Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: dxhall on October 12, 2020, 10:17:08 PM
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Helmet manufacturers say that helmets should be retired after 5 years. My newest helmet is now 7 years old - one is 15 years old, but still looks fine. Does anyone follow the manufacturer’s recommendation? I checked prices on replacements, and am still in sticker shock.
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From what I've read, how much a helmet deteriorates over time depends on: how much it has been used, how much exposure it has had to sun or chemicals that would cause the plastic to break down, temperature, and probably some other things.
A helmet that has been in a box in storage will have deteriorated much less than one that has been worn a lot. I recently bought a Shuberth C3 that was NIB but 3 yr old for $350, figuring that it should last 4-5 yrs.
Rich A
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Helmet life depends on several factors:
Padding care: was the helmet interior kept clean and was the helmet kept in a fume-free closet out of the sun not in the window of a chemical-rich garage? If not, time to replace it because the padding has deteriorated.
Shell damage: was the helmet dropped or banged enough to scratch it? If so, time to replace it because the shell is compromised.
Technology: today's helmets are much safer (padding, shell, eye opening, weight, noise reduction, cooling air flow) than earlier years. 7 years is probably new enough, 15 years isn't.
I like my Bell Qualifier DLX which I purchased from a local dealer for about $200 but Bell is no longer offering it, just the Qualifier (cheaper) and the Qualifier DLX MIPS (more expensive but worth it). Either helmet is good value for money.
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Yes.
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And here's the second best reason to buy Bell: they use MGs in their descriptions https://www.bellhelmets.com/motorcycle/p/qualifier-dlx-mips-motorcycle-helmet/250070000300000005.html
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UV radiation & organic solvents, both liquid & gaseous, will detrimentally effect helmet structure, linings & padding. Kept away from a damaging environment, say in a helmet bag inside a cool closet, it should theoretically last indefinitely.
Nevertheless, new helmets are getting better all the time. New materials (aramid fibre, carbon lattice etc.), construction techniques (lightweight, advanced integral reinforcing mesh overlays) & features (noise reduction, aerodynamics, integral sun visors etc) are all useful advances that don't come cheap.
What price your head?
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Probably a good rule of thumb to get a new helmet every 5-7 years. Also, no price on your "NOGGIN", so one can never go wrong with a quality SHOEI / ARAI / BELL / AGV / SCHUBERTH / SIMPSON, and there are many others. Just MHO... :wink: :thumb: :cool:
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Supposedly, much of the reason for a helmet needing to be replaced in a prescribed number of years, is the crush material between the shell and the fabric liner. It degrades over time, and becomes more brittle, with less ability to absorb energy.
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I bought my last couple of HJCs for $120 or so, no sticker shock. End of issue for me - I buy them every few years, it’s hardly worth replacing the visor versus buying a new one.
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It's every five years for me with normal use; a helmet with less use gets replaced no later than seven years. YMMV of course.
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Supposedly, much of the reason for a helmet needing to be replaced in a prescribed number of years, is the crush material between the shell and the fabric liner. It degrades over time, and becomes more brittle, with less ability to absorb energy.
This ^^
I have worn Arai for as long as I can remember, I'm sure the life of their helmets to 7 year shelf or 5 year in use.
I try to stay within this timespan.
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I bought my last couple of HJCs for $120 or so, no sticker shock. End of issue for me - I buy them every few years, it’s hardly worth replacing the visor versus buying a new one.
I’m the same. I’m not choosy about brand. But am choosy about snell rating. I’ve had two different helmets do their job. A few hundred dollars every 5 years is cheap insurance to me.
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I only have one helmet at a time, and use it on every ride. So in 5 years, it's about worn out - I've made one last 7 years, but it was shot by the time I was done ... lining coming out, mechanisms getting loose.
If I had one in a box that I didn't use, I wouldn't see why it wouldn't be like a "new" helmet 10 years later - no "crushing", no UV, no wear and tear - I don't think anything on a helmet evaporates or degrades like, say, a bike tire.
Lannis
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foam does crumble as it gets old. In racing we are not allowed to use a helmet more than 5yrs old.
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foam does crumble as it gets old.
This is true but it's hard to predict the rate at which it degrades. Almost all plastics outgas over the years, losing volatiles, just as tires do. In my collection of ski boots, I find that polyurethane shells from the '70s can crack if even unbuckled. A couple of years ago I finally tossed a Bell 500 I acquired in 1969, which I quit using around 1985. When I took it off the shelf all the foam had turned to powder -- there was nothing left but fabric and fiberglass.
That said, I rotate several helmets. I use a Bell MX9 Adventure for most solo riding because it's very comfortable. Riding two-up with Gail I use a four-year-old Snell-rated Bell Star wired with the SENA intercomm. I have an older Bell studded with ugly GoPro mounts. Etc. Helmets older than about five years sit on the shelf, and if the interior materials still seem okay I feel safe loaning them to visitors. I may not get rid of them, but in the normal course of events I phase out of using them after about five or six years. Sort of the same thing with ski boots.
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(https://i.ibb.co/1RmDZNh/292531-10150868265196878-301251747-n.jpg) (https://ibb.co/1RmDZNh)
My favorite helmet, about 60 years old. 1950s Harlie police helmet. Still has the harlie logo embossed on the leather. Paid $2 for it 30 years ago at a yard sale. I rode about 400k under that particular helmet.
Flame away!
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I guess there should be a crash test dummy to prove it? Or helmet makers could offer new interiors? or both
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I've found that even in a quality helmet, the interior padding starts to wear out after 6 or 7 years. That said, I usually hang on to my Ariai's for 9 to 10 years before retiring them. Now the important question yet to be asked...what do you do with an old helmet? Dumpster, recycle (where?) flowerpot?
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I have Arai XD4 and the $600 price tag for a new one is high.
However my head is still worth the $600 (give or take $20), so I'll get a new one this year.
Old Arai is 5 years old, been through too much...
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I generally buy a new helmet every 5 years, but keep the old in rotation until it is unserviceable or too stinky. With removeable liners, that is easier to do.
I used to wear Shoe exclusively till about 2008 when the movers lost the box with all my helmets and jackets. Had to go out and buy new helmets for my wife and myself, and ended up with a Scorpion I liked very much. Since then, bought an AGV Skyline in 2014, and last year bought a Nolan N44.
I used to care about the Snell rating, not so much anymore. I tend to buy highly rated (by industry and customer reviews) mid to high range 'last year - leftover' models from reputable brands.
The AGV (6 years) has aged very well, still has great feel, cushion, and all functions well including the drop down visor. Due to it being a bit warm, and low fogging, even though it is 6 years old, I wear it in cooler weather as my go to. It is quiet, comfortable, and functions well. The Nolan N44 is also well made, comfortable, and has the best visibility and ventilation of any helmet I've owned. It is also the loudest, and without the pinlock fogs easily despite having excellent ventilation.
Two things that have become 'must haves' for me in addition to quality, comfort noise level and visibility are the drop internal visor and in hemet speaker/intercom capability.
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I replaced a six year old ARAI with a AGV K6-super lightweight helmet. Never going back to a 3 1/2 pound lid.
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Mine always last right up to the time when BELL or SHOEI come up with the newest and bestus friggin' helmet ever. Then I get last years model. :thumb:
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Now the important question yet to be asked...what do you do with an old helmet? Dumpster, recycle (where?) flowerpot?
(https://i.ibb.co/3vxh764/IMG-1643.jpg) (https://ibb.co/3vxh764)
North edge of Amarillo, Texas (not my artwork, but I like it)
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After Shoei's started to resemble a house payment, I moved to HJC helmets. They fit my big square head just as well as the Shoei's did and I find their fit & finish to be right up there with Shoei. And I see a fresh helmet every 6-7 years to be a good idea even if it still seems to be in excellent shape. Back in 1995 my Shoei full face saved my life when I got hit. Hell, after the Commander of the Norfolk Naval Safety Center saw it, he asked if I would donate it to the base Motorcycle Safety Training course as a training aid. I bought a new Shoei a year later when I started riding again. But as the 20th century ended, I found that Shoei was out of my price range and I discovered HJC. 'Been wearing HJC ever since.
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That’s when I switched back to Bell
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That’s why I’m choking on this purchase. A new Arai Defiant to replace my old one is $800 plus. I’ve worn Arais
for 20+ years, but I’m starting to wonder if the cost is justified.
Edit: now on sale for $688.
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It isn’t justified.
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It isn’t justified.
Totally agree. The thing of it is, as they say up here, is that if you don't have an accident, it don't matter. My first helmet was a Bell open face I got used in the 70's, has a Snell '62 sticker. In the early "80's, it started to shed foam, so bought a Bell Tour Star II. First full face helmet and what a revelation! Still use it sometimes, but have gotten a few more since then. The point is, any helmet is better than none at all. If you got one you like, just wear it and don't worry about it. The companies make money by selling helmets, so they want you to buy a new one. If they wore out that fast, well maybe they're not so good to begin with. JMHO.
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I don't think anything on a helmet evaporates or degrades like, say, a bike tire.
Lannis
It's the expanded foam that absorbs the shocks that degrades. I guess if you could replace this, the outer shell would last decades.
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another vote for HJC, and the replacement visors are only about $20. My last Arai, the visor was $60.
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I still love my 15 yr old Arai Signet...new ones fit a bit looser and are 25% larger...makes you look like a martian. But...had to replace when I couldn't get face shield parts.
After watching my buddy get hit with a collapsing tree--surviving and having the ER Dr hand me the shattered Arai...I'm sticking with them. Said he couldn't believe he had zero head or neck trauma.
I agree on watching for sales on last year's new models. I got a new Signet for $599 via a last yr model sale at Revzilla. They are def pricey, though. Todays helmets are way easier to clean all the Vitalis n sweat out of with snap in and out liners.
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I bought my last couple of HJCs for $120 or so, no sticker shock. End of issue for me - I buy them every few years, it’s hardly worth replacing the visor versus buying a new one.
:thumb:
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I love the way Arai's fit me. They are by far the most comfortable helmet I have. But their stubborn refusal to make a helmet with an internal sun visor has forced me to abandon the brand. Shoei doesn't fit me quite as well, the medium I wear in an Arai is painfully tight on my Shoei. I recently purchased a Scorpion EXO At950 modular. I love the fit and it has become my go-to helmet for most rides. About half the price of an Arai or Shoei.
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This AGV protector was introduced to my head in 1971, it's been part of destroying several bikes over the years, but it has protected me well for 50 years, is it time to say farewell ? :sad:
(https://i.ibb.co/kg9D52V/hell-mutt.jpg) (https://ibb.co/kg9D52V)
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Okay ratguzzi -- I'll take the bait.
1. What is that bug catcher on the front of your motorcycle? Would you please publish more pictures of it. We don't need to see your helmet.
2. As wide as those side cases are, it looks like your mirrors and knees are wider. Do you even bother with a side stand? And how often do you repair the outside corners (you can see the sparks)?
3. Wonder Lake looks to be casual about lighting, etc. You can't park on the street overnight -- I'm surprised they let you park that motorcycle on the street in daytime. Did the HOA grandfather you in?
4. At $0.000005 per mile, I'd say you got your helmet investment (same $2 as your Yard Waste Sticker) back. Probably a record ROI.
I laughed when I first saw your picture and laughed even harder when I looked at the details. Thanks for that!
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Well their going to say that because they need to sell helmets. Not much businessis going to happen if people keep their helmets for 20+ years. If you drop your helmet onto the road or concrete or the interior is falling apart then yes you would need to buy a new one.
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I've worn Arais for probably 30 years. But I've always gotten them used. Fifteen years ago I had my first real accident (injured an elk) and had to retire the helmet. Big bash on top and badly scraped visor, but no head or neck damage. Well, I do wear a foam neck collar that probably had a lot to do with saving my neck.
Twenty or so years ago the Arai rep and I were at the store at the same time. He told me a story that stuck with me, about an F1 driver who rear ended the wall at something like 150 mph. His helmet hit the lifting bar (not really a roll bar) behind the cockpit and popped a big round section of paint off the back of it. Arai put it through the tests and it passed.
I've worked in a fiberglass shop 30 years ago and can believe what the rep said. Properly constructed fiberglass is very strong and not brittle.
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I gave my five year old Shoei Neotec to the local first responders.
They were thrilled to have it and will use it for training people on how to remove a helmet from an injured/incapacitated rider. Odds are good that that rider will be me since I live in a town of 1,500 people and I'm the only one here who actually wears a helmet.
I thought $700 was too much for the new Neotec so I bought a $550 HJC. I made the mistake of wearing it. Got two hours use out of it and decided it wasn't gonna work (too tight on the brow) so it can't be returned. It's been on Craigslist and FB market place for two years. Can't get $200 for it. ZERO interest. Not a single person has expressed interest in it. If it's not gone by next spring I'll donate that one to the fire department.
IMO more people need to donate old lids.
According to HJC an old helmet is more dangerous than no helmet. The air trapped inside the expanded polystyrene (EPS) out-gasses and removes the cushioning effect it's supposed to have.
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According to HJC an old helmet is more dangerous than no helmet. The air trapped inside the expanded polystyrene (EPS) out-gasses and removes the cushioning effect it's supposed to have.
Well I'd certainly like to see any data that supports that quote. My guess is that an old tin pot is better that no helmet!
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I guess it’s time for me to show my hand and take my spanking😂
Here’s my favorite summer time helmet, a 1967 police motor officer helmet which was used by my forefathers.
However controversial helmets are I do acknowledge the safety factor and the survival rate is greater when wearing a good quality headgear. That being acknowledged, Ive Investigated two fatalities where high dollar racing helmets were removed from the deceased before being loaded in the ambulance.
In my defense, I am very claustrophobic and the distraction for me would far outweigh the safety issue.
However, each to his own.
(https://i.ibb.co/cXdR5nj/883-BE25-D-9-E64-4346-B8-EE-C2710-A5-C4288.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cXdR5nj)
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Well I'd certainly like to see any data that supports that quote. My guess is that an old tin pot is better that no helmet!
I'll look for it. My guess is that an old tin pot would transmit shock directly to your head. The larger diameter of the helmet would allow torsional/twisting forces on it as well. In that regard, not having a lid would be better than having a bad one.