Author Topic: Opinions for a sport tourer pls  (Read 12513 times)

Offline boatdetective

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #30 on: July 12, 2016, 07:38:28 PM »
One of the coffee klutch guys as a VFR1200 and rides the snot out of it but recently picked up an older (2004?) SV650 and that is pretty much all we see him on now.

I'd have you take a look see at the CB1100. She is a sleeper, very low key when out and about and super easy to ride in town. Get the rpms up and the frisky red head comes out. Being a true standard, she does a lot of different things.

I've always admired the CB1100. Fabulous looking and painful attention to detail. There's a custom out there that is rumored to go into production.  I'll have to look it up. A bit ore of an "angry" look. However, the original red bike is wonderful to look at.
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Offline boatdetective

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #31 on: July 12, 2016, 07:44:20 PM »
Great variety of responses- thank you!  Once again, this group shows a great depth of experience as well as a willingness to accept all types of machines.

I'm on a road trip for work (in a Ford🙁). Pulled into the motel and there's an older guy on an F800GS with Iowa plates. Totally experienced road warrior. The bike has serious wabi and Caribou /Pelican bags.
Jonathan K
Marblehead, MA

1981 V50III "Gina"
2007 Griso 1100 "Bluto" (departed but not forgotten)
2003 EV "Lola" gone to the "Ridin' Realtor" in Peoria
2007 1200 Sport "Ginger"

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Offline Lotsahorses

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #32 on: July 12, 2016, 07:49:41 PM »
 :1: for the ST3.
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Offline Cool Runnings

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #33 on: July 12, 2016, 08:48:55 PM »
Great variety of responses- thank you!  Once again, this group shows a great depth of experience as well as a willingness to accept all types of machines.

I'm on a road trip for work (in a Ford🙁). Pulled into the motel and there's an older guy on an F800GS with Iowa plates. Totally experienced road warrior. The bike has serious wabi and Caribou /Pelican bags.

Get an old Kwacker connie (cheap as hell).  :evil:


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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #33 on: July 12, 2016, 08:48:55 PM »

Offline charlie b

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #34 on: July 12, 2016, 09:12:50 PM »
Well, if dreaming, SPIII.
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Offline Hugh Straub

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #36 on: July 12, 2016, 09:39:02 PM »
As many former first generation Concours owners have discovered, the Honda NT 700 V is a fine touring bike which weighs about 100 pounds less than the Concours, handles better though not quite as quick.  Cheap, reliable (it's a Honda after all) and for those preferring European iron, it's made by Montessa in Spain. Worth a look.

Brgds

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Offline Bulldog9

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #37 on: July 12, 2016, 10:14:41 PM »
So many variables.

Are you looking new? used? and how old? Price range? What is medium sized to you? Weight? Size?  REAL fairing or 1/2 fairing? Why not a Norge?  Depending on how big you are will determine how 'big' a bike feels to you, and how stable. IMO, the BMW f800 though a nice bike would not be for someone over 170lbs for more than a commuter. Same for VFR.

You mention the F800 and VFR, both new, so I am guessing you are willing to lay down some coin.

The only new Japanese ST with any soul are the FJR (likely too big), and the FZ1(sets up very nice with bags, and Canada had lowers available as well), maybe the VFR with a nice can and new fuel map, but the rest are so bland....... generic, vanilla...........

New: Triumph Tiger, Aprilia Caponord with the travel pack, Multi Strada are all great midsize options, with great motors with a bit of the Adventure thing, but not like the goofy GS.
The R 1200 GT or RS are midsize BMW ST, and very nice. The Honda VC700 and Suzuki GSX 1000 get good press. A buddy of mine got the MV Turismo VELOCE 800. Is kinda weird, but he loves it. Too small for me.

Used:  Gen 2 FJR, Sprint ST, Gen 1 Concours C10, are all good options as well.

It really is what YOU want..... GO ride and buy. 

You need to go ride!
« Last Edit: July 12, 2016, 10:33:39 PM by Bulldog9 »
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Offline kirkemon

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #38 on: July 12, 2016, 10:27:23 PM »
To answer your question, yes, I've had experience on a F800.

Rode one 800 miles from Munich into Italy, Switzerland, Austria, over a few different passes. Great bike plenty of punch, only the seat was a little high for me. The belt drive seemed flawless.
No experience with the Honda.
Kirk

Offline charlie b

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #39 on: July 13, 2016, 07:18:48 AM »
My brother had the GS version and liked it.  It was his 'beginner' bike so now he has the boxer GS.  He can flat foot the big GS where I cannot.  The little GS was quite a bit faster than my T5.
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Offline Kev m

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #40 on: July 13, 2016, 07:42:36 AM »
This is a category that has always interested me, and in which I've dabbled, but I always walk away from because in the end it doesn't suit my desires in reality as much as it does in theory.

The examples I've owned were on the periphery - R1100RSa, Breva 1100, Buell S3T.

Obviously FOR ME I've always prioritized EASE OF SERVICE, so everything had easily accessible valves or hydraulic lifters, and a belt or shaft.

If I had to make the choice again today traits would probably still factor highly in the discussion.

I mean, IF I WASN'T worried about service - then I would probably chose the Ducati.

Though IF I was going for practicality - then I would seriously consider the Honda NT700.

Of course then I'd likely wake up, say screw them both, and get either a T120 or new Harley CX with bags....or if I WAS SERIOUSLY thinking about highway travel and pounding out miles, then I'd just buy an RK.... so yeah, other than reflecting on what traits are important to YOU, I'm no help.

But have fun, I think it's hard to go wrong in this category from the point of view of buying a bad bike. So I guess you really just need to figure out what speaks to you.

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Offline Noguzznoglory

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #41 on: July 13, 2016, 12:52:37 PM »
i'll add a blessing for the NT700V. not spectacular in any way but a really good tourer. front suspension is a little soft but otherwise  a great bike. low maintenance. only negative is the integrated bags. after owning them i'd prefer the detachable bags.

if you're stuck on a beemer the f800S or f800ST msy be a better choice then the GT. same bike obviously but more of a tourer.
of course the GT is such a beauty.
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Offline drw916

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #42 on: July 13, 2016, 01:19:46 PM »
Not sure where the Sport part of a Sport Touring bike is for the NT700V
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Offline Kev m

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #43 on: July 13, 2016, 01:34:14 PM »
Not sure where the Sport part of a Sport Touring bike is for the NT700V
Well, that's up to BoatD.

One MIGHT argue that performance is all relative.

The NT shares the following traits with a typical Sport/Tourer:

1. Relatively light weight.
2. Relatively nimble performance.
3. Some wind protection.
4. Some luggage/cargo capacities/options.

Sure it's not a SPORT-bike, but I'm not certain I read into BD's desires that it HAD to be a high performer in that area.

But if that is one of his concerns, then ok, the NT is probably not on the list.
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Offline Tom

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #44 on: July 13, 2016, 01:52:21 PM »
Suzuki SV650 or the Yamaha FZ07.  Both mid-size twins.  Good reviews for general use.  Get one and outfit for your type of riding.  Easy to use in town.  You have to get past the commercial.

www.motorcyvideos/on-two-wheels?video=x4i693gclistonline.com/
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Offline charlie b

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #45 on: July 13, 2016, 03:13:52 PM »
The NT700V is a really good all around bike.  It is great for in town.  Can handle curves at moderate speeds (at least as good as any non-adjustable suspension Tonti and there are after market shocks/springs).  Really good wind protection if you get a larger windscreen.  Not too tall and there is a lowering kit for it as well.  Custom seats from the regular places (mine was done by Russell).

Not a speed demon but quite adequate for 90% of riding.

I have never liked removable cases.  I want them there cause I always need to carry something, not to take them off and leave them at home.  And the times when touring they get dirty.  Take them off the bike into the room and you track dirt everywhere, including on you as you carry them.  And the removable cases are like really heavy luggage.  I just pack my stuff in a small duffle and shove it in the case, leave the cases outside.

You can get the oversize lids for the NT, which means you can put a FF helmet in the side case.  Also lowers if you want to keep the wind off your feet (only really needed in cold/wet weather).

Some will say it gets tossed around in the wind.  But, it is better than my T5 with the fairing on it.  Feels fairly well planted at speed, even up to it's top end somewhere just south of 120mph.  I was following a couple of cars (Audi and Mercedes) one morning out here and was surprised to look down and see we were going over 105mph.

Reliable.  Several here in the states have over 100k on them.  One has been in the Iron Butt rally twice now and several have done the shorter Iron Butt runs.  At least one has been to the north and south end of the Americas.  But, if it needs to be worked on chances are the Honda mechanic has never seen one before.  They are more rare than Guzzi's.

It is on the touring side of sport touring.  If you want more sport this isn't it.  And, they haven't sold them in the states for several years now.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2016, 03:15:44 PM by charlie b »
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Offline wcguzzi

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #46 on: July 13, 2016, 03:37:22 PM »
I'm right there. Keeping my '81 cafe thing, but need a rider fr retirement. My shortlist;

MV Tourismo Veloce Lusso, for reasons listed above. But I'd add that This is a lightweight nimble bike that suits smaller roads that comprise much of NorCal riding. 800 cc's is enough and hard cases are a must. Check the MV forum which now has enough posts to indicate the biased early lovefest is over. Actual issues discussed.

BMW R1200RS checks all the boxes, but it is big and not less costly than the MV. Good local dealer and shaft drive, some character.

Ducati ST3 or ST4, (S preferred), whatever is a bargain.

Looking for same thoughts you are.
Best of luck.


Offline jrt

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #47 on: July 13, 2016, 09:21:32 PM »
I think you are suffering from the same delusion that I have- some mystical bike that does all things well. I am not sure that bike exists.  You're describing several different requirements that are orthogonal.   Good handling in town (low speed) suggests light bikes, while stability on the highway is heavier bikes. 
So, I propose the following- there is nothing wrong with having two or more bikes.  Ride one long distance, the other in town. 
My criticisms of other suggestions (of bikes that I have had)-

Ducati ST- I had an ST4s.  Brilliant bike, but the turning radius was a full two lane street.  Hard to work on the bike because the fairing is  a pain to take off.  The range was too low for that bike also, just over a hundred miles if I recall.  Super fun to ride, though and it sounded glorious.

Ducati Multistrada 1200- my current ride (ok, no one has suggested this one).  It's a pretty decent jack of all trades.  Goes like stink, handles on rails.   Doesn't sound as good as the ST4s.  Weird lookin' beak on the front.  Shitty rear brake.  I like the multi over the ST because I sit upright and it doesn't put strain on my elbow.  It is bigger than a 'mid size' bike.   Also, very tall.

Guzzi Breva- wife has a 750.   Also a decent all-rounder, but not particularly sporty.  I managed to ride one from St. Louis to Maine and back without too much discomfort, so they have that going for them.  My wife's has been absolutely stone axe reliable.  Very short.

I enjoy riding the SP and G5 Guzzi's but they are getting kind of old, so will often require more attention.  They are heavy bikes also and not particularly fast.  But they are fun to ride. 

So, I would suggest getting a Multistrada for trips and mid-1950's or so Guzzi Galleto for around town.  Bet you didn't see that coming.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2016, 09:22:35 PM by jrt »
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Offline Kev m

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #48 on: July 14, 2016, 05:41:53 AM »
Quote
Good handling in town (low speed) suggests light bikes, while stability on the highway is heavier bikes. 

I'm not sure I accept this premise.

I will admit that I think it's EASIER to make a heavier bike feel stable on the highway as it seems to be a factor, just like center of gravity and wheelbase.

But our 696 is extremely stable on the highway and it is a very light, short wheelbase bike without a particularly low center of gravity.

I think therefore that there must be other, more important factors in stability.

I would guess that quality of suspension, along with frame/steering architecture, and possibly even tire size/type/compounds play more important roles.
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Offline rocker59

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #49 on: July 14, 2016, 08:17:27 AM »


Ducati ST- I had an ST4s.  Brilliant bike, but the turning radius was a full two lane street.  Hard to work on the bike because the fairing is  a pain to take off.  The range was too low for that bike also, just over a hundred miles if I recall.  Super fun to ride, though and it sounded glorious.
 

Ducati ST fuel tank capacity 5.5 gallons.

So, even if you were getting only 30 mpg, it would go 150 miles...

If you were getting 40 mpg, it would go 200 miles.

Yes, the fairing is a pain.  They all are.  Just look at the Norge.  It has a fairing that's a pain.

Yes, maintenance can be expensive at a dealership.

Yes, it's the benchmark sport-touring bike.  A sportsbike with bags.  The way it should be.

A 450 lbs sporty bike with a decent fairing, nice luggage, comfortable seating, and a killer V-twin engine!

 :bike-037:
Michael T.
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Offline rocker59

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #50 on: July 14, 2016, 08:18:48 AM »
I'm not sure I accept this premise.
 

Me, either.

My 485 lbs Sport 1100 is one of the most Stable motorcycles I've ridden at speed. 

I think a big part is aerodynamics.
Michael T.
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Offline alanp

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #51 on: July 14, 2016, 09:24:30 AM »
A bike that seems to get overlooked is the relatively new Kawasaki Versys 1000.  IThey seem to have been aiming for a cross between and ADV bike and standard.  Comes with luggage and priced very reasonably at about $12k. I test rode one recently and although I didn't buy it (got an FJR) it would seem to meet your criteria very well.  The most outstanding thing about it was that it had loads of power and torque and felt lighter than a 650.  It carries its weight as well as any bike I have ridden making it a great all around be machine.  It only narrowly lost out to the FJR, but my criteria are maybe different that yours.
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Offline Travlr

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #52 on: July 14, 2016, 09:40:05 AM »
>Ducati ST fuel tank capacity 5.5 gallons.

And it's metal.  Magnetic tank bags welcome.

ST3 sits nicely between the easy to work on, but sedate ST2 and the wild and wooly ST4.
No flaking rocker issues, a nice broad spread of power and fewer valves to maintain than the 4.
Ducati's best street motor imho

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #53 on: July 14, 2016, 10:32:44 AM »
OK- so I have the itch. I feel like I have too many bikes (I know, silly me). I'm hoping to sell two and replace them with one.  So, I have Gina the V50- may keep just for sentimental reasons- but selling still a possibility. There's the 1200 sport. Great bike, but not much wind protection and no real options to improve that.  Then there's the Shiver-  great bike, but doesn't fill the spot for highway use. 

I'm trying to find a mid sized sport tourer that will be planted on the highway with some windscreen- yet nimble enough around town. It has to be able to mount hard cases. I'm not sold on the gigantic ADV bikes. Seems a bit much to me.   I am OK with working on my own bikes- but I really don't want to go through another Guzzi "re engineer 12 things so the bike works the way it should have originally from the factory" experience.  I would like to have nice suspension over high horsepower (the suspension is what I miss most about the Griso).

Yes- I know about the Norge - and it's not on the list.  I've narrowed things down to the latest version of the Honda VFR 800 and the BMW F800GT.  Seems like the BMW ergos may be easier around town.  The Aprilia 1200 caponord is much larger- but certainly seems capable.

Anyone have experience with the VFR or F800?  Any thoughts on other candidates?

Thanks!

I keep my Beemer Roadster largely because it checks all the boxes you mention.

Offline WitchCityGuzzi

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #54 on: July 14, 2016, 10:41:13 AM »
Clearly the best option available to you, is a Motus.

I recommend the MST-R. All the beautiful engine characteristics of the Guzzi, but with a bit more...."muchness".

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Offline jrt

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #55 on: July 14, 2016, 11:09:48 AM »
I'm not sure I accept this premise.

I will admit that I think it's EASIER to make a heavier bike feel stable on the highway as it seems to be a factor, just like center of gravity and wheelbase.

But our 696 is extremely stable on the highway and it is a very light, short wheelbase bike without a particularly low center of gravity.

I think therefore that there must be other, more important factors in stability.

I would guess that quality of suspension, along with frame/steering architecture, and possibly even tire size/type/compounds play more important roles.

There are many factors that contribute to stability.  Of course! 
Perhaps I should have said 'much lighter'.  My around town bike is a KTM350 (~250 lbs), which is just frightening above about 65 mph.  I guess the knobbies and height don't really contribute to a planted feel at that speed, eh? 
The difference I was thinking was between something like my wife's Breva750 and my Eldorado.  The Breva is just a lot easier to drive and I prefer it in town.  The Breva is really nice on the highway as well but I rather like the heavier Eldo for long distance. 
Anyhow, I believe we are in agreement here.
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Offline boatdetective

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #56 on: July 14, 2016, 11:44:22 AM »
Clearly the best option available to you, is a Motus.

I recommend the MST-R. All the beautiful engine characteristics of the Guzzi, but with a bit more...."muchness".



You sir, are a scallywag!

Now that I think about it, I'm trying to imagine Witchy as a lad. I'm SURE your mother called you a "rascal".
Jonathan K
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2003 EV "Lola" gone to the "Ridin' Realtor" in Peoria
2007 1200 Sport "Ginger"

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Offline WitchCityGuzzi

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #57 on: July 14, 2016, 01:09:38 PM »
There were times that "rascal" would have been high praise. 
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Offline Huzo

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #58 on: July 14, 2016, 01:51:19 PM »
Flip reckons a Trimph Sprint, I did 70,000 on a '07 Sprint ST and would not have sold it except wanted shaft drive by then. They're cheap ( inexpensive) strong, pullhard at medium revs, they have 85% of their peak torque @ 5,000 rpm and they sound great. Also hundreds on the 'net

Offline Nic in Western NYS

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Re: Opinions for a sport tourer pls
« Reply #59 on: July 14, 2016, 02:00:56 PM »
Me, either.

My 485 lbs Sport 1100 is one of the most Stable motorcycles I've ridden at speed. 

I think a big part is aerodynamics.
My Spot1100 was much more stable at speed than my BMW R1100RT.  Ducati ST4s is very stable too.  Not sure why, but not a function of weight in my limited experience. All sorts of confounding variables could be lurking!
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