Author Topic: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!  (Read 5426 times)

Offline Zenermaniac

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #30 on: April 09, 2021, 10:57:18 PM »
What is the zip tie method?

Offline Solorider73

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #31 on: April 09, 2021, 10:57:48 PM »
Since I’ve seen your Griso in person, I might buy it without the front tire.  If you get frustrated enough I’ll take it off your hands. :grin:  :bike-037:
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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #32 on: April 09, 2021, 11:18:30 PM »
 The zip tie method is simply using about 5 or 6 large zip ties thru the tire pulled very tight expanding the inner circumference enough so the tire will slip over the rim . Really easy with tubeless , although I have managed it with tubes also . The reverse can be used to dismount a tire , but fishing the zip tie under the tire is kinda tricky .

 Dusty

Offline Kiwi_Roy

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #33 on: April 09, 2021, 11:22:08 PM »
I have found I sometimes can't get the tire to seat using my small shop compressor, if that's the case I take it up to a nearby service station, their compressor has much more capacity.
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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #33 on: April 09, 2021, 11:22:08 PM »

Online Brand X

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #34 on: April 10, 2021, 05:11:04 AM »
I  have had issues with mounting Pirelli diablo tires on my Aprila wheels. Using the slippery mounting lube from No-mar/etc/ and super clean rims Only thing that worked in the one stubborn bead area that would not seat, was to take a small bit of silicone grease to the area,and it would seat.. Rubber mallet, and other things like higher then safe pressure was not moving it..Only a inch or two was lubed with it.  The tire was taking way too much air pressure to seat the bead..  I had a Continental car tire blow up seating the bead  about 50 years ago.. It knocked me silly ,and I saw stars on that one.. It rates up there with getting hit in the face with a baseball bat.. Which also happened a few years earlier, The air pressure hit harder in the area of brain trauma (IMO)

The China made Pirelli tires have a weird plastic like feel to the sidewall. I think that is part of the issue with seating the bead. They worked well, but I am not going to use them again. I've mounted up Avon, Continental, Michelin,Dunlop,Shinko,and a few othrs in the last few years, and zero bead seating issues. Even many different car/truck tires.. Pirelli bike tires on certain rims can,and do suck in that area..   I am not talking about seating the whole tire bead issue thing.. Bazooka can help, and tire bead seaters in general.. A bicycle tube can also help just to get the bead seated/started. Just never a problem with Motorcycle tires, and rim combos to really need help with getting a bead seat started.

I have good equipment,and Mounted many type tires using different machine, and bars/levers,etc..   BTW, do not seat tires with any parts of the body around, over the tire.. Use a ft control for air pressure, and hands free/


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« Last Edit: April 10, 2021, 05:39:35 AM by Brand X »

Offline greer

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #35 on: April 10, 2021, 05:18:40 AM »
We had this problem a couple of weeks ago with one of the tires on Doug's Roamer; it was as if the tire was just entirely too small, we tried everything we could think but it wouldn't even begin to seat.  A buddy mentioned he'd had the same trouble with a trailer tire and ended up at a fleet service shop where they'd used a bead seater tank.  Like magic, it took those guys a matter of seconds to fix us up.

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« Last Edit: April 10, 2021, 05:22:40 AM by greer »
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Offline flower_king001

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #36 on: April 10, 2021, 06:37:10 AM »
clean tire and rim
you only need a small amount of lube (I use 50/50 Dawn dish soap & water in a spray bottle)
clip/click on air chuck
big rush of air

I have been where you are at a couple of times and took my tire to my buddy's shop. Larger compressor than my small
Husky did the trick.

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Offline tazio

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #37 on: April 10, 2021, 07:27:08 AM »
Mike, you've got my sympathy brother! As already said, let it rest and come back at it fresh later on.
Oh, and PLEASE be careful not to bend a rotor in your struggles.
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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #38 on: April 10, 2021, 07:35:43 AM »
I think there’s a little confusion here. The issue was not that he couldn’t get the tire to take air and inflate, it was the tire in one area would not seat, or “pop out” if you will.  Putting a belt  around the center of  the tire would do nothing for this issue.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2021, 07:52:45 AM by Ncdan »

Offline Motormike

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #39 on: April 10, 2021, 10:36:43 AM »
Success! (of a sort).   Well, I de-mounted the Metzeler, and just for grins, measured the inside diameter, bead to bead, and compared it to a new Avon 120/70-17 front I was saving for another bike.  The Avon measured a true 17 inches across, bead edge to bead edge.  The Metzeler measured 16 & 3/4.  So I mounted the Avon.  Took all of about 15 minutes, the bead fully seated at 60 psi with a satisfying "Pop!"  While I could try and send the Metzeler back, I'm so pissed at it my last act will be to throw it as hard as I can in the tire trailer at our local dump...where that Chinese POS belongs!  Please consider yourselves warned and stay far away from Chinese-made Pirelli/Metzeler tires.  Avon..Made in England...God save the Queen!

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #40 on: April 10, 2021, 11:42:44 AM »
Nope! The OP only needs more pressure to get the bead to pop/seat.

 Actually no , read the rest of the thread .

 Dusty

Offline wymple

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #41 on: April 10, 2021, 12:11:30 PM »
Over the years I've seen lots of tires take 80-90 lbs to finally seat. Clip on chuck, no valve stem to slow down the air rush, foot pedal. Get around a corner & let er rip. Never had one blow.
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Offline leroy_can

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #42 on: April 10, 2021, 12:43:59 PM »
 I keep thinking of the original "JAWS" movie when Roy Schneider said "We're going to need a bigger boat". Change boat to compressor and there you go.  At the end of the movie it was compressed air that took out Jaws.
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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #43 on: April 10, 2021, 01:29:36 PM »
Best $380 I ever spent. Coats 200 Cycler. Home-made copy of the Marc Parnes balancer.



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Offline SmithSwede

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #44 on: April 10, 2021, 01:32:51 PM »
Maybe take your wheel to a good machine shop and have them face off that extra 1/4”.   No more trouble with cheap Chinese tires.   And think of the $$$ saved
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Offline cookiemech

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #45 on: April 10, 2021, 01:37:19 PM »
Best $380 I ever spent. Coats 200 Cycler. Home-made copy of the Marc Parnes balancer.




Was the model 200 the predecessor of the 220 (which is the one I have)? Think I paid something like $800 quite a few years ago for mine (new). Agree that it's a terrific machine!

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #46 on: April 10, 2021, 01:40:36 PM »
Continental did a demonstration at a BMW Rally back in the 80's. They were showing the strength of their tires, They has a special solid wheel that they mounted used tires on. They would blow them up to over 200 lbs before they blew. I wasn't there but a friend was, he said it was quite impressive. I bet the bang was at the least.
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Offline Scout63

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #47 on: April 10, 2021, 09:55:50 PM »
This thread saved my day. I was having the exact same problem getting a 90/90 Avon Roadrider to seat.  I put the wheel in my car in the sun for an hour, lubed the bead with tire lube, and clipped a chuck onto the valve without the stem.  I put it outside the garage with a blanket on it, then plugged the air hose into the compressor set at 100# from far away around the corner. It took two shots to seat both sides. Firing another $5.00 off to Luap as he is the matchmaker who added to my skill set.
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Offline Scout63

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #48 on: April 11, 2021, 07:06:13 AM »
Warm tires are easier but again if you use the right technique its not a problem hot, warm, cool, cold or freezing. I've changed tires for fellers in the dead of winter who tires were left in the car trunk at sub freezing temperatures for day or more until they could get here. Bring the tire/wheel down to the basement and change them out.

Correct me if I’m wrong Perrazzimx14 but I think you may be talking about mounting the tire on the wheel vs. getting the bead to seat.  Tire mounting is a pia but doable if one pushes the tire into the center well while spooning on the other side.  Much easier on the knuckles with a tire machine.  Seating the bead is something that never troubled me over 40 years of tire changing until this last set of Avon’s.  One side of the bead hung up in the center well a bit even with a substantial amount of air in the tire.  Shocking it with air solved it.  It was a clean cast v50ii rim and I lubed the bead, so I must assume that the problem was with the tire itself.
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Offline SIR REAL ED

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #49 on: April 11, 2021, 08:20:10 AM »
The zip tie method is simply using about 5 or 6 large zip ties thru the tire pulled very tight expanding the inner circumference enough so the tire will slip over the rim . Really easy with tubeless , although I have managed it with tubes also . The reverse can be used to dismount a tire , but fishing the zip tie under the tire is kinda tricky .

 Dusty

I like it.  I might try it with hose clamps in the future.

What color zip ties work best?
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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #50 on: April 11, 2021, 08:39:07 AM »
Was the model 200 the predecessor of the 220 (which is the one I have)? Think I paid something like $800 quite a few years ago for mine (new). Agree that it's a terrific machine!

Yes, the 200 was the predecessor of the 220. The 220 was $1200 when last available. My brother bought mine (used) while on a road trip in the Carolinas.
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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #51 on: April 11, 2021, 08:51:12 AM »
I like it.  I might try it with hose clamps in the future.

What color zip ties work best?
A ratchet tie down works much more efficiently and much stronger.

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #52 on: April 11, 2021, 08:54:15 AM »
I like it.  I might try it with hose clamps in the future.

What color zip ties work best?

 Hose clamps have sharp edges that might damage a tyre or the rim , and would be slow . A bag of 20 large zip ties doesn't cost much . I have a zip tie gun , it has a ratchet assembly that pulls the ties really right .

 Oh , white works best  :laugh:

 Dusty

oldbike54

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #53 on: April 11, 2021, 08:58:11 AM »
A ratchet tie down works much more efficiently and much stronger.

 Two different concepts Dan , we aren't wrapping the circumference of the tyre with zip ties , they are going around the carcass to expand the inner circumference . I have learned that stretching the tyre this way also helps it seat if yo keep it warm .

 Dusty

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #54 on: April 11, 2021, 10:38:14 AM »
Two different concepts Dan , we aren't wrapping the circumference of the tyre with zip ties , they are going around the carcass to expand the inner circumference . I have learned that stretching the tyre this way also helps it seat if yo keep it warm .

 Dusty
Ok, got it. Yes, different cause and effect objective👍

oldbike54

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #55 on: April 11, 2021, 11:38:38 AM »
Actually yes! Pressure is what pushes the tire bead outward and over the bead of the rim. If the tire bead is not being pushed over the wheel bead at a given pressure there is not enough pressure to push it over.

 Dude , the tyre was 1/4 inch too small , you are being a bit too cocksure here .

 Dusty
« Last Edit: April 11, 2021, 10:02:48 PM by oldbike54 »

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #56 on: April 11, 2021, 11:59:14 AM »
Dude , the tyre was 1/4 inch too small , you are being a bit to cocksure here .

 Dusty

 let me rephrase that . Would you bet a hundred bucks that putting oh say 200 PSI to the tyre would 100% for certain seat it , then would bet that the structural integrity of the tyre would not be compromised by being permanently stretched over the rim ?

 Dusty

Online Perazzimx14

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #57 on: April 11, 2021, 01:54:15 PM »
let me rephrase that . Would you bet a hundred bucks that putting oh say 200 PSI to the tyre would 100% for certain seat it , then would bet that the structural integrity of the tyre would not be compromised by being permanently stretched over the rim ?

 Dusty

I have no idea if 200# or 137.6# or 54.4# is the magic number. But yes I'd wager a bet that more pressure than has been used and did not set the bead will set the bead.

Bring you tire and $100 bill along. I have an air compressor and beer.  I can also prepare dinner if you like. Any food allergies or dislikes?
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oldbike54

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #58 on: April 11, 2021, 01:57:50 PM »
I have no idea if 200# or 137.6# or 54.4# is the magic number. But yes I'd wager a bet that more pressure than has been used and did not set the bead will set the bead.

Bring you tire and $100 bill along. I have an air compressor and beer.  I can also prepare dinner if you like. Any food allergies or dislikes?

 You are willing to risk another member's safety to prove a point then ? Think about this for a moment , because that is what I am reading .

 Here's the deal , the OP is ultimately the person who must make the decision . you do you , let him make his choice , fair enough ?

 Dusty

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Re: Beaten by a F***ing Tire!
« Reply #59 on: April 11, 2021, 03:21:05 PM »
Well there's a spin I didn't anticipate. You made the bet I'm willing to follow through. As for safety you or anyone else for that matter safety will not be jeopardized. If you like you can put on a flack jacket, goggles, helmet and stand behind bullet proof glass if you want to bring all that stuff along or even vacate the property while I inflate the tire.

I'm not promoting doing anything unsafe although anytime you are working with pressurized items there is a risk factor. Be that as it may sometime it takes more than 20 or 30 pounds of pressure to "set" a bead. Clip on the chuck, crank up the pressure a bit and stand back.

I got that hundy waiting whenever you are ready.

 You can do whatever you want with your tires , telling someone else they are somehow stupid for not wanting to do the same is problematic . Capeesh?

 Dusty

 

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