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General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: MattiGuzzi on May 04, 2020, 09:39:07 PM
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I have a non-starting 2004 V11. No lights, no fuel pump clicking, nothing. Checked the Clutch, side stand and neutral switches. All seem to be working. Switched the relays around, etc. Still nothing. Opened the Startus Interruptus thread, and looked at the MPH bypass option, but it is not indicated for the V11. Any help would be appreciated.
Matt
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Dead battery? Ignition switch? The wireharness to the ECU still plugged in?
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No dash lights , or horn , completely dead ?
Have you checked the battery connections ? Hell , is there any juice in the battery .
Dusty
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Is there a main fuse in those models?
Do you have a volt meter to check the battery?
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Kill Switch
Paul B :boozing:
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Welcome aboard
When you swapped the relays around did you notice if they had been upgraded, Omron are usually considered the preferred replacements for the oem's which can be an issue.
Iirc, there has been discussion of similar problems caused by loose connectors in the wiring harness around the steering head, fwiw.
Good luck
Kelly
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I have a non-starting 2004 V11. No lights, no fuel pump clicking, nothing. Checked the Clutch, side stand and neutral switches. All seem to be working. Switched the relays around, etc. Still nothing. Opened the Startus Interruptus thread, and looked at the MPH bypass option, but it is not indicated for the V11. Any help would be appreciated.
Matt
First of all welcome to the forum Matt, we should have you going in no time, many of us are familiar with that machine.
Around 2004 there was a change made to the wiring so it may take a little time to sort out if yours is earlier or later.
Early http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzi007/schematics/1999_V11_sport.gif This bike came with an electric petcock, a chrome thingy hanging below the fuel tank left hand side but a previous owner may have removed it and put a manual fuel cock in its place.
Later http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzi007/schematics/2004_EV_Catalytic.gif
Do you own a multimeter? if not a test light or just a 12 Volt bulb with a couple of wires attached will do.
Perhaps start by checking the battery connections take them both apart and clean the terminals.
You should be able to get 12 Volts or the lamp to light across the battery then from the chassis to the positive terminal. and several of the fuses to chassis.
You can see that F1 to F5 are alive at one side or the other and the rest should be when you turn the key On
If you don't get 12 Volts from chassis to the positive terminal also try from chassis to the negative terminal with the key turned On, if that lights you have a bad ground connection.
If fuses 1 thru 5 are alive but not the rest when the key is On chances are a wire has broken off at the ignition switch, it happens with constant bending as the steering is back and forth, its very easy to check. Looking up from underneath you will see two black Philips screws holding the switch block to the lock mechanisms it just takes a few seconds to remove and take the cover off.
The reason there is no MPH bypass for the VII, it never needed one at least not the early version, the factory got it right, I cannot say the same for the later version.
I will try not to overwhelm you with too much information off the bat.
Cheers
Roy
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Welcome aboard
When you swapped the relays around did you notice if they had been upgraded, Omron are usually considered the preferred replacements for the oem's which can be an issue.
Iirc, there has been discussion of similar problems caused by loose connectors in the wiring harness around the steering head, fwiw.
Good luck
Kelly
The bikes came with a mixture of 4 and 5 pin relays, the start relay in slot 1 has to be a 5, most owners change them out for all 5 pins they work in any slot.
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I have a non-starting 2004 V11. No lights, no fuel pump clicking, nothing. Checked the Clutch, side stand and neutral switches. All seem to be working. Switched the relays around, etc. Still nothing. Opened the Startus Interruptus thread, and looked at the MPH bypass option, but it is not indicated for the V11. Any help would be appreciated.
Matt
Very first thing, ALWAYS, is to test the battery. Not check it with a voltmeter, because they can show 12 volts and not be able to supply any current, but LOAD TEST it! Make sure it can supply current at 12.65 volts. If it's showing 12V at rest, it's dead.
Lannis
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Very first thing, ALWAYS, is to test the battery. Not check it with a voltmeter, because they can show 12 volts and not be able to supply any current, but LOAD TEST it! Make sure it can supply current at 12.65 volts. If it's showing 12V at rest, it's dead.
Lannis
Lannis, would that hold true to a battery in a bike just ridden or fresh off the trickle charger?
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Very first thing, ALWAYS, is to test the battery. Not check it with a voltmeter, because they can show 12 volts and not be able to supply any current, but LOAD TEST it! Make sure it can supply current at 12.65 volts. If it's showing 12V at rest, it's dead.
Lannis
Agreed on load testing, though the voltmeter's on the bikes regularly show 11.7 when sitting a while and will still kick over the motor without issue.
I think the advice to start at the battery and work out is well advised. Check battery, then connections, grounds, etc. Then all fuses and main power relay and its connections. If still no life when you turn on the key, then I'd look at the ignition switch itself. Simple test would be to trace it to it's connector, unplug and test continuity. If I'm reading the original message correctly, there is no power or response at all. No warning lights, gauge sweep (if V11 does this). Generally, the Kickstand and bar mounted kill switches will not inhibit powerup, tail lights, dash/warning lights, just immobilizes the starter, though i am not familiar with the V11.
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I don't believe its a dud battery since there is nothing on turning the key On, even a very weak battery should cause some lights or fuel pump activity.
Matt, please verify that you have all the battery wires connected, there are at least 3 on the positive terminal, very easy to miss one, don't ask me how I know.
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I don't believe its a dud battery since there is nothing on turning the key On, even a very weak battery should cause some lights or fuel pump activity.
Matt, please verify that you have all the battery wires connected, there are at least 3 on the positive terminal, very easy to miss one, don't ask me how I know.
You aren't the only one who has missed one of those wire Roy :laugh:
What Roy and the rest of us are advising is to check the simple stuff first . Roy has become our go to guy on electrical issues , and will get you there .
Dusty
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Lannis, would that hold true to a battery in a bike just ridden or fresh off the trickle charger?
Batteries are the most inconsistent and temperamental things on a bike, in my experience. They can last 20 years from new, or they can die in 6 months. They can show 12 volts on a meter, and not be able to supply any current. They can sink every electron that a charging system can put out, and not supply any current back.
But especially, even when just charged up, they can look all bright and happy, and light up all the lights, and when you push the starter button, everything goes out, dead.
They have more failure modes than you can almost count. And yet, and yet .... very few people ever want to believe that their electrical problem on their bike is related to the battery.
I'm not necessarily an expert because I don't retain every experience I have or everything I hear from the real experts, but with my 50 years of bike ownership, 34 bikes, and reading and posting tens of thousands of posts about electrical issues, I can say with real confidence that 95% of all bike electrical problems are either a failing battery or a bad ground.
Those are ALWAYS the first places to look!
Lannis
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Agreed on load testing, though the voltmeter's on the bikes regularly show 11.7 when sitting a while and will still kick over the motor without issue.
And that's as it should be. However, when a battery has been charged up, and the "surface charge" taken off with a quick load (headlight or load tester), and it doesn't read 12.65 volts, it's potentially hosed. If it reads 12.40 volts it might work, but something's wrong ... if it reads 12.0 volts in a charged-up state, it's dead.
A good battery that's been sitting for a while might have lost some charge but still be able to turn the starter and fire the plugs if it's in good shape.
But test first!
Lannis
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I have a non-starting 2004 V11. No lights, no fuel pump clicking, nothing. Checked the Clutch, side stand and neutral switches. All seem to be working. Switched the relays around, etc. Still nothing. Opened the Startus Interruptus thread, and looked at the MPH bypass option, but it is not indicated for the V11. Any help would be appreciated.
Matt
Hi
The V11 does have a 30amp main fuse under the seat as far as I know, if that is blown you'll probably have the issues you described. However, with blown fuses....why did it blow?
Anyway, in figuring out problems with my V11 Lemans, I've also had success reaching out to the guys at https://www.v11lemans.com/forums/.
Goodluck,
Art
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Yes, like Art sez.. the 30 amp fuse is a known issue on the V11 sports. That's the first place to look.
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Is there a main fuse in those models?
Do you have a volt meter to check the battery?
No, the 30 Amp fuse is just the charging circuit
If no Voltmeter just a 12 Volt lamp will be better than nothing.
There are no lights when the key is turned On
The VII is an easy bike to troubleshoot, first check the battery is alive then look for power on all fuses with the key On
It would be nice to know if this one has a petcock, that will establish whether its the Early of Later wiring, I'm leaning towards Later.
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1. fuses
2. relays
clean the connectors once you determine they are OK
3. kill switch, I miss this all the time since it's an odd design and easy to unintentionally trip off. Also clean the contacts.
4. neutral switch on bottom left side of transmission, check connection
5. key switch
Sometimes rattle old bones and dance a voodoo jig.
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No, the 30 Amp fuse is just the charging circuit
OOps, my bad again. Just assumed the OP had a dead battery.
A common problem for no sparks at all is the main ground , located in an inaccessible place on the transmission from memory.
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Like everyone else I just assumed this was a spine framed bike,
Suppose it's an EV or some other California, a different animal altogether.
Maybe it doesn't exist at all.
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Definitely look for ALL the wires that should go to the battery. Guzzis often have more than one factory connection to each terminal, and not the same number on each terminal. I was looking for but couldn't find a picture of the indent in the bottom of the rubber battery tray liner that was a clear imprint of the third negative wire that had been under the battery for hundreds of miles when its owner finally gave up on his mystery electricla problems and brought it to Hamlin for service. Andy found it in three minutes. We were all astounded that it had worked at all, but I guess things found a path to ground most of the time.