Author Topic: What I want them to build  (Read 1642 times)

Offline reidy

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What I want them to build
« on: July 29, 2019, 05:07:54 AM »
Following on from Huzo’s highly successful “Why won’t they do it” post and the “Harley Davidson stock prices fall post” where we discuss what they should have done, I thought I would let someone at Moto Guzzi know what I want. Surely out of the well-connected and educated readers of this fine forum, one of you knows the head designer over at Lake Como.

Remember the 80’s and Japan was selling what become known as the UJM (Universal Japanese Motorcycle). I think it time for another TLA. The RWM, or in full, the Real World Motorcycle. I want a bike that I could ride to work, go for a scratch at semi legal speeds on the weekend and once or twice a year go for a week’s trip. They are heading that way with the V7 range but have a way to go in my opinion.

For performance it only needs to be respectable up to the old imperial ton. Enough to get you in trouble with Mr Plod but not sent to jail. By all accounts the V85 motor might do it. Handling should be a lot better than the twin spring design of the V7. Can they adapt the CARC to the small block and put on a decent set of forks? It only needs one disk but make it a bloody good one.

I want a fairing that keeps some of the weather and wind of me, and not just a little bikini. I have nothing against little bikini’s, but they are really only practical on a nice day.

I would like the weight kept around the 200kg mark so I can push the bugger up an angled carpark with a bit of gear on and not give myself a hernia. I should have said not upset my hernia. Put a center stand on it to for when I load it up.
Don’t put a heap of bodywork around the arse end so I can strap some gear on, or put a set of panniers on for a trip. Add a few tie down points whilst you are at it.

The wheels must be tubeless and I don’t care what size tyres they use, as long as they pick a really common size that also comes in a range of compounds from commuter to extra sticky.

Whilst it is being designed make sure the wheels can be removed without removing an exhaust pipe. That also goes for the oil change. I don’t want to remove the fairing for a tappet adjustment. The tank seat and aircleaner should come off without tools. In fact just make the sump plug and axle nut the same size as the plug spanner. And the tappet adjuster should use the same size allen/torx  head as the tappet cover screws.

Put a decent headlight on it and have it so the fault codes can be retrieved on the dash.

I know most of these things have been done in the past on different bikes, so it should not be that hard to put them all on the one bike.

Also for Huzo, I have intentionally left some grammar and spelling errors for your correction.

Steve   

Online Huzo

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2019, 07:23:47 AM »
Jeez mate.
That was a darn good effort actually. I only noticed you spelled centre like a Yank and arse like an Aussie.
But a bit of multiculturalism is always welcome.
I notice a lot of people start a sentence with the word “And” which is not technically correct and a couple of trifling issues that I expect would go largely unnoticed.
I only pick one out of every hundred mistakes and highlight them, but that’s still more than enough to keep a nit picker busy..
As for the main thrust of your post...?
Couldn’ta poot it better meself... :thumb:
« Last Edit: July 30, 2019, 06:02:25 AM by Huzo »

Offline Knuckle Dragger

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #2 on: July 29, 2019, 08:41:00 AM »
So, you're after a bike that's sensible to own, easy to maintain & service, versatile and genuinely weather protective.  With universal fasteners, tyres and other ancillaries.  Simple, lightweight and luggage friendly, yet simultaneously well illuminated & sophisticatedly suspended with reasonably encompassing front fairings.

Sounds just a little like a Moto Guzzi to me:  when qualified and compared to the alternatives from other manufacturers' fares at the time of each model's release for the last 40 odd years anyway. Yet it still doesn't really sound much like any particular Guzzi that I've ever known either.

Aren't the marque's eccentricities, frustrations, quirks and peccadilloes precisely that which makes these bikes so appealing, nay even endearing to many if not most aficionados?  Frankly, it sounds a trifle boring to me.......... in my mind more like a BMW boxer in fact, maybe without their rather superfluous shimmed valve clearance adjustment.
Severus bastardis

Offline Lannis

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #3 on: July 29, 2019, 01:28:43 PM »
I think you've already identified the issue.

"Them" won't build it because "You" would be one of the very few that would buy it ... !

Much better to line up your desires, find a bike that ticks the most boxes out of those, minimize the amount of fabrication that it would take to meet the rest of the requirements, and build it yourself.

I'll wager that a nice 80s Tonti, a G5 or something similar, would be a fantastic starting point.

Lannis
"Hard pounding, this, gentlemen; let's see who pounds the longest".

Wildguzzi.com

Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #3 on: July 29, 2019, 01:28:43 PM »

Offline reidy

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2019, 02:54:51 AM »
Thanks for the comments and I will respond in the order they come in.

Huzo, I have never been a great speller. I blame that on a state school education education in the bush. Therfore I get a few red underlines lines from time to time. If I am confident with the stralian spelling I go with that. Otherwise I just go stuff it, and let Microsoft tell me how it should be. It is easier that way. As you know we are in danger of becoming the 51st state so I may as well just roll over and join the rest in letting our national identity go, but that is probably a story for a different audience. 

Knuckle dragger, It does sound boring when you put it like that. But that is part of the point I wanted to make, and cleverly described it by not mentioning it. I can only speak for myself, but I have come to realise that the marketing people have sucked me in. A 300 Km/h with 180 Hp bike sounds really cool. The only issue is I lack the ability to meaningfully use about half of those horses and I have heard what supposedly goes on in prison, and that is where I would end up if I used the 300 Km/h on the road. I don't really fancy being bubba's bitch. An interesting experiment next time you go for a decent ride is to count the seconds that you have the throttle held fully open. If you are not in the top third of your bikes rpm only count them as half seconds because you were to lazy to drop back a gear. Some riders will be surprised out how few a seconds they count yet they feel they need more top end power. The problem is how do you advertise a boring sounding bike.

Lannis, you are 100% correct and I will most likely do that when I finish my current project and recover from biting of more than I could comfortably chew. I can see how to address most issues. The two main ones are the rear suspension or starting with a CARC equipped bike. I am happy for tips on how to make a twin spring Guzzi handle in the rear end. The second is that I can err on the side of being a tight arse, but I prefer financially responsible. For some reason most of the second hand Guzzi's for sale in Australia are in my opinion overpriced. It can be cheaper to buy one in the states and have it imported. I would easy sink more than a new bike cost into getting some of these up and running. That is with me doing a lot of the labour.

If anyone in Australia has a Guzzi that they actually want to sell and not just put it on bike sales for a year or two, please let me know. My two preferences are a California that I would modify along the lines of a 1000s with a fairing, or something I could model similar to a 1971 v7 sport as I kind of like the idea of a bike from my birth year. I would even consider a 1971 Ambassador. It is a bit heavy and may be a challenge to get it handling but it would fit with the 1971 thing. 

Steve

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2019, 05:58:24 AM »
Not interested in my Mk 2 perchance...?


Offline blackcat

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #6 on: July 30, 2019, 06:13:35 AM »
“My two preferences are a California that I would modify along the lines of a 1000s with a fairing...”

Don’t, just buy Huzo’s MKII.
1968 Norton Fastback
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Offline reidy

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #7 on: July 30, 2019, 06:28:21 AM »
Email sent.
It is a definite maybe.

Steve

Offline blackcat

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #8 on: July 30, 2019, 07:34:11 AM »
Strip it down, new paint, wiring harness and your good to go. Good touring bike, while the lower fairings are kind of a pain they do work.
1968 Norton Fastback
1976 Lemans
1981 CX-100
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2007 Red Norge

Offline Lannis

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2019, 08:05:37 AM »
Strip it down, new paint, wiring harness and your good to go. Good touring bike, while the lower fairings are kind of a pain they do work.

Looks like that bike ticks most of your wants.   "Remove wheel without removing exhaust pipe" might take some mods, but the tank, seat, and air cleaner without tools thing will work.   Weight's a little higher than 440 pounds I think, but they're easy bikes to handle in the driveway.   Performance will be way above your minimums.  Bodywork won't get in the way of touring mods.   Maintenance is dead easy and you can change the valve cover screws to match the socket size for the tappets.

You're hosed on the "fault codes displayed on dash", though!   :laugh:

Lannis
"Hard pounding, this, gentlemen; let's see who pounds the longest".

Offline LowRyter

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #10 on: July 30, 2019, 08:42:05 AM »
It sounds like the OP wants a Honda Pacific Coast.    :angel:
John L 
When life gets you down remember it's one down and the rest are up.  (1-N-23456)

Offline Lannis

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #11 on: July 30, 2019, 08:55:23 AM »
It sounds like the OP wants a Honda Pacific Coast.    :angel:

I doubt it.   I had one, and while you're riding, it's a clean smooth maintenance free ride with little or nothing that has to be done ....

... until it's time to change tires or set the valves.   Then your world disappears in a cloud of fiberglass and plastic ....

And you either have to like the space in the trunk or do without, because there's no way to add anything to it ....

Lannis
"Hard pounding, this, gentlemen; let's see who pounds the longest".

Offline blackcat

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #12 on: July 30, 2019, 05:44:04 PM »
 "Remove wheel without removing exhaust pipe" might take some mods..”

Nope, the wheel can be taken off easily if a piece of plywood is used under the center stand. Even without the plywood, the wheel can be taken off if you slightly tilt the bike to squeeze it past the license plate.
1968 Norton Fastback
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Offline Lannis

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #13 on: July 30, 2019, 05:45:39 PM »
"Remove wheel without removing exhaust pipe" might take some mods..”

Nope, the wheel can be taken off easily if a piece of plywood is used under the center stand. Even without the plywood, the wheel can be taken off if you slightly tilt the bike to squeeze it past the license plate.

Well, there's one MORE point in favor of taking a nice clean sport-sport/touring bike and making it your own ....

Lannis
"Hard pounding, this, gentlemen; let's see who pounds the longest".

Offline reidy

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #14 on: July 31, 2019, 05:07:52 AM »
Lannis, it does display the fault codes on the dash, just not in great detail. For instance when the red oil light is on it means either low oil pressure or the oil sender is stuffed.  :grin: The performance could be made to suit, and I may have given the impression of I wanted a bit less performance than what I want. What I want is a big fat midrange power curve but don't need the top end to send me to jail. Respectable probably means different things in different countries.

LowRyter, I am happy to say the the Honda Pacific Coast was not available in Australia. The last time I saw that much plastic was at a, oh never mind.

Steve


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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #15 on: July 31, 2019, 05:11:46 AM »
The last time I saw that much plastic was at a, oh never mind.
Steve
Remember the good old “plastic maggot” CX 500 ?

Offline Two Checks

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Re: What I want them to build
« Reply #16 on: July 31, 2019, 08:50:34 AM »


Quote from: blackcat on July 30, 2019, 05:44:04 PM
"Remove wheel without removing exhaust pipe" might take some mods..”

Nope, the wheel can be taken off easily if a piece of plywood is used under the center stand. Even without the plywood, the wheel can be taken off if you slightly tilt the bike to squeeze it past the license plate.

Ya gotta lube the driveshaft coupler anyway, remove the bevel drive and the wheel comes out easily.
IF the axle will clear the muffler.....

« Last Edit: July 31, 2019, 08:52:58 AM by Two Checks »
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