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General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: wirespokes on January 21, 2020, 02:33:05 PM
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Matteo just informed me someone won the Iron Butt on a LM3. Searching the web didn't find anything, at least not what I wanted. Do any of you have the story? Who was this and when did it happen?
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I forget the year but many years ago a young English fella, 1st time in the US won it on a LM running on 1cyl with minutes to spare.
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I remember reading about that on the MGNOC before Al invented the interneck. And yes, he did finish on one lung. At the time, I remember being amazed that he'd done it on a stock LeMans saddle. That's one TOUGH limey! That thing is like an old growth oak 2x6.
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That would be Steve Attwood (sp?) in 1993, on an '83 LMIII. He DNF'd in 1997.
See https://www.ironbutt.org/ibrfacts.htm and search for 'Guzzi'.
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That would be Steve Attwood (sp?) in 1993, on an '83 LMIII. He DNF'd in 1997.
See https://www.ironbutt.org/ibrfacts.htm and search for 'Guzzi'.
I'm pretty sure that he is the one that showed up at the Maryland Rally at Thurmont afterwards on his bike. Quite impressive. John Herring could verify this.
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Did he win? Or just finish? Hard to believe and LM3 won the event.
Mke
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http://www.five-minute-fiction.com/nonfiction/wheels/wheels.html
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Thanks guys! Now I'll try to find some pictures and something about him.
A stock LM3??? Unbelievable!!! :bow:
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"The Iron Butt Association (IBA) organises the IBR every two years, but also sponsor a number of rather less demanding events and challenges. The easiest of them all, the entry level challenge as it were, is the Saddlesore 1000 (SS1K). This comprises riding 1000 miles in 24 hours or less."
I've done the SS1K in July 2008 in 22 hours, on a V11 Rosso Mandello with stock seat... Afterward, my b#tt was numb for about two days... :D
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Matteo just informed me someone won the Iron Butt on a LM3. Searching the web didn't find anything, at least not what I wanted. Do any of you have the story? Who was this and when did it happen?
Welcome to 1993 !!!
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From a website called UK GSer.com: https://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php/282425-2012-Royal-British-Legion-Iron-Butt-1000-Are-you-tough-enough-June-22-24/page5
"British Invasion!
Steve Attwood, a management consultant from Ampthill, Bedfordshire, England, shipped his 1983 Moto Guzzi MK III LeMans to the United States to compete in the Iron Butt. While the rest of the field of 41 riders came equipped with radar detectors and laptop computers (for navigation), Steve showed up with a set of simple AAA maps and an iron will to finish.
Eleven days and 12,458 miles later, Attwood won the Iron Butt Rally by a decisive 1,751 points (only 6 points separated the top three in 1991)! Steve overcame enormous odds to win the rally. Besides the handicap of locating remote bonuses (imagine finding places like Lee's Ferry, Arizona or Kelso, California in Europe on a rally of this type), Attwood had to deal with flat tires (the '83 Guzzi uses tube- type tires which require time-consuming wheel removal to repair) and had to replace wheel bearings in Florida. On the last day of the rally, with just 150 miles to go, the LeMans refused to start. Attwood traced the problem to a broken ignition coil and with just three hours remaining before being time-barred and eliminated from the rally, Attwood pulled out a spark plug and rode the final leg on one cylinder. With just 29 minutes remaining, he limped into the final checkpoint in Mansfield, Texas with the Moto Guzzi sounding like a large air-compressor rolling down the road.
Great Britain has thrown done the gauntlet to the American Long Distance Endurance Riding Community. Is the U.S. up to returning the Iron Butt crown to the States in 1995? Only time will tell!
Fast forward to 1995 and bad luck reared its ugly head. Steve hit a deer on day 3 and was uninjured but did not finish the rally."
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Some years ago I attended a lecture from a professional long distance rider. Prudhoe Bay to Key West in 87 hours or something like that.
During the Q and A he was asked about which record of his would last the longest. One he could take to his grave. He reported 1,400 miles in 24 hours. Huh? I've done 1,000. That distance doesn't seem too much more. He replied "Yes, but I never left the confines of the City of San Francisco." He had planned out a circuit route with the fewest number of traffic lights and then just went round and round for 24 hours. Men in white coats and big nets arriving soon.
Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA
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Thanks guys! Now I'll try to find some pictures and something about him.
A stock LM3??? Unbelievable!!! :bow:
You bet, especially considering how "hilariously slow" Guzzis are compared to other bikes! :grin: :grin: :grin:
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Guzzis, hilariously slow??? Where'd that come from? Is that a common perception?
I guess from a Japanese sport bike perspective, maybe. A friend, when asked about racing his airhead, said "sure! I'll race you to the end of the next state!". They're not drag racers, more like endurance machines in it for the long haul.
Sounds like Attwood is quite a guy! Hard to believe he had all those troubles and still won. That's really impressive.
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I dunno how his arse stood the punishment, he must be from Sydney or San Francisco..?:wink: :kiss:
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Guzzis, hilariously slow??? Where'd that come from? Is that a common perception?
I read it on the Internet. It must be true!!
https://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=104170.0 Reply #10. I'm sure I got it right ..... :angel:
Lannis
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Steve's story was an incredible tale.
During the Iron Butt Rally he would do extra miles every day and the last night he limped in on the Guzzi running on one cylinder, IIRC.
Just an inspiration. I did read recently, within the past few years that he actually sold that LeMans...!
Go Guzzi.
rad__
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(https://i.postimg.cc/bwPwqS5S/20200123-094942.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/9rxhp0Cc)
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(https://i.postimg.cc/vTzbB3k1/20200123-094951.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/8fjqXB1D)
(https://i.postimg.cc/yd6kT3KS/20200123-095919.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/B8ySS6Xq)
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(https://i.postimg.cc/wTZbNhz3/20200123-095010.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/YhN3KLhw)
Cheers
Min
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Thanks for taking the trouble to photograph and post that!! Answers all the questions ...
Lannis
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awesome thanks min!
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I do like the way that Attwood won that year with NO electronic aids, NO radar detectors, none of the stuff that people think is essential for even a ride to the corner these days ... AND did it on tubed tires, patching one quickly and still making the checkpoint ....
Lannis
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Thank you Min - great read!
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Yep, good read! THANKS for posting!
I did a saddle sore and a bun burner in one loop in 2007 on the Tiger, I have no need to try that again. Those guys are ANIMALS!
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Guzzis, hilariously slow??? Where'd that come from? Is that a common perception?
When compared to a modern bike and we are not just talking sports bikes, yes they are, someone won something almost 30 years ago on a 7 year old bike so they must be fast? is this the logic we are hanging on to?
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Murray - a bike that can do 130 or 140 is plenty fast. Others may get there a few seconds faster, but as attested by Steve's accomplishment, there's more to winning a long distance race than top speed or quarter mile sprints.
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Murray - a bike that can do 130 or 140 is plenty fast. Others may get there a few seconds faster, but as attested by Steve's accomplishment, there's more to winning a long distance race than top speed or quarter mile sprints.
130mph guzzi even on the most sporting versions you need a lot of room a lot of paitence and you are kicking the snot out of the thing and probablly not stock unless you have a Daytona RS or Racing, it might be possible on a 4 valve griso however you'd be doing you best impression fo a human windsock, however you missed the point. Back in 1993 (27 years ago) the bench mark of a modern sport bike was around a 100hp Guzzis 80ish wasn't miles away from that. Currently the benchmark for a modern sports bike is 180-200hp, not to mention the massive advances in geometry suspension brakes that has happened over that time.
Suggesting Guzzi's are fast is a bit like a HD fan claiming the sporster is a sport bike it's hanging onto the past and ignoring the present. The difference is a lot more than a few secounds. I.m not trying to discount Steve's achievemnt I am saying its is of its time and that should be reconized as that. Not a poster child for the current reality.
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Murray - There's a point at which there are diminishing returns. Sure - a bike from the '80s doesn't have as much HP, the suspension or the brakes, as newer stuff. I've ridden newer bikes so I'm not unfamiliar with the game. What I'm saying is that when it comes to the real world, conditions on public highways, anything over 90 or 100mph doesn't count, except for passing. And the newer bikes, as we've seen, with their complexity, aren't necessarily more durable than the simpler machines from a bygone era.
How much do you really gain with a bike that will do 200mph when speed limits are 80?
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All competitive long distance rides are won by excellent planning of complex routing, plus the stamina and will power to stay alive 'til the finish. IOW care and consideration of what the bonuses may do or undo for you. Include making all arrivals at designated spots, on time. Easy to imagine? Did you include that ferry schedule, surprise need for repairs, highway construction? Tire, oil changes? sleep? Your health. The constant record keeping alone requires more attention than many people can give.
Patrick Hayes referred to John Charles Ryan. John, a type 1 diabetic, set many long distance records on motorcycles (early on a K75. Many more riding an FJR - including Prudhoe Bay to Key West, FL.
'The Man Who Would Stop at Nothing' Melissa Holbrook Pierson.
Steve Attwood, Mike Kneebone & Robert Higdon have taken on many long complex rides through places many of us haven't heard of including challenges to their survival skills. Look for 'The Higdon Chronicles'. Higdon is/was 'scribe' for the Iron Butt Assoc.
It's not about speed? My best is 1600 in 24 hrs. I used to do them as needed and only West of the Mississippi; typically starting in Seattle, San Fransisco, Salt Lake City, etc. Do the math. My favorite Grosjean number. R3~
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And the newer bikes, as we've seen, with their complexity, aren't necessarily more durable than the simpler machines from a bygone era.
How much do you really gain with a bike that will do 200mph when speed limits are 80?
No they are typically better as someone said on this forum if you can fix it on the side of the road you probablly will.
Quiet a bit actually in intial acceleration engine response, gear changes, better brakes and handling.
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There was a guy named Fred Tausch who rode his R60 over 600,000 miles, supposedly without any engine work. There are quite a few stories about him. One that I recall went something like this. A group of sport riders blew by him, all heading to a BMW rally. Several hours later, they blew by him again. Later in the day, they again overtook him and kept on going. When they got to the rally, there he was sitting next to his tent, smoking and reading a book.
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There was a guy named Fred Tausch who rode his R60 over 600,000 miles, supposedly without any engine work. There are quite a few stories about him. One that I recall went something like this. A group of sport riders blew by him, all heading to a BMW rally. Several hours later, they blew by him again. Later in the day, they again overtook him and kept on going. When they got to the rally, there he was sitting next to his tent, smoking and reading a book.
I knew Fred , we compared notes on a couple of occasions . The legend of his R60/5 has grown over the years , and yes , it had some serious miles . However , ask any old BMW mechanic , there is no way the engine ran for 600K miles W/O some major work . Still , Fred was an interesting character, one of those people who made the BMW world fun back then .
Dusty
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BTW: Fred didn't smoke. Fred was the most frugal of all. An honest assessment regarding 600K miles? His bike never overnighted in a repair shop. Low speed, <than 40 mph, got him escorted off the MA Turnpike. Burnt valve. THAT valve was replaced. Another time it was a clutch, disc only.
When I 1st got the Daytona, 2000, Fred knew more about it than I. He was one of the kindest people I've known and brilliant. PhD in Physics, iirc. He taught at MIT.
At a local bike show the vintage bikes all looked pristine. People were marveling. I couldn't stand it and suggested they look in the parking lot - at Fred's bike. Fred had a way of engaging people in conversation, if they were 1st to speak. You would have the most engaging conversation ever and be treated as an equal. His bike is at Bob's bmw, museum, Maryland. As is with an accessory oil catch basin.
The only mc gear Fred wore was his open face helmet. Typically he would be wearing a suit jacket, pants that didn't match and black dress shoes, water proofed by oil soaking.
The legend (he would simply ignore that), lives on in many minds. R3~
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I knew Fred , we compared notes on a couple of occasions . The legend of his R60/5 has grown over the years , and yes , it had some serious miles . However , ask any old BMW mechanic , there is no way the engine ran for 600K miles W/O some major work . Still , Fred was an interesting character, one of those people who made the BMW world fun back then .
Dusty
Its the enthusiasm that counts..
Some time back I was on my way back from AR to CA on my Beemer and I stopped one morning at a McDonalds for a bite.
In the parking lot was a giant Goldwing+trailer rig. I walked in looked around and didn't see anyone that looked like a rider.
Just as I started my Mc something an old gentleman walked up in just street garb('bout mid 80s' And introduced himself w/smile.
He pointed to a lady of similar vintage,(she gave a smile and wave), across the room and said "My wife and I are on the Goldwing traveling and we saw you ride up. I remarked to her... now that is a real rider...BMW!"
Kept smiling the rest of the day.
:-)
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Just a data point , Kirby has done 1,000 miles a day on his CX 100 more than once coming from Tehachapi to Cedar Vale :bow:
Dusty
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I don't think it's too tough doing 1,000/day on the interstate. Several years back I rode the 100GSPD 3,000 miles from Portland Oregon to eastern PA for the 90S rally in 3 1/2 days. One of the days was close to a thousand miles. Rode till dark, set up the tent, slept till dawn, packed up and moved on. Wasn't even tired or sore when I got there. Didn't really push any speed limits either. Took it nice and easy, stopped at rest stops for my breaks and meals. Nothing to it. Those GSPDs are better tourers than RTs.
Back roads - that's different. Four or five hundred miles is a long day. But then again, it's a different purpose, and definitely more fun.
I mentioned Fred as a counterpoint to those who say the faster newer machines make it easier. I say it aint necessarily so.
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Well, having done the trip between SoCal and AR about 30 times in the last 10 or 12 years I'd say its hard to do 1000 miles in 24 hr.
I've done it all on the interstate and most on back roads and it takes a hard piece out of you to do 1K in 24.
If you take a couple of meal breaks of 30 min and 5 or 6 gas stops in a 0500 to 2030 day would require an average speed of about 78 mph.
I've done it and by taking no meal breaks just snacks and doing a gas and go on every other fuel stop.
Oh, and running at least + 10 when ever possible (or more).
That's on a R1150R.
Try it on a '81 CX100 with rear sets and clip-ons w/14" from the pegs to the seat (and it rides like a buckboard).
You have to be damn committed to getting there.
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I did a run once in my younger years from Denver Colo to Mystic Conn in my younger years. It was 1848 miles at least by the odometer in 46 hours. This was on a naked R75/5. I also got close to 6 hours sleep on the side of the road, a coupIe of quick naps. I sure couldn't do it today almost 50 years later due to age and probably couldn't maintain the speed I did due to traffic. I was in the Army at the time so I was in pretty good shape.
kk
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The GSPD has a 9 gallon tank, so that saved quite a bit of time. Two gas stops/day was about it. With plenty of food in the luggage, hit a rest stop, kick back for a bit then move on. Not at all stressful with the tank, wind screen, tank paniers and hand guards deflecting most of the wind. Can't imagine doing that kind of mileage on a LM3. Attwood must have an immunity to pain.
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The GSPD has a 9 gallon tank, so that saved quite a bit of time. Two gas stops/day was about it. With plenty of food in the luggage, hit a rest stop, kick back for a bit then move on. Not at all stressful with the tank, wind screen, tank paniers and hand guards deflecting most of the wind. Can't imagine doing that kind of mileage on a LM3. Attwood must have an immunity to pain.
Not going to flog a dead horse but, that moto of yours gets 50+ mpg is pretty good at 75 mph..wow. (have not a clue what a GSPD is but frugal is an understatement.)
And as grizzled as I am and motivated to get to destination I can't do much more than 3 hours,(one tank), w/o a stop but then I'm a boomer (among the first group).
A huge factor is the wx conditions as in tail wind, head wind, or worse of all a stiff crosswind.
Attwood has nothing on you!!
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A 4L fuel bladder with a hemostat on its fuel line to the main tank can keep you going through the nite; when fuel stops are scarce.
Wish I could still do that. R3~
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. (have not a clue what a GSPD is but frugal is an understatement.)
BMW R100GS, Paris-Dakar replica...
(https://i.ibb.co/nspzM8s/My-Bikein-VT-L.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nspzM8s)
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BMW R100GS, Paris-Dakar replica...
(https://i.ibb.co/nspzM8s/My-Bikein-VT-L.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nspzM8s)
Ah!
Thanks mike. Lots of leg room there!
I've done the run from Tehachapi to Rogers 30 or more times almost all on the slab and its tough to make 1000/24 even in mid summer ,no wx and the rare occasion w/20 kt average direct tailwind and riding from before sun up to well after sun down..still a test of your ability to withstand pain.
:-)
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its tough to make 1000/24 even in mid summer ,no wx and the rare occasion w/20 kt average direct tailwind and riding from before sun up to well after sun down..still a test of your ability to withstand pain.
:-)
I've done 1000/24 three times. Always needed a day to recover. Getting worse with age. I don't know how those IBA-types can do it for ten days straight!
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Not going to flog a dead horse but, that moto of yours gets 50+ mpg is pretty good at 75 mph..wow. (have not a clue what a GSPD is but frugal is an understatement.)
And as grizzled as I am and motivated to get to destination I can't do much more than 3 hours,(one tank), w/o a stop but then I'm a boomer (among the first group).
Attwood has nothing on you!!
Seems like most of my bikes get 50mpg on the highway. Some do a little less, but somewhere in the high 40s. I've heard of guys getting less, and some of mine were in the high 30s when I got them, but I stumbled through the tuning process and eventually brought them up to what seemed right to me.
I don't normally stay in the saddle three hours either. A lot of people think you don't need a larger gas tank if you can't ride all the way to the next fill up. Truth is, time is wasted at gas stations when the same amount of time could be spent resting and snacking, so the fewer times at the pump means more time resting. I think a couple hours is about my limit before a break.
Hey, I was taking it easy and not pushing it at all! I've done close to 1000 mile day, but it was a very long day. Didn't help that it was over 100 through the San Joaquin valley and was stopping at every rest stop to wet down the T and jeans. They'd be totally dry by the next one. Nah, Steve has it all over me! No way I could pull off a stunt like he did. He did close to another 50% more miles per day than most of mine. If you don't stop at restaurants, save on gas stops and keep up a steady pace the miles roll by. Doing something like Steve did takes some real determination, stamina and pushing the limits. I have no intention of doing things like that - the only reason I bombed across the continent like that was because I had work that had to get done so was delayed several days. Once I was on the road Sunday afternoon I realized I couldn't take the back roads and make it there by Thursday. At that point, the slab was the only answer.
Thanks for posting the photo of a PD, Rocker.
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And then there's Randy Tefft, NH MGNOC Rep. Coast to coast on a Rokon and smiling all the way. R3~
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By the way, while I wouldn't put myself in Attwood's class, I did a rather demanding Ironbutt ride some years ago on my 2008 Norge.
The details are here - http://www.ironbutt.com/rides/spacerace3600 (http://www.ironbutt.com/rides/spacerace3600) - although it looks like the association's server is having some issues right now.
Basically, I rode just over 3620 miles in 70 hours and 20 minutes.
The big block is an excellent mount for long-distance riding, and I have done many 1000 mile days on my Norge, my Stelvio, and even one on my Griso. I also did two on my Breva 750 while I had it...
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^^^^^^^
RESPECT!!!
:cool:
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As Count Basie was heard to utter: 'One more Once'.
The January 1994 issue of MGNOC News (MG 500cc V8 on cover),
page 4. "Iron Butt" by Steve Attwood, the man himself for 2-1/2 pages. BTW: Bob Higdon mentions Steve Attwood several times in his recent book "The Higdon Chronicles". Enjoy, R3~