Newbie here. Question reg my v12 sport.

[Padsta]

Hello. I'm new too Guzzis, do please be patient with me.
Have just purchased a V12 sport corsa, registered on 19th Jan 2012.
It's mint with just over 4K. Day after buying I researched on net and found out that the cams go on these bikes?!
I understand there was a recall to fit rollers or something?
It doesn't have all the service stamps from dealer, only 1.
Are they all going to fail, or is it pot luck?
It sounds totally fine right now.
Am I worrying too much?
Any advice would be brilliant.
It's just cost me an arm and a leg, I don't want to be spending more at the moment.
Cheers all.

[pete roper]

1200 Sports were never made with rollers. There never was a 'recall' but all flat tappet 8V's are going to fail. How many miles/Km on the bike? Where are you located? Do you have a good dealer?

If the bike has a full service history then if you get it inspected and damage is found to be evident then Piaggio will provide a kit to rollerise it but you will be expected to pay for installation. No service history? They'll give you nothing. Sorry.

Being a Sport it will need either a 'C' or a 'D' kit both of which require the heads to come off.

Pete

[Padsta]

1200 Sports were never made with rollers. There never was a 'recall' but all flat tappet 8V's are going to fail. How many miles/Km on the bike? Where are you located? Do you have a good dealer?

If the bike has a full service history then if you get it inspected and damage is found to be evident then Piaggio will provide a kit to rollerise it but you will be expected to pay for installation. No service history? They'll give you nothing. Sorry.

Being a Sport it will need either a 'C' or a 'D' kit both of which require the heads to come off.

Pete
Hi Pete.
Thanks for reply.
It's done 4250 miles, it had 1st stamp at 1200 miles, but not a second yet.
If I dealer service now, will they replace the parts free of charge?
What's the mess if they fail?
Cheers.

[Chuck in Indiana]

Unfortunately, this is the biggest black eye Guzzi has ever had. Well, that and the Lario back in the 80s. Also, doing your research *after* spending the big bux wasn't the best idea in the world. I fully realize that you **shouldn't have had to** do that research, but now you have to live with it. Sorry, I mean no offense, but that is the unvarnished truth . IMHO, the selling dealer should never have sold it, knowing they are going to fail. The problem is.. the selling dealer "may not" have known it.
Hopefully, Guzzi will give you the kit, but you'll have to shell out a fair amount of money to get it installed.

What's the mess if they fail?

As Pete said.. they will fail. No if.
Grenade.

[Nic in Western NYS]

Pete's a true expert in this issue so take his advice like it's chiseled in stone.  No 'yes buts'.

Sorry you got one that wasn't already rollerized.  From what is said here, once the conversion is done, the engine is very solid.

[Scud]

I feel your pain... I fell in love my low-mileage Scura on a dealer's floor. Did a little research before buying, but more afterwards. Had to take care of several known issues (a problematic flywheel being the main one) to get it sorted. At least you're in the right place now and finding out about the problem while there's still time to prevent the damage.

It'll be a great bike after you take care of the fatal flaw.  Or, I suppose you could try to undo the purchase if you feel they were not honest and if you don't have means or desire to fix it.

[pete roper]

NO rollerisations will be done pre-emptively. The engine has to fail before replacement parts are supplied. Yes this is stupid and unconscionable but they are obviously trying to save themselves money.

The thing is the early stages of failure can be detected before serious damage occurs by pulling a cambox and inspecting the tappets. On a Sport this is a fifteen minute job but a lot of shops seem reluctant to do it. I have no idea why?

Once the cambox is off the damage is obvious and, as long as there is a FSH, the kit will be supplied. By your mileage I would expect you to see something like this.



Sometimes it's better, sometimes worse. Given your talk of miles I'm assuming you're in the UK? If this is the case the damage is likely to be at the worse end of the spectrum.

Pete

[Padsta]

So my bike is knackered then?
Yes I'm in UK.
Bikes 1st and only service was 1200 miles, it's the only stamp. It's now at 4300 miles.
If serviced now and checked etc, is it still in the warantee free parts replacement for the roller kit?
Thanks.

[pete roper]

That really depends on how hard your dealer goes in to bat for you, (So don't be a dick and piss them off! It's your own back you'll be making a rod for.) and the attitude of the importer and whatever Piaggio droid oversees the claim.

Originally I was tod that the service schedule had to be filled according to time or distance travelled. ie, if the bike is a 2012 it should of been serviced five times by now regardless of mileage! Luckily I think enough people kicked up a stink about this that by the time I stopped being an official service agent and therefore could no longer do 'Warranty' rollerisations I could put in a claim on pretty much anything and as long the services matched the mileage, (Like yours does.) the claim would be rubber stamped.

As I said no claim will be approved pre-emptively. There HAS to be photographic evidence of damage and this requires removal and disassembly of at least one cam box. The problem for owners is that if the dealer is lazy or believes that the problem is simply an 'Internet Myth' they may well charge for an inspection, not perform it, and tell the owner everything is honky-dory. It isn't. Insist on photos of the disassembled cambox and tappet faces. No need to be a rude, shouting, asshole but you're the one paying for the inspection......

In one of the numerous threads on this issue there is a video Mark made of me pulling a cambox on a Griso. The video is about 13 minutes and 20 seconds long! It's NOT open heart surgery or rocket science. As I said it is highly unlikely that at your mileage there won't be visible damage sufficient to justify a claim. Just look at the thread on page 2 or 3 about this issue by the bloke in So Cal. 1300 miles and the damage is clearly visible.

If you wait until it gets noisy or noticeable you greatly increase the risk of much more serious bottom end damage. How do I know this? Because three of the bikes I have rollerised, (Close to 90 now!) have consequently shat their bottom ends due to particulate bearing damage. One of those was mine  !



Pete

[JeffOlson]

Congratulations on your new bike! You have a beautiful bike. I'm envious!

If it were mine, I would have it looked at and then bite the bullet if necessary. If not necessary, I would ride it another 1,900 miles, take it in for its next service, and have it looked at again.

I hope you really enjoy your new bike. I really am envious! 

[Padsta]

Cheers for replies guys.
I'm seriously pissedoff that this is happening.
So if bike was to get dealer serviced now at 4500 miles, with cam inspection done and photos etc, will guzzi send kit free of charge?
As said before, it has 1 rubber stamp at 1200miles in book.
Also what's the labour time to swap the cam stuff out?

[pete roper]

I thought my explanation was pretty clear? Nobody can 'Gaurantee' anything. If though you can show evidence of damage and a service history in my experience this will be enough to make a claim.

As for time? If you include the other things that are needed on a low mileage CARC bike that need doing which are greasing the swingarm bearings and shock linkage? Well in my shop it would include dropping the sump fer a clean out as well but all of that with a 'C' or 'D' kit install would be 7.5-8hrs.

Pete

[twodogs]

Dude you have your answer from Pete, no better person to answer your questions, it sucks and I know you don't want to hear it but the ball is in your court and you'll have to deal with it. By the way welcome and nice bike, post some pics.

[Padsta]

Pete, thanks for detailed info, apologies if I come across dumb, just this is a huge shock after spending so much on a low mileage bike!
Looks like my BSA will have to go to afford it!
I'll get it down to dealer and report back with low down.
Can't believe though that such a refined bike would be such a headache!

[Padsta]

Dude you have your answer from Pete, no better person to answer your questions, it sucks and I know you don't want to hear it but the ball is in your court and you'll have to deal with it. By the way welcome and nice bike, post some pics.

Thanks buddy. No one likes to hear stuff like this! Lol.
It's a beautiful machine though!
I'll get some pics up soon.

[nobleswood]

Padsta,

Where in the U.K. are you ?

Over on Grisoghetto.com there are a number of 8v 1200 Griso owners, from the U K. Many of whom have been through this BS.
They could probably help you with dealers who know what they are looking at & a Guzzi Support group. Who can help you through this birthing period of owning a Guzzi.

Bought my first Guzzi 5 years ago & now have another.

Great machines but they can take some fettling to get sorted initially.

[JeffOlson]

I will include a placeholder while we wait for you to post pictures of your own bike (and your own Italian supermodel):

[Padsta]

Okay, just a quickly...

[Padsta]

Padsta,

Where in the U.K. are you ?

Over on Grisoghetto.com there are a number of 8v 1200 Griso owners, from the U K. Many of whom have been through this BS.
They could probably help you with dealers who know what they are looking at & a Guzzi Support group. Who can help you through this birthing period of owning a Guzzi.

Bought my first Guzzi 5 years ago & now have another.

Great machines but they can take some fettling to get sorted initially.

Many thanks for that! I'll be over there for chats!
I'm in north Cornwall.

[JeffOlson]

Okay, just a quickly...

Very nice! A bit like my Norge, only sexier...

[Scud]

I have never seen that paint scheme before. 

You are forgiven for falling in love and buying it without conducting your due diligence research. And so your relationship is off to a rocky start... but it'll smooth out and probably last a long time.

[pete roper]

My mate Peter in Townsville has one just like it. I rollerised it at 4,000km or so.



As I've probably said before Sports seem to be very hard on their tappets. I think these are the ones out of a 9.5K Km Sport.



Pete

[nobleswood]

I like the Supermodel on the pic that JeffOlson put up rather than Ropers pic.
 

[pete roper]

I like the Supermodel on the pic that JeffOlson put up rather than Ropers pic.
 

Peter runs on Pizza and red wine. I fear the other one might be a bit more costly to run......

Pete

[Chuck in Indiana]

Oh, there's no doubt that the other would be more expensive to run. 

[smdl]

Oh, there's no doubt that the other would be more expensive to run. 

Sure, but that might be an acceptable trade-off...

[lucian]

Careful what you wish for men. She could be a flat tappet model.

[smdl]

Careful what you wish for men. She could be a flat tappet model.

Oh, no.  She's a high-roller for sure!

[Padsta]

No supermodel here!


imag

[pauldaytona]

But with service at 1200 miles and 4025 miles done there should not have been a second service, so just do service at next point, that is 6000miles?  And when it breaks you get it paid.