2 Stroke Ban

[rschrum]

Ban nothing, except speed limits.

[guzziart]

I got tired of using my two stoke Stihl string trimmer for the 150' long ditch out front and went back to using my two stroke '78 Lawnboy.



 

[SIR REAL ED]

I got tired of using my two stoke Stihl string trimmer for the 150' long ditch out front and went back to using my two stroke '78 Lawnboy.

I love those things!!!  I can remember mowing a friends lawn back in the early 1970's with one of those that was probably 20 years old at the time.  I bought a new one about 1989 and used it here for years, but the deck wore out.  Didn't have the good old cast aluminum decks like the oldies!

[SIR REAL ED]

The gas back blower is a whole other kind of loud and w/o earmuffs would deafen you quickly. Maybe it's the blower fan and housing rather than the engine?

Right you are.  Moving air is the very definition of noise.  Same with some mowers, the blade noise (the vacuum) is louder than the engine noise.

[guzziart]

I love those things!!!  I can remember mowing a friends lawn back in the early 1970's with one of those that was probably 20 years old at the time.  I bought a new one about 1989 and used it here for years, but the deck wore out.  Didn't have the good old cast aluminum decks like the oldies!

I have a '67 I bought new when I was 13 after I roached 2 of my dad's bastard brands, I still have it, it has a magnesium deck. My '78 & '81's have aluminum decks...not as good as magnesium.  They all run!

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

I have a '67 I bought new when I was 13 after I roached 2 of my dad's bastard brands, I still have it, it has a magnesium deck. My '78 & '81's have aluminum decks...not as good as magnesium.  They all run!

I have a '59 Snow-Boy, '62 & '64 (mag deck) Lawn-Boys, '80-something (aluminum deck) and a ?? with steel deck. Been using a Toro (Suzuki built 2-stroke engine, alloy deck) this year because it's self-propelled and I'm getting lazy. 

[SIR REAL ED]

I have a '59 Snow-Boy, '62 & '64 (mag deck) Lawn-Boys, '80-something (aluminum deck) and a ?? with steel deck. Been using a Toro (Suzuki built 2-stroke engine, alloy deck) this year because it's self-propelled and I'm getting lazy. 

Charlie,

Id like to see a picture of the Toro with the Suzuki two stroke engine.  Never heard of such a beast!

I never realized the old Lawn Boy decks were magnesium!  Can't imagine anyone going that route today!

Do we need to discuss that the two stroke all come with automatic mosquito repelling features?

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Charlie,

Id like to see a picture of the Toro with the Suzuki two stroke engine.  Never heard of such a beast!

I never realized the old Lawn Boy decks were magnesium!  Can't imagine anyone going that route today!

Do we need to discuss that the two stroke all come with automatic mosquito repelling features?

Looks like this, only in not as nice condition: https://www.k-bid.com/auction/3053/item/13
It belonged to a friend's late father and was destined for the scrap heap. I "saved" it, bought a few parts, got it running and have been using it since. Heavy, good power, more complicated than a Lawn-Boy.

[Alfetta]

2 strokes noisier ??  I do a lot of dirt riding, and i can assure you that i will hear a thumper coming long before i can hear a 2 stroker.  the sound doesn't carry, and im not sure a DB meter  will actually indicate them as louder (never preformed such a test myself).

I will say that the sound that a 2 stroke makes may be more offensive to the human ear than the sound a thumper makes, but louder is relative..

IMHO 2 strokes are the ultimate engine design, and they can be just as clean as a modern 4 stroker. But this debate would probably need it's own thread.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Then there's this... https://youtu.be/JVfqqSbB3Po

[Canuck750]

I have to admit I broke down and bought a Sthil back pack blower last fall I went to buy a battery powered unit to blow snow and after trying it out I returned it the same day, had to take an in store credit and went for the mid range unit. It works super well blowing up to 4” of snow with no effort. It blows leaves like nothing else. It’s bloody noisy but I do both my neighbour’s walks to make up for the racket

[demet]

The older I get the less tolerance I have for loud machines dedicated to supporting the massive gut of some dork that inherited their money ;-) Rakes and goats are the future of property maintenance IMHO. Fight me.

[SIR REAL ED]

The older I get the less tolerance I have for loud machines dedicated to supporting the massive gut of some dork that inherited their money ;-) Rakes and goats are the future of property maintenance IMHO. Fight me.

 

That's why I prefer to hang out with old people.  Hard to say which are more fun, those who get less and less tolerant of others as they get older, or those who care less and less for the opinions of others as they get older.

The best part is neither are shy about "Telling it to you straight!" after they jump to conclusions or turn their filters up to 100%.

Few things are more fun than having a ringside seat to two or more old guys who don't give a damn what the other one's think!  Especially when they have been best friends for decades!!

Unfortunately, the internet filters out all the descriptive body language, and the printed word doesn't convey more than a fraction of actual intent.

[Old Jock]

Just to set it straight, I don't believe 2 strokes should be banned

I just said I'm surprised some agency or country hasn't, as the media focuses lazer like on global warming and the rhetoric beomes hysteric

I have no idea if its my advancing years, or perhaps some other factor, but I percieve a great deal more intolerance in general and don't understand where all the aggression is coming from.

I do get an insight though when next door's gardeners fire up multiple 2 stroke strimmers, trimmers and leaf blowers.

It sounds like a 70s 500 GP race is taking place outside my window at 7:30, heh I'm retired and entitled to sleep late if I want now and again

Is there some underlying reason that these small engines need to be so loud, most of them can easily be heard 1/4 mile of away?

I've never said a word to them about it, live and let live, it's not like it's life threatening.

They in turn say nothing when I'm balancing my throttle bodies on a peaceful Sunday which is probably equally annoying to them.

John

[mechanicsavant]

I find it odd that no one mentioned adequate mufflers ! Ever notice how quiet some of the Honda equipment is?
I understand price point is a large motive with Mfgr. Maybe there’s a niche market out there for noise reduction kits ? Just saying .

[Vagrant]

There are quiet units, but, it turns them into pigs so nobody buys them.

[Madtownguzzi]

Here is a real two stroke. SCREAMING JIMMY! 16cyl 2 Stroke Detroit Diesel 16v71
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxLb3Yqqds4

[Rough Edge racing]

 Houses are spaced out around here. It seems everyone including the hillbillies has a zero turn mower with 25 plus Hp gas engines .The sound of the blades is extremely loud.. We have a 1986 John Deere 20 hp Diesel lawn tractor. Despite the clattering pre chamber engine ,when mowing it's quieter than a zero turn and uses half the fuel...My wife has a walk behind 4 stroke string trimmer thats used more a mower....Every year we mow less.

[SIR REAL ED]

I have no idea if its my advancing years, or perhaps some other factor, but I percieve a great deal more intolerance in general and don't understand where all the aggression is coming from.

John

I have similar perceptions.  I suspect a lot of the change is due to generational differences and the result of technology, specifically social media/the internet.

As a child, most of the adults in my life, and the adults in lives of my peers, lived thru WWI, the Great Depression, and WWII.  The obvious result of experiencing the real hardship they faced was they did not suffer whiners and crybabies gladly.  I remember the expressions:
"Children should be seen and not heard!" 
"This is a free country.  Everyone is entitle to their opinion!"
"You are offended?  Why don't you grow up?"
"Quit yer whining or I'll give you something to whine about!"

IMO, back then, intolerance was seen as a lack of self-awareness, self-reflection, emotional maturity, and just plain old polite manners.  Talk is cheap.  Quit crying and roll up your sleeves and start fixing the problem!

Now (last 15 years?), IMO, criticism of everyone and everything is a symptom of chic elitism.  In my experience, today, the people I know who are upset and intolerant, view themselves as more nuanced and sophisticated than the person who thinks other people are entitled to different perspectives.

I think a lot of it has to do with Social Media.  So many view themselves as activists, crusaders, brands to be marketed, and constantly-on-stage.  I think the old expression was "Living in their front windows."  It also reminds me of the phrase "Sea Gull Management!" or "Sea Gull Experts!"

IMO, it is easier and less contenscious to simply communicate face to face.  That alone might be the biggest factor.  Beyond a few hundred yards..... everything gets foggy!  Imaginations are stimulated.

As I like to say "There is no common ground in cyberspace!"     

[Old Jock]

I have similar perceptions.  I suspect a lot of the change is due to generational differences and the result of technology, specifically social media/the internet.

As a child, most of the adults in my life, and the adults in lives of my peers, lived thru WWI, the Great Depression, and WWII.  The obvious result of experiencing the real hardship they faced was they did not suffer whiners and crybabies gladly.  I remember the expressions:
"Children should be seen and not heard!" 
"This is a free country.  Everyone is entitle to their opinion!"
"You are offended?  Why don't you grow up?"
"Quit yer whining or I'll give you something to whine about!"

IMO, back then, intolerance was seen as a lack of self-awareness, self-reflection, emotional maturity, and just plain old polite manners.  Talk is cheap.  Quit crying and roll up your sleeves and start fixing the problem!

Now (last 15 years?), IMO, criticism of everyone and everything is a symptom of chic elitism.  In my experience, today, the people I know who are upset and intolerant, view themselves as more nuanced and sophisticated than the person who thinks other people are entitled to different perspectives.

I think a lot of it has to do with Social Media.  So many view themselves as activists, crusaders, brands to be marketed, and constantly-on-stage.  I think the old expression was "Living in their front windows."  It also reminds me of the phrase "Sea Gull Management!" or "Sea Gull Experts!"

IMO, it is easier and less contenscious to simply communicate face to face.  That alone might be the biggest factor.  Beyond a few hundred yards..... everything gets foggy!  Imaginations are stimulated.

As I like to say "There is no common ground in cyberspace!"   

 

[Wayne Orwig]

What is the obsession with leaf blowers?
I think it is mostly just a way to make noise that others can hear, like putting flatulent exhaust systems on a motorcycle.

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=annoying+thing+audio&&view=detail&mid=1CAB91A3758B2671EFD51CAB91A3758B2671EFD5&rvsmid=F245D8DB63A18B36DC39F245D8DB63A18B36DC39&FORM=VDRVRV

[larrys]

I have similar perceptions.  I suspect a lot of the change is due to generational differences and the result of technology, specifically social media/the internet.

As a child, most of the adults in my life, and the adults in lives of my peers, lived thru WWI, the Great Depression, and WWII.  The obvious result of experiencing the real hardship they faced was they did not suffer whiners and crybabies gladly.  I remember the expressions:
"Children should be seen and not heard!" 
"This is a free country.  Everyone is entitle to their opinion!"
"You are offended?  Why don't you grow up?"
"Quit yer whining or I'll give you something to whine about!"

IMO, back then, intolerance was seen as a lack of self-awareness, self-reflection, emotional maturity, and just plain old polite manners.  Talk is cheap.  Quit crying and roll up your sleeves and start fixing the problem!

Now (last 15 years?), IMO, criticism of everyone and everything is a symptom of chic elitism.  In my experience, today, the people I know who are upset and intolerant, view themselves as more nuanced and sophisticated than the person who thinks other people are entitled to different perspectives.

I think a lot of it has to do with Social Media.  So many view themselves as activists, crusaders, brands to be marketed, and constantly-on-stage.  I think the old expression was "Living in their front windows."  It also reminds me of the phrase "Sea Gull Management!" or "Sea Gull Experts!"

IMO, it is easier and less contenscious to simply communicate face to face.  That alone might be the biggest factor.  Beyond a few hundred yards..... everything gets foggy!  Imaginations are stimulated.

As I like to say "There is no common ground in cyberspace!"   

I am convinced that humans, as a species are not mentally equipped to effectively manage a world with planet wide instant communication. Before the innanet, people with stupid and uninformed opinions didn't get heard beyond their neighborhood bar or grocery store. Now they can publish their stupid and uninformed opinion planet wide, instantly. Then 100,000 equally stupid and uninformed people read that opinion, and go, " He thinks just like me, I must be right!" and that's the root of most of the stupid drama that we see.
Larry

[larrys]

What is the obsession with leaf blowers?
I think it is mostly just a way to make noise that others can hear, like putting flatulent exhaust systems on a motorcycle.

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=annoying+thing+audio&&view=detail&mid=1CAB91A3758B2671EFD51CAB91A3758B2671EFD5&rvsmid=F245D8DB63A18B36DC39F245D8DB63A18B36DC39&FORM=VDRVRV

Sounds like you've not had to rake an acre or two of leaf strewn yard every year. Jes sayin'...
Larry

[blackcat]

I am convinced that humans, as a species are not mentally equipped to effectively manage a world with planet wide instant communication. Before the innanet, people with stupid and uninformed opinions didn't get heard beyond their neighborhood bar or grocery store. Now they can publish their stupid and uninformed opinion planet wide, instantly. Then 100,000 equally stupid and uninformed people read that opinion, and go, " He thinks just like me, I must be right!" and that's the root of most of the stupid drama that we see.
Larry

True.

[egschade]

I find it odd that no one mentioned adequate mufflers ! Ever notice how quiet some of the Honda equipment is?
I understand price point is a large motive with Mfgr. Maybe there’s a niche market out there for noise reduction kits ? Just saying .

My father and I have the same Honda HRX217 mower. Mine is quiet, his is noisy - go figure...

[Wayne Orwig]

Sounds like you've not had to rake an acre or two of leaf strewn yard every year. Jes sayin'...
Larry

I like my leaves right where they fall.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

My main use of a leaf blower is to clean my rain gutters and downspouts, without having to climb a ladder. I bought a long extension with nozzle at the top which fits into my leaf blower. I can already hear what's coming next: "<If you had Leaf Guard or Gutter Helmet or (fill in the blank with whatever brand you favor) you wouldn't get leaves in them!" 

I do use it as intended - to blow leaves into rows, which I then pulverize with my Gravely. There are lots of leaves too, since none of my neighbors gives a crap (even the Baptist church across the road) and if I didn't do something with them, they would cover the front of the house up to the windows.

As far as noise levels: the electric Toro blower I had previous to my current Husqvarna was actually louder. The Husky engine is quiet and catalyst equipped, the impeller obviously better designed.

Yeah, I just like to "make noise that others can hear" 

[SIR REAL ED]

The logical old school answer to a neighbor who complains about how loud your lawn care equipment is, or at what time of day you decide to perform your lawn care is:

"If you don't like that my equipment is loud, or when I am working....... Why don't you get your ass over here and take care of my property with your own equipment at a time that is convenient time for you?"

If they don't follow thru and do it themselves, then they aren't very good neighbors......

[SIR REAL ED]

I am convinced that humans, as a species are not mentally equipped to effectively manage a world with planet wide instant communication. Before the innanet, people with stupid and uninformed opinions didn't get heard beyond their neighborhood bar or grocery store. Now they can publish their stupid and uninformed opinion planet wide, instantly. Then 100,000 equally stupid and uninformed people read that opinion, and go, " He thinks just like me, I must be right!" and that's the root of most of the stupid drama that we see.
Larry

I agree.  That is kinda what I mean when I say there is no common ground in cyberspace.

The two analogies I like are
1.  The Rorschach ink blot test, and the fable about the four blind men touching the elephant.   Each of our worlds are filled with our own personal ink blots. 
2,  The internet is billions of blind men touching their own personal elephant and then assumes the world they experience is the same world everyone else experiences.

The other thought is the person who spends hours stewing over someone's comment, rarely realize that the comment was probably the result of a few milliseconds of thought.

The response of my childhood mentors would be something to the effect of "So you spent several hours or days being upset about a comment that somebody made that probably didn't have even a few seconds of thought behind it.......  Whaddaya stupid?"
Me: