Author Topic: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?  (Read 9052 times)

Online Matt Story

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Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« on: January 03, 2015, 12:38:18 PM »
It only took 6 hours to take apart.  It looks like it may be 6 years to put it back together.  Who knows how many hours.

I took my 850T apart in May of 2009.  It was instigated by a bad clutch.  Had wanted to do a restoration for a long time and I was laid off and had the time.  Luckily, I found work the next year, and I haven't had that kind of time since.

With exception of the rear hub assy, most everything has been dis-assembled and either has or will be gone thru.  The body and frame have been painted, powder coated.  Some plating has been done, and some improvements along the way.  The trans is rebuilt, and as of this week, the motor is nearly assembled.

Just last week I upgraded to a natural gas furnace (from wood burner) and now it is so much easier to get out there to work.  This will make working in the evenings very easy through the winter instead of heating with the wood stove.  Lots of progress has been made in my last week off.  I can see the light at the end of the tunnel and am starting to get excited.  There is a long way to go.

So, I ask those who have done it before, what is the best assy order practice to get my major assemblies back into a motorcycle?

How far should I build up the engine before marrying with the frame?  -or- What if anything I should leave until its in the frame?

Should the engine and trans be bolted together first?  What order should the front and rear suspension be added into the mix?

Are there any non-obvious 'gotcha' items that need to be done in a certain order?

My frame is currently all loose pieces.

Has anyone written a guide to follow form where I am?

Thanks,

Matt
'75 850T - First & only owner
'77 Honda CB750 Supersport
'02 BMW R1150RT

Flint, MI

Offline Antietam Classic Cycle

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #1 on: January 03, 2015, 01:03:47 PM »
I don't know about "best", but I prefer to assemble the engine "long-block" with clutch, mate the transmission to it, install lower frame rails and centerstand, then mate the main frame to that. I also find it easier to install the coils, regulator and rectifier (assuming their locations are similar to the V7 Sport) to the frame before it's mated with the engine/trans/lower frame sub-assembly.

This photo album of Tom Pepper's V7 Sport may help. It kind of bounces around, but it'll give you an idea.

http://www.antietamclassiccycle.com/toms_v7_sport/
Charlie

Offline fotoguzzi

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #2 on: January 03, 2015, 01:04:57 PM »
Mate the tranny to the motor with it tipped on the front so your dropping tranny gear into clutch , this way you can jiggle things into place as the splines mate. Have trans in gear so you can turn it to meet teeth of the
gear as it settles into cluch. I just did so with Bones this morning.
He has blocks under motor/ trans so it's about the height of bike when assembled. Next he will mount lower frame and c stand. Then drop frame over top.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2015, 01:25:49 PM by fotoguzzi »
MINNEAPOLIS, MN

canuck750

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #3 on: January 03, 2015, 01:32:02 PM »
Like Charlie says,

A few small things learned from trial and error,

Use new rivets to re-install the frame ID tag if you removed it for painting the frame

Install the swing arm before you install the foot peg brackets (foot rest nuts will bind with the swing arm as you wiggle the swing arm into position)

Install the plastic inner fender to the frame before you install the swing arm (bottom two 6mm bolts and nuts are hard to get to with the swing arm in place)

Attach the high tension leads to the coils and then install the coils onto the frame before you install the engine (unless you have real long elastic hands this will save you some grief)

Install the electrical sub-harness to the rectifier and regulator including the ground wire before you install the reg/rec assembly into the frame and then install the assy prior to installing the motor.

Install the front fender brackets and fender before you put the front wheel on (sounds obvious but ...)

Install the main wire harness and sub harnesses before you attach the headlight (its easier to plug in the headlight before you bolt the bucket to the fork ears)

Cheers
Jim

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #3 on: January 03, 2015, 01:32:02 PM »

Offline acogoff

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #4 on: January 03, 2015, 02:37:37 PM »
     It doesn't matter because what ever you put together, you will have done in the wrong sequence anyway and will have to take it apart again. Consider it a rite of passage. We have all done it.
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Online Matt Story

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #5 on: January 03, 2015, 04:15:38 PM »
Oops. too late on this one...  They seem to be solid though.

Use new rivets to re-install the frame ID tag if you removed it for painting the frame
'75 850T - First & only owner
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'02 BMW R1150RT

Flint, MI

Offline Chuck in Indiana

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #6 on: January 03, 2015, 07:25:49 PM »
     It doesn't matter because what ever you put together, you will have done in the wrong sequence anyway and will have to take it apart again. Consider it a rite of passage. We have all done it.

 ;D :+1
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Offline earemike

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #7 on: January 05, 2015, 12:15:25 AM »


Has anyone written a guide to follow form where I am?



Thanks for posting this question Matt,  ;-T I'll be reading intently as I prepare for reassembly.
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Online Old Jock

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #8 on: January 05, 2015, 03:22:01 AM »
Hi Matt

The way I do it is, I don't know if its the best or correct but its worked for me

Engine - get Pete's guide to engine disassembly & assembly here

http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzitech.dk/gb_en_complex-technical_engine-strip-pictures.htm

Gearbox

My guide (not so good and not in Pete's class, but handy none the less)

http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzitech.dk/gb_en_complex-technical_gearbox-rebuilding-pictures.htm

Shimming guide by Pete here

http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzitech.dk/gb_en_complex-technical_gearbox-shimming-pictures.htm

Build both separately then mate them back together via the clutch

Once engine gearbox is built you have a good block for putting the rest of the bike around it. Frame next followed by headstock & triple tree

After that you don't need any more advice you'll know what to do and the build will gather its own momentum. You planning to use the old loom? I hear that Gregg Bender is doing looms or rewire yourself depending on how adventurous you feel

John

Offline mtiberio

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #9 on: January 05, 2015, 07:30:11 AM »
on a tonti, I bolt tranny to engine, and then put lower rails onto the engine/trans assy, lower rear transmission/centerstand mount bolt up finger tight, front simple held in place by a couple of screwdrivers or bolts used as locating pins.

do not have the batter tray bolted to the frame as you lay the mess over the engine/tranny/lower rail assy.

as someone suggested, get the swingarm on (no  rear drive) before you put the footpeg bolts all the way through. (you can insert until flush with the inner surface). One might be able to be inserted all the way and held with a nut, I can't remember.
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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #10 on: January 05, 2015, 11:48:37 AM »
Lots of good info posted here, I'll definitely save this thread for when/if I do restore my bike all the way. Small question... Can the lower frame rails be easily removed without too many other parts coming off (engine)? I want to get them powder coated along with the floorboard.

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Offline mtiberio

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2015, 12:36:58 PM »
they can be removed. what your def of "too many other parts" is open to discussion. Exhaust, footpegs and centerstand come to mind.
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Offline Groover

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2015, 12:52:08 PM »
Perfect, thanks! That I can handle!
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Offline JoeW

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2015, 12:52:45 PM »
This is a slideshow of my first V7 Sport build. The early pictures will show progression of assembly. The work stand comes in handy!
http://s1146.photobucket.com/user/jwalano/slideshow/74%20V7Sport
Joe Walano

Online Matt Story

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2015, 11:06:55 PM »
Thanks everyone.

Jock,

As a matter of fact I followed all three of those guides.  I will be giving Greg a call before long to order a harness.  He's got it down to a science.  It would make alot more work for anyone else.

Good advice and thanks Mtiberio.

No one has mentioned the starter.  Put that on after the frame is complete I'm thinking.

I'll take a look at the Joe's slides next.


Matt






'75 850T - First & only owner
'77 Honda CB750 Supersport
'02 BMW R1150RT

Flint, MI

Online Old Jock

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #15 on: January 06, 2015, 04:00:51 AM »
Could be wrong Matt but I usually put the starter on, when mating  engine to box as the starter fasteners are integral to holding the gbx and crankcase together. That's not a must it could be done later if you like

Glad you got some idea Good Luck and WE WANT  :PICS!:

John

Offline Tobit

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #16 on: January 06, 2015, 03:48:50 PM »
Did you use some form of clutch centering tool when you reassembled the flywheel / ring gear / clutch?  If not, no amount of jiggling will help in getting the transmission input shaft hub through.

Beyond that, the couple of times I've had the LeMans and engine apart, I completely reassembled the engine before building the bike around it. 

Engine & trans > lower rails & center stand > with block under oil pan and unit on centerstand > if front end still assembled in frame, wheel frame over engine/trans & hand tighten all mounting hardware > install swingarm, centering cardan joint bearing carrier housing to trans output shaft > rear shocks > rear drive unit & shaft > rear wheel and axle to center drive unit > final torque on all frame/engine/trans/swingarm/drive unit hardware > peg hangars > wiring & cables > airbox, breather, carbs and fuel lines > etc, etc,.

IIRC that is.   :D
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Offline Late to the party

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #17 on: January 07, 2015, 04:04:59 PM »
Many thanks to all who contributed to this thread. Am getting close to the same stage as Matt with my 850T and have been wondering how in heaven's name I'm going to get this thing bolted back together again.

Lateness.

Offline Testarossa

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Re: Best order to assemble an early Tonti?
« Reply #18 on: January 07, 2015, 07:09:54 PM »
In addition to the coils, install the diode board before you drop the frame on, plus everything on top of the crankcase:  the "distributor," oil feed lines, breather box. Saves some skinned knuckles later. It's also easier to torque the time chain cover before the frame gets in the way. You'll also want to install the tool boxes before the battery, or you won't be able to get at the lower nuts.
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