Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: moto-uno on March 19, 2020, 03:51:58 PM
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If any members are familiar with this model and could fill me in on the pros or cons of owning one I'd
love to hear from you :) .Peter
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A local fellow in my area owns an Eldorado, and had the speedo replaced under warranty. Also I read on GuzziTech that the speedo can get misty from water vapor, and have water drops inside.
Recently there was a post about a Guzzi 1400 model "dropping the valves" and damaging the engine.
(https://i.ibb.co/1Qq4cL3/9j5EuBB.jpg) (https://ibb.co/1Qq4cL3)
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Recently there was a post about a Guzzi 1400 model "dropping the valves" and damaging the engine.
(https://i.ibb.co/1Qq4cL3/9j5EuBB.jpg) (https://ibb.co/1Qq4cL3)
THAT sounds like an anomaly.
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IMHO, the Eldorado 1400 is without doubt the most beautiful Moto Guzzi being made today. By a very wide margin. Some of the 2016 models had an electrical component (Demand Sensor) issue which, when it failed, the bike ran very poorly. By now it's a fairly well documented issue and should be quick to remedy 'if' there's an issue. So far, I haven't read of the Demand Sensor being an issue on the 2018 models. From what I've been able to put together, the biggest differences between the 2016 and 2018 is the updated cruise control and a change to higher European emissions standards on the 2018. The bikes are set up very lean from the factory and can run much better with an aftermarket ECU program. Which, just happens to be available on this forum from Beetle.
As you may have seen, new Moto Guzzis tend to last a while in the showrooms. There are a handful of excellent dealers around the country so please ask on this forum before you buy. A brand new 2018 Eldorado is already 2 model years old so the purchase price should, and often does, reflect that.
Depending on your current and past motorcycle experience, what you'll find out quickly about the Moto Guzzi brand is there's a very limited after market for these bikes and accessories tend to be quite expensive compared to just about any other brand. If you price some Polaris Indian accessories you'll get the idea.
The 1400 bikes, if set up properly from a good dealer, are a joy to ride and own. This forum is by far the largest and most active with many contributors having been here since its inception. Find your best deal on the 2018 Eldorado, buy it from an excellent dealer and you'll likely have it for many fun filled years to come.
Also as I'm sure you know, a Moto Guzzi is a whole lot easier to buy than to sell.
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I'll add my two cents. I own an Audace which is a very similar bike to the Eldorado. It is virtually the same except for some body work and I believe without checking front end geometry. It is by far the best bike I have ever owned. Fast, comfortable, good handling and a joy to look at, gets lots of comments. It was priced very well, well below MSRP. The dealer did add on a bunch of fees to recoup some of the low pricing. I paid $11,000 for mine but it was 2016 which I bought in July.
There was a bunch of hassle buying this bike however. It was advertised as new but had a bit over 500 miles on it. I assumed it was used as a demo but had actually been sold but had been repoed due to a fraudulent credit app. Anyway I bought the bike after some trials and tribulations. I actually had tried to buy the bike 3 years prior but the dealership didn't want to be bothered moving a bunch of bikes to get it out of the showroom. So I bought a Harley instead. Three years later after being fed up with the HD I went looking for another Audace, I had my heart set on this model. Anyway it turns out this was the same bike I had looked at 3 years prior. So before I got to the dealership to test ride it, they took it out for a spin to make sure all was well. During this warmup ride by the manager, it dropped a valve. Why? Who knows. Anyway Piaggio sent a new motor for it. I test rode it, loved it and bought it.
I have only 5,000 miles on it at this point with no problems other than an installation short coming in the new engine installation due to an improper sensor connector not being fully engaged. My other gripe is that the dashboard is hard to see in certain lighting conditions. I solved that by installing a Ram mount for my cell phone with a speedometer app. One or the other can be seen at all times now. My major issue with the bike isn't the bike at all but the dealer network. It is a group of three stores. The first one where I bought the bike messed up the paperwork resulting in nothing being mailed to me. They also got my phone number wrong, so the finance couldn't contact me and I couldn't contact them resulting in a couple of dings on my credit. The main dealership also screwed up the paperwork further. The third one never got a couple of due bills completed. So make sure you use a reliable dealer. I bought my bike in early July and wasn't able to get it registered until late October. When this was all going on I asked the first dealer if they could get another when the engine blew. I waited a month for the bike to be repaired. I was in the third dealer not too long ago and they had another Audace on the floor. I jumped all over the salesman, you couldn't get another aways back yet here is a new one. You had the last one for three years why would you gat another? "We got a good deal on it." All I can say for them is they gave me a good price for my Harley.
Sorry for all the ranting and raving but I kind of got wound up. It was absolutely the worst experience I have ever had buying any vehicle. We have had a dealership another 20 minutes further down the road that just took on MG so I am planning on checking them out soon. But you know what, it has all been worth it in the long run. I will also be looking at at a V7 for a second bike when finances allow. Good luck.
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Love my Eldo
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Thanks for all the hasty remarks , much appreciated . I'm going for a rode test at noon , kinda excited !
My last new motorcycle was a Le Mans 2 bought in 1983 , so it's been a while :azn: . I still have that Le Mans . Peter
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That’s wonderful! I’m looking forward to reading your thoughts on it. The. a Touring windshield, driving lights, bags etc can all be added.
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It's the best handling of the Cal 1400 series bikes. The difference is the 16" wheels and tires. Throwing it into Alpine style mountain roads with switchbacks is where the difference shines.
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I bought a used 2016 Eldo in January and have put 3,000 miles on her so far (10,000 total). This is my 4th Guzzi and it is great! I got a good trade in value for my 1991 Heritage Classic but I have owned quite a few bikes before the Harley. I am getting into my late 60's and just simply can't mount a high seat height bike anymore hence the Harley and Kawasaki Drifter that I had before. The Guzzi has plenty of power, great brakes, handles very well for the bike that it is and is fairly simple to work on (removal of the tank is not) but let's not fool ourselves anybody that owns a Guzzi has to know how to do his/her own wrenching. I'm getting 44mpg avg. twisties, mountains, desert and freeway. As noted above, the instrument readout is somewhat difficult to read depending on the light. I have been working on decreasing the wind resistance as it seems to be not as good as some other bikes that I have had but is livable. The bike is a wonderful cruiser and sporting at the same time as evidenced by the previous owner wearing down the sacrificials on the footboards down to nubs. The only thing that was done to the bike was Agostini pipes (I left the db killers in as the low rpm fueling gets messed up) and I added a Boosterplug which cures some low rpm fueling, Thermo-Tec exhaust wrap, a bat-wing style front fairing, spots, and will put in Custom Dynamics Truflex brake/run for better visibility on braking. I also bought a laptop to download Beetle's Guzzidiag format for analyzing any malfunctions. No need to remap as the motor runs great. I also put on Progressive 944 shocks and am contemplating going with Racetech gold valves/springs or the more expensive Traxxtion AK-20 cartridges. The front end works fine but it could work better and since I will need to change the front tire soon it becomes an option as I don't like to have to redo work. There is one thing that I have noticed here in SoCal, I have not seen another Eldo on the road. So, if you don't like being the cookie-cutter crowd Guzzi is perfect!
(https://i.ibb.co/NVMhjT1/harley-trade-1-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/NVMhjT1)
(https://i.ibb.co/BCgWPK8/guzzi-new-spots-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/BCgWPK8)
(https://i.ibb.co/QjjNhg1/guzzi-new-rear-shocks-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/QjjNhg1)
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We have a 2016 model. It drives and handles well.
The only issue was that it had a failed throttle position sensor which took nearly five months to resolve. This was a dealer service issue.
Half the people on this board immediately knew what it was. After using the Guzzi diagnostic software, so did I. The dealer? Not so much.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49158209496_ce84755434_b.jpg)
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I thought you were selling this bike?
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So the road test went well . I wasn't too impressed with the low speed running , both my carbureted bikes run smoother down low .
I've read that the "Booster plug" improves this . Any personal experiences would be much appreciated . Highway performance is rather
amazingly smooth and plenty of power . Thanks again for all inputs and hopefully more to come . Peter
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What rpm's were you running the bike on the test ride?
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The revs were from around 1800 to 4500 rpm . Under 2500 rpm was not too smooth . Peter
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I wasn't too impressed with the low speed running , both my carbureted bikes run smoother down low .
Any personal experiences would be much appreciated .Thanks again for all inputs and hopefully more to come . Peter
Hey Peter, Iirc, you are mainly a "carb" bike guy? like I was until just a few years ago.
If this is your first ride on an ECU/EFI bike, there can be a noticeable difference, especially if it's in need of a tune up and TB's balance.
I found the lurchy/gurchy instant on/off at slow walking/parking lot speeds, very disconcerting on my first EFI bike compared to carbs. I modified my riding style on the EFI bikes and typically will trail brake at very low speeds, just to smooth things out, I don't remember ever thinking about doing that on a carbed bike on a regular basis.
A good tune up & balance and possibly a map upgrade can help a lot; I've had 3 EFI bikes, without a doubt, my Griso, the only one with a Beetle map, is the best mannered of the bunch at low speed.
Personally I'm not into the 1400 bikes so much, but of them all, the Eldorado is the one that works for me; :bow: very classic lines, and the wheels make it the best handling of the bunch, if it was well tuned and set up, I'm sure it would be a very nice motorcycle. :thumb:
I'm glad it's your decision and not mine, :evil: I've seen 2 major deals on beautiful Eldorados go by that I shed a tear every time I think of them,lol. :cry:
Good luck with it :popcorn:
Kelly
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Personally I'm not into the 1400 bikes so much, but of them all, the Eldorado is the one that works for me; :bow: very classic lines, and the wheels make it the best handling of the bunch, if it was well tuned and set up, I'm sure it would be a very nice motorcycle. :thumb:
I'm glad it's your decision and not mine, :evil: I've seen 2 major deals on beautiful Eldorados go by that I shed a tear every time I think of them,lol. :cry:
Good luck with it :popcorn:
Kelly
The Eldorado has been working on me since they came out. I have read all the mail on them - good and bad, but am still drawn to the Eldo like a moth to a flame. Except for the white walls I really love the look of the modern Eldo!
(https://i.postimg.cc/T10CsXTD/5e7591dc2d9f780e5f627d76.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/hQJLJ6zD)
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So the road test went well . I wasn't too impressed with the low speed running , both my carbureted bikes run smoother down low .
I've read that the "Booster plug" improves this . Any personal experiences would be much appreciated . Highway performance is rather
amazingly smooth and plenty of power . Thanks again for all inputs and hopefully more to come . Peter
Make sure it is in VELOCE mode! No problems then. I LOVE my 1400 Eldo.
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This is in fact the first fuel injected Moto-Guzzi I've ridden , but as an m/c mechanic for quite some time I've ridden
countless other fuel injected bikes , none exhibited this rough a low rpm running . The bike is brand new from a
dealership and I'd hope it is setup as well as it should be (wanting to sell it and all :) ) Peter
Thanks again for all your remarks .
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Mine has low speed low gear surging between 2000 and 3000 rpm. It is kind of a pain because I have to go tomy house on a quiet residential street. It is hard to keep the speed down without the surging. It isn't something that I can't live with. I will probably do a Beetle map at some point. It isn't as bad as my Harley was.
kk
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Make sure it is in VELOCE mode! No problems then. I LOVE my 1400 Eldo.
I have the 1400 tourer. Are there much of a noticeable difference between the touring mode and the race mode?
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I do not see a reference to any 1400 maps on Beetle's site.
https://www.griso.org/
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Until the bike gets thoroughly warm it does have a slight glitch at low speed. The Boosterplug makes the bike run richer especially at low rpm's.Of course when you give it throttle and have it at 6,000rpms it is getting enough fuel. Installation is not easy as most temp sensors are in the airbox on most bikes but this one is mounted to the manifold. The motor does have a lot of engine braking on deceleration which takes some getting used to. The fueling is not nearly as bad as my VII was even after it was mapped/dyno'ed and a Power Commander was put on. The bike also does not like to be run below 3,000rpm's just like my Suzuki SV1000s and GSXR750. Keep the rev's up as lugging is bad...
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^ Are you pleased with the low speed running after installing the Booster Plug ?
I had no qualms with any other engine speeds . Thanks , Peter
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This is in fact the first fuel injected Moto-Guzzi I've ridden , but as an m/c mechanic for quite some time I've ridden
countless other fuel injected bikes , none exhibited this rough a low rpm running . The bike is brand new from a
dealership and I'd hope it is setup as well as it should be (wanting to sell it and all :) ) Peter
Thanks again for all your remarks .
I believe the roughness at idle is intentional.
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I believe the roughness at idle is intentional.
Intentional or not, that's the nature of those bikes. Sorta reminds of a Harley.
All Guzzis that I've ridden, including the 1400 need to be ridden 3k+. Great powerband but Guzzis don't like to be lugged. When my EV is loaded down with saddlebags and windshield, it doesn't like top gear until an indicated 80 (70 in the real world).
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I believe the roughness at idle is intentional.
I think you're right.
Iirc, I've read comments by Pete and Beetle, that MG's engineers/designers, did some funky tuning down low, to give the 1400 bikes that HD potaeto/potahto sound and feel.
Beetle's maps may not show up on his site yet, but I "think" he's probably got some in the works or available.
fwiw, good luck with the decision
Kelly
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The first time I test rode a CA Touring the fueling map was horrible. The throttle was like a light switch between a too low idle up to about 2400 rpm. Something was clearly way off on that bike. I didn't get to switch ride modes to see if it would have a positive effect. A slight throttle blip would send the rpm up to 2400, hold it there then drop it like a rock to 800rpm. This is definitely not a designed in element to mimic anything. It's either a fuel map error, something was broken or something was way out of adjustment. Other EFI bikes I've ridden have been spot on, so again, no legitimate opportunity to bash EFI in general. Maybe Moto Guzzi EFI on some models, but not EFI in general.
On some makes, disconnecting the the Oxygen Sensors in the exhaust will fool the ECM into thinking the bike hasn't warmed up. This allows the bike to run on a richer 'cold' fuel map in the lower rpm range. But most newer models will throw a code if the sensors get disconnected.
The second Guzzi 1400 I test rode was an MGS-21 which had better fueling. That bike exhibited much less EFI low speed jerkiness. Before and after it was fully warmed up. So again, something sounds to be off on the Eldorado Peter rode. There are ways to correct the oem fuel map which was only designed to pass strict emissions testing, not to allow the engine to run properly. The aftermarket is your friend to getting the 1400 to perform and run properly through correct fueling.
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I can live with mine if I have to but the fueling in the lower gears at lower rpm is annoying. I am not going to put one of those devices that trick the ECU into believing the temps are lower than they actually. I am also not going to spend more than $1,000 for one of those Power Commander tuners which is about a 1/10 of what I paid for the whole bike. I have looked at Beetle's maps and I don't see one for the 1,400. The only one close is an 8 valve with roller tappets but that is for a Griso. I hope he develops onefor our bikes, even though I would be nervous messing with my ECU but for a smooth running bike I will do it. :thumb:
kk
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Things like a Power Commander V (PCV) or a Maximus remapping of the ECU work beautifully. Though you’d have to do a couple of bikes to get up to $1K with a PCV with a dyno tune. The Maximus ECU tune, if available for the Guzzi, is also shy of $1K. Installation of the PCV with a dyno tune was around $500 from the most respected tuner for my bike brand that exists. My PCV has been 100% perfect for over 7 years.
The harder issue is finding someone who’s both knowledgeable and capable of correctly tuning the Guzzi to run like it should and can. Again, the oem map was intentionally made way too lean to pass emissions testing. Change mufflers and/or alter the intake and you only exacerbate the issue. A bone stock Guzzi 1400 clearly needs a proper (aftermarket) fuel map.
YMMV,
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More than a few years ago (middle 2000's) while working at Harley dealerships , a common and cheap improvement
in low speed running was the installation of an H-D non adjustable module which made noticeable improvements to the low
speed running on non modified engines . Keeping the bike stock pretty much negates the wisdom of spending cash
on a power commander ( which worked well on many of the significantly modified H-D motors ) . Keeping it stock is a priority.
So to return to my last question , has anyone tried the "Booster Plug" ? Peter
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I was impressed with the powerband & fueling on the 1400 Touring I rode. I did give the Mrs a big jolt a couple of time when I stabbed the throttle in V mode (even though I did it on purpose. Heck it had a backrest on it, she didn't fall off.)
Then I slipped it in Urban mode.
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More than a few years ago (middle 2000's) while working at Harley dealerships , a common and cheap improvement
in low speed running was the installation of an H-D non adjustable module which made noticeable improvements to the low
speed running on non modified engines . Keeping the bike stock pretty much negates the wisdom of spending cash
on a power commander ( which worked well on many of the significantly modified H-D motors ) . Keeping it stock is a priority.
So to return to my last question , has anyone tried the "Booster Plug" ? Peter
I've read forum posts from those who tried it saying it definitely helped. You'll also find posts from those who have never tried aftermarket tuning devices condemning the whole idea. The Eldorado 1400 is certainly a beautiful motorcycle. Though they very often need adjustments and tuning to get to them properly sorted out. Once properly sorted, they're a real treat. Getting them properly sorted can (not necessarily will) be an issue. If you have the interest and the ability to sort out the fueling of the Eldo you test rode, you'll likely be well pleased with the purchase. If not, look elsewhere. The market is over flowing with excellent new and used options.
PCV's are typically under $350 (used $200) and a dyno tuning session is typically around $250. If you've been around a tuned H-D, Indian or Victory etc, you know the difference can be night and day in heat reduction, performance increases and fuel consumption reduction. All factors going in the right direction.
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Alls I know is I want one. Red. Maybe someday
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I should know within a week if the beauty is coming home with me or not. It may be a simple
matter of getting the throttle bodies sync'd . It wasn't from being cold as I rode it for over 25 miles.
Peter
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I really like my 2016 and think the stock set up is really good. I realize mapping would let the engine run cooler and probably run even better but really don't want to spend the money on something that I feel isn't necessary, at least for me. On another note, I just texted the guy who designed the Eldo and asked if there was any difference with the 2016-2018 models other than the cruise control. He said there should be no difference in the models at all. The risk is for the 2021 Euro 5. I do find the cruise on mine to be touchy but rarely use it anyway.
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Can you text him again to ask what ever happened to the Eldorado rear passenger backrest/luggage rack? Nearly a year ago he said it “fell through the cracks”. Seriously, what’s the issue?
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Can you text him again to ask what ever happened to the Eldorado rear passenger backrest/luggage rack? Nearly a year ago he said it “fell through the cracks”. Seriously, what’s the issue?
Went through that with him already. It just never made it into production, he made calls and it did fall through the cracks. Todd at Guzzitech ended up making one for me that you can order.
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Alls I know is I want one. Red. Maybe someday
Same here. I started with the red one but I’ve switched my affections to an all black one. Though I still hold out hope for a Touring version, maybe called the Ambassador as a centennial model. I just love the styling cues of the Eldo over all the other 1400 variants.
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I am partial to the Audace. It is the one that nobody wants though. A great bike except for the fueling issues but those are a minor nuisance compared to all the good stuff. I have the early cruise control which does not have a plus, minus or resume. I need cruise for my messed up right hand, I just set the cruise just below the average speed of traffic near me. That is usually the speed limit anyway.
kk
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Went through that with him already. It just never made it into production, he made calls and it did fall through the cracks. Todd at Guzzitech ended up making one for me that you can order.
Must be a pretty big crack. They still can’t seem to build what they showed installed on an Eldorado at a trade show. Sadly that’s become SOP for the brand. No thank you on the GT version.
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This appears to be an option.
https://www.motomachines.com/hepco-becker-sissybar-w-rack-moto-guzzi-california-1400
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I think only if you remove the Eldo two piece seat for the CA Touring one piece seat. I'm not 100% certain on that, but that's the only way I've ever seen this unit mounted on an Eldorado. In reality, if you're good with bending a few steel bars, making one fit the Eldorado could be the best way to go. The GT unit is expensive at $900 and still doesn't include a luggage rack.
I posted a picture once of what is likely a home made unit that looked perfect on the Eldorado. I have a few friends who are machinists so if I had an Eldo, I'd ask them to make one. Total price would be the cost of the actual backrest plus material. Well under $200.
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From what I have been able to find Dyno Jet does not make a PCV for Moto Guzzi. Guzzi Tech seems to have them, so are they modified to work with a Guzzi by Todd? But it seems if you get everything required to make the bike run better will require a significant investment but seems to be quite a quagmire as to what will work with what. Furthermore most of the information on that site as to what is required and how it works is several years old. I guess I will just deal with it until something better come along. Hopefully Beetle will write a map for the 1400's.
kk
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Well , short of a flood , I'm going to be the owner of a 2018 Eldorado tomorrow , so you'll get to hear about
this adventure into a new Moto-Guzzi :azn: . Last new bike, a 1980 Le Mans 2 , bought new in 1983 , does
anybody here even remember the 80's ? Peter
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Congratulations!! You will love it.
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I owned a Ducati a few years back and felt like the Booster Plug was a definite improvement on that bike, made it much easier to manage the throttle when puttering around our gravel drive and in and out of the garage. Prior to buying I emailed with a few questions and Jens got back to me right away, always helpful and friendly but not the least pushy. He offers a 4-week return policy that seems fair enough:
https://www.boosterplug.com/shop/cms-terms_and_conditions.html
Congrats on the new bike Peter, can we see a few pictures, please?
Sarah
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Well , short of a flood , I'm going to be the owner of a 2018 Eldorado tomorrow , so you'll get to hear about
this adventure into a new Moto-Guzzi :azn: . Last new bike, a 1980 Le Mans 2 , bought new in 1983 , does
anybody here even remember the 80's ? Peter
Congratulations! So, some details please. Black or red, stock or with some accessories, dealer and the experience etc etc etc.
PS - regarding a PCV. Maybe they're plug type specific more than brand/model. I have huge doubt the PCV that's on my Victory is in anyway different from one that would work just as well on a Moto Guzzi. Just that mine was plug and play with the plug connections. Plug connections can be removed and the correct plug attached for pennies and in a few minutes. It's a very quick and easy alteration. The PCV basically adjusts the Air/Fuel ratio independently on the cylinders, their timing and at rpm ranges above 2500. Anyone who knows how to dyno tune an ail/oil cooled V-Twin can dyno tune an air/oil V-Twin. Be it Moto Guzzi, Indian, Victory, BMW, H-D etc. Finding someone that knows the sweet spot of A/F ratios of a specific brand/model is the key. Even a bone stock motorcycle will greatly benefit from aftermarket tuning equipment. A replacement map is simply doing internally what the PCV does externally. Something like a Maximus (direct ECU) tune can also adjust timing below 2500 while a PCV cannot. The difference between a properly tuned engine versus the oem government mandated fuel map is literally night and day.
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My 2015 1400 tourer seams to do fine with the factory mapping however my max RPM range is around 6800. I don’t ride hard but when I want to subside the need for speed, I want the full effect. I would like at least 7500 before she shuts down. I was ready to download a map with Mark(beetle) but at this time this is put on hold due to the possibility of “bricking” the ECU and in that case the gains are not worth that possibility, I trust Marks decision on this, it will get worked out.
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Well , short of a flood , I'm going to be the owner of a 2018 Eldorado tomorrow , so you'll get to hear about
this adventure into a new Moto-Guzzi :azn: . Last new bike, a 1980 Le Mans 2 , bought new in 1983 , does
anybody here even remember the 80's ? Peter
Although I have not posted on this before now, I have followed your thread.
I have a bit under 30K on my '16 Eldo. I have no complaints with fueling or low rpm grunt. When I picked mine up, all the nanny net things were set to the most conservative settings. The traction control began to cut in on dry pavement. I literally pulled over and changed that on the spot. If the bike is in rain mode, that also dials down the performance. Touring and sport don't seem to be as drastic between the two as rain is, so look at the dash to see what the setting is. At idle, there is a deliberate lope to the engine. It is silly, but that is what Guzzi did. If your more used to Harley, you might not be spinning the engine enough in lower gears. Single throttle body, no syncing required. Like every new Guzzi I have ever had, the engine gets smoother as it gets some miles on it, getting smoother down low and spinning easier as you build the revs. Incidentally, The revs come very quickly as long as you don't lug it.
So, for now, check the MGCT setting and see which ride mode you're in. IIRC, the lower number is the less invasive setting. 1 to 3, and if Piogga(sp) is displayed on the dash, you're in sloth mode. Yes, this is a very different animal than your Lemon Z. :boozing:
John Henry
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It sounds like some of these are worse than others as far as low speed fueling goes. Mine isn't so good. I can run it over 3,000 rpm but I will be speeding on my street. Neighbors don't tolerate this very well. My former bike, a Harley was worse. It is just a result of the EPA's mandated lean burn requirement. Lean Burn was a trademarked name for a system used by Chrysler in the 70's to delay the move to catalytic converters. It didn't work very well for them either.
kk
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Yes Peter, I do like the Boosterplug. It seems to work quite well on catalyzed bikes. I had it on my BMW R1150RT as the fueling on that bike was atrocious. It worked. The other device that I have used on bikes is the EJK fuel controller. Unfortunately, they only make it for the 1200 sport. And besides here in SoCal you can't get much of anything because of CARB rules. AFI also has something that is similar made for Ducati and Guzzi.You cannot run the Boosterplug and the EJK fuel controller at the same time. They seem to cancel each other out. But EJK worked great on my Suzuki SV1000S and my Kawasaki Drifter 1500 and it is very easy to set yourself.
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i thought my stock mapping was good until I got the mistral bosterplug. not faster, just smoother throttle response.
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Thanks again for all the follow up responses . As of yesterday , I'm now the owner of a new 2018 black Eldorado ! Was dropped off at the
dealership on a sunny day . Started raining as it was pushed out the door , 2 kilometers later it was hailing . Hid in a gas station for a few
minutes and off I went . 5 kilometers later sunshine and the weight left my shoulders . Geez that behemoth (at a stop light) sure lightens up
at walking speed . And trying to keep the revs down for break-in requires constant attention , it just seems to go . Low speed running and
new to me hydraulic clutch became a non issue after about a hundred K . Lost count of the number of times I got off to stare at this new beauty .
Good service from International Motorsports in Langley B.C . Call me one happy camper (and my wife loves it , how crazy is that ? ) :grin:Peter :grin:
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After reading everything on the Boosterplug site as to how it works and looking at a thread on Adventure Rider about them and how ell it worked for some Beemer rider I ordered one yesterday, I was concerned about using something that tricked the ECU in a linear fashion. This apparently doesn't do that but drops off at higher revs. I am supposed to get it in a week. It wasn't a lot of money so no great loss if it doesn't do what they say it is advertised to do. I am looking forward to it.
kk
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Teehee!
Hey, Pete. Hearing the grin in your words made my day! I spread the word to the rest of the Ottawa boyzz and the predominant comment was 'It ain't YELLOW!!'.
For the rest of y'all, Pete & I have been good friends/riding buddies since the early '70s when I showed up at his shop in Ottawa with my 69 BSA Rocket 3. Some of you may remember the 'Peterbuilt' Guzzi chopper that he showed up on when the National was held in Paul Smiths, NY. It was YELLOW. His LMII was YELLOW.
I am sure that you & SWMBO will enjoy many, many miles on your new ride.
Cheers!
G
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For the rest of y'all, Pete & I have been good friends/riding buddies since the early '70s when I showed up at his shop in Ottawa with my 69 BSA Rocket 3.
Hey Geoff, Hope you're loving your new Triumph. Which shop was that? I haunted all the bike shops in Ottawa in the '70's, I've probably bumped into him, looking at bikes or bling.
Congrats on the new bike Pete, wishing you many smooth miles and smiles.
Ride safe and often
Kelly
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i thought my stock mapping was good until I got the mistral bosterplug. not faster, just smoother throttle response.
It would be nice to have a dollar for everytime I read comments on motorcycle forums where people would post how "the bike runs fine, I see no reason to add a ______"
Then at some future point the same person posts about their impression after installing an aftermarket tuning device. They all come down to something like this: "why did I wait so long, this bike is better than ever, I can't believe the difference. Thanks for the information everyone".
People simply don't know what improved performance (lower running temps, smoother running etc) is until they experience it or see the A to B results on a dyno sheet.
Ask yourself how much time Piaggio spent making the oem fuel map compliant versus making the bike perform and run well within its capabilities.
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My experience has proven that a PCV will make a Guzzi, and any other I reckon, perform better, if it's the only viable option. I put one on my 99 Bassa and had it tuned on a dyno for improved drivability. It did improve drive-ability and my enjoyment of ridding it was certainly greater.
Couple years later, I took it to Jim Barron who at the time was in Woodstock IL operating a Guzzi dealer, and asked him to give it the works over since it hadn't been given a "tune up" since it's 600 mile service years back. Jim is one of the best techs in the nation. When I went to pick it up, he handed me the PCV and told me I wouldn't need that any more. I was a bit dubious, as I had spent hundreds getting the PCV dialed in, but I was wrong. Without added, non OEM fuel devices he was able to tune the bike to run far better than it had ever run, period.
My point is, if you can find somebody that really knows their shit around FI Guzzi, and has the right tools, they can get them to run the way they should, and it's great! But getting access to someone of that ability is not always practical. I believe Jim is still operating as an independent in Ringwood, Northern IL.
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Hey Geoff, Hope you're loving your new Triumph. Which shop was that? I haunted all the bike shops in Ottawa in the '70's, I've probably bumped into him, looking at bikes or bling.
Congrats on the new bike Pete, wishing you many smooth miles and smiles.
Ride safe and often
Kelly
Hi Kelly
We might have bumped into one another back then too - memories of those days are kinda hazy if you know what I mean....
He worked at Ottawa Cycle back then, spent some time at Gary's Custom Cycle, and Felix at Cycle Salvage, Hurst Yamaha and Freedom Harley Davidson before migrating to the wet coast
I took the cover off the Bonnie today …. man that is one pretty motorcycle.
Cheers!
G
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My experience has proven that a PCV will make a Guzzi, and any other I reckon, perform better, if it's the only viable option. I put one on my 99 Bassa and had it tuned on a dyno for improved drivability. It did improve drive-ability and my enjoyment of ridding it was certainly greater.
Couple years later, I took it to Jim Barron who at the time was in Woodstock IL operating a Guzzi dealer, and asked him to give it the works over since it hadn't been given a "tune up" since it's 600 mile service years back. Jim is one of the best techs in the nation. When I went to pick it up, he handed me the PCV and told me I wouldn't need that any more. I was a bit dubious, as I had spent hundreds getting the PCV dialed in, but I was wrong. Without added, non OEM fuel devices he was able to tune the bike to run far better than it had ever run, period.
My point is, if you can find somebody that really knows their shit around FI Guzzi, and has the right tools, they can get them to run the way they should, and it's great! But getting access to someone of that ability is not always practical. I believe Jim is still operating as an independent in Ringwood, Northern IL.
The fuel maps and government regulations between the 1100 Bassa and the 1400's are quite different. But, I get your point and agree about the 1100. The only reason I bought the 2009 Griso is because of Jim Barron. Yes, he was (is) a master technician. He actually understood how to make the parts on the motorcycle function in unison. Unlike Moto Guzzi that simply installed parts and kicked it down the assembly line. What you get is what you get. Too many dealers install the mirrors, put a battery into service incorrectly and call it done.
You're also quite right in that finding someone like Jim Barron to work on and tune your Moto Guzzi is vital. Without someone like Jim, it's a crap shoot at best. Sadly, I see very few dealers or technicians like Jim Barron to be found in the US and Canada.
There's certainly not someone like Jim anywhere within several hours ride from Chattanooga, TN.
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Well , time for a follow up on this Eldorado thing . Took a while to put on the first 600 km ( weather ) . Was coming to grips with
the low speed running , but it still took more revs to get away from the lights than I thought a 1400 cc should require . And my shifting
was in serious need of improvement , too many years with cable actuation I guess .
The Booster Plug arrived and in it went , the tank removal isn't half the problem it's reported to be , and the plug was one bolt to
loosen and a couple of tie straps to located the lead . AND , I wasn't 5 feet up our steep driveway and I knew things were better :boozing: .
Within about a kilometer of leaving , I was able to leave the lights comfortably at around 1300 rpm , no feeling of lugging the motor .
And did I say something about my shifting , the low speed throttle control was improving my shifting throughout the day . Have no idea
about any more power further up the rev range 'cuz I'm still breaking it in . Also winding up the preload on the shocks has improved it's
harshness over sharp bumps , which I'm enjoying . It's highway ride and engine smoothness are in a class of their own .
Call me one happy camper ! Peter
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1300 rpm's is too low. That's not much over idle.
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It definitely was before the booster plug :thumb:. Peter
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I put a Booster Plug in my Audace last week. Holy Moly what a difference. Going down my street has always a struggle to deal with the surging first gear or lugging it in second to try and go down the street smoothly at a neighborly speed. That has now all gone away. I can go down the street in either with no issues.
kk
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:thumb: ^Probably the best bang for the buck I've had in quite some time . Peter
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Interesting comments about the Booster plug. I've had an Audace since 2016 and it ran so badly at low revs (<2500) that I invested in the PCV/AT300 set up from GuzziTech and it's been great, but that set up removes the stock O2 sensors and replaces them with wideband sensors attached to the AT300. This forces the ECU itself to run open-loop. In my (admittedly somewhat limited) experience of trying to fool the ECU before the PCV was added, I've found that it always found a way to "trim" around anything I did to make it run richer as the closed loop control coupled with the stock O2 sensors provided the feedback that allowed it to adjust mixture back to stock. This sometimes took 3+ days of riding so I'd be interested to hear how your experience progresses with time
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I own a 2014 California. Same bike, different "dressing". It is a great bike, but if you ever need support from a dealer don't do it. Moto Guzzi is terrible at dealer support.
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Not sure what you’re trying to say?
We have some really great dealers in this country. Unfortunately, we have some, to many at that, who don’t do a good job after the sale. That’s been one of Guzzi problems for decades.
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Not too sure what the last couple of remarks have to do with the Eldorado and Booster Plug thread ? Just sayin' . Peter
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Hey Pete!!
You are right - the last couple of posts had nothing to do with the BoosterPlug thread.
But I am surprised a little. The BP is a "Let's fool the ECU" solution. I would have expected a more sophisticated approach.
But then, you cant argue with success.
Please keep us posted on your life with the Eldo.
Cheers!
G
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Peter/kk
Recently purchased 18 Eldorado and considering the BoosterPlug. Does the tank need to be completely removed? Do the emblems need to removed and replaced. Just want to know what I am getting into.
Thanks
Scott
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Do not attempt to take off the emblems ! It's unnecessary and the tank can be turned and set on the seat while you do the task . IIRC , you remove
the seat , the covers around the steering neck and the gas cap surround . That should get you to all the fasteners . I've presently gotten over 6500kms
on it . It's a treat , super smooth , extremely quite , and power out of keeping with it's appearance ! I've finally tried full throttle a few times and actually
engaged " Veloce" mode a few times :shocked: , it's back to Tourismo for now . Mileage has been about 20km per liter by myself and 17ish with 2 up .
Stable as a rock , yet it tilts the horizon with abandon . Still running perfectly . I have however purchased a laptop and Lonelec cables and Beetles Guzzidiag.
I'm going to try that , but for now the weather here is fantastic and I'm doing more riding than playing around with it's running . As a side note I finally took
off the rear shocks and replaced them with a set of HD Dyna shocks from the early or mid 2000's ( they've got real adjustable dampening) and that alone
has transformed the riding experience ( the springs are noticeably firmer and that's what they needed ) . Made a backrest for my better half and she loves
riding with me . Loved the original seats ( for looks ) , but I've since made a couple of replacements and am good for hours in the saddle now! Long winded way
of saying I'm loving it more with every passing kilometer :grin:. Peter
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From one Peter to another Peter that is great!. I put the Boosterplug in as I had used it on a previous bike with catalytic converters (a BMW R1150RT) and it works great. I have the Agostini pipes but I took out the dbkillers and put them back in as it would need to have a remap if I left them out. I did however put a K&N filter in the airbox and cut a 2" hole in the housing using a hole saw and the bike can finally breathe well.I did have it on "veloce" but because SoCal is really "hilly" I did not like the excessive engine braking on downhill twisties so put it on "turismo" mode. It works great! Right now I am putting the finishing touches on a Matris fork cartridge install with new tires, pads, oils etc. I also installed LED light strips on the rear near the taillight but could not use the dual function as the converters are too large to effectively fasten to the rear license holder and fender. A matter of fact after I installed them I went for a ride and the rear tire wore through them and blew a fuse which put the bike into "limp mode" and I was able to solve that one with help of one of the guys on here. Remember that code: 34534 This picture is of the LED's but it is in full sun...
(https://i.ibb.co/brtfVjB/taillight-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/brtfVjB)
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Thanks Peter
Scott
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Time for a follow up on my Eldorado . Passed 11,000kms and it's still a treat .
The booster plug has been in it for around 10,000kms and I had nothing to complain about , nothing has changed in it's running !
Weather and air has taken a dive lately and I decided I'd install a "Beetle" map .
After a mere 3 retries I succeeded , patience is a virtue when you're not the brightest crayon in the box :)
Low speed running is as good as the booster plug ( that really is high praise ).
BUT , 2 things not mentioned , I am no longer shifting like a newbie teenager , jeez that jerk was annoying if you weren't perfect in clutch and speed execution !
And that engine breaking when letting the throttle off ( like hitting the kill switch ) is now like a normal carburated bike , my wife no longer hits the back of my helmet when I back off !
So my experience is that the booster plug was good , but the "Beetle" mapping is Great !!!
Many thanks to all those responsible for GuzziDiag and their mapping expertise :thumb: . Peter
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Did you disconnect the Boosterplug to set up the Beetle map? Did you change pipes and airbox or did you leave them stock? Gas Mileage? I have put 8,000 miles since January which is not a lot to get excited about but the bike runs great. However, you are correct in that there is a lot of engine braking especially in first, second and third. I put mine in Turismo mode to calm some of the engine braking. It would be nice if there was less engine braking.
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Yes you definitely should disconnect the booster Plug , left everything in it's place in case the download completely screwed up .
I was also able to remove the O2 sensors (Lambda ?) and noticed they were quite clean and a silver grey , so certainly no over fueling .
I had no idea that the engine braking was such a nuisance until it was gone , the bike gets more perfect with this download . As mentioned
some time ago , the ride quality took a giant step up by replacing the rear shocks with a pair of old HD Dyna shocks , with the adjustable dampening :).
Maybe some heated grips and hand guards next . Peter