Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: egschade on April 08, 2021, 11:10:00 AM
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Autoweek just published an article debunking the safety impact on loud pipes - they DON'T save lives: https://www.autoweek.com/news/industry-news/a35952569/loud-pipes-do-not-save-lives/ (https://www.autoweek.com/news/industry-news/a35952569/loud-pipes-do-not-save-lives/)
Enjoy the sound and performance but don't think you're any safer...
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True , although at a vintage show at the dealer in Tulsa a guy almost ran over me on his Zero , never heard him coming :laugh:
Dusty
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True , although at a vintage show at the dealer in Tulsa a guy almost ran over me on his Zero , never heard him coming :laugh:
Dusty
THIS^^ Will be interesting to see if e bikes are involved in more incidents. I still think I will have one someday.
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THIS^^ Will be interesting to see if e bikes are involved in more incidents. I still think I will have one someday.
Same here , guessing we will adapt .
Dusty
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The problem with blanket statements i.e Loud Pipes save Lives, is that there is no yes or no answer but a maybe. In some cases, such as commuting in a lane splitting state, if a distracted driver meanders even inside his lane, a loud bike might just wake him up in time, whereas if he has also has a super loud stereo and enjoying a live version of Freebird (no offense to the beloved Skynyrd band) he may still veer into the path of the biker.
As per the study in Romania, it looks like many other studies where orchestrating the study accordingly proves ( the intended) point.
Ebikes might need pedestrian alert sound tracks, not unlike Fisker and Tesla, so we get to keep Dusty...and other folks
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Autoweek just published an article debunking the safety impact on loud pipes - they DON'T save lives: https://www.autoweek.com/news/industry-news/a35952569/loud-pipes-do-not-save-lives/ (https://www.autoweek.com/news/industry-news/a35952569/loud-pipes-do-not-save-lives/)
Enjoy the sound and performance but don't think you're any safer...
And in other breaking news water is wet :rolleyes:
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Loud pipes were never meant to save lives...they were meant to annoy others, same as unnecessary throttle blipping at a stoplight...if it annoys others around you...mission accomplished.
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Loud pipes were never meant to save lives...they were meant to annoy others, same as unnecessary throttle blipping at a stoplight...if it annoys others around you...mission accomplished.
Agree 100%. Funny how those with the loud pipes proclaim their "freedom" to do so, while ignoring everyone else's "freedom" to peace and quiet.
(Stock pipes on all eight of my bikes, including the Harleys.)
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There is a legal measurement for how loud any exhaust on a registered vehicle can be, the “decibel range”. It’s only an issue when the sound exceeds that maximum legal range, which is plenty lenient in my state. In and around my area LEO pays little to no attention to the law.
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not necessarily a proponent of loud pipes, but also not a proponent of this form of testing and reporting.
be careful of how you take this.
Test was only looking at a driver in a car with radio on and windows rolled up. (some people have windows down, some people don't listen to the radio)
Test did not take into account pedestrians in the streets or crossings. (not all accidents are bike / car )
Test did not consider deer crossings on back roads. ( I can personally state that the sooner a deer or moose hears you the better change you have to not die )
Test did not review farm equipment operators entering roadways. (again, the sooner a farmer knows your coming, the better chance you have not to be combined )
This test was also taken in a location that could be considered "over-controlling" ( just sayin )
So to make a blanket statement, "loud pipes DONT saves lives" by this test metric, is not a very responsible solution statement. it's a bit of "fake news"
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I always put pipes on my bikes. I got Agostinis on my Bobber. I love the sound. I love to blip at lights. I blip in tunnels. I blip in traffic. I blip when downshifting.
I'm a compulsive blipper.
I don't do it for safety although I've seen drivers recognize the blip. I do it because I like it.
That said, that study doesn't "prove" anything.
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Plenty of municipalities have noise or dance laws. It boils down to do police spend their time tracking down the exhaust bandits or spending time on more violent crimes.
As a tax payer I know where I’d prefer their time and my money be spent.
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Plenty of municipalities have noise or dance laws. It boils down to do police spend their time tracking down the exhaust bandits or spending time on more violent crimes.
As a tax payer I know where I’d prefer their time and my money be spent.
I would like to know what their "dance laws" are? :tongue:
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I got Agostinis on my Bobber. I love the sound.
Agostini's are tastefully done, running one without the baffle (or db killer) would be annoying. I run an Agostini on my Norge as well, but stock (with the baffle/db killer in). Other bikes are stock, they sound just fine stock with the La Franconis. It's barely any louder than stock from what I can tell, but does sound much better...totally agree there.
These aren't the annoying pipes in question however...
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not necessarily a proponent of loud pipes, but also not a proponent of this form of testing and reporting.
be careful of how you take this.
Test was only looking at a driver in a car with radio on and windows rolled up. (some people have windows down, some people don't listen to the radio)
Test did not take into account pedestrians in the streets or crossings. (not all accidents are bike / car )
Test did not consider deer crossings on back roads. ( I can personally state that the sooner a deer or moose hears you the better change you have to not die )
Test did not review farm equipment operators entering roadways. (again, the sooner a farmer knows your coming, the better chance you have not to be combined )
This test was also taken in a location that could be considered "over-controlling" ( just sayin )
So to make a blanket statement, "loud pipes DONT saves lives" by this test metric, is not a very responsible solution statement. it's a bit of "fake news"
I live on a very low traffic gravel road and I've had deer run full speed into the side of my Jeep. I suspect noise attracts them. Deer are just plain dumb.
Diesel farm machinery is loud. Very loud. You won't hear a loud bike sitting on a cab-less tractor. Older tractors with cabs can be even louder than tractors without cabs. All that metal in the cab gets loose are vibrates making them even noisier than machines with open air cabs. The glass reflects sound. New tractors with cabs are heavily sound insulated. Again, outside noise is drowned out by the engines, implements and radios.
When I enter the roadway, I have never once stopped and listened for a motorcycle..or a truck or a bus or a minivan. I look for them.
"And all of a sudden, this minivan pulled right out in front of me. It's like they never even HEARD me!" ~ Said no one ever.
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My V7III is the first bike I have ever changed the exhaust on. I did it mostly for looks. The stock exhaust cans are huge.
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IMHO, on the matter of loud pipes, I have concluded that loud pipes make noise, period. If your car sounded like that, you'd get it Midasized. And, I ain't an advocate of blipping either...don't want folks asking me why I ride such a poor running machine or if I have a nervous tic. :laugh:
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I was waiting at a traffic light yesterday in my pickup when a very loud motorcycle approached beside me on my right side, I thought to myself what an annoying Harley, then I glanced to my right and it was a Ducati Monster, loud annoying pipes are not limited to Harleys.
I feel it’s just rude to be so loud and annoying.
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There is a legal measurement for how loud any exhaust on a registered vehicle can be, the “decibel range”. It’s only an issue when the sound exceeds that maximum legal range, which is plenty lenient in my state. In and around my area LEO pays little to no attention to the law.
In my state (MD) some of the moto LEOs fiddle with their mufflers to make them louder.
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Excessively noisy bikes and cars have caused the UK Gov to do this
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-noise-camera-trial-to-crack-down-on-illegal-vehicles
Be careful what you wish for in the pursuit of "freedom"
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Playing cards clicking on the spokes will help the electric bikes save lives?
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I can testify that the deer around here hear me coming and they stop crossing the road when they do so. Vehicles though, they don't hear anything. Heck, they're blind half the time I think.
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Electric vehicles are deer magnets !
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I'll keep my loud pipes, bubs and mistrals on the Beast and Stone.
My own studies have shown that many times I will hear the bike before I see it so that bike is now safer in regards to me changing lanes in my truck and killing him/her.
Also get a great kick out of those of you who don't like loud pipes which actually seems to be "well mine aren't stock and they are louder, but only the ones louder than mine are annoying.
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It's pretty obvious the difference between what's obnoxious vs. a change of tune with an aftermarket pipe....just stand next to one for 5 seconds without ear plugs.
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I live near a "Crashed Toys" shop, Loud pipes didn't save most of the mangled bikes I see there.
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I live near a "Crashed Toys" shop, Loud pipes didn't save most of the mangled bikes I see there.
Are we talking bikes or lives?
If it bikes, gas stations are probably the number one contributor to motorcycles being wrecked. If there was no gas to put in them they would not be on the road or being wrecked. So I say the problem is not loud pipes its gasoline!
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"Lies, damned lies, and statistics"
is a phrase describing the persuasive power of numbers,
particularly the use of statistics to bolster weak arguments
Statisticians strike again! .... no statistician ever rode a loud bike
I rest my case against this absurd study
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I can testify that the deer around here hear me coming and they stop crossing the road when they do so.
+1 on this.
And I'm not talking about Sportsters with drag pipes......my EV with Lafranconis or Superhawk with V&H were both loud enough to make the long legged forest rats move away from the road.
G
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+1 on this.
And I'm not talking about Sportsters with drag pipes......my EV with Lafranconis or Superhawk with V&H were both loud enough to make the long legged forest rats move away from the road.
G
Though often when startled they go towards/across the road too. May depend how the noise travels or echos.
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Though pero often when startled they go towards/across the road too. May depend how the noise travels or echos.
:thumb:
Same with loud pipes on the 405. I hear them, but don't know where they are. If I need to change lanes I put on my turn signal and they better be paying attention.
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Loud pipes were never meant to save lives...they were meant to annoy others, same as unnecessary throttle blipping at a stoplight...if it annoys others around you...mission accomplished.
Yup............ that pretty much covers it.
Its the pirate mentality :rolleyes:
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If you've ever tried to get to sleep in a French town or village, when the local 15 year olds are showing off on their 50cc mopeds you'll agree that loud (or non-existent) pipes make you want to take lives.
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open pipes is a penis extender...
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open pipes is a penis extender...
Only in the tiny brains of the riders - unless the bikes are being ridden on a legitimate race course.
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open pipes is a penis extender...
So does that make OEM pipes penis shrinkers?
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So does that make OEM pipes penis shrinkers?
No, cold shrinks.....Notice I said open pipes...Sporty sounding mufflers on a bike ridden with common sense in built up areas isn't annoying....
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No, cold shrinks.....Notice I said open pipes...Sporty sounding mufflers on a bike ridden with common sense in built up areas isn't annoying....
The problem is that’s one persons opinion. Noise levels and what is acceptable is a very individual thing.
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The problem is that’s one persons opinion. Noise levels and what is acceptable is a very individual thing.
Yes, and when your noise offends me, you have now forced your opinion on me..In reality I pay little attention to most excessively noisy vehicles going down the road...
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This conversation is a good indication of how the history of written laws and the enforcement methods of those laws came about. Simply answer, comment sense and respect for others or the lack of abounds.
Just an observation:)
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Never cared for flatulent exhaust systems on anything.
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It's also a question of where and when. I love the sound of a bike winding through the gears or signing at redline - on a race track. Not so much at 11pm screaming down a nearby road or the blipping of open pipes in my ear at a stoplight.
Bought my Griso with a 'custom' open pipe that sounded pretty cool at idle but could not be ridden on the road without pain - even with earplugs. Not sure what the PO was thinking but it turned a glorious bike into a loud obnoxious turd. It wasn't the Guzzi 'sound' we love - just noise.
The selfish and inconsiderate few upset the masses and we wind up with blanket laws thrown at everyone. A little respect and consideration for others is all that's needed.
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Sometimes the stereotypes are correct. :evil:
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The problem is that’s one persons opinion. Noise levels and what is acceptable is a very individual thing.
And the individual who believes open pipes loud enough to damage the hearing of those beside him is acceptable is a selfish immature needy jerk in my opinion.
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And the individual who believes open pipes loud enough to damage the hearing of those beside him is acceptable is a selfish immature needy jerk in my opinion.
But it begs the question...what is loud? I have friends and/or family who are darn near deaf and others who are noise sensitive. What dB level is irritating or tolerable?
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But it begs the question...what is loud? I have friends and/or family who are darn near deaf and others who are noise sensitive. What dB level is irritating or tolerable?
That, my friend, is the right question. There is no right answer but it won't stop one side from trying to impose their collective will on the other.
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120 dB and above is unsafe for any period of time. A short burst at 130 dB can cause permanent hearing loss.
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120 dB and above is unsafe for any period of time. A short burst at 130 dB can cause permanent hearing loss.
Yep .
Dusty
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It's not just the loudness that causes damage for me. The low rumble of a guzzi or similar engine has to get quite loud before I find it unpleasant.
For decades I never wore hearing protection while using a variety of equipment and machinery (including motorcycles), that changed when I started using little 2 stroke powered whipper snippers & brush cutters a few years ago.
The higher pitched scream of those smaller 2 stroke engines, literally caused my ears to ache. I realized at that point my hearing was a finite commodity and started wearing hearing protection around all machinery, including my motorcycles. Preserve it or lose it.
jmo fwiw
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The sad truth is that it does not take that high of a decibel level to damage our ears and causing ringing or tinnitus. I ruined my ears years ago at the firing range simply by forgetting to put my hearing protection on for just the first round, a few times over the years. What’s too loud on a motorcycle is when your buddy won’t ride near you on a road trip🤔😂😂😂
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I think most campgrounds want invertor generators under 60 db. Good rule for motorcycles too. Of course they also restrict the hours so no more nighttime riding either if we follow that rule. yes sarcasm.
Another data point to my study, ready to pull out of a pull-off on the side of a Tn mountain and luckily I heard him in just enough time to stop pulling out, otherwise I'd have Kawasaki green all over my blue Chevy truck. His loud pipes definitely saved his ass on that one. He was well above the posted 25mph so it would have been nasty.