NGC - has it really been 100 years?

[ohiorider]

Several years ago, one of my sons gave me a model of a WW1 SPAD.  I've kept it on top of a china cabinet, where it looks down on the room from  a lofty height of 7 or 8 feet.

I looked at it this evening, and thought ...... damn ...... it has been 100 years since French, American, Italian, and other nationalities flew these biplanes in combat.

The SPAD was powered by a V8 Hispano Suiza engine.  Amazing .... they actually designed an engine that advanced that long ago.

The first SPAD I saw was in 1948 - 49, when the new Kanawha Airport opened in Charleston, WV.   A WW1 SPAD was flown at the opening, along with a Curtiss pusher.  It had a lot to do with Eastern Airlines, and Eddie Rickenbacker, since he'd been a founder of that company.  I was 6 years old and still remember it today.  My dad took me to the opening.

Bob

[twowings]

Nothing like two wings! 

[Gliderjohn]

Anyone that flew anything in WWI had big brass ones. 
GliderJohn

[ITSec]

While I admire all airmen of WWI, there's a problem with the premise.

WWI began on either June 28th 1914 (assassination of Archduke Ferdinand) or August 1st 2014 (first declarations of war outside the Austro-Hungarian Empire).

It has been very nearly 103 years.

It would be a long time before the US entry to the war, and they would enter using a lot of equipment - including planes - from the countries already engaged. Consider what might have been the situation had the US military enthusiastically accepted the overtures from the Wrights and other innovators, and if the US had engaged in 1915 when American civilians were first made casualties...

[ohiorider]

I'm not certain what you think the premise is........

I was simply making a comment that the Spad fighter had been developed nearly 100 years ago, along with the engine that powered it.  If you're debating whether I said 100 years or 103 years, you're picking at nits.  My  post wasn't intended to be a political commentary on how or why the USA did or didn't jump into the war sooner or later.  It was simply a statement about technology from 100 years ago.

[ITSec]

I'm not certain what you think the premise is........

I was simply making a comment that the Spad fighter had been developed nearly 100 years ago, along with the engine that powered it.  If you're debating whether I said 100 years or 103 years, you're picking at nits.  My  post wasn't intended to be a political commentary on how or why the USA did or didn't jump into the war sooner or later.

What can I say? I was a history major at a Canadian university, and I once met the author of "The Guns of August'.... 

As I said, I have great admiration for all the aviators of that age,who got into their machines knowing the odds were against them with each and every flight. The SPAD VII and XIII were great examples of the achievements and failures of the era, with a knife edge separating performance (and survival) from reliability (and survival). Every war leads to a rapid increase in technology, and WWI was perhaps the most extreme example, with each new technology so revolutionary that it was as dangerous to its users and to the enemy.

[azguzzirep]

I love WWI planes!

The German  'Albatross' is my favorite.

[Old Jock]

What can I say? I was a history major at a Canadian university, and I once met the author of "The Guns of August'.... 

You were very privileged to meet such august company.

Barbara Tuchman, a fantastic historian and author, able to make history read like a thriller. Thoroughly recommend her work.

Guns of August and the Zimmerman Telegram are both great reads.

Another brilliant author in her peer group is Robert K Massie, get a hold of "Castles of Steel"

Probably my all time favorite book, detailing the British Naval activities during WWI. I found the book pretty much one these un-put-downable tomes.

[charlie b]

I also love the SPAD.  My favorite model airplane to fly as well.  Mine is 1/6 scale and is 12yrs old now.  Why the SPAD?  It was the plane Frank Luke flew (he was also from Phx and my family knew his family).  He was also the first aviator to receive the Congressional Medal of Honor. 

Daring?  Yep.  He decided he wanted instant respect from the other pilots so he went after balloons (used for artillery spotting and usually protected by ground anti-aircraft guns as well as other aircraft).  He earned all of his kills in a total of 19 days of flying.  Yep days.  He was shot down on his last mission and killed by German infantry.

The SPAD XIII had the later Hispano Suiza engine that developed 200hp from 12L displacement.  Water cooled.  Geared so they could get more revs with the huge props they put on those planes (around 16ft dia props).  The gearbox was a problem.  Reliability very poor.  Some days 12 planes would start out and only 3 or 4 would reach the front.  Luke, in his short flying time, went through 5 planes in those 19 days (only one from enemy fire, IIRC).

[Zoom Zoom]

Wow Charlie, that is one big control line model.

Seriously, I realize it is likely RC. I would love to see a pic of it if you have one.

When I was a kid, I built many models. I always liked the biplanes simply because I thought they were beautiful.  To one point, I had 80 model planes of various eras and various scales hanging from my bedroom ceiling. Always loved airplanes.

Thinking back on the advancements in technology, I usually think of someone born near the end of the 1800's that saw the advent of pretty much everything we now take for granted. To have witnessed that first hand would have been an amazing thing. Electricity, rail roads, flight, space flight, telephones, cell phones, automobiles, etc. In no particular order. So much advancement in one lifetime.

John Henry

[Chuck in Indiana]

Eh, I think those new fangled monoplanes are just a passing fad.. <snapping suspenders>

[Sheepdog]

I had a similar childhood experience, Bob. My folks took me to Rhinebeck Field in New York when I was eleven. I can still remember standing with my eyes tilted up; watching that Fokker Dr1 make lazy passes overhead. My grandfather was a flier during WWI, but he flew for the Signal Corps. They would reel out wire for field telephones to connect the front lines to command and control locations. It was a heck of a thing for a guy raised on a pig and horseradish farm...

[Mark Harpell]

You all need to come on up and visit this place....
http://owlshead.org/

[Mark Harpell]

Ck out their collections page.....
http://owlshead.org/assets/119/_dsc6512-2__medium.jpg

[John A]

https://youtu.be/EdJjQdA-q-k?list=PLB2vhKMBjSxP4G7pljFCWC9B2t_wo0twt
I got hooked on these about The Great War. those old boys had some rough duty in this complex war where the world was introduced to mechanized killing.

[Chuck in Indiana]

You all need to come on up and visit this place....
http://owlshead.org/

One of my very favorite museums..  I found this project there. Suddenly, it's 1930..
2016-03-08_02-59-06 by Charles Stottlemyer, on Flickr

[tasdisr]

I am lucky enough to have Wright Patterson AFB and the Air Force Museum about 50 miles from here. Its been a while since I have been there, but might be a good day trip with the grandson!

[oldbike54]

Eh, I think those new fangled monoplanes are just a passing fad.. <snapping suspenders>

 Yep , like the helicopter , unproven technology 

 Dusty

[trippah]

With all the Viking tv shows, and sword "play" in so many movies; I have always thought I am happy not to live in that time. 
You had to be big, or fast , or eagle eyed..today you  only need a pistol, which is why I think a realiable pistol and ammo is the game changer in modern life relations.

[Steph]

Yep, these guys were pioneers

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lafayette_Escadrille

[Denis]

If you want to get an idea of how tough flying fighter planes was, read the two volume biography of Capt. Roy Brown, the Canadian pilot officially credited with downing von Richthofen. It takes the reader through his initial training at the Wright Brothers School, then to England and finally to France. Though he never lost a pilot under his command, he himself crashed many times due to engine failure, damaged props, etc.

As the planes got more advanced the pilots flew patrols at least twice a day at altitudes of 18,000 feet. Even when it was scorching hot on the ground they had to dress for winter because of the extremely cold temperatures at those altitudes. As a result, many pilots who survived the war still died relatively early from the affects of those patrols. Extremely cold, no supplemental oxygen, etc.

Crashing was a common occurrence even without help from the enemy. If an engine stalled on take-off the pilot, especially a novice, was often doomed.

There were also many interesting tidbits you'd never think about. Some pilots looked over at the plane next to them and saw it disintegrate in midair because it was hit by an artillery shell. Some pilots saw small arms bullets come within arm's lengths of them as the bullets reached their maximum height before they fell to earth.

It was common knowledge to pilots that if you were chasing an enemy plane and heard gunfire behind you, you were dead if you looked for it. You learned to immediately change direction or altitude, then tried to figure out where the plane was.

Stories of planes firing a hundred rounds at a plane as they flew past them were mostly fiction. Usually the number fired was seldom over 20-25 at a time, sometimes as few as 5 or 10.

It's a fascinating pair of books.

[twowings]

I'm no pilot, but as a passenger I feel 100 times safer in a biplane...

[nobleswood]

I am lucky enough to have Wright Patterson AFB and the Air Force Museum about 50 miles from here. Its been a while since I have been there, but might be a good day trip with the grandson!

A great place to visit, & cheap, took the wife & kids there & had them asking to come back.

[azguzzirep]

I highly recommend the Boing History of Flight museum in Seattle. One of the best!

[Arizona Wayne]

Interesting that so many of you guys are infatuated in 100  years ago aircraft.  When I was in my teens and my father was a bombardier/navigator in the Army Air Corps, USAF thereafter for 20 years flying in B-17s(WW II), B-29s (Korean War), B-36s, B-52s(Cold War).  I had plastic plane models of jets, prop. bombers, and kept up to date of current aircraft specs. I've also appreciated WW I & WW II war documentaries, etc., but have never read books about them.  I prefer watching films or legit movies about those days.

[charlie b]

This is mine.  54" span and only 5lb.

http://www.manzanolaser.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=65&products_id=250

Yes, you can buy the kit.  I built the prototype from hand cut parts.

http://www.manzanolaser.com/index.php?main_page=popup_image&pID=250