H4 type LED headlight bulb...Anyone try one of these?

[Moto Fugazzi]

Do you have the photos posted somewhere else?  That forum won't let me see them unless I register.

I Just added the pics to my photobucket account here: http://s286.photobucket.com/user/ksiegel7/library/V11%20Sport?sort=3&page=1

The low beam is inconspicuous during the day, but I do turn on my aux. lights.
Ken

Edit: Each photo has been tagged properly…high beam, low beam, etc.

[Triple Jim]

Thanks very much, I'll take a look.

[cloudbase]

That kind of money buys plenty of standard style bulbs.  If your LED cooks, it's not as though you can pick up a replacement just about anywhere.

[Triple Jim]

Presumably you could put a standard halogen bulb in if the LED one quit. 

[Wayne Orwig]

That kind of money buys plenty of standard style bulbs.  If your LED cooks, it's not as though you can pick up a replacement just about anywhere.

You just unplug the after market system and plug in the old bulb.
In my case it is either a better light, or not riding every day. The factory lighting is too dangerous in the middle of the night for my daily drive. And in the case of the Stelvio, the stock system melts the headlight on high beam over a period of time.

[Moto Fugazzi]

ADV Monster now sells one as well for $45. Problems is, it's about 2" deep past the mounting flange. My V7C bucket is too shallow unless I cut a hole in the back, or buy a deeper bucket.
Ken
http://stores.advmonster.com/h4-led-headlight/

[Wayne Orwig]

ADV Monster now sells one as well for $45. Problems is, it's about 2" deep past the mounting flange. My V7C bucket is too shallow unless I cut a hole in the back, or buy a deeper bucket.
Ken
http://stores.advmonster.com/h4-led-headlight/

6000K color temp.
Too bad.

[Pfaff!]

6000K color temp.
Too bad.

Why's that bad ???

[LowRyter]

how bright is 2400 lumens? 

how does it compare to 100 wt incandescent? 

[rodekyll]

Misc, random errata:

In the headlight spectrum*, 6000k ranges from a very cold white to a blue tinge.  Very harsh contrast at night -- can't tell the difference between a wet spot on the pavement and a chuckhole with some.  They also alter color -- stop signs look magenta/purple, and they cause eye fatigue.  I try to keep my lights in the more warm, yellowish, 'sunlight' range of mid 3000's to <5500.


I'm basing the numbers on the lighting charts for LED/HID which may be different from classic kelvin.  Here's one mfgr's chart.  I think you need add some blue to all of the examples to get the real-world color tone.

http://www.delonixradar.com.au/hid-xenon/colour-chart.php

Since LED gives pure color tones rather than ranges of tone, the color shifts per 1000ºk are more obvious:

Here's the table from a university study on light temp v annoyance.  They're mainly discussing HID, but the effects of color are the same.  The lower the number, the higher the annoyance factor:

(study is at http://deepblue.lib.umich.edu/bitstream/handle/2027.42/57444/98625.pdf?sequence=1  )

The effect of lamp type on de Boer ratings of discomfort glare.
(Lower de Boer units indicate more discomfort.)
Lamp type Discomfort glare (de Boer units)
Tungsten-halogen 5.3
HID 4.7
LED-4000 4.2

One test conclsion:  "As indicated in the Introduction, there is evidence that bluish light results in more
discomfort than white light. The imprecise term “bluish” should be regarded here as a
serviceable but rough approximation."
LED-4800 3.7
LED-6600 3.3


Here's a chart of LED headlight tones:

http://static---ledinsider.app-hosted.com/media/img/ledinsider/-/chart/colorchart2

As you can see, it differs fro mthe HID scale by a little bit.  Why 6000ºk in HID and LED are different, I don't know.

This is a quick discussion of temps with respect to bulb choices:

http://www.tirerack.com/accessories/lighting_tech/techpage.jsp?techid=170

[rodekyll]

how bright is 2400 lumens? 

how does it compare to 100 wt incandescent? 

A 100w H4 Halgen puts out ~1100, 1400 lumens.  So a 2400w would put out about twice that.  Interestingly enough, a 55w Halogen is in the 950 lumen range.  That's some dimishing return, right there.

The question is -- where does it put it?  If it's not properly focused, it put it in the eyes of the oncoming driver.  If 'scattered' it does not put it any farther down the road, which is what we're really after with greater output.  Scatter also reflects off of all chunks in the air, including vapor.  So there is a lot of reflected glare with an unfocused beam.  As has been discussed here before, HID, LED, and halogen all require their own specific reflector/parabola design due to the placement and direction of the light source.  No 'conversion' of bulb type is optimal without also converting the reflector.

[Penderic]

I had saved a pic of temp color for car headlight lamps ...



I like the 4000 range ... maybe put a blue dot in the center.

[Triple Jim]

6,000° is bluer than I like, but it's just a personal preference.

[Wayne Orwig]

Why's that bad ???

6000k is very blue.
You can be sure that street sign reflection at night would be annoying, and they would be useless in fog because of the glare.
5000k would be better. 4000k even better.

[Lannis]

I've been reading this and other headlight threads, and am having a hard time sorting it out, because everyone's got a different need - colors, voltage, clearance, beam patterns, etc.

I'm hoping that things have developed such that there is something like this:

1) A bulb that will replace the H4s in my Stelvio.

2) Plenty of clearance on the back side; it's not in a headlight shell.

3) I can install relays if needed, but if they pull less current that the present H4s, I wouldn't need to.

4) Don't run so hot that they'll melt my plastic reflectors.

5) Don't care if it's "DOT approved" and all that, just so it gives a good pattern and won't blind people on low beam.   No one checks on headlight patterns here.

Does the collected data say that there's such a thing?   The development of new stuff moves so fast, last year's solutions aren't optimum any more ....

Lannis

[Wayne Orwig]

I've been reading this and other headlight threads, and am having a hard time sorting it out, because everyone's got a different need - colors, voltage, clearance, beam patterns, etc.

I'm hoping that things have developed such that there is something like this:

1) A bulb that will replace the H4s in my Stelvio.

2) Plenty of clearance on the back side; it's not in a headlight shell.

3) I can install relays if needed, but if they pull less current that the present H4s, I wouldn't need to.

4) Don't run so hot that they'll melt my plastic reflectors.

5) Don't care if it's "DOT approved" and all that, just so it gives a good pattern and won't blind people on low beam.   No one checks on headlight patterns here.

Does the collected data say that there's such a thing?   The development of new stuff moves so fast, last year's solutions aren't optimum any more ....

Lannis

Yes, I installed a pair of HIDs in my Stelvio. Somewhere around $60 for the pair.
Excellent light. They have built in shields so they are not blinding. Lower wattage so that don't melt the reflectors or the handlebar switch.
I used 4500k, so they are not the goofy blue glaring color, but rather a very functional light.

[Lannis]

Yes, I installed a pair of HIDs in my Stelvio. Somewhere around $60 for the pair.
Excellent light. They have built in shields so they are not blinding. Lower wattage so that don't melt the reflectors or the handlebar switch.
I used 4500k, so they are not the goofy blue glaring color, but rather a very functional light.

My question related to the fact that the HID system that you have required you to mount the ballast and install relays, and do a little handwork to the shells (as I remember); and it was a couple years ago you did it, because I've been reading about it.   My question was based on a hope that a headlight lumens version of Moore's Law is in effect, and maybe in 2014 there's something neat that I can just slip into the place where my current H4 bulbs are, turn on the switch, and get 100W equivalent worth of light for a 35W draw .... ?

Lannis

[Wayne Orwig]

My question related to the fact that the HID system that you have required you to mount the ballast and install relays, and do a little handwork to the shells (as I remember); and it was a couple years ago you did it, because I've been reading about it.   My question was based on a hope that a headlight lumens version of Moore's Law is in effect, and maybe in 2014 there's something neat that I can just slip into the place where my current H4 bulbs are, turn on the switch, and get 100W equivalent worth of light for a 35W draw .... ?

Lannis

The LEDs will also need driver boxes mounted.
Yes, you need +12V from the battery. A good thing IMHO.
The modification to the bulb holder took about 10 seconds.

[Rob Morton]

A 100w H4 Halgen puts out ~1100, 1400 lumens.  So a 2400w would put out about twice that.  Interestingly enough, a 55w Halogen is in the 950 lumen range.  That's some dimishing return, right there.

The question is -- where does it put it?  If it's not properly focused, it put it in the eyes of the oncoming driver.  If 'scattered' it does not put it any farther down the road, which is what we're really after with greater output.  Scatter also reflects off of all chunks in the air, including vapor.  So there is a lot of reflected glare with an unfocused beam.  As has been discussed here before, HID, LED, and halogen all require their own specific reflector/parabola design due to the placement and direction of the light source.  No 'conversion' of bulb type is optimal without also converting the reflector.

 :+1

Rob

[Zinfan]

I saw these in another lighting thread and ordered one for my V7. http://www.cyclopsadventuresports.com/3600-Lumen-H4-H6M-LED-Headlight-bulb-_p_83.html  Just shipped yesterday so I'll let you know how the install goes.

20w low beam 30w high.  Just re-read the thread on vendors over at ADVRider and his last post indicates the recent redesign has allowed for an additional 1/2" clearance at the back.

 http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=948701&page=51

[redrider]

I installed 4 yellow H7 bulbs in the Benelli and they are fantastic. Detail at night is outstanding. Illumination to the sides is better and signage is not washed out with glare. The Benelli uses a faceted reflector like the Café Sport and the swap for it is on the list. Nokya makes the more yellow color. Web bike world has a very good write up on yellow headlights. An added bonus is that a lot of traffic ahead moves to the side, probably from thinking I am EMS or something.

[Zinfan]

Got my LED H4 lamp the other day and installed it on my V7 Stone.  It fits but was tricky to do so, I didn't think I'd be able to re-fit the rubber cap the goes on behind the stock H4 bulb to protect it from weather but managed in the end to get it to work.  After that it was a struggle to get the clip back onto the backing plate of the bulb but again after a bit of time I managed it as well.  Took some video of the old vs new during my nighttime commute into work and maybe I'll post them up at some point but for now I did get some screen grabs of the same section of road while using the high beams and another section when I had the low beams on.

First up is the low beam using the stock H4 bulb


Now the same section of road with the low beam LED light


High beam stock H4


High beam LED H4



A few observations,  The light is much whiter as can be seen in the pics above.  The LED high beam does not seem to project much farther than the dipped/low beam, it just fills in the space in front of the bike better.  The LED light seems to throw more light out to the side than the stock H4 bulb, I didn't run into any head on traffic on the ride in so I can't tell if it will be bothersome to oncoming drivers but I'm a bit worried about that.  Also noted that the blue high beam lamp stayed on once the LED was set to the dim position for 5-10 seconds and then the blue lamp would go out.  Also the small daytime running lamp underneath the main bulb was not lit, not sure if it only comes on during the day?  I never noticed it before so I'm not sure how it works.

[leafman60]

Looks better than stock to me from the pictures.

[Zinfan]

Looks better than stock to me from the pictures.

yep and less power draw is nice, just worried about too much light being thrown at oncoming drivers, I'm sure I'll find out soon if it is a problem.

[Zinfan]

Oh and here is what that road looks like when I go home at 0800ish.  7 miles of private access road along the Pacific Ocean, very nice stuff.  Sorry about the June Gloom fog but this time of year it is almost always hanging about in the mornings.

[leafman60]

From those low beam pictures, the led beam seems skewed more to the right, away from oncoming traffic.  Maybe that's just the way you were holding the bars.  

Anyway, if people flash you, you could just adjust your headlamp down and/or to the right to reduce problems with oncoming traffic.

I'm using HID on several bikes but I'd prefer to go with led once they are developed to match the HID output.  This looks promising.

[jas67]

From those low beam pictures, the led beam seems skewed more to the right, away from oncoming traffic.  Maybe that's just the way you were holding the bars.  

It is how he was holding the bars.    Look at the corner of the GPS unit vs. the double-yellow road stripe.

In any case, I think that I'll be order a couple of these; one for my V7R, and one for my R75/5, which only has a 180W alternator, and could benefit greatly from the lower power draw.

[Triple Jim]

It looks like in the stock headlight photos the light is aimed too low.  Maybe the LED photos too.  I know photos can be deceptive, so sorry if I'm wrong.

[G-zulu]

ADV Monster now sells one as well for $45. Problems is, it's about 2" deep past the mounting flange. My V7C bucket is too shallow unless I cut a hole in the back, or buy a deeper bucket.
Ken
http://stores.advmonster.com/h4-led-headlight/

Mounted a pair of these on my NTX. I have a 25 minute ride to work and the heat sink was cool to the touch. Had to modify the locking ring and dust covers to accommodate the heat sink. Light output and visibility are improved.

[1Sourdough]

Yes, but when compared to the rise of personal computers during the same time, LEDs did not develop as quickly, or drop in price as quickly as computers.  I've always been curious as to why.

I think the reason for that is found in comparing the incandescent light bulb to the LED vs. the room filling computers of the early 1980s vs. the computers made possible with the 608x processors!  No one was really motivated to replace a cheap light bulb which worked pretty well with a really expensive light which provided poor light in comparison.  The LEDs had to be developed on a shoestring budget, from what I have been told, simply because few people cared much if they lived or died.  Until the Gummit mandated transitional lights which are filled with mercury vapor, of course; Then money magically became available for LED R&D...