What does Guzzi need? Be realistic given economies on all fronts?

[Testarossa]

The bright spot for me, at age 69 and 148 lb, is that the big manufacturers are going after Asian markets hammer and tongs, which means a lot of agile, lighter bikes coming thru. Presumably Piaggio will be there with a practical 350 lb development of the V7.

[Darren Williams]

Just a data point from my perspective...

About the younger street riders, the Grom and the Z125 are going out the door of dealerships well above MSRP around here. No leftovers and no discounts to be had. And it's not old guys buying them. Also the Cyclegear bike nights (where the younger folks in their 20's gather around here) were having more and more 250 and 300 sport bikes showing up, along with the mid-sized naked SV650, FZ07 for stunting and general hooligan riding. The older guys (in their 30's and early 40's) were still riding the supersports and superbikes.

[Huzo]

Force your son or daughter to come on trips, either on the back or on their own Guzzi (preferably) and make sure the first few are as devoid of drama as possible. This will build memories that are inexorably linked to the feelings of fun, freedom and a great life.
At some point your kid will just become a "Guzzi person" and wouldn't bother going if it was on a GS 500 Suzuki or such...

[oldbike54]

Force your son or daughter to come on trips, either on the back or on their own Guzzi (preferably) and make sure the first few are as devoid of drama as possible. This will build memories that are inexorably linked to the feelings of fun, freedom and a great life.
At some point your kid will just become a "Guzzi person" and wouldn't bother going if it was on a GS 500 Suzuki or such...

 Force ? Yeah , that's gonna work 

 Dusty

[Kev m]

Just a data point from my perspective...

About the younger street riders, the Grom and the Z125 are going out the door of dealerships well above MSRP around here. No leftovers and no discounts to be had. And it's not old guys buying them. Also the Cyclegear bike nights (where the younger folks in their 20's gather around here) were having more and more 250 and 300 sport bikes showing up, along with the mid-sized naked SV650, FZ07 for stunting and general hooligan riding. The older guys (in their 30's and early 40's) were still riding the supersports and superbikes.

Not for nothing but I suspect part of that is normal and part of that is generational.

Normal = it's normal for older people in a society to have more money for more expensive toys.

Generational = millennials watched their parents go through the recession and housing crisis, and have been as a group more reluctant to spend money on vehicles in general. So smaller (and cheaper) bikes appeal to their sensibilities.

[Huzo]

Force ? Yeah , that's gonna work 

 Dusty

Just stop feeding them 'till they comply Dusty...

[Guzzi Gal]

Moto Guzzi doesn't have to be bigger, just more proactive in their marketing approach, and support for new/existing dealers.  Sitting astride a Moto Guzzi is a visceral experience, you'll either love it, or you won't.  If people aren't given the opportunity to fall in love, MG will fade into history.

1.    I want advertising that makes me curious about MG, regardless of my sex/age.
2.    I want a dealer network I can easily visit to experience an MG.
3.    I want reviews that talk of the joy, comfort, ease, economy, and reliability of MG.

Tap into that ol' Italian penchant for romance, MG, revel in your history, ignite the potential buyers soul, and feed the love story yet to blossom. 

Oh, and Norman Reedus would look so much better ridding a Guzzi.   
 

[Kev m]

1.    I want advertising that makes me curious about MG, regardless of my sex/age.
2.    I want a dealer network I can easily visit to experience an MG.
3.    I want reviews that talk of the joy, comfort, ease, economy, and reliability of MG.

You can have all the advertising in the world, it means nothing without quality control.

Actually same with dealer network, as dealers can't make a living if people expect their products to break.

And if the products are breaking, then reviews that talk of joy, comfort, ease, economy won't happen as they'll be focused on the lack of reliability.

[TN Mark]

Trying to figure out what Moto Guzzi needs to build market share and increase sales in the US has been an ongoing topic for decades. In 1978 I bought my first new Moto Guzzi, a 1977 Convert. I had many Guzzis from that first one in 1978 until 2013. Most of them I loved, one I hated and one just didn't move me at all. In 2013 I traded off my last Moto Guzzi, a Cal Vintage, along with a Honda Valkyrie Interstate and my wife's H-D Sportster Low for a leftover 2012 Victory Cross Country Tour. The dealer, Randy's Cycle in Marengo, IL gave me as much for the 3 trade ins as I could have ever hoped to get on my own. The total OTD price of the Victory was a whopping $1,200! Since I guesstimated it would be about $5K, I simply added the accessories I wanted at the time of purchase.

Around that time, Guzzi had recently come out with the 1400 California Touring. I seriously looked at it and I seriously wanted to love it. I tried, but it just couldn't hold a candle to the big pearl white Victory. I wanted a bike that my wife and I could easily, effortlessly and comfortably tour on. The Vic won hands down in every category that mattered, and still matters to me. The trunk that easily holds two full face helmets comes off in about 3 minutes. And 113 rear wheel hp and 114 ft./torque went in quickly and easily as well. The Victory 106 engine and drivetrain was designed to withstand nearly double it's stock output. By installing readily available bolt on items like cams, a timing wheel, air filter, mufflers, a PCV and getting it dyno tuned. After increasing engine output it produced much less heat and gets 3+ better mpg. The Vic runs better than most would ever think it should. Many have well over 200K and even 300K miles with nothing more than routine maintenance. Very Moto Guzzi like. At least with the older 1064 engine if not the later 1200's. The Vic will run all day 2 up at 80 mph in 6th gear at 3000 rpm and return 45 mpg. The only time it's ever sees a dealer is when I get new tires. And that's about every 18K miles or so.

I'm not on this site these days like I was when I had the Guzzis. But I still have love in my heart for the Moto Guzzi brand and for the people who own them. When I read this thread, even with Polaris bailing on Victory, it solidified I made the right decision (for me) back in May of 2013.

Three of the best Guzzi dealers I knew and trusted years ago have bailed on Guzzi. Why? For all the reasons mentioned throughout this thread. At some point as I get older, I'm guessing I'll be looking for a new motorcycle. I hope Moto Guzzi will have something I want at that point. But the basics like quality control, a functioning dealer network and a bike that meets my requirements are non negotiable. Some complain about amenities like a bluetooth audio system, cruise control, seat and grip warmers, a reverse option, a low seat height etc etc etc. But once you have these things, going without them (for me) isn't going to happen.

I hope Piaggio can do, and wants to finally do, what's been needed in the US for decades. If so, I'd definitely consider getting another Moto Guzzi. If not, like my wife and I have been talking about: my next bike may very well be my current bike with a few more performance mods. 196 hp and 180 ft./torque from the 106 is as easy as bolting on a supercharger. Just because I'm getting older doesn't mean I want less power. :)

Forza Moto Guzzi

[kingoffleece]

That's so interesting.  It's almost the exact opposite of what I'd want in a motorcycle.  Neither are  wrong or right, just different.
My Triumph dealer buddy (now dropping them as of Nov 10, 2017) was also a Victory dealer.  Now, as a quick aside, what Polaris did the the Vic dealers is almost unbelievable, but that's another story altogether.

I lead over 200 demo rides over the past several years for demo days-Polaris and Triumph. Have ridden every model from both OEM's.  Thought the Victory bikes were completely without character and never really felt riding it was engaging at all.  But that was ME.  Folks that did buy them loved the "extras" like cruise and the like.  Just goes to show to each their own, and that's the way it should be.  TH Mark makes a good point about the extras and I heard it all the time about the Triumph R3 Touring.  Before anything else, folks would ask "where's the stereo, the cruise, the bluetooth, the power key fob", that sort of thing.

I think a huge part of the discussion needs to consider where the rider lives and rides.  Where we love to go in New England and WV, for example, any big cruiser is not what any of us want or will ride there.  Those that have bikes like that use them for other types of riding.  Yes, I understand most riders (I think) don't have more than one motorcycle but my admittedly small sample of Guzzi riding friends all seem to have several bikes!

it's such a huge issue (bike sales on the whole are soft in 2017) and all the thoughtful ideas here hit at least part of the considerations any OEM must face.

[Psychopasta]

I have been on this forum too long. I find myself agreeing with Kev M.

- Pasta

[blackcat]

How to attract younger customers is the question every motorbike manufacturer is trying to answer . HD is targeting female riders , BMW is building the R9T , Triumph markets the base Bonnie to the younger crowd , and the V7 seems to be MG's entry into that market . Maybe young folks don't really care about hi-tech motorbikes , they seem to get their tech fix with electronic toys . Dunno , but a new generation of counterculture hippies with their attitudes about 2 wheels might help .

Add more power and better suspension to the V7, market directly to the 25-30+ year old males and females in targeted urban areas with vetted dealers and build out from those centers. Price of course is an issue as this group is already dealing with paying off their enormous student loans.

[Huzo]

We could at least have fun whilst sucking the treasury dry.   Hire Pete Roper as public relations spokesperson. Squatch is in charge of hiring and  the sexxyterries. Turnip is product testing. Dusty is union officer. Shorty will write all the snobby commercials. Tom is in charge of warehousing and shipping. Lannis and HD Goose handle complaint department. LowRyter will smooze the govt and handle bribery. Doug and Dave run the employee mess and wine cellar.  Luap will.live nearby in Monte Carlo and handle the asset management.  Damn Yankee will translate. Who have I missed?

The other 300 or so forum members...
If Guzzi built a retro styled 850 with the internals of the V9 but altered it enough to displace around 870 cc's, scaled down CARC rear end with single sided swingarm and wire wheel option, orange/red colour, don't black the motor, and take the soft edge styling away from the motor. Rocker cover reminiscent of the Le Mans. Stylised seat seat like the V7's racer but no silly numbers on the arse, twin front discs, radial Brembo's, and name it V8 Ritorno or Rinascita suggesting it's come back from the past and market bits to increase it's performance after it's passed emissions testing.
That new Kawasaki 900 on the forum the other day, has a badge on the side cover just like the old Zeds of yesteryear but bristles with modern stuff, it tips it's hat to the past but acknowledges the present. Look at the new Bonnies and Thruxtons, get into bed with Benetton and market bike aparrel.
Make sure the ergonomics are such that smaller guys and females can fit on, there are a lot of women who want to ride on something that's un apologetic.
Get Boorman and Ewan to ride around the world on a couple, that'd be a slam dunk.
Every morning the BMW bosses should fall to their knees and perform a lewd act on wax replicas of those two guys while thanking the KTM dickhead who knocked them back...
If Guzzi did the V8 thing, I'd buy on this afternoon...

[waxi]

What it needs? It needs Guzzi/Piaggio CEO and other few key people to read this thread! They have all great and perfectly doable ideas listed in this four pages. Should I send them a link? Kev, FTW with Huzo's idea not bad either. Hell, that's what happened to me.

[wheaties]

Why did I buy a Guzzi?

I thought I wanted a Bonneville but with a better seat.  The dealer had a California that he wanted to sell.  It fit the bill.  What an awesome ride it has been!

Early on, I was in the Northwest corner of Connecticut when I stopped at MacDonalds because the local hot dog stand was closed for the Winter.  A guy was standing by the bike, waiting for me, when I came out.  "Do you realize you have nowhere to go from here?  You've started at the top, there is no better bike out there", he said.  "What can you possibly replace this with?"

"I don't know, maybe a Norge?"

He nodded.

[Huzo]

Just a thought.
I commented earlier that the V7's would look better with twin front discs and was told (quite correctly) that it doesn't need twins. I know that's true after riding one, but buyers want something that gives them a chubby, whether it needs twin discs or not, they look normal.
Have a look at the front end Old Jock did for his bike, it's worth the price of admission just for that.
Stop being "sensible" Guzzi.
Don't give people what they "need".
Give the bastards what they "want".

[Huzo]

I have been on this forum too long. I find myself agreeing with Kev M.

- Pasta

Don't tell him that !
He'll change his mind if you do....

[Kev m]

Stop being "sensible" Guzzi.
Don't give people what they "need".
Give the bastards what they "want".

Ha ha this is just about exactly what I wrote in the other thread about smallblocks and duals.

Unless of course you want me to change my mind?!?

[Huzo]

Ha ha this is just about exactly what I wrote in the other thread about smallblocks and duals.

Unless of course you want me to change my mind?!?

If I had a mind like yours, I'd change it too grasshopper...

[normzone]

To what do we owe that rude comment?

http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=93108.0

[Huzo]

Sorry (publicly), was in jest...
PM sent

[Kev m]

Sorry (publicly), was in jest...
PM sent

No need, my bad. I deleted...

[Matteo]

Never say never.

[Kiwi_Roy]

They just need to fix Startus Interuptus for once and for all, easy peasy and cost nothing.
This simple ailment must have lost them hundreds if not thousands of owners over the last 40 years.
 
 

[Huzo]

They just need to fix Startus Interuptus for once and for all, easy peasy and cost nothing.
This simple ailment must have lost them hundreds if not thousands of owners over the last 40 years.

Every chance KR...

[fossil]

This is an interestic discussion. For me the question really was: "why do I want to buy a Guzzi?". In fact, I didn�t want to. It was absolutely clear: Several years ago I wanted to buy a Harley Sportster Roadster 883. Why? I love the bikes of the late 60s and the first half of the 70s. A friend allowed me to ride his immaculate Norton Commando 750 (first series). And I was sold. A classic bike like this one. But not an old one. And as new bike there were only the Kawasaki W 800 (chain drive - no go) and the Harley, which I loved (and still love) f0r decades. Ok, in a catalogue I stumbled about the Guzzi Cafe Classic, a nice bike. But: plastic tank, two throttle bodies, a bit weak. And I never liked the edgy design of the cylinders of the small block. But, it was a nice bike.

Then suddenly there appeared the stb model. All these things that did bother me were gone! As the Guzzi surely is nearer to the Norton than the Harley this choice was clear. Remained the question: where to buy? As it goes, twenty minutes from my home (with the bicycle!) there is a real good dealer! He carries Aprilia, Guzzi, Vespa, Ducati, Suzuki, Kymco, Mondial and Kreidler. And his service department is good. Well-schooled personnel! So, for more than 4 years now, I own a white V7 Stone. No problems (a broken screw from the rear suspension, a bit oil out of the rear drive). The bike simply runs! I could not be happier. Today I would buy a V7 III.

So the offer from Guzzi appealed to me, and what they achieve today with the small block (V7 III and V9) is hugely attractive to me.

By the way, I am 63 now.

[willowstreetguzziguy]

I think the Groms and 125’s have the best shot of bringing Millenials into motorcycling, like the smaller Honda’s din in the 60’s.