Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Daleroso on August 29, 2019, 09:20:47 AM
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Are they more reliable? Are they less expensive? Are they sexier? Do they have a better dealer network/support? Are more accessories available for them? (Euro Cycles in Reno, worse dealer I've ever experienced, doesn't stock anything for MG. The'll "order it.") They've won more races? Is red more popular? Just wondering.
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In the early 80s, Ducati was making less than 2000 bikes per year. Cagiva then did an incredible brand building job for approximately 10 years, 1987-1997, initially hiring the best designer in the world (Massimo Tamburini), setting him up in a new design facility and then pouring money and resources into a successful World Superbike racing program. After that TPG (an American investment company) bought the company and in its tenure fixed most of the remaining reliability/maintainability issues. Once that kind of thing is established it takes on a life of its own, the name becomes a reason to buy and buyers are less critical of how the product itself evolves.
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Less weight, less wheel base, more power..faster. Sexier.
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Ducati appeals more to a younger base of riders that value sex appeal, than Guzzi does.
Face it.. none of us have much sex appeal any more.
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I remember Ducati being popular with Hollywood, sports, and music celebrities, those who had that kind of cash. And then it probably became a matter of following your role model.
-AJ
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The Monster.
Are they more reliable? Are they less expensive? Are they sexier? Do they have a better dealer network/support? Are more accessories available for them? (Euro Cycles in Reno, worse dealer I've ever experienced, doesn't stock anything for MG. The'll "order it.") They've won more races? Is red more popular? Just wondering.
They aren't more reliable, though we've found ours to be nearly flawless.
They aren't less expensive, not only was ours more expensive it costs WAY more to service.
Sexier - well Jenn bought ours over a V7...and only later only picked a "sexier" V7.
Better dealer network - I think so, though it's not by a huge margin.
Races - more lately, so that probably has some draw.
You didn't ask if they performed better though? And honestly if low weight and high hp (in an Italian bike) is your priority, they have an advantage there for some. Not for me, but certainly for a number of other people.
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Ducati is pretty savvy using a few basic engines but coming up with new cutting edge models every year. Ducati will warrant their products and have many more service depts while staying loyal to its performance image. In the last 10 years Guzzi has treated their legacy bikes like orphans, has seen it's dealer network dry up and has difficulty getting a new model out every few years with attendant flaws and reliability issues. The brand itself has been hodged podged with no defining image.
So the advantage goes to Ducati regarding product, image and support.
I probably could've been more tactful but that is the answer.
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The Monster.
They aren't more reliable, though we've found ours to be nearly flawless.
They aren't less expensive, not only was ours more expensive it costs WAY more to service.
Sexier - well Jenn bought ours over a V7...and only later only picked a "sexier" V7.
Better dealer network - I think so, though it's not by a huge margin.
Races - more lately, so that probably has some draw.
You didn't ask if they performed better though? And honestly if low weight and high hp (in an Italian bike) is your priority, they have an advantage there for some. Not for me, but certainly for a number of other people.
"Sex appeal" to a greater number of riders than Guzzi.
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Less weight, less wheel base, more power..faster. Sexier.
I'm with ya on this one except for the sexier thing. Don't know what that means? Never have I had, an erection, a franticly, or performed a sex act with a motorcycle. As Bill would say.... " I did not have sexual relations with that motorcycle".
Both Kev's wife and some guys here find the Guzzi sexy.... I'm sooooo confused. :sad:
Paul
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I'm with ya on this one except for the sexier thing. Don't know what that means? Never have I had, an erection, a franticly, or performed a sex act with a motorcycle. As Bill would say.... " I did not have sexual relations with that motorcycle".
Both Kev's wife and some guys here find the Guzzi sexy.... I'm sooooo confused. :sad:
Paul
It's ok that language confuses you...
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I pretty much knew the answers but got good validating feedback. I did forget to ask if they had more seductive models at the shows.
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My 96 900 Monster is thrilling to ride fast or slow...For me it's a mechanical feel of the bike..It's also lightweight...
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Ducati appeals more to a younger base of riders that value sex appeal, than Guzzi does.
Face it.. none of us have much sex appeal any more.
Thus, the ongoing tale of....."The Guzzi Geezer!!" - - - Dooooooohhhhh!!! :laugh: :grin: :wink: :shocked: :huh: :rolleyes:
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Are they more reliable?
More? Well, they never used to be. The quality has dramatically improved since at least 2010. Some issues- fuel tank swelling, fuel sending units, other items have been problematic for some. I had an original Diavel...was 100% reliable for me. I even did the valve/belt service. It was much more involved, but not all that hard. Bike was well designed to make all of that not very difficult. Mine was bullet proof, so was a buddy's 1200 Multistrada with over 30k miles.
Are they less expensive?
No. You pay for the technology. They have this in spades. Some of the best handing bikes you can buy.
Are they sexier?
This is always depending on what a person considers sexy. Ducati is the ultimate Italian motorcycle design. They have some iconic bikes that just look right.
Do they have a better dealer network/support?
Do they sell better? Then they have more dealers. I show twice as many Ducati dealers than Guzzi dealers around the lower Lake MI area.
Are more accessories available for them?
The superstore near me sells everything but KTM. They stock more Ducati stuff than Piaggio stuff, but hardly any accessories for anything. Most accessories they can get in a week, so they don't divert $$ to something they may not sell. It mostly sells with a new bike purchase anyway. Guzzi, is one of the worst sellers for them. They only keep them around to sell Aprilia and Vespa.
They've won more races?
At least in this century.
Ducati is now more diverse than ever. You can find just about any fit of bike you need...except a touring cruiser or off-road. The Multistrada could be one of the best executed bikes ever...power, light weight, comfort, and able to tour. The liquid 4-valve twin that powers the Diavel, Multi, and 1200 Monster is a brute. Twist the throttle on a bike with one and you will see the light of why Ducati is so desirable. Eyeball flattening acceleration while sounding amazing. I'll own another someday...
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They're equally popular at my house :evil:
(https://i.ibb.co/yFgFmgx/20180928-121122.jpg) (https://ibb.co/yFgFmgx)
Paul B :boozing:
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They're equally popular at my house :evil:
(https://i.ibb.co/yFgFmgx/20180928-121122.jpg) (https://ibb.co/yFgFmgx)
Here the Duc is outnumbered 2:1 by the Geese.
And until this past week was outnumbered 2:1 by the Harleys... but now they're dead even, unless we go by weight or CCs, then the Harley still is at LEAST DOUBLE the Ducati hmmmmm if we go by HP I think it's about a dead heat again :shocked: :grin: :boozing:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/TiPba1Vk5qKeGcTJdHRD1TkJZ107pmxUUmAEvOwu_BQ4JgunCrRT8rugG8aQfIUqnQqRjWNamKzjPAUvFIVtaGw3npQFP7TXK9xk8AirdeSE00sa3zCbCG9yMltxmHWutWL3n2bfCul2H-FcQGq7FXKlz8cblJMIDcWU0ChT7RZcm68T8h7WlZ3Qs9MrL4kh_6wLdm6HKvZGR_axHE1OxcFj1tb2CnIMWXWyOpBgr7LYT6Zj-VF4bj9bAt9BWHEpHiyaJIP4QK9Dk1aC9LB4xF32ldx6JrF_r9yYz3M2seH9qIRAIbZdus1yJhBFfslN0nMeEJ814lmddWiEZ1iWb6JGQyvQbGOqQOJiM13quU0fwmopp9M6VSDj3QCuvLILhbOiBzFXNAWYd-lsT6cc-JTQXpHSZ1JeNq4JH0gy-aTb7KN5b5XCRociB-9m8Zjih9T8KB9EcyoryHMQji-41rQdrf5t5lLomTcXQQgP-z4Y5rQGOVCM5HROBN5IKRAPavU7pMZ2zMqkU1ZofvL4k1NEOycKz0HolT_6xOtlUguhHQ7UyDcWboBIbZc_9Z_r9iiU7ibvvl9IOCNst7fzE7WHp46X_Zhjk15rr6ruUbDqY4eu9AcA7mb3htJ1BA62JVKWj1zzhXW091y3wpa_5CoOHN3rZyTWMgHT4LXDQ2KarGxQwreBwfCzZU4B3hPKuPtVaXPbPIdHNRap5fQOf7shXQ=w1124-h843-no)
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My MG Cali is a super fun machine for the more relaxed rides. The attached sidecar is fun also. Comfortable, reasonably reliable, affordable to buy & maintain. I love that beauty. My 30 yr. old Ducati 851 is definitely "sexy", sounds amazing, runs fabulous, lightweight, fast enough for just 105hp which is more than enough for a 73 yr. old 230 lb. 6'2" guy who refuses to grow up. The Race Replica riding position is uncomfortable to say the least, which limits rides to short durations. Bout all I can take...BUT......tha t old beast makes my blood run faster & hotter and I love her. It has made me lose some weight & shape up some, which can't be a bad thing. Ya only live once.
Definitely much more access in my Palm beach County Florida region for quality Ducati service. MG= not good at all. I love 'em both, along with my Triumph T-Bird Sport- with it's comfy upright riding position.
The new 200hp Ducs don't interest me. Can't fit on 'em anyway & what the heck would I do with the extra hp??
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Ducati's dealer network?
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Are they more reliable? Are they less expensive? Are they sexier? Do they have a better dealer network/support? Are more accessories available for them? (Euro Cycles in Reno, worse dealer I've ever experienced, doesn't stock anything for MG. The'll "order it.") They've won more races? Is red more popular? Just wondering.
1. The Cagiva save helped them continue on through the early 80s and help them survive until;
2. The Superbike rule allowing 1L twins vs 750 fours made them a household name.
That's a pivotal time that connects vintage Ducati with modern Ducati. The Brits were gone, and BMW and Guzzi had moved away from modern racing.
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Being a younger member of this board take this with a grain of salt. Imo i think Ducati is better advertised and has more visibility in the public eye. Guzzi for what it is very obscure brand for most people. Half the time i fill up i get guys who are confused asking what kind of motorcycle it is. Guzzi are awesome, relatively fast but i think it's comparing Apple's and oranges.
If i had the money id buy a Griso first and than a Aprilia Tuono. Id think about a Ducati after that. I think in reality Aprilia is kind of Moto Guzzi's racing and technology division. I understand they are merely owned by the same company.
I think a better comparison is Aprilia vs Ducati.
Just my 2 cents. Love the topic.
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Ducati is 'cooler' than Guzzi for sure, that's just perception but they have done a great deal of excellent marketing work to back it up. The bikes are perceived as very fast and very exotic.
To me the number one issue is dealer network. EVEN if you know what a Guzzi is, where the hell can you buy one? Maybe a single dealer per state...
Once you get one, who's gonna work on it? No dealers + no support and no mechanics. I know a lot of you old codgers will say "work on it yourself" and while that was all well and good in the days of points & carbs, it's just not the way people live now--- not to mention the warranty aspect or the fact every bike they produce needs to go thru two generations before the kinks and niggles are all sorted out. Couple that with the fact that even when dealers are present, most of them turn over every few years, so if you buy new from a dealer, chances are they will have dropped the brand before your warranty is even up.
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The last sexy bike made by Moto Guzzi was the MGS-01 and it was t readily available to the public. Before that is was Daytona RS. So to recap: 2001 and 1997 for a production model in a similar category as Ducati.
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Race success.
If Guzzi was leading WSBK, what would that do for it’s sales figures..?
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What Huzo says, they have been winning since Mike the bike in the 70's, Guzzi gave up in what, the fifties?
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Sex appeal = you can pick up hotter chicks on a Ducati, than on a Guzzi! The only exception is a sidecar rig.... I have had pretty girls ask me for a ride in my sidecar, after turning down a ride on a Harley! On the other end of the spectrum, I also had a very conservative , but younger catholic Nun, ask me for a ride, which I gladly gave. About 9-10 nuns were out for dinner at a restaurant, sitting outside,waiting for a table to open up, when she asked me. Told me she was a "farm girl" growing up, and loved riding atvs on the family farm. :bow:
You should have seen all the other sisters clapping and cheering, as we came back after the little ride ! It was sooo much fun!! :thumb:
Sorry about the thread drift,
Rick.
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Sex appeal = you can pick up hotter chicks on a Ducati, than on a Guzzi! The only exception is a sidecar rig.... I have had pretty girls ask me for a ride in my sidecar, after turning down a ride on a Harley! On the other end of the spectrum, I also had a very conservative , but younger catholic Nun, ask me for a ride, which I gladly gave. About 9-10 nuns were out for dinner at a restaurant, sitting outside,waiting for a table to open up, when she asked me. Told me she was a "farm girl" growing up, and loved riding atvs on the family farm. :bow:
You should have seen all the other sisters clapping and cheering, as we came back after the little ride ! It was sooo much fun!! :thumb:
Sorry about the thread drift,
Rick.
No mate..
I REALLY like where this is going... :drool:
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Giving nuns a ride is not on my to do list.
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What Huzo says, they have been winning since Mike the bike in the 70's, Guzzi gave up in what, the fifties?
I saw Baldwin win at Charlotte in 1977 on a LeMans!
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Giving nuns a ride is not on my to do list.
There’s more material here than a linen factory..
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I saw Baldwin win at Charlotte in 1977 on a LeMans!
Then there's Dr. John's wins...
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Paul Smart winning the Imola 200 6 years before Hailwood won at the IOM didn't hurt .
Dusty
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Paul Smart winning the Imola 200 6 years before Hailwood won at the IOM didn't hurt .
Dusty
Both are important historically but were irrelevant to the market by the early-mid 80s when effective Japanese sport bikes came out and Ducati was almost dead, selling 1500 bikes a year and Government owned. The reason that is not the case now is Cagiva (CRC), the desmoquattro engine, 1990s Superbike racing, Carl Fogerty etc. by the late 90s Ducati was selling 60,000 bikes a year and they have never looked back in terms of sales.
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I have a limited knowledge set, only having owned two Guzzis and two Ducatis. I traded my last Guzzi, and very nice, well sorted 2015 Stelvio in on my current Ducati Multistrada 950. The duck is 150 pounds lighter, which at my age (67) counts for a lot. The ride by wire and the riding modes that go with it are big pluses for the Duck. Fuel economy is better on the Duck. THe Duck does not vibrate like an industrial paint shaker. The Stevio had a much better seat. If Idrop the Duck, there is a decent chance I can get it back on its wheels myself - not so with the Stelvio.
The Stelvio was a really good bike, despite the weight and vibration. The Duck is lighter, quicker and more of a blast to ride - and the Stelvio was no slouch. THe Duck is way more sexy - at least in my exprience as it is the only bike I have ever owned that elicited favorable commentary from persons of the female persuasion. Maintenance is higher on the Duck if you have the valve adjustments done by the dealer, but it is doable by a decent home mechanic if you take your time and there is a ton of assistance on the web and good videos of the process.
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Oh - and I just rememberd. There are a lot of old pharts riding Ducks. Maybe the demographic is slightly less aged than the Guzzi folks, but not by much. But the Guzzi folks ride a heck of lot more mileage. Seems a bunch of the other folks have multiple Ducatis, but don't accumalate a bunch of miles on any of them.
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They're equally popular at my house :evil:
(https://i.ibb.co/yFgFmgx/20180928-121122.jpg) (https://ibb.co/yFgFmgx)
Paul B :boozing:
OK, I'm 2:1 Guzzi but my Guzzi criticism remains. My new bike is a Duc
(https://g4.img-dpreview.com/D628EC341DCE4F28886578E858C2B1A1.jpg)
(https://g4.img-dpreview.com/41243FEB29E74958B360D3C9DA31968F.jpg)
(https://g3.img-dpreview.com/70F3A0724B7A4AD08C5FF66D9DFC7573.jpg)
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my son has whatever the high horsepower multistrada was in 2011. with hoses going everywhere and flat paint, i think it is as ugly as home made sin. it is fast as hell, but very nervous, like a thoroughbred horse that hates being held back. if you hit a bump and you hand jiggles, you will gain 5 mph and then overcorrect so it is jerky. the suspension is electrically adjustable and is real nice except he has some electrical gremlins. it uses michelin pilot road 5s and is a standard fitment to most sport bikes and sport tourers, so a plus for finding tires as long as you don't care about the on road-off road type of tires. the seat leans forward slightly pushing your junk into the tank, this with a sargent seat and the seating area allows no shifting. wind coverage with a cal sci shield is pretty good. so, i let him ride the new v85. he is 32, so finally has some sense. he loved the perfect fueling and the totally relaxing riding feeling. when he is behind me, i often see him stretching his legs down. i think if he rides mine a few more times, he may head to enzo's to see about a trade. after all, power like that is fun the first dozen times you roll your eyeballs back, but when you are going 400-500 miles in a day, its not everything. only one small comparo, on the whole i love the look of the slightly older air cooled ducati sportbikes 898, 900ss, 916, even the paso, the monster with its air cooled beauty hanging proud for all to see. kind of what i like about the guzzi too, air cooled in the breeze. there are cool looking guzzis from days gone by as well. good discussion.
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Blu, consider:
950 Multistrada
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Ducati is more “popular”, in my humble opinion,because of the introduction of the Multistrada. It sold more Ducks than anything ever had. That kept the dealer network in good shape and gave them momentum to build on their offerings. Guzzi May have their own Multi in the V85, however the dealer network is much, much worse than Ducati’s.
As for the twitchy suspension of the 2011, it is much less capable than the air cool 1100S with fully adjustable Ohlins
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I don't wish to rub salt into the wound, but, seriously, this thread is like an exercise in masochism. Why is Porsche popular? I mean we here at Volkswagen make German cars too? Why do so many people buy Porsche's? Is because they're, by and large, lighter, faster, sexier, as reliable, sexier (yeah, I said sexier twice), and have a terrific dealer network, is that it? Did I get it right? Are those the reasons? Why so many people buy them? Are those...the...re... .sons....?
Jeeesus.
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Ducati is more “popular”, in my humble opinion,because of the introduction of the Multistrada. It sold more Ducks than anything ever had. That kept the dealer network in good shape and gave them momentum to build on their offerings. Guzzi May have their own Multi in the V85, however the dealer network is much, much worse than Ducati’s.
As for the twitchy suspension of the 2011, it is much less capable than the air cool 1100S with fully adjustable Ohlins
I reckon the Monster could/should share some of that kudos....No ?
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I'd think It would be that Ducati is more prominent in the public arena than Guzzi. Just turn on your TV any weekend and you'll see The World Super Bike ChampionShips, Moto GP just to name 2. And who features prominently on these 2 events, not Moto Guzzi.
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(https://i.ibb.co/VVmJfg4/image.jpg) (https://ibb.co/VVmJfg4)
Guzzis can be really sexy too.
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Guzzis can be really sexy too.
He seemed to think so...
(https://i.ibb.co/Srf7108/085-ACABF-6-ADD-462-A-93-E9-3-A2-E966-F3-E66.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Srf7108)
(She’d be not much short of 70 now, wonder whether she’s still as smokin’ hot as the Le Mans?)
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I'd think It would be that Ducati is more prominent in the public arena than Guzzi. Just turn on your TV any weekend and you'll see The World Super Bike ChampionShips, Moto GP just to name 2. And who features prominently on these 2 events, not Moto Guzzi.
what tv channel can you see this on? I can only find WSB on premium channels that cost extra and BEin Tv with MotoGP is not even on directv. If wsb is on directv, what channel?
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I don't wish to rub salt into the wound, but, seriously, this thread is like an exercise in masochism. Why is Porsche popular? I mean we here at Volkswagen make German cars too? Why do so many people buy Porsche's? Is because they're, by and large, lighter, faster, sexier, as reliable, sexier (yeah, I said sexier twice), and have a terrific dealer network, is that it? Did I get it right? Are those the reasons? Why so many people buy them? Are those...the...re... .sons....?
Jeeesus.
VW makes Porsches. VW makes Ducatis. None of the three are very sexy to me in 2019. One of them was once quite sexy... Guess which one.
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See, not long ago we saw that Guzzi eschewed the trend towards chasing increased sales by subliminal and/or overt displays of T & A.
Personally if two supermodels were together swapping lipstick on a Guzzi in a compromising position acting provocatively, it would not have one ounce of bearing as to whether I bought the bike or not..
But.
When you see a scarcely clad young lady with strategically placed back lighting, drawing your attention to the contact patch between herself and the seat of the bike, then compare that to Ewan Mc Gregor staring wistfully into the distance pondering how much he has to give to his (now estranged) wife...?
You can see which one will grab the attention of the young male would be owner.
Point is..
Guzzi will need to do more than build good bikes. They need to build bikes they can sell that are also...good bikes.
To do that they will need to get into bed with Bennetton or similar and sell accessories for new young owners so they don’t instantly look like old farts.
And get hold of the guy that looked after Triumph’s PR.
In a previous post some guy said, “ you pickup more chicks on a Ducati”, lamentably I think he’s right. There is something that draws the cashed up young computer geek to a Ducati and not a Guzzi. Guzzies don’t look “ modern”.
Regrettably, as it stands at present, I think the demographic that drifts this way, have already cleaned up the mess from their 40th birthday party, and decide they’d like a “ nice old man’s bike that’s all day comfortable””
It’ll need to change.
The new Le Mans will need to kick butt.
Guzzi may not be able to pull a rabbit out of a hat !
But with a bit of effort..a hare out of their arse...?
Or all they’ll do for the next 99 years is sell IC engined and electric bikes to old blokes in the twilight of their motorcycling careers...(like me.. :clock: :bike-037:)
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I reckon the Monster could/should share some of that kudos....No ?
The scrambler sold in large numbers also .
Sorry , that Multistrada thing is one ugly motorbike . Gak :laugh:
Dusty
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There is something that draws the cashed up young computer geek to a Ducati and not a Guzzi. Guzzies don’t look “ modern”
(https://photos.smugmug.com/Ducati/i-tJGR72s/0/18eff4fa/M/IMG_0052-M.jpg) (https://fotoguzzi.smugmug.com/Ducati/i-tJGR72s/A)
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Not sure I can answer the popularity question or speak to the more modern Ducatis. But I will say that my 2013 small block V7 Guzzi has been, beyond question, my all time favorite bike for 6 years now. That is, until I got an old 1996 2 valve 900SS. That Ducati just keeps growing on me. The more I ride it the more I like it. Might knock Guzzi out of #1 at some point. Not very modern—air cooled, carbs, no ABS.
The Guzzi is charming and engaging all day, in a sweet and gentle way. The Ducati is considerably more engaging; almost brutally visceral. Overall handling of the Ducati is very much better, as are brakes and engine power. It feels noticeable lighter.
Too early to have an opinion as to comparative reliability.
I think both the Guzzi and Ducati are exceptionally beautiful machines. Exposed air cooled engines, honest, purposeful design, no extraneous plastic and gee-gaws.
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I've always considered Ducatis to be sportier, & Guzzis classier, than each other.
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Looking at the question there is only one correct answer
Dick’s Lexia
Of course Guzzis would be more popular than Ducati’s
Plural beats possessive, just a numbers game
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In the eyes of the unwashed masses, Ducati is an aspirational brand. Guzzi is not. Like Harley, Ducati is an iconic brand that non-motorcyclists recognize.
I get lots of comments about my 1400 but about half of them come from people who have never heard of Guzzi. When I had my ‘93 900SS, EVERYONE knew it was a Ducati. One of the reasons I sold it was the attention it drew.
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Timing & little luck
Imola 1972 & Paul Smart (Ducati didn’t expect to win), Paul commented in an interview how trick Jack Findlay’s Guzzi was but that’s racing...
Move forward to 1987 & the Daytona was looking good but they were having trouble finding the right alloy for the head, meanwhile Ducati released the 851 & Guzzi missed the boat. Shame really as the 1288 race engines were pushing over 140hp.
The LM3 was hugely popular but what did Guzzi follow with? 949cc & not much more. I love the Tonti framed bikes but when other manufacturers keep dropping new models more different from previous models where is the average punter going to drop their money?
When the Americans took over & updated the slab sided bikes they had had solid market share.
Oh & they couldn’t afford Hailwood who was positive about the V7 sport?
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I am with Smith. The Ducati is the girl you don't take home to meet Mama. The Guzzi is the girl you marry.
I think what I was saying is that the Duck makes demands on you and the Guzzi just takes care of business.
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At my last bike meet, I let a couple young guys ride my '00 V11 Sport. 2 didn't like it-- their opinion was that it was an "interesting bike that occasionally tries to kill you." The third thought that it had "character". He may have just been being polite.
Now, if I had put them out on one of those beautiful Duc 900's with that 2 valve air cooled engine, they probably would have fallen in love. The Ducati is lighter, handles better, and has an amazing engine (one of the best of all time, imo).
I can't blame them. The fact is that Ducatis work better from a rider's point of view. Guzzis are tractors for those of us who like tractors and their durability and big honkin' metal bits. And it's fun to rail around on a tractor sometime.
Edit: One of the things that I liked about the new V85tt during my test ride is that some of the tractor like qualities had been toned down a bit. It's smoother than most Geese. Kinda like a Duc.
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The press plays a part, too. Bikes in general, and Ducati in particular, are rewarded with high ratings as the horse power goes up.
I tend to keep all my motorcycle magazines, much to the displeasure of my wife, for years. Looking back at times at the reviews of the same model of bike reviews really shows that what was "unbelievable performance and all that" is "the old bike this replaces had XYZ faults addressed in the NEW bike" ad nauseum.
Having had the privilege of following some very accomplished riders I'm always aware how much the rider means to the equation as opposed to the bike. At least as interesting is that riding with these folks made me take plenty of training to up my game so as to be able to maintain contact with the group. Goal achieved, and suddenly it no longer had the satisfaction expected. But that's personal. The point is, as so many hunters know, "it's the gunner, not the gun". Geez, did I digress or what?
As an aside, if any of you snowmobile, which I'm sure some do, it's very similar to biking in that the highest horsepower sled with the latest race replica details is "always best in the shootouts". I recall being in the UP of Michigan with several others, one of which was a professional motocross racer. he had a 440 fan cooled sled-about like having a V7 and everyone else on the 140bhp plus bikes-in the sled world. I got a chance to ride this machine and could not believe how this man could be SO FAR ahead of all the rest of us, including some very talented amateur local racers. There's a point here somewhere.......... ...
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From what I read 2/3 of Ducati sales were and maybe still are Monsters...Take a ride on a Ducati, if you can't figure out why so many riders like them, you might want to check to see if you have a pulse....
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When I answered THE MONSTER earlier it was specifically because that is the bike whose sales they rode to much higher production numbers. Since then the Multi and the Scramblers have contributed to growth as well, but it was the Monster that got it started.
Edit: One of the things that I liked about the new V85tt during my test ride is that some of the tractor like qualities had been toned down a bit. It's smoother than most Geese. Kinda like a Duc.
I keep saying this. If there's a sliding scale between an old fashioned Guzzi big block (one end) and a modern Duc (other end) the V85 has slid closer to the Duc than any Guzzi before it. This is going to be positive for a lot of people, though it probably isn't so for me. But that doesn't mean I don't think it's a good idea for Guzzi. Especially if they do both, continue models that are closer to the Guzzi end of the scale while developing models closer to the Duc end of the scale.
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Not sure I can answer the popularity question or speak to the more modern Ducatis. But I will say that my 2013 small block V7 Guzzi has been, beyond question, my all time favorite bike for 6 years now. That is, until I got an old 1996 2 valve 900SS. That Ducati just keeps growing on me. The more I ride it the more I like it. Might knock Guzzi out of #1 at some point. Not very modern—air cooled, carbs, no ABS.
The Guzzi is charming and engaging all day, in a sweet and gentle way. The Ducati is considerably more engaging; almost brutally visceral. Overall handling of the Ducati is very much better, as are brakes and engine power. It feels noticeable lighter.
Too early to have an opinion as to comparative reliability.
I think both the Guzzi and Ducati are exceptionally beautiful machines. Exposed air cooled engines, honest, purposeful design, no extraneous plastic and gee-gaws.
Having owned both a '97 900ss like yours, and a V7ii, I understand completely. A '90s era Ducati is sort of like a modern Guzzi. Both need a little sorting out to make them mine. The '97 Ducati needed a few of its electrical connections sorted (like regulator and alternator) and the Guzzi had an oil leak from the alternator cover, plug wires, etc...It's really not fair to compare them from a performance standpoint, as the 900SS/SP model I had was equipped with fully adjustable Showa, and the V7 with junk basically. The 900 on a tight twisty road is magical. I miss that and will probably get another. While looks are subjective, the later, fuel injected Terblance versions worked even better.
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Now, if I had put them out on one of those beautiful Duc 900's with that 2 valve air cooled engine, they probably would have fallen in love. The Ducati is lighter, handles better, and has an amazing engine (one of the best of all time, imo).
Correct. That old 2 valve Duck engine is not the most powerful, rip-snorting motor ever made, but it is absolutely enchanting.
I was surprised how often people would walk up and comment on my Guzzi. Well, that has been nothing compared to the Ducati.
My only complaint about the Ducati so far is that Dusty invokes some kind of obscure “noise ordinance” and requires me to shut off the Ducati engine when I’m 1000 feet from the Cedar Vale pavilion. I think he’s just jealous of that dry clutch symphony.
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They have dominated WSBK and won a motogp series and contiune to be one of the main contenders, the most important part all in living memory. Yes Guzzi did some stuff 65odd years ago, however you can't draw a link between the machines of then and what they make now, well other than completely obsolete :P .