V7 III Special, first impressions after owning various V7 iterations

[jas67]

Some of you may have seen kballowe's thread "My Wife made me do it!"    Where he traded a new V7III Special on a California.   Not being one to pass up a good deal, I bought it.    It was delivered to my house yesterday!





This is the third evolution of the modern-day V7 that I've owned, the first being a 2009 V7 Classic with the plastic 4 gallon fuel tank and two throttle bodies (Mk0?), then the "Mk1" 2013 V7 Racer and 2014 V7 Special with the 5.5 gallon steel fuel tank and revised motor with a single throttle body and rounded corners on the cylinders and heads.   This one, of course, is Mk3, which brings the most major revision to the small block platform yet, as it is a departure from a long history of heron heads in favor of hemi-heads.   Other changes including the lowered, more level positioning of the power train, along with ABS and traction control all of which came along in the Mk2.   And, finally revised instrumentation, and new paint and graphics.

Initial impressions: stock shocks way better than what came on the Mk1.   You're not supposed to rev over 4,000 RPM for the first 620mi, I largely observed that as a red warning indicator flashed angrily at you if you did.    It does seem to have slightly more grunt down low, but, not significantly more as some have reported.   I certainly wouldn't sell a Mk1 or Mk2 bike and get Mk3 just for the additional power.    RPM limited to 5,000 from 620-1200 miles.   After that, I'll really know.

The stock exhaust, IMHO, sounds nicer than the stock exhaust on the Mk1.    It's a little deeper and less hollow sounding than the mk1, but, certainly no louder.

The switch to a 6 speed transmission was unnecessary.   The gears are too closely spaced, esp. when shifting at 4,000 for break-in.   The shifter feel is very light to the point of not even feeling it click up.   That took some getting used to.  Finding neutral is a bit tough, I need to double check the clutch free-play.   Speaking of clutch, clutch pull is noticeably lighter.  It feels like the hydraulic clutch on my Monster.

Braking is very good.     I did some panic brake tests, it stops very quickly without drama.   I didn't test the front ABS, but, did test the back, it works well.

Gas cap looks cheap, but, everything else about fit and finish is nice. 

I like the instruments with the status indicators in the middle of the gauge instead of a separate bezel.


Foot controls and pegs are very nice, foot pegs are a little wider.   They're also a little lower than than the mk1.   I may not bother putting the lowered pegs on it.


The seat is nice, better than the stock unit on the Mk1 one.   I don't know for sure if this is the standard seat, but, I like it.    It looks good too.



Pretty paint and color, and, as I already mentioned, cheap looking gas cap:


I like the black covers over the intake tubes vs. the chrome on the mk1. 


There is a mode switch on the right control switch assy. to change display modes.  I like this MUCH nicer than the buttons up on the dash that the Mk1 has.    Pressing the mode switch switches between clock, total miles, two trip counters, ride time, average speed, average MPG, current MPG, and ambient temperature.    There is also a gear indicator that is visible in all modes except total miles.

If the MPG display is to be believed, fuel efficiency should be about the same as the Mk1 and Mk2 bikes.    I averaged 52 MPG over about 90 miles.

I like the look of the cylinders and heads better than the Mk1 & Mk2.     The heads are noticeably larger with more cooling fin, likely identical to the 850cc motor.

So, being an engineer, I like to over-analyze things.   I rode the '17 and '14 V7S's back to back, and did a couple of 5k RPM gear changes on both.    I'd have to actually time it, but, the new one doesn't really feel much, if any faster, contrary to what some on this and forums have said.   Had I test rode one before I committed to buy, I might not have made the jump.

I do question why Guzzi didn't use the 850cc version of this motor from the V9, especially since the main competitor to the V7 is the 900cc Triumph Street Twin.   It can't cost any less to make the 750 than the 850, and would give them less part numbers to inventory.    The additional 100cc would definitely give it some extra torque, and more on-par with the Triumph.

So, was it worth the additional spend over what I'm eventually going to get for the '14 V7 Special, and the additional money for accessories that won't move over (center stand, luggage mounts, all different on the mk3)?    As I stated above, don't do it for the additional power, you'll be disappointed.    I may feel differently after it is broken in as, comparing a 300 mile bike to one that has almost 7k and is broken in isn't quite fair, though I was riding the '14 within the break-in parameters of the '17 (OK, 5k limit instead of the recommended 4k for less than 620 miles).

My '14 has been my main bike for my commute to work in warmer weather,  during the time that I've had it.   ABS will be a welcome addition for peace of mind on those days when the road is wet for the ride home.

The bottom line is that the Mk1 V7 are already a fantastic bike  and a tough act to follow.    Yes, Pete, I know, primitive chassis, blah, blah, but, for those of us wanting a classic bike with decent brakes and fuel injection, it is.   This is a nice evolution of the species, but, is it worth spending the several $k that I've spent above what I'll get out of my '14?     I dunno.    Don't get me wrong, I love the bike, and ABS may save my sorry as some rainy day on the way home from work.   It's a little sad to see the orange and black one go, as I still love the 750S homage paint scheme -- watch the "swap meet" section later this week.     Of course, the blue with the silver and orange stripe is beautiful, so, I'll embrace the next chapter of my Guzzi life.

[SmithSwede]

Thanks for that analysis.   I find the 5 speed gear box on my 2013 to be perfect.   You have confirmed my hunch that the 6 speed is really unnecessary.

[roadscum]

I enjoyed your review jas67. I too own a V7 III special and every ride brings a smile to my face and, in the past, a grimace of pain shooting up my spine when the sub par suspension bits encountering a bump in the road.

After several test rides on a V7 III I decided I wanted one in my stable but would need to do something about it's less then mediocre suspension. Prior to delivery last September the dealer installed emulators in the forks. After consultation with Ted Porter at the BeemerShop about 8 weeks ago decided on custom built Wilber shocks for the rear with springs and valving to match my weight and riding style. I  installed them last week. The V7 Special, also a purdy blue one, now handles as I would expect any modern motorcycle, without electric suspension bits, to handle. No more wagging of the tail when pushed aggressively into the mildest of curves, and no more bone breaking jolts when riding over even the slightest if sharp bumps, it's a safer and far more comfortable motorcycle now.   

The only remaining issue I have is the lack of electrons making it impossible to run a Nav unit, heated grips, and a heated jacket liner without discharging the battery. Because of this limitation I use one of my other bike for touring.

I will offer that I'm pleasantly surprised by the comfortable ergonomics, especially the all day seat that makes easy work of 800 mile days. 

Paul

[Travlr]

Super informative!  Thanks.   

[alanp]

Thanks.  That is a great looking bike!  Your review makes me comfortable with my decision to buy a leftover V7II vs. waiting n a new III, as it sounds like the differences are minor.

But what I really want to know is what is that windshield and how do you like it?  I have tried a few things, but haven't found a solution for touring.  I either get too much wind pressure on my head/chest or too much buffeting.

[Lcarlson]

Congrats, Jas — beautiful machine. I’m actually considering adding a new V7iii myself, although I’m not certain why. My Beemer, while no longer young, is my “Goldilocks” bike: not too big, not too small....  It’s also fully equipped for touring, including Ohlins/Hyperpro suspension upgrades, and at about 500 lbs as set up, it doesn’t weigh all that much more than the V7.

So why do I want a a V7iii? I like the modern vintage styling, and it just seems “of a piece”, if that makes sense. I’m also impressed by all the folks on this forum who have extensive experience with all sorts of bikes, including those with much higher performance parameters, who still rave about their V7s. And when I had a V7ii loaner a couple  of years ago, I remember thinking that it was a hoot to ride. I would use it almost exclusively as a day-ride runabout, so in the end, I just feel like it would do all I need for that purpose. It would also be the least expensive brand new bike I’ve ever purchased, so there’s that. And dammit, I just like it. So we’ll see.

[jas67]

Thanks.  That is a great looking bike!  Your review makes me comfortable with my decision to buy a leftover V7II vs. waiting n a new III, as it sounds like the differences are minor.

But what I really want to know is what is that windshield and how do you like it?  I have tried a few things, but haven't found a solution for touring.  I either get too much wind pressure on my head/chest or too much buffeting.

The windscreen is a National Cycle "Deflector Screen."
http://www.nationalcycle.com/deflectorscreen-hd.html

It's 14" high, and 18" wide.

It does a nice job of taking pressure off the chest w/o  creating buffeting at the head.

[Guzzi Gal]

:1: Not having ridden any other Guzzi, I find comparisons very informative.  Thank you!   

[SmithSwede]

>>> I�m also impressed by all the folks on this forum who have extensive experience with all sorts of bikes, including those with much higher performance parameters, who still rave about their V7s<<<

Yep.  I bought a 2016 Triumph Street Triple Rx with the extra wonderful suspension and super duper modern engine, big modern radial tires, dual front disk brakes, etc.  This is a bike that fans of modern technological improvements rave about. 

It leaves me a bit cold.  I vastly prefer to ride the little small block.  Will probably sell the Triumph.  Newer is not necessarily better, except maybe on paper. 

[jas67]

I'm also impressed by all the folks on this forum who have extensive experience with all sorts of bikes, including those with much higher performance parameters, who still rave about their V7s.

It's way more than the spec sheet.    I do own and enjoy a few more powerful bikes (see list below) with better handling and brakes, etc, and have ridden some properly fast bikes such as the Motus, DucatiDiavel,BMW XR1000, BMW S1000R, Suzuki GSXS1000R.

The V7 is a competent street machine that has character, style and class.    It yields more smiles per mile than many more powerful machines.

I can have more fun on the V7 on public roads than I can on any of the 4-cylinder liter bikes on the list above.     On those machines, my reaction was, "Nothing good would come of it."

[Lcarlson]

It's way more than the spec sheet.    I do own and enjoy a few more powerful bikes (see list below) with better handling and brakes, etc, and have ridden some properly fast bikes such as the Motus, DucatiDiavel,BMW XR1000, BMW S1000R, Suzuki GSXS1000R.

The V7 is a competent street machine that has character, style and class.    It yields more smiles per mile than many more powerful machines.

I can have more fun on the V7 on public roads than I can on any of the 4-cylinder liter bikes on the list above.     On those machines, my reaction was, "Nothing good would come of it."

I get it. I traded in my Diavel and BMW K1200GT for my California. I just wasn’t using their capabilities (particularly the Diavel, which was unhappy at anything below 4000 rpm).

[jas67]

I get it. I traded in my Diavel and BMW K1200GT for my California. I just wasn�t using their capabilities (particularly the Diavel, which was unhappy at anything below 4000 rpm).

My Monster, like your Diavel is also unhappy below 4,000 RPM.    That's one of the things I love about the R1200RS.   It's perfectly happy as low as 2,000 RPM.  It can be ridden all day long in a relaxed fashion between 2,000 and 4,000 RPM.     But, there's a lot of fun from 4,000-8,000 RPM should the mood strike 

I'm more likely to behave myself one the V7; that's one of the things that I love about it.

Plus, I don't mind putting commuting miles on it, knowing how simple it is to maintain, and how much less money per mile I spend on tires than the R1200RS or Monster.

[Lcarlson]

<<My Monster, like your Diavel is also unhappy below 4,000 RPM.    That's one of the things I love about the R1200RS.   It's perfectly happy as low as 2,000 RPM.  It can be ridden all day long in a relaxed fashion between 2,000 and 4,000 RPM.     But, there's a lot of fun from 4,000-8,000 RPM should the mood strike  >>

Yep — that’s why I still have my boxer, after buying and selling numerous other bikes since I bought it new in 2002. I recently test rode a new watercooled R1200R, and while it was indeed very nice, I didn’t feel any need to give up my old R. That it still works so well is the main reason I hesitate on pulling the trigger on the V7iii. Even if I do pull that trigger, the old ‘50 R isn’t going anywhere; it’s still a great touring mount.

[kern16]

2012 V7R #198 I was just getting ready to post a question when I read your analysis:

"I like the instruments with the status indicators in the middle of the gauge instead of a separate bezel."

With that said I love everything about this bike with the exception of the instrument cluster which like the gas cap you mentioned I think looks cheap. My question is has anyone replaced their instrument cluster with an aftermarket one they would recommend? Personally I would prefer a white face with black numerals. I hope this would not be
hi-jacking a thread by inserting my question.....if it is I apologize.
Thx

[kballowe]

That blinky red light that starts to annoy you over 4,000 RPM is the rev limiter light.

You can set it up to a higher number

Great write-up on the bike - and excellent pictures !

 

P.S.  Yes, that is the factory seat.  I believe it is slightly different from the V7 III Stone seat.

By the way - did they give you all the extra nuts and bolts and reflectors and that factory grab rail with the deal ???

[jas67]

I hope this would not be hi-jacking a thread by inserting my question.....if it is I apologize.

No problem.   

Back to the V7-III.   My wife had the luggage scale (like a fish scale out) which gave me thought.   So, off the garage I went to actually measure the clutch pull.    I measured the force at the ball end of the lever on all the bikes, except for the Eldo, which has a lever about an inch longer long the the handlebar, for that one I measured approximately at the end of the handlebar.

V7-III 10# / 4.5 kg
V7 (mk1). 14# 6.4 kg

So, the V7-III have the same clutch pull as my Monster.   My R1200RS has an even lighter clutch at about 7# / 3.2 kg.

Being an engineer with a mind that needs lots of data, I checked some others:
W650 10# / 4.5 kg
Ducati 749 #14 / 6.4kg (and that's a hydraulic clutch)
R75/5 18# / 8.1 kg
Eldorado 25# / 11.4 kg
Honda 305 Superhawk 30# / 13.63

Yes, the little Superhawk has a monster clutch pull.   And that is with a new teflon-lined cable.   The clutch is small in diameter, so, they use lots of force.   My little 250cc Ducati has an equally hard clutch pull.

 

[jas67]

So, as I read various ride reports on the V7-III, here and elsewhere, it definitely sounds like the higher RPM's is where the III's motor shines over the V7-II and earlier.   Makes sense, as one would think that the hemi head would breath better than the heron head.   

In any case, watch this thread for updates as my III breaks in.

[Unkept]

I know I've seen people talk about the six speed feeling unnecessary... but the major flaw in the old five speed box (which is almost identical to the original design in the seventies) is the poor lubrication system which caused Breva's to eat fifth gear (usually only developed a whine), and they have a history of puking oil (not unlike the engine did in the past.)

Sure the old five speed was *acceptable* but this new one has an actual lubrication system (it has an oil pump) that uses half the oil, and even though many of us were fine with it the old transmissions clunk between gears (in a satisfying way) and the new one seems to be modern smooth in comparison from the reports I've read.

I guess they could've stuck with five speeds and the same ratios in the redesign, but I don't think that would've sold well to most of the market as an "upgrade" as adding a gear is the only *obvious* difference to the casual motorcyclist who doesn't know Guzzi's entire story and past of the small block.

Oh and I love the blue Special! Congrats.

[rider33]

Yep.  I bought a 2016 Triumph Street Triple Rx with the extra wonderful suspension and super duper modern engine, big modern radial tires, dual front disk brakes, etc.  This is a bike that fans of modern technological improvements rave about. 

It leaves me a bit cold.  I vastly prefer to ride the little small block.  Will probably sell the Triumph.  Newer is not necessarily better, except maybe on paper.

‘funny how that works.  Some of the fastest, most advanced bikes bikes I’ve owned have also been among the one’s I’ve sold the quickest.  Part of that is warp-speed-in-seconds is not necessarily always a good thing & part of it is likely technical trickery and rider engaugement are not necessarily related.
That perhaps is the real beauty of the iii’s, old school look and feel that stirs the soul with enough spice on top to keep it interesting, a nicely balanced little bike IMHO.

[Rion]

Glad it arrived safely.

Hi Kevin!

[twowings]

I could stare at that beautiful blue bike all day...

[neverquit]

Thanks for comparison jas67.  I have an older 2 throttle body Nevada and have been considering the VIII so your review is very helpful.  I hope to read more from you when you have had a chance to put some miles on it.  Nice looking bike, you made a good buy.

[bpreynolds]

Nice write up and congrats on getting what I think is one of the prettiest Guzzis ever made. 

I owned a ‘14 Stone and then later a V9, and then a ‘17 Stone.  You’re riding them back to back so hey, who can argue much with that and I don’t want to argue with what you’re saying as I think it might be splitting hairs.  I will say my experience with my ‘14 versus the ‘17 was noticeable to me; however, it was not in the grunt area or low down per se, rather, to me it felt like it had a bit - a bit, I say - more of a rush whoosh and push once it got up into the band.  Again, nothing grandly different but definitely there to me.  But like you, I wouldn’t buy a newer one just for that reason alone. 

[Vagrant]

owning both the 15 and 17 I'd say Jas is spot on. as with all Guzzi's the power will come with breakin miles. mine is at 3500 now and it feels much better. as for the real power difference I say the V7III is 500 less RPM for its power development with a bit more torque down low. it also runs out of steam 500 early on top. the mid range powerband is stronger and smoother BUT it could all be the tune of the computer because the 17 really does run fine right out of the box and the 15 sucks! The biggest thing is the gauges on the special are big and easy to read / see all the time where the 15 is hard to see / read. the suspension alone is worth the extra money. the 17 is tolerable for most folks and most roads. the 15 is not! There is a lot of extra detail work that was done on the 17 and I think they actually assembled it without the benefit of wine.
On another note I pulled mine out of the garage yesterday with the new radial on the rear (now tubeless) a Bill Mayer seat and while I was waiting for the silicone to dry I slapped on a 20 year old set of Conti replica mufflers seeing as one was off anyway. OMG what a beautiful sound!

[Rich A]

The first thing I noticed about my V7III Special (compared with my Bassa and Jackal, about 110k mi combined) is that it is quiet. The silencers do look a little big, but at this point, I’m not inclined to upgrade them. The gearbox is much better and the clutch pull far lighter compared with the big blocks. The more modern instruments provide some useful info. Handling is OK; braking OK, too. I have traction control set on 1, and I don't really notice it.

Overall, I am pleased with the way it performs. The main thing at this point is that I want to get the break-in over so I can push it a little to see what it can do under more normal riding conditions.

[jas67]

On another note I pulled mine out of the garage yesterday with the new radial on the rear (now tubeless)

Do tell about going tubeless?  Did you switch to a pair of V7 Stone mags, or somehow seal your wire wheels?

The first thing I noticed about my V7III Special (compared with my Bassa and Jackal, about 110k mi combined) is that it is quiet. The silencers do look a little big, but at this point, I’m not inclined to upgrade them.

Yes, the mufflers definitely look huge, though, they sound good enough.

[Warren Rhen]

It's way more than the spec sheet.    I do own and enjoy a few more powerful bikes (see list below) with better handling and brakes, etc, and have ridden some properly fast bikes such as the Motus, DucatiDiavel,BMW XR1000, BMW S1000R, Suzuki GSXS1000R.

The V7 is a competent street machine that has character, style and class.    It yields more smiles per mile than many more powerful machines.

I can have more fun on the V7 on public roads than I can on any of the 4-cylinder liter bikes on the list above.     On those machines, my reaction was, "Nothing good would come of it."

I get it. I traded in my Diavel and BMW K1200GT for my California. I just wasn�t using their capabilities (particularly the Diavel, which was unhappy at anything below 4000 rpm).

It's way more than the spec sheet.    I do own and enjoy a few more powerful bikes (see list below) with better handling and brakes, etc, and have ridden some properly fast bikes such as the Motus, DucatiDiavel,BMW XR1000, BMW S1000R, Suzuki GSXS1000R.

The V7 is a competent street machine that has character, style and class.    It yields more smiles per mile than many more powerful machines.

I can have more fun on the V7 on public roads than I can on any of the 4-cylinder liter bikes on the list above.     On those machines, my reaction was, "Nothing good would come of it."

Well said J. I've had 8 prvious MGs' and 12 Ducs and my stornello and  othe rbikes too numerous to mention yet for no reason I can show you on paper my stornello has become one of my top 3 favorite bikes. And Ican barely park it anywhere that someone doesn't come over and comment on what and excellent looking bike it is. Guess you got everytthing under control back there in PA. I miss those good riding roads

[Vagrant]

Tubeless. first there are tons of U-tube blips, some over the top with stupid ideas. I have a good spoke wrench so I checked the spokes for tightness. I cleaned the wheel with dish soap then again with brake cleaner carefully in the spoke recess. I installed a Napa 90-426 valve stem using a tiny layer of silicone on it. don't over tighten they can brake. then I used high temp silicone gasket maker (only because all the types were basically $8.00 at autozone) putting a dab on then mashing it into the spoke screw to get it in everywhere then finished it off with another big dab to over cover the whole recessed area making it flush with the rim center. once done I put the axle in and placed on jack stands to balance it. it took the same 3 weights that were on the original tire so they got glued into the rims center then siliconed over too. 24 hours drying time then remounted and leak checked using big plastic storage tub. one spoke leaked. I couldn't believe it but I had to remove the tire and redo it. saw no reason for it. my only guess is silicone is self settling and maybe I should have done 1/4 of the wheel at a time to let it settle in. anyway when redone all was well and the finished wheel took no weights. It took almost the whole tube of silicone and when I do the front I think I will just go get the 30 year window stuff. much cheaper. I think I will also seal the spoke threaded area with seals all first to be safe. A bit time consuming but well worth it.

[kballowe]

Glad it arrived safely.

Hi Kevin!

Hi Ryan!

[Kev m]

Well I can't wait to ride it... Not to cast aspersions but Jay might also be a little jaded from the rest of his fleet.

I do think it is hard to compare a smallblock that is just starting break-in with one that has thousands or tens of thousands of miles more.

I remember when Jay and I compared his first smallblock (V7C) side-by-side with my then too new V7 Stone (MkI). The Stone felt more torquey at lower rpm, but tight and less free or willing to rev. Thousands of miles later I suspect that side-by-side might have sounded a little different.

I'm curious on the transmission too just because since I added the RK with the 6-spd to the fleet (we already had the 6-spd Duc) I find myself looking for 6th more on the V7.