Author Topic: Old bikes  (Read 574 times)

Online John A

  • Gaggle Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 4382
  • No way to slow down...
  • Location: Hager city ,western WI
Old bikes
« on: November 25, 2022, 11:05:41 PM »
Beautiful old machines in this vid https://youtu.be/igK5tBTnYt4
John
MGNOC L-471
It is easier to fool people than it is to convince them that they have been fooled-Mark Twain
99 Bassa, sidecar
02 Stone
84 V65C
15 F3S Spyder

Online bigbikerrick

  • Gaggle Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 5348
  • 73 Eldo, 98 V 11 ,12 Ural Gear Up, 76 Convert,
  • Location: Southeastern corner of Arizona, right next to "Old Mexico, and New Mexico"
Re: Old bikes
« Reply #1 on: November 26, 2022, 01:25:27 AM »
I really enjoyed that video, John. Thank you for putting it up!    :thumb:
Rick Duarte
"You meet the most interesting people on a Guzzi"

Offline Scout63

  • Gaggle Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 2292
  • Location: Orleans, MA USA
Re: Old bikes
« Reply #2 on: November 26, 2022, 07:09:13 AM »
Interesting video with some great looking and sounding bikes.
Ben Zehnder - Orleans, MA USA
‘46 Rapide
3 Bevel Ducs
‘71 R75/5
‘72 Combat Commando
‘73 v7 Sport
‘78 SR500
‘79 G5-T3 mashup
‘19 Husky Vitpilen

Offline ddrillmaker

  • New Egg
  • *
  • Posts: 3
  • Location: Wilmington
Re: Old bikes
« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2022, 07:48:48 AM »
Love it!
Thanks for sharing it.

Wildgoose Chase Moto Guzzi

Re: Old bikes
« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2022, 07:48:48 AM »

Offline guzziart

  • Gaggle Mentor
  • ****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 668
  • Location: Northeast Ohio
Re: Old bikes
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2022, 09:06:16 AM »
 :thumb:
'72 Eldo, '72 CL350, '81 CB125s, '87 LMIVSE, '91 CT70, '03 V11 Lemans, '08 Wing & '12 Wee Strom

Online JJ

  • Gaggle Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 19349
  • Life is meant to ENJOY...not "endure."
  • Location: Village of Oak Creek, Arizona
Re: Old bikes
« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2022, 10:12:10 AM »
:thumb:

Yes....way cool...and ya gotta love those 250cc Bevel-head Ducati's at the end of the video.  Here is one I recently saw at a bike show...







Life Member: MGNOC L-772, AMA, HOG
'98 V10 Centauro GT
'14 Victory Vision Tour
Village of Oak Creek, AZ

Offline cliffrod

  • Gaggle Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 1897
  • AC Button II
    • Carolina Sculpture Studio
  • Location: Spartanburg, SC USA
Re: Old bikes
« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2022, 12:34:58 PM »
The Ducati bevel single heads have two styles of heads. 

The very common spring valve models, like the widecase 250 shown, have a single rocker arm shaft for each valve (two shafts total) for the single rocker arm used to open the valve.  The camshaft end cover on these heads have a wide top narrow bottom design with the engine displacement displayed in the casting. 

The very rare Desmodromic models, specifically referenced but not shown, have two rocker arm shafts for each valve (4 shafts total) - one for the rocker arm to open intake and one for rocker arm to close the valve.  See the plexiglass operational model shown.  These heads require a camshaft end cover that’s approximately trapezoidal in shape, with the word DESMO displayed in the casting.

The DESMO end cover can be used as on a spring valve head.  Poser trick.   But a spring valve end cover should not be used in a Desmo head since it will not properly capture the two lower closing rocker arm shafts.  You’ll be able to see them.  The heads are different castings, with additional material present to support the extra pair of lower rocker arm shafts.

And the caption is even wrong, labeling the bike in video as a 350….

I like watching videos to learn more, but have reservations about how accurate the rest of the video is when such obviously glaring inaccuracy is presented for the viewer to assume it is correct.  Far too many people already think every Ducati is a Desmo.  They are not. Beyond the HD bikes shown, I have little in-depth knowledge of the various and somewhat exotic models shown.  So I wonder if what’s being presented is accurate or just more convenient stuff (i.e.- they’ll never know the difference..) like showing a Ducati widecase bitsa spring valve bike while talking about Desmo details. 

Rant over.
1973 V7 Sport  "Now THAT'S a motorcycle!"-  Master Sculptor Giuliano Cecchinelli
1967 V700 Corsa Record
1981 Lemans CX100
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExX3YmQel_Q
http://carolinasculpturestudio.com/
Carolina Sculpture Studio YuoTube Channel-
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCzSYaYdis55gE-vqifz

Online John A

  • Gaggle Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 4382
  • No way to slow down...
  • Location: Hager city ,western WI
Re: Old bikes
« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2022, 01:12:08 PM »
I almost didn’t post it because of the quality of the information but I thought the pics of the bikes made it worth it. :grin:
John
MGNOC L-471
It is easier to fool people than it is to convince them that they have been fooled-Mark Twain
99 Bassa, sidecar
02 Stone
84 V65C
15 F3S Spyder

Offline cliffrod

  • Gaggle Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 1897
  • AC Button II
    • Carolina Sculpture Studio
  • Location: Spartanburg, SC USA
Re: Old bikes
« Reply #8 on: November 26, 2022, 06:40:41 PM »
Older members here likely already know this, but might be beneficial for others.  Last year, I got a very complete set of Classic Bike magazines.  I was surprised how many very obscure and very old European bikes are included in the first approx 5 yrs of publication (1978-1983.) It varies from simple mention to captioned photographs to entire feature articles, including many of the bikes in the video, and much content related to the history & people tangent to these motorcycles.   Anyone interested in such things who has not seen the early magazines should consider looking into old magazines or reprints.  Not sure what is available, but there’s really great content in the early Classic Bike magazines.

After those early years, the editorial content largely shifts to the more typical post war bikes.  Increasingly, those older bikes only showed up in For Sale advertisements.
1973 V7 Sport  "Now THAT'S a motorcycle!"-  Master Sculptor Giuliano Cecchinelli
1967 V700 Corsa Record
1981 Lemans CX100
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExX3YmQel_Q
http://carolinasculpturestudio.com/
Carolina Sculpture Studio YuoTube Channel-
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCzSYaYdis55gE-vqifz

Offline Scout63

  • Gaggle Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 2292
  • Location: Orleans, MA USA
Re: Old bikes
« Reply #9 on: November 26, 2022, 10:37:05 PM »
The Ducati bevel single heads have two styles of heads. 

The very common spring valve models, like the widecase 250 shown, have a single rocker arm shaft for each valve (two shafts total) for the single rocker arm used to open the valve.  The camshaft end cover on these heads have a wide top narrow bottom design with the engine displacement displayed in the casting. 

The very rare Desmodromic models, specifically referenced but not shown, have two rocker arm shafts for each valve (4 shafts total) - one for the rocker arm to open intake and one for rocker arm to close the valve.  See the plexiglass operational model shown.  These heads require a camshaft end cover that’s approximately trapezoidal in shape, with the word DESMO displayed in the casting.

The DESMO end cover can be used as on a spring valve head.  Poser trick.   But a spring valve end cover should not be used in a Desmo head since it will not properly capture the two lower closing rocker arm shafts.  You’ll be able to see them.  The heads are different castings, with additional material present to support the extra pair of lower rocker arm shafts.

And the caption is even wrong, labeling the bike in video as a 350….

I like watching videos to learn more, but have reservations about how accurate the rest of the video is when such obviously glaring inaccuracy is presented for the viewer to assume it is correct.  Far too many people already think every Ducati is a Desmo.  They are not. Beyond the HD bikes shown, I have little in-depth knowledge of the various and somewhat exotic models shown.  So I wonder if what’s being presented is accurate or just more convenient stuff (i.e.- they’ll never know the difference..) like showing a Ducati widecase bitsa spring valve bike while talking about Desmo details. 

Rant over.

Great info Clint. The Desmo bevels get all the love but I like the spring valve heads since they are so easy to adjust. I’ve only had the twins but would really love to get a single sometime.
Ben Zehnder - Orleans, MA USA
‘46 Rapide
3 Bevel Ducs
‘71 R75/5
‘72 Combat Commando
‘73 v7 Sport
‘78 SR500
‘79 G5-T3 mashup
‘19 Husky Vitpilen

Offline cliffrod

  • Gaggle Hero
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 1897
  • AC Button II
    • Carolina Sculpture Studio
  • Location: Spartanburg, SC USA
Re: Old bikes
« Reply #10 on: November 27, 2022, 07:16:37 AM »
Great info Clint. The Desmo bevels get all the love but I like the spring valve heads since they are so easy to adjust. I’ve only had the twins but would really love to get a single sometime.

I really liked my 1970 450 Desmo, for special reasons as well as what it was.  But the bike I would buy that’s actually comfortable to ride, use and is  as “practical” as a Ducati single can be would be a 450 Street Scrambler known as a Jupiter. Handsome bike, even if it isn’t as chic as the cafe racer or the early 250 narrowcase scramblers.   The Jupiter is just really comfortable in terms of dimensions and riding position for a grown man, good power/torque vs a 250 that needs to be revved to the moon and decent to start with a std equipment compression release & Spring valve simplicity.  My 450 Desmo and even nicer 450 Jupiter were the last two singles I sold for the studio.

This Jupiter is for sale now on Raleigh FBMP, maybe priced a little high at $5500 but decent examples aren’t cheap anymore. Might even be able to buy it cheaper…





And if you must have a Desmo, you can always drop another $3k+/- and stick a 450 R/T head on it when you find one.

1973 V7 Sport  "Now THAT'S a motorcycle!"-  Master Sculptor Giuliano Cecchinelli
1967 V700 Corsa Record
1981 Lemans CX100
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExX3YmQel_Q
http://carolinasculpturestudio.com/
Carolina Sculpture Studio YuoTube Channel-
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCzSYaYdis55gE-vqifz

Crusty Cycle, Vintage Moto Guzzi Parts
Ambassador, Eldorado, 850T, T3, 1000SP, G5, Convert, etc. Good Prices - Fast Shipping
http://www.crustycycle.com
Advertise Here
 

Crusty Cycle, Vintage Moto Guzzi Parts
Ambassador, Eldorado, 850T, T3, 1000SP, G5, Convert, etc. Good Prices - Fast Shipping
http://www.crustycycle.com
Advertise Here