Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: gearman on October 11, 2019, 09:25:17 AM
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I wonder if any one ever made a single carb manifold for a round fin big block engine?
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Yes, Soney Angle in CA had one years ago.
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It was kind of the answer to the question nobody asked.. :smiley:
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I won one at Kens Italy rally in 86 maybe and ended up donating it to the Oklahoma rally. Nice unit but I never built a bike for it. The guy that had Atlas cycle won it as I remember. I thought it would have been great on a home built Quota.
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It was kind of the answer to the question nobody asked.. :smiley:
I am asking because my trike has a gas pedal and the bell crank system I made is out 1/16 in over full travel . A single carb would be simpler.
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I have one in my stash.
I think someone in Pa. Made it for an Eldo.
I ended up owning the bike but took manifold off after a year for some forgotten reason, single carb, i guess you could say the original person that made it was about 45+ years ahead of time.
As a side note the manifold is made from chrome plumbing sink parts and rubber bushings, and soldered together.
Not as pretty as the cast one that someone made but i guess it was less $$$$.
The guy that made the one i have did horse shoeing and was a member of the Keystone Motorcycle Club .
Mine is similar, pic from this old tractor---- Greg Bender
(https://i.ibb.co/sq6S0jw/single-carb-6.jpg) (https://ibb.co/sq6S0jw)
TOMB
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http://thisoldtractor.com/moto_guzzi_loopframe_intake_manifolds_-_two-into-one_for_use_with_a_single_carburetor.html
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I am asking because my trike has a gas pedal and the bell crank system I made is out 1/16 in over full travel . A single carb would be simpler.
It's a simple enough job for someone that can fabricate something..<shrug>
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http://thisoldtractor.com/moto_guzzi_loopframe_intake_manifolds_-_two-into-one_for_use_with_a_single_carburetor.html
Great response Charlie also thanks tomb.The angle version looks asemetrical.I wonder how well it performs?Yeah, if I knew someone who can make things :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:I made a beer bottle carb balancing set up. I balanced both carbs but at 60mph one side rose a lot more than the other liquid.
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Interesting timing. Just had short conversation with Don Angel, Sonny's brother about the single mani. Interesting.
Tom
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Might it be possible to adapt a Cali 1400 one? Or maybe even a V7 one? For the Trike I mean.
Pete
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Depends on the choke diameter, but I made one for a V50 II out of copper water pipe, 1 inch as I remember. Soldered together using 45 degree angles etc.
Problem I had was the Dellorto has an offset idle fuel hole in the body so I could never get the idle to run evenly.
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Multiple cars need to be balanced at idle and around 3000 rpm in neutral. A manometer will work but in my opinion an airflow meter is better for higher rpm balancing. If done carefully with carbs in good condition, a single carb offers no advantage in my opinion..
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http://thisoldtractor.com/moto_guzzi_loopframe_intake_manifolds_-_two-into-one_for_use_with_a_single_carburetor.html
I've seen one or more listed from time-to-time on ebay, w/conditions ranging from nearly new-looking to extremely crusty.
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Never ridden a single carb Guzzi or a Quota or Vt with a single throttle body, buy have ridden single carb Triumphs and truth be, I like their "ride feel" better than the twin carbs.
As an aside, perhaps a Quota manifold could be adapted / modified for a carb if you're curiosity overwhelms you. Probably better than building an ornithopter during those long cold months in the nice heated garage.
.
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This thread is making my head swim lol
I think I has a sickness. Somehow I just can't countenance the notion of less than one hole per cylinder.
The Norton guys are always having the same conversation, but I don't think anybody there would allow somebody to show up with water pipe as a manifold. Guzzi people are the most curious community I've ever been part of.
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If Guzzis were supposed to run on one carburetor, then Carcano or Tonti would have designed it that way. :wink:
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This seems cleaner [url]http://www.thisoldtractor.com/moto_guzzi_quota_carburetor_conversion.html[url]
(A Quota will run just fine if you can take it to someone who has the equipment to re-map it and knows what they are doing)
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Not Guzzi but I took this contraption off of 650 Triumph a few years ago...
(https://i.ibb.co/8PdNMQg/20181130-114345-XL.jpg) (https://ibb.co/8PdNMQg)
(https://i.ibb.co/99214YN/20181130-114349-L.jpg) (https://ibb.co/99214YN)
(https://i.ibb.co/HG6Lv2z/20181130-114401-L.jpg) (https://ibb.co/HG6Lv2z)
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That "Triumph" manifold above looks like it came off a toilet...Looks too long to clear the engine casting? I tune old Triumphs, there's a lot of debate on single VS dual carb..When properly tuned, the dual carb is better above 3000 rpm...in my opinion.......Those long intake runners on a Guzzi single carb manifolds may not get warm enough to help in fuel vaporizion in cooler weather...
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There's a whole science on intake runner length. I haven't a clue what this mod would affect, but suspect high RPM would suffer.
I've dealt with dual carbs on most of the bikes I've owned since the 60s and don't recall having trouble tuning them - enough to want to eliminate one of them. Seems like a lot of trouble over nothing.
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On the Sonny Angel manifold that I held in my hot little hands, the Mikuni carb pointed to the left cylinder and the pipes were a different size from each other. I’m thinking the left side was smaller. It was nicely made. I wonder if someone ever put it on a bike
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pressureangl
This thread is making my head swim lol
I think I has a sickness. Somehow I just can't countenance the notion of less than one hole per cylinder.
The Norton guys are always having the same conversation, but I don't think anybody there would allow somebody to show up with water pipe as a manifold. Guzzi people are the most curious community I've ever been part of.
I can't understand "Why anybody would want more than ONE CARB. on anything between 1 and 4 cylinders anyway , CAN'T BUT ONE CYLINDER AT A TIME SUCK ON IT in a 4 stroke engine" ???
Four cylinders , Four cycle , One carb = smooth constant flow -- Smooth is Good for flowing things !
Those up-draft carbs are wonderful fuel savers ! :wink:
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pressureangl
This thread is making my head swim lol
I think I has a sickness. Somehow I just can't countenance the notion of less than one hole per cylinder.
The Norton guys are always having the same conversation, but I don't think anybody there would allow somebody to show up with water pipe as a manifold. Guzzi people are the most curious community I've ever been part of.
I can't understand "Why anybody would want more than ONE CARB. on anything between 1 and 4 cylinders anyway , CAN'T BUT ONE CYLINDER AT A TIME SUCK ON IT in a 4 stroke engine" ???
Four cylinders , Four cycle , One carb = smooth constant flow -- Smooth is Good for flowing things !
Those up-draft carbs are wonderful fuel savers ! :wink:
Truth. An updraft carb won't fill your crankcase when the inlet sticks, either!
For a 'Guzzi, a single carb with properly designed intake would probably be the bee's knees for part-throttle cruising and MPG.
Personally, in my mind I still like to believe I like to be WFO whenever possible, but reality is I've got old and enjoy my driving privileges.
Packaging is a problem, and as pointed out fuel atomisation and drop-out when cold would be an issue. All solved with port EFI.
These home-made 'solutions' are a stitch, tho.
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Never ridden a single carb Guzzi or a Quota or Vt with a single throttle body, buy have ridden single carb Triumphs and truth be, I like their "ride feel" better than the twin carbs.
As an aside, perhaps a Quota manifold could be adapted / modified for a carb if you're curiosity overwhelms you. Probably better than building an ornithopter during those long cold months in the nice heated garage.
The Quota engine has a "torquey feel" to it, but it's super-tall gearing kind of ruins it.
I have no idea what the Quota's dyno graph looks like compared to other 1100s, but it feels nice and is real tractable.
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Any one have a sonny angle manifold for sale?
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Any one have a sonny angle manifold for sale?
Sonny and Chris’s last name was Angel, as in winged and white.
The first Guzzi I ever rode had one of those asymmetric manifolds, it ran poorly and Sonny himself converted it back to twin carbs.
Piaggio seems to have done a pretty good job implementing a single throttle body, and it would be interesting to figure out why it works better than the Todero era Quota setup.
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Sonny and Chris’s last name was Angel, as in winged and white.
The first Guzzi I ever rode had one of those asymmetric manifolds, it ran poorly and Sonny himself converted it back to twin carbs.
Piaggio seems to have done a pretty good job implementing a single throttle body, and it would be interesting to figure out why it works better than the Todero era Quota setup.
Does the single throttle body Guzzi have a port fuel injector for each cylinder?....Or is it a throttle body injector?
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Interesting timing. Just had short conversation with Don Angel, Sonny's brother about the single mani. Interesting.
Tom
So, what was the gist of your conversation? Did it work well?I have searched the net and don't find any real info. Thanks
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That "Triumph" manifold above looks like it came off a toilet...Looks too long to clear the engine casting? I tune old Triumphs, there's a lot of debate on single VS dual carb..When properly tuned, the dual carb is better above 3000 rpm...in my opinion.......Those long intake runners on a Guzzi single carb manifolds may not get warm enough to help in fuel vaporizion in cooler weather...
It might have .
Young fella in NW Arkansas built a branch manifold out of plumbing pipe for a Kawasaki twin , it was crude , but the bike seemed to run OK , or as well as a 400 Kawasaki was gonna run :laugh:
Dusty
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RER, If I saw it correctly, single TB and 1 injector for each cyl. positioned about where a 2 TB's are.
Gearman, because of needing the carb at an angle, it wouldn't breathe right. If you do a search here at WG, you'll find a thread that really talks about that manifold. He did think that if it was turbo'ed or blower, it may have worked better with pressurized air. IF there would have been room for the carb like on a Triumph single carb, it would have worked better.
Tom
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So, what was the gist of your conversation? Did it work well?I have searched the net and don't find any real info. Thanks
Donny knows how well it worked :wink: :grin:
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Thanks all.