Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: aschem on November 06, 2018, 03:14:23 PM
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Appears that Kawasaki is bring the W800 to the states next year.
https://www.kawasaki.com/Products/2019-W800-Cafe?cm_sp=VehicleDetails-_-W800CAFE-_-HomePageBucket#
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This excites my wife a lot for some reason...who doesn't ride...LOL...
Think she is hinting me something...
I like it a lot too as W800 is such a memory for me in Asia...that and W650
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Black engine leaves me out. I find the color of the rest similarly unattractive.
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my eyes, my eyes.
I'd say five years too late and few thousand dollars short.
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poop brown? satin black fenders? $9,800? well, that doesn't appeal to me. I liked what they did with the W650, but not this one. I give them credit for coming back to the market, but don't think this will set the market on fire.
P.S. Yes, I would buy a new RE twin before this Kaw W800...hmm, what have I just said? Like Ohiorider says a few posts below, I sure hope RE does well with their new twin - QA will tell the tale and what dealer's charge for the bike OTD.
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People who actually bought the W650 seemed to love them. I nearly bought one but a ZRX1100 was sitting on the dealer floor next to the W650 for the same price. I rode home on the ZRX and I still think that was a smart choice.
I like the lines of the W800 but I'm struggling to find a reason they chose monkey poo brown. Why? If they're trying to give a nod to the Z1, that was rootbeer, with flake. It was not dull, gibbon poo colored. I am beyond sick of the matte paint thing and that includes the V7 line.
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The Japanese do flatter their predacessors well. Looks like a VII Bonneville with the 1st gen V7 tank stripe. Sure, it will work well but I question this color shown. Hopefully there'll be a couple options. Aah, but will it have "character?"
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I wanted a green and gold one bad when I saw it on the Euro sites. I was hoping they would bring it to the states, but like others have said "Too Late Kawasaki!" For the price I am glad i bought my V7III. No regrets.
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A little late Kawi and double the price of:
(https://cnet1.cbsistatic.com/img/rvuzaXEwzLIQx20heXdVbFCeMWE=/2018/09/27/54dced06-631b-40c1-9d60-da4d4c4c7b7f/el3-1116.jpg)
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OK, I was really excited until I saw it was a cafe style bike. If that is the only option, it will be another 20 years before they bring another bike like that over. At least give us a standard setup!
PS - Agree the color is kinda gross
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A little late Kawi and double the price of:
(https://cnet1.cbsistatic.com/img/rvuzaXEwzLIQx20heXdVbFCeMWE=/2018/09/27/54dced06-631b-40c1-9d60-da4d4c4c7b7f/el3-1116.jpg)
I truly hope RE does well with their new twins. They're definitely priced right, good looking, and if they prove reliable, then what's not to like? I'd do one.
I really liked my 2000 W650. Rode from Aug 2000 to the end of 2006. But keep in mind, I only paid $4995 plus a few dealer fees and tax in Aug of 2000. Rode it 50,000 miles before selling. Great little machine, but there's a lot of other nice retro iron out there today, especially from Moto Guzzi and Triumph. And now that I'm getting used to my CB1100 with much more compliant aftermarket suspension, I see it as a bike that could hurt W800 sales. There's leftover/new 2014 CBs being sold for $5995. Not bad for a DOHC, 1140cc, 88hp bike, with torque available nearly anywhere in the rpm range. I plan on keeping mine for a good while, and making additional improvements along the way.
Bob
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We have had the W800 out here for a number of years. Nice looking bike.
I remember the tester that rode it saying it was a much better bike than the W650, yet the price of a second hand 650 is usually quite a bit more than an 800, :rolleyes: Go figure.
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I truly hope RE does well with their new twins. They're definitely priced right, good looking, and if they prove reliable, then what's not to like? I'd do one.
I really liked my 2000 W650. Rode from Aug 2000 to the end of 2006. But keep in mind, I only paid $4995 plus a few dealer fees and tax in Aug of 2000. Rode it 50,000 miles before selling. Great little machine, but there's a lot of other nice retro iron out there today, especially from Moto Guzzi and Triumph. And now that I'm getting used to my CB1100 with much more compliant aftermarket suspension, I see it as a bike that could hurt W800 sales. There's leftover/new 2014 CBs being sold for $5995. Not bad for a DOHC, 1140cc, 88hp bike, with torque available nearly anywhere in the rpm range. I plan on keeping mine for a good while, and making additional improvements along the way.
Bob
Twin versus I-4? I'd chose twin every time. If I were an I-4 person I would choose the Kawasaki rootbeer Z900 retro bike over the Honda.
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" a little late"?
Do any of you pay attention to what people under the age of 50 are riding?
That bike will sell. It won't be a "top seller", it won't become bike of the year, but it will sell well.
It has Japanese reliability behind it, which makes it far more attractive to the average rider than Indian wrenchability.
For me, it's the "Cafe" pretentions that don't sit right with me. But I do love the colour.
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" a little late"?
Do any of you pay attention to what people under the age of 50 are riding?
That bike will sell. It won't be a "top seller", it won't become bike of the year, but it will sell well.
It has Japanese reliability behind it, which makes it far more attractive to the average rider than Indian wrenchability.
For me, it's the "Cafe" pretentions that don't sit right with me. But I do love the colour.
Late for me. I was all Kawasaki a decade ago. Had a bike of every genre in my stable except the W650 / W800. The used W650s were selling for more than I was willing to pay for what it was. I was following the W800 hoping it would come to the states.
In 2015 I moved to other manufacturers and am not looking back. Now Kawasaki has to prove to me that they are the better bike and better value if they want me back.
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Black engine leaves me out. I find the color of the rest similarly unattractive.
Yup, a beautiful bike with blacked out drive train and crappy colors. STUPID!!!!
The blacked out drive train is like popcorn ceilings, covers up bad workmanship!
For me, it's the "Cafe" pretentions that don't sit right with me. But I do love the colour.
I like the cafe fairing and hump seat, but I need polished aluminum and bright colors!
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Yup, a beautiful bike with blacked out drive train and crappy colors. STUPID!!!!
The blacked out drive train is like popcorn ceilings, covers up back workmanship!
I like the cafe fairing and hump seat, but I need polished aluminum and bright colors!
Never liked non blacked out engines myself. Black with silver diamond cut fins, and a few chrome bolt on parts is the way to go.
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Must be the only one, but I think it looks pretty cool..
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Must be the only one, but I think it looks pretty cool..
You're not the only one, BUT....
It needs gloss paint, and at least another color choice, I'm not a fan of the color choice shown. Like many others here, I've never been a fan of matte/satin paint. Go gloss, or go home.
Also, they should bring the standard version too, not just the cafe version. I would think many of the people shopping in this category want more upright ergos.
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Can't say I like the color combination and near full black-out of the engine. I think I'll keep riding my '01 W650.
Spud
(https://thumb.ibb.co/kytqCq/W650side.jpg) (https://ibb.co/kytqCq)
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At least it doesn't have fake carbs on it. That black engine is just plain wrong though.
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Loved the W650. This is a good looking bike, BUT I prefer polished engines. Waiting to pull the trigger on one of the new RE twins once they arrive.
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Can't say I like the color combination and near full black-out of the engine. I think I'll keep riding my '01 W650.
Spud
(https://thumb.ibb.co/kytqCq/W650side.jpg) (https://ibb.co/kytqCq)
Yes, I too would prefer the polished engine on a classic bike like this.
And, I too will keep riding my '00 W650.
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1901/31896994708_e498c132b3_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/QACrfC)IMG_3338 (https://flic.kr/p/QACrfC) by jay_snyder67 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/97354518@N02/), on Flickr
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With the blacked out engine and other components, for me it’s just falls short on good looks. Triumph styling has it all. They nail it almost every time they bring a bike to market. Prefer the Royal Enfield over this.
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With the blacked out engine and other components, for me it’s just falls short on good looks. Triumph styling has it all. They nail it almost every time they bring a bike to market. Prefer the Royal Enfield over this.
Agreed, at least on looks:
(https://www.royalenfield.com/motorcycles/twins/images/twins/interceptor/orange/orange-2.png)
BUT, I'd rather own and ride the W800, as it is a known quantity from the reliability standpoint.
Of course, the W800 is nearly twice the money.
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no price advantage over the real thing that happens to be a great product. and at about 40 HP at the rear sorry, V7 any time before this.
in addition they raised the Versys 1000 from $12995 to 17995 by adding a few gizmos found on their other bikes. THEY ARE NUCKING FUTS!!!
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no price advantage over the real thing that happens to be a great product. and at about 40 HP at the rear sorry, V7 any time before this.
in addition they raised the Versys 1000 from $12995 to 17995 by adding a few gizmos found on their other bikes. THEY ARE NUCKING FUTS!!!
They'll sell 10's, maybe 100's of them. They'll be a cult bike in 10-20 years.
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in addition they raised the Versys 1000 from $12995 to 17995 by adding a few gizmos found on their other bikes. THEY ARE NUCKING FUTS!!!
Oh come on now. Cornering ABS, electronic suspension, cruise control, LED lighting, luggage, etc. Wouldnt call that a few gizmos. Sure not everyone can afford that. My Triumph Trophy SE MSRP was $20k, but I paid $15k plus Triumph threw in $1500 in accessories of my choice. That bike spoiled me for all bikes that followed.
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Good effort by Kawasaki. Not a fan of the color scheme, but a nice bike overall.
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Not at all interesting to me, looks like another copy job from Japan. Meh.
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no price advantage over the real thing that happens to be a great product. and at about 40 HP at the rear sorry, V7 any time before this.
in addition they raised the Versys 1000 from $12995 to 17995 by adding a few gizmos found on their other bikes. THEY ARE NUCKING FUTS!!!
Whoa! I seen they updated it but didn't catch the price. I paid $11,400 for my brand new '16 Versys 1000LT in '16. A $6,000 premium over that is insane. I could see maybe paying an extra $2,000 for the electrically adjustable suspension. LED lights are cheap. The TFT dash is nice but not necessary.
These bikes aren't popular which makes 'em hard to sell. I tried to sell it last summer and couldn't even get $6,000 for it. Knowing that really puts a limit on what I'd pay for one now.
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I predict that the W800 will out perform, be more comfortable, and more reliable than the new RE twin.
Yes, I rode a W650 for ten years - loved the bevel and 8 valve engine. I think I'd take a V7 III over these as well.
When I went to but a V7 III it was parked next to the new Bonneville T120 - I rode both and came home with the Bonneville, so far, no regrets.
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Not at all interesting to me, looks like another copy job from Japan. Meh.
Copy of what? A previously made japanese motorcycle
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https://www.revolvy.com/page/Kawasaki-W-series (https://www.revolvy.com/page/Kawasaki-W-series)
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https://www.revolvy.com/page/Kawasaki-W-series (https://www.revolvy.com/page/Kawasaki-W-series)
Nice history article.
Bob
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Jas67,
Looks like we both liked to do some light touring on our W650s. Here's a pic of mine, taken in September 2006, riding along Rt 39 in Virginia, overlooking the Maury River, which runs through Goshen Pass.
(https://thumb.ibb.co/jemoYV/2000-W650.jpg) (https://ibb.co/jemoYV)
- Aftermarket fly screen
- Kawasaki Euro bars
- Corbin saddle
- 5 Star pannier mounts
- Givi E21 hard bags
Purchased new in August 2000. Approaching 50,000 trouble-free miles in Sept 2006. A well-built machine.
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https://www.revolvy.com/page/Kawasaki-W-series (https://www.revolvy.com/page/Kawasaki-W-series)
Yep a copy of a Japanese bike that copied a BSA. Kawacopy! LoL
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I like it. Not crazy about the color. Always dug the W650.
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Yep a copy of a Japanese bike that copied a BSA. Kawacopy! LoL
Not a copy. Licensed production in another country. More like Royal Enfield than Triumph, the sequel.
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Well, it looks like Kawasaki are producing a regular W800 as well, but, we may or may not get it in the US, as the US Kawasaki site only shows the cafe.
https://www.visordown.com/news/new-bikes/2019-kawasaki-w800-cafe-and-street-unveiled-eicma-milan-show (https://www.visordown.com/news/new-bikes/2019-kawasaki-w800-cafe-and-street-unveiled-eicma-milan-show)
(https://www.visordown.com/sites/default/files/styles/v2_normal/public/19EJ800B_101BK1DRF3CG_A.jpg?itok=4qMk-0hq)
Like the cafe, the model shown is in satin/matte paint :sad:
Hopefully the offer it in gloss paint as well. As others have said, I think the all black engine does detract some from the looks of these bikes. They should at least polish the edges of the fins like they do on the Cafe.
They look SO much better in gloss paint, and with the engine in silver with polished side cases.
(https://advrider.com/f/attachments/4c2c97c9-7032-481a-b5d2-762665f9562d-jpeg.1421495/)
At least it has a tach, unlike the V7 III Stone.
(https://www.visordown.com/sites/default/files/styles/v2_normal/public/19EJ800C_40RGY1FME3CG_A.jpg?itok=TKvgeHch)
At nearly $10k, I do think the price is about $2,000 too high. The Guzzi V7III's are a much better deal. At $10k, these will languish on dealer floors like the Honda CB1100's did, and will be sold as 2-3 year old models for $7k. Due to this, Kawasaki will discontinue them promptly, and not attempt to import them to the US again.
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jas67, I have to agree with everything you said.
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If they sell one to everybody that has pleaded for Kawasaki to bring the 800 stateside
(on this forum alone :boozing:)
they've got a hit on there hands..
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I like it, the brown seat insert flows into the brown tank and silver side panel and fairing is a nice contrast.
It will probably be super reliable, comfortable with plenty of power, I hope its a hit for Kawasaki.
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To each his own, but these things cost about the same as a Bonneville. I'm not sure what you would get with the Kaw the Triumph doesn't already deliver. Is bevel drive that attractive? I could understand wanting the W650 (vs. the early Bloor Bonnie) to get a lighter package and kickstarter, but I don't see the attraction to the 800. Then again, I freely admit a bit of bias.... :wink:
(https://thumb.ibb.co/k4P3kA/My-Bonnies.jpg) (https://ibb.co/k4P3kA)
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Canada will get both versions of the bike, $11,499C for the Cafe, and $9,999C for the standard.
https://canadamotoguide.com/2018/11/06/the-kawasaki-w800-is-coming-and-its-coming-to-canada/ (https://canadamotoguide.com/2018/11/06/the-kawasaki-w800-is-coming-and-its-coming-to-canada/)
So, with the US price for the cafe set for $9,799, that would put the price for the standard, if we get it, at around $8,499.
I do think that only offering the Cafe in the US is a mistake. I would think that they'd sell 3 standards for every Cafe.
The Cafe looks cool (s**t brown color notwithstanding), but, I'd rather ride the standard. I know, I've had a V7 Racer for 5 years, and during 3 of those years also had a V7 Special ('14 for 2 1/2 years, and the '17 for a half a year). The Special always got 3-4X the miles on it.
If I had neither, given my experience, I'd buy a Special over a Racer, and, likewise would buy the standard W800 over the Cafe.
That said, I'm sure they're hoping to engage the younger "hipster" crowd, and I hope they do, otherwise, see my previous post for the outcome.
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Jas67,
Looks like we both liked to do some light touring on our W650s. Here's a pic of mine, taken in September 2006, riding along Rt 39 in Virginia, overlooking the Maury River, which runs through Goshen Pass.
(https://thumb.ibb.co/jemoYV/2000-W650.jpg) (https://ibb.co/jemoYV)
- Aftermarket fly screen
- Kawasaki Euro bars
- Corbin saddle
- 5 Star pannier mounts
- Givi E21 hard bags
Purchased new in August 2000. Approaching 50,000 trouble-free miles in Sept 2006. A well-built machine.
I would think your version would sell much better. But what do I know? :rolleyes:
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Must be the only one, but I think it looks pretty cool..
Nah, I like it too. So does Jenn.
We're casually looking at Bonnie's.
I wonder what we will dislike more their water-cooling or this tubed-spoke wheels.
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Easy call for me......I can live with spoked wheels, but not water cooling!
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At nearly $10k, I do think the price is about $2,000 too high. The Guzzi V7III's are a much better deal. At $10k, these will languish on dealer floors like the Honda CB1100's did, and will be sold as 2-3 year old models for $7k. Due to this, Kawasaki will discontinue them promptly, and not attempt to import them to the US again.
Yeah and then blame the soft US market for all future standards. Other brands will quote it as well. When we all know a glossy W800 or CB1100DLX at $9999 woulda sold.
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That W800 lookis nice, really nice. I think Kawi missed an opertunity by not bring it to the US earlier. They could have could have rode the rising wave of retro interest.
I was at the local Yamaha, Suzuki, Vespa dealer yesterday and a
Kawi. Sales rep was there meeting with the GM and the sales manager. Seems the dealer will soon be a Kawi dealer.
The sales manager confirmed he has a W800 on order. Probably not a bike I'll buy at this point but would like to lay my eyes on one.
Paul
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One would think that Kaw would have amortized the cost of the W650 and W800 series over the past 19 - 20 years, Euro 4/5 aside. As a previous post mentioned, these bikes are coming in with a suggested MSRP that is too high, and then end up languishing for a few years until the manufacturer drops the price on unsold stock. Ironically, when I purchased my W650 in Aug 2000, it was still a current year machine. The dealer had three of them gathering dust ..... I bought mine for $4995 plus a few hundred for shipping and fees. Their philosophy was 'if it's still on the floor by July, move it out.'
Although my 2014 CB1100 originally retailed for slightly over $10k, I picked it up in April of 2017 for $6995, plus tax and doc fees. Total: $7190.00. Came with 12 month Honda warranty. One of the CB1100 forum members picked up a leftover 2014 this year, and added a 5 year extended factory warranty, all for approx $7000. Whether you like the machine or not, that's a lot of bike for the price. Although it took a while, I'm starting to appreciate and enjoy this Honda retro bike. Sure, it weighs slightly over 500 pounds, but on the relatively narrow tires she is docile, and though rated at only 88hp, makes really good torque throughout the rpm range.
(https://thumb.ibb.co/gTyWqA/My-CB1100.jpg) (https://ibb.co/gTyWqA)
2014 standard at Eldon Russell Park, Burton Ohio Sept 2014, at approx 6000 miles
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(https://thumb.ibb.co/bQJrsq/dbimage-file-L2hvb-WUvd3d3-LWRhd-GEvb-Glzd-HNlb-Gx0cm-Fk-ZS5jby5uei.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bQJrsq)
Seems something like this is wanted?
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(https://thumb.ibb.co/bQJrsq/dbimage-file-L2hvb-WUvd3d3-LWRhd-GEvb-Glzd-HNlb-Gx0cm-Fk-ZS5jby5uei.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bQJrsq)
Seems something like this is wanted?
Definitely!
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I do think that only offering the Cafe in the US is a mistake. I would think that they'd sell 3 standards for every Cafe.
I read in one of the intro articles that the US would be getting both eventually. I assumed it was a manufacturing capacity issue. I'm surprised they are both offered in CA and not here, as the homologation process is practically the same.
Gustavo
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One would think that Kaw would have amortized the cost of the W650 and W800 series over the past 19 - 20 years, Euro 4/5 aside.
Yes, but according to the press releases this is not the W650/W800 we know. 90 % of the engine are new according them, and a new frame is mentioned. If we are unlucky this is another 270 degrees twin. One should leave that to real V-twins and build parallel twins instead.
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Agreed, at least on looks:
(https://www.royalenfield.com/motorcycles/twins/images/twins/interceptor/orange/orange-2.png)
BUT, I'd rather own and ride the W800, as it is a known quantity from the reliability standpoint.
Of course, the W800 is nearly twice the money.
To me... that is beautiful! Clean and classic.
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A little late Kawi and double the price of:
(https://cnet1.cbsistatic.com/img/rvuzaXEwzLIQx20heXdVbFCeMWE=/2018/09/27/54dced06-631b-40c1-9d60-da4d4c4c7b7f/el3-1116.jpg)
The seat looks just a fraction under done, but another disc and it'd be damn nice..
Are they any good ?
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I predict that the W800 will out perform, be more comfortable, and more reliable than the new RE twin.
Well that's probably stating the bleedin' obvious, but the Kawasaki looks as ugly as a slapped arse..!
That RE is bordering on nice, almost to the point of being desirable.
Hmmmm....
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I tell ya, if they bring that street model to the states...I would add a Dart Flyscreen, K&H 1" taller seat, and H&B C-Bow mounts, and I would be good to go. Tres chic!
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Yes, but according to the press releases this is not the W650/W800 we know. 90 % of the engine are new according them, and a new frame is mentioned. If we are unlucky this is another 270 degrees twin. One should leave that to real V-twins and build parallel twins instead.
Agreed! I would hope Kaw has retained the 360 degree crankshaft. Change whatever else internally to improve the engine (if any improvement is necessary!), but keep the 360 firing order. It's the real deal when it comes to retro vertical twins. My 2000 model sounded pretty good with the stock pipes. Left them on for the 50,000 miles I rode the W. When I picked up a 2003 790cc Bonnie, it was sooooooo quiet. A set of Triumph's TORs cured that issue for me.
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These are the two W800s that I would have wanted brought to the states.
(https://thumb.ibb.co/f6xnHq/012511bottom-730x453.jpg) (https://ibb.co/f6xnHq)
(https://thumb.ibb.co/ccqUVA/w800-kawasaki-cafe-racer.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ccqUVA)
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These are the two W800s that I would have wanted brought to the states.
(https://thumb.ibb.co/f6xnHq/012511bottom-730x453.jpg) (https://ibb.co/f6xnHq)
(https://thumb.ibb.co/ccqUVA/w800-kawasaki-cafe-racer.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ccqUVA)
Love the orange/silver with bikini fairing!
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These are the two W800s that I would have wanted brought to the states.
(https://thumb.ibb.co/f6xnHq/012511bottom-730x453.jpg) (https://ibb.co/f6xnHq)
(https://thumb.ibb.co/ccqUVA/w800-kawasaki-cafe-racer.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ccqUVA)
The orange one is clearly trying to recall the R90S.
(https://media.boingboing.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/IMG_0350.jpg)
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Yes, but according to the press releases this is not the W650/W800 we know. 90 % of the engine are new according them, and a new frame is mentioned. If we are unlucky this is another 270 degrees twin. One should leave that to real V-twins and build parallel twins instead.
Is the 270
Just for the sound? Like a narrow v twin? Cuz I thought I read the 270 had an advantage over 360 in power delivery. I personally like my twins L or flat.
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Is the 270
Just for the sound? Like a narrow v twin? Cuz I thought I read the 270 had an advantage over 360 in power delivery. I personally like my twins L or flat.
The 270 has the same power delivery as a 90 degree V twin (L-twin).
It also always has a piston in motion, and one is at maximum velocity when the other is stopped. 360 and 180 parallel twins, and opposed twins the pistons are both stopped at the same time.
As a result the 270 (also called cross plane) and the 90 degree V-twin both have a relatively constant kinetic energy within the rotating assembly + the rods and pistons. Where the 180 and 360 parallel twins, as well as the boxer twins the piston and rods go from zero kinetic engery to a lot and back to zero. Thus causes torsional vibration in the crank that the cross plan parallel twin and 90 degree V-twin don't have (or at least don't have as much).
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The orange one is clearly trying to recall the R90S.
(https://media.boingboing.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/IMG_0350.jpg)
Yes it is, and Gawd love 'em for doing it!
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The 270 has the same power delivery as a 90 degree V twin (L-twin).
It also always has a piston in motion, and one is at maximum velocity when the other is stopped. 360 and 180 parallel twins, and opposed twins the pistons are both stopped at the same time.
As a result the 270 (also called cross plane) and the 90 degree V-twin both have a relatively constant kinetic energy within the rotating assembly + the rods and pistons. Where the 180 and 360 parallel twins, as well as the boxer twins the piston and rods go from zero kinetic engery to a lot and back to zero. Thus causes torsional vibration in the crank that the cross plan parallel twin and 90 degree V-twin don't have (or at least don't have as much).
This is all clear and understood. But a motorcycle is not a machine you buy because it is a reasonable thing to do. At least our favourite bikes are here because we want to feel the engine. Because we want to ride a mechanical, archaic thing. The same in my opinion applies to everybody who rides a Harley, a retro-styled bike of any provenience, an Enfield Bullet (the last of course does not apply to most riders in India). And the best sounding bike I have ever heard (and ridden) was a Norton Commando 750 Fastback with Roadster pipes. When I want a perfect quiet running motor I take the Honda CB 1100. When I want the slightly rough way of a 270° engine I do what I do, I ride a Guzzi and contemplate Ducati and Aprilia.
But thats only me.
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Is the 270
Just for the sound? Like a narrow v twin? Cuz I thought I read the 270 had an advantage over 360 in power delivery. I personally like my twins L or flat.
When I was looking at the Bonneville lineup a few years ago the Bonnie and the Thruxton were 360 and the Scrambler was 270.
The Scrambler made more torque down low, but the Bonnie/Thruxton had higher peak horsepower.
I much preferred the Scrambler layout. It had a better 'feel' and more character.
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In 2006, my good riding buddy Tom and I decided to take a ride from Cleveland Ohio out West. We both had larger bikes at the time, but we both had some saddle time on our Bonnevilles and thought 'why not? I fab'd up some mounts for a set of E21 bags I already owned, installed a rear rack. Tom's bike was already ready to travel. Several days into the ride, we were outside of Taos, New Mexico, when we took this short video of Tom's Bonnie, equipped with TORs (Triumph Off Road) mufflers. Nice, and not nearly as loud as so many of the aftermarket pipes.
Here's one example of why I like vertical twins with 360 degree cranks. The video is blurry (it had been through a few conversions before making it onto YouTube,) but the audio is ok.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbQBFtDOK5M
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That is odd as the 360 single pin crank is like two singles running together, maybe a bit more vibes but singles are known for torque "down low".
Sort of. They do not fire together, but on alternate revolutions.
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Oh man that "character" thing! (subjective..no?)
That is odd as the 360 single pin crank is like two singles running together, maybe a bit more vibes but singles are known for torque "down low".
Probably the one single thing about the HD's popularity is the sound...blip...blip!! And for some of us?? that 360 firing order is the business.
"Live long and prosper" V....
:-)
From CW magazine: https://www.cycleworld.com/2015/08/20/triumph-900-scrambler-motorcycle-review-road-test-numbers-photos-specifications#page-2
First the engine, an 865cc dohc eight-valve air-cooled vertical-Twin, has been revamped for a lower, flatter torque curve, with a loss of peak horsepower. Triumph switched from a 360- to a 270-degree crankshaft, as used also in the Bonneville America and Speedmaster, and the engine pumps out just 47 horsepower at 6400 rpm and 44 foot-pounds of torque at 5100 rpm. By comparison, the Thruxton (Triumph’s hottest Twin) makes 57 hp at 7200 rpm and 46 ft.-lb. of torque at 6400 rpm.
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Not to nitpick, but those cycle world numbers are wrong. The classic fuel injected scram makes 59 hp (6800 rpm) and 50 ft lb torque (4750 rpm) at 507 lbs wet weight. It's a pretty revvy motor that in my experience likes to hang out in the 5000 rpm range.
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Not to nitpick, but those cycle world numbers are wrong. The classic fuel injected scram makes 59 hp (6800 rpm) and 50 ft lb torque (4750 rpm) at 507 lbs wet weight. It's a pretty revvy motor that in my experience likes to hang out in the 5000 rpm range.
Your source? On the Dyno at the rear wheel? Published from Triumph at the crank?
I want concerned with the numbers, just that the torque curve was where I like to ride. I guess triumph agreed with my thoughts since all the new classics are 270 degree cranks.
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The W650 and W800 motors have a counter-balancer to offset the vibes from the pistons going up and down together, so, the vibes are pretty minimal.
I would think that a 270 degree parallel twin would still need a counter-balancer. Yes, the torsional vibration is less (than a 360), but, it won't have the inherent good primary and secondary balance of a 90 degree V-twin.
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They have to stick w/it so have gone to extraordinary measures to isolate the vibration from the rider. (V rod good example)
The V-Rod has a 60 degree angle and a counter-balancer...
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The 270 degree cranks were not done for power but for SOUND (like a 90 degree V twin ala ducati or guzzi) and a bit less vibration.
A parallel twin with a 360 degree crank can be tuned w/just as much power as a 270 degree. But w/both pistons moving together the vibration can get a little intense.
The HD w/45 degree cylinders are awful in this respect but is done mainly 'cause its a Harley! They have to stick w/it so have gone to extraordinary measures to isolate the vibration from the rider. (V rod good example)
Norton did the same thing w/isolastic frame.
To each his....
Beating a dead horse!
Good post, EXCEPT that the V-rod is a 60 degree V-twin so I imagine its vibration characteristics are a bit different. I mean, I guess it's knife/fork connecting rod too and vibrates enough that it is counterbalanced. But it's a different animal in so many ways I don't know if I'd use it as the example.
Now a Harley M8 in a touring platform that uses both rubbermounts AND a counterbalancer, or the new Softail M8 that uses dual counterbalancers, those are better examples to me.
EDIT - late to the party I see...
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I'll say it again. According to Triumph statements from factory many guest riders were exposed to 360, 180, and 270 cranks. Triumph was trying to determine what customers wanted. According to Triumph, the overwhelming majority preferred the 270.
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I'll say it again. According to Triumph statements from factory many guest riders were exposed to 360, 180, and 270 cranks. Triumph was trying to determine what customers wanted. According to Triumph, the overwhelming majority preferred the 270.
Same with the new Royal Enfield 650s.
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Your source? On the Dyno at the rear wheel? Published from Triumph at the crank?
MCN tested one in April 2015. Their measured it at 50 HP, 45 lb-ft and 515 lbs wet.
Gustavo
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Since we are discussing the sound, -- I can tell you my 360 parallel twin sounds glorious with these Arrow exhausts I recently fitted !!
(https://thumb.ibb.co/gDyeKf/IMG-3667.jpg) (https://ibb.co/gDyeKf)
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I used the V rod 'cause it doesn't have that 90 degree(firing order) sound. I've heard several comments from HD folks....I agree.
I have taken one of the 114 inchers for a ride w/feuling mods (131hp 123 ft lbs torque) and its very fast (hold on to something acceleration). Ha!
Still sounds like a Harley! Some (majority) like it.
I like the 360 degree sound and the younger generation have not grown up w/that and prefer the Duc sound (and Guzzi).
As the world turns, I'll have mine and they can have theirs...
:-)
The Kawasaki 650 twins are 180 / 360 and they sound like thumpers when an aftermarket exhaust is put into the system.
When I test rode the '14 Triumph classic bikes I didn't even know the engine in the Scrambler was different going into the rides. I mentioned to the salesman how much better the Scrambler was and he told me it had the 270 degree crank. My FZ-07 had the 270 degree crank and is such a sweet engine. If they could put that engine in a bike that looks just like a 1970s Yamaha 650 but with modern components I would be interested.
The V7III Carbon definitely scratches the itch for that type of bike though so probably won't be doing anything similar that competes against the V7. I might consider another KLX250S in fuel injected if I find a discounted one and get the dealer to set the sag on the rear shock for me as part of the purchase. Yes, you have to remove the shock to adjust the sag!
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I might consider another KLX250S in fuel injected if I find a discounted one and get the dealer to set the sag on the rear shock for me as part of the purchase. Yes, you have to remove the shock to adjust the sag!
Do you?
I don't know how different the current KX250 is from the KLX, but you don't have to remove the shock (though you might as well have to).
On the KX250 you have remove:
If the rear spring length must be adjusted, remove the following components for access:
Seat
Side Covers
Muffler
Sub Frame
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Do you?
I don't know how different the current KX250 is from the KLX, but you don't have to remove the shock (though you might as well have to).
On the KX250 you have remove:
If the rear spring length must be adjusted, remove the following components for access:
Seat
Side Covers
Muffler
Sub Frame
Just trying to simplify the post since it was off topic. :grin:
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Talked to my local dealer and they ordered one of the new W800. Said the "Street" version was not orderable. Salesman opined that the Cafe version won't do well here in the states. He was open to doing a bar swap prior to purchase if that would seal the deal. Hmmmmmmm
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Talked to my local dealer and they ordered one of the new W800. Said the "Street" version was not orderable. Salesman opined that the Cafe version won't do well here in the states. He was open to doing a bar swap prior to purchase if that would seal the deal. Hmmmmmmm
DOOOOOO ITTTTTT.
We're gonna take a serious look at it when it comes in and compare it to the incoming new Street Twin.
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We're gonna take a serious look at it when it comes in and compare it to the incoming new Street Twin.
:thumb:
If you get one, I'll need to ride my W650 out and do a side-by-side comparison ride.
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:thumb:
If you get one, I'll need to ride my W650 out and do a side-by-side comparison ride.
:thumb:
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Talked to my local dealer and they ordered one of the new W800. Said the "Street" version was not orderable. Salesman opined that the Cafe version won't do well here in the states. He was open to doing a bar swap prior to purchase if that would seal the deal. Hmmmmmmm
I talked with my local multibrand dealer and he said the Kawasaki was overpriced.
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I talked with my local multibrand dealer and he said the Kawasaki was overpriced.
Multi brand dealers have a unique perspective that is likely a result of their market segment.
I remember a conversation with my local multi-brand shortly after the T120, Thruxton R etc. came out.
This place carries all of JAPanInc., Polaris, Sea-Doo/Ski-Doo, Ural, and Triumph (and at the time still had Vic and RE).
Anyway, his customers want the fastest they can get for the cheapest, they just don't GET most of the Triumphs, especially the Thruxton R for the price.
That said if you compare this Kawi to Triumph, Guzzi, Harley, you see it's priced to THAT market.
Kawi - $9799
Old Street Twin (no dual clocks, no cafe features etc.) - $9100
New Street Twin (TBA, bet it's damn close to the Kawi)
Street Cup - $10,500
T100 - $10,400
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It'd be interesting to find out if there are any cast wheels from other models that will fit the W800.
Even if they could be found, since the new W800 has ABS, there might be some fabrication needing to be done to mount the tone rings, and or modifications to the mountings for the sensors.
While I do think the W800 looks right with wire wheels, I also appreciate having tubeless tires.
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It'd be interesting to find out if there are any cast wheels from other models that will fit the W800.
Even if they could be found, since the new W800 has ABS, there might be some fabrication needing to be done to mount the tone rings, and or modifications to the mountings for the sensors.
While I do think the W800 looks right with wire wheels, I also appreciate having tubeless tires.
Which again will be part of what we need to consider between the two.
Tubeless tires on mags - but water cooling and no tach - Bonnie
Wire wheels/tubes and tach - but air cooled! - W
I know we could eventually seal the wheels, but I still don't like spokes no matter how "period" or "style" correct they are.
Then again would it kill us to have ONE exception to mags or air-cooling?
naaaaahhh, it wouldn't.
Ohhh, one more difference, the incoming Street Twin is going to have a Brembo front brake.
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Which again will be part of what we need to consider between the two.
Tubeless tires on mags - but water cooling and no tach - Bonnie
Wire wheels/tubes and tach - but air cooled! - W
I know we could eventually seal the wheels, but I still don't like spokes no matter how "period" or "style" correct they are.
Then again would it kill us to have ONE exception to mags or air-cooling?
naaaaahhh, it wouldn't.
Ohhh, one more difference, the incoming Street Twin is going to have a Brembo front brake.
I think this absolutely calls for a test ride, and detailed analysis. :grin:
I think I need to come help.
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I think this absolutely calls for a test ride, and detailed analysis. :grin:
I think I need to come help.
And in the end NOTHING we think will matter, cause it will be Jenn's decision... :laugh: :grin: :laugh:
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Multi brand dealers have a unique perspective that is likely a result of their market segment.
I remember a conversation with my local multi-brand shortly after the T120, Thruxton R etc. came out.
This place carries all of JAPanInc., Polaris, Sea-Doo/Ski-Doo, Ural, and Triumph (and at the time still had Vic and RE).
Anyway, his customers want the fastest they can get for the cheapest, they just don't GET most of the Triumphs, especially the Thruxton R for the price.
That said if you compare this Kawi to Triumph, Guzzi, Harley, you see it's priced to THAT market.
Kawi - $9799
Old Street Twin (no dual clocks, no cafe features etc.) - $9100
New Street Twin (TBA, bet it's damn close to the Kawi)
Street Cup - $10,500
T100 - $10,400
Yep. They sell the Japanese, BWM, Indian, and used to sell Triumph up until 2 years ago. Even though they had a falling out with Triumph he thought Triumph was a better bike for the money.
I will say though that my experience with Kawasaki over the years has been stellar. They stand behind their products and their extended warrantees are probably the least costly in the business. Of course some parts have to come by way of a slow boat from Japan so a 3 month wait for a part they didn't expect to fail is normal.
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I called Kawa today and they said that no spare parts other than for the product sold will be available via dealer network. So no orderable "Street" handlebars to be installed on the Cafe version.
I guess ebay or aftermarket is the only route left.
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I called Kawa today and they said that no spare parts other than for the product sold will be available via dealer network. So no orderable "Street" handlebars to be installed on the Cafe version.
I guess ebay or aftermarket is the only route left.
You can do what I did when I wanted color matched hand guards for my Red Versys. I ordered them from a Kawasaki Dealer in the UK.
Since Canada is supposed to get both versions, you could order through them.
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Never one to miss an opportunity to heap praise on the W650.... Had my 2000 since new and it is still a blast.
Really like the idea of the W800 - and I want to jump on the new Royal Enfield Interceptor - but I already have he W650 and it might just be a little redundant. (Still the Royal Enfield is very affordable....)
Here it is some years back with 'guzziownr' at 'Dinosaur Land'
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3705/9529067771_157441ff56_c.jpg)[/url]Roll 148 - 50 (https://flic.kr/p/fw3XRV) by OnlyFarm (https://www.flickr.com/photos/80403172@N00/), on Flickr[/img]
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You can do what I did when I wanted color matched hand guards for my Red Versys. I ordered them from a Kawasaki Dealer in the UK.
Since Canada is supposed to get both versions, you could order through them.
Yup, this or aftermarket.
Actually I thought I already read that Canada was going to get the W800 standard version so you might get those stock bars on this side of the pond as well.
But then again aftermarket would likely be fine as well.
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I bought my W650 in 2000 and rode it for 7 years/50000 miles. Troublefree! I did take a slight bump from a following vehicle in the rear fender and tail light assembly that required that both these parts be replaced. Since it was an insurance job, I decided to let the dealer make the repair. I got a call from their service department in slightly less than two weeks. "OK, I thought. What's the problem?"
No problem ..... bike was repaired and ready for pick up. No, the dealer had none of the body parts in stock, but ordered them through Kaw in Japan.
I was impressed.
Bob
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I bought my W650 in 2000 and rode it for 7 years/50000 miles. Troublefree! I did take a slight bump from a following vehicle in the rear fender and tail light assembly that required that both these parts be replaced. Since it was an insurance job, I decided to let the dealer make the repair. I got a call from their service department in slightly less than two weeks. "OK, I thought. What's the problem?"
No problem ..... bike was repaired and ready for pick up. No, the dealer had none of the body parts in stock, but ordered them through Kaw in Japan.
I was impressed.
Bob
I think Jay got a new rear fender and exhaust for his W650 just last year.
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I think Jay got a new rear fender and exhaust for his W650 just last year.
I got a new fender, but, not exhaust. The original exhaust cleaned pretty nicely with Quick Glo chrome polish.
I got the fender from:
https://www.kawasakipartshouse.com (https://www.kawasakipartshouse.com)
It did take many weeks for the fender to arrive, unlike service parts ordered from the same place, which showed up in days.
That says to me, that the fender had to be ordered from Japan, but, that the common service parts were in a US warehouse.
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I got a new fender, but, not exhaust. The original exhaust cleaned pretty nicely with Quick Glo chrome polish.
I got the fender from:
https://www.kawasakipartshouse.com (https://www.kawasakipartshouse.com)
It did take many weeks for the fender to arrive, unlike service parts ordered from the same place, which showed up in days.
That says to me, that the fender had to be ordered from Japan, but, that the common service parts were in a US warehouse.
Of course, that was a ~10 year old, low production bike, that was only sold in the US for 2 years. Still not bad.
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Of course, that was a ~10 year old, low production bike, that was only sold in the US for 2 years. Still not bad.
I wasn't complaining. I was happy to be able to get a new fender from the dealer for this 17 year old bike.
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Wait, have we all been bitching about nothing with regards to the paint?!?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181117/52cb8bf3330b8806dcb683ce97eb44ca.jpg)
Saw this bike in the flesh today at the Long Beach IMS show.
The paint isn’t matte/flat, it’s a nice metallic brown.
?!?
Oh and Jay, yeah I didn't think you were bitching...
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Team Triumph in Janesville, Wis. has a couple of RE 650 twins for the dealers to test ,,,,,,,, a white cafe' and a orange interceptor they aren't certified yet here in the USA
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Wait, have we all been bitching about nothing with regards to the paint?!?
?!?
Oh and Jay, yeah I didn't think you were bitching...
Hmmmm. The first pics, it looked matte, but, then later, I saw some that I could've sworn were gloss. This confirms it.
OK, well, that looks a lot nicer than my first impression.
If they see fit to bring the "Street", hopefully, they also see fit to give it better paint, because, it certainly is matte. At least it comes with a tach (unlike the Stone).
(https://www.kawasaki.ca/product/w800-street)
(https://image.ibb.co/jNyNEf/Screen-Shot-2018-11-17-at-7-26-42-AM.png)
(https://www.kawasaki.ca/media/_thumbs/f/7/b/f7b4606c71938594fed203c079035313/w6oj3g1vja_19ej800b_40rbk1drf3cg_a.jpg)
https://www.kawasaki.ca/product/w800-cafe (https://www.kawasaki.ca/product/w800-cafe)
(https://image.ibb.co/hN9170/Screen-Shot-2018-11-17-at-7-28-15-AM.png)
(https://www.kawasaki.ca/media/_thumbs/7/1/6/71612068d060c1abae6afdad0aec4d55/w6oj3g1vja_19ej800c_40rgy1drf3cg_a.jpg)
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Hmmmm. The first pics, it looked matte, but, then later, I saw some that I could've sworn were gloss. This confirms it.
OK, well, that looks a lot nicer than my first impression.
If they see fit to bring the "Street", hopefully, they also see fit to give it better paint, because, it certainly is matte. At least it comes with a tach (unlike the Stone).
(https://www.kawasaki.ca/product/w800-street)
(https://image.ibb.co/jNyNEf/Screen-Shot-2018-11-17-at-7-26-42-AM.png)
(https://www.kawasaki.ca/media/_thumbs/f/7/b/f7b4606c71938594fed203c079035313/w6oj3g1vja_19ej800b_40rbk1drf3cg_a.jpg)
https://www.kawasaki.ca/product/w800-cafe (https://www.kawasaki.ca/product/w800-cafe)
(https://image.ibb.co/hN9170/Screen-Shot-2018-11-17-at-7-28-15-AM.png)
(https://www.kawasaki.ca/media/_thumbs/7/1/6/71612068d060c1abae6afdad0aec4d55/w6oj3g1vja_19ej800c_40rgy1drf3cg_a.jpg)
Its got flake in it so it will look good polished. My '11 Versys had Mettalic Flat Spark Black on the tank and I just polished it up since it was too tough to polish the Imperial Red and not touch the tank.
(https://thumb.ibb.co/nhU4uf/DSCN6390.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nhU4uf)
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I still want a bright color gas tank and the engine/tranny silver, polished or chromed!
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(https://thumb.ibb.co/nqiKvL/46408084-10157910775662926-5954401243081211904-n.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nqiKvL)
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I still want a bright color gas tank and the engine/tranny silver, polished or chromed!
Like this mate??
(https://thumb.ibb.co/hcjwaL/IMG-20170901-105815.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hcjwaL)
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Like this mate??
(https://thumb.ibb.co/hcjwaL/IMG-20170901-105815.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hcjwaL)
Exactly, maybe not green but I'd settle for it. :thumb: That brown or matte with blacked out motor doesn't cut it for me. :violent1: Cafe fairing but non-cafe bars - I'm getting old!
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16 years ago I bought a new W650, Green and Gold. It's been gone for years but I still have fond memories of that bike. I'm glad to see they are finally bringing the W800 into the states but I wish it looked more like my old W or some of the W800's the rest of the world got in recent years. Comparatively speaking, I think the W800 Cafe is not nearly as well turned out as my V7/50 or for that matter, as good a value.
(https://vgy.me/v6f4WK.jpg)
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The more I looked into the W800, I soon realized that there was a bike still readily available here that did everything the W800 does and probably better, and looks just as good if not better? Bonneville T100 anyone?
(https://i.ibb.co/6RC0NM6/T100.jpg) (https://ibb.co/6RC0NM6)
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The more I looked into the W800, I soon realized that there was a bike still readily available here that did everything the W800 does and probably better, and looks just as good if not better? Bonneville T100 anyone?
(https://i.ibb.co/6RC0NM6/T100.jpg) (https://ibb.co/6RC0NM6)
Well again, when people compared the first of the Neo-Bonnies to the W650 a number found the W650 was the "better" bike (smaller, lighter, quicker steering etc.).
And now the T100 is a water-cooled variant, which some might prefer and others not.
But if you prefer air-cooled and want something with a super-sexy bevel cam drive, the current T100 wouldn't fit the bill and the older one might not have been as good a bike.
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The bike in the pic is a 2016, that engine is known to go 100K miles, same as the Scrambler, they are heavy but built like tanks, and tons of aftermarket stuff that the W800 will never have...definitely a safer, cheaper, and saner path I think. Plus, look at that Bonnie!!
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The bike in the pic is a 2016, that engine is known to go 100K miles, same as the Scrambler, they are heavy but built like tanks, and tons of aftermarket stuff that the W800 will never have...definitely a safer, cheaper, and saner path I think. Plus, look at that Bonnie!!
Wait, do we now think a Kawi isn't built to go 100k miles? Hmmm ok.
I guess I'm just saying I see both sides of this. I can see valid arguments for either.
I've ridden both, they're decent bikes, similar, but different.
I wouldn't fault someone for choosing either.
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Wait, do we now think a Kawi isn't built to go 100k miles? Hmmm ok.
I've read of several owners in the W650 thread over on ADVRider that have some pretty high miles on their W650's with no major work.
They're very robust. Mine only has 23k miles on it, so, I guess it'll last me a lifetime, given that I split my miles between several bikes.
I'd trust it to ride cross country.
I guess I'm just saying I see both sides of this. I can see valid arguments for either.
I've ridden both, they're decent bikes, similar, but different.
I've not ridden the older air-cooled Triumphs,only the current (non-R) Thruxton. Well it had great torque, it was heavy feeling, even compared with the R9T that weighs the same. The water cooling jacket around the cylinders do mute the mechanical sounds of the motor a good bit. I expected to like the sound of the 270 degree Triumph motor better than the R9T's boxer, given that the timing of the power pulses is the same as the 90 degree V-twins that I love, but, I found it a bit underwhelming. The R9T motor sounded a lot better, which surprised me.
I wouldn't fault someone for choosing either.
Nor would I. In fact, it would probably be best to ride all three (W800, air-cooled Triumph, and water-cooled Triumph), and buy the one you like best!
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Wait, do we now think a Kawi isn't built to go 100k miles? Hmmm ok.
I guess I'm just saying I see both sides of this. I can see valid arguments for either.
I've ridden both, they're decent bikes, similar, but different.
I wouldn't fault someone for choosing either.
Can't comment with W800 but in Asia, 650 is EVERYWHERE, and a lot of them are still running since new...
And also as the retro-graze as well as emission rule, most of these older 650 get revived and now running again with decent amount of mileage.
IF W800 follows the 650 footstep, I don't see an issue with being a good high mileage bike.
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16 years ago I bought a new W650, Green and Gold. It's been gone for years but I still have fond memories of that bike. I'm glad to see they are finally bringing the W800 into the states but I wish it looked more like my old W or some of the W800's the rest of the world got in recent years. Comparatively speaking, I think the W800 Cafe is not nearly as well turned out as my V7/50 or for that matter, as good a value.
(https://vgy.me/v6f4WK.jpg)
You right, that V7/50 is way better
The mid size retro market is getting crowded lately, not sure if they’re geared towards us 65 yr olds or the younger
New riders or both, but I only like a blend of finishes that don’t include black. Not sure what young riders want if anything. I don’t like the V7 stone at all, I like the V7 Special and V7/50 and the Milano.
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You right, that V7/50 is way better
The mid size retro market is getting crowded lately, not sure if they’re geared towards us 65 yr olds or the younger
New riders or both, but I only like a blend of finishes that don’t include black. Not sure what young riders want if anything. I don’t like the V7 stone at all, I like the V7 Special and V7/50 and the Milano.
I'm 56 and tired of polishing chrome. Love the Carbon Dark and my blacked out Road Glide Special. :)
I love the look of Chrome bikes and if I had a climate controlled garage I would probably still have them. Right now the humidity in my shop is at 99 percent.
(https://i.ibb.co/B4zgCJx/028-Road-Glide-Special.jpg) (https://ibb.co/B4zgCJx)
(https://i.ibb.co/fkm2VZ6/20181112-151918.jpg) (https://ibb.co/fkm2VZ6)
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I have always hated chrome.
In college I found a classic muscle car that was devoid of chrome (1970 Old Rally 350 in bright yellow with yellow painted bumpers).
From the moment I started riding I preferred one that were not black, less chrome, and no polished aluminum.
Seems like the older the rider, the more they like chrome...
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I guess I need to supply context.
The W800 is only coming to the US in the "Cafe" style with M shaped clubman bars. That does not work for me. We were discussing the possibility of acquiring the factory handlebars from the "Street" version and doing a swap at the dealer. Plus, it seems likely that the W800 will not be a longterm import, if sales of the CB100 and previous sales of the W650 have any indication.
The Bonnie looks just as retro, is modern, beautiful, perfect ergonomics "as delivered" and still available on closeout in the air cooled form.
Just thinking out loud fellas.
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I guess I need to supply context.
The W800 is only coming to the US in the "Cafe" style with M shaped clubman bars. That does not work for me. We were discussing the possibility of acquiring the factory handlebars from the "Street" version and doing a swap at the dealer. Plus, it seems likely that the W800 will not be a longterm import, if sales of the CB100 and previous sales of the W650 have any indication.
The Bonnie looks just as retro, is modern, beautiful, perfect ergonomics "as delivered" and still available on closeout in the air cooled form.
Just thinking out loud fellas.
So, based on this post the W800 is the bike to get since it may become collectible like the W650 and hold its value. Of course if you can wait until it is canceled and buy a discounted one you will do even better if and when it comes time to sell. :grin: