Author Topic: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR  (Read 3888 times)

Online Motormike

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #30 on: August 10, 2021, 08:32:49 AM »
As I've said, it could be called the Michelin No Mar tire changer, as that's the only brand of tire I've had any luck changing.  But I have no use for a "one brand only" tire mounting device.  I'd buy a Weaver pneumatic tire machine tomorrow, but don't want to spend another $2000 dollars on a industrial compressor with the required 175psi output.  I emailed Weaver to ask them if my cheap 20 gal. Lowes/Cobalt would run it...nope!  Anybody here have any experience with pneumatic tire machine care to differ?

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #31 on: August 10, 2021, 08:37:21 AM »
  After having experience with a Coats pneumatic machine, the NoMar is really pushing my patience to its limits.  I thought it would be a cost effective alternative to spending thousands for a powered changer plus a larger air compressor.

I can't justify the cost simply by comparing it to what I'd spend on tire changes at a shop.  I live 45 miles one way from the nearest motorcycle shop.  For me it's all about convenience and the freedom to work when and as I please.  Independence from the other guy.  I''ve spent a whole lot of money on that, and will continue to do so.  They say "no man's an island"  but I'm doing my best.

Offline Perazzimx14

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #32 on: August 10, 2021, 09:18:22 AM »
Yeah, I'm not happy with my NoMar but haven't given up completely....thank s for the tip on the Mojo bar, I'll get one and try it again.  I didn't have a problem dismounting, mounting is another story.  And, yeah, I've watched all the videos, used lube & yellow thing, let the tire sit in warm sunlight, get bead in drop area of rim, etc.  After having experience with a Coats pneumatic machine, the NoMar is really pushing my patience to its limits.  I thought it would be a cost effective alternative to spending thousands for a powered changer plus a larger air compressor.  Oh well, I'll spend a couple more bucks and try the Mojo, Thanks!

Art

The NoMar or any manual tire machine is a cost effective alternative vs spending thousands of dollars on a pneumatic commercial tire machine but there are some sacrifices.  1st and foremost its a manual tire machine. It takes more effort.  Its like buying a Honda Civic and then wonder why it doesn't perform like a Ferrari. I mean a car is a car. They both have 4 wheels and an engine.

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #33 on: August 10, 2021, 09:35:14 AM »
I like the autonomy as well, even though I'm no longer out in the boonies or as money poor like I have been in the past.    Bummed that I was not going to be closer to you on this TN trip to move daughter into college & pick up my wife.  She's been on the road for a couple of wks and thanked me for not adding another long day/night to the travel to chase bike stuff one more time.  I didn't want to need to rename that tire machine from No Mar to No Mor....

Thanks again for the offer, Mike.
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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #33 on: August 10, 2021, 09:35:14 AM »

Offline larrys

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #34 on: August 10, 2021, 09:46:55 AM »
Its a shame to let an inanimate object get the better of you.

Not just a shame, but bad policy, and worse to speak of it.
I have used the same spoons and nylon rim protectors that I bought forty years ago. I use a homemade bead breaker that uses an old bumper jack. Works on everything up to and including light truck tires.
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Offline Perazzimx14

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #35 on: August 10, 2021, 12:28:10 PM »
Fixed it for you.   :boozing:

Seriously, both the Honda and the Ferrari meet the basic goal of transporting you from point A to somewhere else.  They do it with reliability and repeatability, on all sorts of roads.  If you want to compare the no-mar to another tire changer it would have to be the BGE.  Like the Honda and Ferrari, both are manufactured.  And like the no-mar and any other tire changer, the comparison ends there.

Seriously a tire machine.....any tire machine meets the basic goal of dismounting tire "A" and replacing with something else. If not it would not be a tire machine.

I get it there are some who do not like the NoMar or struggle with it for one reason or another. However there are far more like myself who find it user friendly and more than adequate for home or light shop use. If I was changing tires for a living I'd probably not choose an manual tire machine  but for hundred's of tires I've changed in the last 8 or 9 years of ownership the NoMar has met all my needs and has been money in the bank and beer in the fridge.

I dismounted and mounted 8 tires in the last week alone on the NoMar. 3 sets of Dunlop Trailsmarts and one set of Metzler Karoo 3's. Not exactly soft super sport tars.



 

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Online Moparnut72

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #36 on: August 10, 2021, 01:53:42 PM »
You guys make me want to get one just to see what all the fuss is about. However it is going to be awhile before I have to change another tire anytime soon. Besides the shop that changes and balances mine is within a stones throw and only charges me $20.  :azn:
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Offline flong

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #37 on: August 10, 2021, 02:06:48 PM »
I have a question for NoMar users who mount all types of tires with it.  Are you mounting the stiff walled tires with the mount/demount bar or with tire spoons? 

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #38 on: August 10, 2021, 04:09:12 PM »
Its like buying a Honda Civic and then wonder why it doesn't perform like a Ferrari. I mean a car is a car. They both have 4 wheels and an engine.
No, It's like buying a Honda Civic and wondering why the damn thing doesn't run!

Offline Guzzistajohn

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #39 on: August 10, 2021, 04:19:57 PM »
The No Mar experience sounds so profound, I will have to get one just for the joy of a worthy defeat.

I'll make you a deal on one, only 90 miles away :thumb:
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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #40 on: August 10, 2021, 04:21:38 PM »
Well, the tire is on the rim and the rim is back on the bike.  And all I had to do was drive 90 miles round trip to my nearest Cycle Gear and pay them $54.00 including tax.  :angry:
Not a viable long term solution, obviously.  Well, it is a solution, just not a very good one.  Watching that machine spin effortlessly and mount that tire without the installer breaking a sweat sure made me envious.



If you think I'm using tire irons on a rim like this?  Nope, not happening.

Offline AJ Huff

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #41 on: August 10, 2021, 04:36:24 PM »
This tread is epic!

Cheers to you MotorMike! I'm in a hundred percent agreement with you, if the tool doesn't work or is too much effort, get rid of it!

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #42 on: August 10, 2021, 04:42:11 PM »
I'll be the first to admit, this is the most "First World Problem" belly-aching I've done in a while!

Offline Tiki Joe

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #43 on: August 10, 2021, 04:54:16 PM »
Well, the tire is on the rim and the rim is back on the bike.  And all I had to do was drive 90 miles round trip to my nearest Cycle Gear and pay them $54.00 including tax.  :angry:
Not a viable long term solution, obviously.  Well, it is a solution, just not a very good one.  Watching that machine spin effortlessly and mount that tire without the installer breaking a sweat sure made me envious.



If you think I'm using tire irons on a rim like this?  Nope, not happening.
What type of bike is that?
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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #44 on: August 10, 2021, 05:02:05 PM »
2007 Honda VFR.  Or "Interceptor" as they are know better by across the pond. 800cc V-four.   A nice "Gentleman's" sport-touring bike.  It would be brilliant except for the stupid VTEC. 

Offline Iron Cross Junction

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #45 on: October 08, 2021, 06:25:34 AM »



Had my first victory with the No-Mar yesterday, so my No-Mar might not join Motomike's at Goodwill just yet.

OTOH, it was a "Marshmallow Michelin" Power, and, as he says, maybe it is only a "Michelin No-Mar" tire changer, so maybe this doesn't count. 

Moreover, despite GearheadGrrrl's one-(wo)man  :bow: success doing it alone, I did need another to help.  In fact, I mostly "supervised" Dr. John as he did all the tech stuff and only threw in my weight -- in a most literal sense -- when more force was needed.   :rolleyes:


Mr. Brown delivers ...




Undressing the Griso ...





Dr. John counts his fingers after I try amputating them with N-M bar ...





Victory at last!





My next task, possibly today while I have adult supervision still here, is to swap out my EV's rear tire.  As both old and new are Michelin Pilot Activs, I may not get full credit for that one either even if successful.   :wink:

Bill

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Offline twowheeladdict

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #46 on: October 08, 2021, 07:02:59 AM »
]


Dr. John counts his fingers after I try amputating them with N-M bar ...





Thanks to the help from a friend grabbing the bar to give a yank my thumb got fractured while changing a tire on the ole KLR. 

That was the end of do it myself.  For years my local country tire shop would change them on their fancy machine for $5 a tire. 

Now I pay about $30 a tire but don't put down the miles I used to.
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Offline guzziart

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #47 on: October 08, 2021, 08:32:18 AM »
OK, I'm stubborn.  I've had one successful tire change on my NM... a front tire on a '72 Honda CL350 but probably could have done it w/o the NM.  I was successful removing the rear tire from a '12 Wee Strom but could not mount.  Anyway, I just ordered a Mojo Lever because I am unable to finesse the NM bar accordingly.  I would really like to be able to use the NM and become somewhat proficient at it too.  Hope I don't break a thumb or hurt myself.

Yeah, the local Cyclegear, 35 miles away, offers $25 tire changes and a road hazard warranty for another $10 or $15.

On another note, I have the same NM a pictured in a couple comments above.  My issue is with the paint coating.  NM painted the changer & center post with a "wrinkle  finish" type coating.   The complaint is every time I move the center post up, down or lock it in place the white paint with black veins flakes off and makes a small mess of the wheel hub (and axle seal) area of the wheel.  I reached out to NM about it, they let me know that they don't offer that color anymore and that I can give them a cc number and buy a new post.  Well, it ain't that big of a problem to where I want to spend for a replacement post ( and possibly continue to encounter the same problem), I figure I'll remove the existing wrinkle finish (crap) coating and rattle can it with rustoleum or the like.



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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #48 on: October 08, 2021, 01:15:22 PM »
"Michelin No-Mar"  That's a good name for them!  If you watch the various videos No-Mar has, it's always a Michelin tire they are changing.  Too Funny.  Since my original post, I'm about 50-50 on tire change attempts.  Michelins...always go on and off without much trouble.  Bridgestones and Dunlaps...meh, I cuss, and it may take longer than it should, but I usually win the battle.  I've learned not to even make the effort with Pirelli and Metzeler.  I won't use those tires any more...too stiff to change by hand.  Besides, Pirelli and Metzeler fronts are made in China now, so no thanks. 

Offline tonyduc

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #49 on: October 08, 2021, 06:42:33 PM »
I marked my 71st birthday changing a 100/90-18 Marathon and a 175/55-17 car tire with my NoMar. The machine has it's limitations- it seems to be designed for wider sport bike tires and rims, so I had to use the tire levers with the 100/90-18 and a bit with the little car tire. The keys are lots of lubricant and work with the tire- keep the opposite side down in the recess of the rim. But scrap a NoMar? Never, I wouldn't even try mounting those little car tires without a machine!
I agree with the above, after using plenty of the lube and spraying with soapy water continuously, the tires are now going off and on better.
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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #50 on: October 08, 2021, 07:24:30 PM »
The problem with the "lots of lube" advice is soon enough the rim is so slippery that the nylon dog block clamps can no longer keep the rim from rotating on the stand.  I've had to use tie-down straps to hold the rim in place from rotating when I'm trying to mount a tire with "lots of lube."  PITA.

Offline Matteo

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #51 on: October 08, 2021, 07:46:12 PM »
Been whipping tires off and on with mine for almost 20 years. Lube well and no reinforced tires. I do changes for my buddies at a cost of a bottle of Sangiovese per pair. Filled at least ten cases over time. Easily recouping cost. All my Guzzi wheels are a breeze. :boozing:
« Last Edit: October 08, 2021, 07:49:13 PM by Matteo »
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Offline Muzz

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #52 on: October 10, 2021, 08:32:58 PM »
I have a local guy, changes tires and balances for $25.   I would never try to change a m/c tire, a gave that crap up before I turned 30.

I gave up when I got the Breva.  $25 is what the place where I get my tires from charges me.  I was going to make a machine, came to the conclusion it wasn't worth the effort.
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Offline marcmorrison

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #53 on: October 11, 2021, 08:16:35 AM »
As my grand-dad (a mechanic/machinist) used to say "any darn fool can get the job done with the right tool".
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Offline Chuck in Indiana

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #54 on: October 11, 2021, 04:31:05 PM »
As my grand-dad (a mechanic/machinist) used to say "any darn fool can get the job done with the right tool".

There is a certain amount of truth to that.. :smiley: When I was an apprentice, I was complaining to the lathe hand that was watching over me about how sloppy the old lathe I was running was. He said, "Any swinging dick can make a good part on a new lathe. It takes some skill to do it on this one. Let me show you some tricks.."
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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #55 on: October 11, 2021, 05:29:49 PM »
I emailed Weaver to ask them if my cheap 20 gal. Lowes/Cobalt would run it...nope!  Anybody here have any experience with pneumatic tire machine care to differ?

The tire machines weaver sell are made by brite. Not too much different then any of the cheaper Ebay units.. The smaller compressor will work just fine, but your bead breaker will not break some tough truck tires very fast. I have a weaver, 894xs and had a friend with a small tire shop with a cheap ebay tire machine, and a ranger running just fine on a dingbat compressor. I did build a manual tire machine a use a No-mar bar quite a bit.. Mostly car tires though. The K&L is not very versatile, like a larger tire machine model . You can outfit just about any tire machine to motorcycle spec machine for a bit over $100.. I am consonantly saving my friends about $600 on per for truck tires over any tire shop..  I should of bought a tire machine years ago, but always put it off.. My RV space renter works at the PNW tire wholesaler/retail place . I can beat the heck out of any tire he can get with his company discount..   




Offline Muzz

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #56 on: October 12, 2021, 02:10:41 AM »
There is a certain amount of truth to that.. :smiley: When I was an apprentice, I was complaining to the lathe hand that was watching over me about how sloppy the old lathe I was running was. He said, "Any swinging dick can make a good part on a new lathe. It takes some skill to do it on this one. Let me show you some tricks.."

After spending another day at the son's business :rolleyes: (tell me again Chuck why I am retired) :grin: I came back with the top hat off some obscure top hat off an old obscure imperial steering box with an oil seal made of unobtanium.  He was able to obtain a seal of the right ID, wrong OD.  My lathe may not be new but it's a helluva lot better than his.  A quick wine, zip zap in the garage and then it's tea time. :thumb:  Seal in.  Just had to grind a tool to do it.
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Offline Iron Cross Junction

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #57 on: October 12, 2021, 07:36:38 AM »

Well, this thread has longer leags -- Gambalunga -- than I would have ever thought.  Figured a quick "PM sent" to Motormike from someone near would have ended it several w/g pages back.

 
Been whipping tires off and on with mine for almost 20 years. Lube well and no reinforced tires. I do changes for my buddies at a cost of a bottle of Sangiovese per pair. Filled at least ten cases over time. Easily recouping cost. All my Guzzi wheels are a breeze. :boozing:

Can have something mid-grade waiting for you here if you are ever this way.   :bow:

Why not pull the bike fully into the wheel vise until it hits the stop then tie it down side to side further back (like the redline drawn in on the pic) on the lift for better triangulation and stability.  Having the bike short of the vise's stop with ratchet straps barely wider than the front wheel and pulling it forward is not stable. Its really not securing anything and then lifting the rear of the bike up that old regulator of the universe gravity will make the bike want to roll forward. The straps when pulling forward just help it along.  The tire pinched in the vise is only offering a bit of a hold forward/backward. If leaned it would pop right out of the vise. I do not trust these vise's to hold the bike when the wheel is full inserted against the uprights and tightened down let alone just pinching 2 inches of the tire on the bottom.





Its far better to have the wheel against a stop then the straps a wide as possible and just barely pulling forward holding it against the stop.

Thanks.

I understand what you are saying.  I’ve also disobeyed the laws of physics from time to time with predictable results.  :embarrassed:

OTOH, I have used that lift countless times over the last 15 years with zero “OMG” incidents, at least of my own doing. 

A friend borrowed my GarageMahalo once in Atlanta to do some work on his Norge using the lift.  I called midday to see how things were going.  His voice was of the sort all parents recognize when a child — of any age — in trouble calls.  I drove home immediately.

His Norge had just toppled over while up high on the lift!   :shocked:

Happily for him, it went off on the opposite side of where he was working; incredibly for him, the only real damage was a broken mirror!

How could that be, you might reasonably ask?

Well I had a couple of tallish mover’s dish-pack boxes filled with towels and rags almost against the life on the dropped side.  The Norge lay there dripping fuel — sayonara to my wealth of rags; sigh — and looking like a big red beached whale.  We called in some neighbor reinforcements — one a 98-pound woman with more grit than John Wayne — and righted the beast.   :azn:

Anyway, moving forward to the pic you mention of my Griso on lift to R&R front tire, trust you saw the scissors jack under sump.  Out of pic were straps at rear at a better than angle than those front ones.

In this particular event, I cannot recall why I spotted it right there, but pretty sure it had to do with the Griso’s side stand, knowing that I was going to lift it with the scissors jack, and that I was going to strap it down at the rear.  I routinely use the full bite of the vise on front wheels as you noted.

Be all of that as it may, the Griso is back on the road.  Let a visiting ST1300 rider take it for a romp yesterday.  He was dutifully impressed; or just had the sense and civility to so emote.   :grin:







Best,

Bill


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Offline eldoroddo

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #58 on: October 13, 2021, 05:30:32 PM »
Well, this thread has longer leags -- Gambalunga -- than I would have ever thought.  Figured a quick "PM sent" to Motormike from someone near would have ended it several w/g pages back.

 
Can have something mid-grade waiting for you here if you are ever this way.   :bow:

Thanks.

I understand what you are saying.  I’ve also disobeyed the laws of physics from time to time with predictable results.  :embarrassed:

OTOH, I have used that lift countless times over the last 15 years with zero “OMG” incidents, at least of my own doing. 

A friend borrowed my GarageMahalo once in Atlanta to do some work on his Norge using the lift.  I called midday to see how things were going.  His voice was of the sort all parents recognize when a child — of any age — in trouble calls.  I drove home immediately.

His Norge had just toppled over while up high on the lift!   :shocked:

Happily for him, it went off on the opposite side of where he was working; incredibly for him, the only real damage was a broken mirror!

How could that be, you might reasonably ask?

Well I had a couple of tallish mover’s dish-pack boxes filled with towels and rags almost against the life on the dropped side.  The Norge lay there dripping fuel — sayonara to my wealth of rags; sigh — and looking like a big red beached whale.  We called in some neighbor reinforcements — one a 98-pound woman with more grit than John Wayne — and righted the beast.   :azn:

Anyway, moving forward to the pic you mention of my Griso on lift to R&R front tire, trust you saw the scissors jack under sump.  Out of pic were straps at rear at a better than angle than those front ones.

In this particular event, I cannot recall why I spotted it right there, but pretty sure it had to do with the Griso’s side stand, knowing that I was going to lift it with the scissors jack, and that I was going to strap it down at the rear.  I routinely use the full bite of the vise on front wheels as you noted.

Be all of that as it may, the Griso is back on the road.  Let a visiting ST1300 rider take it for a romp yesterday.  He was dutifully impressed; or just had the sense and civility to so emote.   :grin:







Best,

Bill


OR...you had it pulled back a little bit so the rear tire could be removed after removing the rear panel on the lift?
My Harbor Freight lift is like that.

Offline Chuck in Indiana

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Re: FREE to a greater fool..No More NO MAR
« Reply #59 on: October 14, 2021, 06:03:32 PM »
New Road Attack 3s for the Mighty Scura today. HF changer with delrin rim protectors. HF mount/dismount bar made to look like a Mojo lever. Free. (Guzzi content)  :smiley:

I'd be lyin' if I said it was easy, but I'm also about half the man I used to be. It's more technique than brute strength, fortunately.
Chuck in (Elwood) Indiana/sometimes SoCal
 
87 AeroLario
95 Skorpion tour
22 Royal Enfield Classic 3 fiddy
 "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."
Albert Einstein

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