Tire Bead seating ideas (changed title)

[Chuck in Indiana]

Ok, I've been making my G5 wire wheels tubeless. Had no problems whatsoever with the front, but I can't get the rear to seat the bead. I've been able to seat garden tractor tires with a tie down strap around the tire. Tried that. Nada. Fooled with it for an hour or so, and admitted defeat for today. <shrug> This is the first time I've not been able to seat the bead on a bike tire.
Took the tire back off, put the tube in it and have it blown up until the beads are roughly 5-6" apart, and I'll leave it overnight.
Tomorrow, I thought I'd heat the tire up really well, either with the sun  or my Heat gun from Hell, apply RuGlyde liberally to the bead area on the wheel and tire, slap that sucker on there, and give it a try.
Any other ideas? I'm not above buying a new tire, but this one would last through the summer.
TIA

[bad Chad]

This works for me!

[cliffrod]

We've had a number of tires at the shop, more in the near past, that were simply impossible to seat.  Not difficult- impossible.  Even a tube will pop before the bead seats.  You expect a low $$ no name to be a potential bum tire once in a while, but the last one I personally worked on was a better brand name new tire.  The owner bought it online, then had trouble mounting it and called for help.  we said we would try if he brought it to the shop.

We did everything we knew, short of filling it with gas or lacquer thinner and throwing a match....  That usually works but can significantly damage the tire carcass (or more). On a tractor, maybe no big deal but not cool on a bike tire.  Same with crazy air pressure. After two of us working with him for over two hours with zero progress, we told him we suspected the tire was bad.

Sometimes heat/warm tire plus soap, conduit lube or whatever slippery stuff you like to use will help.  Blow it up, beat on it with a dead low or rubber mallet to creep the bead out a little, let out the air and repeat a million times.  Mallet blows in other areas of the tire can help as much or more than simply hitting it in the obvious area that isn't seating.   But sometimes, it just isn't going to happen.  The local Tucker Rocky rep is great about warranty service.

Good luck.

 

[Lannis]

Chuck this is a good plan and I have used it with success,but....

There will be some that think I'm crazy (could be,but I've been tested) I would use more pressure, I've done over 100 psi to seat beads on my CX..

If this fails, I get my trusty lighter (aerosol ether diesel start fluid and squirt a little bit inside the tire then ...you guessed it the bic lighter..has never failed me yet.
A little goes along way and "pop" done...

When iI was a kid that how we seated tractor/truck tires.

Those of you who don't like this method, please spare me the criticisms...I've heard them all.....
:-)

The way I understand Chuck's issue, he can't get enough air to flow in order to push the beads to make contact with the rim so it can start filling.   Even with the valve core out and 120 PSI pressure in the tank, sometimes I can't get it either, and the ratchet strap 'round the tire only works for me on big floppy yard tires.

When it happens to me for whatever reason, I bail out and take it to the bike shop, where they have a "Cheetah" air tank where you put 150 PSI in the tank and BLAST it into the tire via the bead, with the regular compressor hooked up to the tire valve.   That always works.

Once the bead is in contact, and the tire is filling up, it's up to your own judgment how high to go with the pressure to actually "seat" the bead, as you say.   I start getting nervous around 60 PSI, but with proper RuGlyde on the rim, I never have to go higher ....

Lannis

[RinkRat II]

      Here Ya Go Chuck....... What could possibly go wrong??
     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abH9__WKMhc

          Paul B

[Ncdan]

Take it to a tire shop as they have a special tank setup with a instant release valve and attachment to place on the stubborn tire and wheel. All the air is release from the tank at once, forcing the tire to seal on the wheel. The controlled explosion will work as I have did it numerous times but the correct equipment usually is the best path. Good luck!!!

[Frenchfrog]

When I was running Contis on my cast wheels it always took 90/100 psi to get them to seat...needless to say copious Tyre soap too.

[Vagrant]

Spray it all with Pam. Yes that Pam. Place it the sun if possible if not make a tent over it and stick a heater in for a while.

[Lannis]

      Here Ya Go Chuck....... What could possibly go wrong??
     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abH9__WKMhc

          Paul B

You know, that spray-and-blow process for seating a bead must be a sort of fail-safe process.   I've seen people spray just a little WD-40 or starter fluid and it works, and I've seen them spray a lot and it works.

I think it's self limiting because as soon as the tire bead seats, and there's no more fresh oxygen inside the tire to combust with the spray, it turns itself off and stays where it's at.

But unless it was a matter of filling my tire or risking death in the desert or tundra, I'm not going to be trying it ...

Lannis

[Chuck in Indiana]

During this saga, one time.. with the ratchet strap pretty tight, hooked up to 120 lbs. and the valve core out, it started to seat. Not wanting to make my life complete,   (I had visions of that big hunker ratchet assembly headed for my ear hole) I took the chuck off, and the tire collapsed. Never did get it to do that again.

[John A]

I've used acetylene and o2 scary as hell but works. I usually put too much in so go slow

[Perazzimx14]

I have only ever had one tire that I could not get the bead to even attempt to start to seat. It was a Harley wheel (doesn't matter I've changed mutiple Harley and GW tires) and I forget the tire. I tried everything in my arsenal to no effect. Ratchet strap, 2 rachet straps, 3 ratchet straps. Bouncing the wheel/tire on the floor trying to get it centered in the drop center. After about and hour I ran out of curse words and energy and gave up. When the guy came to pick up the wheel I admitted defeat and asked if he could take it someplace with a big air compressor. He did and it worked. 

[Tom]

I've used up to 100 psi, that's with tire having sat in the sun.  86F+. 

[jacksonracingcomau]

 not sure what ruglide is
but tyre lube from auto place makes all the diff for me
seals air first then lubes bead to seat, trick is the sealing first bit
but maybe old tyre is issue here  ?

[oldbike54]

 I have a wooden box large enough to hold a tire with a glass top that can be propped at different angles to catch the Sun . Even on a cool day it will warm up to 120 F , leaving a tire warmed thoroughly making it quite pliable . Normally it only takes a few lbs over normal inflation pressure to seat a bead .

 Dusty

[John Croucher]

The last set of tires I put on, on the tubeless rims project, I cleaned all the "mold flash" from the bead and lightly finished with a green scotchbrite  pad.  I then wiped the bead area with red wheel bearing grease.  Just enough to make the surface moist.  I then put the first side on by hand and the second side on with only one flip of the tire iron (with a plastic pad between the rim and iron).  The tire popped onto the rim very quickly.  It is all about overcoming friction.

And a warm tire always seems to go on much easier.  I have used the sunshine trick and the heat gun method to warm. 

[bad Chad]

Really, I get nothing for that?   Tough crowd.

[jacksonracingcomau]

The last set of tires I put on, on the tubeless rims project, I cleaned all the "mold flash" from the bead and lightly finished with a green scotchbrite  pad.  I then wiped the bead area with red wheel bearing grease.  Just enough to make the surface moist.  I then put the first side on by hand and the second side on with only one flip of the tire iron (with a plastic pad between the rim and iron).  The tire popped onto the rim very quickly.  It is all about overcoming friction.
seriously?
grease rim to tyre ?
caution anybody reading this, tyre lube is not grease





And a warm tire always seems to go on much easier.  I have used the sunshine trick and the heat gun method to warm.

[guzzisteve]

This works for me!

That's what I thought the thread was about, so I didn't even look.

I seen the fire trick before, I had to use heat gun and straps on a few.
I'll bet it's kinda cool in the hanger!!

[John Croucher]

You left out "Pam", Over Pressurizing", "extereme heat", "WD-40", "starting fluid", "acetylene", "gas" and "lacquer thinner".  All extreme measures that will most likely void the warranty and damage a tire.  Along with using multiple extended pry bars to stretch the tire over the rim lip. 

[80CX100]

Really, I get nothing for that?   Tough crowd.

     Quite well done actually, altho I had to go back and do a double take to fully appreciate it, slow on the uptake.

     Penderic would be proud!

     Kelly

[Perazzimx14]

There are 3 steps in installing a tire on a wheel:

1. Install tire over rim
2. Apply air in sufficient volume to balloon the tire beads outward past the drop center to a point where the tire will begin to take air and seal against the inner wheel
3. Continue applying air in sufficient pressure until the bead of the tire slides over the wheel bead

Step 2 takes volume of air over pressure. Step 3 takes pressure of air over volume. The OP is having issues with step 2.

[Chuck in Indiana]

not sure what ruglide is
but tyre lube from auto place makes all the diff for me
seals air first then lubes bead to seat, trick is the sealing first bit
but maybe old tyre is issue here  ?

RuGlyde is a tire lube from a large North American auto parts place. As far as I'm concerned, it is the standard for tire work.
I wonder about the old tire issue, too. It's had a tube in it for a few years and few thousand miles. It's flat spotted.. but no more than I plan on riding the G5, should last the season.
I will try every trick posted here before giving up. 
Thanks all.. gotta love WG.

[Chuck in Indiana]

I'll bet it's kinda cool in the hanger!!

Yes it is.. but the shop is 68. When I was a kid on the farm I told myself I was never going to freeze my ass off working again. 

[Texas Turnip]

this works for me: Put tire back on bike, pick up fat girl, run over railroad tracks or a rough road and the tire pops out. Drop off fat girl and hope no one with a camera captures the moment.

Tex

[kballowe]

Some tires just don't cooperate.

I have a cardboard box thingy.  Put tire in box.  Use wooden blocks to open area between beads.
Shove an old incandescent shop light in there and then cover everything with blankets.
This takes several hours.

If you're in a hurry, then you can get a $10 hair dryer at Wal-Mart.  Cut a little slot in the box somewhere and crank it up.
I like 115-120 degree tires.
 

In summer, I throw them out on the asphalt driveway.
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[Lannis]

There are 3 steps in installing a tire on a wheel:

1. Install tire over rim
2. Apply air in sufficient volume to balloon the tire beads outward past the drop center to a point where the tire will begin to take air and seal against the inner wheel
3. Continue applying air in sufficient pressure until the bead of the tire slides over the wheel bead

Step 2 takes volume of air over pressure. Step 3 takes pressure of air over volume. The OP is having issues with step 2.

Thanks!   You explained that better than I did .... !

[John A]

this works for me: Put tire back on bike, pick up fat girl, run over railroad tracks or a rough road and the tire pops out. Drop off fat girl and hope no one with a camera captures the moment.

Tex

Sometimes it takes two fat girls,  or maybe you can get by with a fat one and a skinny one if you have to buy them dinner.  It's where the long seats on a Convert are really nice

[Ncdan]

Sometimes it takes two fat girls,  or maybe you can get by with a fat one and a skinny one if you have to buy them dinner.  It's where the long seats on a Convert are really nice

Well John, I resemble that remark as my wife would have to take 3 wheelbarrow loads if someone yelled " HAUL ASS " 😂😂

[oldbike54]

 

 Dusty