what happens if.....

[azguzzirep]

You run your EV totally out of gas? It has an internal tank fuel pump that is cooled by the gasoline. Would it get damaged if it got hot?

Reason for the question is, last weekend I was riding with the gas light on. I stopped to refuel and put in 14 litres of gas. One guy with us complained that I could have gone farther, to another gas station that sold the gas he wanted to buy, and I had a 17litre tank,and wah, wah,wah.(I had ridden over 20km with the light on)

I told him I wasn't sure how much further I could have ridden and I didn't want the fuel pump to get hot from being exposed to air.

[pehayes]

Tom: What year is your EV?  I thought you had a 98?  I don't think they went internal until 2004???   Early ones had an external fuel pump under the left side cover.  No cooling effect there.  Meanwhile, our 98EV's will both easily do about 40 miles with the light on.  I once stretched mine to 54 miles until it died one block from a gas station (Tonopah, NV).  If you do run out, you can't just refill and restart.  The fuel filter is likely empty and it takes time to refill that before the pressure builds in the injectors.  Hit the kill switch on/off several times to cycle the fuel pump and refill/pressurize the system before trying to start.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

[azguzzirep]

Patrick, yes it's a 98. So how many litres is the tank and how many litres are in reserve?

Thanks!

[pete roper]

Running any fuel pump dry isn't a good idea but neither is it going to be sudden death. As for yer mate? What a numpty! He wanted 'Different' fuel? Well why didn't he just say he didn't like that brand and he'd fill up a few Km later? What did he think was going to happen? Does his willy drop off if he doesn't use a certain type of petrol? His hair catch fire? His underpants explode?

I've never heard of such a lot of pompous drivel!

Pete

[azguzzirep]

Pete, ya, he wanted super premium plus and all this station had was super.

Happened once before with an HD rider friend. He wouldn't fill up at the local station had to have the gasoline from Shell or some place. Arco gas wasn't good enough for his HD.

[calfruit]

I go on a small group ride to Death Valley each winter (8 to 10 riders)  An ever changing group, one year a couple H-D riders joined. We always stay at Stove Pipe Wells. The gas station there only carries regular gas and we usually arrive with about 1/2 tanks of fuel.  We have always filled with regular and been on our way. The next morning we went to fuel up and the H-D riders had a fit.  No regular for our motos. We were heading north for the day and the only other fuel in the valley was s/e at Furnase Creek, about 25 miles away. They were advised to do as they please, they could always catch up with us later. Never saw them again that weekend.

[Lannis]

I ride with a guy who, for reasons of principle having to do with water quality in Alaskan fjords and incompetent steering of large ships, will not buy Exxon gasoline.   I expect he'd ride by one on a pretty low tank to get to the Shell station 5 miles up the road.

Anyone riding with me will ride past Cracker Barrels and McDonalds to get something to eat even if we're hungry, so I know the feeling ...

Lannis

[azguzzirep]

I'd pass by a McDonald's too.

[normzone]

I'm a fuel snob, Chevron is my current favorite and Shell a reliable go-to. You can run on other brands, they just don't taste or smell as good.

[Ncdan]

Sounds like some of y'all's friends need to have to walk to the next fueling station now and then so as not to be so picky.

[Lannis]

Sounds like some of y'all's friends need to have to walk to the next fueling station now and then so as not to be so picky.

For the things I really believe in, I can be a really stubborn SOB when it comes to "I'm not going in one of those, even if I DO have walk/go hungry/stay thirsty."

I've usually found that it's worth it ..... !

Lannis

[ejs]

Patrick, yes it's a 98. So how many litres is the tank and how many litres are in reserve?

Thanks!

Ca. 19 litre total and of that is 4 litre reserve.

[pehayes]

Patrick, yes it's a 98. So how many litres is the tank and how many litres are in reserve?

Tom:  I wouldn't worry about the number of liters in reserve.  What you need to know is the DISTANCE for YOUR bike.  The float/light system for low fuel is a rather crude instrument and its activation may vary significantly from bike to bike.  If I say X and you drive Y and run out of fuel you're going to be pissed at me.  I can only report what MY bike does and you can use that to guide your own personal judgement and research.  I can easily get 40 miles on the light and might push over 50 if I drive VERY GENTLY.  I would suggest you buy a small fuel container of a few liters and carry that with you.  Note the mileage when your light first goes on.  Drive until it sputters to the side of the road and read that mileage.  Now you know what YOUR bike will do.  Add the two liters and go find a station to fill up.  I wouldn't recommend this technique in the middle of Nevada.  Regina used to panic and start searching for a station as soon as her light ignited.  She's gradually learned to accept at least 35 miles before worrying.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

[pete roper]

Pete, ya, he wanted super premium plus and all this station had was super.

Happened once before with an HD rider friend. He wouldn't fill up at the local station had to have the gasoline from Shell or some place. Arco gas wasn't good enough for his HD.

Dunno what it's like in the US, worse than here I think, but while we rarely get really *Bad* fuel when you head off not the real outback the fuel that is available is often only 91 RON nominally and may of been in the tanks a while as most vehicles out there are diesels. 

Having explained that I've never had a problem with fuel that couldn't burn! When we were travelling en-masse on Grisos out west past Wilcania we picked up some fairly ordinary petrol at a couple of servos. Yes, it caused the bikes to detonate a bit so you had to be judicious with the throttle but the problem was obvious and easily addressed. Once we'd filled up again with 95-98 in Broken Hill it was the end of the problem.

All it takes is a bit of mechanical sympathy and an understanding of what your engine is doing. If you can't work that out you'd be better off travelling on the 'Short Bus'!

Pete

[oldbike54]

 No idea why a modern Harley needs anything more than 87 octane MON/RON . Hate to say this , most HD riders think they own high performance motorbikes instead of the ditch pumps they really are 

 Dusty

[Chuck in Indiana]

I ride with a guy who, for reasons of principle having to do with water quality in Alaskan fjords and incompetent steering of large ships, will not buy Exxon gasoline.   I expect he'd ride by one on a pretty low tank to get to the Shell station 5 miles up the road.

Anyone riding with me will ride past Cracker Barrels and McDonalds to get something to eat even if we're hungry, so I know the feeling ...

Lannis

Neither will I. I remember Karen Silkwood, too. I'll walk before I buy Exxon, although the managers at that time are probably dead.
Now, I'm boycotting BP for the deepwater horizon. I'll bring them to their knees, too. 

[Lannis]

Neither will I. I remember Karen Silkwood, too. I'll walk before I buy Exxon, although the managers at that time are probably dead.
Now, I'm boycotting BP for the deepwater horizon. I'll bring them to their knees, too. 

Gotta be careful, you start boycotting ALL the oil companies that have something stinky in their background, you'll have to start distilling your own fuel.   

I'll bet Shell and Chevron and all the rest have got dirty secrets they're not telling us ... !   Yet.

But you're right - you can't take care of every problem in the world, you can only control what you can control, and that starts with who you open your wallet for .... !

As far as octane, I do the same as I do for oil - I burn whatever's recommended by the maker.  For the newer tourers, it's 87 octane more often than not.   For the old nails, since there isn't any such thing as the fuel they sold when they were made, I set the ignition timing so that it won't "ping" on the fuel I can get on the road and roll on.   

Lannis

[Arizona Wayne]

When I ride with picky other riders, whether it be food or gas brand, they buy what suits them and I buy what suits me if possible.  Never regretted my decisions.   

Have ridden with a `97 Cali. EFI rider who had never ran out of gas so didn't know his reserve fuel capacity. In fact his bike still had a reserve pet cock switch + a fuel light.  Every time that light came on he was convinced he was going to run out of fuel if he didn't get more gas quick.  1 time he had no choice but ride until a gas station was available to fuel up.  Only then did he find out how far he could ride before he actually ran out of gas.

I carry an extra 1 gal. of fuel just in case so I know how far I can go before I run out of gas.  If you do that this subject is a non issue. 

[azguzzirep]

I had the idea to run the bike empty to see how far it went with the god light on. I did it before in AZ with my G5.

Next sunny day....

[maquette]

With a '98EV why not just fill up when you're within a known range of your bike? Say 150-180 miles? Your friends don't like it, get new friends, or ride solo.

[azguzzirep]

With a '98EV why not just fill up when you're within a known range of your bike? Say 150-180 miles? Your friends don't like it, get new friends, or ride solo.

I usually can get to where I'm going without filling up during the tide.. I tank up before leaving and all is good. I told the guy leading us I wanted to gas up, but he asked if I could make it another 25 miles or so, and since the light was not on yet, I said I could. I 'might' have made it to the second station, but being from  AZ, I tanked at the first opportunity.

And, like my friends...

[Chuck in Indiana]

I'm a fuel snob, Chevron is my current favorite and Shell a reliable go-to. You can run on other brands, they just don't taste or smell as good.

I can see we're going to get along famously. 

[jcctx]

Really wish you folks would not boycott Shell or BP; they are the only ones paying a decent dividend! Important to us that "lives off our savings" in our dotage!!!

[Lannis]

Really wish you folks would not boycott Shell or BP; they are the only ones paying a decent dividend! Important to us that "lives off our savings" in our dotage!!!

Hey, I'M not boycotting them; us old "fixed income" guys "living off the fat of the land" need for folks to "keep those cards and letters coming!"

Feels a little funny not being able to just work more for more money like I used to ... but feels even better not having to work at ALL!! 

Lannis

[Chuck in Indiana]

I don't have any gripe with Shell..
I'll continue to vote with my wallet.

[jbell]

Running out of fuel with an "in the tank fuel pump" is never a good idea.  The fuel does indeed help cool the pump, but as stated by Pete, it won't be sudden catastrophe, it will only shorten the life of the pump a bit and make restarting harder.

[rodekyll]

The external pump is also cooled by the fuel going through it.  But for the amount of time the bike will run with the pump dry, I doubt that there would be any damage.