Author Topic: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?  (Read 30273 times)

slepsnys

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Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« on: May 15, 2014, 01:24:28 AM »
Hello,
I am new to this forum and it is my first post, because couldn't find answer in the forum. I have bought Le Mans III from Germany and before starting to ride I wanted to clean the carburetors, when I have cleaned them, I have looked at the needle set and it looked strange to me, it is different than US specification lean burn carburetors. Main body also looks little different than LM3, am I right? Please help me to identify from what model this carburetor is, from Le Mans III or not? I have take couple of photos of the carburetor and of the needles, throttle valve (slide) is 60/3.


Vasco DG

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2014, 01:28:18 AM »
The true tell tale will be if you can take the bell crank top off and remove it and the slide. Post up a pip looking down the Venturi with the slide removed and I'll be able to tell you if they are the 'Lean Burn' type or not.

Pete

Rumba

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2014, 05:37:50 AM »
after being introduced to the existence of "lean burn" Le Mans III carbs trough this here board a couple of years ago,
I checked with my German Moto Guzzi dealers if they had ever heard about these.

they didn't, that assures me that these carbs have never been put onto the market in Europe, especially Germany
where I am from.

what you have there is a typical Le Mans III Dellorto PHF 36 carb in all of its beauty.  ;-T

the 140 main jet is another hint for that, "lean burn" carbs use a way smaller main jet.


and before I forget:  welcome to this board, all the best with your new Guzzi.  ;-T  :BEER:

slepsnys

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #3 on: May 15, 2014, 05:50:28 AM »
To: Vasco DG,

Thank You, I will take photos after work and will add them to forum.

To: Rumba,

Thank You :) :BEER: Well I know that lean burn main jets are smaller, but I thought that it was changed or something. Maybe You know what was carburetor factory settings for bikes (LM3) sold in Germany or Europe, I don't know if they differ from country to country, info I have found about factory settings in the net was about lean burn carburetors sold in US?

Wildguzzi.com

Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #3 on: May 15, 2014, 05:50:28 AM »

Rumba

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2014, 06:16:14 AM »
what you have listed there jet wise in your first post is the stock factory setting for the Le Mans II,
it is advised to run this setting with the Le Mans III as well if you plan to run open velocity stacks
or correct sized as in big enough K&N filters.
the idle mixture screw has to be at ~ 1 1/2 turns out for this carb, that is about it.

 :)

the lean burn carbs have a kind of shroud around the main-jet / emulsion tube exit I believe,
but I have not seen either one of these carbs or even a picture yet.

 :BEER:

Vasco DG

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #5 on: May 15, 2014, 06:55:13 AM »
(Sigh.)

A common mistake made by people who think they are cleverer than they are is to suggest that because they have never seen something it doesn't exist.

AFAIK all Mk III's in all markets used 'Shrouded' carbs. Hence my request for a shot down the venturi.

MkI/II/III Le Mans engines are all essentially the same in terms of bore/stroke/combustion chamber shape and valve size.

A common Tuning Modification' made by the ignorant is to fit Mk I/II jetting to MkIII carbs because everybody knows that the only reason the Mk III uses much leaner jetting is because of some tinfoil hat conspiracy by the 'Government' and probably the Illuminatti and anybody else you want to have a conspiracy about who wanted to restrict your fun and curb 'Pollution' which we all know is a lefty plot.

In fact the changes were made to take advantage of the greater cooling of the squarefin head design to promote better fuel economy.

*IF* these carbs are the earlier, unshrouded, type? Then Mk I/II jetting is a fine starting point. If however they are the original carbs as fitted to a Mk III fitting MkI/II jetting will turn it into a thirsty, gutless pig. This is a pity as it will also cause premature wear in the engine but if that is what floats your particular boat? Be my guest.

Pete

Rumba

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #6 on: May 15, 2014, 07:15:37 AM »
I for myself would put the jets back into the carbs, with the clip at the second notch
from above like where it is at now and take the bike for a ride.

if you encounter a well running machine and find brown spark plugs afterwards, I would call it good.

I do not need to get personal or even unkind on an internet board, that is simply not the way I want to live.



Vasco DG

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #7 on: May 15, 2014, 07:29:50 AM »
Why would you do that before finding out whether the bodies were one type or another? The two require completely different settings ???

Pete

Morizzi

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #8 on: May 15, 2014, 07:42:43 AM »
Hi Rumba,

Ive been watching your posts for some time and I have been in agreement with all the ones I've read. Lately the 2 plug issue with timing. May I say spot on!  ;-T

I don't want to get in the middle of a misunderstanding but I have a lm 3 with lean burn carbs that I purchased at the factory in 83. I have also purchased a second hand Lm3 since then and it is also fitted with lean burn units. One is a very early 81 and by its numbers about 100 from the start of the model and my original bike is an 83 so between the mid and end.  

It is just the little brass shroud that makes the difference. There was absolutely no difference between my EU bike to my Australian bike. None what so ever. From what I can tell this is no longer the case with modern models but back in the 80's there was none.

This is in no way a criticism. I just wish to inform you that the Lean Burn Units existed but there is nothing to really differentiate between them by part number until you look down the venturi and look for the shroud.

My second bike has suffered excessive wear as the previous owner had jetted it like a LM II and the excessive fuel has washed the bores. It still runs but I'm glad I saved it in time.

I look forward to reading more of your posts. I actively seek them out as you seem to have a very similar opinion to me.  :BEER:

Cheers

Rod

kidneb

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #9 on: May 15, 2014, 08:04:30 AM »
(Sigh.)

A common mistake made by people who think they are cleverer than they are is to suggest that because they have never seen something it doesn't exist.

AFAIK all Mk III's in all markets used 'Shrouded' carbs. Hence my request for a shot down the venturi.

MkI/II/III Le Mans engines are all essentially the same in terms of bore/stroke/combustion chamber shape and valve size.

A common Tuning Modification' made by the ignorant is to fit Mk I/II jetting to MkIII carbs because everybody knows that the only reason the Mk III uses much leaner jetting is because of some tinfoil hat conspiracy by the 'Government' and probably the Illuminatti and anybody else you want to have a conspiracy about who wanted to restrict your fun and curb 'Pollution' which we all know is a lefty plot.

In fact the changes were made to take advantage of the greater cooling of the squarefin head design to promote better fuel economy.

*IF* these carbs are the earlier, unshrouded, type? Then Mk I/II jetting is a fine starting point. If however they are the original carbs as fitted to a Mk III fitting MkI/II jetting will turn it into a thirsty, gutless pig. This is a pity as it will also cause premature wear in the engine but if that is what floats your particular boat? Be my guest.

Pete

Informative and well put,- again !

Right,- all the Mk IIIs came with the B-type shrouded 36mm PHFs,- and I see no reason for a B stamped 36 PHF as pictured, not to be the shrouded type ?

I run 12o main jet, 55 pilot jet and 50/3 slides in mine, with 950cc, HMB torque cam, deactivated acceleration pumps (with no off idle stumble) and original air box with the LM IV cartridge in it (bigger surface than LMIII).
According to the spec sheet in my parts catalogue, it looks like there were 2 different versions of the B-type though,- red spot and green spot, with slightly different internals.
 But most importantly,- don`t jet a B type as if it were a D type.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2014, 06:25:28 AM by kidneb »

Morizzi

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #10 on: May 15, 2014, 08:24:16 AM »
The shrouds are a pressed in fitting.They can be pressed in and out. The carb bodies have the same name in all the documentation that I have. All PHF 36 B with D for Dexter and S for sinista (Right and Left.)

There is a difference. Jetting is different. How you run a lean burn to a conventional carb is different.

Again, I think there seems to be a misunderstanding here. Pete I know and respect. Rumba, I don't know but I've been reading his posts and he has saved me butting in on numerous occasions. He is no fool. I've read the posts above and I can see where the misunderstanding has occurred. I'm sure this is just a language issue.


Rod in Oz.


oldbike54

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #11 on: May 15, 2014, 08:57:29 AM »
Yeah , Morrizi is correct , a simple misunderstanding  :+1 This is an interesting thread  ;-T
Dusty

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #12 on: May 15, 2014, 09:57:47 AM »
Fascinating thread.

Would someone be so kind as to post an image of the "shroud" as they know it?

Am currently preparing a set of PHF36's (HD, I believe) for service on a round-fin 850. Still very early in the process. Have yet to determine which cam I want to go with. Can read a spark plug adequately. Would very much like to be instructed on how to proceed with initial jetting.

Thanks in advance,

-Late to the Party

slepsnys

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #13 on: May 15, 2014, 10:46:18 AM »
Hello again :) I see that this is a interesting thread not only for me but also for other people and of course there are a lot of confusion. These are the photos of the shroud I took:





I have found interesting manual of the Le Mans III written in Italian and this is one page from it, I am sure it is about jets:





This is the link to the full manual:


http://www.guzzista.com/ClassicGuzziManuals/850LM3Italian.pdf


What are Your thoughts about lean burn carburetors and differences between US models and European models?
« Last Edit: May 15, 2014, 10:50:56 AM by slepsnys »

kidneb

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #14 on: May 15, 2014, 12:10:02 PM »
slepsnys

The pics you posted clearly show that your carbs are not shrouded, even if they have the B stamp on them, so they are to be jetted as the LM850 and LMII PHF D type. Somebody obviously changed the shrouds.
The casting is of course the same for the PHF D and the PHF B versions, and they both additionally have the D or the S suffix stamped on them. D for "destra" and S for "sinistra",- right and left.

So,- : PHF 36 BD and BS,- and PHF 36DD and DS.

Here is what the B type with their shrouds originally look like :





« Last Edit: May 16, 2014, 04:24:25 AM by kidneb »

slepsnys

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #15 on: May 15, 2014, 12:34:37 PM »
Well, understood that shrouds are not lean burn type in the photos I have uploaded, but how to explain the Guzzi manual written in Italian about jets (image I have attached), these carbs clearly are non lean burn type according to the jets, am I right? Can it be that in Italy (maybe in all Europe) was some Le Mans III with non lean burn type carburetors???

Vasco DG

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #16 on: May 15, 2014, 01:29:51 PM »
I sincerely doubt it. The thing is we are talking about a bike that is now thirty years old. Who knows what its history is? Perhaps this is a reasonable scenario....

At some time in the past a previous owner who knows no better has decided that the 'Lean burn' jetting is all wrong. Not because the bike isn't running well but because he just *Knows* that the change in jets and needles was done purely for emissions and obviously pouring in more fuel will make it more powerful! So, being *Smart* he finds out what the jetting was for the earlier LeMans models which were unsullied by interference by the dreadful ogres in Brussels and pops them into his carbs. Having done this he now finds that his bike runs like a three legged donkey with a stomach full of sleeping pills, belches black smoke, drinks fuel like a drunken sailor on shore leave necks rum and wont pull the skin off a rice pudding! Taking it on a test run he is overtaken by a septuagenarian nun riding a bicycle so even he can work out its not right!

So, rather than going back to the original jetting he perseveres in his quest for more performance by changing jets, atomisers, slides, you name it and all the time generally going bigger because of course he still *Knows' the bike was deliberately jetted lean!

Eventually in disgust he buys new or second hand carbs off an earlier model, doesn't examine them too closely and runs them with the MkI/II jetting and voila! The bike runs much better 'Proving' beyond a shadow of a doubt that there was something wrong with his original carb bodies! Oh sure, it uses more fuel than it did and it isn't as smooth but that is just a sign of its awe inspiring performance improvement, even though this isn't actually really detectable in any other way other than in his imagination!

Of course this is all mere supposition and I've never actually seen this scenario played out, well, only a dozen or so times over the last thirty years......... :D

Pete

slepsnys

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #17 on: May 15, 2014, 01:48:08 PM »
To Vasco DG:

Well I understand that this theory can be true in most cases, but I found one interesting thing and still nobody haven't made comment about it, I am talking about a copy of genuine factory Le Mans III user manual from the same era bike was build, language is Italian, so clearly it was for Italian market, in 43 page is a complete list of jets, which clearly isn't for lean burn type carburetors??? Somebody who knows please comment about this.

Vasco DG

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #18 on: May 15, 2014, 01:52:46 PM »
Probably because when the manual was 'Updated' for the MkIII they forgot to change the jetting specs. This sort of omission is commonplace in Guzzi workshop manuals from back beyond the dawn of time right through to today!

Pete

Bill Havins

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #19 on: May 15, 2014, 01:55:35 PM »

So there you have it.   ;-T

When you "buy" a used bike you "get" every mistake made by every person who approached the bike with an "idea" and a wrench or screwdriver.

Change the oil and other fluids, return everything to "stock," and you may then have a sweet ride.  And if you later have an "idea," hit your thumb as hard as you can with the biggest hammer you can find.  If the idea is still there when your thumb stops hurting, well, do what you want to.

 ;D


slepsnys

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #20 on: May 15, 2014, 02:12:33 PM »
To Vasco DG:

Well I don't think that there is evidence which could support Your theory about bad printing because:

Le Mans II jetting:

Idle jet    Main jet    needle    Clip position (From top)    Needle jet       Slide
60               140      K-5                      2                         265             60/1

Le Mans III jetting according to the Italian manual:

Idle jet    Main jet    needle    Clip position (From top)    Needle jet       Slide
60               132      K-18                      3                         265             60/3

It is possible that they revised manual changed 4 position out of 6 and the res two left unchanged, I have doubts about it, do You? :)

Vasco DG

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #21 on: May 15, 2014, 02:24:36 PM »
Main jet size is definitely a misprint for the MkIII, as is the atomiser. Mk III uses a 268 atomiser and a 118 main. The K18/265 combination is all wrong and definitely would cause issues in an unshrouded carb.

Pete

Bill Havins

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #22 on: May 15, 2014, 04:30:21 PM »
slepsnys,

The jets that you show in your photo are identical to those that D. Richardson identifies as being fitted on all LMIIs (in his book Guzziology).

He lists two sets of jets for the LMIII, a "U.S." set and a "European" set.  Here are the numbers:

Idle - U.S...53  European...50
Main - U.S...120  European...115
Needle - U.S...K-18  European...K-18
Clip Position - U.S...2  European...3
Needle Jet - U.S...262  European...268
Slide - U.S...50/3  European...60/3

Guzziology also lists a "Performance Kit" for the LMIII that uses PHM carburetors.  In the same order as listed above the jets are:  60, 170, K-4, 3, 265, and 60/1.  (You never know where people get their ideas for jet choices.  "Performance kit?  Really?  You think we can jet these PHFs kinda' like the PHM kit?")

Perhaps this helps a bit.

Good luck!

Bill

Vasco DG

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #23 on: May 15, 2014, 04:39:31 PM »
I stand corrected, yes, MkIII main was a 115. I excuse myself because I was typing at 4.00AM in bed while trying to get to sleep. What I'd give for a full night's sleep.......

Pete

Morizzi

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #24 on: May 15, 2014, 07:51:17 PM »
Interesting the printed specifications for the Italian motor. Different to the English language user manual.

I purchased a LM III new at the factory in 83. It still runs its standard jetting.



Slide 60/3
Atomizer 265AB
Main Jet 115
Idle Jet 50
Needle K18/3

That's how mine came and it agrees with the Owners manual and every other manual I have for it. I've got this bike mothballed as I can't afford to keep them all on the road.

My second LM 3 which was pre loved before me came with 'upgraded' jets.  ::)

Slide 60/3
Atomizer 268AB
Main Jet 145
Idle jet 60
Needle K18/3
The only thing that compensated for all these big holes was the float was set a few mm lower.

It is now at Slide 60/3
Atomizer 268AB. I tried 265s but it had a real hole in power.
Main Jet 120
Idle Jet 52
Needle K18/3

This is my main touring ride.



So there you have it. My experience of 2 bikes. One runs happily with a 265AB atomizer and the other doesn't. The one that doesn't has a lot more kms on the clock. 340,000km roughly and it will still give me about 550 Veglia km per 25L tank which is about 500 real kms before I have to push. Economy, power and plug colour are all good.

Lean burn carbs can be jetted up a bit but not too much, IME.

I do find the Italian setting interesting. I can see that it would work with the jets compensating for the atomizer.  :BEER:
« Last Edit: May 15, 2014, 07:55:19 PM by Morizzi »

Offline jacksonracingcomau

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #25 on: May 15, 2014, 08:21:40 PM »
slepsnys

The pics you posted clearly shows that your carbs are not shrouded, even if they have the B stamp on them, so they are to be jetted as the LM850 and LMII PHF D type. Somebody obviously changed the atomizers.
The casting is of course the same for the PHF D and the PHF B versions, and they both additionally have the D or the S suffix stamped on them. D for "destra" and S for "sinistra",- right and left.

So,- : PHF 36 BD and BS,- and PHF 36DD and DS.




Not in my memory or by Guzzi factory and Dell Orto books
All of them were B type, just later ones have shroud and jets but not marked differently
one visible difference on first LM to  3's is brass spigots for vent hoses, not in OP's pictures

 but are in manual pic posted above.

I think they may be on some Mk 2's as well but not all

Unlikely anyone changed the cable support arm, that's another way to tell which model they were from, 1,2 & 3 are all different

But OP's carbs origins may never be known,


kidneb

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #26 on: May 16, 2014, 08:58:45 AM »

Not in my memory or by Guzzi factory and Dell Orto books
All of them were B type, just later ones have shroud and jets but not marked differently
one visible difference on first LM to  3's is brass spigots for vent hoses, not in OP's pictures

But OP's carbs origins may never be known,

It may never be known,-  but this is getting interesting as to approaching the OPs question I think.

 Jackson,- you do mean that all of the LMIII`s carbs were B types, and not that all of the early (I+!!+!!!) LeMans carbs were,- right ? If so, you are also saying that not all of the LMIIIs came with lean burn carbs ?

I have some Dellorto manuals, but reading them only adds to the confusion,- Manual nr. 19 even states the LMIII `82 came with PHM40 Ds !!

As I`m sure most of you already have figured out, I don`t come here in any "expert capacity",- and I`m happy to be corrected and learn something new in addition to all the other useful and interesting things I`ve learned here.
But I must admit, conceding that not all of the PHF 36 B type carbs came shrouded from the factory, is some sort of a camel to swallow.
And it immediately opens up the next question : what does the B stand for then ? What makes it differ from the D type ?
And is it likely that a significant mod as the shroud would not earn some kind of marking on the carb?  Hmm,-

     slepsnys, - do you have the German Ersazteilkatalog for the LMIII ?
On the last page there is a "Datenblatt" that also contains carb jetting specs. Apart from the two clearly lean burn jettings,- "roter und grüner Punkt",- there is one that resembles the jetting you found in Italian.




So I`m thinking that these obviously "unshrouded values" shown for the LMIII may indicate that there were a few early LMIIIs that came with non lean burn carbs ? And that slepnys carbs are, or very well could be, the original ones?


Also, it`s not ver likely that people swop their 36 carbs for another pair of 36s ? Nor that they would change the shrouds ?

   slepsnys, - is your LMIII an early one ? High milage ?


 
Uhh- ohh,- going out for a ride in the sunshine,- on my (lean burn) bicycle !  :)




« Last Edit: May 16, 2014, 11:31:47 AM by kidneb »

guzzimike

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #27 on: May 16, 2014, 09:01:30 AM »
Gentlemen, I am holding a Le Mans II Owner's Manual, Technical publications code 14-90-00-56  dated 11/79

It lists the following specs for the PHF 36B Carburators:

140 - Main Jet

265AB - Atomizer

60 - Idle Jet

70 - Starter Jet

38- Pump Jet

10gr - Float

60/3 -  Throttle Valve

K5 Needle ( 2nd Notch )





Now, in order to muddy the waters a bit more, I'll mention my Own bike's PHF 36B Carb settings, which differ a bit from those listed above. I'll post them because my bike runs perfectly smooth on all RPM ranges  and this info may help someone, somewhere.

My Moto Guzzi is a 1979 CX100. But it is not a stock CX100 - My bike was modified by previous Owners ( I'm #3 ), and in fact I was told by PO#2 that this motorcycle had been modified by the original dealer in Glendale, Ca. ( Woods..? ) with PHF36 Carbs, Bub Pipes, Fork Brace, etc.. And that this work had all been done to the bike  before it being delivered as "New" to #1 owner.  


Anyhow, over the years I've added on some modifications to the bike in general, and the powertrain in particular. About 2007, after ten years of me beating the living shiite out of it, the engine was diagnosed by Mark Etheridge of MG Classics as needing serious Top End Work. This probably partly due to me running Malossi Open Velocity stacks for 5+ years.. :D

Oh, well...If you wanna play, you gotta Pay ( sooner or later) - So on came Top End Rebuild Time which was done at MG Classics. I forget the exact details list but it included Cylinders bored out, New pistons, rings, etc.. Also the Heads were "massaged" by Etheridge's off-shop expert in the Black Magic world of engine Head Work... I forget this Voodoo Priest's's name, but IIRC, larger valves were installed, new valve guides and seals; Heads ported, flowed and decked, etc..

With the engine out, and while waiting for a new Clutch, my buddy and fellow Weekend Apex Straffer Ed Milich suggested a Diet to lighten the flywheel so as to make the bike more responsive to the way we rode.. Sounded good to me, and so this was as added to the work-scope as well.Next came new FAC fork dampers and wirth Springs, and 7614 IKONs out back. Finally, Delrin Manifolds were fitted, to prevent Carb-Sag.

And when all this stuff was finally said and done, the PHF 36B internals were fiddled with in order to optimize throttle response across the RPM range, as it regarded the new setup.
 
Since then, the CX100 has run like a dream.  ;-T  ;-T  ;-T

Starts instantly when cold (+choke) or hot (no choke). Idle settles at 980 RPM within 20 seconds of cold startup ( Choke OFF ), No flat spots or stumbles anywhere in the RPM range..

Sweet spot for cruising is about 4800 RPM, give or take 200 Revvs.

Ideal RPM-range for farking around in the Hills is 6000 - 6300 RPM.

Runs out of useable Power at around 7200 - 7300RPM


MPG runs about 35 - 40, depending on the bike's mood and its accelerator pumps.
  
 
I mention all this stuff detailed above in order to give context to the following Carb Data, which allows my CX100's engine to run like a Downhill Locomotive on Steroids...  ;-T:


So, here are the ( PHF 36B) Carb settings as fitted to my CX100

130 - Main Jet

60 - Idle Jet

K6 Needle (*3rd  notch )

2.65 - Atomizer

( Pump Jet - 38, IIRC  )




Hope this helps in some degree.

-


 

slepsnys

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #28 on: May 16, 2014, 10:09:18 AM »
As I`m sure most of you already have figured out, I don`t come here in any "expert capacity",- and I`m happy to be corrected and learn something new in addition to all the other useful and interesting things I`ve learned here.

Thank You for being open-minded, it leads to ultimate truth not just opinion of majority. :)

I don't have German Ersazteilkatalog for the LMIII, but thank You for the photo You have uploaded.

I also think that jetting spec in Italian and German manual can't be just type errors, probability is to small that errors would be in both manuals, at least I think so, but didn't know.

My Le Mans III is low millage and it has another interesting thing, the gearbox is ZD type, close ratio straight cut gearbox, maybe this helps as I know this is a rather rare gearbox. I have uploaded couple of photos of the VIN numbers and engine number:






« Last Edit: May 16, 2014, 11:51:10 AM by slepsnys »

Offline cruzziguzzi

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Re: Le Mans III carburetors PHF36B, from what model they are?
« Reply #29 on: May 16, 2014, 11:25:33 AM »
This is a fascinating thread. Very informative.

Though, given my experience with four and two wheeled Italian gas burners, I can't help but chuckle a bit whenever certain words are used in discussing them - words my wife and I try not to use between us if at all possible; always, never, every, none or their synonyms.
Todd
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