H4 type LED headlight bulb...Anyone try one of these?

[jas67]

Zinfan -- I ordered the Cyclops LED light from the link earlier in the thread.    I finally got a chance to *try* to install it today.
It seems to be about 1/8" too tall.    I can't get the reflector assembly back into the headlight shell, it sticks out about 1/8" too far.

Did you have to modify the rear of your headlight shell?

Thanks,
Jay

[Zinfan]

Zinfan -- I ordered the Cyclops LED light from the link earlier in the thread.    I finally got a chance to *try* to install it today.
It seems to be about 1/8" too tall.    I can't get the reflector assembly back into the headlight shell, it sticks out about 1/8" too far.

Did you have to modify the rear of your headlight shell?

Thanks,
Jay

Jay,

I did not modify the housing to get mine to fit, do you have it aligned so the bulb triangle is pointed up?  Traveling at the moment so I may be slow to reply.

[jas67]

The Cyclops LEDs that I received were the earlier version, which are too deep to fit the V7 headlight shell.
They exchanged them for the new style at no cost.
That light is now in my V7R.   It works well, except the low beam cut-off is nonexistent.   This will not be good in fog, and may piss off oncoming drivers at night.

The ADVMonster LED H4, at only $45:
http://stores.advmonster.com/h4-led-headlight/ is a well made unit.  I got two of them to try.   They have an excellent low-beam cutoff, but, alas, are too deep to fit in the V7's headlight shell.    I'll likely put them in my VFR800.     I like them enough that I'll likely try to modify (or replace) the V7's headlight shell so that I can switch to them.

[Birch71]

Have the Cyclops on the Griso and LOVE IT!!

Only thing is if it is hot, and I'm in traffic, my high beam indicator lights up on my dash. I think that must be reacting to the draw when the fan turns on.

[canuguzzi]

What about contrast? A bright light is one thing but less effective if the contrast isn't there. If the temp of the light is such as it gives you that washed out and lack of depth perception, I'd rather give up some illumination to have better contrast.

[Triple Jim]

 They have an excellent low-beam cutoff, but, alas, are too deep to fit in the V7's headlight shell. 

If you get a minute, can you post the distance from the mounting flange to the rear end of the bulb assembly please?  I'd like to know if it would fit the shell I have.

[rodekyll]

Have the Cyclops on the Griso and LOVE IT!!

Only thing is if it is hot, and I'm in traffic, my high beam indicator lights up on my dash. I think that must be reacting to the draw when the fan turns on.

Interesting.  Is it just the indicator light, or does the high beam actually come on, too?  I'm asking because it could indicate a ground problem where something is feeding back through the high beam circuit because it can't find an adequate path to ground.

[Birch71]

Interesting.  Is it just the indicator light, or does the high beam actually come on, too?  I'm asking because it could indicate a ground problem where something is feeding back through the high beam circuit because it can't find an adequate path to ground.

Just the indicator. I can trigger the high beans with the pass toggle or the selector button.

[jas67]

If you get a minute, can you post the distance from the mounting flange to the rear end of the bulb assembly please?  I'd like to know if it would fit the shell I have.

I'll do it tomorrow.

[Triple Jim]

Thanks, whenever you get a chance.

[Zinfan]

What about contrast? A bright light is one thing but less effective if the contrast isn't there. If the temp of the light is such as it gives you that washed out and lack of depth perception, I'd rather give up some illumination to have better contrast.

I find it better than the stock light in all regards including depth perception.

[jas67]

If you get a minute, can you post the distance from the mounting flange to the rear end of the bulb assembly please?  I'd like to know if it would fit the shell I have.

The new, low-profile Cyclops one is 31mm.
The ADV Monster one is 50mm.

[Triple Jim]

Thank you, Jas, Now I'll go measure mine and see which one it is.  I do know that it barely fits.

[Triple Jim]

Mine is 35mm from the three tabs on the flange to the back of the plastic cover over the fan.  Measuring all the way to the disc shaped flange, it's about 40mm.  I've been told that my headlight shell is a Bosch type, like BMW used.

I doubt if the ADVmonster bulb would fit in my shell, but I'd have to put a glob of clay in there and measure the clearance I have now to know.

[1Sourdough]

Just the indicator. I can trigger the high beans with the pass toggle or the selector button.

Is the high beam indicator controlled by a switch around the light asswmbly?  If so, heat might be warping the trigger device and causing it to actuate while the low beam circuit is energized.

[charlie b]

Well, I also got the cyclops LED headlight bulb.  I also had to get a new headlight 'adaptor' since the T5 had sealed beams.

Got the Hella replacement headlight from Summit Racing.  Put the Cyclops bulb in there.  Easy.  FWIW, there is nothing behind the headlight to interfere (I have the SPIII/Police fairing on my T5).

The difference between my sealed beam halogen and this is stunning.  BUT....not more in distance, just in all around light (which is what I wanted).

Color is more blue.  I can tell the difference when seeing white reflective stuff (like on street signs).  As far as seeing 'things' the color is no bother and is more pleasing to me than the yellowish H4 sealed beam.

For oncoming traffic, the LED low beam is just as visible (even in daylight) as the high beam.  I used to have to run the sealed beams on high during the day.

Best thing is the lower current draw.  20W vs 55W. The alternator thanked me :)

So, if you need  the light at a distance, stick with HID or halogen.  For my uses the LED is perfect.  (and, yes, I will keep an H4 bulb as a spare until I see how long the LED lasts, or, if I have a trip with extended night riding).

[rodekyll]

Thanks for the report.  We need some real-world impressions rather than marketing hype.  I'm unclear what you mean when you say "headlight adapter". 

What are the specs on the bulb?  20w tells us the energy budget, but watts has no relationship to useable light.

[ejs]

 :beat_horse

I bought the Cyclops H4, and mounted it on my California EV. think the light outpus is ca:3000 lumen ?
Removed it after a week.
To much stray light, using low beam ,olmost blindet by the reflections from the roadsigns...
Hi beam was almost as short range as low beam.
To me it was waste of money.
Current setup is relays and 85w bulb. Much better for my use.
Anybody want a cheap bulb ?

[jas67]

Yes, the cut-off sucks.   I have two bikes with them in, and use them for daytime riding only.
The ADVMonster H4 has a very good low-beam cutoff, but, the heatsink is longer (deeper), and doesn't fit the headlight buckets of either my V7R or R100R Mystic.

I'll likely put the two ADVMonster H4's in my VFR800.

http://stores.advmonster.com/

They're only $45.



ADVMonster also have LEDs for H1, H3, H7, H9, and H11.

They have a very active thread on ADVRider.    I posted a request there for a lower-profile (shorter) model so that I can use them in the V7R and R100R.    Cyclops actually revised theirs for the same reason.   They had originally shipped me the earlier model, which didn't fit my V7R, but, exchanged them for the new, low-profile model.

[charlie b]

Thanks for the report.  We need some real-world impressions rather than marketing hype.  I'm unclear what you mean when you say "headlight adapter".  

What are the specs on the bulb?  20w tells us the energy budget, but watts has no relationship to useable light.

Yep, rateed at 3000 lumens, but, that is also really no relation to usable light.  Much of the light is spread out rather than directed straight down the highway.  Same is true of my LED "driving lights" (ie, flashlights).

They really are not for those who want long range lights.  I wanted one due to the low current draw.  It was either that or spring for a high output alternator for $400.

The headlight 'adapter' is this one for my T5.  They have others for round and other rectangle shape sealed beams.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hla-003177862/overview/

So, you mount this reflector assembly just like you would a seald beam, but, it has a socket on the back for an H4 halogen lamp.

[Triple Jim]

I wanted one due to the low current draw.  It was either that or spring for a high output alternator for $400.

That's exactly why I got one and it's serving my needs very well.  I carry a quartz-halogen bulb as a spare, and in case I find myself needing to ride more than a couple miles at night.  My next one will be one of the ADVMonster LED bulbs that  has better low beam cutoff.

[rodekyll]

I'm attracted to the low power demands of LED but the scatter, lack of down-range penetration and deceptive claims of illumination are holding me back.

The senseless part is if you have to replace the reflector and lens to accommodate the bulb, they should provide stuff that's not onlt base (h4) compatible, but also LED compatible.  That would correct my first two objections.  The lying about performance part will still be a crap shoot.  For example, MOST places selling LED driving lights sell by the pair and advertise (as an example) 50watts of power.  WOW! I say -- 50w is the equivalent of me current H4 halogen.  Given the illumination difference I should be able to bbq venison from a mile away!  Not so.  This is the total draw on the system for both of the pair.  By the time you do the math, you've got about 15w at the bulb, per bulb.  The rest of the draw is for fans, voltage converters, etc.

Others add up the draw of the elements that make up the bulb -- say 5w elements x 4 = 20w.  They don't tell you the total system draw for cooling and voltage conversion.

And the methods go on.  I can't get an apples to apples comparison of LED to halogen or HID, and not even to other LEDs. 

[charlie b]

ADV Monster and Cyclops do not sell anything near 50W and sell single bulbs.  Their targets are off road motorcycles.

Reflectors tailor made?  Not mine and not any factory ones that I know of.

Most reflectors are made for H4 pattern lights.  That's what most headlights are made for.  There is a shift to projector type headlights in cars and bikes.  You can also get sealed beam replacements that have projector type reflectors.  I was leery of these and, like I stated before, my main concern was current draw, not down range performance.

You can find complete LED headlight assemblies but they are very expensive.  Even then I would not expect the light projection capability to be equal to a good halogen.

Last, when I found bulbs rated at 40W or 60W that was for a PAIR of lights, ie, each bulb was 20W/30W.  Most of the higher output LED's are the CREE 10W variety.  Even in mine there are three LED's.  Two for low beam and one additional for high beam, hence 20W on low and 30W on high.

Yes, there is a lot of hype.  Just don't believe it. LED replacement bulbs do NOT outperform HID or halogen.  They just don't.  If you are concerned with down range performance then get a good halogen or HID.

[Triple Jim]

You can find complete LED headlight assemblies but they are very expensive.  Even then I would not expect the light projection capability to be equal to a good halogen.

Actually, the reviews I've read on the Truck Lite sealed beam LED headlamp say it's as good or better then quartz-halogen.  I don't have one because of the high price. 

[Seagondollar]

For those of you fussing about the heatsink handling 25W, you're thinking about it a bit wrong.  The LED uses 25W.  Whatever needs to be dissipated by the heatsink is the current drawn through the LED (Kirchoff's law) times the voltage drop across the controller the heatsink supports.  Not the voltage drop across the LED.  And the basic calculation is P=IxE  Power equals Current times Voltage.

[Triple Jim]

For those of you fussing about the heatsink handling 25W, you're thinking about it a bit wrong.  The LED uses 25W.  Whatever needs to be dissipated by the heatsink is the current drawn through the LED (Kirchoff's law) times the voltage drop across the controller the heatsink supports.  Not the voltage drop across the LED.  And the basic calculation is P=IxE  Power equals Current times Voltage.

Well, there are two heat sources.  The LED(s) probably drop about 3V, so you can calculate that heat.  The controllers are usually switching supplies, which are pretty efficient, so that's not a straight I x E calculation.  The LEDs themselves are cooled by the main heat sink and fan in the bulb I have.

Wake Forest, huh?  We're about 40 minutes apart.  We'll have to go for a ride some time.

[rodekyll]

Hi, seagondollar!  Long time no see!

I get the part about a heat sink being a passive device -- no energy supplied.  But some of the LEDs I've looked at have a fan as well.

ADV Monster and Cyclops do not sell anything near 50W and sell single bulbs.  Their targets are off road motorcycles.

Reflectors tailor made?  Not mine and not any factory ones that I know of.

Most reflectors are made for H4 pattern lights.  That's what most headlights are made for.  There is a shift to projector type headlights in cars and bikes.  You can also get sealed beam replacements that have projector type reflectors.  I was leery of these and, like I stated before, my main concern was current draw, not down range performance.

You can find complete LED headlight assemblies but they are very expensive.  Even then I would not expect the light projection capability to be equal to a good halogen.

Last, when I found bulbs rated at 40W or 60W that was for a PAIR of lights, ie, each bulb was 20W/30W.  Most of the higher output LED's are the CREE 10W variety.  Even in mine there are three LED's.  Two for low beam and one additional for high beam, hence 20W on low and 30W on high.

Yes, there is a lot of hype.  Just don't believe it. LED replacement bulbs do NOT outperform HID or halogen.  They just don't.  If you are concerned with down range performance then get a good halogen or HID.

H4 is a bulb base definition.  It defines (among other things) that particular 3-eared base plate and the terminal arrangement.  It's not a lens pattern and has nothing to do with light dispersion.

I understand that a lot of these h4 replacement 'bulbs' do not come with 'tailor made' reflectors and that it's hard to find LED-compatible reflector/lens assemblies that properly handle LED light.  That's the problem, and these low-end products only offer half of the solution.  However, KC, Truck-lite, VISION-X, ARB, and Speaker all make LED headlights as complete assemblies.  Unlike the bare bulbs, many offerings from these folks are DOT compliant.  Since I can't get a good apples-to-apples comparison, I can't judge whether or not they do better than halogen without buying and trying.  As you say, they're spendy, spendier than I can afford to experiment with.

 . . .and the rating per PAIR is inherently deceptive.  When you buy a 4-pack of household light bulbs do you buy 240 watts, or do you buy four 60-watt bulbs?  Is that beer a 72-ouncer or is is a six pack of 12 ouncers?  If you buy a bag of bolts did you buy 150mm or a ten count of 15mm?

 

[charlie b]

I understand the distinctions.

A headlight shell made to take an H4 halogen bulb has a specific reflector design made to optimize the output from the halogen bulb.  If you put in an HID or LED you will not have an optimum pattern. 

And, yes, the purpose made LED headlights might work well.  Don't know and not willing to shell out $400 just to find out they aren't any better than a halogen or HID setup.  Heck, I'd rather get one of the projector adaptors for HID's and use it instead of one of the LED setups.

For what I wanted performance wise the setup I bought fits my needs.

[HDGoose]

I just do not know how people survived riding any distance at night before halogen bulbs were default on all motorcycles. I myself only covered a few miles. I know it was more than 10,000 miles ridden at night. And, oh my, some of it was in the rain!

[Triple Jim]

And, oh my, some of it was in the rain!

Uhhhhhggg... you just reminded me of the times I rode in the rain, at night, with my stock Kawasaki H2 headlight.  In dry weather it was about as much help as a candle.  In the rain I remember it was hard to tell if it was actually on.  Fortunately that's now converted to a standard automotive QH sealed beam.