Author Topic: How many use a fluke  (Read 27554 times)

Offline rboe

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #30 on: February 19, 2015, 07:54:13 AM »
Fluke at work that we "inherited" from a careless workman that left it and never came back. Doesn't see much use.

Simpson at home that sees little use; but a RadioShack DMM that does see some use. Have a couple cheap cheap meters too. One that sees some use every couple years, another I won at a Rally that is still in the packaging. I think the plan was to put it in the tank bag for road trips.
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Offline redrider90

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #31 on: February 19, 2015, 07:59:58 AM »
You can find good testings done on some youtube:  fluke performs against other brands. Like Jim says they are bullet proof. But Jim is a pro and no doubt needs the extra the fluke will deliver.
But if you are an average not daily user and if you will not be using it at it maximum capabilities then it comes down to is it worth the difference. I'm no pro and never will be so it wasn't worth it. I prefer to not buy used electronics unless you are sure of the source.
This guy is funny and has all sorts of tests on electronic products.
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gh1n_ELmpFI
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Offline Triple Jim

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #32 on: February 19, 2015, 08:12:27 AM »
Where are you buying your fuses? Last I bought fuses for our "fleet" of Flukes at work they were under $10.

Retail suppliers really do charge a lot for those high voltage interrupt fuses.  I can usually find a couple on eBay for a few bucks when I need them.  The 87 beeps a warning if I have the leads in the current measuring locations and set the meter to volts, so I don't tend to blow fuses in that meter.   :D

If you're never measuring high voltages, you can install cheaper fuses, but I don't to that except temporarily.
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Offline charlie b

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #33 on: February 19, 2015, 08:14:41 AM »
So, the big question is, what do you need it for and how precise do you need the measurement to be?



See my earlier post.

For the rpm feature especially for small single cylinders.

Then get a tachometer.  And for the VOM duties get cheap HF versions.

It's not like you are working on a missile or laser system.  :)

PS yes I do have a Fluke at home.  It was free.  The guy who had it got a new one and was going to throw it away.  I grabbed it out of his hands :)  FWIW, I rarely use it cause I almost always have one of the cheap HF versions with me.

« Last Edit: February 19, 2015, 08:18:41 AM by charlie b »
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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #33 on: February 19, 2015, 08:14:41 AM »

Offline Wayne Orwig

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #34 on: February 19, 2015, 08:20:39 AM »
We have a number of Fluke meters, Tektronix scopes, Rohde & Schwarz receivers, at work. We have to maintain current traceable calibration on them.
That is why I use cheap stuff at home. I get more value out of having three cheaper meters laying around, then one high end one that would 'leave me stranded' if it failed, or I simply questioned that it was working right.
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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #35 on: February 19, 2015, 08:31:12 AM »
Have a Fluke 23 I bought years ago and it probably needs recalibrating by now but seems spot on. Other than changing the battery and cleaning the rotary switch contacts it has been trouble free. Only have the thermistor attachment though in which I have never used. Most of my older analog test equipment is byTektronics.  Another quality manufacturer.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2015, 08:31:48 AM by LaMojo »

Offline Two Checks

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #36 on: February 19, 2015, 08:36:26 AM »
Retail suppliers really do charge a lot for those high voltage interrupt fuses.  I can usually find a couple on eBay for a few bucks when I need them.  The 87 beeps a warning if I have the leads in the current measuring locations and set the meter to volts, so I don't tend to blow fuses in that meter.   :D

If you're never measuring high voltages, you can install cheaper fuses, but I don't to that except temporarily.

We used to buy lots of electronic components at work from places like Newark, Allied, etc so we got the fuses fairly cheap. I use a Fluke 83 at work and a 77 at home, also a Simpson 265 I got from work for $5. I think I gave my 260 to my son who is a electrical maintenence man in a stel mill.
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Offline Triple Jim

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #37 on: February 19, 2015, 08:38:28 AM »
One problem with cheap meters is their response to non sine wave AC.  I once measured the output of a square wave inverter with several cheap meters and my Fluke 87, which is a true RMS meter.  The cheap meters were all over the place, and none read anywhere near 120VAC.  The 87 did what it was supposed to do.

This can come into play around motorcycles when measuring things like battery voltage with the engine running.  The output of the regulator is not steady DC, and causes ripple on the battery's DC.  Meters that aren't designed for measuring DC with ripple can give readings that are pretty far off in a case like this.

Some guys insist on using analog meters around vehicles for this reason.  Analog meters are also immune to RF interference from the ignition system, where even a Fluke can get confused.  I've had to put ferrite beads on the meter leads a few times, to keep the Fluke happy when making measurements around CDI systems.
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Offline jetmechmarty

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #38 on: February 19, 2015, 09:16:41 AM »
The biggest problem with cheap meters is they can kill you!  I'd hate to have one short out when trying to read 480 vac!  BOOM!  Fluke is the good stuff.

I keep those $5 HF meters all over the place.  They're in my tank bag, glove box, etc.  It's fine for that purpose, 90% of the time.


LCD Automotive Multimeter with Tachometer Kit $35 at HF

That's probably what I'd get for my own garage using it once or twice every couple of years.  As a professional, where accuracy and safety are paramount, Fluke is a good choice.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2015, 09:17:11 AM by jetmechmarty »
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Offline kckershovel

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #39 on: February 19, 2015, 09:19:39 AM »
I fish with Flukes all the time. Great Bass lure.

Offline redrider90

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #40 on: February 19, 2015, 09:58:04 AM »
One problem with cheap meters is their response to non sine wave AC.  I once measured the output of a square wave inverter with several cheap meters and my Fluke 87, which is a true RMS meter.  The cheap meters were all over the place, and none read anywhere near 120VAC.  The 87 did what it was supposed to do.

This can come into play around motorcycles when measuring things like battery voltage with the engine running.  The output of the regulator is not steady DC, and causes ripple on the battery's DC.  Meters that aren't designed for measuring DC with ripple can give readings that are pretty far off in a case like this.

Some guys insist on using analog meters around vehicles for this reason.  Analog meters are also immune to RF interference from the ignition system, where even a Fluke can get confused.  I've had to put ferrite beads on the meter leads a few times, to keep the Fluke happy when making measurements around CDI systems.



Help this layman out Jim. What is the purpose of ferrite beads?
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Offline Kiwi_Roy

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #41 on: February 19, 2015, 10:03:22 AM »
The biggest problem with cheap meters is they can kill you!  I'd hate to have one short out when trying to read 480 vac!  BOOM!  Fluke is the good stuff.
 
That's the reason Flukes have the High Rupturing Capacity fuse. I just looked up our Fluke 179 it uses a Bussman DMM 44/100 that's rated 10,000 Amps @ 1000 VAC This fuse is listed at CAD$43.58 on Digikey, over $90 on other sites, and that's just for the milliamp range.
 
I spoke to an electrician once who tried to measure 3.3KV with an AVO, he said every time he tried to lift the probe of it would draw a long arc. In the end he just dropped it and ran. That was in the days before you had to wear a fancy suit working on live switchgear.

To put it in perspective 10,000 Amps at 480 Volts is equivalent to 6,000 HP, everyday stuff for an industrial electrician.
As Jetmechmarty says, working around high powered AC you need quality instruments. The electrical industry is very concerned about cheap Chinese knockoff components, I'm sure you can buy a "Bussman" fuse from China with a strand of copper wire inside for <$10
« Last Edit: February 19, 2015, 11:21:47 AM by Kiwi_Roy »
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Offline Scott DeRoss

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #42 on: February 19, 2015, 10:14:03 AM »
The biggest problem with cheap meters is they can kill you!  I'd hate to have one short out when trying to read 480 vac!  BOOM!  Fluke is the good stuff.

I keep those $5 HF meters all over the place.  They're in my tank bag, glove box, etc.  It's fine for that purpose, 90% of the time.


LCD Automotive Multimeter with Tachometer Kit $35 at HF

That's probably what I'd get for my own garage using it once or twice every couple of years.  As a professional, where accuracy and safety are paramount, Fluke is a good choice.
This would be great if it did one and two cylinder engines. So I guess my question would be, what do people use for tuning rpm on one and two cylinder engines two or four cycle motors. Since most meters start at three and up.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2015, 10:26:57 AM by Scott DeRoss »
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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #43 on: February 19, 2015, 10:33:28 AM »
That's the reason Flukes have the High Rupturing Capacity fuse.
I spoke to an electrician once who tried to measure 3.3KV with an AVO, he said every time he tried to lift the probe of it would draw a long arc. In the end he just dropped it and ran. That was in the days before you had to wear a fancy suit working on live switchgear.

Linemen/electricians have been wearing long sleeve insulating gloves and vests for 75 years or more to work on high voltages.Sounds like the guys was being very careless... 3300 volts doesn't care about fuses and may jump the blown fuse and zap you anyway....High voltage high current demands specialized tools.....

Offline Triple Jim

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #44 on: February 19, 2015, 10:47:35 AM »
Help this layman out Jim. What is the purpose of ferrite beads?

Passing the wire through a ferrite bead or snap-together ferrite choke forms an inductor in the wire.  Inductors don't like to allow a sudden change in current, and tend toward becoming an open circuit at high frequencies, looking like a broken wire to RF.  Since RF interference from ignition systems is a high frequency phenomenon (radio frequency), the bead(s) greatly reduce the ability of the RF to get to the meter.
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Offline charlie b

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #45 on: February 19, 2015, 10:51:42 AM »
This would be great if it did one and two cylinder engines. So I guess my question would be, what do people use for tuning rpm on one and two cylinder engines two or four cycle motors. Since most meters start at three and up.

If you have it set for 4cyl, 4 stroke that means it is measuring the number of pulses and doubling.  4cyl is times 4.  4 stroke is divided by 2.
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Offline Kiwi_Roy

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #46 on: February 19, 2015, 11:38:29 AM »
Linemen/electricians have been wearing long sleeve insulating gloves and vests for 75 years or more to work on high voltages.Sounds like the guys was being very careless... 3300 volts doesn't care about fuses and may jump the blown fuse and zap you anyway....High voltage high current demands specialized tools.....

No argument from me, In that respect I think Linemen were probably leading the way, an awful lot got killed in those 75 years.
The guy was the first to admit he had been stupid, he was just trying to pass on the experience to prevent someone else doing something equally so, If I saw him again I would thank him for it. BTW I'm pretty sure some AVOs had a pair of terminals labeled for something like 3.5 KV at the top.
http://www.richardsradios.co.uk/avo8.html  I still have a Model 8 but it's too valuable to use.
I was working with an apprentice once, he looked at an outlet, it read 10 Amps and before I could stop him jambed the meter probes in to check if it really was 10, fortunately the AVO had a really good protection arrangement.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2015, 11:50:03 AM by Kiwi_Roy »
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Offline oldmxdog61u

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #47 on: February 19, 2015, 01:00:27 PM »
I remember using a Jesus hook to ground out high voltage systems when working on them. You haven't lived until you are twisted up inside of a large piece of equipment using in eccess of one million volts that shunts to ground while your working on it.
I had quite a surprise from that.
we used a special fluke and probe if live. Yes, gloves shield and rubber suit like some serial killer.
Good memories.
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Offline GuzziPilot

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #48 on: February 19, 2015, 05:55:13 PM »
I like the older, less glitzy Flukes like the 77, I tolerate the newer ones, and also think they're grossly overpriced.  Mandated to calibrate them annually, to relatively exacting standards, and they usually do need it.  So no digital meter is good forever......but are reasonably OK.  I really favor the analogs and specifically Simpson meters.  And you can zero them on every use, they'll indicate spurious fluctuations, where digitals wont even budge.

But, after all we're discussing a solid signal here and relative ease of use that any $10 meter will provide....so don't overspend just so you own the top brand.

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Offline oldmxdog61u

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #49 on: February 19, 2015, 11:00:31 PM »
It used to be you could tell a lot about a man by his tools. Used to be.  My dad would turn over in his grave with the idea of disposable tools aka  h/f. Can't say I didn't inherit a similar feeling for quality tools.
Still bugs the neck out if me to see cheap worn out tools used to further bigger up a bike. That said, I have a complete set of disposable tools myself for the boat, such that for emergency,  if lost or more  I borrowed, I am not out some tool passed down from my great grandfathers time.
since many of my "keeper" tools are such vintage, they are like old friends.
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Offline rodekyll

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #50 on: February 20, 2015, 01:39:52 AM »
My boat went down with a bunch of snap-on aboard.  By the time we got them back they were ruined.

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #51 on: February 20, 2015, 06:00:35 AM »
I remember using a Jesus hook to ground out high voltage systems when working on them. You haven't lived until you are twisted up inside of a large piece of equipment using in eccess of one million volts that shunts to ground while your working on it.
I had quite a surprise from that.
we used a special fluke and probe if live. Yes, gloves shield and rubber suit like some serial killer.
Good memories.

 I was a construction wiremen not a linemen but we did high voltage work. I worked in high voltage vaults with 17K live wires all around while dressed in normal work clothes. We shut it down for splicing...then test the 5 foot long high voltage test stick by raising the hood of a running truck and holding it by the distributor. Then ground the phase conductors ....sometimes with a chain...Depending on the situation I worked on live 240 volt bare handed. 3000 volts will burn your arms off, 460 volts with high amperage if shorted phase to phase or phase to ground will explode vaporizing metal and blowing a workman 20 feet with his body smoking... While working on live stuff,even 120 volt, every fiber in your body is focused on the task at hand.

Offline jetmechmarty

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #52 on: February 20, 2015, 07:47:10 AM »
It used to be you could tell a lot about a man by his tools. Used to be.  My dad would turn over in his grave with the idea of disposable tools aka  h/f. Can't say I didn't inherit a similar feeling for quality tools.
 :beat_horse

The tools I've carried on the job have always been first quality.  I've always used what I like and what feels best in my hands.  Tools like that are very expensive.  The tools at home that I use often are what I call Craftsman quality.  No junk, but being sensible about the cost.  The specialty tools for home that might get used once or twice, I don't hesitate to pick up at a place like HF.  If I break it and still see a need for it, I might replace it with a better one.  A Fluke meter for working on my motorcycle occasionally is unlikely.  For working on an airplane, or plant maintenance, Fluke is a name I trust.
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Offline redrider90

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #53 on: February 20, 2015, 11:30:43 AM »
Passing the wire through a ferrite bead or snap-together ferrite choke forms an inductor in the wire.  Inductors don't like to allow a sudden change in current, and tend toward becoming an open circuit at high frequencies, looking like a broken wire to RF.  Since RF interference from ignition systems is a high frequency phenomenon (radio frequency), the bead(s) greatly reduce the ability of the RF to get to the meter.



Do they teach that in school.  ;D :bow
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Offline Triple Jim

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #54 on: February 20, 2015, 01:04:16 PM »
Do they teach that in school.  ;D :bow

Yes, if you're studying electrical engineering 40 years ago.  I hope it's still part of the curriculum.  I studied mechanical engineering, but got pretty far into ham radio later, and ended up learning a lot of RF related stuff.
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Offline rodekyll

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #55 on: February 20, 2015, 01:18:29 PM »
Or you can ask Wayne about ferrite beads.  He'll tell you.   ;-T

Offline Pasta Hog

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #56 on: February 20, 2015, 01:38:48 PM »
I got spoiled by Fluke meters when I was in college. My physics professors used them. Then I went out in the real world and found out what they cost.
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Offline Mark West

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #57 on: February 20, 2015, 05:07:28 PM »
I bought a 77 when they first came out in the mid 80's and it works flawlessly to this day. didn't know there was a tach attachment. I also have a mini meter from Extech that I carry with a small tool kit and costs 20 bucks or something. It's fine but could never replace the Fluke. I suspect one of my kids will be giving it to one of their kids one day.
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Offline JoeW

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #58 on: February 20, 2015, 05:18:46 PM »
I have an older Fluke 88. It was a shop tool and is now not working. I was quoted 350.00 to have it repaired, I've not done it, yet. As far as setting idle, I use a Snap-On timing light with a digital display for advance and RPM. Not sure how much they are now but, you get two tools in one!
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Offline rodekyll

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Re: How many use a fluke
« Reply #59 on: February 20, 2015, 05:31:45 PM »
I have a fancy snap-on timing light with a dial for delaying the strobe.  You can find where the timing mark is and then 'dial it in' to the proper timing marks.  The dial will show you how far out you are.  Very handy.  I took it for a walk last week and the bulb flashed once.  I think after 40 years the smoke came out of the bulb part.  You can still hear it buzz and click like it should, but no light.

 

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