General Category > General Discussion
2003 EV no start, Cam sensor?
jrt:
I have a 2003 EV hydro that won't start. It simply cut out on me driving home- I thought it ran out of gas. So, I put some gas in it, it started, I drove to the gas station, filled it up, started home and it died again. I think I've covered the common issues- I thought it might be the relays, so I ordered new ones from Dan- replaced them all. Checked all the fuses. I have the sidestand leads wired together permanently.
Next, I removed the tank, checked all the connections (there's five big waterproof connectors under the tank). They look fine- no corrosion. Looked for exposed or loose wiring. But- I could not find any connections that might have come loose.
The fuel pump cycles, all electrical devices (horn/signals lights) are working properly. Fuel filter is new.
So now I am wondering if it might be the cam position sensor- I have the three-wire version, and no sensor on the bell housing. After reading these two threads:
https://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=101903.0 (Smithswede's V7 wouldn't run)
and
https://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=95648.0 (98 EV won't run)
I measured the resistance across the three leads (on the sensor side), but none of them show current- they are all infinite ohms. Should I see 680 ohms across two of the leads?
I don't see gas on the plugs, but it has been a week or two since it has run, so I didn't expect to see anything. I can pull out the sensor as well, but I don't know what I would look for if I did that.
Any other tests I should run while it is apart? I'm thinking maybe I should put the tank back on and try to crank it over, look for spark then check for gas on the plugs? That darn tank is heavy when it is full of gas.
jrt:
It has the external fuel pump and filter. Actually, I'm using a big-ass filter from a Subaru (don't judge me!) and it has less than 200 miles on it. The 'new' tank I'm using was clean, the petcock (manual) flows just fine. The throttle bodies are connected, the injectors have pressure (I had to tighten up the clamp to stop a leak on one side).
The sockets for the relays and fuses look good- very little oxidation. There may be a wire that's come loose under one of them, but I'm not seeing it yet. One old relay did test bad, so that's what I initially thought it was. I'll have another look at the sockets.
I'll squirt some starter fluid in the intake...it might be next week before I get to the point where I can do that (work sucks!). It is a good suggestion.
I will continue to follow up and post a resolution when I get it sorted. Now, where did I put my electric hammer?
Thank you
JRT
SmithSwede:
Yes. You should see about 680 ohms across two of the wires. (One of the wires is just a sheathing that is grounded to minimize radio wave interference.
At least on the V7, the tell tale sign of no cam phase signal is that you get BOTH an absence of spark, and an absence of fuel.
I think my problem was a bad connector on the cam phase sensor wire. It looked ok, but didn’t work. Letting some Craig De-Oxit sit on it for a good while fixed it.
FYI, you can get new ones much cheaper than stock Guzzi parts. Lots were used on Fiats. Just need to figure out the cross reference
Kiwi_Roy:
Yes you need to know if the timing sensor is working.
https://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzi007/schematics/2004_EV_Catalytic.gif
The pump will always prime when you turn the key On, that's just a simple timer inside the ECU turning on relay (50) to do that, nothing at all to do with the rotation sensor.
When you initiate cranking the timing sensor detects the engine rotation and turns On relay (50) again via the ECU so all you need to do is see if the relay is On, a little light bulb on the Red/Black wire, the 87 pin on relay (50) would be a good place to monitor that.
Another thing that will effect the smooth running is the condition of the signal to the ECU relay (52) its quite often less that 12 Volts due to a dirty contact, again a small lamp connected from 85 to 86 of the relay will monitor that.
pehayes:
I've had it happen twice on 98-EV. Front timing sensor. First time it was dirty contacts in the connector plug up under the tank. Second time it was due to an open/broken wire. Had to replace the sensor.
Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA
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