New powder coating oven

[Chuck in Indiana]

Some assembly required. 
Last fall, I mentioned to Austin that it might be nice to have a FREE (Guzzi content) oven so we could powder coat small parts and not worry about over spray in the shop.
I'd almost forgotten about it when he sent me a text and said the guy says it works.  Loaded it in the van and brought it home.

I think I'll make a stand for it and put it on big castors so we can move it out of the way when not using it. I love it when a plan comes together..

[Perazzimx14]

Also good for peculator coffee and a couple fried eggs done up in a cast iron skillet

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

I've been using an oven here in the shop that my sister gave me about two years ago. Haven't done any powdercoating (yet), but it sure makes removing and installing bearings in alloy engine/transmission/rear drive cases a whole lot easier and quicker.

[Ratso88]

Damn it, Chuck! You guys stole my idea 

I've been on the lookout for a cheap (free is nice too) wall oven for the shop also.
Mostly for the install of bearings. Never thought of powder coating with one.
For the bearings the wife says "use the kitchen oven, you've done it before". Well, it wasn't winter then and I could open the windows and doors.

More info on this DIY powder coating option please.

[Perazzimx14]

I've never had issues with bearings. I store bearings in the beer fridge's freezer so they are ready to go when I am. When it comes time to use them I hit the interference part with a heat gun for a few minutes. Pull the bearing from the wrapper quickly coat with a thin film of grease and normally it drops in. Sometimes a few light taps on the bearing driver are needed to get it home.

Never had to resort to the oven for bearing work. 

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Damn it, Chuck! You guys stole my idea 

I've been on the lookout for a cheap (free is nice too) wall oven for the shop also.
Mostly for the install of bearings. Never thought of powder coating with one.
For the bearings the wife says "use the kitchen oven, you've done it before". Well, it wasn't winter then and I could open the windows and doors.

More info on this DIY powder coating option please.

One source: https://www.eastwood.com/eastwood-original-diy-powder-coating-gun-starter-kit.html

I've never had issues with bearings. I store bearings in the beer fridge's freezer so they are ready to go when I am. When it comes time to use them I hit the interference part with a heat gun for a few minutes. Pull the bearing from the wrapper quickly coat with a thin film of grease and normally it drops in. Sometimes a few light taps on the bearing driver are needed to get it home.

Never had to resort to the oven for bearing work. 

So how are you removing the bearing to be replaced? I used a heat gun or placing whatever on the woodstove up until I got the oven, both work... eventually. The oven is just easier and faster. I do chill the bearings too, but that alone doesn't always do the job.

I've been doing a bunch of Guzzi transmissions lately and without the oven they would take forever. A heat gun isn't going to get the part hot enough for the Loctite to let loose.

And parts like a Morini engine case - a heat gun is going to take a very long time to get it up to temp for all four bearings. Let alone doing four engine case halves...

[Moparnut72]

As I have said before I worked for a couple of years in a shop that overhauled/restored radial aircraft engines. We had a situation that required the main bearing which was also the thrust bearing to be installed on the front of the crank. This was an interference fit. The scary thing was that one make of engine required a special made bearing that was manufactured in Germany at a cost of $1,000.  I removed the old one with a special made tool with fairly long All Thread as the bearing had to come over a fairly long area on the crank and there was no concern regarding damage to the old one as it would be discarded anyway. But putting the new one was a whole different deal.

What we did to install the new one was to heat it in a container of oil on a hot plate. We made sure it got very hot and worked very quickly to get it on. It always scared me with the what if it went halfway on and stopped. It never happened but I still thought about it. I never had the nerve to ask. We couldn't use the puller and do it again because it pulled on the outer race and would damage the bearing. I suppose we could use a length of pipe on the inner race and drive it on but that would be scary too. And the crank was probably 2.5" in diameter.

 We used heat and cold for a lot of our work. Dry ice, liquid nitrogen were used quite often. The acetylene torch was also used a lot mainly to remove and install valve guides. We bought new heat guns on a regular basis as they were used on a daily basis. The main thing I learned there was when in doubt use the heat gun.
kk

[canuck750]

Nice!

I set another one in my shop (got one in my garage at home) unfortunately it dies last week, need to find another one for $25, that seems to be the going rate.

[Ratso88]

Charlie, thanks for the Eastwood link. Looks pretty nice, I may get around to that a little later.

If I can't find the oven I'm looking for I'll probably use the kitchen oven again.
I have a little 250 two stroke Honda motor for a vintage flat tracker that I want to race this season. It just needs assembled. Time is ticking.

Chuck has the right idea. Definitely need an oven in the shop. I already have a 240V/60amp outlet, just need the oven.

I used to work in an engine shop we did overhaul and repair of Pratt & Whitney 4000 engines.
The other side of the shop did the PW2000 and Air Force contract engines.
Used dry ice, induction heaters, "not for food" ovens, hydraulic rams and a lot of special tools/fixtures.

[Rick4003]

Hi Chuck,

I'm currently building a powder coat oven out of an old kitchen stove I got from my mom when they were rebuilding the kitchen, it has been standing around for years now. Finally got to start the project in december.

Unfortunately I have had a bad spell of this "work" thing that has been keeping me from finishing the oven.

Some pictures of the project.
Started out with a frame:


Cut up the old oven to fit in the frame:

The cut is made so I retain all the original components of the oven but extend the oven height with 700mm.

New side and back plates welded in:


Painted and insulation installed:


The powder gun I use is this one: https://www.electrostaticmagic.co.uk/
Works well for small parts but probably doesn't have the power to coat several layers on top of each other.


I need to make a door for the oven, skin the outside, make a new blower casing to send air to the bottom and make a top also. Plus I need to extend some of the wiring for the bottom heater.

The biggest issue with the powder coat was that the oven height was never enough for just slightly bigger parts. So that problem should be solved as soon as the oven is finished.

Oh and speaking of bearings, I'm going to Norway in a few weeks to install a new set of bearings in a gearbox. The two biggest ones have an ID of 440mm and OD of 700mm. You don't want that thing to get stuck half way 

-Ulrik

[Perazzimx14]

So how are you removing the bearing to be replaced? I used a heat gun or placing whatever on the woodstove up until I got the oven, both work... eventually. The oven is just easier and faster. I do chill the bearings too, but that alone doesn't always do the job.

In an average year I probably replace half dozen to a dozen bearings. A beer fridge/freezer, blind bearing puller and a heat gun have worked for me.

The electrical motor repair shop at work replaces 1,000's of bearings per year. I'll have to inquire about their means and methods for how they do on and industrial scale. I don't think they have a beer fridge/freezer

 

[Chuck in Indiana]

Hi Chuck,

I'm currently building a powder coat oven out of an old kitchen stove I got from my mom when they were rebuilding the kitchen, it has been standing around for years now. Finally got to start the project in december.

snip
  That's a *little* more of a project than I was thinking of.. With my luck, my FREE oven would fail at that point, and parts would be unobtainium..

[larrys]

I have an apartment sized kitchen range (24" wide) in my garage plugged into a 50A welder receptacle. My Parkerising tank sits on the two front burners making it easy to control the temperature of the solution. I have baked powdercoated parts in the oven with good results. Haven't used the oven for bearings. Mrs. larrys has cooked food in it and on it when we've put on a large feed.
Larry

[RinkRat II]

 Nice score Chuck but are you sure that will fit in with the hangar  "Decor"??   

      Paul B

[Trialsman]

I'm glad I didn't see Rick4003's project when I was looking for a powder coating oven.  It is an awesome idea and I still might do it!

Anyway I used a 110v meat smoker from Sportsmans Guide.  With its vertical layout it is tall enough to do most Guzzi parts and takes up little floor footprint.  I have used it now for about five years with a Redline gun and a copper pipe rack that is permanently attached to the garage ceiling.  It swings down to use and folds flat to the ceiling when stored.  I grounded it to an eight foot solid ground rod just outside.  I rarely paint things anymore.  For the V85 I have powder coated handlebar mounts, GPS mount, headlight frame, skidplate sides, pannier and top box mounts, aux lights mounts ....... and the list goes on.  It was cheap and is another option for you guys to consider.

[Chuck in Indiana]

  I grounded it to an eight foot solid ground rod just outside.

Hmmm, I've been researching, and read that all grounds in the shop should go to the same place? I was thinking of going through the wall and attaching the ground cable to the shop ground rod. Is this over kill?

[Trialsman]

Everything in the panel box goes to an isolated ground bar rather than combining with the neutrals.  I have all my ground cables going through the wall rather than the cold water pipes.  They attached to two eight foot ground bars four feet apart.  Is that overkill as well?

[twhitaker]

The electrical motor repair shop at work replaces 1,000's of bearings per year. I'll have to inquire about their means and methods for how they do on and industrial scale. I don't think they have a beer fridge/freezer

They, most likely use an induction bearing heater.

[Chuck in Indiana]

Everything in the panel box goes to an isolated ground bar rather than combining with the neutrals.  I have all my ground cables going through the wall rather than the cold water pipes.  They attached to two eight foot ground bars four feet apart.  Is that overkill as well?

Dunno. That's why I'm asking. A powder coating site was saying to drill a hole in the shop floor and drive in a ground rod for the powder coat gun. An electrician said no. All grounds should go to the same place. I'm neither a powder coater painter (yet) or an electrician ever. 

[RinkRat II]

  Easy to determine, is your panel or service entrance separately grounded to a rod in the ground(earth). If it is, no worries. Wire your oven outlet as per usual, two hots a neutral and a ground. If not,  drive a rod into the earth and connect that to an earthing strip in the shop i.e. your metal frame building.

      Paul B

[Trialsman]

I drove a separate ground bar for powder coating.  It works well.

[Chuck in Indiana]

  Easy to determine, is your panel or service entrance separately grounded to a rod in the ground(earth). If it is, no worries. Wire your oven outlet as per usual, two hots a neutral and a ground. If not,  drive a rod into the earth and connect that to an earthing strip in the shop i.e. your metal frame building.

      Paul B

Yes it is. If so, why would a separate ground rod be better?

I drove a separate ground bar for powder coating.  It works well.

 I'm *not* being cantankerous here.. trying to learn something.

[RinkRat II]

 In some older systems neutral and ground were synonymous, in todays world a separate ground is required by code and if your panel didn't have it ,it would be necessary to put one in to be up to code. You say it's there, your conduit would act as your ground as long as it's metal.  As long as your powder machine is properly wired I don't see the need for a separate ground in your case.

      PaulB

   

[Chuck in Indiana]

In some older systems neutral and ground were synonymous, in todays world a separate ground is required by code and if your panel didn't have it ,it would be necessary to put one in to be up to code. You say it's there, your conduit would act as your ground as long as it's metal.  As long as your powder machine is properly wired I don't see the need for a separate ground in your case.

      PaulB

   

Hmmm. I helped my old friend Paul (RIP) drive the rod in. Now, this was in 85, and Paul was an electrical inspector. I'm *assuming* it's correct.. (?) Is there an easy way to check? Can you tell I've never had any interest in electricity unless it involves a Guzzi? 
Thanks, Paul.

[RinkRat II]

     Located on that ground rod should be a clamp that connects a bare copper wire to your service entrance or circuit breaker panel. If it's there your good to go.

     



   Should look like this^^^^^^
     Paul   

[Chuck in Indiana]

Oh yeah.. we did that..

[Perazzimx14]

They, most likely use an induction bearing heater.

Yes they do have an induction heater for heating bearing to expand to put on shafts. Not sure what they do for bearings in recessed housing

[Groover]

Sounds like you are properly grounded to me. What RinkRat has been saying sounds correct. I ran a 4-wire 50A circuit in a older building (second story condo) last year when doing a light kitchen renovation (was only gas). The 4-prong 4-wire is new code for new builds, to then find out the panel had neutral and ground combined (I should've looked there first), so I would've been better off just using the 3 wire setup and would've still be to code being that it was an older build that was to code at the time the electrical panel was installed. This building also has a lot of old wiring where the grounds are the conduits leading to the panel, so technically even the outlets that don't have a ground wire, they are still grounded as long as they are mounted to a metal box tied to a metal conduit all the way to the panel. (building was built in 1910, electrical added ?? year). This was a huge learning experience of old stuff for me...

Unfortunately a guy I used to work with whom had all electrical codes for various states at his fingertips quit where I work, otherwise I'd ask what the code is for your state for workshops, though to me it sounds like you are to code of whatever year you installed that grounding rod to your panel.

A way to check to see if it's a good ground is to put a voltmeter between a phase and ground, and if you have ~120V then it's a ground (also should be 0 between neutral and ground). Basically voltmeter measurement should read the same between phase-ground and phase-neutral. I'm sure there is more to that as larger industrial applications use ground grids and such for better dispersion.

Codes change every year, but it's my understanding you can add small stuff to comply with the older codes of when the last thing that was permitted to your building passed. When doing a major addition or renovation, that's when the new code kicks-in. I'd ask a contractor in your area, they'd be able to take a pretty educated stab at your question.

[Ratso88]

OK, alright 

I picked up an old (1990) wall oven today, 25 bucks. I may try some power coat but its pretty small. It'll fit the engine cases I need to do but not much more. I'll be fabricating a wheeled stand for it so I can move it out of the way when not in use.

I was explaining to the young lady and her father what I wanted to use it for and it was the normal "stupid looks for free" response.
Took a minute to explain how it works and they seemed impressed/astonished that such things were possible.

Then I had a look at my sub panel in the shop, no ground just a common neutral. Looks like I'll be drilling the floor and adding a ground rod.

Damn it!

Even the wife was Impressed with how clean it was. I didn't get the usual 
Then again a new motorcycle didn't "follow me home".

[tcunnien]

I went to the local Habitat for Humanity Restore and found a brand new wall oven for $50. The plastic trim was cracked on the worksite so it was donated to them. Fit under my workbench perfectly. I have powered coated many a part since.