Lane splitting study

[Tom]

ABATE in CA, lost it's meaning to me when they couldn't fight the helmet law.  The local AMA outlet might do a better job. 

[Arizona Wayne]

Hello all, getting in here kinda late, but here it is.
1) Born and raised in California, come here or don't, like the place or don't, like the people or don't.

2)  As far as lane splitting being a problem that needed to be solved,  that is incorrect. The practice wasn't, isn't a problem.
Lane splitting in Ca. isn't unlawful.  That is the big major difference. It isn't legislated her like most everywhere else. There are other violations in the California Vehicle Code that reflect on various practices, that would stem from a squid dashing along at 60 between stopped traffic.  The problem is a matter of practicality, do you chase said squid doing 60 by going 90 to catch him ?  Do you wait for the collision, where Mr. Squid has now involved some innocent in his actions?  No real good answer.

3) Personal observation: The C.H.P. put out some public affairs guide lines about motorcycles and lane splitting a year or so ago.  I commute from Ventura county into Calabasas every weekday.  Calabasas is the epicenter for texting, calling, distracted and entitled drivers, period.  I actually had folks moving over when I was splitting traffic, more so than normal.  I thought, wow, this P.R. stuff actually worked to a degree that I did not expect.  I was impressed.  There were still squids.

4) Then someone sent an angry letter to the Governors office saying he didn't like that the C.H.P. was endorsing this kind of behavior, and thought that Jerry should do something about it.  Yep it takes 1 angry letter to kill a project.  So the website came down, the P.R. campaign stopped, and not as many people are moving as before. There are still squids.

5)  I understand that the State will legislate lane splitting.  This will probably not have an effect or affect on me or my actions.
However, I have seen the process in action and the frankenstien like monstrosity that comes from these sessions, and I know I am just going to shake my head and say bad words under my breath. 
No it wasn't a problem that needed to be fixed.
The fix, is generally not a good thing.

6)  Anyway, I hope other places can educate the masses and lane splitting can become a common practice most everywhere else.

7)  Gotta go, a friend has just bought some big $ Harley Electra Glide, so we gotta go have a looksee, a cup of coffee and such.


kjf

This is exactly right.  Lane splitting in Kalifornia has been legal for decades if you follow the rules.  It's the asshats that give it a bad name.

[travelingbyguzzi]

I think it NEEDS to be written into law so that the general public knows that they cannot impede the motorcycles progress.
Last week, near Seattle, I saw a bike slowly moving down the solid white line between the HOV  lane and the general purpose lane. As soon as it passed, a Caddilac Escalade  put his drivers side wheels on the white line. He was NOT going to allow another to go by.

[MotoGoosy]

It's true, it's not illegal in CA.  Local TV channel interviewed me about the proposed law as it looks like it's going to pass, with restrictions on speeds.  One question asked is "If you shear off someone's mirror, who is responsible?".  Thought that was a no-brainer.  Asked if I'm a lane-splitter, i answered "No".

[Tom]

Seems the new legislation is to fine tune the previous regulation concerned with filtering through traffic.  There is no need to lane split at speeds higher than 45mph.  I have been passed by squids while I was on the 405.  They were going way faster and the traffic was moving at 30mph.

[Arizona Wayne]

Seems the new legislation is to fine tune the previous regulation concerned with filtering through traffic.  There is no need to lane split at speeds higher than 45mph.  I have been passed by squids while I was on the 405.  They were going way faster and the traffic was moving at 30mph.

1 time on a L.A freeway we were doing 75 mph like everyone around us and a CHP BMW bike lane split all of us with no lights or siren on!   

[Tom]

Law or no law.  CHP can do what they want to do.

[Zinfan]

Law or no law.  CHP can do what they want to do.

And I've seen squids do the same thing at the same speeds.  There are crazy riders out there law or no law.

[Lannis]

Rodekyll, I'm kind of surprised at you, taking a grudge against a whole state full of people, 39.8 million at last count. 

Well, it's kind of hard NOT to assume that there's some arrogance and control-freaking going on when the majority of packages of EVERTHING I eat, drink, wash with, or clean with says:

"The State of California has determined that this product contains ingredients that cause cancer".    That's an overblown, BS statement, so if you don't want California impugned, make 'em take it off.   

You won't do it?   Then a majority of you 39 million people are the problem.

Lannis

[Randown]

Well, it's kind of hard NOT to assume that there's some arrogance and control-freaking going on when the majority of packages of EVERTHING I eat, drink, wash with, or clean with says:

"The State of California has determined that this product contains ingredients that cause cancer".    That's an overblown, BS statement, so if you don't want California impugned, make 'em take it off.   

You won't do it?   Then a majority of you 39 million people are the problem.

Lannis

Dear state representative,

A member on a motorcycle list is annoyed with that carcinogen warning on various products & is of the opinion that it is BS. He's on the verge of pronouncing us Kalifornians as arrogant & controlling, I beseech you to reconsider this program.

Cordially yours,

Hope that does it.

[Lannis]

Hope that does it.

38,999,999 more to go.

[Chuck in Indiana]

This is exactly right.  Lane splitting in Kalifornia has been legal for decades if you follow the rules. It's the asshats that give it a bad name.

True, but it's not been legal, it just hasn't been enforced. This law would make it legal, and give the police rules to abide by.

[rocker59]

I hope other places can educate the masses and lane splitting can become a common practice most everywhere else.

Don't hold your breath.  Lane sharing will not become common or legal outside Kalifornia in the lifetimes of anyone currently posting in this thread.

It just won't.

It would take a huge change in the status quo.  "Wait your turn" is taught to people from kindergarten.  "Don't cut line" is taught to people from kindergarten.  Sorry, but most citizens will not be able to handle the sea change of allowing others to cut line and get an "unfair advantage" in traffic, regardless of how much it would help congestion.  The culture just won't allow it.

And the legislators will not go against The People to make it legal, and pay for all the PSAs to educate The People, and pay to enforce the law on citizens who block and harass those who are lane sharing.

It just won't happen anytime soon.

[Lannis]

Don't hold your breath.  Lane sharing will not become common or legal outside Kalifornia in the lifetimes of anyone currently posting in this thread.

It just won't.

It would take a huge change in the status quo.  "Wait your turn" is taught to people from kindergarten.  "Don't cut line" is taught to people from kindergarten.  Sorry, but most citizens will not be able to handle the sea change of allowing others to cut line and get an "unfair advantage" in traffic, regardless of how much it would help congestion.  The culture just won't allow it.

......

It just won't happen anytime soon.

I think this is the majority of the truth.   I think the rest of it is the "competitive spirit" that seems to be built into Americans.   That CAN be turned into positive energy and positive achievements, and has been, but on the road it turns into the "I HAVE TO BEAT YOU" philosophy.

If I get ahead of a man in his car, I've castrated him.   If I get ahead of a woman, I've made her self-defensive about this man-dominated world and she's going to use her weapon to get back.    It's why roundabouts are so difficult here; people think they're a NASCAR track and they have to get there first.

I agree - it won't happen anytime soon ....

Lannis

[rocker59]

The lane sharing guidelines from the CHP were published in the LA Times and even on this forum. After that I saw where the attorney general of CA wanted these guidelines withdrawn because being issued by the CHP made them a "de-facto" law and it was determined that is was too soon to issue such guidelines until the legislature actually approved. In other words it could open a real can of worms in the courts.
 

This is the way I understand it.

[blackcat]

Don't hold your breath.  Lane sharing will not become common or legal outside Kalifornia in the lifetimes of anyone currently posting in this thread.

It just won't.

Can't argue with this, plus it's a revenue stream and a way to check those bad boys.

They even stopped traffic on the LIE to grab bikes as they filtered through to the police:
https://youtu.be/Xh0lFQ_rQYM

[Moto]

As for the study, I find it unconvincing.  They point out the problem with their analysis as if it supports them:  the riders they're looking at apparently have better safety skills - apparel, alcohol, acceleration (they speed less.)  So sure, they're able to [fill in the blank] and get away with fewer accidents than you might think - and that thoroughly disqualifies them as a statistically representative sample.

 :1: Good comment on the original topic. In fact, about the only comment on the original topic!

However, when the law is passed there won't be random assignment of riders to do the lane splitting. The better-prepared ones will still be doing it, and the drunks will not, since there is nothing stopping either group from splitting lanes now. So I think the study is still valuable in showing that the group doing the splitting is not causing particular problems, and should not be made to ride like the others.

[Lannis]

Curious statement, seems they all are somewhat related more or less, about normal for a thread no?

Well, some folks, if any comment on the thread is not SPECIFICALLY and EXACTLY related to the original post, they don't like that.   In this case, the topic was the Berkeley Lane Splitting Study, so a comment on Lane Splitting that doesn't include the Study is "Off Topic" and needs to be commented on or suppressed ...

If it's all in good fun, that's fine, but if it's not, then control-freakism may be raising it's ugly and prune-faced head ....

Lannis

[Arizona Wayne]

When I lived in Yuba City, Ka. off the I-5 corridor, when I split lanes in town traffic @ signals, some drivers there would get pissed off as if I was doing something illegal.    So not all drivers in Ka. know it's legal either. 

[Moto]

Well, some folks, if any comment on the thread is not SPECIFICALLY and EXACTLY related to the original post, they don't like that.   In this case, the topic was the Berkeley Lane Splitting Study, so a comment on Lane Splitting that doesn't include the Study is "Off Topic" and needs to be commented on or suppressed ...

If it's all in good fun, that's fine, but if it's not, then control-freakism may be raising it's ugly and prune-faced head ....

Lannis

You can write what you like, Lannis, but those looking for information about a topic never get back the time they spend reading off-topic blather, like your comment. I get a bit impatient about it at times. Carry on as you like, but have you ever considered whether you really have over seven (7.275) useful remarks to contribute per day? I don't think you do.

P.S. Don't call me prune faced.

[kirkemon]

It always makes me happy to hear people bad mouthing California for any reason. And I'm glad when they're afraid of earthquakes and fires as well.

Anything that discourages even one more person from moving here or staying here just makes my life that much better.

 

Amen brother! 
Get off my wave, I'm surfin' here!
Here's the state ranking:
http://www.thrillist.com/travel/nation/ranking-the-united-states-of-america-from-best-to-worst?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=Social&utm_campaign=Thrillist

[Lannis]

You can write what you like, Lannis, but those looking for information about a topic never get back the time they spend reading off-topic blather, like your comment. I get a bit impatient about it at times. Carry on as you like, but have you ever considered whether you really have over seven (7.275) useful remarks to contribute per day? I don't think you do.

P.S. Don't call me prune faced.

Well, if me old mucker Dusty can have 13.9 remarks per day, and I'm only half as useful as him (a conservative estimate), then 7.2 remarks per day doesn't sound so bad.   That's only one comment every three hours or so; I think it shows admirable restraint.

Not only that, I make SURE I have my name at the top of every one of them, so anyone who wants to say "There's that Lannis again dammit" can just skip them and (now here's a shocking and radical concept) NOT READ THEM!   Our friend "The Bailey" has already said that he doesn't read my BS at all, although for some reason he can't help responding to what he hasn't read, which leads to some interesting interchanges, like a blind guy fencing with someone who can see.

If everyone has to wait their turn and raise their hand and say Mother May I and certify that they are On Topic before responding, the board's going to slow down some.   There's probably some software (which comes with a stick up its butt, a hair bun in the back, and a real prune-ey face) which does that .... 

Lannis

[Moto]

Well, if me old mucker Dusty can have 13.9 remarks per day, and I'm only half as useful as him (a conservative estimate), then 7.2 remarks per day doesn't sound so bad.   That's only one comment every three hours or so; I think it shows admirable restraint.

Not only that, I make SURE I have my name at the top of every one of them, so anyone who wants to say "There's that Lannis again dammit" can just skip them and (now here's a shocking and radical concept) NOT READ THEM!   Our friend "The Bailey" has already said that he doesn't read my BS at all, although for some reason he can't help responding to what he hasn't read, which leads to some interesting interchanges, like a blind guy fencing with someone who can see.

If everyone has to wait their turn and raise their hand and say Mother May I and certify that they are On Topic before responding, the board's going to slow down some.   There's probably some software (which comes with a stick up its butt, a hair bun in the back, and a real prune-ey face) which does that .... 

Lannis

You slow down the board by being off-topic. I hope that the Topics will lead to material I'm interested in, rather than to more of your bile and self-indulgence. You just waste my time more than you should, though you make an occasional worthwhile contribution.

[Lannis]

You slow down the board by being off-topic. I hope that the Topics will lead to material I'm interested in, rather than to more of your bile and self-indulgence. You just waste my time more than you should, though you make an occasional worthwhile contribution.

Look at the time you've spent today responding to my bile and self-indulgence; you could have been doing brain surgery instead.   I didn't "make" you do that, you did it yourself!   

I'll put this in the category of "Worthwhile Contribution".

Lannis

[yackee]

I'm confused. When I lived in LA I split lanes all the time (almost always at stop lights and traffic jams, not at speed) and so did everyone else. I thought it already *was* legal?? The article implies that it is not currently legal, but may be if the new law passes. Am I missing something?

[rodekyll]

Yes, you're missing the point that I'm being vilified for saying  -- the issue is murky and needs clarification.  I think the topical parts of this discussion and your confusion bear that out.

[cruzziguzzi]

I'm confused. When I lived in LA I split lanes all the time (almost always at stop lights and traffic jams, not at speed) and so did everyone else. I thought it already *was* legal?? The article implies that it is not currently legal, but may be if the new law passes. Am I missing something?

What you're missing is generally this:

It wasn't "legal" as a codified method of vehicle operation. At the same time, it was not illegal for two vehicles to occupy the same lane laterally. Many states in which "filtering" and "splitting" are notably illegal, base the code upon this lateral lane sharing being prohibited.

So, it wasn't illegal to split but it wasn't actually an authorized method of vehicular operation either.

Todd.

[Arizona Wayne]

Christ, this subject has turned into the equivalent of an oil thread just because 1 person in Kalif. complained about it not even because of what it was originally for, saving the over heating of an air cooled MC motor in stalled traffic.     Cars are water cooled and their drivers don't understand that unlike them , a MC rider can't sit there w/o destroying his motor doing it.  Even W/C MC motors can't stay stationary as long as car  motors w/o overheating. 

[Lannis]

Christ, this subject has turned into the equivalent of an oil thread just because 1 person in Kalif. complained about it not even because of what it was for originally for, saving the over heating of an air cooled MC motor in stalled traffic.     Cars are water cooled and their drivers don't understand that unlike them , a MC rider can't sit there w/o destroying his motor doing it.  Even W/C MC motors can't stay stationary as long as car  motors w/o overheating. 

All of what you say is true, but look at it from the car owner's point of view.

Even if they UNDERSTAND that the air-cooled motorcycle can't just sit and idle in traffic, their response would be "Well then they shouldn't be on the highway to begin with!"   They don't WANT to share the road, they don't WANT anyone to "get in front of them" even if it SPEEDS UP TRAFFIC, and they think motorcycles should be gone anyway.   Between stunting squids and loud obnoxious pipes, many of them hate all of us.

So that argument is not going to work.

Lannis

[guzzimike]

Christ, this subject has turned into the equivalent of an oil thread just because 1 person in Kalif. complained about it not even because of what it was originally for, saving the over heating of an air cooled MC motor in stalled traffic.    

BINGO !!


And because Police motorcycles of the time were mostly air cooled, they had the option to "Lane Split" as needed. And so too the tactic applied tacitly to civilian owned motorcycles.

 IOW, it was NOT Illlegal for us to Lane split.

BTW, I think that the "study" is Bullshiite.

IMHO, it is akin to the proverbial Camel first sticking his nose into the tent...It is but another mechanism ( sugar-coated for ease of consumption ) for an ever growing, overreaching "progressive" legislature to define, limit, encroach on and finally, marginalize yet one more Natural Right of one select minority sector of the Citizenry.


Lane Splitting is a system which was ( is ) Not Broken. Why the rush to "fix it"..?


And speaking personally, I have been Lane Splitting on Highways located all over California since the Mid-1970s; though mostly in SoCal.

Never a problem, never any issue of any kind. Sometimes drivers pulled over, sometimes they do not.

It's all about developing a sense of what the driver is going to do before He / She them-self know what they will do .

Its about putting some of our most noted advantages to work...

Recall that a motorcycle affords us a greater field of view than that which surrounds a typical driver stuck in traffic. We can see farther than they can; and in addition, we can see inside their vehicles. We can watch their body movements; and we scan multiple targets almost simultaneously, sometimes up to five or ten cars ahead of our present position in the Freeway peloton.

In due time, as one succeeds in Freeway Combat 101, 202 and 303, a person tends to develop a certain type of situation awareness.. Your own sense of survival sharpens and focuses this mechanism. It's sort of a Two-Wheeled Darwinism.

Hard to describe exactly, but I think that it boils down to this - most drivers are prone to displaying subtle "Tells" which much more often than not prove indispensable in determining the best line for the motorcyclist to navigate.

You learn to pick up on these multi-variable "Tells"...and you learn to Trust them with YOUR LIFE..


And No Effin SUCK-ramento  Gummint Asswipe is qualified to tell me How, When and by How Much to apply my hard-gained "Spidey Sense".

f*** them and the Limo they rode in on.







-