California 1400 Windshield - turbulence

[CBJoe]

Hello Folks,  I'd like to inquire with other California 1400 owners (with guzzi windshield) about turbulence and head buffeting.  I have a number of bikes with no windscreens, so this is what I'm comparing to with regards to helmet area turbulence. 

On my triumph bonneville, I have a small Fly-Screen and though I have lots of wind resistance, it doesn't cause helmet area buffeting.  http://www.motorcyclestore.us/triumph/accessories/retro/images/Bonneville_Fly%20Screen.jpg

I put the Guzzi Touring Windscreen on my california custom, and both my wife and I get helmet area buffeting at 60+ MPH speeds that is worse than riding without the shield.  It's not horrible, but when you are on the road for 2+ hours it gets headache inducing. 

It's very obvious that it is the wind "bubble" from the screen that is hitting at the top of my helmet and then most of my wifes head area. 

So the question is to cut the screen lower like I've seen here from WFORIDER (and maybe he can chime in with input on shorting the screen)  http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=65010.0   Or to put an extender on it to make the air "bubble" taller. 

Thanks for the input.  I do like having the air kept off my chest, but the helmet vibrations suck  :'(

Cheers, Joe

[rboe]

I have a buddy that has one, he's a bit short than me and does not complain about turbulence. I hope to test ride in May. Until then, I have had bunch of experience with turbulence and in two cases the addition of a Laminair Lip was a big help. Something to consider.

[gwb_mg]

I too had the turbulence/buffeting problem on my 1400T, put the Guzzi air deflectors on and the turbulence stopped completely.
http://www.harpermoto.com/california-1400-exhaust-tips-clone.html

[rtbickel]

I have both the wind deflectors and a Laminar Lip and the buffeting is greatly reduced but not entirely gone.  I have seen on a couple of websites that you can put spacers such as rubber or plastic washers between the windshield and its lower mounting points on the bracket to give the shield a bit more rake,  I am thinking about that for the near future. .

[CBJoe]

I too had the turbulence problem on my 1400T, put the Guzzi air deflectors on and the turbulence stopped completely.
http://www.harpermoto.com/california-1400-exhaust-tips-clone.html

Hmm...the turbulence is mostly on the helmet so I'm not sure how the side deflectors would help unless I'm missing where they mount.

[gwb_mg]

Hmm...the turbulence is mostly on the helmet so I'm not sure how the side deflectors would help unless I'm missing where they mount.

The deflectors keep the wind from coming up and around the lower part of the windshield, they do work.

[CBJoe]

I have both the wind deflectors and a Laminar Lip and the buffeting is greatly reduced but not entirely gone.  I have seen on a couple of websites that you can put spacers such as rubber or plastic washers between the windshield and its lower mounting points on the bracket to give the shield a bit more rake,  I am thinking about that for the near future. .

Now there's an idea.  That would be super easy to test.  I think I've got some different sized plastic washers/spacers already in the garage.  

BTW...do you have a picture of your bike with both the Laminar Lip and the deflectors?

Cheers, Joe

[CBJoe]

The deflectors keep the wind from coming up and around the lower part of the windshield, they do work.

Gotcha...thanks.  Didn't think about the wind coming from that direction.  I can actually follow the flow of air from the top of the screen with my hand and feel the turbulence starting just in front of my face and then hitting the top of my head.  So I wasn't focusing on the side deflectors.  But they cant hurt either as I'm sure it's a compounding issue from deflection from the side and top  :)

Joe

[kingoffleece]

"Cop Bike" shields are well known for causing the issues you are having.  It's caused (this is the simple version) by the low pressure area on the back side of the shield being filled-or trying to be filled-by the high pressure air everywhere else.

What works for one will not for another.  You'll need to explore many solutions until you find what works.  Helmets have an effect, too.

A vent installed into your shield may very well solve the problem.  For an idea look at the GoldWing shield.  You can purchase the vent and have it installed.  Harley found this out-the evidence is the venting to control pressure in the new RoadGlide.

CalSci and/or Clearview may be able to assist.

[Wissing]

I put spacers (1/2 inch) between the windshield and lower mounting points. It reduced buffeting quite a lot for me. It's easy and cheap - worth a try.


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[CBJoe]

I put spacers (1/2 inch) between the windshield and lower mounting points. It reduced buffeting quite a lot for me. It's easy and cheap - worth a try.


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I just installed 1/2 in spacers and I'll see how it goes when riding to work in a day or so.  I'll post input on whether it helped at all after trying out for a bit.

Joe

[rocker59]

This, or a similar product, will help:

http://rifle.com/Motorcycle-Windshields/Accessories/Air-Balance-Windshield-Vent-Kit.aspx

[John Ulrich]

I put the Guzzi Touring Windscreen on my california custom, and both my wife and I get helmet area buffeting at 60+ MPH speeds that is worse than riding without the shield.  It's not horrible, but when you are on the road for 2+ hours it gets headache inducing. 

Yup,  First thing I noticed was at 60 mph my head was rattling just like the Bassa did.....  I ended up spending $1,000 to cure it with a H&H (Swanee) from Harpers and a pearl white paint job to match it to the bike. 
Frank Wedge adapted a Swanee/H&H to his 1400.

[CBJoe]

Thanks for the links.  I'm not ready to chop the Shield just yet.  Gonna play around a little more.

I just did a quick ride 0 - 80mph on a highway and amazingly most all of the buffeting is gone from my position.  I'm going to have to go for a ride with the wife to see our combined consensus.  Here's a pic of the 1/2" Spacers I installed. If all tests out well in long run i'll install some nicer looking metal spacers.



Regards, Joe

[rocker59]

Harper's has the Cal 14 listed for the H&H:

http://www.harpermoto.com/h-and-h-fairing-for-cali-1400.html

[John Ulrich]

Interesting using the spacers on the bottom.  When I was experimenting with the Calif. Touring windshield, I had 1 inch of spacers at the top mount to move the shield forward which raised the "wind" higher to miss my head....(somewhat)

[CBJoe]

Interesting using the spacers on the bottom.  When I was experimenting with the Calif. Touring windshield, I had 1 inch of spacers at the top mount to move the shield forward which raised the "wind" higher to miss my head....(somewhat)

I'll be honest I thought the same, but both comments above mentioned putting the spacers on the lower mount points.  All I can guess is that it does a combination of things...one of which is changeing the pressure area because the pitch is different.

Wont know for sure until I get both myself and my wife out on the roads for a bit.  Did almost 400 miles this last weekend, so I'm sure if there's a difference i'll feel it ;)

Joe

[Wissing]

The idea behind the lowe mounted spacers is to allow for a little more air flow on the inside of the shield, which results in a more even pressure on the two sides of the shield.


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[gwb_mg]

Harper's has the Cal 14 listed for the H&H:

http://www.harpermoto.com/h-and-h-fairing-for-cali-1400.html

I have one on my Cali II and it great to ride behind, will probably be getting one for my 1400T.

[segesta]

FWIW--I did the "nylon spacer" approach described above and I just got back from a brief interstate ride at ~70 mph, and it really helped the helmet buffeting.

(of course, neither Ace Hardware nor Home Depot sell button-head Allen-wrench bolts in the necessary extended length, so I'm stuck with ugly Phillips-head bolts on the front of my bike--but hey).

[perk5560]

I know its been awhile since the last post on this topic but am wondering what became of the idea of using spacers on the bottom bolts of the windshield, angling the windshield and thereby reducing turbulence.

My only concern on this is developing stress cracks over time around the top windshield bolt holes since the windshield does not lie flat against the windshield bracket.

Any thoughts or ideas on this?

Thanks,

Dave

[segesta]

Based on this very thread, last year I put the nylon spacers--just not as long/deep as those pictured above. I just sold my California, but after a year I saw no problems with the windshield itself, and the helmet buffeting was much better.

[Sheepdog]

I put Vetter Pop Vents on my Rifle Cal Vintage shield (slightly taller and wider than stock) and adjusted for rake that matched the angle of the forks. The buffeting stopped and summer riding got a little more comfortable...

[LowRyter]

I wonder if they'll come out with a proper fairing for the T models? 

[Gliderjohn]

Question here. Is the screen on the Cali14s the way it is due to styling? I am guessing so as I have to assume Guzzi knows how to design a better screen with their wind tunnel and all. Surprised by the effectiveness of the bottom spacers. Guzzi didn't experiment with things like that?
GliderJohn

[Zoom Zoom]

Hmm...the turbulence is mostly on the helmet so I'm not sure how the side deflectors would help unless I'm missing where they mount.

They do help some. They are on the bottom corner of the shield on either side and extend up slightly behind the shield. They probably deflect a little air to the back side. I did notice an improvement. All in all, mine doesn't seem terrible. I look over the shield and don't seem to get beat up.

John Henry

[perk5560]

What I've noticed on my longer rides is a neck and shoulder ache but from what I can't quite figure out.  I lift my head up more and really don't feel much of a difference and the same when I lower my head.  Not much difference.  My previous bike was a Roadking and I never had neck pain but did have pain in my lower back after a long ride.  So who knows?   

On my earlier post I stated my concern of developing stress cracks around the upper windshield mount holes but Segesta was kind enough to respond that he didn't notice any cracks after a year of riding.  I may push forward with the spacers if the MG wind deflectors I just ordered don't seem to help.

Dave

[toaster404]

1" spacers top and bottom.  Laminar lip.  Large PVC pipe deflectors.  May slot the screen and put scoop/guide in to direct upwards.  Much much better, I'm just tall.

See http://imgur.com/a/cI4lf

[segesta]

Question here. Is the screen on the Cali14s the way it is due to styling? I am guessing so as I have to assume Guzzi knows how to design a better screen with their wind tunnel and all. Surprised by the effectiveness of the bottom spacers. Guzzi didn't experiment with things like that?
GliderJohn

There's a reason the aftermarket for windshields is huge--because manufacturers DON'T experiment with things like that. At least, my BMW K1300GT also had a lousy stock windshield, so Aeroflow got several hundred of my dollars. The OEMs just go with what looks good on the sales floor, I think.
I thought Guzzi had that innovative wind tunnel, but maybe they don't use it...

[Johan]

After market higher screen + spacers at the bottom. Works for me.