Author Topic: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!  (Read 14926 times)

Offline guzziownr

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Offline Triple Jim

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2015, 04:49:38 PM »
Man, I know I look for moving traffic on the crossroad before I head across it, and keep an eye on it while I'm crossing.  That guy had the video camera on his helmet and it didn't turn from straight ahead once he started moving.  He's lucky to be alive.
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Offline Lannis

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2015, 05:04:27 PM »
Man, I know I look for moving traffic on the crossroad before I head across it, and keep an eye on it while I'm crossing.  That guy had the video camera on his helmet and it didn't turn from straight ahead once he started moving.  He's lucky to be alive.

I agree that I probably wouldn't have been jumping into a city intersection quite that fast myself and MIGHT have been able to avoid that lick.

On the other hand, the car blew the red light pretty badly.   Everyone else had been long stopped (except the car doing a right-turn-on-red), and the car LOOKED like it was turning into the biker's lane.   If you looked at where it stopped, you can't tell where the car was actually going ....

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Offline redrider90

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2015, 05:19:22 PM »
Man, I know I look for moving traffic on the crossroad before I head across it, and keep an eye on it while I'm crossing.  That guy had the video camera on his helmet and it didn't turn from straight ahead once he started moving.  He's lucky to be alive.




 :+1 Ditto on that one Jim. I would never had that accident. Never ever trust any intersection ever but especially after the lights first change.
Notice there is one frame where the guy is standing up and looking back at the intersection. The V7 is still sitting in looking over at the wreck. Theoretically the Guzzi should have taken the hit if he/she had gone into the intersection at the same speed at the same time. Maybe the Guzzi saw it coming.



Here is the Guzzi rider. He pulled over and came back to check on the guy.
[URL=http://s1318.photobucket.com/user/redrider901/media/ScreenShot2015-01-30at74029PM_zps53002020.png.html]
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 06:48:02 PM by redrider90 »
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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2015, 05:19:22 PM »

Offline brenwin

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2015, 05:26:15 PM »
I agree that I probably wouldn't have been jumping into a city intersection quite that fast myself and MIGHT have been able to avoid that lick.

On the other hand, the car blew the red light pretty badly.   Everyone else had been long stopped (except the car doing a right-turn-on-red), and the car LOOKED like it was turning into the biker's lane.   If you looked at where it stopped, you can't tell where the car was actually going ....

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I wonder if he would of left the light so fast if he hadn't been beside that Guzzi racer ?
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Offline Lannis

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2015, 05:51:25 PM »
I wonder if he would of left the light so fast if he hadn't been beside that Guzzi racer ?

You know, that could be true.   All of us have had that impulse when we're taking off next to another bike, to see if he's thinking the same think we're thinking!!

Not on a crowded city street, though ... !

Lannis
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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2015, 06:39:11 PM »
Hmmm... Although I like to think that I always look both ways, and I too mistrust all intersections, I don't think the rider in the video did anything outstandingly stupid--in other words, it could happen to anyone of us.  It's important to always look, and to be aware, and to expect the unexpected--but it isn't always possible nor will we always get it right.  Luckily for him, he didn't wind up catapulted down the street or through the car's windshield.  It could have been ugly. 

Offline Guzzistajohn

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2015, 06:42:29 PM »
I wonder if he might have been thinking about the film footage from his goofy camera instead of paying attention to the real matter at hand, like not getting your ass run over?
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Offline cruzziguzzi

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2015, 06:43:57 PM »
Well now.

What the survivor Guzzi and its rider teach us: "Slow bikes save lives".

I figure what queered the rider's play was the VW driver realized he was about to mow down those couple-three pedestrians just entering the cross walk and veered right causing him to hit our man who failed to clear the intersection before entering it.

Sometimes wrong can be shared. Even though the rider got unfairly Fahrvergnügened he does get to share responsibility to a degree.

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« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 06:44:18 PM by cruzziguzzi »
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Offline Triple Jim

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2015, 07:22:59 PM »
Dusty, my opinion comes from the fact that all of us regularly have to avoid collisions that would have been caused by another driver not seeing us, or otherwise putting us in an unsafe situation.  If we didn't constantly drive defensively, you can be sure we would all get hit by cars before many months passed.  I believe that the rider in the video had an opportunity to avoid the collision and should have.  The car driver caused the unsafe situation and is to blame for that.  I hope he got the book thrown at him.  The motorcycle rider had the last chance to avoid the collision and blew it, and I'm blaming him for that, but hope he didn't get cited for the collision.

Interestingly, in MD, the motor vehicle code states that a driver is at fault for a collision if he had the last chance to avoid it and failed to do so.
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Offline Lannis

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2015, 07:30:45 PM »
Good grief fellas , the crash was the cars fault  ??? Yeah , maybe the rider should have been paying more attention , but blaming him absolves the idiot driver . SHEESH  :o

  Dusty

I don't think that anyone is "absolving" the idiot driver.   He's entirely at fault, legally and ethically.   But that doesn't mean that a little more attention by the rider couldn't have kept the rider from getting hit.    The Guzzi rider didn't get hit, probably because he looked to see the car coming and waited for it.

I think that what people are expressing is "EVERYTHING is your responsibility when you're on the road on a bike!"   It's the only way to keep your behind in one piece.   Doesn't do any good to say "It was HIS fault!" from your hospital bed, or as your last words, if a more defensive attitude could have kept you on your bike.

That being said, if I was the guy that got hit, my next action would depend on the car driver's reaction.   If the car driver was like "Oh, man, buddy, I'm sorry.  I screwed that up, I wasn't paying attention, we'll wait for the police, I'll make it right, screw what my insurance company says, I'm admitting it was my fault RIGHT HERE in front of witnesses." and appears to mean it, then I'm OK and won't make it hard on him, anyone can screw up, it's whether you admit it or not that makes the difference.

If he says "Hey, my light was YELLOW, you pulled right in front of me, damn motorcycles" or got out of the car reeking drunk, then I'd end up owning the guy with whatever a good lawyer could do to him.   His choice of how it goes; can't say fairer than that!

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Offline Guzzistajohn

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #11 on: January 30, 2015, 07:38:40 PM »
Doesn't matter who's "fault" it is, if you're on the bike YOU LOOSE!
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dilligaf

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #12 on: January 30, 2015, 10:30:33 PM »
Good grief fellas , the crash was the cars fault  ??? Yeah , maybe the rider should have been paying more attention , but blaming him absolves the idiot driver . SHEESH  :o

  Dusty
 

      :+1  Sure are a lot of experts here.   :BEER:
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oldbike54

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2015, 10:34:43 PM »
 

      :+1  Sure are a lot of experts here.   :BEER:
Matt

 



Yeah , bestest , greatest riders ever  :o ;D

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Offline cruzziguzzi

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #14 on: January 30, 2015, 10:38:43 PM »
Good grief fellas , the crash was the cars fault  ??? Yeah , maybe the rider should have been paying more attention , but blaming him absolves the idiot driver . SHEESH  :o

  Dusty

 

      :+1  Sure are a lot of experts here.   :BEER:
Matt

  



Yup, a lot of "experts" that likely wouldn't have been struck as he was. Perhaps the rider next to him for one is one of us "experts" and he was theoreticallygeomet rically closer to the VW.

For what it's worth - I don't read one single post above blaming the rider but many noting his accountability/responsibility. It's not like he was rear-ended.

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Offline Stormtruck2

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2015, 11:12:37 PM »
On the bright side, looks like he stuck the landing. ::)
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Offline Nic in Western NYS

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #16 on: January 31, 2015, 08:05:02 AM »
I wonder if he might have been thinking about the film footage from his goofy camera instead of paying attention to the real matter at hand, like not getting your ass run over?
Yup, that might account for less scanning. Nic
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Offline drawnverybadly

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #17 on: January 31, 2015, 08:33:52 AM »
The guy posted this to Reddit and answered all these questions;

He did wait a second and looked, you can even see pedestrians on his right that would have been hit if he didn't have his bike in the way

The car making the right on red blocked his view of the on-coming car which was still pretty far up the street, the driver said he was speeding because he was out of town and unfamiliar with the roads (?!)

The guzzi took off after he did because they were stopped at the red in a staggered position.

Here's the thread
[http://www.reddit.com/r/motorcycles/comments/2u3spt/my_helmet_camera_video_idiot_cager_blows_red/]

Online nick949

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #18 on: January 31, 2015, 08:38:47 AM »
Stupid 4 way intersections ::( - where's the round-about?

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Offline Lannis

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #19 on: January 31, 2015, 09:03:26 AM »
 

      :+1  Sure are a lot of experts here.   :BEER:
Matt

 



And some of the experts haven't been hit by a car in 40 years, either.   Again, no one is saying that the rider is "at fault".   We are saying that the rider, in THIS case, could have avoided being hit by the car that WAS at fault.

When I ride with non-Guzzi riders here at home, I'm SHOCKED by the speed at which they navigate city streets and intersections.   We'll be going down an urban four-lane together with multiple cross streets.   At every intersection, my head is on a swivel.   I'm watching the pending left-turning cars, the pending right-turning cars, the cars next to me, my hand is covering the brake, and I slow down if I see the least chance that the top of someone's wheel is in motion toward me.   

But the guys I'm generally riding with?   They're looking straight ahead, sometimes feet on the highway pegs, cruising at a speed that would have them in someone's grill or driver's door if they pulled out.   Not a bit defensive.   

And, by the way.   I'm NOT an expert race driver, airplane pilot, mechanical designer, electrical technician, or stonemason.   I'm NOT an expert tree-climber, hiker, roofer, sailor, swimmer, runner, or politician.   I'm NOT an expert with women, I know nothing about horses, I'm a fair shot, a so-so venison butcher.   I'm NOT an expert fisherman, scuba diver, bicyclist, or chemist.   I'm no good at law enforcement, publishing, computer technology or salesmanship.   I'm NOT an expert botanist, carpenter, welder, potter, balloonist, historian, or author.   I can't tan a hide, produce a television show, or sing tenor.   I'm NOT an expert weaver, dressmaker, hatter, cobbler, or blacksmith.

But I AM, after 44 years and half-a-million miles of riding 25+ motorcycles, an expert street motorcycle rider, if there is such a thing.  Not a road racer, not a trials specialist, not an enduro expert but a street rider.   And so are some of the other folks on this list.  If they're not, then who on God's green earth IS?   They're worth listening to when it comes to something like this, and not just dismissed.   We can all be hit by an errant driver, jumped on by a deer, slide on spilled diesel or antifreeze, or tagged from behind in an intersection.   But we're good at avoiding avoidable "accidents" ....

Lannis
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Online nick949

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #20 on: January 31, 2015, 09:07:46 AM »
And some of the experts haven't been hit by a car in 40 years, either.   Again, no one is saying that the rider is "at fault".   We are saying that the rider, in THIS case, could have avoided being hit by the car that WAS at fault.

When I ride with non-Guzzi riders here at home, I'm SHOCKED by the speed at which they navigate city streets and intersections.   We'll be going down an urban four-lane together with multiple cross streets.   At every intersection, my head is on a swivel.   I'm watching the pending left-turning cars, the pending right-turning cars, the cars next to me, my hand is covering the brake, and I slow down if I see the least chance that the top of someone's wheel is in motion toward me.   

But the guys I'm generally riding with?   They're looking straight ahead, sometimes feet on the highway pegs, cruising at a speed that would have them in someone's grill or driver's door if they pulled out.   Not a bit defensive.   

And, by the way.   I'm NOT an expert race driver, airplane pilot, mechanical designer, electrical technician, or stonemason.   I'm NOT an expert tree-climber, hiker, roofer, sailor, swimmer, runner, or politician.   I'm NOT an expert with women, I know nothing about horses, I'm a fair shot, a so-so venison butcher.   I'm NOT an expert fisherman, scuba diver, bicyclist, or chemist.   I'm no good at law enforcement, publishing, computer technology or salesmanship.   I'm NOT an expert botanist, carpenter, welder, potter, balloonist, historian, or author.   I can't tan a hide, produce a television show, or sing tenor.   I'm NOT an expert weaver, dressmaker, hatter, cobbler, or blacksmith.

But I AM, after 44 years and half-a-million miles of riding 25+ motorcycles, an expert street motorcycle rider, if there is such a thing.  Not a road racer, not a trials specialist, not an enduro expert but a street rider.   And so are some of the other folks on this list.  If they're not, then who on God's green earth IS?   They're worth listening to when it comes to something like this, and not just dismissed.   We can all be hit by an errant driver, jumped on by a deer, slide on spilled diesel or antifreeze, or tagged from behind in an intersection.   But we're good at avoiding avoidable "accidents" ....

Lannis

You forgot to add: really articulate, occasionally bewildering, sometimes frustrating, often entertaining Wildguzzi postie.

Nick

Offline Nic in Western NYS

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #21 on: January 31, 2015, 09:14:54 AM »

When I ride with non-Guzzi riders here at home, I'm SHOCKED by the speed at which they navigate city streets and intersections.   We'll be going down an urban four-lane together with multiple cross streets.   At every intersection, my head is on a swivel.   I'm watching the pending left-turning cars, the pending right-turning cars, the cars next to me, my hand is covering the brake, and I slow down if I see the least chance that the top of someone's wheel is in motion toward me.   

But the guys I'm generally riding with?   They're looking straight ahead, sometimes feet on the highway pegs, cruising at a speed that would have them in someone's grill or driver's door if they pulled out.   Not a bit defensive.   
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Offline Lannis

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #22 on: January 31, 2015, 09:44:28 AM »
I need to concentrate on the road so much that I stopped riding with even expert riders. Solo for me.

I usually end up being solo on group rides, because I just drop off the back and let them go if we're in those kind of conditions.   And I don't even start out with "parade-speed" groups.

I will say that I'm almost ALWAYS happy with other Guzzi riders, like on our Third Saturday rides; we tend to ride exactly the same way.   Or on BritBike rides, with guys that I've been riding with for 15 years.

But solo IS safest.   Less things to keep up with for a busy (not to say overloaded) brain.

Lannis
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Offline Triple Jim

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #23 on: January 31, 2015, 09:55:50 AM »
I refer all of you experts to this  ;) :D  :D

  Dusty

I'm not claiming expert status, but I stand behind my statement that the guy had a helmet camera, and once he started moving, it never deviated from straight ahead until he was hit. 
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dilligaf

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #24 on: January 31, 2015, 10:19:09 AM »
I've been riding over 56 years and in SC we can ride year round and, until recently, I road most every day. That is quit a bit of exposure but I have yet to hit or be hit by a cage.  I have no idea why.  Were I the rider in the video, I suspect I would have been hit. Other than being in the wrong place at the wrong time, I just don't see what the rider did wrong. Knowledge or in my case "road smarts" is helpful but I believe just plain luck has more to do with it than anything.   :BEER:
Matt

I'm not claiming expert status, but I stand behind my statement that the guy had a helmet camera, and once he started moving, it never deviated from straight ahead until he was hit. 

He was hit almost as soon as he started moving.

Offline Lannis

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #25 on: January 31, 2015, 10:27:48 AM »
I've been riding over 56 years and in SC we can ride year round and, until recently, I road most every day. That is quit a bit of exposure but I have yet to hit or be hit by a cage.  I have no idea why.  Were I the rider in the video, I suspect I would have been hit. Other than being in the wrong place at the wrong time, I just don't see what the rider did wrong. Knowledge or in my case "road smarts" is helpful but I believe just plain luck has more to do with it than anything.   :BEER:
Matt

He was hit almost as soon as he started moving.

Well, experts can have different opinions too.   Nothing wrong with having different opinions after we see the same video.

Lannis
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Offline Triple Jim

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #26 on: January 31, 2015, 10:28:57 AM »
He was hit almost as soon as he started moving.

True.  A view from above might tell more.  I suppose the extreme case would have been where he didn't move at all and was hit, and the motorcycle driver couldn't be blamed for that.
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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #27 on: January 31, 2015, 10:31:22 AM »
I've been riding over 50 years as well and never been in a two vehicle accident. (In the emergency several times due to my own stupidity.) I would never have been in this accident UNLESS I was asleep at the wheel/handlebars, which this guy was, IMHO.

Luck a very small factor. Never trust traffic lights, never trust yield signs, never trust cross traffic stop signs, never trust one way street signs...etc.

In this case the cage driver was a d***head and the cyclist (at that moment in time) had s*** for brains.

Sorry, but nobody forces anyone to get on a motorcycle. Once you do there is no better protection than your own awareness. Defensive driving anyone??? Maybe that's not taught anymore as your safest refuge.
« Last Edit: January 31, 2015, 10:32:54 AM by tusong200 »

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dilligaf

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Re: Hey, is that a Moto Guzzi? Caaarunch!
« Reply #29 on: January 31, 2015, 11:07:26 AM »
Dusty posted: "I seldom deal with true urban traffic , it can be a bit overwhelming".
Me too.  However, my brother, who has been riding as long as I have, rides to work, about 40 miles round trip, in Tampa traffic on his TW200 or his Majestic Yamaha scooter.  When I visit I find it very hard to keep up. To me, it appears he has no regard for traffic or his own safety.  He is 72 and to this day has not hit or been hit by a cage.  Last month, when returning from work, around 0200, he got tangled up in some new construction and crashed. He wasn't moving very fast at the time so no injury but the LEO impounded his scooter and made, according to my brother, go to the hospital.  He was given a ticket for reckless operation. Needless to say he is pissed. Only cost him $25.00 to get his scooter back.  He think nothing of splitting lanes, will jump up on the sidewalk to get around traffic you name it. I don't think there is a stop sign in Tampa that he hasn't run.  Now if that's not a communication of street smarts and luck then I have no idea what  is ;-T  :BEER:
Matt
« Last Edit: January 31, 2015, 11:08:29 AM by dilligaf »

 

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