.JPG)

That is why it is not about being pedantic or cleaning things it is about mechanical fitting of parts or making what you have fit for purpose be they new or used.

In two days I might have done an hour on the Moto Guzzi.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 22, 2020, 09:04:10 PM
I never saw that coming, the head light being a project of sorts.

Old classic Lucas head light reflectors have old classic bulbs that most likely give a feeble glow so the Le Mans is back in the box, I robbed the new contemporary genuine Lucas reflector out of my Mk2a 850
It is new and has a modern bulb which will fit the three spade loom plug.

Getting it all into the bucket is something else so the wiring will need some rearrangement.

The fuses removed would have taken a small power station to blow, new ones from the Greg Bender loom kit on the left.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/fs.jpg)

The components inside the bucket are in great condition right down to the decals on the main fuse block considering their age but was soon reminded why I put a blade fuse unit in my 900 SD (which had those same fragile fiddly fuses)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 23, 2020, 02:12:14 AM
That was quick I ordered some LED's from China, made from the best quality Chinesium and they are here already with a possible delivery before the weekend.

I got 10 BA9S in white for the 'police dash.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/10-x-BA9S-White-7020-3SMD-LED-Light-Bulbs-T11-T4W-1895-Car-Interior-Lamp-12V-DC/153648713012

8 of the BA15S @ 21w in amber which should fit the Lucas indicators on the Eldorado and Mk2a Commando.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/2x-1156-BA15S-P21W-Car-Turn-Light-Signal-36-SMD-LED-Bulb-Amber-Yellow-Orange-12V/153686725253

The fully rejuvenated (internally) and bench tested Bosch generator should be happy with the purchase and will have an easy time powering the head light.
After screwing around with this today I have to wonder why all the bits are in the head light, a decent LED headlight would be nice but can not see how it could fit...It was like an electrical Rubik's cube.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on April 23, 2020, 09:04:45 AM
That was quick I ordered some LED's from China, made from the best quality Chinesium and they are here already with a possible delivery before the weekend.

I got 10 BA9S in white for the 'police dash.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/10-x-BA9S-White-7020-3SMD-LED-Light-Bulbs-T11-T4W-1895-Car-Interior-Lamp-12V-DC/153648713012

8 of the BA15S @ 21w in amber which should fit the Lucas indicators on the Eldorado and Mk2a Commando.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/2x-1156-BA15S-P21W-Car-Turn-Light-Signal-36-SMD-LED-Bulb-Amber-Yellow-Orange-12V/153686725253

The fully rejuvenated (internally) and bench tested Bosch generator should be happy with the purchase and will have an easy time powering the head light.
After screwing around with this today I have to wonder why all the bits are in the head light, a decent LED headlight would be nice but can not see how it could fit...It was like an electrical Rubik's cube.

For best results, you really should use LEDs of the same color as the lens they will be behind.

A "decent LED headlight" is actually not as deep as just about any H4 and will fit nicely. I've used a JW Speaker LED sealed beam in several customer bikes and there are cheaper alternatives on ebay and Amazon.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 23, 2020, 05:34:08 PM
I was thinking of something like a Cyclops H4 now that I have a H4 reflector back in there that will dip to the left... I should have said LED bulb not head light / reflector unit.
Of course things like the Cyclops probably work much better with a modern headlight/reflector even if you could get all the bits in the bucket.

(https://adventurebikeaustralia.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/cmn1551-hdr.jpg)

What is there will do for now until actual use.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on April 23, 2020, 07:25:12 PM
I've been using a Hella H4 headlight with ADVMonster Native H4R2 LED bulb in my V700, and it works very well. Just as well as the JW Speaker LED sealed beam. Cam just used the same combo in V7 Sport and police Ambassador. Fit is the same as a halogen bulb - nothing sticking out the back except the terminals. That bulb has been superseded by a new one, which I've not tried yet:

http://stores.advmonster.com/budget-h4-led/
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 24, 2020, 12:45:42 AM
I will look at getting one of those Charlie  :thumb:
Like everything else, I figure unless a fuse blows I won't be opening the headlight again so might as well put a decent bulb in there and those ones won't need any more space at the back over a stock H4 bulb.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/LED.jpg)

An email arrived saying check the mail box.
Same weird drill now.
Throw packaging in the bin and wash hands.
I will take the LED bulbs out of the package, put them outside somewhere safe since they came from China and leave them there for 72 hours +++.
Ohhh and hit the keyboard with 'Spray & Wipe then wash those hands again.  :shocked:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 26, 2020, 02:33:33 AM
There goes a couple of hours, I could have used NOS Lucas indicators still in their 40 year boxes but that would be to easy.
I did go through my Brit bike spares to complete a set that suits the bike along with what was on the bike.

The threads in the body get industrial silicone so they stay put and do not rely on the locking nuts being over tight (The reason the bodies crack when combined with vibration/harmonics)
The nuts get the same along with 10 mm alloy sealing washers.
The lens got Brasso metal polish which has worked well on this type of thing including tail light lens also.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/sig.jpg)

Usual boring stuff, every single component checked right down to the fibre washers under the lens screws and rubber discs on the inner side.
I have enough old black wire cover to make four, pushed to the inside of the body via the mount stem bores to avoid any electrical shorting.

I saw Jim's post about what is acceptable as far as gremlins on a bike back on the road, for me that would be none.

This bike should be re torquing, oil change, check nothing has fallen off and then be capable of riding around the world, I do not think that unreasonable.
 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on April 26, 2020, 03:49:14 AM
Not unreasonable considering all the work you've put into it Les :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on April 26, 2020, 06:28:32 AM
I think it is safe to say that no one in the world has ever restored an Eldo to this level.  Way beyond factory specs!  It should be motoring on for generations! 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: s1120 on April 26, 2020, 08:10:55 AM
I gotta say, and Im sure Im not alone here..  Having been watching this thread all this time, and seeing the bike SOOOOOO close to running down the road...   MAN I cant wait to see the first ride report on her!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 05, 2020, 07:11:57 PM
It took a bit of work to get it to fit including machining the side stand pivot bolt shorter and using a standard (low height) M10 Nyloc, bending the header and cutting the balance pipe.
The whole exhaust is now push fit assembly as it should have been at AU$1287 + international post.
I used 309 wire but it will probably still rust but is out of sight for the most part.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/Pipe.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/WTF.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/we.jpeg)

So that is another self fixed vender screw up, no doubt they will blindly peddle that part, just remember don's bother contacting them you will not get a reply.  :laugh:

More importantly my favourite eBay seller...

https://www.ebay.com/str/lamontsanfurd

listed a 4 piston R/H Brembo brake caliper, to my welcome surprise I won it as the only bidder for the princely sum of US$9 , hopefully the post cost will be favourable :wink:
I will machine a bracket to fit it to my 1974 Mk2a Commando and will go nicely with the original now Blanchard ground rotor  @ AU$128.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/dsc.jpg)

I have an interested party in my 1954 Sunbeam S7 Deluxe, I will of course keep my 1949 model.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on May 05, 2020, 09:09:22 PM
It's not a "vendor screw up" , it's a manufacturer screw up. The same crossover is sold by several sources and they all look the same.
https://scramblercycle.com/collections/guzzi-exhaust/products/moto-guzzi-exhaust-muffler-crossover-ambassador-eldorado-12123900

AFAIK, they all get them from Moto Storiche Italian in Italy.
https://motostoricheitaliane.com/negozio/collettori-di-scarico-moto-epoca/guzzi-collettori-di-scarico-moto-epoca/ricambi-moto-epoca-guzzi-850-gt/?v=65cac26844d0

Odd that they're like that - I've installed three sets of those mufflers in the past two years and not one of them had a malformed crossover.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 06, 2020, 07:05:05 AM
I can not explain it and now notice even HMB Guzzi show the same balance pipe with the ends angled inward, I can only assume people who get that one just move the muffler parallel and the stubs bend to suit (but that would risk cracking the chrome)

At the end of the day the one I have looked just like the pictures on all those web sites and now fits nicely with a fairly large pie cut although it is now around 5 mm from the tyre.
It has to be remembered all of those web sites are run my long time Moto Guzzi experts and I haven't even ridden one, so I will continue to bumble my way to completion.

What is very noticeable as a steel trade worker is, the OEM 47 year old original balance pipe is of high quality and has a deeper loop (for tyre/tire clearance) and the curves are flowing, almost like it was hydroformed but am not sure that was even done back then.
Craftsman no doubt with lost skills.

The exhaust took a bit of work to fit in general but is done now.


 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 06, 2020, 05:39:16 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/tl7.jpg)

8 mm bore rubber hose and original loom sleeve.
 
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/trf.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 08, 2020, 08:41:41 PM
Cranking plugs out.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/oil.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 09, 2020, 07:32:09 PM
I am not to bad on some of the more complicated things but sometimes the more straight forward catch me out.

The headlight was not plugged in and the tail light was staying on with the ignition turned on so figured I must have plugged some wires in incorrectly.
This morning I tested a notion that occurred to me, perhaps it was due to something simple and indeed when I went to the handlebar turning the light switch to off did just that, no wonder this bike has taken so long to date.  :laugh:

The Charlie M tail light with Greg Bender wiring is now working like a charm.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: s1120 on May 10, 2020, 08:09:08 AM
I am not to bad on some of the more complicated things but sometimes the more straight forward catch me out.

The headlight was not plugged in and the tail light was staying on with the ignition turned on so figured I must have plugged some wires in incorrectly.
This morning I tested a notion that occurred to me, perhaps it was due to something simple and indeed when I went to the handlebar turning the light switch to off did just that, no wonder this bike has taken so long to date.  :laugh:

The Charlie M tail light with Greg Bender wiring is now working like a charm.

Been there!!  Tracing down a skipping, stalling issue on my Cali stone..  Ya, turned out there was no gas in it...  Fuel light wasnt on, so I didnt even thing about it. 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on May 20, 2020, 04:18:02 AM
You did your best Les. Hopefully when both you and the Eldo is on the road, those kinds of experience will be forgotten :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 20, 2020, 06:46:41 AM
Its all good Bill... just another roll of the eyes and move on.......... I guess I never mentioned, way back when I was advertising for a gearbox (I ended up ringing Rex off US Craigslist and getting one for AU$700 posted) I was contacted by a name player who I will not name for fear (not) of being banned here or on the Loop FB page  :laugh:
He tried to sell me a box that was not only obviously rusty but had trashed dogs, total junk and would have cost some $400 to get here, when I declined, politely of course I never heard back... He is probably still thinking I am a whiner and he was doing me a favour.  :laugh:

I actually got two gearbox offers like that off these websites, both junk but it worked out in the end.  :thumb:

Sometimes I think why help other people but ...well you know.

My first dealing with a Moto Guzzi person was (and a member of this site) when no one would help them.. in the world and saw this thread (ADV Rider) go on and on.........I worked 28 days away from home, 6 days back (or 9 months away from home per year)
I see this thread then pages long so offer to machine the part off his measurements,
It took a decent chunk out of one of those 6 precious days....... I machine it, he says how much, I say lets wait until it gets to the US.

That is free machining, free post.
He gets it and asks how much, I reply, no charge.

I never heard anything back.

You can't hold onto that kind of thing as a negative thought, its just a reminder the next person might appreciate it and should charge for the service.

The only down side (The list of BS over the the duration is much bigger than I am letting on) is my motivation is effected by it...... I would say my time on the bike today was under 10 minutes and what I made went in the bin.
Total time for Monday through to today (Wednesday) would be somewhere around 30 minutes, it is what it is.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on May 20, 2020, 10:42:25 PM
You're a generous person Les :grin: :thumb: Just look out for those "bumps", eh :wink:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 21, 2020, 01:48:16 AM
The good thing about new days is there will be another one tomorrow if this one has bumps Bill

I decided to bite the bullet and buy a new ignition switch and be done with it so found a place (Beewah) that had genuine you beauty, Made in England LUCAS ignition switches @ $77.50, a small price to pay for a quality part and it even came in a pretty green box.
I was asked on the phone if I wanted a replica type switch as the 'you beauty real deal Lucas version was a little pricey, I said Lucas genuine for me thank you for asking.

It is a little late in the piece to be worrying abut money now (even though unemployed)
So I jump in the trusty old Golf and head off, the first major drive since I do not remember for a trip of over two hours return on a wet and windy drive, motorway and country roads.

I get there after paying on the phone to pick up my socially distanced purchase in its little sealed bag sitting on a outside table, a quick chat with a woman who appeared at a near by garage door and was off again.

I did not look at the switch so waited until home to unbox this fantastic purchase that will probably last 50 years.. (Haha, yeah right)

All I can say is it must have been made in the Lada factory in the 1980's and the action is probably more suited to a T34 tank, the body is some form of pressed alloy with a thread with melted plastic on the end , as a bonus the one tumbler key barrel   :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:  when you push it into the plastic inner body slot does not lock as the spring loaded pin will not engage because the hole for it is off set in the slot it goes into. (faulty)
That means if turned on you can pull the whole tumbler out...  :laugh:

I will have to drive all the way back up there tomorrow and see if I can get a refund but based on pass experiences am not optimistic.
Usual story, otherwise going well.





Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on May 21, 2020, 04:12:10 AM
I feel very bad :angry: about that Les
Raises all sorts of questions but if you are laughing........... ...
Well, stay cool Les but it really is a Bitch.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 24, 2020, 04:03:48 AM
They did not open Friday so must be following this thread, I will ring them tomorrow (Monday) ....... I have more machining requests.

I guess everyone extends the Superpratic with the drum being oddly short, I thought grips would be a 2 minute job.

Tube extension is 18 mm wide (for now) , 25.3 mm OD / 22.4 mm ID.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/sup.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on May 24, 2020, 09:00:15 AM
I just use the Superpratic throttle as-is. Doesn't really hurt anything to have the last bit of grip unsupported.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on May 24, 2020, 05:21:07 PM
I just use the Superpratic throttle as-is. Doesn't really hurt anything to have the last bit of grip unsupported.

Ditto,  you will never know the difference Les, but knowing you that wont do!   :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 24, 2020, 07:19:12 PM
The action and lightness is smoother than both my (FI) Africa Twin and Hypermotard 1100S but that will have to do.

#
I got through to the place I got the $77.50 genuine ignition switch off.

No surprises.
I get some old dude (it was a friendly woman last week) on the phone.

Its all good until I mention the word defective new part (politely)

He then has a instant grump, says bring it back (An over 2 hour return trip) and it will be replaced and hangs up ? (Hello, hello ?  :laugh:)

I know the drill now, part with hard earned wages, get junk and then you are deemed a whiner. (shrug)  :laugh:

Its a sunny day so might ride up there on the AT/DCT.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 25, 2020, 01:32:58 AM
Well there you go.
45 minute ride to return the Lucas switch, the look was priceless when after being told there was nothing wrong with it, I turned it on and then pulled the barrel out with the key still in it.  :laugh:

He came to the party after that, got me a good one that I checked  :thumb: and we ended up chatting in the morning sun for nearly an hour. 
I can't be that bad after all.  :laugh:


I will take the ignition leads to the same place that checked the generator and starter motor to have the ends changed from bullets to spade terminals.
I have found it hard to find quality electrical  terminals that are not made of cheese, a dedicated auto electrical should have good ones.

My neutral light is not going out so have to conclude I put the sensor in upside down (I do have both the green and black wires on its terminal but that should only mean starting in neutral only )

The switch is made in the UK and due to its smaller size might be viable in a single instrument dash.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on May 25, 2020, 05:01:26 AM
you're getting there Les :grin: even though it's been a  :boxing: :boxing: :wink:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 26, 2020, 11:25:04 PM
All is good again, I went and measured up the was a big block Mustang but now a $$$ 351 with quad down draft Webers for the easy linkage job (It won't be easy but it is a sunny day)

On the way I dropped the GB wiring loom parts off at the same Auto electrical who/whom did the Bosch starter motor and generator checks (and de soldered the solenoid cap to refurb the contacts)

It needed to be a job to the same or as close to as GB did with decent quality terminals (They fit tightly and do not bend/distort/open)
This new switch had spades and the loom was done for the Magneti Marelli switch which had bullets.
They tried to charge me $3 (US$1.92) but would not have a bar of it, the best I could do was get it up to $5 (note)

I will add this momentous no drama, no BS occasion to the list of other one.  :laugh:

Thanks dudes, always great service and smiling faces.  :thumb: :thumb:

https://bashisautoelectrics.com.au/

The new super high quality second Lucas switch (OFF/ON/START)  has a nice action and the barrel does not come out in the ON position so I will stop complaining  :wink:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bt.jpg)

Of course in true fashion the bits I machined for the OEM switch are now paperweights to go with the many others over this journey.

The switch body is 35 mm OD , the boot is off a 1970's Norton Commando.

They also have a front boot which I will use, mounting by a simple plate that passes through the slot.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bt4.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bt6.jpg)


 

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 02, 2020, 03:27:49 AM
Back to it, a police type ignition switch bracket in the morning......

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/c.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/x.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on June 02, 2020, 04:24:18 AM
That's Beautiful :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 02, 2020, 08:53:04 PM
Its a 1967 big block S code car with that 550 hp small block now, hard to believe I was driving the 1968 version 40 years ago as a 20 yo.

Time to make some swarf.
The Lucas switch with Norton rear boot should almost look factory and will allow the tool box to be retained unlike the original police set up (no tool box)
The original Magneti Marelli ignition switch was way to big to do this... so all good for the Anglo/Italia version.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ign.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 02, 2020, 09:26:56 PM
Some revisions to be made, Ignition switch, tool box opening, rear grab rails, Lucas indicators on the stock mount and tucked in Dan Brown panniers will not go together.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 04, 2020, 07:48:03 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/s3_3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/s2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/s1_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/sw9.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/sw10.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on June 04, 2020, 08:02:22 PM
Hey Presto!
Another pretty piece pops out of Les's workshop :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 06, 2020, 12:09:11 AM
That will do with another front cover machined from Acetyl, the window in it to fit over the alloy bracket was a bit tricky with a 1.6 mm wall but a insert inside it stopped any shattering.
Its looks like a stock type part.

I need to drill one 6 mm hole in the frame gusset to mount it front of the L/H Ikon shock absorber.... It will be a time to be careful, drilling through the rear fender and into the tyre/tire is best avoided.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/cv1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/cv4.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/cv89.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/cv8.jpg)


 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Canuck750 on June 06, 2020, 11:51:08 AM
How do you think this stuff up?  :thumb:

Amazing detailing, I wish I could apprentice in your shop for a year or two just to learn how to run a mill with some skill and confidence.

I don;t think too many people could make a motorcycle from scratch with just some steel tubes and aluminum billet, but I am pretty sure your one of them. :bow:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on June 07, 2020, 08:04:31 PM
Every time I look at the craftsmanship exhibited by Les I feel like riding my restorations off a cliff.  Of course jumping off just in time to get another.   :boozing:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 07, 2020, 08:33:10 PM

Those circles were looming last week.
When I got the bike it had the large stock ignition switch at the location below the speedometer (Police dash)
The switch fascia ring is a little to large so was a bit bodgy, the trip reset was mounted at the left side of the dash where the reset had been.

It might be a 100 pages back but I modified the dash to get the trip reset back in the stock location below the speedometer and then a bit of work to get the needed push/pull switch back to the left side under the warning lights.

I had not given much thought to it when I ordered the Greg Bender police loom to suit the dash (It had a hacked civilian loom) only to find (not doing ones homework) the police ignition switch is at the rear of the bike and even if I had one (or the bracket) it would not be a bolt in with a L/H tool box, the police bike does not have one.

In hindsight given the Lucas switch is only around 35 mm diameter, I probably could have put it in the dash and asked Greg to do a police dash loom with civilian ignition switch wiring that goes to the front of the bike.

FB has had its entertainment this week especially from my good old mate who I met when we started out Boilermaker apprenticeships in 1976.

Probably 1985 and some form of bad hair day.  :laugh: :laugh:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/sd%20-%20Copy.jpg)

 



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 07, 2020, 08:38:17 PM
I need to do something about the breather box, that hopefully will be the last major part to make or modify.
It will have a small twin petal reed valve that I have already.

Thanks for the replies  :thumb:

A guy posted on the FB Commando page the other day and when I held the mouse over his name to see what the bike was then looked in his profile for the bigger pic version, what other bike did he have (In the UK)  ?
A T3 California in stock trim.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on June 07, 2020, 09:03:07 PM


A guy posted on the FB Commando page the other day and when I held the mouse over his name to see what the bike was then looked in his profile for the bigger pic version, what other bike did he have (In the UK)  ?
A T3 California in stock trim.

I need to seek out this obviously supremely intelligent fellow!   :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 10, 2020, 05:19:48 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rd.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 11, 2020, 09:11:51 PM
If there was a little voice  :laugh: .. It might say, why not just remove the flapper disc and put one of those reed valves inside the stock breather box that was cut open a week or three back and fuse weld it back together.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/tin.jpg)

I think this was rusty/corroded on the inside from sitting for many years (The connecting rods were rusty (replaced) as was the crankshaft (cleaned up fine)

Do these bikes really push oil out of the breather hose from the box ? or only with a high oil level.
The tube/tower inside rises to maybe 6 mm / 1/4" from the roof of the box and you might think (or not) any oil would hit the flapper disc and fan outward settling on the box floor running down the return to the sump.

Charlie M did say 2.8 litres is about it.



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on June 12, 2020, 01:27:23 AM

Do these bikes really push oil out of the breather hose from the box ? or only with a high oil level.
The tube/tower inside rises to maybe 6 mm / 1/4" from the roof of the box and you might think (or not) any oil would hit the flapper disc and fan outward settling on the box floor running down the return to the sump.

Charlie M did say 2.8 litres is about it.

The breather box is supposed to condense the oily mist. 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 13, 2020, 02:18:40 AM
The was a crazy amount of work but that bit is done and will get back to it.

What I will do now is modify the stock breather box to take one of those reed valves and T.I.G it back together and try that... or the stock breather box will go into the top of this, tomorrow.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/drt.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rd90.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on June 13, 2020, 04:28:16 AM
Nothing wrong with your motivation Les :bow: :bow: :bow:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 13, 2020, 05:22:08 PM
You don't want to know what I have come up with.  :laugh:

It will need some of that black paint.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/blk%20-%20Copy.jpg)

I need to make a breather for the final drive but it can not have a hose or look to obvious.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on June 14, 2020, 07:25:13 PM
Never found the need to add a breather for the rear drive. Run it until up to max. temp, "burp" it, done.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 14, 2020, 09:48:14 PM
Never found the need to add a breather for the rear drive. Run it until up to max. temp, "burp" it, done.

That works for me.  :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 17, 2020, 06:49:18 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rtu.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 17, 2020, 09:03:42 PM

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/tnk2.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on June 17, 2020, 11:49:55 PM
WOW!!! :thumb: :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 18, 2020, 09:27:59 PM
Assembled and ready to fit, I need to find a piece of non china hose to attach it and some no china thin band hose clamps or similar.
The oil return hose will be 8mm/13mm green Ariete hose that is Made in Italy same as the fuel lines (7mm/10mm)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/asc.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/yui.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on June 18, 2020, 10:54:12 PM
Lovely work Les :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Frenchfrog on June 19, 2020, 04:15:50 AM
Art!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 19, 2020, 06:30:40 AM
 :thumb:

The oil needs to stay inside the engine when it has to sit on 80 to 100 mph across the Northern Territory.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/fgh.jpg)
Title: .
Post by: Rick4003 on June 19, 2020, 11:39:38 AM
Lovely job indeed! I like the use of the reed valve. Seems like it should be more reliable than the old ball valve. At least if it was to fail is would fail to seal and not fail to open like the ball valve does.

There can't be a lot more stuff you can come up with to change is there?

How is the - regulations in OZ? Are you allowed to ride there?

Great job as always!
Title: Re: .
Post by: LesP on June 19, 2020, 08:36:07 PM
There can't be a lot more stuff you can come up with to change is there?

I might have to redo or rejig a couple of things.

An oil pressure gauge is a must, I had thought of using an adjustable Hobbs switch (oil pressure switch) there are some that are adjustable for the indicator light to go out between  15 PSI and 50 PSI.
I got the Marlin USA 0/100 PSI gauge and it needs a mount which looks like being a clamp around the steering head between the top frame tube and upper bearing cover.
A twin bolt split version would be easier, a one piece, one bolt version would mean removing the dash and top triple to fit it.
The gauge will be at the front of the fuel tank, L/H side.

I have a small Mugura brake light switch that needs to mount to the brake lever perch (No switch MGC brake cable, I would like a HD Barnett ? cable)

I need to make a hold down of some sort for the ignition coil holder.

I have a bunch (I hope) of bits coming from the UK (ignition sundries/HT lead etc)

I have a National Cycle Police type screen (used but great condition) that needs mounting.
Did I say how I got that screen (who knows)
It was on US eBay (Los Angeles iirc) I asked the seller if I could bid on it with no reply (iirc)
An Aussie mate living in the States (CA) had said if I ever needed anything just contact him, I got him to bid on the screen which I got for peanuts  :evil:
He sent it on to me and I sent a mail to the seller saying thanks for the screen  :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Even with post it was cheap and a big thanks to Aussie mate.  :thumb:

I have fork cover screen mounts so spacer bushes should be all it needs to fit, I might cut the top down a little (maybe)

A hose and vent bottle off the gearbox vent.

You know the L/H tool box is off again (easier to fit the ignition switch wiring) I would guess I have around 25 hours in fitting and removing them over and over  :laugh: (I might have to fit the second set of M6 Nylocs to that one)

The front brake will need extra careful set up and of course I am just now reminded I should have remembered to get a M7 - 1 lefthand tap when I rode down to the city last this week to get fasteners for the breather unit.  :violent1:

The front 2LS brake connector link rod will be cut to have a  M7 left hand/right hand central adjuster inserted which will make setting the shoe contact easy.

The Dan Brown panniers will need some work to refit.

Looking at the bike (In the living room now) there is not that much to do.

I have two Brembo brake caliper adaptors to machine, one for the DR780 and one for the 1974 Commando (I was waiting for a M10/1 banjo bolt that arrived)........ and of course that means I should have got two bolts not one.  :laugh: :violent1:





 

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 21, 2020, 03:45:46 AM
More Acetyl, M44-1 thread that will have a same thread cap at the back of the alloy bracket.
A 44 mm OD ring (2 mm x wide 3 mm deep) is an interference fit holding the gauge in place, that meant the ID and OD could get a 2 mm radius (cutter) in the mill.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/gh.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dsr.jpg)

Somewhere inside the flat bar is what I am looking for.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/df_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/gth.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 22, 2020, 11:27:50 PM
A lot of work for a gauge.
I was thinking, what were you thinking but it doesn't matter when it is done
It would have been an easy job with a CNC.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ct.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bhy.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on June 23, 2020, 05:56:05 PM
Les,  when you titled this a a quest you sure weren't kidding!!    :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 23, 2020, 07:17:57 PM
Can't have any excuses to not like it Dave.

First easy job out of the way, shorten and countersink the end of a SS banjo bolt for a ZI 900.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/fghy.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 28, 2020, 12:12:13 AM
Another exciting instalment from slower than slow motion productions.
Can you believe that remainder from the can of VHT Barrel Paint is still going, I must have around $3 (US$1.92) in black paint in the bike by now.
I can get that new hose tomorrow being Monday.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/q1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/brt.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/q2.jpg)

The top Acetyl cup goes in the bracket, the lower screws to it (Internal M44 - 1 thread), the gauge and adaptor push into the cup, the 2 x 3 ring with 2 mm radius on the ID presses in on top of the gauge bezel and the NPT fitting is screwed into the adaptor.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on June 30, 2020, 07:28:55 PM
I had finished my morning coffee (KitchenAid Expresso hopefully Made in the USA) and thought I better make something to hold the coil in that base I made who knows when.
I'm on a roll with the Acetyl so why stop now.

I think those hose bums farm the actual hose making (oil gauge) out, day three and no pick up call, what if I was in the hurry ?.... I need more bits from the city when it is ready.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ct4.jpg)

It goes nicely with the rejuvenated internally starter motor exterior patina.
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ct7.jpg)

From the archives.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/coil4.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/coil2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/coil3.jpg)

Relocating the coil allowed the breather tower... My order from the UK for HT leads/terminals/rubber bits etc is only at the Completed stage after three weeks ? ( I can only assume 'they know about this thread)

I took some time to look at the $9 caliper from https://www.ebay.com/str/lamontsanfurd over there in Texas (He would be the only vender who over many years has simply sent parts that were what he said they were)

The caliper is date stamped 00 (2000) so it was no surprise one piston was a little sticky, I elected to make some (Acetyl) spacers etc to restrain the other three pistons and after setting up a spare master cylinder pumped that piston out with no drama.
I was going to refurbish it anyway but was surprised to find full seal kits (pressure and dust) were thin on the ground (Not to mention there are kits with ChinaRubber to be avoided)
I found a set in the UK for a decent price with post, they should be here this month, I will need to come up with a bracket to fit it to the Norton.
Brembo do seal/piston kits but they do not come with dust seals that can harden over time.

http://www.ebaystores.com.au/Powerhouse-Automotive-Ltd

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/cal.png)


........ and back to it, CCR is band of the day (My HD has 123000 songs)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 01, 2020, 12:59:32 AM
I change out kitchen cutting boards every six months or so for hygiene reasons. After boiling water sterilisation they go in the bin ?, of course not they get to have a new life in the lathe/mill material bin.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bnm.jpg)

Outside 3 jaws, face the front, bore the centre/center to size (54.8 mm)
Flip it over, newly faced side up against the jaws, face that side to finished thickness.
Swap to inside jaws turn the OD.
Ready for mill rotary table.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/u.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/cvb.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 01, 2020, 06:06:53 AM
No surprise, a call this afternoon to say the braided line is ready 300 mm @ $60 (US$40).

No one will ever guess the ignition coil hold down was once part of a bread board.
It will need some holes....

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rg6.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rgb9.jpg)

Top side.
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ryt4.jpg)

Under side.
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rbu8.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on July 01, 2020, 09:19:35 AM
I am gobsmacked and completely out of adjectives.  Struck dumb!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 01, 2020, 05:05:00 PM
Desperation is the English way Dave.

The Moto Guzzi force (frugality) was with me when I recycled that bread board, the electricity probably cost more than the material.

We are in the middle of Winter now so I need to dig deep to get through this (It was down to 11c / 52f in the early AM and a chilly high today of 21c/70f ) and find some woolly garments.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 02, 2020, 08:17:16 PM
That will do besides some de burring and find some M4 nylocs for the bottom (6 mm rod stepped to take M4 thread)
The ignition coil should be happy.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hd1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hd2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hd3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hd4.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hd5.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on July 02, 2020, 10:13:00 PM
Well done Les :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 03, 2020, 02:03:16 AM
I am running out of things to do to avoid starting it.  :laugh:

The China L/H M6-1 tap and die arrived today (along with another rates bill (increased $399 per 1/4) which means another 3 months has passed by)
The L/H tap and die  means I can cut the 2LS front brake rod up and add an M6 LH-R/H adjuster so it can be set on the bike easily.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/tap.jpg)

Design has started on the RollerRider 550.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 03, 2020, 05:22:43 AM
I won't mention having to fettle one thread on the fancy $60 braided oil line (The male fitting stopped half way)

Anyway, I finished dinner (easy to chew being elderly) and thought I might as well remove the brake link rod and have a look,one thing led to another.
I have spare throttle cable rubber boots so two of them will go on the adjuster.

I googled M6 L/H nuts but could not see any, then it came to me, where are the stainless turn buckles from early in the year to pull the shoes in hard on the cams for arcing the newly bonded brake shoes.
Sure enough M6-1 L/H - R/H and there they are, saved making them.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/lnk2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/lnk1.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 03, 2020, 07:05:38 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/lnk9.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: s1120 on July 03, 2020, 07:31:31 AM
Nice touch with the rubber boots on the brake link! 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 03, 2020, 07:46:00 AM
I got 10 or so rubber boots on the last MGCycle order so using them up (It hides the mod a little also)
#
It is not a restoration by any means but the more of this shiny crap I add the more the poor old Bosch starter motor looks neglected (externally).. I might have to use the last of that VHT paint to give it a birthday.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 06, 2020, 09:28:15 PM
OD 16 mm
Length 12 mm
Bore 13.6 mm ID  X 6.2 mm deep.
Thread M9-1.25.

Time to make, about 10 minutes.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bt1_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bt3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bt4_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bt6_1.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 07, 2020, 09:36:54 PM
New electronic flasher, but no bracket... Use a rubber band or something else.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bnk1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bnk2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bnk3.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 08, 2020, 07:14:59 AM
Brand new, don't scratch it.
This will do until I get the rest of the bits for the distributor mod but that will be after it is run in and will be a new over size distributor body to take the stock cap (The Made in Italy for a Fiat 500 version)

The Dyna mount is some more bread board so a new plate to take the Greg Bender relay group, flasher unit and Dyna box.
Loose ends.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/d4_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/d5.jpg)

This guy is a genius so thanks for making the video.  :thumb: :thumb:
Loop distributor with hall effect sensor pick up, deadly.

https://youtu.be/Uo5DqKGnZzs
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 09, 2020, 09:00:49 PM
I tried a simple version time wise and bodged both, maybe the Deep Purple was to loud in my Qantas supplied Bose headphones.

I had another go this morning.
Left/Flasher unit, Middle/Greg Bender relay's, Right/Dyna Booster probably does nothing Box.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/pl3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/pl5.jpg)

Reduced from 6 mm thickness down to 4 mm to save weight.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/pl1.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 10, 2020, 09:01:40 PM
Wow, the box was well packed, all there and not a drama to be found... Fantastic.
I got another Lucas head light that does not have the pilot light so to be swapped out.

Some time ago I couldn't even buy HT terminals, fixed, including 2 metres of copper core HT lead and plenty of rubber parts.

The front brake cable is non switched so I got this mini Magura  switch.
The pitch measured 0.8 mm but the OD is bigger than 6 mm, more like 1/4" so thought UNF but that is 28 TPI and this gauged at 32 TPI.... Could it be 1/4" UNS (1/4 - 32) , I hope so, a tap is in the mail for next week and will break the rule again and mount it to the brake perch body unless some other place comes to mind.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/swh.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: pariah on July 16, 2020, 12:37:03 PM
Remarkable thread. Just read it from the start. Lovely work Les. You have any idea how much money you have into this so far? (Having just bought a 73 GT850 :) )
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 16, 2020, 06:34:02 PM
Remarkable thread. Just read it from the start. Lovely work Les. You have any idea how much money you have into this so far? (Having just bought a 73 GT850 :) )

Thanks, it (Your GT) looks like a good bike in the pictures (Maybe the front brake shoes are worn or 'something based on the lever angles and threaded adjusters)

I would do just as I wanted to do in the beginning, change the oils, maybe check the rocker clearances and ride it  (since it has Gilardoni's)  for a bit before thinking about digging to deep.
My bike started with the the universal near failing point so would suggest putting it on the centre stand in gear and rocking the back wheel, I would not want to see much more than 10 to 12 mm of movement out at the tyre.

The cost I am not sure of because this bike is an oddity, it looked like the 15000 mile bike it was sold as but every conceivable component that could wear out was pretty much just that.
I am not even sure if the paint is original, only someone knowledgeable could tell me that.
#
The bike cost around US$9000 landed in Australia, MGCycle got the most loyal custom/money @ US$5000 + post (Maybe $1000 over 14 orders) so there is $14000 off the bat.
Around 2000 at HMB... The ring and pinion was AU$799 locally and so on, the 1000SP gearbox from San Francisco AU$700, wiring loom US$462 so maybe $20000 + , (US$14k/$20k depending on the exchange rate over the last 8 + years)  that's why I joke about having 3 or 4 dollars invested in paint. (maybe a half roll of 'tin foil (and water) in the chrome restoration)

No offence meant to anyone, I do not build bikes to putt around the neighbourhood or dawdle down some back road, this will be a working bike which is why the cosmetics are as is but shown some respect given their age and condition, whatever that might be.
We will never know why it had worn out stock cylinders but already (ruined by chrome) on a first under size on the crankshaft, knurled internally valve guides.. etc etc.

In hindsight it would have been better (logically) as considered at the time (1 for 1 exchange rate) when the extent of wear was found, an incomplete 1100 or 8 valve bike imported to use its running gear for what would be a modern (disc) Loop Eldorado but it it would have been a Loop in name only.

The irony is I might now be one of the most knowledgeable people on the planet regarding the 1973 2LS brake Eldorado who has never ridden a Moto Guzzi.

The Mk2a 850 is up on the table the Moto Guzzi vacated, the 1949 Sunbeam up on another, War of the Worlds continues....... Spring is closer than it was yesterday and have wondered how far I could go on my BWS/Zuma 125 with my lightest camping gear.


Back to the (not yet) Spring clean.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on July 17, 2020, 01:38:06 AM
Getting some mileage out of that bread board.
A push fit in the lower manifold cap screws for no melty wires or Mr Bean floorboard foot entanglements.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rt6.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rt8.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/cft.jpg)

Who would have thought, that was a very long circle and ended up using the Pazon (NZ) HT leads in the end.
The HT lead I got (2 metres) from the UK was OK and stainless steel core but like a wet noodle, these leads are copper core and quite HD in construction.
I got new NGK caps but they only had the short version in brown but got a pair anyway, they actually fit better and of course the colour goes nicely with the Made in Italy 'brown distributor cap.  :wink:
I made a press to fit the coil end right angle terminal to the lead.
Not bad in the end at around 6 months to fit HT leads.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/vb.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Mayor_of_BBQ on July 23, 2020, 12:12:50 PM
jeeze les, this is a pretty wild thread. I certainly hope you dont put a few kms on this bike and say "nah, guzzi isnt for me!"

Would be a real shame if you had to export it to the US for sale  :popcorn:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 01, 2020, 07:10:34 PM
I forgot to mention, from nearly a week ago on my FB page.

Quote
I got a little side tracked this morning and in that side track I passed the 1973 Moto Guzzi Eldorado that sits in the living room... I got it way back in 2011 with it arriving in Australia early 2012 after being missing for some 3 months between New York and Australia, of course when it got here (Port of Sydney) it was road freighted 900 kms to Queensland then back 900 kms to NSW where I lived ?? but finally it arrived only to find it was totally worn out.... I worked on it every now and again over the years and stopped counting when it went over $20000 all in, I did start it once back in 2012 but the engine was weak and it never ran again since that day, not even ridden.......... So this morning I am opening the back windows and it occurred to me having made a new coil lead days ago, if I was to hook the battery ($250) up and add some fuel, maybe it would start so I did both then just stood there wondering what would happen given I had this bike down to the last nut, bolt and wire.............. I give it some choke and hit the starter button and it just winds over, Ohhh well........... Hmmm, then I look on the police dash, maybe the push/pull kill switch is not in for Go but out for Go so pull it out and try again.......... It started instantly for the first time in over eight years.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on August 01, 2020, 08:51:59 PM
 :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Klinkhammer on August 05, 2020, 04:43:31 AM
Great news :laugh:
Have been following this thread for a long time. Fantastic job. Very inspiring!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 05, 2020, 05:45:11 PM
 :thumb: :thumb:

Its not over until its over so its still the threads that just keeps giving .  :laugh:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bat.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 05, 2020, 06:04:06 PM
Might be one of the fanciest hitch pins, fully machined, done within the hour.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/pin.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 05, 2020, 09:01:29 PM

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/bat6.jpg)

1968.
Never take things to seriously.  :laugh:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/thumbnail_Image%20_1_.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 06, 2020, 02:05:32 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bt8.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 06, 2020, 02:08:18 AM
https://youtu.be/gp5JCrSXkJY
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 12, 2020, 08:00:44 PM
Not much to report.

There are quite a few small things to finish, the gear box breather is done incorporating a banjo from a Norton Commando rocker oil feed line.

This might be a bad idea but the crank case reed breather will not have a hose to who knows where but a small tank that will expel in the location where the original coil bracket is on the frame so it better be air and not any form of oil.
It will be the last time consuming mod.

50 mm x 92 mm with 6 mm radius corners top and bottom and to be split to become a top and bottom once hollowed out.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/baff.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 12, 2020, 08:01:58 PM
https://youtu.be/2Qs1J612nZs
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: pariah on August 13, 2020, 11:04:21 AM
Remarkable work Les.

That battery post made me laugh. Talk about detail..
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 15, 2020, 07:24:50 PM
Remarkable work Les.

That battery post made me laugh. Talk about detail..

You can blame Greg Bender and his loom that needs some battery connections (relay power etc)  :laugh:

I did stack them all up on one connection of the cheesy stock terminals but made those things (Maybe it comes back to being a Boilermaker/Welder by trade so don't mind the extra time with this winging it machining stuff)

There are still details to finish.
I was to cheap to buy one of those fuel line 'Crosses so made one from spare Dellorto parts including two of the gauze discs.
In hindsight it was not to smart bolting it to the air box plate because if they needed cleaning for some reason half the bike needs to be removed to get to the head of that bolt to separate the body so needs modifying and change the routing of the fuel lines... The beat up paint stays for the ride.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rty.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/fti.jpg)



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 15, 2020, 07:36:25 PM
I read that the gearbox can vent oil, why is beyond me unless the hose is going downward.

I modified the MGC sourced fitting with an M8 thread on the outer end and bleed hole @ 12:O clock.
One expansion tank and the inner fitting is from a OEM Norton Commando rocker oil feed line as it became surplus being replaced with a braided Venhill kit)

(How unimpressed was I to find that expensive vent hose fitting advertised as stainless steel turned out to be cheap aluminium, moly paste applied to avoid any form of future galling in the gearbox thread)

It simply gets a small clear riser hose so any oil can be seen. (curiosity mostly)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/opl.jpg)

The last thing I need is oil on my WhiteWalls.


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on August 16, 2020, 01:04:14 AM
That's a Great looking bike Les :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 16, 2020, 08:22:41 PM
Thanks Bill.
Some careful cutting and filing got a slight weight refund for all that added brass.

With the coil relocated to the battery area, the old bracket was redundant and in the way a bit.

How's that can of VHT paint that just keeps giving.
There was a little weld undercut but let it go.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/x.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ghy.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 16, 2020, 08:31:04 PM
I had forgotten about mirrors, the bike had those round things more suited to Pee Wee Herman's Schwinn bicycle so just ordered two TEX / UK mirrors.
Not round, not rectangular.

 (https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/s-l1600.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 17, 2020, 06:26:10 PM
I had noticed when fitting the rear brake switch it was somewhat finicky and access to it for adjustment would be a PITA.
As it was the switch had to be at the lowest point in the mount plates slots for the L arm to have a reasonable clearance to a frame tube which had marks on it from being in contact.

Any future adjustment a 5 minute job now and no chance of frame contact.
I'll thank myself one day.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bra.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/33.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/11_3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/gh_1.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Chuck in Indiana on August 18, 2020, 06:59:18 PM
Les, you have done some *really* nice rotary table work. It's almost a lost art since cnc took over. Attaboy! :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: SoCalBreva750 on August 19, 2020, 03:59:48 AM
Les, I don't even feel qualified to comment on all the work that you've done to the Eldorado, but had to at least say something after spending several hours reading from start to finish. There is quite possibly nothing more important or satisfying than looking back at a project completed knowing that everything you did was done to the best of your ability.  Well done! Your creativity, ingenuity and persistence are an inspiration.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 23, 2020, 05:32:19 AM
Thanks for the replies, I will post up in the morning (How bad is it when you think it is Saturday and your phone tells you it is Sunday)

The fuel tank is held to the frame by a couple of longish 8 mm bolts and nuts.
To put the nut on the left or the right side.

Custom bolts will have the next caretaker of the bike scratching their head with a bit of luck.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bt_1.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on August 23, 2020, 07:26:06 AM
You are nuts! In the best way possible of course!   :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 23, 2020, 06:29:06 PM
My new English neighbours might prefer eccentric, works for me.  :laugh:
A sunny day and good reason to go find some new hardware for the windscreen (I didn't realise it was so old, dated 2002)

10 seconds and worked like a dream.
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ct_1.jpg)

Fuel tank bolt.
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bt_2.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 23, 2020, 06:35:34 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bt2.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on August 23, 2020, 10:27:35 PM
That bolt is extra sneaky Les.
Also in the best possible way :bow: :thumb: :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 24, 2020, 12:34:23 AM
I might have to do one for the Harpo seat also.

After over 200 kms total to south of the river and back I found new 1/4" hardware for the Police type windscreen.
Its either the same as it had or 99% the same, close enough.

https://www.anzor.com.au/

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/scr.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on August 24, 2020, 06:37:12 AM
Well............it was a nice day for a ride, so you killed two birds with one stone eh mate :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 25, 2020, 07:11:44 AM
The (2002 dated) windscreen is rejuvenated.
Chrome tin foiled, the screen polished with plastic polish and the new 1/4" UNC hardware cut to length via a simple threaded and split holder.

I will make some adaptor mounts tomorrow.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/jig.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/mnts.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/sct.jpg)

I took another look at the front brake with a machined spacer to move the backing plate outward and allow the axle to be torqued and see the shoes, I think it should be OK once bed in.
The Left hand / Right hand adjuster makes setting the rear shoe all but easy.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/adj_1.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 25, 2020, 07:41:15 AM
Les, you have done some *really* nice rotary table work. It's almost a lost art since cnc took over. Attaboy! :thumb:

Thanks Chuck, I misquoted/ Had a senior moment the other day so deleted the reply.

A 10 inch rotary table was the next purchase after a decent machine vice quite some years ago now (Both are in storage in NZ still) but get by with this smaller one.
I would like some form of CNC mind you.

Les, I don't even feel qualified to comment on all the work that you've done to the Eldorado, but had to at least say something after spending several hours reading from start to finish. There is quite possibly nothing more important or satisfying than looking back at a project completed knowing that everything you did was done to the best of your ability.  Well done! Your creativity, ingenuity and persistence are an inspiration.

I apologise for that time you will never get back.  :laugh:
Sometimes I wonder if it will ever end but will endeavour to finish it as far as done with no more after being put into use. (Not an ongoing project)

The fuel lines have been cut and rerouted and the fuel junction turned so it can have the filter discs cleaned if need be without having to access the inside of the air box.
The old alloy centre was retained and a Acetyl body done on the 'rotary table to hold it.
I would not normally want anything in the air box that could if it came loose damage the engine so it has M4 studs that recess into the alloy centre with Loctite 680 and the Nylocs got some wicking 290.
 
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/vnt_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/12_2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hhj.jpg)

I made a second one that was deeper to take more thread and of course it took half the time, I turned the three jaw chuck into a offset version via a packer to push the hole off centre.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/os.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/thumbnail_Image_1.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on August 25, 2020, 07:16:34 PM
It's a beauty Les :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on August 26, 2020, 01:31:22 PM
I must say, you haven't posted many full frame pictures where you can see the bike in all it's glory, but it looks fantastic!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 26, 2020, 08:34:28 PM
 :thumb:

The windscreen brackets, I need to machine a 30 mm radius to those risers to suit the mounts that came on the bike.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/mt1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/mt2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/mt3.jpg)

A band saw one day.... Some hand sawing of 40 x 25 bar for extra exercise.
Will I use the screen, maybe, probably but either way the mounts will be there made.
8 mm holes and M 8 to be tapped.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/mt4.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 27, 2020, 12:43:29 AM
Recessed cap-screw in the centre, Helicoil at the threaded hole.
I took the easy option and did the radius in the vice with a boring head set to 60 mm.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/mt5.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 27, 2020, 06:59:45 AM
Its to hard to get an accurate picture/photo but I broke out the Never-Dull and gave the fuel tank chrome panels a light polish, from 47 years old to maybe 10 years in a few minutes.
It even works on chrome plated plastic as on Lucas indicators without scratching.
Its a great product.

http://www.nevrdull.com/

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/nd3.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 28, 2020, 01:43:29 AM
Just a quick 180 km run today to get some brass and some sundry fasteners... We are only days away from Spring now and perfect riding weather is already here... The hot will be here before Christmas.

No point in cutting corners now, it looks like the screen and mounts will account for a couple of days easily if not more.

https://www.blackhawkmetals.com.au/brass/

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/bss.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on August 30, 2020, 05:00:28 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/wsh2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/wsh1.jpg)

Dan Brown panniers now.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 04, 2020, 06:45:53 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/gg4.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ffg.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: s1120 on September 04, 2020, 07:23:00 AM
I gotta say those spacer/washers look so cool!!  Just a wild little detail
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on September 04, 2020, 06:52:53 PM
Everything you do is beautiful Les. Can't wait for you to ride it :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 06, 2020, 02:19:38 AM
It's almost a case of, all dressed up and nowhere to go.
#
I meant to do this when the engine still had the heads off.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ptr.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on September 06, 2020, 04:23:53 AM
No idea what that is Les.  :huh: :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 06, 2020, 05:37:10 AM
It fits to the threaded hole to the right of the lower generator pulley for ignition setting.
The alloy disc gets degree calibrations for both cylinders but with one set of points any discrepancy would be hard to rectify.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on September 06, 2020, 06:44:59 PM
It fits to the threaded hole to the right of the lower generator pulley for ignition setting.
The alloy disc gets degree calibrations for both cylinders but with one set of points any discrepancy would be hard to rectify.

Clear as mud Les :grin: I have to admit :embarrassed: But it's a terrific piece of work :thumb: and I won't ask anymore stupid questions :angel:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 06, 2020, 08:16:08 PM
No such thing as a stupeed question Bill.

The gismo will work with these marks but all will be at the front of the pulley instead of at the rear as per stock.

TDC - 10 - 20 with 2 increments to 38 full advance.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dsc5.jpg)

I used the advance springs that were in the distributor (iirc) which were not the same (They might be the stock ones)
The crankshaft degree wheel of truth will soon tell me what is going on as far as the advance curve (Charlie M did say something about the springs but forget what it was as far as spring replacement and the curve being fast or slow.)

It will get another set of degree lines for the other cylinder.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 06, 2020, 08:19:26 PM
The pointer (block) is not permanent, only fit / removed at timing checking. (I like all maintenance to be easy or as easy as can be)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 07, 2020, 12:02:18 AM
No more bolts in the generator belt drive flange, studs (Made from three of the original M6 sump/pan bolts) will make it easier to fit the belt.

PCD on the flange fasteners is 50 mm.
The spacer plates for belt tension are replaced with a single alloy spacer (for now)
The timing marks will be easier to see and the two TDC marks will make valve adjustment easier also.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dsk8.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dsk9.jpg)

A first for milling graduated lines and was surprised how well they came out using a 1 mm drill in the chuck with the smallest stick out at high speed.
The large lines are 0.2mm deep, the smaller 0.1mm deep with multiple passes.

To easy, start engine, shine timing light to see where the finger is pointing.  :laugh:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dsk4.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Canuck750 on September 07, 2020, 09:19:31 PM
You could market that, stunning!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on September 07, 2020, 10:14:30 PM
Now I get it!!!
Excellent :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Pescatore on September 07, 2020, 10:30:51 PM
Wow, it even resembles a finger!!! I have never seen so much detailed milling work.
A selfish thought: I don't want this quest to end.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 10, 2020, 03:16:24 AM
If I keep losing things it may very well go on until the end of time if not longer.
Carburettor synchronisation hose fittings somewhere unknown so had to make some.

(https://accumate.co.uk/fl070001.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/tb5.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/tb2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ff_1.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on September 10, 2020, 04:13:50 AM
Boy, it looks good Les :grin: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 11, 2020, 04:55:18 PM
The long and winding road.

Its all the small bits now, the knob/wheel ? on the DIY dipstick came loose as I found out one day and then had to double nut it for removal.
It now has Loctite 660 and a M3 10 mm long SS grub screw (at the 6:00 position installed :wink:) to stop any detachment.
When I got the bike it had one of those pull to remove dipsticks but it did not reach the oil, this one does so should be handy.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ds1_1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ds2_1.jpg)

 (https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/weg.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 25, 2020, 05:05:15 AM
I moved it from the living room to the garage, the last time it was there was when it was unloaded as a bare frame and storage bins from the Interstate move.
It got a tune put on it a day or so back and runs like a champ so will most likely get a roadworthy next week in preparation for registration.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis_1.jpg)
 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on September 26, 2020, 11:11:54 AM
I can hear the drum roll starting!!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 26, 2020, 05:37:26 PM
Its running very nicely Dave but spent yesterday replacing that silly DIY fuel cross pretty much to the first but unmade version.
Now it is simply the two fittings back to back with the gauze filter between them with a small brass collar to centralise things.

 (https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/crs.jpg)

The reality is I could ride it within an hour.
I did get another distributor to do the electronic conversion but that can be for another time and was surprised to find the timing for both cylinders was exactly the same.
The stock distributor seems to do a fine job including both the same at full advance.

The tank is ready to refit and seat and then a general check over, its getting hot here now and still Spring.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: balvenie on September 26, 2020, 06:10:22 PM
Getting a bit warm, Les? Go for a ride on that custom made motorcycle and you won't notice a thing :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on September 27, 2020, 06:17:04 PM
I just got back from filling my petrol container so anything is possible.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on September 30, 2020, 04:44:09 PM
 :popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 02, 2020, 04:26:43 AM
I have 4.7 miles on the odometer.
It runs OK but the power seems very average and the sooty plugs now confirmed to be weak spark.

Maybe it is the new condenser but will have to start swapping parts to find the cause.
I had noted the new points seemed of poor quality an fit so maybe they have some input.

I had suspected the stock V1000 jetting at first (not wanting to believe it was ignition being all new parts even though the plugs clearly showed it)
I will have to troubleshoot that and picked up some bungs to weld into the old headers so I can fit Bosch O2 sensors (Of course the desired location is under the floorboards so not straight forward) 
 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: s1120 on October 02, 2020, 07:33:12 AM
Nice to hear you got a few miles on her anyways.. Im sure the rest can be sorted quickly.

It does just go to show that no matter the care put into something there is still ALWAYS something that bites you!! :)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 02, 2020, 03:44:13 PM
In all honesty I am hoping it is something I have installed or set up incorrectly (with the ignition as a complete package) which would be an easy fix if I found the problem.

Of course not having any benchmark to gauge against it might actually be running fine, the engine is very smooth running and accelerates briskly but seems odd to me like something is off a little.  (The heavy flywheel is very noticeable)

I will check and reset everything this morning to see if the spark at the plugs looks healthier including the new points which seemed of very average quality as far as fit up. (The contacts are out of alinement by quite a bit and only touch on one side)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 03, 2020, 12:37:58 AM
Plugs checked at 0.023"
Points at 0.017"
Timing reset.
Another cap, rotor and condenser and cranked over (with the plugs out against the engine case)
No change so I guess that is normal.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: s1120 on October 03, 2020, 06:49:24 AM
Of course as per the very first start, it is one push of the button, not endless cranking........ Maybe I am chasing fairies.

Heck... my California Stone you need to crank a bit after its been sitting a few weeks, and thats a modern electronic ing, and FI!
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 05, 2020, 01:59:46 AM
Looks like it was this bit in the distributor, the shaft was way out of round, fixed.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/grd.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/aa.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis9.jpg)

https://docs.rs-online.com/374e/0900766b800b6bc2.pdf

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/disk6.jpg)

1.1 mm thick ground both sides.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/v1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/v.jpg)





Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on October 12, 2020, 01:40:39 PM
Very interesting Les, do you have a standard ignition box to work with your custom distributor?  And lovely work as always of course.

How did you hold the disk while grinding the second side? Superglue?

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on October 12, 2020, 04:20:29 PM
Very interesting Les, do you have a standard ignition box to work with your custom distributor?  And lovely work as always of course.

How did you hold the disk while grinding the second side? Superglue?

I think Les is building a system like this, only much nicer.
https://youtu.be/Uo5DqKGnZzs
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on October 13, 2020, 07:06:41 PM
Absolutely, this is the work of Tommy Pettersen and am very grateful he took the time to make that video.
I did post the video link but it is probably a page or so back.

On order is an ignition module (Tridon 7 pin TIM018) and another Bosch coil (TCI # 0221122399) so will have to wait for those bits to do a direct comparison.
 #
The wing is 54 and machined so its leading edge is parallel to the sensor on entry and the trailing edge is parallel exiting.
Since this picture I made a small press mandrel to reshape the portion that holds the rotor, it was a little out of shape.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis00.jpg)

The trigger plate started as 50 x 6 mm steel flat bar (I had some) and was initially cut with a hole saw (boilermaker content)
I wondered if it being fairly close to the sensor it might have a continuous magnetic effect so it has a Acetyl holder and that small disc on top.
Hopefully only the wings will be seen by the sensor now.

I am not sure where it (trigger) should be in relation to the rotor contact so that needs to be looked into then the holes drilled in the alloy flange.
It can be done once it is operational and have the modified cap to see what is going on in there.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis000.jpg)

I have no idea about these things but with all that commotion going on with the rotor and cap contacts I made this Acetyl disc so it is somewhat isolated from the sensor.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis0.jpg)

The disc was simply ground (at 6 mm thick) then in the lathe reduced to around 1.3 mm then held via a cap screw against the rotary table jaws to do the the other side.
That would be 90 passes per side., the wings measured via micrometre were within the same 0.001" so will put that down to luck more than anything.
#
The bike runs fine by all accounts but I do not know what fine is really, to me it has an odd feeling and that might be the carburetion off a little or perhaps the advance (5 static / 33 full but at the actual rpm unknown) curve is slow (springs ?) so will have to get some form of rev counter to check that.

Some would say if it is running it is fine  :laugh: but I do not get the stock distributor, it seems like it is modified (hence the long rotor contact compared to a Fiat 500 rotor, short) so wonder what the points dwell is for both cylinders given the one long, one short duration cam on the distributor (to get the 135 with a 180 poles distributor cap)
If this electronic conversion (The dwell and coil saturation set by the module and equal ?) makes a difference then that might be part of it.
#
I did not want to wreck the stock header pipes but have two fittings to weld in for the A/F meter to see what is going on with the jetting (or not) typically the needed location is under the floor boards.
#
I did check the crankshaft end float and it is 0.2mm (0.008") seems about right.

That's about it.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on October 14, 2020, 04:23:12 PM
Thanks for the post Les,

It looks like something I might have to do also on mine. Let us hear how it works compared to the stock points.

You can make a little pipe for the lamba sensor to install in the back of the exhaust that will loop the exhaust gas around the sensor. It will probably not be as accurate as a plug in the proper position to take the readings, but at least it gives you an idea on how things look. I bought a AFR500 air/fuel kit a while ago but have been too busy with kids, work and restoring the house to try it out.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on November 03, 2020, 01:00:48 AM
My back ordered Bosch TCI coil and TIM018 ignition module turned up so can finish the distributor.
As Dave will know I did some work on the Norton while waiting.

If the right angle drive looks familiar, it is the Moto Guzzi arm that was machined for the shift linkage but a bit of a no surprise failure.
I am doing a new one but with a split and 6 mm pinch bolt so it remains tight.

I needed to machine a jig to make 0.25 mm x 70 mm x 58 mm stainless steel shims to reduce the crankshaft end float down from a loose 0.032" to now acceptable 0.012".

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/arm6.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/brg.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/dl1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/s2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/s4.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/s7.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/s8.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/s44.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/s55.jpg)

Rods are prepped and ready for a light polish, new forged bolts with new nuts.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/Rod1.jpg)



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on November 05, 2020, 03:19:04 PM
Those rods look to pretty to use!   :cheesy:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on December 09, 2020, 09:03:32 PM
Just keeping the shine on the inside Dave.  :grin:

The NOS AE pistons got the prep also.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/piston.jpg)

The Postie just dropped these off for the Moto Guzzi so I can get back to addressing the slop in the shift linkage and a new arm to suit them (which was 70% of the problem)
Its probably getting to hot here now to ride old air cooled bikes.
We are lucky that AU is opening the borders again so it is Tasmania on the Africa Twin early next year.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/jnts.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on January 17, 2021, 06:46:41 AM
Just keeping the shine on the inside Dave.  :grin:

The NOS AE pistons got the prep also.


Tell me how you polished those pistons! 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on February 05, 2021, 03:38:34 PM
With care Dave, the tops are lapped to a certain lustre, not to shiny, not to not shiny.
Autosol on the sides only and then washed with acetone twice.

Only small things done on the Eldorado, one being another arm for the connection from the FB to the linkage up to the gearbox arm.
This one has a clamp, the first one did not and had a slight amount of slop which was noticeable, this one has 50 mm centres over the 43 mm of the last one and uses a stock ? dog leg connector rod on the riser linkage. (straight before)
The ball joints turned out to be a no go so the stock clevis's are retained with 'maybe 1/4"OD x 1/2" long shouldered bolts replacing the clevis pins.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/arm.jpg)

The arm at the end of the heel toe shifter was worn badly (and will straighten it from some past owner cranking the bolt until it deformed) at the clevis hole so I reamed the old clevis and arm hole oversize.
That meant a custom clevis pin to suit.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/p1_1.jpg)

Looks like a 47 year old semi neglected parts on the outside.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/p2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/pi1.jpg)

Then pressed with the fox wedge and splined shaft in place.
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/pi2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/pi3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/pi4.jpg)


The LamontSanfurd sourced Brembo caliper (Moto Guzzi fitment)is now mounted on the Norton via a machined adapter along with titanium hardware.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/brk1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/brk2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ti.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/cal.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/dr3%20-%20Copy.jpg)

He also has a set of later alloy rocker plate components in the mail to me which I will fit to the Eldorado.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rck.png)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis3.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: 1down5up on February 09, 2021, 07:18:09 PM
Will those rocker plates fit? I thought the square heads had the cylinder studs pushed further out to allow for larger bore
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on February 09, 2021, 08:09:44 PM
No and yes.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: 1down5up on February 13, 2021, 12:46:53 AM
Also may be worth checking that the oil galley hole is in the same spot.

The feed for the square heads is obviously different, but not sure if the little rocker feed holes are in the same spot relitive to the stud holes.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on February 17, 2021, 01:45:50 AM
I will look into it when they get here, nearly two weeks and still in the processing stage of USPS but a sign of the times unless sent by courier.

There is no real interest in this sort of thing so pretty much flagged it but have prepped up the electronic distributor which has massive amounts of end float on both the main shaft and advance unit which would not suit the hall effect sensor.
There is probably four hours in the rework of a points distributor, this one probably has numerous days all up.
There are quite a few mods to get the advancer very smooth in operation.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis4.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis7.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis99.jpg)

The spark plug threads had some wear so with the steel rocker mounts needing removal I might as well do what I should have done last year so will get some M14 -1.25 Time- Serts.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on February 18, 2021, 03:27:41 PM
Looks very good Les,

What caused the high end float and how did you fix it?

-Ulrik
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on February 19, 2021, 05:32:47 PM
The bikes original points distributor needed a bronze shim added (18 x 10 x 1.2 mm) above the camshaft driven drive gear to set the end float at 0.2 mm (0.008") as did this replacement distributor.
The difference was there is a steel shim washer and plastic (or similar, maybe Bakelite) shim washer that the main shaft seats on in the bottom of the distributor body (cup)
Both had those two shims except in the base of the body, the original one is raised for them to seat on, this replacement distributor (which still had the original drive gear pin in place looking untouched) is recessed and it did not look worn so there was still a lot of end float.
I put all the parts in the tin at disassembly so do not think a part (larger washer) was lost (who knows)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ds2_2.jpg)

I machined a 24 x 12.5 x 1 mm Acetyl washer so it also now has around 0.2 mm end float.
The advance mechanism also had end float so it got a 11 x 7 x 0.75 mm Acetyl shim under it and then the shaft was ground so it has maybe 0.015" float.
The washer raising the unit also made it rotate smoothly which is did not do previously.
There is only around 1 mm above and below the trigger arm plate as it passes through the sensor so it needs to be fairly precise to avoid a drama.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ds1_2.jpg)

It makes a small noise when the plate is at that exit point so maybe it is close enough (being non adjustable now without upsetting the cap pole to rotor relationship)

The ID of the distributor body is machined so is irreversible (it was not round)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis88.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis55.jpg)

Here is the oddity (folk of the if it manages to start it is fine, look away  :grin:)

Every Loop video I have watched (Except for the one with a C5 ignition) which is probably near all of them on YouTube to me sounded like they had a weak cylinder, not bad weak but something odd sounding, this bike was no different, 99% good but something odd, I will call it a lazy cylinder.

I had bought two of the brown FIRE brand caps and rotors from Italy, these are a very nice cap but of course then found the rotor is not going to work in a Moto Guzzi.
I had wondered why the arm on the that OEM rotor was so long but nothing beyond that until I saw that Fiat rotor.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/Fiat.jpg)

In the Tommy Pettersen video (A big thanks once again for us electrically challenged folk) it says the sensor signals as the plate leaves it but I needed to see what the cap and rotor were doing at that position so I milled this brand new cap purchased years ago (You know to fit after the oil change, Gilardoni's and ride it in 2012 ?)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uo5DqKGnZzs

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis5_2.jpg)

This meant I could (with the dual read out ignition degree disc on the front pulley) check that each trigger paddle ? (by eye) looked to be parallel with the sensor at exit on each cylinder (yes they are machined so they are parallel entering and exiting the sensor) and then be able to rotate that unit on the shaft until the cap poles were in the best position for each cylinder (before drilling and fixing the trigger plate to the shaft)

I am hoping it will all work with no rework besides setting with a timing light.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dsk4.jpg)

Here (to me) is where it gets murky.
This distributor seems to be altered to work in a 90 V twin and that ? is where that long arm on the rotor comes into it (or not ?)
The arm extension (I forget) either adds or takes way to gain the needed 135 (90 / 180) which a Fiat engine would not need being a parallel twin ?
The narrow and wide (extended?) points cam lobes surely alter the dwell (and ignition coil saturation ?) on each cylinder.

When I put that machined cap on with the points distributor (out of curiosity) it enables the points to be seen and also where the rotor was to the cap poles (at static and fully advanced)
I was amazed the engine manages to run based on the arm to cap pole at those 4 positions and believe that is part of the lazy cylinder sound.

Because the sensor trigger plate allowed it to be positioned at the better all round position then removed for the drilling of the M3 fasteners it should be better but not perfect.
Perhaps this is part of the reason the dual point distributor was introduced.

At this 'point (points distributor) the Eldorado has not only a lighter throttle action (stock springs) but also starts quicker than my F.I Honda Arica Twin. (It would need to do at least one extra cranking turn having a cam shaft position sensor)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on February 19, 2021, 05:46:03 PM
The short version.
When the distributor body is rotated to set the points opening point it is also altering the relationship between the rotor arm and distributor cap poles.
Not a big problem in a Fiat but in the Moto Guzzi (Loop) that is either adding to or robbing that relationship because each end of the arm is being used.
That I saw with the open top cap.

Maybe this distributor will give me 60 mpg @ 60 mph as a bonus.


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on February 20, 2021, 04:06:03 PM
Anti magnetic (I hope) cups for the M3 dome heads, they will get a smidge of blue Loctite then the cups sealed over with silicone.
Its not that I don't trust electrical parts but maybe I do now.

With the sensor using magnetism to trigger I want that trigger to have as little outside interference as possible.
The metal trigger plate is incased in a Acetyl body and a Acetyl disc locates in the distributor body below the rotor.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/cup.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis000.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis67.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on February 25, 2021, 04:47:25 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/DSC02120%20_Small_.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/DSC02147Small.JPG)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on February 25, 2021, 08:17:56 PM
The California II top end parts arrived today.
All in very nice low mile condition.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on February 27, 2021, 03:21:34 PM
Done.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Scout63 on February 28, 2021, 02:27:53 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/DSC02120%20_Small_.JPG)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/DSC02147Small.JPG)

Beautiful work Les.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Rick4003 on February 28, 2021, 03:25:18 PM
The short version.
When the distributor body is rotated to set the points opening point it is also altering the relationship between the rotor arm and distributor cap poles.
Not a big problem in a Fiat but in the Moto Guzzi (Loop) that is either adding to or robbing that relationship because each end of the arm is being used.
That I saw with the open top cap.

Maybe this distributor will give me 60 mpg @ 60 mph as a bonus.

So the right way to have done it originally was to have a distributor cap with poles 135 degrees apart instead of 180 degrees? And the cost effective solution was to extent the reach/length of the rotor arm tip?

Makes sense that they changed to the dual points distributor that should rule all this out and make it possible to adjust both cylinders accurately.

Thanks for the good write up on the problem and I look forward to hear if your fix solved the problem.

And very nice machining of the intake manifold. TLR/SV1000?
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 07, 2021, 03:26:08 AM
Also may be worth checking that the oil galley hole is in the same spot.

The feed for the square heads is obviously different, but not sure if the little rocker feed holes are in the same spot relative to the stud holes.

The oil feed holes are at the same location, only the stud spacing moved.

On the steel mounts 98.5 mm x 57 mm.
On the California II mounts 104 mm x 60 mm.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/plt.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/hyu.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/Mod8.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 07, 2021, 03:34:08 AM
So the right way to have done it originally was to have a distributor cap with poles 135 degrees apart instead of 180 degrees? And the cost effective solution was to extent the reach/length of the rotor arm tip?

Makes sense that they changed to the dual points distributor that should rule all this out and make it possible to adjust both cylinders accurately.

Thanks for the good write up on the problem and I look forward to hear if your fix solved the problem.

And very nice machining of the intake manifold. TLR/SV1000?

It is probably not a problem to most folk if the engine runs with the stock distributor.

There is still the rotor to cap pole limitation with the Tommy Pettersen modded distributor but with trigger plate being movable (until pinned) some mucking around with the open top cap got a better position which can not be done with the stock version.

#
Those manifolds were to suit Honda SP1 TB's and later got 61 mm SP2 TB's.
I have two 1998 TL1000S's, one bought in 2000, the other in 2004, both in the lock up along with H2's and bevel Ducati's.
- has put a stop to any chance of getting them in a shipping container until ? 2022.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 08, 2021, 01:55:01 AM
There is little point posting this in the main forum.

I noticed this video today having Moto Guzzi in my YouTube.

Not only was the old filter not particularly tight but the new one might have gone on two turns.
The thread pitch on the to short from the Moto Guzzi factory spigot in the sump is 1.5 or two turns of the filter would be only 3 mm of engagement.

No wonder they can loosen (apparently)
My sump is modified so the filter screws on at least 4 turns (probably more but forget) or more than double the amount of the stock set up. (8 mm iirc)

Anyone get it ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OiCN9sM9BzY
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 08, 2021, 01:56:53 AM
Just one person in the whole world who might have noticed this obscure thread in passing would do.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: bmc5733946 on March 08, 2021, 05:47:55 AM
No oil on gasket????!!!! Mike won't be working on my bike!!

Brian
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 08, 2021, 03:30:25 PM
I rest my case.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 11, 2021, 05:05:22 AM
The 1954 Sunbeam S7 Deluxe is sold so only have one now (The first year 1949)
Two brothers bought it for their father and were delivering (unknown to him) it tonight after picking it up, I am happy it went to a good home.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/sunbeams7deluxe/Three.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on March 11, 2021, 08:46:51 AM
Have you seen this photo?

Gendarmerie, on Sunbeam S8 motorcycles, waiting to Escort Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Lisbon, in 1957

(https://i.ibb.co/XD2Nbyv/Gendarmerie-on-Sunbeam-S8-motorcycles-waiting-to-Escort-Queen-Elizabeth-II-on-her-visit-to-Lisbon-in.jpg) (https://ibb.co/XD2Nbyv)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 11, 2021, 04:04:05 PM
Can't say I have seen that photo.

The photo description should say S7 Deluxe (the S8 from 1949 on was the skinny wheel/ mud guard model with BSA forks and non cantilever sprung seat)
S7 Deluxe / S8 production was over by 1956 starting in 1949.

https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/1949-sunbeam-s8

I seem to remember the Scout guy (Moto Guzzi parts) has or had a S7 Deluxe.



Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 15, 2021, 06:05:15 AM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/rrt.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/slve%20-2.jpg)

VHB30 manifolds from Germany ready for the original 32 mm PHF Dellorto's off my 1981 Ducati 900SD.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/mn1.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 16, 2021, 07:21:56 PM
(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/crb%202.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 16, 2021, 10:57:58 PM
Both carburetors needed to swing out a fraction, the 0 to - 1mm taper gasket machining jig did the job.  :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Gasket holes look to be 33.25 mm from the hole on the right to the holes on the left then 27.5 mm out to each of those holes (fwiw which wont be much)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/gsk.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: s1120 on March 17, 2021, 08:06:59 AM
I will look into it when they get here, nearly two weeks and still in the processing stage of USPS but a sign of the times unless sent by courier.

There is no real interest in this sort of thing so pretty much flagged it but have prepped up the electronic distributor which has massive amounts of end float on both the main shaft and advance unit which would not suit the hall effect sensor.
There is probably four hours in the rework of a points distributor, this one probably has numerous days all up.
There are quite a few mods to get the advancer very smooth in operation.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis4.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis7.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/dis99.jpg)

The spark plug threads had some wear so with the steel rocker mounts needing removal I might as well do what I should have done last year so will get some M14 -1.25 Time- Serts.


Back in the days before affordable good aftermarket dist's for US V8 powered cars, I was amazed how BAD most of the stock dist's were!!  I would spend hours rebuilding, swapping parts, and shimming, to get a good unit. As a low buck racer back then I had far more time, then money back then!!  Nice work, and the bike is coming along well!! 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 17, 2021, 06:01:05 PM
Paul, the bike was done some time ago now and ran like a champ from the first start.
The throttle action (stock VHB springs) is lighter than my F.I Africa Twin and the gear box shifts quieter than its DCT transmission.

Now we address what I heard on every running video bar one, this one and that is with non pumper Amal carburetors.
Its sounds crisp and a good deal of that will be the ignition. (This IE might be discontinued now for whatever reason)

1974 Eldorado 850 First Start C5 ignition.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhz8ep8fd68

#

Hopefully I can squeeze the PHF 32's in without having to move the air box but it should look 'fairly stock either way.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/trp%20-2.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 18, 2021, 12:42:57 AM
M48 / 1.25 threads to suit the Dellorto's and good to go for now.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/adt%202.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/phf.jpg)


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on March 18, 2021, 08:54:26 AM
Very nice!  :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 18, 2021, 05:50:42 PM
Thanks Charlie, appreciate it.  :thumb: :thumb:

I had found this post online (and was surprised to find 60/3 slides in these carburetors when 70/2's are stock)

https://www.guzzitech.com/forums/threads/dellorto-phf-32-carbs-for-850-t.5109/

I will need to sort out cables but want to keep the stock throttle.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/IMG_0322.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 18, 2021, 10:49:01 PM
These PHF's have been in dry storage for the best part of 31 years (I bought a PHM 40 mm Malossi kit @ $750 to replace them, which were replaced with Keihin 41 mm FCR's)
They were unbodgerated but a little sad looking so got a spray (a few times) with diluted DuraGloss 853 and washed off as soon as any white foam appeared then gone over with the trusty wood handle brass bristle wire brush followed by some Pledge.

Of course you need to be careful with any acid based product unless you want to turn them black hence washed off as soon as the white foam appeared.
I am glad they will get another go round, the last time I worked on them I was probably in my early/mid 20's.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/del1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/del2.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/del3.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 21, 2021, 06:26:33 PM
A (letterbox) parts delivery waiting game now
Hopefully the action will be as smooth as the VHB's and I get the same up to 60 imperial MPG as in the 1980's on the stock 900SD.
There is probably not much more I can do besides a cartridge fork to go with the Ikon's to make it the ultimate classic long distance tourer.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/crb3.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Dave Swanson on March 22, 2021, 08:11:00 AM
Les, when you said "quest" you weren't kidding!   :laugh:

The most impressive Guzzi build I have ever seen. 
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 22, 2021, 11:54:01 PM
Thanks Dave.  :thumb: but I will never be in your league let alone same galaxy.

If I can find that black paint can I should give the poor old battery tray a touch up.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Mayor_of_BBQ on March 25, 2021, 06:23:53 AM
Les, when you said "quest" you weren't kidding!   :laugh:

The most impressive Guzzi build I have ever seen.

I'm exhausted just following along and I havent turned a single wrench
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 29, 2021, 06:23:57 AM
I'm exhausted just following along and I havent turned a single wrench

I hear you, it must be the most mechanically loved Eldorado in these parts.

IIRC this is the gas cap surround I machined and sent you for free via ADV Rider.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/TrimRing.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 30, 2021, 07:44:05 PM
We are in three day lock down but tracking says the PHF jetting and other parts are due today.
I did not want to modify original parts but to get the 32 mm carburetors to fit, angled outward slightly using the original rubber air boot the air box needed to go rearward around 6 mm (1/4")
I decided to mill the battery tray lugs so there is a north/south 6 mm slot.

It now fits even easier than stock, place the air box with the top bolt in then push the bottom in a couple more mm for a great seal (It is sitting with the bottom bolts loose in the picture which can in n place at installation unlike stock)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/ab.jpg)

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 31, 2021, 04:37:46 PM
Another instalment for 'but if it was running fine, why not keep riding it.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/f1%20-%20Copy.jpg)

Almost looks stock ish.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/phf_1.jpg)

A rookie mistake and denial to some degree but the heads will need spark plug thread inserts for longggggg time reliability , they are wobbly enough to warrant it and would be stupidity if they failed in the future and you got stuck on a forest dirt road far from home.

I will use TimeSerts.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 31, 2021, 04:47:34 PM
Hard to believe a T4 frontend (LamontSanfurd eBay) (forks / triples / axle / 08 calipers) only reached US$102.50 / AU$134.88.
I had been tempted to ask about shipping cost (forks only) and bid for a if needed future disc conversion.

The front drum brake is OK but the cable (inline switch) is quite stretchy and will be replaced with a non switch version (have one) to see if there is an improvement.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on March 31, 2021, 07:15:06 PM
Hard to believe a T4 frontend (LamontSanfurd eBay) (forks / triples / axle / 08 calipers) only reached US$102.50 / AU$134.88.
I had been tempted to ask about shipping cost (forks only) and bid for a if needed future disc conversion.

The front drum brake is OK but the cable (inline switch) is quite stretchy and will be replaced with a non switch version (have one) to see if there is an improvement.

That was a good deal. Looks like an SP front end, not a T4 (which we never got in the US) though.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on March 31, 2021, 09:06:00 PM
That was a good deal. Looks like an SP front end, not a T4 (which we never got in the US) though.

I would have thought the calipers worth $50 each in the US alone but will get back to gaining forward motion again over stopping.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/frk.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: leroy_can on March 31, 2021, 11:22:40 PM
Hard to believe a T4 frontend (LamontSanfurd eBay) (forks / triples / axle / 08 calipers) only reached US$102.50 / AU$134.88.
I had been tempted to ask about shipping cost (forks only) and bid for a if needed future disc conversion.

The front drum brake is OK but the cable (inline switch) is quite stretchy and will be replaced with a non switch version (have one) to see if there is an improvement.
  I really like LamontSanfurd,s auctions I thought the 7/33 rear box from the same bike was going to be mine but got blown out of the water on it in the last 10 seconds. He gives good descriptions and clear pictures and has the balls to do true no reserve auctions starting at almost nothing. He does end up giving the odd item away but often gets people fighting over things in the last seconds. You can search anything on ebay and find 10,000 in a category then click on auction only and it drops to maybe 500 and lots of those are not really auctions because the starting bid is really a buy it now price. Also living in Canada I know if you get a shipping quote from Sanfurd it is very reasonable.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 01, 2021, 02:54:44 AM
Indeed, a top bloke and have bought a few bits off him now over the years, even the Moto Guzzi fitment Brembo caliper on the Commando was from him.

Even the stanchion chrome looks good on those forks.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 08, 2021, 05:13:07 PM
No TimeSerts, they were priced at AU$500 to $700 for kits in standard and long tooling so ended up getting a coil insert kit.
Even the coil set was expensive but with a lengthy drive it was available off the shelf.

The sun is out again but a funeral to attend today.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: leroy_can on April 08, 2021, 09:37:58 PM
  Hi, Hopefully when you say it was expensive that means it is an actual Heli-coil kit. I have installed literally 100s of them and swear by them. I used a Perma coil kit once to enlarge a set of dual plug Harley heads that had been done in 10mm and I enlarged them to 12mm. It was a spark plug specific kit that had a special tap that threaded into the remains of your old thread and then reamed it to size and then cut the new thread. The actual thread you finished with turned out rough even though you would never know once the coil was installed. I blamed it on the fact that I did it on an assembled engine but the real problem was the tap that began after the reamer portion was far to blunt and wouldn't of had a chance without the old thread helping to pull it in. I recently used it on a bracket I was making and even with a good thread to pull it in on a piece of 6061 it still made a rough thread. Just a warning that if it is Perma coil of the type I described proceed with caution and try it on a test hole first. With your equipment you could probably grind a bit more lead-in on the tap if required. When I tried it on the piece of 6061 I made a normal 12mm thread first for it to start in and only had a bottoming tap for that and even so it effortlessly made a perfect thread but the perma coil tap not so good even with the good thread to follow.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 11, 2021, 12:39:06 AM
All I can say is, what was I thinking buying this bodge kit (That has a bottoming thread) and have to ask myself why I did not buy a conventional M14 - 1.25 insert kit and do it in the mill with angle plate even if it took all day to do two holes.

Yes it is the tap like you describe but has a decent lead in from the guiding to cutting thread.
I tried it on a spare head which I would now regard as scrap, the plug was loose enough to think it was a taper thread most of the way after the coil was in place.
There is no way I would use this insert on the heads in the bike and I thank my lucky stars I tried it on another head which now has a thread looser than what was in place before hand.

I will leave the existing threads as is and simply hope for the best as they are better than this kit produced but am still kicking myself all the same.

I will get back to replacing parts that were not broken which is making a lot more sense than before. :laugh:


Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 20, 2021, 08:13:34 PM
Everything is ship shape again.
The rocker mounts only needed machining in these locations to fit including clash with the original valve covers.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/Head7.jpg)

I think it will be safe to say it will be the only Eldorado in my neighbourhood with California II rockers, 32 mm PHF's and Tommy Pettersen distributor.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Canuck750 on April 20, 2021, 09:17:37 PM
Les I think it would be safe to say your Eldorado is the only one anywhere with just about everything made better and prettier, details, details, details!  :bow:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 21, 2021, 09:20:56 PM
Thanks Jim.  :thumb:

The bike was running great but hope it will be even better.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 22, 2021, 05:44:28 PM
I still should have fit that AMR300 supercharger for the 'Worlds fastest Eldorado, to late now.

The new parts bolted up like stock but what to set the valve clearance to is a mystery.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/head6.jpg)

Amazing how things can machine in a fraction of the time compared to the first ones.
New and improved versions that will make the 32 mm bore match to the carburetor easy with the shoulder at that ID.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/mgmods/man7.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Peter949 on April 26, 2021, 05:31:25 PM
For Valve Clearances my owners manual for the 1984 California II shows 0.009 inches for both Inlet and Exhaust!

Other have suggested 0.006 & 0.008 inches can be safely used.

I have also read on this forum that 0.005 & 0.007 inches is still very safe to use for the valve clearances.

 :bike-037:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 26, 2021, 06:00:09 PM
For Valve Clearances my owners manual for the 1984 California II shows 0.009 inches for both Inlet and Exhaust!

Other have suggested 0.006 & 0.008 inches can be safely used.

I have also read on this forum that 0.005 & 0.007 inches is still very safe to use for the valve clearances.

 :bike-037:

Thanks Peter  :thumb:
You are the only person in the world to offer any answer so muchly appreciated.
I will try .006" and .008"
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Mayor_of_BBQ on April 27, 2021, 07:00:03 AM
I hear you, it must be the most mechanically loved Eldorado in these parts.

IIRC this is the gas cap surround I machined and sent you for free via ADV Rider.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/TrimRing.JPG)

Still going strong Les!

(https://i.imgur.com/gxrYehz.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on April 27, 2021, 04:43:38 PM
 :thumb: :thumb:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 02, 2021, 07:10:19 AM
No surprise, if there was a schedule its behind time.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/74.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 05, 2021, 04:03:16 PM
Charlie misses nothing, maybe it was an omen, one step forward, two backwards then three forward..  :laugh:

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/motorcycle/1973motoguzzieldorado/E5.JPG)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on May 05, 2021, 07:40:16 PM
 :grin:
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 06, 2021, 04:11:27 PM
Oddly enough (or not) I would be to afraid to touch those decals which should be replaced with ones that do not have the Eagles flying backwards.  :boozing:

I think the last time I applied a deacl/sticker (Airfix model) was before New Zealand had colour television (1973)
Would they be a decal or some form of water transfer ?

How would they be removed and will hope the PO did not use some form of clear over them.
The tank is original paint so would not want to damage it, I am more at home drilling holes in crankshafts.

Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Antietam Classic Cycle on May 07, 2021, 08:44:46 AM
Kind of hard to tell from the photo what type they are. They look like water transfer without any clear over them, to me.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Scout63 on May 07, 2021, 10:31:26 PM
No surprise, if there was a schedule its behind time.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/74.jpg)
That front brake is going to break your heart Les. I stayed true to mine for about a year and then ordered this from Don Pender:


(https://i.ibb.co/2Ss2323/8-A0434-F1-755-D-4-B2-E-B941-C34306-A15-E07.jpg) (https://ibb.co/2Ss2323)
q

I also dont envy the poor lad that works on your Eldorado in 30 years with a shop manual in his hands. Your work is a pleasure to look at.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 08, 2021, 12:55:16 AM
Hi Ben, I put one of Don's sleeve kits in the master cylinder along with new SS pistons and seals in the caliper (The rotor got Blanchard ground) so will see how it goes.
I have the Brembo that I made a bracket for (full seal kit and new Brembo pads added) to try later on.

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/brm.jpg)

The Mk2a is all mechanical and to look as stock as possible besides the FullAuto cylinder head and 2.5" Excels (with radials)
The paint on the frame is original.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: LesP on May 08, 2021, 06:44:09 PM
Pesky drive chains and sprocket nuts needing 80 ft/lbs of torque.
Take the easy option and stand on the rear brake and guestimate it with a box spanner or..........

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/spr2%20-%20Copy.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/spr3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/z3.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/sp1.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/spr4.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/tt.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/sp9.jpg)

(https://photos.imageevent.com/time_warp1959/misc/tr5t/N1.jpg)
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Scout63 on May 10, 2021, 07:02:38 AM
I went the same route with sleeved mc and stainless black lines for the front brake Les. I wanted the bike to look completely stock. I couldnt get it to stop leaking fluid through the caliper. The new setup males riding easier since I can two finger brake while blipping the throttle on downshifts.

Your countersprocket tool is killer. Also, Im interested in how the Fullauto heads feel. I have Combat heads and 2s cam and the power output is surprisingly strong. The engine is happiest above 4500 and pulls past redline.  I tend to back off at 6000.
Title: Re: Eldorado and the quest to ride a Moto Guzzi for the first time.
Post by: Klinkhammer on May 17, 2021, 09:49:43 AM
Les!
Very interested in how you will jet those PHF 32 (same as on my V7 Sport)...