Author Topic: 1948 Airone - restoration  (Read 7267 times)

Online Canuck750

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 915
  • Location: Edmonton, Canada
1948 Airone - restoration
« on: November 24, 2020, 05:11:47 PM »
I picked up this 1948 250cc Airone (these early generation models are nick named the Astorino as it has the same rear shock absorbers damper design as the 500cc Astore)



It came out of the San Diego area and I have had it for a couple years but have only fired it up but not ridden it. The tank is apparently not the original flatter chrome type (I have a repro) and the tank was touched up at the front and top due to some serious ruts.



At a minimum I need to overhaul the brakes, wheel bearings, suspension, steering bearings, fit new tires etc. It has a serious oil leak I need to find and fix.



I have been struggling with what to do with it for a couple years, restore it 100% or save the 'Patina' and just go through it mechanically??

This spider web of rust below the surface of the tin wear is typical, worse in some areas.



The fenders and the rear fender supports are very corroded, but its all in or nothing.

All the bright plating is mostly gone, it is however a complete bike, nothing missing other than a tire pump and tool kit and nothing appears to be broken.



I have gotten so far as putting it on a lift and giving all the fasteners a good blast of penetrating fluid.



Front wheel is a chrome plated rim with galvanized spokes, the rear is a red painted rim and spokes, I am betting the front was replaced at some time???



Restore or conserve?

« Last Edit: January 14, 2021, 03:31:19 PM by Canuck750 »
48 Guzzi Airone, 57 Guzzi Cardellino, 65 Benelli Barracuda, 66 Aermacchi Sprint, 68 Gilera 106SS, 72 Eldorado, 72 Benelli 180, 74 Guzzi 750S, 73 Laverda SF1, 74  Benelli 650S, 75 Ducati 860GT, 75 Moto Morini 3-1/2, 78 Moto Morinii 500

Online Turin

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 4299
    • crap and stuff
  • Location: Chandler, Arizona
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #1 on: November 24, 2020, 07:11:38 PM »
If it was 100% original, I'd say preserve.  The tank, the wheel and the rust pushes me over to the restore column.
2000 Quota 1100 es
1997 Daytona RS
1987 LeMans SE Dave's Cycle Racer
1974 850-T Sport
1969 A-series Ambassador
1996 Triumph Daytona 1200
1991 Ducati 907ie ( Paso )
1982 Alfa Romeo GTV6 Balocco SE 3.0

Offline Dave Swanson

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 3255
  • Northern Illinois USA
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2020, 08:51:06 PM »
I am in the same camp with Turin. 
Dave Swanson - Northern IL
1935 GTS
1968 V700
1973 V7 Sport
1974 Eldo
1977 Vert
1977 Lemans 1.2
1980 T3 California
1993 1000S - Sparklehorse
2004 V11S - Eraldo-ized
2015 Norge GT8V - Beetle-ized
2015 V7 Special - Beetle-ized
2016 Griso SE - Beetle-ized

MGNOC L-780

Online Canuck750

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 915
  • Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2020, 09:58:53 PM »
If it was 100% original, I'd say preserve.  The tank, the wheel and the rust pushes me over to the restore column.

I respect both of your opinions very much, thank you. That's where I keep leaning to, many who have seen the bike want me to conserve it, I hate rust and I even hate it more when its called PATINA.

The Airone is not a big money bike, a real nice one can be found for between $8 and $10K USD. It could be freshened up and just ridden but I know I am going to take it all apart regardless and I think I would really struggle to put it back together without refinishing it.

I was able resist restoring my 1957 Cardellino because the overall condition was so good despite some big paint scratches in the tank, the Airone is in no where equal shape.

It will come apart ……….
48 Guzzi Airone, 57 Guzzi Cardellino, 65 Benelli Barracuda, 66 Aermacchi Sprint, 68 Gilera 106SS, 72 Eldorado, 72 Benelli 180, 74 Guzzi 750S, 73 Laverda SF1, 74  Benelli 650S, 75 Ducati 860GT, 75 Moto Morini 3-1/2, 78 Moto Morinii 500

Wildgoose Chase Moto Guzzi

Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2020, 09:58:53 PM »

Offline Glawster

  • Sunday Rider
  • **
  • Posts: 82
  • Location: Cheltenham, UK
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2020, 06:18:28 AM »
+1 for restoration.  It needs the corrosion on the tinware arresting and by the time you've painted it, well better make a proper job!

I have a similar potential project with the Falcone Turismo below.  A good friend of mine bought it from Garlatti Moto in Italy a couple of years ago.  It has languished unloved in his boatyard since then.  We got it going a few weeks ago and it runs very well.  Actually I find it a better ride than my Falcone Sport, probably the smaller carb and lower compression make it more even tempered.  Anyway he want to trailer it to the 100th anniversary in Mandello next September and spend a few days riding in Northern Italy, and wants to improve the cosmetics.  As I'm newly retired with time on my hands I volunteered to have a go at it, thinking I'm bound to learn a lot along the way.
I look forward to following your progress on the Airone.
Cheers,
Derek


20200731_110644 by Derek Wardell, on Flickr
« Last Edit: November 25, 2020, 08:16:07 AM by Glawster »
1955 Falcone Sport
1973 V7 Sport
2019 V85TT
1955 Moto Parilla Turismo Special

Offline s1120

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 1659
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2020, 07:44:31 AM »
Its a cool bike, but with all that rust everywhere under the finish, if you start taking it apart to repair stuff it makes zero sense not to restore. If nothing else the tin all needs doing, and no use doing that half way...  maybe a serviceable clean/repair on mechanical bits, and a restore on the tin work.. 
Paul B

Online Groover

  • 2019 Board Donor
  • Guzzi Hero
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 2644
  • If it ain't broke, I'll break it.
    • Scooteropolis
  • Location: Columbus, Ohio
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2020, 08:33:31 AM »
I'd just get it running and let it idle forever in your shop as music... the low RPM capability of those engines is very zen.

I'd also start sourcing the right parts to restore it.

Edit: got the engine confused with the Falcone, 500. That's the low idle magical one. (I misread where you said 500cc)
https://youtu.be/-j_B-ZbmjLI
« Last Edit: November 25, 2020, 09:02:27 AM by Groover »
1981 Moto Guzzi V1000G5
1987 Moto Guzzi LM1000SE, a
1987 Moto Guzzi LM1000SE, b
1980 Piaggio Vespa P200E
1980 Piaggio Vespa P125X
1980 Vespa Grande Moped
1980 Vespa SI Moped
http://scooteropolis.com/

Online Canuck750

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 915
  • Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2020, 11:05:56 AM »
I'd just get it running and let it idle forever in your shop as music... the low RPM capability of those engines is very zen.

I'd also start sourcing the right parts to restore it.

Edit: got the engine confused with the Falcone, 500. That's the low idle magical one. (I misread where you said 500cc)
https://youtu.be/-j_B-ZbmjLI

This 250 idles very slowly, a gentle chug chug. It’s so easy to turn over by hand, compression must be very low. I have collected some engine service parts but need to find rims and spokes. I am rebuilding a 1948 GTV engine and thanks to Patrick and Shawn for their brilliant translation of the factory repair manual the mysteries of the bacon slicer have been explained. I will replace the case bearings and felt seals at a minimum. If it needs guides, valves or a piston I will replace them.

Anyone have a contact for a shop that can go through the magneto and dynamo?

Thanks
Jim
48 Guzzi Airone, 57 Guzzi Cardellino, 65 Benelli Barracuda, 66 Aermacchi Sprint, 68 Gilera 106SS, 72 Eldorado, 72 Benelli 180, 74 Guzzi 750S, 73 Laverda SF1, 74  Benelli 650S, 75 Ducati 860GT, 75 Moto Morini 3-1/2, 78 Moto Morinii 500

Offline Glawster

  • Sunday Rider
  • **
  • Posts: 82
  • Location: Cheltenham, UK
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2020, 11:48:16 AM »
I sent my MCR4E to Marco Valenti for reconditioning.  He sells all the parts but persuaded me to send him the whole unit.  I was nervous about this, but within 3 weeks the magneto was returned with new coil, condensor and bearings.  Cost including return postage (to UK) was €180, which seems to be somewhat less than half the price of a UK overhaul of a Luca / BTH
https://valentimotorestauri.com/en/
1955 Falcone Sport
1973 V7 Sport
2019 V85TT
1955 Moto Parilla Turismo Special

Online Canuck750

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 915
  • Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #9 on: November 25, 2020, 06:58:13 PM »
I sent my MCR4E to Marco Valenti for reconditioning.  He sells all the parts but persuaded me to send him the whole unit.  I was nervous about this, but within 3 weeks the magneto was returned with new coil, condensor and bearings.  Cost including return postage (to UK) was €180, which seems to be somewhat less than half the price of a UK overhaul of a Luca / BTH
https://valentimotorestauri.com/en/

Thank you!
0
I will send mine to Valenti, Mike Peavy handles all sales in North America for Valenti so I will ask Mike if I send it through him.

I started the disassembly today getting ready to pull the engine out of the frame, cleaning the parts as I take them off and cataloguing them.



I had changed to oil when I got the bike and fired it up, I was surprised to see the tar like sludge that came out of the oil reservoir when I removed it and flushed it. Same heavy sludge deposits inside the right hand timing case,



Interesting stack of sheet metal shims under the magneto, some of them are cut from Shell Oil tins.



I don't think I can salvage the sprockets  :evil:, hardly anything left of them, the rear is no better



I don't think the gear selector has ever been off the motor, it took a lot of pressure before it cracked loose



Such a difference from the 70's bikes I am used to working on, something new at every turn, a great COVID project!


48 Guzzi Airone, 57 Guzzi Cardellino, 65 Benelli Barracuda, 66 Aermacchi Sprint, 68 Gilera 106SS, 72 Eldorado, 72 Benelli 180, 74 Guzzi 750S, 73 Laverda SF1, 74  Benelli 650S, 75 Ducati 860GT, 75 Moto Morini 3-1/2, 78 Moto Morinii 500

Offline Dave Swanson

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 3255
  • Northern Illinois USA
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #10 on: November 26, 2020, 06:31:06 AM »
I am glad to see the process beginning.   This will be a heartwarming story similar to those dog videos where the abused, skinny, and neglected dog gets a new lease on life!  :popcorn:
Dave Swanson - Northern IL
1935 GTS
1968 V700
1973 V7 Sport
1974 Eldo
1977 Vert
1977 Lemans 1.2
1980 T3 California
1993 1000S - Sparklehorse
2004 V11S - Eraldo-ized
2015 Norge GT8V - Beetle-ized
2015 V7 Special - Beetle-ized
2016 Griso SE - Beetle-ized

MGNOC L-780

Online Canuck750

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 915
  • Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2020, 06:05:36 PM »
It's a mutt Dave!

OK so the GTV 500 manual says the engine can come out by removing the three through bolts, shifting the engine forward, then rotate and back end out on the right hand side.

Well this is NOT a 500 and try as I might I could not get the engine to come out in one piece, I unbolted the fender and shifted it forward and onto the tire for more clearance, I had removed the magneto and dynamo ….



So after spinning, twisting, left and right I pulled the head off



Not pretty



I gave the head and the cylinder an initial clean in the vapour blast cabinet, once the head is stripped I will give all the parts a final vapour blast then into the ultrasonic tank for ahour to get any beads out of the blind threaded holes





Next to split the cases and see what all the internals and clutch look like, the barrel feels good but I need to measure it and everything else



The cleaned parts pile so far sharing a spot with my 500Cc GTV 500 engine project





48 Guzzi Airone, 57 Guzzi Cardellino, 65 Benelli Barracuda, 66 Aermacchi Sprint, 68 Gilera 106SS, 72 Eldorado, 72 Benelli 180, 74 Guzzi 750S, 73 Laverda SF1, 74  Benelli 650S, 75 Ducati 860GT, 75 Moto Morini 3-1/2, 78 Moto Morinii 500

Offline jas67

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 5381
  • Location: Palmyra, PA
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #12 on: November 26, 2020, 06:53:39 PM »
Wow, the before and after vapor blast pics of your cylinder head are a fantastic add for vapor blasting.
I really want one, but, haven't been able to justify the cost, as I wouldn't use it enough.    Now, if I could get a local friend or two to go in together on one.....
2017 V7III Special
1977 Le Mans
1974 Eldorado
2017 Triumph Thruxton R
2013 Ducati Monster 796, 2013 848 Evo Corse SE, 1974 750GT, 1970 Mk3d Desmo, 1966 Monza 250
2007 Vespa GTS250
2016 BMW R1200RS, 80 R100S, 76 R90S ,73 R75/5
76 Honda CB400F, 67 305 Super Hawk, 68 CL175

Offline 80CX100

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 1120
  • Location: Kinburn, (Ottawa), Ontario, Canada
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2020, 12:01:07 AM »
Hey Jim,     It's amazing watching you work  :bow:

    Thanks for not only documenting the work, but also the tools you're using;

    I bought a big collection of old tools a while back and still haven't figured out what they all are, but I'm sure I've got a set of those split collar puller attachments similar to what you're using on the tranny.

    Re your bike, I thought it looked pretty good for the years on it, I might've been inclined to just do fluids and tires and go for a ride,lol, but man that cylinder head did look nasty and gnarly, I agree very impressive cleaned up.

    Looking forward to watching you work your way through it, it's a very pretty bike.

    Tia following

    Kelly 
2008 California Vintage
2003 V11 Lemans
2007 Griso 1100
1979 G5 & 1980 Lemans CX100
2010 Suzuki DR650 & 1978 SR500
2010 Honda CRF50 & CRF100

In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. George Orwell

Offline Dave Swanson

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 3255
  • Northern Illinois USA
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2020, 06:54:59 AM »
Very cool to see the process started.   I have my seat reserved.   :popcorn:
Dave Swanson - Northern IL
1935 GTS
1968 V700
1973 V7 Sport
1974 Eldo
1977 Vert
1977 Lemans 1.2
1980 T3 California
1993 1000S - Sparklehorse
2004 V11S - Eraldo-ized
2015 Norge GT8V - Beetle-ized
2015 V7 Special - Beetle-ized
2016 Griso SE - Beetle-ized

MGNOC L-780

Online Canuck750

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 915
  • Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: Airone - referesh or restore ?
« Reply #15 on: November 27, 2020, 07:00:40 PM »
Today I stripped the head down and finished cleaning all the components.



The push rod access plug is all messed up from a previous owners use of vice grips



A propane torch heated the plug and case until the plug cracked loose, one more part to be replaced





The vale to guide clearance for both intake and exhaust is sloppy, the head will need new valve guides at a minimum, the amount of carbon on the inner surface of the intake valve suggests the guide has been worn for a very long time

The exhaust valve was much cleaner but the guides is too loose



after cleaning the valves, rockers and rocker bushes



Back to the rest of the engine, separated the clutch, a combination of steel and copper plates with a single fibre disc, steel plates are deeply scored, will need a new clutch kit



The clutch springs are on the opposite side of the engine, a steel push rod runs though the center of the output shaft and the clutch springs are outboard of the drive sprocket, different huh!

The knurled outer ring is threaded to the output shaft (left hand thread) and by turning it in or out the clutch spring pressure is adjusted, the adjuster was seized to the shaft and took a lot of persuasion, heat and penetrating fluid to release





with the clutch and drive sprocket removed and the crankshaft pinion gear that drives the cam removed the cases can be unbolted and with a few soft taps of a rubber mallet on the protruding shafts the case easily came apart





The crank shaft pulled free of the bearing with little effort



The opposite side kept the transmission set in place



The transmission shaft is reluctant to leave the bearing, I will leave it to soak with penetrating fluid over night

The crank, output and lay shaft bearings all feel like crap, at a minimum all will need to be replaced and the felt seals renewed



The crank / rod assembly 'may' be ok, needs to be stripped and cleaned then measured



All the parts I removed today have been degreased and vapour blasted, bagged and tagged for reassembly.

The bolt together frame shows its simplicity with the engine removed


48 Guzzi Airone, 57 Guzzi Cardellino, 65 Benelli Barracuda, 66 Aermacchi Sprint, 68 Gilera 106SS, 72 Eldorado, 72 Benelli 180, 74 Guzzi 750S, 73 Laverda SF1, 74  Benelli 650S, 75 Ducati 860GT, 75 Moto Morini 3-1/2, 78 Moto Morinii 500

Online Canuck750

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 915
  • Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: 1949 Airone - restoration
« Reply #16 on: November 28, 2020, 05:50:13 PM »
I finished the engine strip down and cleaning today, that's about 16 hours to strip, de-grease and vapour blast and tag all the parts.

One case cleaned beside the degreased only case



Pulled the roller bearing off the crank the roller is toast



Opened the crank sludge trap, clever through wire retainer for the plug



Rod and rollers are very clean, no scoring on the crank bearing surfaces



I stripped the transmission shafts down and cleaned all the parts, they look fine



All the bearings  fell out after heating the cases to 350 F except for the roller race, had to drop an old bearing into the recess to protect the aluminum and weld a bead along the race to shrink it



Cases got a final clean with the bearings out



Stripped the oil pump down



Cylinder has a deep rust spot from the engine sitting, may have to go wit a resleeve



Now to source parts, hopefully delivery from Italy is going to be less than a couple months, its been crazy slow this summer / fall

I do have a set of case bearings and felt seals so I think I can at least get the bottom end back together, new valve guides and a piston on order and will replace the fasteners with the kits Valenti sells.


48 Guzzi Airone, 57 Guzzi Cardellino, 65 Benelli Barracuda, 66 Aermacchi Sprint, 68 Gilera 106SS, 72 Eldorado, 72 Benelli 180, 74 Guzzi 750S, 73 Laverda SF1, 74  Benelli 650S, 75 Ducati 860GT, 75 Moto Morini 3-1/2, 78 Moto Morinii 500

Online Canuck750

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 915
  • Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: 1949 Airone - restoration
« Reply #17 on: November 30, 2020, 04:32:10 PM »
Most of the fasteners and hardware on the Airone are treated with black oxide, I am guessing the factory finish may have been a hot oxide coating, I have a Caswell Black Oxide kit, it includes the black oxide solution that is mixed 9:1 with distilled water and the sealer that is used full strength.



Caswell says to get the parts clean and degreased. I vapour blasted each of the parts then put them in the ultrasonic cleaner with dishwasher detergent for a half hour.



Then I soaked the parts in a 25% solution of muriatic acid / water for 5 minutes and rinsed distilled water before soaking them in the black oxide / water solution for 30 minutes.



The oxide solution gets a little cloudy after three lots of parts going through but I will save it to reuse



I soaked the parts for 10 minutes in the sealer and left them to air dry



Caswell says let the sealer dry for 24 hours, this is the finish after a couple hours of drying



The finish is dull, perhaps that's what it should look like but I had hoped it would have a little more gloss, I am going to try soaking the parts in ACF-50 and then heating them in the oven at 200 F for a couple hours.

At least the cylinder studs and case fasteners are black again



I coated the kick start and shift shafts and the clutch springs that are exposed beneath the drive sprocket cover.

I am debating if I should coat the transmission gears and shafts as well, they are immersed in engine oil but I think at least the gears were black oxide from the factory.
48 Guzzi Airone, 57 Guzzi Cardellino, 65 Benelli Barracuda, 66 Aermacchi Sprint, 68 Gilera 106SS, 72 Eldorado, 72 Benelli 180, 74 Guzzi 750S, 73 Laverda SF1, 74  Benelli 650S, 75 Ducati 860GT, 75 Moto Morini 3-1/2, 78 Moto Morinii 500

Online Groover

  • 2019 Board Donor
  • Guzzi Hero
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 2644
  • If it ain't broke, I'll break it.
    • Scooteropolis
  • Location: Columbus, Ohio
Re: 1949 Airone - restoration
« Reply #18 on: November 30, 2020, 06:51:50 PM »
Really enjoying this one. Thanks for sharing all this. It's my understanding that the shine on the black oxide starts from the shine of the bolt. Have you tried polishing a stud then see how that turns out? Can't wait to see if the baked ACF-50 does the trick. The Le Mans SE have black bolts, so this is exactly what I need to know how to do! Thank you.
1981 Moto Guzzi V1000G5
1987 Moto Guzzi LM1000SE, a
1987 Moto Guzzi LM1000SE, b
1980 Piaggio Vespa P200E
1980 Piaggio Vespa P125X
1980 Vespa Grande Moped
1980 Vespa SI Moped
http://scooteropolis.com/

Online Canuck750

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 915
  • Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: 1949 Airone - restoration
« Reply #19 on: November 30, 2020, 07:56:50 PM »
Really enjoying this one. Thanks for sharing all this. It's my understanding that the shine on the black oxide starts from the shine of the bolt. Have you tried polishing a stud then see how that turns out? Can't wait to see if the baked ACF-50 does the trick. The Le Mans SE have black bolts, so this is exactly what I need to know how to do! Thank you.

That's a good opint on the shine of the base metal which is applies for anodizing of aluminum, if the aluminum isn't polished the finished anodized piece will be dull. I am going to try polishing some parts and then going through the black oxide process again but I am suspect that this 'cold' process can replicate a semi gloss finish.
There are several hot black oxide chemical processes, one that heats the chemical to around 220F and a second that takes it close to 260F, the basic set up with heater, tanks etc runs around $2500 so its cost prohibitive for me. For my Cardellino conservation I just stripped the black oxide parts and powder coated them flat black, looks good and will last forever but for the Airone I wanted to experiment with Black Oxide, I will keep you posted on the ACF-50 treatment.

This is how the Cardellino parts turned out with flat black powder, I treated the chrome plated parts to semigloss clear powder and I didn't repaint any of the original red on the bike. I pulled everything apart on the Cardellino and refreshed / cleaned all the fasteners, I just went with clear powder, it looks untouched for the most part but it won't rust any more.





48 Guzzi Airone, 57 Guzzi Cardellino, 65 Benelli Barracuda, 66 Aermacchi Sprint, 68 Gilera 106SS, 72 Eldorado, 72 Benelli 180, 74 Guzzi 750S, 73 Laverda SF1, 74  Benelli 650S, 75 Ducati 860GT, 75 Moto Morini 3-1/2, 78 Moto Morinii 500

Online Canuck750

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 915
  • Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: 1949 Airone - restoration
« Reply #20 on: December 01, 2020, 08:05:28 PM »
An update on Black Oxide coating - after allowing the Caswell sealer to air dry for 24 hours the finish is solid but not attractive, too dull for my liking. I coated all the parts with ACF=50 - immersing the small bits in a tub, draining the fluid back into the container and hand pump spray the bigger pieces. I then shook the parts in a strainer to get most of the fluid off the part and placed the pieces on a baking sheet. I set the oven to 225F and baked the pieces in my shop oven.

The bad news - the smoke / fumes developed is probably deadly, I had to leave the shop overhead door open and the exhaust fan running, I pulled the parts out, dabbed them dry again and back into the oven, repeated this step a couple times.

The good news - the parts dried to a nice even semi-gloss finish, very good appearance.



I have all the frame fasteners to do so next time I am going to carry out the final step - baking the ACF-50 on in an outdoor BBQ.



I can recommend the Caswell kit with the final extra step of ACF=50 anti-corrosive coating. The finish may have been achieved without baking in an oven but based upon what little I know of the hot black oxide process I don't think this will hurt. I can't say if the ACF-50 will retain the semi-gloss finish over the long run



48 Guzzi Airone, 57 Guzzi Cardellino, 65 Benelli Barracuda, 66 Aermacchi Sprint, 68 Gilera 106SS, 72 Eldorado, 72 Benelli 180, 74 Guzzi 750S, 73 Laverda SF1, 74  Benelli 650S, 75 Ducati 860GT, 75 Moto Morini 3-1/2, 78 Moto Morinii 500

Online Groover

  • 2019 Board Donor
  • Guzzi Hero
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 2644
  • If it ain't broke, I'll break it.
    • Scooteropolis
  • Location: Columbus, Ohio
Re: 1949 Airone - restoration
« Reply #21 on: December 01, 2020, 09:27:38 PM »
Those look great! Does the baking set the finish in more, or is it just to cook on the acf-50? No that regards, even if that were to wash off, they won't ever look as "dry" as they did before I don't think.


Great tip on the fumes, and thanks again for the specifics
1981 Moto Guzzi V1000G5
1987 Moto Guzzi LM1000SE, a
1987 Moto Guzzi LM1000SE, b
1980 Piaggio Vespa P200E
1980 Piaggio Vespa P125X
1980 Vespa Grande Moped
1980 Vespa SI Moped
http://scooteropolis.com/

Online Canuck750

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 915
  • Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: 1949 Airone - restoration
« Reply #22 on: December 01, 2020, 10:20:57 PM »
Does the baking set the finish in more, or is it just to cook on the acf-50?

Hi Groover,

Not sure if the baking hardens the ACF-50 film, literature states ACF-50 will dry to a film and resist corrosion for a couple years in an exterior environment. When I spray ACF-50 onto a bare aluminum surface it can take weeks before the stuff fully dries. I wanted to be able to handle the parts and not contaminate the surface with oily finger prints etc.

I am going to coat some extra bolts on my next run and finish them with ACF-50 but leave them to air dry only and see if it makes any difference.

This is a pretty simple to use product albeit the precautions required of using the muriatic acid and the potential fumes from the AC-50 being heated. If it was not winter here I would be doing this outdoors!
48 Guzzi Airone, 57 Guzzi Cardellino, 65 Benelli Barracuda, 66 Aermacchi Sprint, 68 Gilera 106SS, 72 Eldorado, 72 Benelli 180, 74 Guzzi 750S, 73 Laverda SF1, 74  Benelli 650S, 75 Ducati 860GT, 75 Moto Morini 3-1/2, 78 Moto Morinii 500

Online Groover

  • 2019 Board Donor
  • Guzzi Hero
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 2644
  • If it ain't broke, I'll break it.
    • Scooteropolis
  • Location: Columbus, Ohio
Re: 1949 Airone - restoration
« Reply #23 on: December 02, 2020, 06:50:59 AM »
Ok, got it that makes sense. I haven't tried this myself, and when I asked here on this board, someone mentioned to use saran wrap between the bolt head and the socket to prevent the wrench marks that may happen when eventually torqueing down these black oxide type nuts and bolts.
1981 Moto Guzzi V1000G5
1987 Moto Guzzi LM1000SE, a
1987 Moto Guzzi LM1000SE, b
1980 Piaggio Vespa P200E
1980 Piaggio Vespa P125X
1980 Vespa Grande Moped
1980 Vespa SI Moped
http://scooteropolis.com/

Online Canuck750

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 915
  • Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: 1949 Airone - restoration
« Reply #24 on: December 02, 2020, 05:29:20 PM »
I tore the rear wheel down to inspect the axle and bearings, there is a fixing ring on the brake drum side that is secured with a pin wrench, sometime in the past 70 years a ham fisted mechanic buggered up the nut, the nut is split on the side, how tight did this nut get hammered to split like this?



« Last Edit: December 02, 2020, 05:31:05 PM by Canuck750 »
48 Guzzi Airone, 57 Guzzi Cardellino, 65 Benelli Barracuda, 66 Aermacchi Sprint, 68 Gilera 106SS, 72 Eldorado, 72 Benelli 180, 74 Guzzi 750S, 73 Laverda SF1, 74  Benelli 650S, 75 Ducati 860GT, 75 Moto Morini 3-1/2, 78 Moto Morinii 500

Offline SED

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 1527
Re: 1949 Airone - restoration
« Reply #25 on: December 03, 2020, 10:51:31 PM »
Great thread - love it!  Your reconditioned parts look perfect.

ACF-50 is going to be a much better preservative, but I used Caswell and sealed the black oxide with boiled linseed oil which was the old fashioned way.  The linseed oil dries satin sheen and darkens with exposure. 

the nut is split on the side, how tight did this nut get hammered to split like this?


The split is for a pinch screw.  (a little like the float chamber lid on remote float AMALs and Delortos)  The GTV has the same type of threaded nuts.
1983 LeMans III
1981 Monza
1947 Ariel Red Hunter
1939 Ariel Red Hunter
1937 Guzzi GTV

Offline SED

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 1527
Re: 1949 Airone - restoration
« Reply #26 on: December 03, 2020, 11:07:29 PM »
You've got a BL magneto and they are easy enough to rebuild (easier than Lucas) if you want to try.  The trickiest part is soldering and making a fixture to hold the replacement condensers.  Digikey has the condensers, Mark's Magneto can rewind the armature if it needs it.


      
1983 LeMans III
1981 Monza
1947 Ariel Red Hunter
1939 Ariel Red Hunter
1937 Guzzi GTV

Online Canuck750

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 915
  • Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: 1949 Airone - restoration
« Reply #27 on: December 04, 2020, 10:32:49 AM »
Thanks for the info on the magneto. It’s on the to do list to overhaul.
48 Guzzi Airone, 57 Guzzi Cardellino, 65 Benelli Barracuda, 66 Aermacchi Sprint, 68 Gilera 106SS, 72 Eldorado, 72 Benelli 180, 74 Guzzi 750S, 73 Laverda SF1, 74  Benelli 650S, 75 Ducati 860GT, 75 Moto Morini 3-1/2, 78 Moto Morinii 500

Online Canuck750

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 915
  • Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: 1949 Airone - restoration
« Reply #28 on: December 05, 2020, 05:38:43 PM »
Finished another batch of black oxide / ACF 50, bought a cheap toaster oven, moved it outside and left the ACF-50 to bake at 250 F for about three hours. The original finish on the transmission gear clusters and primary drive is black oxide. Even though these pieces are internal to the engine cases and are bathed in recirculating engine oil I suspect the factory coated these components to resist corrosion from a motor sitting for prolonged periods and the cases being vented to the atmosphere.



Dismantle and inspection of the swing arm is next. The center stand wobbles like a drunk on a bender, I think the bolts have worn oblong holes into the frame, that will require rewelding and drilling.
48 Guzzi Airone, 57 Guzzi Cardellino, 65 Benelli Barracuda, 66 Aermacchi Sprint, 68 Gilera 106SS, 72 Eldorado, 72 Benelli 180, 74 Guzzi 750S, 73 Laverda SF1, 74  Benelli 650S, 75 Ducati 860GT, 75 Moto Morini 3-1/2, 78 Moto Morinii 500

Offline SED

  • Guzzi Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 1527
Re: 1949 Airone - restoration
« Reply #29 on: December 06, 2020, 01:48:11 PM »
Your parts look new!  Nice work.

The frame may also be badly worn where stand contacts it - the GTV was worn back to the rivets.
1983 LeMans III
1981 Monza
1947 Ariel Red Hunter
1939 Ariel Red Hunter
1937 Guzzi GTV

 

20 Ounce Stainless Steel Double Insulated Tumbler with donation credit
Buy a quality tumbler and support the forum at the same time!
Better than a YETI! BPA and Lead free.
Advertise Here