Do you ever wish Moto Guzzi would become like BMW?

[willowstreetguzziguy]

I got my first BMW in 1978, a beautiful R90S. Loved that thing! Rode it everywhere. I also loved going to the rallys. Lots of riders, all on opposed twins until 1985. Loved the commrodery. There was something special there, even at the national rallys with thousands of riders.

It changed slightly in 1985 when they introduced the K100 and the K75 the next year. The R90S was giving me problems so I sold it and got a new K75C. The 3 & 4 cylinder bikes sold along side the opposed twins for awhile.

Somewhere in the 1990's and 2000's they began introducing all kinds of bikes, even chain drive bikes. I was raising a family but still riding 2 different K75's and 2 opposed twins at different times. I could not shake the boring "Electric Motor" feel of the inline triple. In 2013 I needed a change... a twin! Nothing that BMW  was making had the feel of my old R90S until I found Moto Guzzi and zeroed in on an '08 1200 Sport. Nirvana, heaven again but in a more modern formant more reliable. The riders, the v-twin bikes, the rallys, are very reminiscent of the 1970's  and early 80's with BMW! And here I feel like I'm back where I belong!

I like Moto Guzzi as only a V-Twin company but others probably wish for more diversity, like BMW. If MG diverged into other engine types, would we loose this close commrodery? Would it be less exclusive? BMW offers so many different models and reading their monthly owners magazine just feels like a "Big Corporation" rather then a "Mom & Pop" group.

I guess it all depends on what you want out of it. If they were capable of it, do you ever wish for more diversity with MG or staying the same?
 

[Arizona Wayne]

In the past MG had more diversity copying other brands.  Apparently they figured out that was foolish on their part.  It's obvious MG doesn't feel a need to be everybodies MC like Jap. brands.  If MGs were a dime a dozen, I'd not have any.  I prefer riding odd brands. 

As far as being like BMW, good God, I hope not! 

[beetle]

No.

[ITSec]

BMW has significantly more resources than Moto Guzzi. For that matter, it has significantly more resources than Piaggio as a whole (at least now that the other Piaggio businesses are spun off). Those resources allow it to experiment and make mistakes (Husqvarna, for example). It can succeed with these experiments, but it can also go down roads that its customers won't follow (R1200 cruisers, for example).

As a smaller company, Moto Guzzi is in a position that allows it less chance to experiment (and fail) and less chance to experiment (and succeed). That means that when a direction is established that shows promise (renewed retro designs like the Cali 14 family, and the newer V7 and V9 designs) it tends to chase them down relentlessly - since it's less costly to be evolutionary than revolutionary. It means that when development and design dollars are allocated, some projects get put on hold till a current project is complete - such as the next generation of CARC bikes, which will likely come, but not until the current V9 and Cali 14 efforts have run their course.

Would I love to see Mandello del Lario more responsive, more flexible, more willing to experiment? Of course! Would I want them to become BMW Motorad? No.

[Moto]

No. I'd like them to become LESS like BMW. The Breva was a bit too close for comfort, same with the Norge.

How about a nice Falcone?

I'm not giving corporate advice for a successful company. I'm saying what I'd like, as requested.

I also don't want them to become more like Harley, which they're doing.

Moto

[pete roper]

No.

Plus about a quintillion! And the wasps are buzzing........

[flip]

The Breva was a bit too close for comfort, same with the Norge.
Moto

Those Breva based bikes are the only Guzzi's I really like and what brought me to Moto Guzzi ownership.

I'm fine with Guzzi making only v-twins. What I'd like to see more diversity in style, handling and performance than what they are currently selling.

A lot of y'all like cruisers or retro looking bikes but I'm not one of them. For all of you that bought them and love them, I'm happy for you.

[wirespokes]

In the past Moto Guzzi has produced just about every engine configuration there is, and then some. But that's not what you're asking.

I'm like you, and enjoy the closeness of the Guzzi riders. It's there in the beemer community, but not as prominent. I repair airhead gauges and the guys who send them to me are all good people.

It might just be due to the size of the group - people go into different mind sets when they feel like they're only one small part of the whole rather than an important piece (with only a few others around). The Guzzi events I've been to feel like a big family affair - and not the bickering and back-stabbing big families can get into. :-)

It's more a big collection of friends - people happy to have someone with similar tastes to talk to. I just spent last weekend at a Guzzi camp out in eastern Oregon. Good food, a cannon that shot bowling balls a mile into a distant hillside, shooting in the gulch across the road, corona bombs at night, Halibut and roadkill stew for dinner - what's not to like about that???

A friend who was into Guzzis ten years ago said that Guzzi went the direction BMW should have - rather than radically changing the twins, they should have evolved them farther. The newer Guzzis (like early 2002) still had the feel of the earlier ones. I haven't ridden the newer ones, so don't have an opinion to add there.

Everything has to change or it dies. Things either expand and grow, or they whither and die. I'd like to see Guzzi continue, so it's going to have to change and expand. But I have no suggestions except to maybe make parts easier to source (I'm still figuring that out).

One of the things I don't like about the newer BMWs is how automatic everything is. More bells and whistles. They're expensive to upkeep, and when they fail, they fail horribly. A friend with an R12Adventure has to take it in every year for a new fuel gauge pick up in the tank. Luckily it's on warranty, but if it wasn't it would be expensive. I like the simplicity of the older bikes where you have to know what you're doing. You have to know how to brake so you don't skid and fall over. You feel the road and get a feeling of speed long before triple digits. And, you know, I think it IS possible to have character without undependability. Funny thing is, I trust my 77T3 more than I would a newer fuel injected bike. I know I can take care of the T3, but if something fails on the injected bike with all the electronics, I'd be screwed.

[fossil]

Definitely not. Here in Germany about a quarter of all bikes sold are BMW�s. Most of them R1200 GS. Without any question extremely good bikes but the most of them in my eyes (!) are ugly. They look like an erection crane on two wheels. Even the R9T does not have the fine details that can be found on the current Guzzis and Triumphs, or the Indians. Or the CB 1100. Or...

Guzzi in the moment builds something completely different. Perhaps it has to do with "lifestyle" or things like this. Should they offer different lines of bikes? Perhaps. As Moto wrote: perhaps a new Falcone, with a modern single cylinder. It may even be water cooled (Indian and Triumph prove that a wc engine must not be ugly). It must be driveable and not too expensive. And the V2 range could easily be enhanced.

[Carlo DeSantis]

I think a more apt comparison might be BMW and Piaggio.

Moto Guzzi occupies a niche within the Piaggio range and as such likely will never be a full-range manufacturer of motorcycles.

Over the past 30 or so years, BMW has grown from manufacturing one basic engine (boxer airheads) with a few different iterations to a full line that includes scooters on one end of the continuum and six cylinder land barges on the other.  Other than the land barge, Piaggio has (or had) most of the same categories covered -- but with multiple brands rather than model lines within a single brand.

The biggest difference between BMW and Piaggio, IMO, is that of German vs Italian design.  Add to that the different implementation strategies that reflect Germany vs Italy and there you have the full story.

Best,

Carlo

 

[Nic in Western NYS]

Would I wish for more diversity within MG if the product were capable?  Sure, but it would come with a big cost.  BMW now is a slick, corporate, BIG thing that does not seem to tolerate small dealers, the kinds of dealers that WG'ers probably appreciate the most.  But MG is now a line of a big corporate firm, so it's possible that more diversity could happen if Piaggio saw the opportunity.
So I'll bite - the only engine configuration that I'd be interested in would be a water-cooled V4, same transverse 90 degree longitudinal crankshaft design.  For all I know, that's not a design that's at all practical to build, but it would be distinctive and in keeping with the Guzzi VIBE.

[kingoffleece]

Like a lot of others, I had bikes several of the manufactures and have come to appreciate the unique character of the Guzzi.
As an aside, I purchased my NORGE as I wanted a full faring bike for all the colder and wet weather riding I do.  While I do ride my V7 more day in and day out at 60 I now prefer a bit of protection for 2000 plus mile outings and all the other full faring bikes seemed, as mentioned, too "perfect" and car like.

The V7 range, though, checks all the right boxes and has a feel not duplicated by any other.

[Chuck in Indiana]

No. I'd like them to become LESS like BMW. The Breva was a bit too close for comfort, same with the Norge.

How about a nice Falcone?

I'm not giving corporate advice for a successful company. I'm saying what I'd like, as requested.

I also don't want them to become more like Harley, which they're doing.

Moto

What Moto said.

[oldbike54]

 The main thing MG needs to do is focus on the little things . Initial quality control , making sure that the nomenclature used in service manuals is clear . Yeah , a sporting model would be interesting to many , but let's fix a couple of issues first , competing with the large companies head on in the performance market is tough .

 To answer the OP's question , BMW could teach MG a couple of lessons , but most of us probably appreciate MG for what it is , and BMW for what it is , different in a good way .

 Dusty

[Rough Edge racing]

 Ducati sells about 5 times as many bikes as Moto Guzzi...Ducati has used the same basic formula ,90 degree sporting V twins...Just recently the Ducati went to liquid cooling..But still a V twin..There's no argument that Ducatis are light weight and the top models offer world class performance far above any Guzzi's....and of course some are expensive...
   I believe a niche manufacturer like Guzzi  should take a look at Ducati...And since Ducati might be for sale, Paggio should buy it...
 

[oldbike54]

 Why would Piaggio buy Ducati Tony ? How many times has Ducati changed owners over the last several years , something isn't copacetic with the company . Ducati is just one more example of a high profile company that is probably on the verge of failure most of the time .

 Dusty

[arveno]

Piaggio please .... do not buy Ducati.....and maybe sell guzzi to someone that really want the Mandello's eagle to fly again...for real.

to the original question : hell no !

[Rough Edge racing]

Why would Piaggio buy Ducati Tony ? How many times has Ducati changed owners over the last several years , something isn't copacetic with the company . Ducati is just one more example of a high profile company that is probably on the verge of failure most of the time .

 Dusty

  I'm just saying, a bit of sarcasm...But despite it's constant verge of failure, Ducati has an image of extreme performance, and that sells bikes...Just as Guzzi is a different type of machine, so is Ducati ...
  I believe Guzzi needs a  performance bike that weighs a lot less than current models....

[mtiberio]

Ducati is now more like Guzzi...

[vstevens]

As others have said, I'd like to see a smaller, simpler bike... single cylinder, perhaps.  Something akin to the Sym Wolf (a modern iteration of the Honda CB 125/250). 

My daughter recently got her motorcycle license and is too short in the legs for my V7.  Guzzi might attract newer riders with a smaller, basic 'entry level' 125 or 250 with a seat height around 25" inches or so.  Something new motorcyclist can work on and learn how to maintain.... but with Guzzi character!

[Sheepdog]

I've only had one Guzzi; my beloved Vintage. It's not that I didn't want another one before or after. Guzzi has built some bikes that I wanted badly through the years, but life often forces choices that push things like motorcycles to the back of the queue. So that Eldo/Lemans/Sport that I lusted for at various times had to wait until kids/home/work issues were fully dealt with. 10 years ago a window of opportunity opened and I was able to procure that magnificent Vintage. The kids had jobs with health insurance and I was within a year of retirement...perfec t.

However, in the meantime I had a longing to ride that I could not suppress. I filled the longing with a parade of cheap used bikes that I would bring back to life and ride until they got unreliable. Among those heaps was a 1960 BMW R60 that I got in trade for a tired '72 VW Type II. The front wheel was so out-of-round that it became uncontrollable at 55mph and the jetting was so wrong that starting it initially required a very long hill. I mean this bike was so old it had a generator (instead of an alternator) and was manufactured in Munich (instead of Berlin). I nursed it back to being reliable and enjoyed it for many years as a unique and curiously competent ride. I eventually sold it back to the fellow I bought it from (due to a transfer to another state) and miss it still.

Fast-forward to the present. My Guzzi is getting a little long of tooth and I've come into some money, but  nothing in the present Guzzi line lights my fire. On the other hand, BMW has made a bike that I believe is a high watermark machine in the water-cooled Boxers. With this machine they have completed the modernization journey that started with the K-bikes. A clever motorcycle engine configuration has been made completely modern and safety/convenience features once only available in automobiles were made part of the package. I bought one.

Does that mean that my Guzzi is out and the Beemer is in? Well, let's just say I love them both! They are different enough that I have expanded my motorcycling paradigm a great deal and both have a practical side that make them as satisfying to ride to the store as they are to ride two states over. I can't say what will happen to these very distinguished motorcycle companies over time, but for now I feel lucky to have the pair of these superb and interesting bikes.

[twodogs]

No would not like that but if I was selling a bimmer it would be long gone by now, unlike my 1200 sport that has not even had a question about it just saying.
Bruce

[kingoffleece]

For me, part of the charm is that the bikes aren't too "modern" in all the electronics.

I'm no luddite but I'm sure I don't desire 6 traction controls, 14 suspension adjustments, 6 pull down menus, and all that.
Guzzi has hit a sweet spot for this rider.  Just enough of the "add-ons" and not too much.  And I think it's fine that Guzzi is not chasing the HP race.  Having had high HP bikes the feeling was always go go go and more go.  But the fun was less less and less.  Nothing under 100mph was even interesting and that's not how I wanted to live.

I've seen skilled pilots DUST riders on every make of the so called latest and greatest.

I guess the point is it's nice to have a choice-and we all get to have what we want-that's nice, too.

[Tusayan]

In terms of product and customer support philosophy, I'd like both Guzzi and BMW to be like BMW of 1982, with updated design.  Good parts availability, quality, simplicity and enjoyable character.  The modern version of BMW has nothing that appeals to me, they build disposable two-wheeled cars intended to position each owner on a treadmill that never stops delivering money.

[kingoffleece]

BMW=BringMoreMoney.

That said, the bride has her eye on a new 310R when they show up.

[twowings]

Saggy jugs and more useless buttons than a washing machine?? Nope, thanks just the same...🤔

[JJ]

Short answer...."NO"   

BMW are great motorcycles, and I have owned and ridden five (5) in my time....but they are two different companies and bikes...period....a nd they should stay that way...(IMHO) 

[sidecarnutz]

I had a 1971 R75/5 when I was courting my wife. No car. Couldn't keep the thing running while I lived in a Navy barracks. Local Dealer was too far away to be of any help.

Came back from the Gulf War in 1991 and ran into some local Guzzi riders. I found  the round head 1000's to be fascinating! Great combination of comfort, torque and good handling and braking. It just made sense to me that the same frame and engine could be used on very different bikes. The later square head 1000's were very cool as well peaking, IMO, with the 1000S bikes of the early 90's. I had a garage to work in by then, and there was nothing on a Guzzi I couldn't well handle myself. I just needed a great dealer who stocked parts! Thank God for Joe Eish! For many years he was my go to dealer for parts.

29 Guzzi's later, I am still having fun with them! I still own #27. That's the one I mounted the sidecar on this morning!

I for one don't want Guzzi to become more like BMW.

[ohiorider]

Short answer...."NO"   

BMW are great motorcycles, and I have owned and ridden five (5) in my time....but they are two different companies and bikes...period....a nd they should stay that way...(IMHO) 

Well stated, JJ.  They are definitely different machines, from companies with different goals.

[Yard Sale]

The only other engine configuration Moto Guzzi should produce is a V-8. A replica/update of their own GP V-8, that is.