Why is Sport Touring dead?

[Lannis]

Riders becoming too soft? For what? Needless suffering?

It is, after all, supposed to be fun.

All a matter of degree.   People suffer climbing mountains, running 10 mile races, lifting weights, riding competitive motocross, doing century bicycle rides.    If the main thing is to "reduce suffering", we'd not only get off our sport bikes onto fat cruisers, but we'd (Why freeze and get soaked and risk our lives on those) be in a Volvo with active lumbar support and a 10-speaker stereo.   

Riding a high-performance motorcycle IS fun, for most of us.   When it's not, it's time to quit, maybe play shuffleboard or something ... 

Lannis

[Darren Williams]

The FJR and Connie just got a recent makeover. Yamaha recently intro'd the FJ09. Kawasaki updated and expanded the Versys line along with Suzuki improving the Vstom line. Honda... what the hell were they thinking???? Well my wife does sport tour on a CB500X.

Ducati still selling Multistrada's and Hypertrada's, along with a return of a new ST (as John mentioned above. BMW are still selling the R and K sport touring bikes along with the 800GT. And I agree that the big adventure bikes with their top shelf suspensions are more sport touring than single track dual sports.

A sport touring bike (noun) is a bike with some lean angle, decent handling, decent range and the ability to carry some luggage (hard or soft), even if it is just a little luggage rack with a yellow bag strapped on (DK content).  Sport touring (verb) is going places away from home and riding the roads in a sporting manner.  I know a couple guys around here that ride their Cali's in a sport touring way.

[Arizona Wayne]

My sport/touring has taken somewhat of a nose dive because I don't live in motomecca(norCal) anymore.  Close proximity to great curvy roads are non-existent here in the desert.  If I still lived in Yuba City, Ca. I'd still be ripping up corners to my hearts content.   Now when I get to curvy areas I don't have my mojo any more.  It takes me awhile to get it back again with practice in the curves.  If you don't use it, you lose it. 

[Arizona Wayne]

The FJR and Connie just got a recent makeover. Yamaha recently intro'd the FJ09. Kawasaki updated and expanded the Versys line along with Suzuki improving the Vstom line. Honda... what the hell were they thinking???? Well my wife does sport tour on a CB500X.

Ducati still selling Multistrada's and Hypertrada's, along with a return of a new ST (as John mentioned above. BMW are still selling the R and K sport touring bikes along with the 800GT. And I agree that the big adventure bikes with their top shelf suspensions are more sport touring than single track dual sports.

A sport touring bike (noun) is a bike with some lean angle, decent handling, decent range and the ability to carry some luggage (hard or soft), even if it is just a little luggage rack with a yellow bag strapped on (DK content).  Sport touring (verb) is going places away from home and riding the roads in a sporting manner.  I know a couple guys around here that ride their Cali's in a sport touring way.

Yes, for decades Moto Guzzi is the only brand bike that has made cruisers (Calis) that really corner too. 

[tris]

Perhaps"Sports Touring" is a marketing ploy that has had it's time to be overtaken by Giant Trailies and more recently Bobbers and Scramblers

[Lannis]

Just curious as to why Sport Touring pretty much died. Or maybe it's not. Thoughts?...

Good post, in retrospect.   Good because I've been thinking "What's wrong with this proposition?" all day, and I figured it out.

Sport Touring is not a thing whose "dying" can affect anyone who is interested in it.

It's similar to saying:

"Hand tying of trout flies is dying."

"Longbow archery is dying."

"Building and flying Wakefield models is dying."

"Riding fat-tired beach bicycles is dying."

"Two-handed Canasta is dying."

"Train-spotting is dying."

It doesn't really mean anything, because the whole world is divided into two parts when it comes to this.   There are the people who DON'T do longbow archery, never heard of it, or used to do it and now use compound or recurve bows .... and there are people who DO enjoy longbow archery, and will continue to do it as long as they like.   

For the people who don't do it, if the sport is "dying" it's completely irrelevant.   For the people who DO do it, if the sport is "dying" it's completely irrelevant.   Longbow archery has been "dying" ever since Agincourt, when you could get put in the stocks for not practicing at the village butts on the weekend.   But what does that really mean?   Nothing; nothing at all.

Same for "sport touring" motorcycles.   The ones who don't do it are "outside" and don't care, and the ones who DO will .... do it, regardless of the perceived "health" of the hobby.

So, that's me wasting a bit of time on a nice Saturday.   Cutting grass and weed-eating, that's been it today.

Lannis

[RANDM]

I don't think it's dead, but the Adv bikes have drawn the interest away.
With the varied quality of roads over here ST's loose out just a touch.

I use a car only if I have to so a bike I can just about anything on is
important as I'm not exactly floating in filthy lucre - an ST or an Adv.
Bike is the best choice for me, if I had the reddies I'd have a Stelvio
in a heartbeat.

Maurie.

[twowings]

I LOVE Adventure Bikers! While they're communing with rocks and trees, I have more pavement to myself...

[Guzzistajohn]

I sport toured my ass off today And I don't need no steenking bike labeled a "sport tourer"

[twowings]

1. Get a cool bike.
2. Tell everyone your nickname is 'Sport'.
3. Take a trip.

Instant Sport Tourer!

(easier than steel-cut oats... )

[Guzzistajohn]

1. Get a cool bike.
2. Tell everyone your nickname is 'Sport'.
3. Take a trip.

Instant Sport Tourer!

(easier than steel-cut oats... )

And the air is fresher!

[Arizona Wayne]

Hell, anyone who questions if I sport/tour on my bikes that are not supposed to be able to do that can just follow me in the twisties and then decide if I do or not.    If there aren't curves to enjoy then you're not sport/touring, IMHO.  Anyone can go fast in a straight line.  It's the curves that separate the men from the boys. 

[ohiorider]

Here's my thoughts on this thread:
 - My Guzzi 1200 Sport is a sport tourer.
 -  A Norge, either 2 or 4 valve per cylinder is a touring bike
 - A BMW R1200RS  is a sport tourer
 - A BMW R1200Rt is a touring bike
This list could go on, and on, but ......

To me, a sport touring bike is one that takes the best elements of the manufacturer's touring bike, and slims it down, slightly changes the rider's posture to more of a 'lean into it,' perhaps adds better suspension.

The bike isn't designed to make touring more of a sporting proposition.  It's designed for those who like less than a full touring bike, but who like the basic design features of the full bore tourer, without the barn door fairing and windshield, and the higher handlebars.

I've succumbed to the full fairing thing a couple of times (K1100LT and ST1300.) and there was nothing wrong with either bike.  Except neither gave me the feeling I personally wanted from a bike when riding cross country.  Both bikes protected me more than I liked from the elements, mainly the wind.  And after less than 10,000 miles, they were gone.  It is a personal thing.

To me, a well-designed sport tourer lets me enjoy the elements surrounding me more so than would a full blown touring bike.  But at the same time, when the elements turn bad (wetter, colder, etc) the sport touring bike provides enough protection to make the ride ok.

I think what it all comes down to is ......... what feels good to you when you're riding.  How'd Popeye say it? .....  "I am what I am and that's all what I am."

Bob

[Matteo]

Norge is a GT-Gran Turismo, hence the more comfort oriented ride.

[Arizona Wayne]

Here's my thoughts on this thread:
 - My Guzzi 1200 Sport is a sport tourer.
 -  A Norge, either 2 or 4 valve per cylinder is a touring bike
 - A BMW R1200RS  is a sport tourer
 - A BMW R1200Rt is a touring bike
This list could go on, and on, but ......

To me, a sport touring bike is one that takes the best elements of the manufacturer's touring bike, and slims it down, slightly changes the rider's posture to more of a 'lean into it,' perhaps adds better suspension.

The bike isn't designed to make touring more of a sporting proposition.  It's designed for those who like less than a full touring bike, but who like the basic design features of the full bore tourer, without the barn door fairing and windshield, and the higher handlebars.

I've succumbed to the full fairing thing a couple of times (K1100LT and ST1300.) and there was nothing wrong with either bike.  Except neither gave me the feeling I personally wanted from a bike when riding cross country.  Both bikes protected me more than I liked from the elements, mainly the wind.  And after less than 10,000 miles, they were gone.  It is a personal thing.

To me, a well-designed sport tourer lets me enjoy the elements surrounding me more so than would a full blown touring bike.  But at the same time, when the elements turn bad (wetter, colder, etc) the sport touring bike provides enough protection to make the ride ok.

I think what it all comes down to is ......... what feels good to you when you're riding.  How'd Popeye say it? .....  "I am what I am and that's all what I am."

Bob

I pretty much agree, Bob, in that sport/tourers weigh less than touring bikes and therefore go thru corners easier.  I do not consider my Convert. a sport/tourer because of it's weight and handling compared to a real ST.  A Convert. handles like a PU truck, IMHO.  At least the way I set it up.

[kirby1923]

Sport touring is a verb. Sport tourer may describe someone who partakes of sport touring.

As applied to a motorcycle, it is a marketing term that I never understood.

Is that what a "cross over" is? I have never understood what that's all about!

[rocker59]

The Sport - touring guys got old and switched to ADVbikes, the newish street - oriented ADVtouring bikes. Oh, and cruiserz.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk

[pete roper]

As a prime example of one of those 'Older Guys' I have to say that the reasons I would take a Stelvio over a Norge are partly due to versatility and partly due to the lack, or at least minimal quantity, of bodywork.

Taking a Norge on dirt roads is possible but fraught with danger as even a low speed lay-down will be severely damaging to vast expanses of bodywork. I can't toss the Stelvio with impunity but I can drop it without serious damage. It's also got longer travel, and much better suspension which makes graded dirt a breeze.

As for 'Cruisers'? I tried one, a Cali 1400, in 2013 and rode it in the environment it was obviously designed for, the US road system, which is superior in both quality and extent to most other places on the planet. I found it seriously wanting and know I'll never own another, but that's me. They are obviously popular but I can't for the life of me understand why? Far too heavy, rotten suspension, grossly over long wheelbase, no cornering clearance and steer like a 1960's London Bus! Each to their own though.

Pete

[Sheepdog]

It's pretty tough to haul luggage and camping gear for two on a bike that has a sporting pretense. Gross vehicle weight and wind protection come into play, and if folks even think that they might do some unsupported touring, they tend to err on the side of massive. Unfortunately, our fantasies often fuel our consumerism...

[sturgeon]

I habitually peel all the labels off a new-to-me bike as soon as I get it home. That way I'll never know if I'm using it 'properly'.

[LowRyter]

As a prime example of one of those 'Older Guys' I have to say that the reasons I would take a Stelvio over a Norge are partly due to versatility and partly due to the lack, or at least minimal quantity, of bodywork.

Taking a Norge on dirt roads is possible but fraught with danger as even a low speed lay-down will be severely damaging to vast expanses of bodywork. I can't toss the Stelvio with impunity but I can drop it without serious damage. It's also got longer travel, and much better suspension which makes graded dirt a breeze.

As for 'Cruisers'? I tried one, a Cali 1400, in 2013 and rode it in the environment it was obviously designed for, the US road system, which is superior in both quality and extent to most other places on the planet. I found it seriously wanting and know I'll never own another, but that's me. They are obviously popular but I can't for the life of me understand why? Far too heavy, rotten suspension, grossly over long wheelbase, no cornering clearance and steer like a 1960's London Bus! Each to their own though.

Pete

wait till you ride a 'glide, 1600GTL or better yet, a Chieftain.   

[travelingbyguzzi]

If an Eldo is doing the ton, is it a Sport Tourer? Labels mean nothing to anyone but the uneducated.

Bill Lovelady      IS
Eskimo Spy

[oldbike54]

If an Eldo is doing the ton, is it a Sport Tourer? Labels mean nothing to anyone but the uneducated.

Bill Lovelady      IS
Eskimo Spy

  :1:

 Dusty

[Darren Williams]

If an Eldo is doing the ton, is it a Sport Tourer? Labels mean nothing to anyone but the uneducated.

Bill Lovelady      IS
Eskimo Spy

Speed is less relevant than lean angle.   

[not-fishing]

Riding a high-performance motorcycle IS fun, for most of us.   When it's not, it's time to quit, maybe play shuffleboard or something ... 

Lannis

No shuffleboard, I have another Wakefield to build along with a Goldberg/Comet Sailplane and Zipper to RC.  Then there's flies to tie.  Something that being nearsighted does not hinder.

Won one and lost one today.  Got the V50 to run better - it was the old throttle cables.  Punched a couple of holes by mistake seatcovering the Griso's seat.  Well superglue is my friend and maybe in a few years I'll try to recover the seat again

Mark

[Arizona Wayne]

Speed is less relevant than lean angle.   

I put the Ambo., Eldo. in the same category as the Convert.  No way are they sport/tourers.   They are tourers. 

[Nic in Western NYS]

A new leftover 2014 VStrom 1000 for $8k.  ADV/sport tourer/whatever...lot of new bike for not much dash. No idea who the dealer is.

https://greensboro.craigslist.org/mcd/6072071859.html

[Darren Williams]

A new leftover 2014 VStrom 1000 for $8k.  ADV/sport tourer/whatever...lot of new bike for not much dash. No idea who the dealer is.

https://greensboro.craigslist.org/mcd/6072071859.html

When the FJ09 came out the Stroms became second fiddle, Versys too. The bar was raised.

[Nic in Western NYS]

When the FJ09 came out the Stroms became second fiddle, Versys too. The bar was raised.

FJ09 fit me well - wide handlebars, right ergos.  But a triple isn't a v-twin, not sure which I'd choose.  No matter, I'm a one-biker for the foreseeable future.  Maybe if we move back north I'll get a mudder for the months when the roads are passable but covered in salty muck.

[charlie b]

Who said it is dead?