NGC - Tomorrow will tell the tale ...CB1100

[ohiorider]

I'll take a few minutes and try to respond to a few comments that included questions:

Aschem:  Yes, I'm on the CB1100 forum and you're right .... lots of informative stuff there.

KevDog 3019: Yes, I do wish the CB1100 engine used hydraulic self adjusting tappets like your Nighthawk.

Swooshdave: Is the CB1100 in the same category as my 1200 Sport? Don't think so.  I view my 1200 Sport as much more of a road motorcycle, a sport-tourer, if you will.  To me, the CB1100 is more of a 'roadster.'  Although the CB could certainly run 80-90mph all day long, I think it would be tiring.  The 1200 Sport is essentially a stripped down Norge, designed and intended to run comfortably at highway ++ speed all day long.  I didn't buy the CB1100 with the intent of replacing the 1200 Sport ... I wanted essentially to have a smaller, somewhat lighter bike in the garage.

Alanp:  The CB's low rpm performance was a huge surprise for me, too.  Yes, I purchased it new ... it was a leftover 2014 ... zero miles and at what I thought was a good price ($6995 plus shipping and setup .... slightly less than $7200 out the door.  Of course I owe Ohio sales tax in addition.)

Kev M: It really does seem tuned for low rpm performance, but once broken in, I'm certain she'll jump pretty good between 5000-7000rpm.  But the low rpm stuff is a real shocker (unless my speedo and tach are way off!)

Lannis:  We'll see if a Guzzi guy (me) really falls for this bike.  I think it'll take some saddle time to acclimate myself to the difference between 2 and 4 cylinder feel, sound, etc.

KevDog 3019: Probably all the CB1100 engine has in common with your Honda 4 is the # of cylinders.  The CB1100 tach shows redline at 8500rpm.

If I can locate it, there is a good article about the design concept behind this bike, with lots of quotes from the product/project  manager.  I'll paste the link here if/when I find it.

Bob

Here's the link to the Honda design article.  A lot of what it says about air cooling, fins, etc, falls in line with our feelings about our Italian mounts.

http://world.honda.com/design/designers-talk/cb1100/

[jas67]

It sounds like a nice motor, sorta tuned like a twin. Hmmm

Yeah, it sort of is.   A local riding buddy had one briefly (he has Motorcycle A.D.D. way worse than anyone else I know).   He and I swapped rides back and forth one day last summer, my '14 V7 Special, and his '13 CB1100 (5 speed).   We even rode some gravel roads, which both bikes handled quite well.  Despite being a heavier bike, the CB1100 felt very similar to ride from a handling standpoint.   The power vs. RPM is more twin like than most modern inline fours.   It has a nice wide linear power band, definitely more torque than the V7.    The torque starts around 2,000 and pulls strong to redline (8,500).       The dual discs definitely give the CB1100 the edge on braking.      There is a lot to like about the CB1100.   He enjoyed the V7 way more than he expected to.   Aside from the number of cylinders, and obviously different sound, the V7 and CB1100 are more similar than different to ride.   

IMG_9605
IMG_9616
IMG_9598



I got the opportunity to swap back and forth

[blackbuell]

Bob,

I look forward to more comments from you about this bike, as I am considering buying a new left-over 2014, too; would hang on to my '09 Norge if I did. (Still might trade in my Norge for a new '15 Norge though instead, haven't decided yet.) As we are of similar size and age, it was good to hear that the bike seems to fit you well and is relatively easy to move around at a stand-still. If I were to buy one, I would mainly use it for local rides (both solo and 2-up) and for occasional weekend trips; not for cross-country duty. I have worked out a deal with a shop to purchase the bike with a tail rack and plate to accommodate my Givi trunks, and with case guards. I would likely add a small windscreen and a throttlemeister, too.

Have you considered any modifications?

I have read on the CB1100  forum that the bike can get a bit buzzy at speeds over 75 mph. Have you noticed this?

I'm particularly interested in your gas mileage; the relatively small tank is a negative, IMO; but if the bike gets 50 mpg, the lack of fuel capacity is not such a big deal.

Jon

[swooshdave]

Swooshdave: Is the CB1100 in the same category as my 1200 Sport? Don't think so.  I view my 1200 Sport as much more of a road motorcycle, a sport-tourer, if you will.  To me, the CB1100 is more of a 'roadster.'  Although the CB could certainly run 80-90mph all day long, I think it would be tiring.  The 1200 Sport is essentially a stripped down Norge, designed and intended to run comfortably at highway ++ speed all day long.  I didn't buy the CB1100 with the intent of replacing the 1200 Sport ... I wanted essentially to have a smaller, somewhat lighter bike in the garage.

Somewhat lighter? Aren't they basically the same weight?

[ohiorider]

Bob,

I look forward to more comments from you about this bike, as I am considering buying a new left-over 2014, too; would hang on to my '09 Norge if I did. (Still might trade in my Norge for a new '15 Norge though instead, haven't decided yet.) As we are of similar size and age, it was good to hear that the bike seems to fit you well and is relatively easy to move around at a stand-still. If I were to buy one, I would mainly use it for local rides (both solo and 2-up) and for occasional weekend trips; not for cross-country duty. I have worked out a deal with a shop to purchase the bike with a tail rack and plate to accommodate my Givi trunks, and with case guards. I would likely add a small windscreen and a throttlemeister, too.

Have you considered any modifications?

I have read on the CB1100  forum that the bike can get a bit buzzy at speeds over 75 mph. Have you noticed this?

I'm particularly interested in your gas mileage; the relatively small tank is a negative, IMO; but if the bike gets 50 mpg, the lack of fuel capacity is not such a big deal.

Jon

Jon, good to hear from you.  Mods or accessories?  Probably accessories.  I was able to purchase a nice used set of HB 30 liter Juniors and the correct HB mounts for the CB1100 that'll probably go on after I figure out exactly how I intend to use this bike.  The seller also provided me with a new Puig flyscreen and mounts that'll go on later, too.  (Thanks, Jas67 for putting me on to these.)  I think I'd like a set of adjustable footpegs too.  Hope to stay with the stock handlebar, but may try rotating it to the rear slightly to reduce reach to the bars. I've been accused of turning every bike I've owned into a variation of a BMW sport tourer, even if it isn't a BMW!

So far, I've only used the bike's computer to determine fuel mileage.  It tells me slightly over 50mpg.  I won't know how accurate until I keep track of it myself.

Later,

Bob

[ohiorider]

I was afraid I was providing WG with erroneous info regarding rpm @ xx mph, so I posted to the CB1100 forum and asked if 2750rpm in 6th gear at 60mph was correct, and one of the moderators sent me the following info.  Each had an accompanying dash photo which I didn't include here:

MPH  Gear  Rpm
55     6TH   2500
60     6TH   2750
65     6TH   3000
70     6TH   3250
75     6TH   3500
80     6TH   3750

Bob

[ohiorider]

Somewhat lighter? Aren't they basically the same weight?

I should have said "lighter in feel."  You're correct .... published dry weight for both bikes is similar.

[chuck peterson]

Drop two gears and call me in the morning...in the 4-6-7k rpm range it'll come into its own...but, yeah, check the break in specs if there are any...I won't be too tender with it

[Sheepdog]

Handsome bike there, Bob. The fuel tank size always sorta hangs me up, but there is no denying that it's a looker!

[ohiorider]

Handsome bike there, Bob. The fuel tank size always sorta hangs me up, but there is no denying that it's a looker!

Thanks, Sheepdog.  Re mileage, I imagine it'll get approx. the same mileage per tank I used to get from my 790cc Bonnie, which was ok, but nothing like the 'per tank' mileage of the 1200 Sport.  Hope things are going well down South!

Bob

[Lannis]

HWY 250 is grand even on an ox cart....

US250 is paying the price for local prosperity at the moment.   Gas drilling and pipeline construction has generated so much heavy truck traffic that the road surface from Moundsville to Cameron and Fairmont is beat completely to crap, really hurting the "fun factor" for riders.

Of course, the highways aren't meant to be our personal race track anyhow.... and I can tell you that the local folks wouldn't have the situation any other way.   Whenever I go through there, I stop and hang out for a few hours in Cameron and talk to people, and there are a LOT of new F-250 pickups on the road ... everyone who wants to work is working for good money.   It won't last forever, and at some point the highway repair budget will catch up with the road fixing needs, but right now, it's "take your time" through that area .... !

Lannis

[kevdog3019]

That is all very interesting Bob. I will read the article as I'm intrigued by how different this CB engine is from (what I considered) the typical in-line four high RPM mill. Sounds very V-twin-like in some ways; obviously smoother. I find the low torque and linear powerband a big plus.

[ohiorider]

US250 is paying the price for local prosperity at the moment.   Gas drilling and pipeline construction has generated so much heavy truck traffic that the road surface from Moundsville to Cameron and Fairmont is beat completely to crap, really hurting the "fun factor" for riders.

Of course, the highways aren't meant to be our personal race track anyhow.... and I can tell you that the local folks wouldn't have the situation any other way.   Whenever I go through there, I stop and hang out for a few hours in Cameron and talk to people, and there are a LOT of new F-250 pickups on the road ... everyone who wants to work is working for good money.   It won't last forever, and at some point the highway repair budget will catch up with the road fixing needs, but right now, it's "take your time" through that area .... !

Lannis

You're on the mark re the condition of US250.  That exact stretch between Fairmont and Moundsville is really beat.  It's been several years since I'd been over US250.  Looks like the old bank building in Cameron (or was it in Hundred?) is slowly collapsing back into nature.  Probably the right bike for that road is my old R100GS, or any new ADV tourer.  Jumping on a brand new CB1100 that I hadn't ridden and adjusted, and returning home on that stretch of 250 was not a good choice ...... but it was still a fun ride! Weather was perfect.

[Lannis]

You're on the mark re the condition of US250.  That exact stretch between Fairmont and Moundsville is really beat.  It's been several years since I'd been over US250.  Looks like the old bank building in Cameron (or was it in Hundred?) is slowly collapsing back into nature. 

That pretty old stone bank is (was) in Littleton ... It was in pretty good shape until just a few years ago, when some ne'er-do-wells set it on fire.    Relic of a day when people in a local community lived there, banked there, shopped there.   Today, I don't suppose anyone in West Virginia is more than 30 minutes from a WalMart ....

Lannis

[ohiorider]

That pretty old stone bank is (was) in Littleton ... It was in pretty good shape until just a few years ago, when some ne'er-do-wells set it on fire.    Relic of a day when people in a local community lived there, banked there, shopped there.   Today, I don't suppose anyone in West Virginia is more than 30 minutes from a WalMart ....

Lannis

Littleton ..... thanks!  Sad sight.  Every time I ride that stretch from Fairmont to Moundsville, I can't help but remember all the miners who died in mine disasters in that area.

[Markcarovilli]

Beautiful bike Bob - looking forward to seeing it....

Mark

[GuzziDog54]

Thanks for the write-up Bob! I've liked the CB1100 ever since it came out. I might try one at some point and like what I'm reading so far.

[willowstreetguzziguy]

Bob, How do the CB1100 and 1200 Sport engines compare vibration-wise?

[roadventure]

Well, at last, the weather looks like it'll cooperate.  We're leaving at 5am and driving 200 miles from home to pick up the recently-purchased 2014 CB1100.
 
A few current owners here on WG are positive about the bike.  Hopefully she'll strike a chord with me, too.

Bob

Bob,

Why should you care?  The only important opinion is yours!  Have fun and I hope you have a connection with your new Honda.   

[Ncdan]

Wish they would have given it a shaft drive instead on a chain:(

[grebmrof]

Three hours from home to the dealer in Tom's car, nearly 7 hours home.  How the hell did it take this long to ride 247 miles (?) Better question .... how did Tom do it in 3 hours?

Never below 70 and not often above 80 - and no stops, towns, traffic jams or too many morons on the road - and looking for a breakfast in Clarksburg WV will do it!
Tom

[kevdog3019]

Wish they would have given it a shaft drive instead on a chain:(

You may want to look at a CB 700s (otherwise known as Nighthawk S). It got all the goodies of the day including the shaft. But... these are from '84-'86. Sometimes looking back you find you get more with Honda. Not knocking these newer CB's as I'm sure they're great bikes. 

[Huzo]

Is that correct, 2750 @ 60 mph and not 3750 ??? That would be the lowest I've seen !!

[ohiorider]

Is that correct, 2750 @ 60 mph and not 3750 ??? That would be the lowest I've seen !!

Huzo, that's what mine indicates.  I questioned it, too.  A forum moderator on the CB1100 forum who has been riding one for a few years  sent me the figures I quoted earlier in this thread.  So, yep, I see 2750 at an indicated 60mph and so does the moderator.  So, if the meters are accurate, this is the story.  My bike is a 2014 with 6 spd tranny.

Bob

[Lannis]

Huzo, that's what mine indicates.  I questioned it, too.  A forum moderator on the CB1100 forum who has been riding one for a few years  sent me the figures I quoted earlier in this thread.  So, yep, I see 2750 at an indicated 60mph and so does the moderator.  So, if the meters are accurate, this is the story.  My bike is a 2014 with 6 spd tranny.

Bob

That's Harley Big Twin territory.   No wonder the motor is tuned to provide good torque at 2000 RPM ..... !

Lannis

[Triple Jim]

It is an in-line four, so it will take some getting used to the lack of flywheel feel when downshifting .... seems to take a bit more finesse than either the GS or 1200 Sport.

It may just be that you need to shift quicker.  That is, don't leave as much time for the engine to slow down as you're used to. 

[Huzo]

Being a Honda (Jap bike) there's won't be some stupid electrical drama that's at play so good for you and enjoy. Damn though, I just wish the Japanese could provide bikes with that "something"that our Guzzies for instance, can provide. They are just too damn good and sorta' "perfect"...Do you have a figure for Newton metres of torque at that rpm and what the max figure is @ what revs. That thing must pull like a 14 year old.

[ohiorider]

Being a Honda (Jap bike) there's won't be some stupid electrical drama that's at play so good for you and enjoy. Damn though, I just wish the Japanese could provide bikes with that "something"that our Guzzies for instance, can provide. They are just too damn good and sorta' "perfect"...Do you have a figure for Newton metres of torque at that rpm and what the max figure is @ what revs. That thing must pull like a 14 year old.

Huzo, I hear what you're saying.  And I don't yet have torque figures for the bike.  HP wise, I believe it is rated at about 85hp.  Unlike so many in-line fours, the redline is 8500rpm, not way higher.  What's not perfect (yet) for me is the suspension.  Good news is, most of the owners on the CB website seem to think I can cure the abrupt suspension with lighter/less fork oil.  Other than that, she's a sweet ride.

Having said that, I took the 1200 Sport out for 60 miles or so today, after spending the morning on the CB, and the Sport felt super.  They are totally different motorcycles!

[Lannis]

Having said that, I took the 1200 Sport out for 60 miles or so today, after spending the morning on the CB, and the Sport felt super.  They are totally different motorcycles!

I'm sure the Honda CB is an excellent motorcycle, and if I were ever to "ride the other bus" and get a 4 cylinder UJM, it would be that or a Bandit .... but once you're used to a Guzzi, it's hard to change.

On a ride on my Cal III with some friends once, I swapped bikes with a guy with a Kawasaki Vulcan 800, same "sort" of bike as the Cal III in my mind, same seating position anyhow.

I thought something was broken or it had a flat tire or something.   But no ... it's the way they handle compared to a Guzzi ....

Lannis

[ohiorider]

Being a Honda (Jap bike) there's won't be some stupid electrical drama that's at play so good for you and enjoy. Damn though, I just wish the Japanese could provide bikes with that "something"that our Guzzies for instance, can provide. They are just too damn good and sorta' "perfect"...Do you have a figure for Newton metres of torque at that rpm and what the max figure is @ what revs. That thing must pull like a 14 year old.

Huzo, I found a Cycle World road test on the 2013 CB1100, complete with a DynaJet torque (ft/lb) and hp graph.  Not a torque monster, but it has a nice flat torque "curve."

http://www.cycleworld.com/2013/07/02/2013-honda-cb1100-road-test-review-photos-specs

Torque
52@2000
57@3000
60@4000
64.7@5000 (max torque)
60@6000
60@7000
50@8000

82.5hp@7000

The RWHP number sounds a bit high to me, but dynos being dynos .............??

Bob