The most basic riding gear question .....

[Lannis]

Living in Central Oklahoma and traveling multistate from April thru November, I have settled on layering and mesh gear, with heated liners and over the top rain suits. Not uncommon to see 30 to 100's sometimes in the same day and off and on rain. Tried the one suit fit all and didn't like it as I almost always felt it was a compromise and only was "right" a few hours per day. For me stopping and adjusting gear in extremes is the best choice.

Tried the one suit fit all and didn't like it as I almost always felt it was a compromise and only was "right" a few hours per day.   

Yes, that's the biggest downside to the really nice Aerostich and Klim gear, I think.

But for a month on the road, I don't think we have room for separate mesh, fleece, electric, and rain stuff .... for two of us ?

Lannis

[pressureangle]

This thread is awesome.

I'm riding FL/Seattle/Tucson/FL this summer and was giving a lot of thought to exactly this issue.

My problem is, I'm comfortable at temperatures 10-20 degrees hotter than most people, and truly suffer the cold. So most of the trip I'll be fine, but I have to carry enough cold layers to get through the mountains.
I've always ridden in leather and jeans, on the street. I had no idea you could spend so much on riding gear.

[Lannis]

I've always ridden in leather and jeans, on the street. I had no idea you could spend so much on riding gear.

I knew it could be expensive, but I didn't know how expensive until an English riding friend, my age with my same riding habits, same spending habits (semi-cheap usually) and who always wore the same sort of gear I did except all his jackets are leather, his pants were jeans, and he carried a rain suit everywhere ....

... splashed out $2700 on a set of "Rukka" jacket and pants.   He swears by them, says he rides in torrential rains and never a drop of water inside the suit, perfect for him.   I don't know about the heat in those, though.

But you can spend a ton of money that way, especially if you're buying for two .... !!

Lannis

[Lannis]

Aerostich frequently has sales, especially this time of year.

If you get serious about it, naybe a call and talk to someone there and let them know what your looking for as far and size.

I like the two piece because I sometimes wear denim bottoms w/ bohn armor. Wear the bottoms w/ galluses (sometimes red).

:-)

I've considered Bohn underarmor-type gear, where the armor is built into your underwear, held tight against the skin instead of "moving around" like if it were in a jacket, and then you wear whatever you want on top.

Not to get into too much personal detail, but that would work for us only for a 1 or 2 day trip in the summertime.   Beyond that, we'd be spending a lot of extra time each day (that could be spent on riding) washing and drying our gear ... !!

Lannis

[Darren Williams]

Riding across Texas, New Mexico, Arizona  in August, 100+ temps, I wore mesh jacket with a long sleeve heavy tee shirt underneath and regularly poured water down my collar from a squeeze bottle in the tank bag. Not that bad, but have to stop at least every hour to hydrate, starting the previous days.

For cold I wear my armored mesh jacket with wind/rain liner and synergy heated jacket liner with heated gloves. Can stay comfortable down near freezing temp (along with heated grips).  Of course most of my touring bikes now have electrical systems that can power small cities, so that is not a concern. here is a thread on that too.

[pyoungbl]

Lannis, don't forget that you can get a Roadcrafter Light.  Layer up as needed for the cold days.  I have ridden in 103F temps and as long as I was moving all was good.  At any stop I shed the Roadcrafter quickly.  It made a huge difference to wear a cooling scarf....get one from Home Depot...soak that puppy in water, drape it around your neck and let the evaporation keep your core cool.  The only issue with the scarf is it gets still as a board when completely dry.  Klim is also producing some top notch riding gear that is also pretty stylish (if that's important to you).  The prices are in line with Aerostich.

Peter Y.

[Lannis]

Klim is also producing some top notch riding gear that is also pretty stylish (if that's important to you).  The prices are in line with Aerostich.

Peter Y.

I've never been particularly stylish, no reason to be concerned about what I "looked like" on the road.

But I HAVE noticed that since Fay and I are both in the market at the same time for gear, and since we always ride together on the same bike, she HAS mentioned "Wouldn't it be nice to get gear and helmets that actually matched so that it looked like we cared about it ... ?" and hints like that.

I'm old enough and smart enough now to pay attention to those "hints" these days!

As long as the bike has enough alternator to pull her electric gear in the cold, she'll be pretty easy to please in terms of functionality.   But I will pay attention to "presentation" .... It might be sort of fun.

Lannis

[Howard R]

I'm shopping everywhere I can find ...  I've had a Street and Steel "Brighton" jacket similar to what you describe, and my "Bilt" mesh jacket from Cycle Gear is reaching the end of its life.

I wore out a FirstGear Kilimanjaro jacket 2000-2010, and my Tourmaster Rincon has lasted about 8 years but is about done.   I have a heavy AGV armored leather jacket but (unlike most leather, which people find shrinks badly over the years) this one expanded over the last couple years and doesn't fit me any more.

Fay is at the end-of-life of her second Joe Rocket jacket/pants outfit, and also has a Bilt mesh jacket which needs replacing. 

Very little to our credit is the fact that normally we ride in jeans; helmet, boots, gloves, and jacket are all good, but our legs are protected only by cotton denim, which isn't good.   We're not going on our next long tour in jeans.   Kevlar jeans maybe, if we go the rainsuit route.

None of the gear above, however, is waterproof; all of it requires a rain suit if water starts coming down (or up from the highway; you get wetter from truck and pavement spray than from rain) ....

No place I'm aware of within 200 miles besides the Cycle Gear in Springfield VA has an extensive line of gear where you can try things on for size ... so it's the guess-try-return-try again on line cycle ...

Lannis

If you're willing to pay for an hour or so of time with a local tailor to be "professionally" measured, I think at least Aerostitch can use those measurements to get you the right fit the first time.  Maybe some of the other higher end manufacturers could work with that as well, if that's the way you decide to go.
 
I have gotten pretty good results lately with Tourmaster.  What I have settled on is the solid textile jacket, with removable cold liner and lots of vents.  Waterproof as well, you just have to stop to make sure you get ALL of the vents closed if you hit rain on a summer day.  I also have TM mesh pants.  They have rain/wind & cold liners, the rain liner is a major pain to use as rain pants because you have to remove the pants to deploy/remove the liner.  The internal liners are much more workable if you can at least sort-of know the day-long conditions you will face when you start out.  I usually just carry a pair of regular rain pants, much easier to get on/off on the side of the road and as an extra, added bonus the rain pants can also be used as an extra windproof layer in the cold & dry.  Such a split system might be workable for you & Fay.

Howard

[Darren Williams]

Wife and I ended up with matching jackets and both had black pants once. Made me feel weird for us to match so much, even with different helmets. I quit wearing it when riding together. Had husband/wife friends that would race a Flying Scot and they had matching foulies. We used to good nature kid them about being "twinsies".

[Lannis]

If you're willing to pay for an hour or so of time with a local tailor to be "professionally" measured, I think at least Aerostitch can use those measurements to get you the right fit the first time.  Maybe some of the other higher end manufacturers could work with that as well, if that's the way you decide to go.

Fay used to make her own clothes when she was growing up (one of those things you do when you don't have an indoor toilet or a telephone until you're a teenager!), so she's pretty good at measuring in all the right places.   Although we do know a local seamstress who's more current at it, so .... Whoever does it, it'll be a necessity for mail-order.

I have gotten pretty good results lately with Tourmaster.  What I have settled on is the solid textile jacket, with removable cold liner and lots of vents.  Waterproof as well, you just have to stop to make sure you get ALL of the vents closed if you hit rain on a summer day. 

My current (worn out) textile is a Tourmaster Rincon, and it's all you say.   When we're riding and rain approaches, Fay knows where all my vents are and can get them zipped up while we're riding, along with hers (her Joe Rocket doesn't have a back vent).

I also have TM mesh pants.  They have rain/wind & cold liners, the rain liner is a major pain to use as rain pants because you have to remove the pants to deploy/remove the liner.  The internal liners are much more workable if you can at least sort-of know the day-long conditions you will face when you start out.  I usually just carry a pair of regular rain pants, much easier to get on/off on the side of the road and as an extra, added bonus the rain pants can also be used as an extra windproof layer in the cold & dry.  Such a split system might be workable for you & Fay.

Howard

You're right about the "inner" rain liner.   I'll never forget once when we were headed north on US 15 around Gettysburg, PA.  We were riding from southern Virginia, meeting some folks in Harrisburg, and I was trying to stay on schedule. To the west, there was a really ugly squall line headed our way, fast.   We stopped in a service area to put on our wet gear "just in case" because I was sure we could outrun it; the highway was clear, and the storm pretty well defined.

So I pulled on my Frogg Toggs, glove covers, and was ready to go.   Fay took her rain liner to the ladies room since you have to pull the pants off to put the liner in.   

And I waited.   And waited.   And waited.   And the storm got closer, and looked uglier, lightning flashing constantly, and a black rain curtain appearing to the west ... and about 20 minutes after she went in, she came out right when the storm was on top of us.

We got about 3 minutes down the road before it unloaded on us, high winds, lightning, low visibility, torrential rain, all the stuff I hate riding in.   And it all could have been avoided if we could have just "ridden on" in our regular gear .... !

Lannis

[Lannis]

Wife and I ended up with matching jackets and both had black pants once. Made me feel weird for us to match so much, even with different helmets. I quit wearing it when riding together. Had husband/wife friends that would race a Flying Scot and they had matching foulies. We used to good nature kid them about being "twinsies".

I might mind that, but she won't!

The helmets and jackets are going to be at least half Hi-Viz yellow or green.   It's amazing how far down the road you can see that coming.   We've always opted for black (more traditional?   More options?  Doesn't show road dirt?  anyway, always black).

But having had enough experiences with noticing a motorcycle half a mile down the road because the rider is wearing high-visibility colors, we're going that way too.   Many jackets have the yellow in a sort of attractive way so you don't look like you're ready to pick up trash on the roadside or something (something I do on a regular basis!)

Lannis

[alanp]

Aerostich.  I absolutely love not having to deal with “looks like it might rain but I don’t want to stop” or “sure wasted a lot of time putting on that rain gear for nothing”.   With Aerostich you just ride and you have some of the best protection available. 

[Seventy One]

   I rode across Minnesota and South Dakota in a mesh jacket and that was enough for me. I couldn't stay hydrated no matter how much water I drank. Got pretty punchy a few times (mixing up brake and clutch lever) and actually sailed through a 4 way stop at 60mph.

   The following season I went with the Aerostich Darien 2 piece suit. That was 2013. The jacket wasn't waterproof by 2016. Washing in Nikwax had no affect. Since this seemed to be more of a Gore Tex problem than a 'stich problem I sent it in to Gore and within two days they contacted me and asked what color I want my new jacket to be. 'Stich mailed me a brand new Darien 2 months later. While I was diappointed the Gore failed I was impressed with the customer service and warranty.

   In my experience base layers get more important when dealing with wearing heavy Cordura in hot weather.

   I'd say the temp range of the jacket is (IMO) 55 to 100. You can go lower with extra layers of course. The pants are warmer. I'd say they're best between 40 and 85. Keep in mind that the Cordura fabric 'stich uses is PU (polyurethane) coated and it will melt to your skin in a long slide so they recommend wearing something under the pants to insulate the body against this. In my experience smart wool tights work well as does wicking poly/synthetic tights.

   In less oppressive heat (85 or less) I'll wear Army BDU pants under them. These are nice for off the bike or while camping because they are cool to wear, dry quickly and very tough. Look for something in either nylon or poly blend. Avoid 100% cotton. https://www.truspec.com/

   Aerostich has Bambo t-shirts and I highly recommend them. I rode from Minnesota to Tennessee last September and took just this shirt and one other. Did 8 days and only took it off to sleep and shower. At the end of the trip it still smelled nice and didn't feel gross. Normally I'd wash it in a sink along the way but this was a test and it did really well.

 http://www.aerostich.com/clothing/clothing/bamboo/bamboo-cotton-t-shirt.html

[Sheepdog]

The Aerostich gear is some of the best. The back and underarm vents work very well and the protection is top drawer. BUT...you can�t leave the vents open when it rains, so you have to stop anyway. Still, my DarienLight jacket/pants is the best rider gear I�ve owned. It�s eight years old and has thousands of miles on it and I have only had to re-attach a couple of Velcro patches to keep it as new. The sleeves are a little on the loose side (they catch a great deal of air when I ride my BMW), but the latest version has Velcro straps to tighten them down. Next time, I�ll probably purchase the standard model, as it is reputed to hold up better in a fall. These suits are as good a compromise as I have found.

[Lannis]

   I rode across Minnesota and South Dakota in a mesh jacket and that was enough for me. I couldn't stay hydrated no matter how much water I drank. Got pretty punchy a few times (mixing up brake and clutch lever) and actually sailed through a 4 way stop at 60mph.

Closest I came to passing out in my life was on a ride on my BSA A10 from home here in southern VA to eastern Pennsylvania (Ruff Creek/Prosperity) one hot hot day.   I had on my mesh jacket and took a pint of water, rode up US250/I-79).

Wasn't enough.  By the time I stopped in the tavern where we were meeting, I was barely functioning.   Realized I hadn't pee'd in 7 hours and still didn't need to, got up from the table and had to grab a column to stay upright. 

Luckily it was my riding buddies, they figured out what was happening, didn't make a fuss (although conventional wisdom would say they should have) grabbed me and sat me back down with a quart of ice water and a big chocolate bar.   In 30 minutes I was OK again, but no more long trips on hot days with mesh for me.   You almost can't drink enough to keep up ....

Lannis

[Lannis]

The Aerostich gear is some of the best. The back and underarm vents work very well and the protection is top drawer. BUT...you can�t leave the vents open when it rains, so you have to stop anyway. Still, my DarienLight jacket/pants is the best rider gear I�ve owned. It�s eight years old and has thousands of miles on it and I have only had to re-attach a couple of Velcro patches to keep it as new. The sleeves are a little on the loose side (they catch a great deal of air when I ride my BMW), but the latest version has Velcro straps to tighten them down. Next time, I�ll probably purchase the standard model, as it is reputed to hold up better in a fall. These suits are as good a compromise as I have found.

I've read about the crash protection difference between the Darien and Darien-Light ... it's another one of those comfort v. protection compromises, I suppose.    Gotta decide whether to maximize comfort for the 99% of the time, or give up a bit of comfort for the cheer-up-mate-it-may-never-happen event ....

Lannis

[drdwb]

Great topic and timely, my wife and I have been very satisfied with our Darrien stitch gear it is functional and protective, but Mary thinks at times too hot, so she frequently rides with the pant legs partially unzipped,which in my opinion isn’t optimal protection. Recently we’ve been looking at the Helite and other inflatable gear which provides an additional layer of protection. I checked out the Helite vest but over the stitch it diminishes the cooling of the Stitch venting system, which I think works well.
2 friends have invested in the newer Helite coats with built in pads similar to stitch with the air vest built in. They aren’t as hot as the stitch, one has the mesh jacket, the other a regular coat similar to a Darrien but not as long in the back. Both friends are satisfied with their choices and function,but neither has the rain protection of the stitch gear. There are several companies doing these airbag systems now. Look at the gear they are making for Horse riding now also. I think in a year or two the airbag gear will be on par with Aerostitch stuff as far as all around protection incorporating airbag tech. I’m actually surprised Aerostitch isn’t in this game yet. I’m waiting another year to update my gear.





http://www.helitemoto.com/helite-turtle-airbag-vest-black/?_vsrefdom=adwords&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI3pD9lYKX2gIVzbjACh2f6QxmEAQYAyABEgLkAvD_BwE

[Lannis]

Great topic and timely, my wife and I have been very satisfied with our Darrien stitch gear it is functional and protective, but Mary thinks at times too hot, so she frequently rides with the pant legs partially unzipped,which in my opinion isn�t optimal protection.

That's a good observation, and shows clearly that the "Space" that you and I and all the other posters here are in is in a different galaxy than "motorcycle riders" in general.

I'm concerned about the crash protection difference in different weights of armor.   You're aware of the risk increase in riding with partially unzipped gear for ventilation.   Others have photo-documented the sacrificial nature of good gear when you go down, so that you can imagine what it would be like if it weren't there.

And yet what will I see out on the road once the weather turns nice?    Pack after pack of cruiser (and Gold Wings riding as cruisers) riders out for a Sunday ride, with the guy in front in jeans, wife-beater, fingerless gloves, and an unpadded beanie, and his Old Lady up behind in a tank- or tube-top, shorts, and sandals, with a plastic Tupperware helmet.  Eighty miles per hour over 100-degree asphalt, with a guy steering that's been riding for 4 years and has 3500 miles under his belt ....

That's why I perceive that, although we're all "in the wind" "on two wheels", we're in separate universes sometimes ... I used to have one foot in it, but maturity tempered by pain sorted THAT out ... !

Lannis

[drdwb]

That's a good observation, and shows clearly that the "Space" that you and I and all the other posters here are in is in a different galaxy than "motorcycle riders" in general.

I'm concerned about the crash protection difference in different weights of armor.   You're aware of the risk increase in riding with partially unzipped gear for ventilation.   Others have photo-documented the sacrificial nature of good gear when you go down, so that you can imagine what it would be like if it weren't there.

Lannis similar observation for sure. In 1979 I read the �Hurt report� my take away is no matter how safe �You� are it�s the other drivers around you that are distracted by what ever,even more so now with cell phone texting etc... Hurt said make yourself as protected and visible as possible,in town headlight on high beam during the day and always right hand on brake ready to stop. We have 90% of the time adhered to this with combat boot over the ankle protection,leather gloves and leather coats and pants and always helmets. We�ve over the years updated our gear to better protection, better riding boots and the Aero stitch Darrien gear,and up graded helmets. Too many friends who used to be riders arent any more,one friend from high school still has occasional debre like small pebbles coming out of knees and thigh where they didnt get it all and that was from 1973. Weve been lucky and avoided involuntary get offs,but I still like being prepared. I try to remind myself whenever I get on that this may be the time so like Don Juan told Carlos Castinada � This would be a good day to die� so enjoy and appreciate it,that�s my riding attitude.
Dave

[lazlokovacs]

leather treated with dubbin, so its basically waterproof for a small shower....

if the rain settles in then whack on your rain suit... jacksonracing on this forum makes a great one, on and off in seconds

works for me

:

[Lannis]

leather treated with dubbin, so its basically waterproof for a small shower....

if the rain settles in then whack on your rain suit... jacksonracing on this forum makes a great one, on and off in seconds

works for me

:

Judging if it's going to be a small shower is the hard part!   Usually by the time I find out it ISN'T a small shower, it's too late.   Someone here did a review or video or something of that rainsuit you mention, I wasn't able to find it ... ?

Lannis

[Chuck in Indiana]

Lannis, I have two Olympia jackets.. and *on the trip you are taking* I would give the nod to the AST. Those full length sleeve vents are awesome when it is "too hot for a Stitch.."    It is very good in the heat, considering it is a "cold wet weather" jacket.
http://www.canyonchasers.net/reviews/gear/olympia-ast.php
For more "normal" local riding, I prefer their perf jacket with Gore tex liner that can be worn either outside or inside the shell.. I much prefer outside.. and a conventional thermal liner.
I am not too concerned about pants. IMHO, they are not as important as keeping your core comfortable. I wear Compacc mesh Sliders all the time, and carry waterproof overpants for (heavy) rain and cold.
For boots, Sidi On Roads.. may have been supplanted by All Roads.. are waterproof, and will last forever.
As I originally said, though, there is no perfect motorcycle gear.

[Daniel Kalal]

Lannis,

I think were I in your position, I'd get an Aerostich R3-light (it's a one-piece suit).  You did say that cost wasn't part of the decision process.  I've used an Aerostich Roadcrafter one-piece for the last 25 years in all sorts of weather.  Below 90 degrees as long as you're moving it's actually ok.  Above 90 degrees, hot is hot.

The R3 series differs from the Roadcrafter in that it doesn't have a smooth liner and all the seams are well-sealed (similar to the Darien).  It's as waterproof as any rain suit, whereas the Roacrafter has eventual limitations in an all-day rain.  The Roadcrafter is a bit warmer (from the liner).

Just recently, I decided to move on from my Roadcrafter to an R3.  I'll be riding in Ireland soon enough, and I remember my last ride through that country.  I got wet.  I drove up to Duluth to have a new suit custom fitted.  From the outside, the R3 looks just like a Roadcrafter.  The "light" version is just that.  I'm getting the regular weight.

I have my new R3, now, but haven't yet had a chance to test it in real conditions.  These things require breaking-in; I've found just wearing it around the house works pretty well.

As for carrying a separate rain-suit.  I tried that for a few years and was always out of synch with the weather--always too late or stuck with a wet thing and no place to put it.

[Lannis]

Lannis,

I think were I in your position, I'd get an Aerostich R3-light (it's a one-piece suit).  ......

  I drove up to Duluth to have a new suit custom fitted. 

Well, you've ridden in a lot of hot places (at least they LOOK hot from the photos!) so you'd know the "heat" side of the issue!   Fay's said she'd prefer a two-piece but I haven't made up my mind yet.

I think that we're leaning towards the "no rain suit" plan, for the reasons we've both mentioned.   As long as we're both doing that (and we don't have to stop for ONE of us to put on a rain suit), we may decide on really different brands and models, I don't know.

Traveling to Duluth to get fitted is quite a commitment, but considering the cost and the use it's going to get put to, that's probably a good idea.   Aerostich hasn't scheduled any planned local "Pop Ups" yet where they bring their stuff to a venue near you, and can measure you and all ....  They usually have at least one in Virginia every year ....

Lannis

[Mike Crenshaw]

Riding gear is always such a personal thing and I've tried a lot of combinations.  Riding in Texas and the Southwest we can expect two things with certainty.  Heat, and the weather to change constantly.  I've settled on the Aerostich AD1 pants because I like the Gore Tex fabric, the armor protection and the ease with which I can put them on or take them off.  The Gore Tex pants are important to me because I don't need to carry rain pants and when my crotch gets wet when wearing jeans it never dries out until I can remove the pants after the ride.  I can easily wear jean or sweat pants underneath the AD1's to keep me warm.  Access to my billfold and pockets is easy.

As for a jacket, I have two that I really like.  The TourMaster Transitions is my favorite with lots of adjustable vents and a removable liner.  But it isn't Gore Tex so I carry a rain jacket when wearing that one.  I've ridden Hwy 50 across Nevada in that jacket in July and using a water absorbent vest it works just fine.   The Klim is Gore Tex, but not so many vents, no removable liner so I carry a polar fleece that doubles for after the ride wear.  I only bought the Klim because it was on sale at 50% off due to a slight discoloration.  I am no fashionista by any stretch.  I've ridden a couple of hundred miles in the rain in the Klim and stayed quite dry.  Also I find the Klim to be not as warm in colder weather, mostly on my arms, and it also doesn't have the same degree of armor protection as the Tour Master.

[AH Fan]

So anyone out there using Ruka gear?........... looks like it would be a premium build.

Ciao

[kingoffleece]

My go to most of the time is a 'Stitch R-3 Light.  Works a treat.  For extended getaways when it's hot it a KLIM APEX jacket.  Why? Gor-Tex for the chance of rain but the APEX has these really nifty vents on the forearm.  It's a brilliant idea that works and even more so if you have significant wind coverage that blocks most air from the chest.  Those forearm vents, out away from a screen or fairing, work a treat.
And, they in no way compromise any cooling when using the He-Light vest.

Our own Moshe Levy reported that the LD Comfort hot weather solution worked very well so I'll give that a go this summer.

[Mr Pootle]

Only 20 hours and already tons of good experience and recommendations.
   Weather's funny - I've been riding in England for two weeks and never saw anything but sunshine and blue skies

Lannis

That’ll be England, Arkansas.

[Lannis]

That�ll be England, Arkansas.

We're just lucky that way.   When we toured Nova Scotia, including Cape Breton Island and the Cabot Trail, we had brilliant clear skies for three solid days.   So many people make the long ride up there, and then it's socked in solid and you might was well be riding on Bug Tussle Pike as the Cabot Trail for all you can see ....

We did spend a week on the Isle of Man, and it never stopped raining except in the evening for running the race bikes ....

Lannis

[Chuck in Indiana]

We're just lucky that way.   When we toured Nova Scotia, including Cape Breton Island and the Cabot Trail, we had brilliant clear skies for three solid days.   So many people make the long ride up there, and then it's socked in solid and you might was well be riding on Bug Tussle Pike as the Cabot Trail for all you can see ....

We did spend a week on the Isle of Man, and it never stopped raining except in the evening for running the race bikes ....

Lannis

We ended up riding in the rain/fog for one of the two days on the Cabot trail. They tell me the scenery is spectacular..