The Massive American Cars of 1970

[s1120]

70's cars were mostly pretty lame.  Poor quality...I remember the door gaps in my mom's 1975 Pontiac.  Had to be 1/2".  The overhangs on many of those cars were enormous.  The trunks stuck out several feet past the rear wheels.  I wonder who set the record for overhang. 

I remember turning the key to the off position, and then waiting for the car to quit dieseling, and finally actually quit running. 

And rust.  It was accepted that you'd have rust-through in just a few years.  Kept Ziebart in business. 

I can understand some of the nostalgia for the 70's cars, as they had some style and individuality, but bottom line is, the American consumers were suckers.  Thanks, Detroit.

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The early 70's were not all that bad. The cars stopped, and handled a bit better then the 60's era cars. Power was slowly going down, but the bones were still the same. Build quality was hit and miss but the real issues were a little down the road. Once the emission regs came it was down hill!!  They just had NO IDEA how to clean up the old engines. Build quility tanked, and things just crashed. The good news is that today these cars are a great starting point to building a cool car. They are a bit safer on todays roads then the older cars. Brakes were pretty good, handling improved. The engines were the same old engines we have had for years, and with todays aftermarket parts we can build them to run powerfull, clean, and efficient. By now any survivers were odds are the beter built ones, and with the knolage over the years we can go back and build them like they should have been built. I always said if you want to daily drive a old car.. you really cant top a 70's era car.

[Rough Edge racing]

 Not a massive car, but about 10 years ago I bought a 81 G body El Camino...It was  rust free but well used..I converted it from auto to 4 speed manual, built a typical SBC engine, urethane suspenson and body mounts, S10 front springs, stiffer rears, changed the power steering box spooling fr a better feel.
 The result was a lowered car/truck that handled like a Camaro,a firm ride that was great on smooth roads.. It even had working AC....But there was always the poor build quaity, door windows that bowed outward at high speed,  floppy doors,cheap trim parts and generally poor design ....The poor build quality just wears ya down....

[Scott of the Sahara]

My mom bought a 1970 Chevy Belair  4 door in late 1969. It had a 350 CI Engine rated at 250 Horsepower.
It was totally reliable and I could get 17MPG if I kept it around 55 to 60MPH.
I bought it from her in 1980 for $500.00
I would fill the car up with passengers and travel 1000 miles to Canada for school.
A few years later I sold the car because it was hard to fill up with gas at $1.30 a gallon.
I should have kept the car....

[GMies]

My car is Riviera -73, I like to drive on it. 

[JJ]

I have owned dozens of cars in my time, both domestic and foreign. 

I remember the days back east when one could buy a "winter beater" car for $250-$500, throw two 50-pound bags of rock salt in the trunk, and flog it through the winter, and then sell it for the same price the following spring, when it was time to break out the motorcycles again.  Those were the days...

From my recollection, a 1970 Ford Maverick was the biggest "POS" I ever owned...cheaply constructed, poor quality, always breaking down...did NOT like cold climates...Mine was a 6-cylinder..."Beater of my childhood memories!"

[Tom]

It looked cool.     While living in Mesa before moving back to Hawaii.  I had a 442, Torino,  Diplomat, Checker and lastly a Ranchero w/biggest engine you could get oem.  Should have kept that one. 

[blackcat]

....and lastly a Ranchero w/biggest engine you could get oem.  Should have kept that one. 

The insurance on the el Camino is like $200 bucks a year with Hagerty so I keep the truck.  It has a 396 with Hooker Headers (mistake) and a mildly lump cam which sounds good at idle but of course it sucks buckets of gas and is unGodly hot in the summertime. In terms of size, I don't think it is much bigger than the standard F-150 and with any bike in the bed I can't close the tailgate just like the Tundra's I use to own.

Guys are always trying to trade me their big ass trucks but they shy away when I try to hand them the keys.

[Tom]

Wishful thinking on their part.  Where was that picture taken 'cuz it would take a lot of water to keep that yard green.   

Currently working on a '86 El Camino Conquista w/305" engine.  No hot rod but I can work on it.   

[Tom]

Not a massive car, but about 10 years ago I bought a 81 G body El Camino...It was  rust free but well used..I converted it from auto to 4 speed manual, built a typical SBC engine, urethane suspenson and body mounts, S10 front springs, stiffer rears, changed the power steering box spooling fr a better feel.
 The result was a lowered car/truck that handled like a Camaro,a firm ride that was great on smooth roads.. It even had working AC....But there was always the poor build quaity, door windows that bowed outward at high speed,  floppy doors,cheap trim parts and generally poor design ....The poor build quality just wears ya down....

I have a '86 G body that I'm using for hauling bikes and as back-up.  You ever replace the hinge pins on the doors.  The driver's side is sagging.  I'm waiting for the parts to come in.  Seems straight forward but I'll be doing it by myself.  I'm looking at the engine hoist or the bike lift.  Not sure at this point.

The mounting circle clips for the rear brake cylinders is a real piece of engineering design.    Definitely confirms my theory that the design engineers don't work on the vehicles that they design. 

[blackcat]

Wishful thinking on their part.  Where was that picture taken 'cuz it would take a lot of water to keep that yard green.   

Currently working on a '86 El Camino Conquista w/305" engine.  No hot rod but I can work on it.   

House in Floriduh, taken last winter.  Winter vulnerable plants were in the bed of the truck which was headed back into the garage.

I always liked those mid-80's el Camino's and the 305 is reasonable OK in terms of gas mileage. The weak aspect of my vehicle was the stock rear suspension, so I removed the 50 year old air suspension and installed a new system with new springs and shocks.

[Tom]

Mine has air shocks installed by the PO., good for the infrequent bike loads from the harbor.  

[Rough Edge racing]

I have a '86 G body that I'm using for hauling bikes and as back-up.  You ever replace the hinge pins on the doors.  The driver's side is sagging.  I'm waiting for the parts to come in.  Seems straight forward but I'll be doing it by myself.  I'm looking at the engine hoist or the bike lift.  Not sure at this point.

The mounting circle clips for the rear brake cylinders is a real piece of engineering design.    Definitely confirms my theory that the design engineers don't work on the vehicles that they design.

yes, Did the hinge pins..A bike ift would be ideal, I  used a wheeled floor jack , the door steadied by my wife...You may still need a helper or.a temporary wooden cradle secured to the lift

[Tom]

I figured the bike lift would work best with caster wheels and tie-downs.  Probably some 4x4's & 2x4's.  Did you take the hinges completely off or just at the pins?

[blackcat]

I figured the bike lift would work best with caster wheels and tie-downs.  Probably some 4x4's & 2x4's.  Did you take the hinges completely off or just at the pins?

Forgot to answer this question. I just replaced the entire hinges, this was a dozen+ plus years ago, but I don't remember it being anything complicated. If my memory is correct I just fabricated a small platform to keep the door up and I replaced one hinge at a time. 

[Tom]

Good thoughts.   

[twowheeladdict]

The insurance on the el Camino is like $200 bucks a year with Hagerty so I keep the truck.  It has a 396 with Hooker Headers (mistake) and a mildly lump cam which sounds good at idle but of course it sucks buckets of gas and is unGodly hot in the summertime. In terms of size, I don't think it is much bigger than the standard F-150 and with any bike in the bed I can't close the tailgate just like the Tundra's I use to own.

Guys are always trying to trade me their big ass trucks but they shy away when I try to hand them the keys.

You don't see many cars with painted stripes these days.  All vinyl decals now.  That is a beauty for sure.  If I was the type who wanted to spend my weekends sitting around car shows I would have a rig like that.  Definitely wouldn't drag race something that clean. 

[Xlratr]

European cars have got bigger over the years. But Clarissa still shocks when i take her out for a ride! :-).  She’s a big girl.  (72 Newport)

[Rough Edge racing]

I figured the bike lift would work best with caster wheels and tie-downs.  Probably some 4x4's & 2x4's.  Did you take the hinges completely off or just at the pins?

I removed the hinges becaue the pin holes were egg shaped..I welded and got them back it shape...Might be easier to buy new ones ff the quality is decent. Can't imagine any original one being around but ya never know.
 
 

[john fish]

My car is Riviera -73, I like to drive on it. 

That's a beauty.  What size is the engine?

[Tom]

I removed the hinges becaue the pin holes were egg shaped..I welded and got them back it shape...Might be easier to buy new ones ff the quality is decent. Can't imagine any original one being around but ya never know.
 
 

I have the ones that come with different insert hole liners.  I'll probably do one hole at a time with the door attached to the body.  I was overthinking the whole process with taking the door off.  The sag seems to be in the bottom hinge.

[Lannis]

That's a beauty.  What size is the engine?

If it's a stock Riviera, they all came with the 455 ci engine; 250 HP standard or 260 HP with the performance options .. Pollution control was killing the 455 by then; the earlier 455s had options to take them to almost 400 HP ...

Lannis

[GMies]

If it's a stock Riviera, they all came with the 455 ci engine; 250 HP standard or 260 HP with the performance options .. Pollution control was killing the 455 by then; the earlier 455s had options to take them to almost 400 HP ...

Lannis

That's a beauty.  What size is the engine?

Yes, the car is unrestored and the engine is big block 455, 250 HP  DIN ( …. 400 HP SAE).   

[Two Checks]

Remember those HP ratings are NET, not gross, like they wer in 1970.
Today's engines make tons more power then the much bigger engines of yesteryear.
For example, my 70s 318 Chargers were rated at 150 HP net.
My 92 318 is rated at 230 net. That's the gross HP rating of the 318 in 1970.


We have engines now running on pump gas  making 700+ HP NET all the while getting twice the gas mileage. And these engines aren't even broken in at 100k.
In all areas today's vehicles are light years ahead of cars from back then...except for one.


RUST. Breathe on todays cars and you can hear them rust.


MoPar or no car!

[Gliderjohn]

Rust? Most of todays vehicles are WAY better dealing with rust. I had a 65 El Camino that at 10 years of age had half a rear quarter panel fall of due to total rust through. Chrysler vehicles as a whole were rust buckets. Have owned four Hondas, three of which sat out their whole life and were never waxed. All had over 200K miles and one almost 300K with nothing more than slight bits of surface rust around the real wheel well. My old 96 Nissan PU had sat out it's whole life without any rust. Dusty is still using it.
GliderJohn

[s1120]

Remember those HP ratings are NET, not gross, like they wer in 1970.
Today's engines make tons more power then the much bigger engines of yesteryear.
For example, my 70s 318 Chargers were rated at 150 HP net.
My 92 318 is rated at 230 net. That's the gross HP rating of the 318 in 1970.


We have engines now running on pump gas  making 700+ HP NET all the while getting twice the gas mileage. And these engines aren't even broken in at 100k.
In all areas today's vehicles are light years ahead of cars from back then...except for one.


RUST. Breathe on todays cars and you can hear them rust.


MoPar or no car!

Ya, 72 changed from gross to net..  Also the year that they started detuning for emission..  The good news is that under all those air cleaners was the same small and big blocks that are still run today on streets and tracks everywhere..  We know so much now how to get good, clean, efficient power, that its amazing what these old lumps can do with a few basic mods. Granted a lot of todays engines are a better starting point... 

[s1120]

Rust? Most of todays vehicles are WAY better dealing with rust. I had a 65 El Camino that at 10 years of age had half a rear quarter panel fall of due to total rust through. Chrysler vehicles as a whole were rust buckets. Have owned four Hondas, three of which sat out their whole life and were never waxed. All had over 200K miles and one almost 300K with nothing more than slight bits of surface rust around the real wheel well. My old 96 Nissan PU had sat out it's whole life without any rust. Dusty is still using it.
GliderJohn

Ya, im sitting here in upstate NY and have to say anything over 10 years old is on borrowed time..  Most modern stuff is MUCH better in controlling rust. There are some out there that rot just as fast though...  I think the much greater uses of salt, and this new slurry they are on the road is a huge factor though.. Working on cars from the 60's and 70's alot in the past I will say that with some exceptions [Aspen and Volare im looking at you!] the 70's stuff seemed to be sealed to the weather much better then the 60's stuff.. 

[blackcat]

You don't see many cars with painted stripes these days.  All vinyl decals now.  That is a beauty for sure.  If I was the type who wanted to spend my weekends sitting around car shows I would have a rig like that.  Definitely wouldn't drag race something that clean.

Thanks but it’s not a show car. It gets loaded with plywood, cement,etc and of course Xmas tree’s.

[cliffrod]

Ya, im sitting here in upstate NY and have to say anything over 10 years old is on borrowed time..  Most modern stuff is MUCH better in controlling rust. There are some out there that rot just as fast though...  I think the much greater uses of salt, and this new slurry they are on the road is a huge factor though.. Working on cars from the 60's and 70's alot in the past I will say that with some exceptions [Aspen and Volare im looking at you!] the 70's stuff seemed to be sealed to the weather much better then the 60's stuff..

Too funny- we moved to SC in 80 with our 76 Volare wagon.  It was my mother's car and wasn't all rusted up. I think it was 84 when i jacked it up in the driveway to fix a flat back tire.  There was only about 1" (probably less) of frame rail remaining at the top of the frame arch.  I told Ma the Volare was parked for good...

This was after we rebodied our completely rotten 73 Chevy C20 4x4 farm truck, also from VT.  We only had to burn off a few bolts and the remains of the body fell away on its own. I've still got it parked out back, think the entire rolling chassis is now officially lace paper thin.  It's like art.  It makes my current 73 Cheyenne daily driver look like its rust free, even with the holes through the floor.

[Sasquatch Jim]

 Here is the song "Rusty old American Dream".

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CeYpr5-HFWA

[Rough Edge racing]

 I moved to the Rochester NY area in 1973. A girlfriend had a bought new 70 Cougar that was starting to rust through at the door bottoms and top of the front fenders...I bought a 71 Datsun in 75, during a rainstorm my feet got wet..Front floors were gone,replaced by thin plywood. Most new vehicles showed holes in 5 years. Ford got stuck replacing the quarter panels and doors on the mid 70's Torinos because of  rust through. Mopars would suffer from rusted torsion bar mounts , Dodge van rear springs came through the floor. Ford PU truck cab mounts rusted causing the cab to drop and jam the steering column.
 I had a 65 Chevy PU rusted so badly you could see the inside from outside with the doors closed
 There was good rust and bad rust...Generally unit body vehicles suffered bad rust...
  Vehicles have been much more rust resistant the last 20 years..Well sorta. A few years ago I bought
a low mileage 09 4x4 Ford Ranger 5  speed. I knew the bed was rusted under the bed liner...Got a rust free Western bed....When the old bed was pulled, the rear part of the frame was very rusty and two crossmembers were nearly cut in half bt rust...A lot of grinding, welding in new metal saved a nice running truck...I learned that Ford had sold quite a few rear frames....it's a two piece affair riveted together just behind the cab..The front section had no bad rust issues....No recall that I know of..